Will/Did you encourage your kids to join the military? [Archive] - Page 2 - Debate Policy

pegwinn

03-06-2008, 08:49 PM

All I said is I would not recommend anyone join and stated my reasons why and I have some military experence on top of that (no I dont have 20 yrs in and I was not a POW for 10 yrs serving in 3 different combat zones) but I feel I have enough experence to recommend to someone not to join. It turned into a flame war because God forbid anyone oppose joining the military, then why even start the OP if you are not prepared for a range of answers.

Oh get real. Others openly said that they would not recommend etc etc etc. You were the one who then began a tirade about how you were abused, harrased, etc.

Then you teed off and in this and other threads began to denigrate the Military in general and enlisted folks in specific.

Then I tried to be civil and actually engage you. You didn't get it. Others tried to engage you. You didn't get it.

Finally, you went one step too far and have been called out for it (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568). But, apparently there is no history or tradition of college educated engineers who bailed out on thier country actually debating.

Have I missed anything?

Mr. P

03-06-2008, 10:13 PM

Oh get real. Others openly said that they would not recommend etc etc etc. You were the one who then began a tirade about how you were abused, harrased, etc.

Then you teed off and in this and other threads began to denigrate the Military in general and enlisted folks in specific.

Then I tried to be civil and actually engage you. You didn't get it. Others tried to engage you. You didn't get it.

Finally, you went one step too far and have been called out for it (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568). But, apparently there is no history or tradition of college educated engineers who bailed out on thier country actually debating.

Have I missed anything?

Nope.

manu1959

03-06-2008, 10:17 PM

rppearso

03-07-2008, 02:43 PM

are people that disagree with you not entitled to express their opinion of your opinion.....

Absolutly and thats what makes forums fun and interesting but when it becomes uninteresting flames about how im just a whiney bit@h and there is no actual debate then its stupid. I do feel the military is abusive towards its members and I agreed with pegwin that the military is allowed to do what they do once you join no more arguement there pegwin won that but its a pretty damn good case not to join in the first place and expose yourself to abuse and harrassment, I hate the military so why would I recommend anyone join and it is not blind hate I actually have experence and since they cant throw the "you were never in so you cant talk" argument they just minimize my time in and if I had done a full tour and still maintained my opinion they would still come up with lame excuses to attempt to discredit my views. Basicly the opinion of people on this forum is if your not pro join/stay in the military your a whiney bit@h unless you tip toe through the tulips with your reasoning which I refuse to do.

Kathianne

03-07-2008, 06:39 PM

Absolutly and thats what makes forums fun and interesting but when it becomes uninteresting flames about how im just a whiney bit@h and there is no actual debate then its stupid. I do feel the military is abusive towards its members and I agreed with pegwin that the military is allowed to do what they do once you join no more arguement there pegwin won that but its a pretty damn good case not to join in the first place and expose yourself to abuse and harrassment, I hate the military so why would I recommend anyone join and it is not blind hate I actually have experence and since they cant throw the "you were never in so you cant talk" argument they just minimize my time in and if I had done a full tour and still maintained my opinion they would still come up with lame excuses to attempt to discredit my views. Basicly the opinion of people on this forum is if your not pro join/stay in the military your a whiney bit@h unless you tip toe through the tulips with your reasoning which I refuse to do.

Only when you present yourself as a whiny bitch and then say you are advising the youth according to your own skewed perspective.

It would be as if I told my students that someone in your industry were all war profiteers and held you to ridicule. Bottom line to my way of thinking it's important to anyone discussing issues with persons that are short of experience to identify what is your opinion versus facts. You are very, very loose with 'facts' of military.

rppearso

03-07-2008, 07:10 PM

Only when you present yourself as a whiny bitch and then say you are advising the youth according to your own skewed perspective.

It would be as if I told my students that someone in your industry were all war profiteers and held you to ridicule. Bottom line to my way of thinking it's important to anyone discussing issues with persons that are short of experience to identify what is your opinion versus facts. You are very, very loose with 'facts' of military.

