Liberalnation HATES America, AND WANTS YOU TO KNOW IT!

[82Marine89]

But Pale...You are really messed up on this....

YOU did not take an oath to defend the flag IF you were in the Military, at least not to my knowledge and I was reared by a Military Lifer and also I am married to a Vet....

you took an oath to defend the Constitution, NOT the Flag.

And that oath of defending the Constitution INCLUDES you DEFENDING Flag burning, which has been determined, as a First Amendment right.

So, YOU are breaking your vow that YOU took, when YOU entered the Military.

Please, reconsider your position, or you are breaking your vow, your sworn vow....that's pretty serious, in my book.

I answered that on page 5.

[82Marine89]

It's also not defending it.

You said it was "just a picture" and there was "no need to make a big deal about it". It's just a picture of my flag being burned, so there is a need to make a big deal about it. Get bent you fucking cum guzzler.

[Sitarro]

I think it is quite a stretch to think that someone burning our nation's flag is doing it for any other reason than to piss people off. They aren't making a political statement, they are just being assholes with very little creativity.....been done before. How about the dipshits that spray painted the Capital steps? Was that free speech? There are limits to what qualifies as free speech.....watch "Scarface" on network TV and see how close to the original the dialogue is.

A white boy running into the Apollo theater yelling "nigger" probably will not come out the same way he went in and only a fool would think their Constitutional free speech rights would keep them safe. Anyone thinking that they are safe from getting their ass set on fire with the very same flag they have set on fire is just ignorant and naive. This is basically what we are dealing with hear. I have read enough from Miss LN to know that she is a very young, ignorant, naive little shit that doesn't have a clue about anything including sexual preference.

Hey LN, does the name Ann Heche ring a bell? Lesbianism doesn't cure a problem with a male authority figure from childhood.......Lesbians make some of the worst men on the planet.

And if you really want to set fire to something in protest, do what this clown did, set fire to yourself...... now that makes a statement everyone can understand.

[Pale Rider]

But Pale...You are really messed up on this....

YOU did not take an oath to defend the flag IF you were in the Military, at least not to my knowledge and I was reared by a Military Lifer and also I am married to a Vet....

you took an oath to defend the Constitution, NOT the Flag.

And that oath of defending the Constitution INCLUDES you DEFENDING Flag burning, which has been determined, as a First Amendment right.

So, YOU are breaking your vow that YOU took, when YOU entered the Military.

Please, reconsider your position, or you are breaking your vow, your sworn vow....that's pretty serious, in my book.

Bull - shit - sister.

I took an oath to defend "THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA," and the "symbol" of that great nation "is OUR FLAG."

Back in the early days of war in America they had men called "flag bearers." They carried not only their division flag, but the flag of the United States of America into battle. The men that followed the flag bearer vowed that if the flag bearer would fall, they would pick the flag up and carry it themselves until the last man. Can you understand that? "THE FLAG" was the most important thing to advance, until there was no man left standing.

I would do that. You obviously wouldn't. Hell, you don't even understand it.

[Pale Rider]

because she has the right to put it up until the owner of the site tells her to take it down.....or bans her....

This is the third time I've said this manu... "this isn't about whether it's her RIGHT, which it isn't anyway, it's about *DO YOU LIKE IT?*"

[Pale Rider]

Some thoughts:

1. No, the freedom to burn a flag (or anything remotely like it), much like the "right" to an abortion, is not in the Constitution. I believe it was the uber-liberal Warren court that interpreted the 1st amendment prohibition of laws restricting speech to include flag burning.

2. Congress has been overwhelmingly against the SC decision from the start:

"Many in Congress vilified the decision of the Court. The House unanimously passed a resolution denouncing the Court; the Senate did the same in March 2000 when the vote fell four short of the required two-thirds majority. [1]. Congress passed a federal law barring flag burning, but the Supreme Court struck it down as well in United States v. Eichman (1990). Many attempts have been made to amend the Constitution to allow Congress to prohibit the desecration of the flag. Since 1995, the Flag Burning Amendment has consistently mustered sufficient votes to pass in the House of Representatives, but not in the Senate. In 2000, the Senate voted 63–37 in favor of the amendment, which fell four votes short of the requisite two-thirds majority. In 2006, another attempt fell one vote short. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_A...s_Constitution

3. Having posted that, all of the above is irrelevant. This is a message board, a business owned by Jim, a "private community" of people, if you will. Not a court of law or a government agency. We do not need to live and die by what is protected speech. What is acceptable here, IMO, should have nothing to do with SC interpretations of the Constitution. It should do with (a) the board owner's ideas about how his board should be run; and if he so decides, (b) the standards of this community, such standards to be adjudged by the board owner.