That is not even close to the same thing, I have a choice where I work and can move around at my will, so if I find out I work for a war profitter I can go elsewhere, your analogies along with all the other analogys mentioned dont hold weight because in the military you DONT have choices. I have agreed in other threads that in the military there are good units and good tours but the problem with the military is you do not have "the choice" like you do in the civilian world and in basic and other training you WILL be subject to abuse period (by my opinion of abuse but my opinion is what drives my recommendations), after your initial training its a crap shoot some people get lucky and some dont, you can guide the boat to an extent but you dont have as much control as you would in the civilian world, these are just more reasons I dont recommend joining to anyone. Not to mention if you are an unlucky one there are mounds of red tape involved with re-establishing a decent quality of life because as I have conceded to pegwin the military owns your a$$ where in the civilian world I can initiate paper work for litigation and go back to enjoying a beer and playing some halo where in the military you may be confined to dingy barracks for "having a bad attitude" and have to fight for your cause and you wont be playing halo or having sex while that is going on, I basicly tell people the stuff recruiters dont tell you. Or if you end up in the PTRP you wont be having sex or playing halo for a long time why put yourself through all of that, it is all artificially created stress to supposidly "prepare you for war time" when in fact nothing can really prepare you for people shooting at you.

Kathianne

03-07-2008, 08:08 PM

That is not even close to the same thing, I have a choice where I work and can move around at my will, so if I find out I work for a war profitter I can go elsewhere, your analogies along with all the other analogys mentioned dont hold weight because in the military you DONT have choices. Huh? You have a choice to work as a profiteer or as a member of the military.
I have agreed in other threads that in the military there are good units and good tours but the problem with the military is you do not have "the choice" like you do in the civilian world and in basic and other training you WILL be subject to abuse period (by my opinion of abuse but my opinion is what drives my recommendations), after your initial training its a crap shoot some people get lucky and some dont, you can guide the boat to an extent but you dont have as much control as you would in the civilian world, these are just more reasons I dont recommend joining to anyone. Not to mention if you are an unlucky one there are mounds of red tape involved with re-establishing a decent quality of life because as I have conceded to pegwin the military owns your a$$ where in the civilian world I can initiate paper work for litigation and go back to enjoying a beer and playing some halo where in the military you may be confined to dingy barracks for "having a bad attitude" and have to fight for your cause and you wont be playing halo or having sex while that is going on, I basicly tell people the stuff recruiters dont tell you. Or if you end up in the PTRP you wont be having sex or playing halo for a long time why put yourself through all of that, it is all artificially created stress to supposidly "prepare you for war time" when in fact nothing can really prepare you for people shooting at you.Wow, a run on paragraph, without constructing it as such. I'm amazed, do you read what you are writing? Excuse of failure, after excuse...

pegwinn

03-07-2008, 08:34 PM

That is not even close to the same thing, I have a choice where I work and can move around at my will, so if I find out I work for a war profitter I can go elsewhere, your analogies along with all the other analogys mentioned dont hold weight because in the military you DONT have choices. I have agreed in other threads that in the military there are good units and good tours but the problem with the military is you do not have "the choice" like you do in the civilian world and in basic and other training you WILL be subject to abuse period (by my opinion of abuse but my opinion is what drives my recommendations), after your initial training its a crap shoot some people get lucky and some dont, you can guide the boat to an extent but you dont have as much control as you would in the civilian world, these are just more reasons I dont recommend joining to anyone. Not to mention if you are an unlucky one there are mounds of red tape involved with re-establishing a decent quality of life because as I have conceded to pegwin the military owns your a$$ where in the civilian world I can initiate paper work for litigation and go back to enjoying a beer and playing some halo where in the military you may be confined to dingy barracks for "having a bad attitude" and have to fight for your cause and you wont be playing halo or having sex while that is going on, I basicly tell people the stuff recruiters dont tell you. Or if you end up in the PTRP you wont be having sex or playing halo for a long time why put yourself through all of that, it is all artificially created stress to supposidly "prepare you for war time" when in fact nothing can really prepare you for people shooting at you.

Well, based on that infallable logic I can surely advise folks on the best way to go to University. After all, not counting five seperate leadership academies, I have a whopping six credit hours of college and about forty credits worth of civilian trade school.

Or, I could simply take your own example and develope a smug superior attitude against all college boyz.

BS, MS, PHD....... Bullshit, More shit, Piled Higher and Deeper. Did that come across as smugly as I thinkz it did? Advise me Oh educated one.

I am so glad you are on the board to provide me with such a positive example.

rppearso

03-07-2008, 09:48 PM

Huh? You have a choice to work as a profiteer or as a member of the military.Wow, a run on paragraph, without constructing it as such. I'm amazed, do you read what you are writing? Excuse of failure, after excuse...

Military (post join date) = Gov owns your a$$ (no choice)
Dont Join (civilian job) = Choice to quit or stay without permission

That should sum it up pretty good, I am much better at math than writing.

I actually think the BS, MS and PhD joke is funny, although I dont laugh anymore becasue I have heard it probably close to 50 times now.

Kathianne

03-07-2008, 09:59 PM

Military (post join date) = Gov owns your a$$ (no choice)
Dont Join (civilian job) = Choice to quit or stay without permission

That should sum it up pretty good, I am much better at math than writing.

I actually think the BS, MS and PhD joke is funny, although I dont laugh anymore becasue I have heard it probably close to 50 times now.

Blending of two replies, but mine couldn't have been in better company. You sir or rather boy, are really unworthy of reply. You've been unable to put together a reply to any, much less a rebuttal.

AFbombloader

03-07-2008, 10:05 PM

I could try and make sense of this whole thing, but I will focus on only one thing.

I basicly tell people the stuff recruiters dont tell you.

First question to you is this...How many peole have you "informed" about the military? Just a rough guess will suffice.

Second question...How many of them did you go to the recruiters office with and sit in on the interview? I would guess none.

So how can you tell anyone what the recruiter did not tell them? How do you know? I have told you in the past that I was a recruiter, so I take it very personally when uninformed people make blanket claims about recruiters. I would love for you to talk to ANY of the kids I put in and see if I lied or covered ANYTHING up. I didn't, and most recruiters don't either. I liked to use analogys when I spoke to kids and their parents. You wouldn't buy a car from Chevy by talking to a Ford dealer would you? I used it to show the difference in the branches. Air force=Chevy, Army=Ford...etc. In this use, I was Chevy and you weren't even a car dealer so why should they listen to you? Because you almost got to be a passenger in the car? I always told them to verify what I was saying and if I was wrong to tell me. And I also had them bring parents, grandparents, friends, etc with them to ask questions. I would have loved for you to come into my office with one of them. Maybe then you would have realized how incorrect you were and you would have opened your closed mind to the fact that the "military" was not what you experienced but far more than that. You had a horrible experience. We got that. But does that fact mean that Johnny from down the street will? No it doesnt. If anyone you know asks you idf they should join the military, do them a favor and tell them your experience but do it so they will be prepared to ask the questions at the recruiters office. Make the recruiter answer them. There is no way for the recruiters to know everything that can happen to Johnny in his career and it is not our responsibility to try and inform him of every possible outcome. If you dont ask, we will not know to answer.

AF:salute:

Mr. P

03-07-2008, 11:13 PM

Military (post join date) = Gov owns your a$$ (no choice)
Dont Join (civilian job) = Choice to quit or stay without permission

.....

So why did yer DUMB ASS sign-up then? I mean come on yer too smart for that, right? But you did it, right?

rppearso

03-08-2008, 05:19 PM

So why did yer DUMB ASS sign-up then? I mean come on yer too smart for that, right? But you did it, right?

How many times do we have to go through this, joining was one of my lifes blunders the end.

rppearso

03-08-2008, 05:21 PM

Blending of two replies, but mine couldn't have been in better company. You sir or rather boy, are really unworthy of reply. You've been unable to put together a reply to any, much less a rebuttal.

So I guess putting together a very clear and concise post is your idea "unable to put together a reply", I thought my post was pretty clear and easy to understand. It sounds to me like you just dont like my opinion so you just post useless flames.

rppearso

03-08-2008, 05:41 PM

I could try and make sense of this whole thing, but I will focus on only one thing.

First question to you is this...How many peole have you "informed" about the military? Just a rough guess will suffice.

Second question...How many of them did you go to the recruiters office with and sit in on the interview? I would guess none.