In other words, as Pale said, the issue here isn't whether flag burning is protected; thanks to a small group of agenda-driven libs, it is. The issue is whether we want to see a representation of it shoved in our faces every day.

I hate it when this happens...

You must spread some reputation around before giving it to Abbey again.

[nevadamedic]

You said it was "just a picture" and there was "no need to make a big deal about it". It's just a picture of my flag being burned, so there is a need to make a big deal about it. Get bent you fucking cum guzzler.

It is just a picture. If it was an actual flag being burned it would be a different story. I was trying to get people to realize she is only doing it for attention.

Alsi cum guzzler eh? I am flattered you share your fantasies with me, but I am not into that, sorry to dissapoint. Im sure you can find another guy to help you fulfill it.

[Pale Rider]

It is just a picture. If it was an actual flag being burned it would be a different story. I was trying to get people to realize she is only doing it for attention.

Alsi cum guzzler eh? I am flattered you share your fantasies with me, but I am not into that, sorry to dissapoint. Im sure you can find another guy to help you fulfill it.

What if it was "just a picture of your MOTHER getting her HEAD cut off?" Still just a picture? Uh huh... that one might disturb you aye?

Well "just a picture" of an American flag burning disturbs the shit out of me, because I put my life on the line for it for eight fucking years. I guess that's what you're missing about this whole thing. Evidently our flag just doesn't really mean much to you.

[Pale Rider]

You realize nm, that the majority of arguing in this thread has been YOU sticking up for LN. You'd rather side with a piece of shit little lezbo liberal, America hating BITCH that PROUDLY displays the desecration of the American flag, than with you're fellow conservative American patriots. Why is that?

I don't think Tom Tancredo would be very pleased with that info.

[JohnDoe]

Abbey, I disagree with you, and by your own post, it supports the FACT that flag burning is protected by the first amendment...it is ''saying'' something, which is ''up yours'' or ''f/u'' to the government....which is specifically covered and protected by the first amendment....THUS THE REASON, THERE IS A NEED TO AMEND the Constitution.

There would be no need to AMEND the Constitution to allow the gvt to ban flag burning, IF flag burning was not Constitutional, no?

[Pale Rider]

Abbey, I disagree with you, and by your own post, it supports the FACT that flag burning is protected by the first amendment...it is ''saying'' something, which is ''up yours'' or ''f/u'' to the government....which is specifically covered and protected by the first amendment....THUS THE REASON, THERE IS A NEED TO AMEND the Constitution.

There would be no need to AMEND the Constitution to allow the gvt to ban flag burning, IF flag burning was not Constitutional, no?

First of all, calmly, why don't you read the constitution, and then show us where it say's it's a protected "right" to burn an American flag.

And please don't tell me that "free speech" is what you're saying. Burning a flag is a "action." It can be done without uttering a word. That has NOTHING to do with "speech."

[actsnoblemartin]

Funny most right: love america
Most left: hate america

I don't approve of it

It is a sick way for the moonbat left to express their hate for America

[nevadamedic]

What if it was "just a picture of your MOTHER getting her HEAD cut off?" Still just a picture? Uh huh... that one might disturb you aye?

Well "just a picture" of an American flag burning disturbs the shit out of me, because I put my life on the line for it for eight fucking years. I guess that's what you're missing about this whole thing. Evidently our flag just doesn't really mean much to you.

It does mean a lot to me, and it does disturb me, but there is nothing I can do about it and there's no use picking a fight which will ultimatly prolong the amount of time that that picture is up there.

[nevadamedic]

You realize nm, that the majority of arguing in this thread has been YOU sticking up for LN. You'd rather side with a piece of shit little lezbo liberal, America hating BITCH that PROUDLY displays the desecration of the American flag, than with you're fellow conservative American patriots. Why is that?

I don't think Tom Tancredo would be very pleased with that info.

Im not defending her, I am just tired of people running in circles attacking. It is getting nowhere other then her keeping the picture up longer.

[JohnDoe]

Bull - shit - sister.

I took an oath to defend "THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA," and the "symbol" of that great nation "is OUR FLAG."

Back in the early days of war in America they had men called "flag bearers." They carried not only their division flag, but the flag of the United States of America into battle. The men that followed the flag bearer vowed that if the flag bearer would fall, they would pick the flag up and carry it themselves until the last man. Can you understand that? "THE FLAG" was the most important thing to advance, until there was no man left standing.

I would do that. You obviously wouldn't. Hell, you don't even understand it.

well, MAYBE brothah, you didn't serve in the Military for the united states of america as you say, because you don't even know what you took an oath to defend pale? how am i suppose to interpret that....8 years of you misunderstanding your own sworn oath? Or do you really believe you took an oath to defend our flag???

i don't KNOW WHY you do not know that you took an oath to defend the Constitution? PLEASE explain!!!

The wordings of the current oath of enlistment and oath for commissioned officers are as follows:

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).

"I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God." (DA Form 71, 1 August 1959, for officers.)

During the Revolutionary War, the Continental Congress established different oaths for the enlisted men and officers of the Continental Army:

Enlisted: The first oath, voted on 14 June 1775 as part of the act creating the Continental Army, read: "I _____ have, this day, voluntarily enlisted myself, as a soldier, in the American continental army, for one year, unless sooner discharged: And I do bind myself to conform, in all instances, to such rules and regulations, as are, or shall be, established for the government of the said Army." The original wording was effectively replaced by Section 3, Article 1, of the Articles of War approved by Congress on 20 September 1776, which specified that the oath of enlistment read: "I _____ swear (or affirm as the case may be) to be trued to the United States of America, and to serve them honestly and faithfully against all their enemies opposers whatsoever; and to observe and obey the orders of the Continental Congress, and the orders of the Generals and officers set over me by them."

Officers: Continental Congress passed two versions of this oath of office, applied to military and civilian national officers. The first, on 21 October 1776, read: "I _____, do acknowledge the Thirteen United States of America, namely, New Hampshire, Massachusetts Bay, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia, to be free, independent, and sovereign states, and declare, that the people thereof owe no allegiance or obedience to George the third, king of Great Britain; and I renounce, refuse and abjure any allegiance or obedience to him; and I do swear that I will, to the utmost of my power, support, maintain, and defend the said United States against the said king, George the third, and his heirs and successors, and his and their abettors, assistants and adherents; and will serve the said United States in the office of _____, which I now hold, and in any other office which I may hereafter hold by their appointment, or under their authority, with fidelity and honour, and according to the best of my skill and understanding. So help me God." The revised version, voted 3 February 1778, read "I, _____ do acknowledge the United States of America to be free, independent and sovereign states, and declare that the people thereof owe no allegiance or obedience, to George the third, king of Great Britain; and I renounce, refuse and abjure any allegiance or obedience to him: and I do swear (or affirm) that I will, to the utmost of my power, support, maintain and defend the said United States, against the said king George the third and his heirs and successors, and his and their abettors, assistants and adherents, and will serve the said United States in the office of _____ which I now hold, with fidelity, according to the best of my skill and understanding. So help me God."

The first oath under the Constitution was approved by Act of Congress 29 September 1789 (Sec. 3, Ch. 25, 1st Congress). It applied to all commissioned officers, noncommissioned officers and privates in the service of the United States. It came in two parts, the first of which read: "I, A.B., do solemnly swear or affirm (as the case may be) that I will support the constitution of the United States." The second part read: "I, A.B., do solemnly swear or affirm (as the case may be) to bear true allegiance to the United States of America, and to serve them honestly and faithfully, against all their enemies or opposers whatsoever, and to observe and obey the orders of the President of the United States of America, and the orders of the officers appointed over me." The next section of that chapter specified that "the said troops shall be governed by the rules and articles of war, which have been established by the United States in Congress assembled, or by such rules and articles of war as may hereafter by law be established."

Although the enlisted oath remained unchanged until 1950, the officer oath has undergone substantial minor modification since 1789. A change in about 1830 read: "I, _____, appointed a _____ in the Army of the United States, do solemnly swear, or affirm, that I will bear true allegiance to the United States of America, and that I will serve them honestly and faithfully against all their enemies or opposers whatsoever, and observe and obey the orders of the President of the United States, and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to the rules and articles for the government of the Armies of the United States." Under an act of 2 July 1862 the oath became: "I, A.B., do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I have never borne arms against the United States since I have been a citizen thereof; that I have voluntarily given no aid, countenance, counsel, or encouragement to persons engaged in armed hostility thereto; that I have neither sought nor accepted nor attempted to exercise the functions of any office whatsoever under any authority or pretended authority in hostility to the United States; that I have not yielded voluntary support to any pretended government, authority, power, or constitution within the United States, hostile or inimical thereto. And I do further swear (or affirm) that, to the best of my knowledge and ability, I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter, so help me God." An act of 13 May 1884 reverted to a simpler formulation: "I, A.B., do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God." This version remained in effect until the 1959 adoption of the present wording.



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Last updated 27 July 2004