So how can you tell anyone what the recruiter did not tell them? How do you know? I have told you in the past that I was a recruiter, so I take it very personally when uninformed people make blanket claims about recruiters. I would love for you to talk to ANY of the kids I put in and see if I lied or covered ANYTHING up. I didn't, and most recruiters don't either. I liked to use analogys when I spoke to kids and their parents. You wouldn't buy a car from Chevy by talking to a Ford dealer would you? I used it to show the difference in the branches. Air force=Chevy, Army=Ford...etc. In this use, I was Chevy and you weren't even a car dealer so why should they listen to you? Because you almost got to be a passenger in the car? I always told them to verify what I was saying and if I was wrong to tell me. And I also had them bring parents, grandparents, friends, etc with them to ask questions. I would have loved for you to come into my office with one of them. Maybe then you would have realized how incorrect you were and you would have opened your closed mind to the fact that the "military" was not what you experienced but far more than that. You had a horrible experience. We got that. But does that fact mean that Johnny from down the street will? No it doesnt. If anyone you know asks you idf they should join the military, do them a favor and tell them your experience but do it so they will be prepared to ask the questions at the recruiters office. Make the recruiter answer them. There is no way for the recruiters to know everything that can happen to Johnny in his career and it is not our responsibility to try and inform him of every possible outcome. If you dont ask, we will not know to answer.

AF:salute:

I have talked to probably about 5-10 people out of joining the military (rough order of magnitude), I have not gone to the recruiting office with them because it did not get that far, I would be more than happy to go with someone to a recruting office and cut through all the BS and watch the recruiter stir and bite his tongue because I know the possible outcomes and they are not wide spread where the bad experence is a nebulus fluke, I watched numerous people I went to basic with and back at the national guard unit get burned. The scenarios are pretty cut and dry and the questions I would ask are easy and if answered honestly would deter most from joining or if the questions are completely dodged like they are on this forum then that tells the potential recruit that the recruiter does not want to answer because the answer sucks or he will minimize the answer by saying well that doesnt happen very much so therefore its ok when in fact once you ship to basic your a$$ is theres you dont get a phone call to your recrutier like hes your lawyer your just SOL and the more training you have to go through the higher the odds of $hit happening. I would only go in withsome one I talked to before hand and know they are willing to grill the recrutier. The military has so many f***ed up regulations on so many different things its not even funny, like the type of sunglasses you can wear because God forbid you have nice sunglasses that look cool or regulations on concealed weapons, heterosexual sex practices (of course I doubt these are followed I bet most married people in the military participate in oral sex but technically you can get in trouble for it), types of boots you can wear cant have them be to nice or comfortable even if the soldier is willing to pay for them, I believe they make these regulations just to make peoples lives suck, also there are no regulations on max time of deployments in your carrer. These are the real questions that need to be asked because no one talks about the benifits once your in, the questions that need to be asked are job satisfaction and quality of life.

Kathianne

03-08-2008, 06:22 PM

So I guess putting together a very clear and concise post is your idea "unable to put together a reply", I thought my post was pretty clear and easy to understand. It sounds to me like you just dont like my opinion so you just post useless flames.

I flamed you? Where?

pegwinn

03-08-2008, 06:38 PM

I have talked to probably about 5-10 people out of joining the military (rough order of magnitude), Thank God you got to them in time. By talking them out of it you saved some overworked NCO a small bit of time. Tis a great thing lad, to know that you managed to talk the weak out of failure. Not like there was any chance that the .mil could have done em any good.

I have not gone to the recruiting office with them because it did not get that far, I would be more than happy to go with someone to a recruting office and cut through all the BS and watch the recruiter stir and bite his tongue because I know the possible outcomes and they are not wide spread where the bad experence is a nebulus fluke, I'm certain that the nations recruiters are resting a bit easier knowing that your mightiness is not going to visit them. After all, at recruiting school they are taught not to do anything that might humiliate someone opposed to them. That kind of stress can lead to picking up strange women in the bars.

I watched numerous people I went to basic with and back at the national guard unit get burned. The scenarios are pretty cut and dry and the questions I would ask are easy and if answered honestly would deter most from joining No doubt the ones who were "burned' could have been helped by earlier intervention on your part. Don't feel bad, you cannot save them all.

or if the questions are completely dodged like they are on this forum then that tells the potential recruit that the recruiter does not want to answer because the answer sucks What questions are dodged? I need to know as I am truly fearful of making statements that make me look like a fool. It's a whole self esteem issue thingy...

The military has so many f***ed up regulations on so many different things its not even funny, like the type of sunglasses you can wear because God forbid you have nice sunglasses that look cool Aghhh..... why would they have those regulations? Help me out.

or regulations on concealed weapons, nooooooo. Why?

heterosexual sex practices (of course I doubt these are followed I bet most married people in the military participate in oral sex but technically you can get in trouble for it), Oh my god. There is a regulation against going down on the ol lady. Wimmins Libbers aint gonna like it. BTW, which article of the UCMJ did you find that under? Why. Why......

types of boots you can wear cant have them be to nice or comfortable even if the soldier is willing to pay for them, why? Why? WHY?

I believe they make these regulations just to make peoples lives suck, AH, thank you. The tension was killing me. You are obviously an expert in this field. Thank you so much.

These are the real questions that need to be asked because no one talks about the benifits once your in, the questions that need to be asked are job satisfaction and quality of life.

The question that really needs an answer is:Why are you running scared from a one-on-one debate challenge (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568)?

Mr. P

03-08-2008, 07:02 PM

How many times do we have to go through this, joining was one of my lifes blunders the end.

So chalk it up to that, a blunder, by Mr. wizard, and move on instead of presenting yourself as someone with knowledge of the military, who really has no clue. That's the END kid.

rppearso

03-08-2008, 08:11 PM

Thank God you got to them in time. By talking them out of it you saved some overworked NCO a small bit of time. Tis a great thing lad, to know that you managed to talk the weak out of failure. Not like there was any chance that the .mil could have done em any good.

I'm certain that the nations recruiters are resting a bit easier knowing that your mightiness is not going to visit them. After all, at recruiting school they are taught not to do anything that might humiliate someone opposed to them. That kind of stress can lead to picking up strange women in the bars.

No doubt the ones who were "burned' could have been helped by earlier intervention on your part. Don't feel bad, you cannot save them all.

What questions are dodged? I need to know as I am truly fearful of making statements that make me look like a fool. It's a whole self esteem issue thingy...

Aghhh..... why would they have those regulations? Help me out.

nooooooo. Why?

Oh my god. There is a regulation against going down on the ol lady. Wimmins Libbers aint gonna like it. BTW, which article of the UCMJ did you find that under? Why. Why......

why? Why? WHY?

AH, thank you. The tension was killing me. You are obviously an expert in this field. Thank you so much.

The question that really needs an answer is:Why are you running scared from a one-on-one debate challenge (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568)?

I already addressed your questions on your side bar, you may not have liked the answers but I did post in your side bar. You just dodged every statement I made in the post you quoted me on, so I guess I cant really respond to anything.

Mr. P

03-08-2008, 08:52 PM

pegwinn

03-08-2008, 09:16 PM

I already addressed your questions on your side bar, you may not have liked the answers but I did post in your side bar. You just dodged every statement I made in the post you quoted me on, so I guess I cant really respond to anything.

I guess you don't habla very well do ya RP? So lemmie break it down....

What "sidebar" did you comment on that I dodged anything. :link::link::link:

Kathianne

03-08-2008, 09:16 PM

I guess you don't habla very well do ya RP? So lemmie break it down....

What "sidebar" did you comment on that I dodged anything. :link::link::link:

and why won't he take up the challenge to debate you?

pegwinn

03-09-2008, 12:29 AM

and why won't he take up the challenge to debate you?

Fear.

Abject utter wet-the-pants terror.

The horrified realisation that the guidelines require him to post original thoughts without the crutch of merely appearing to be clueless.

Now, I could very well be wrong.

nah..

DragonStryk72

03-09-2008, 01:12 AM

I already addressed your questions on your side bar, you may not have liked the answers but I did post in your side bar. You just dodged every statement I made in the post you quoted me on, so I guess I cant really respond to anything.

RP, either stop posting on the mil threads, or start posting on other threads. You keep going to this crap, and look like a complete a-hole Every Single Time. Do you like getting the crap kicked out of you verbally? It's always everyone else, RP, it was other in Boot, it's others on the board, it's never possibly you, just like, 90% of the rest of the world.

Unless you are going to take on Peg in debate, don't bother sweeping through these threads. You're already being looked at as a punk, as your rep shows. You insult the livelihood of a number of people on this forum, who has almost bent over backwards to set you straight, myself included, and we still keep getting slapped by you. You throw out these insults you refuse to back up, then tell people not to flame you, or accuse them of having done so. Unless you're here to debate, stop jumping in.

rppearso

03-09-2008, 01:25 PM

RP, either stop posting on the mil threads, or start posting on other threads. You keep going to this crap, and look like a complete a-hole Every Single Time. Do you like getting the crap kicked out of you verbally? It's always everyone else, RP, it was other in Boot, it's others on the board, it's never possibly you, just like, 90% of the rest of the world.

Unless you are going to take on Peg in debate, don't bother sweeping through these threads. You're already being looked at as a punk, as your rep shows. You insult the livelihood of a number of people on this forum, who has almost bent over backwards to set you straight, myself included, and we still keep getting slapped by you. You throw out these insults you refuse to back up, then tell people not to flame you, or accuse them of having done so. Unless you're here to debate, stop jumping in.

I already did debate in the side bar and am waiting for something worth while to reply to, unless something just posted I have not seen anything I can comment on when people can start consistantly posting intellectually stimulating posts we can get on a roll but there are always so many one liner flames in between and then people think they can argue me in circles because its been a few posts since I addressed the question that is the disadvantage of posting useless non thought provoking posts like oh your just a boy because I dont like your opinion so I just thought I would post that so I could participate.

pegwinn

03-09-2008, 02:08 PM

I already did debate in the side bar and am waiting for something worth while to reply to,

So now we can add lying to your list of things that piss us off.

rppearso

03-09-2008, 02:25 PM

So now we can add lying to your list of things that piss us off.

I have like 3 or 4 posts in your side bar so dont call me a lyer.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568&page=2

pegwinn

03-09-2008, 02:32 PM

I have like 3 or 4 posts in your side bar so dont call me a lyer.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=12568&page=2

Did you answer the terms of the challenge? No.
Did you come back with other terms to negotiate? No
Are you a liar and a coward? Yeah.

DragonStryk72

03-09-2008, 04:55 PM

I already did debate in the side bar and am waiting for something worth while to reply to, unless something just posted I have not seen anything I can comment on when people can start consistantly posting intellectually stimulating posts we can get on a roll but there are always so many one liner flames in between and then people think they can argue me in circles because its been a few posts since I addressed the question that is the disadvantage of posting useless non thought provoking posts like oh your just a boy because I dont like your opinion so I just thought I would post that so I could participate.

Okay, so it is completely okay for you to insult the people of this forum, insult the profession we chose to help defend the country, but we can't say boo to you, when you refuse to back up any of your statements with facts? so, basically, you just want to make random, anti-military comments and have people bask in your brilliance? Sorry, but that's just delusional.

I've not seen one single person on this forum flame you, so stop throwing everyone into the same basket like that. Yes, you have been called a coward, as well as been accused of lying, only due to your own refusal to stand your ground and back up what you say.

When you do mention something about backing up your posts, it is only to say that you aren't going to, because it would be "boring", and thus, you get cast not just as a liar, and a coward, but as well, it casts you as just plain lazy, which is also seen in your postings.

If you would simply adapt, back up these things your saying, and take up the challenge thread that was started for you, or if you would simply go to other threads and post something worthwhile there, your rep, and your experience with this board would improve, but if you change no numbers in the equation, you can expect the same answer to you, again and again.

rppearso

03-09-2008, 10:05 PM

Okay, so it is completely okay for you to insult the people of this forum, insult the profession we chose to help defend the country, but we can't say boo to you, when you refuse to back up any of your statements with facts? so, basically, you just want to make random, anti-military comments and have people bask in your brilliance? Sorry, but that's just delusional.

I've not seen one single person on this forum flame you, so stop throwing everyone into the same basket like that. Yes, you have been called a coward, as well as been accused of lying, only due to your own refusal to stand your ground and back up what you say.

When you do mention something about backing up your posts, it is only to say that you aren't going to, because it would be "boring", and thus, you get cast not just as a liar, and a coward, but as well, it casts you as just plain lazy, which is also seen in your postings.

If you would simply adapt, back up these things your saying, and take up the challenge thread that was started for you, or if you would simply go to other threads and post something worthwhile there, your rep, and your experience with this board would improve, but if you change no numbers in the equation, you can expect the same answer to you, again and again.

So maybe the challenge needs to be clarified because I felt I more than adaquatly defended my stance and all people have done to me is name call, so maybe pegwinn can go back and look at what I wrote otherwise I am at a point where I dont even know what we are talking about becasue my questions rarely get answered.

Here was my answer to the challenge:

The point I made was taken out of context as it usually is, my point was not towards the population in general that the military serves it was pointed towards contractors that provide high tech weapons of war that enable the military to dominate on the battle field. My beef is with thoes military members that snub the contractor because they are just dead beat civilians (paraphrase of what pegwin called them, I forget the term he used for civilian contractors). The bottem line is the military could not do jack squat without the technology that the contractor brings you (planes, tanks, body armor, guns, you name it a contractor smarter than you conceptualized it, designed it and built it. Some of this military hardware is a feat of human ingenuity (stealth technology, nuclear weapons, guided missles, etc) all also brought to you by the degenerate bum civilian contractor. Military get pissy when people dont respect the military but its ok to for them to disrespect civilian contractors, I just thought it was time some of these over zealous military members be put in there place, and regardless of what is said in these forums if you ever served in a national labratory or with high tech contractors you were on your best behavior otherwise you got your a$$ reamed, you dont treat GS-13 scientists like E-1 privates not even an O-10 can get away with it unless he has a really good reason nor do you treat a boeing engineer like an E-1 private.

And here was pegwinns response:

Let me see..... was there an acceptance in there somewhere?

Looked like weaseling out to me.

Good job pegwinn way to debate.

DragonStryk72

03-09-2008, 10:12 PM

So maybe the challenge needs to be clarified because I felt I more than adaquatly defended my stance and all people have done to me is name call, so maybe pegwinn can go back and look at what I wrote otherwise I am at a point where I dont even know what we are talking about becasue my questions rarely get answered.

No you haven't, you dodged, but you never back anything up. BACK UP WHAT YOU ARE PUTTING FORWARD AS FACT> :link: not just to prior stuff you said, but things you look on places like Google to support your claims. You know, evidence, use evidence.

Post on other threads non-military. respond to both points, or neither.

rppearso

03-09-2008, 10:29 PM

No you haven't, you dodged, but you never back anything up. BACK UP WHAT YOU ARE PUTTING FORWARD AS FACT> :link: not just to prior stuff you said, but things you look on places like Google to support your claims. You know, evidence, use evidence.

Post on other threads non-military. respond to both points, or neither.

I am not going to post links to things that are common knowlage, its common knowlage that civilians build everything you use and that was my whole point, im not going to post in threads if people dont have enough knowlage base in there own head to know simple facts, if it was something I felt should have a link I always provided it but never has once anyone conceded to anything even pegwinn trying to justify making derogitory remarks to GS-13's (a pouge).

pegwinn

03-09-2008, 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by rppearso http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=214511#post214511)
So maybe the challenge needs to be clarified because I felt I more than adaquatly defended my stance and all people have done to me is name call, so maybe pegwinn can go back and look at what I wrote otherwise I am at a point where I dont even know what we are talking about becasue my questions rarely get answered.

No you haven't, you dodged, but you never back anything up. BACK UP WHAT YOU ARE PUTTING FORWARD AS FACT> :link: not just to prior stuff you said, but things you look on places like Google to support your claims. You know, evidence, use evidence.

Post on other threads non-military. respond to both points, or neither.

Nice try DS. I got RP on my ignore list, but I can see when he's being quoted. All he had to do was read post number one of the challenge. It didn't need clarification. But, as you noted, he dodges, and fails to intelligently discuss anything. I applaud your attempts though.

rppearso

03-10-2008, 09:00 PM

Nice try DS. I got RP on my ignore list, but I can see when he's being quoted. All he had to do was read post number one of the challenge. It didn't need clarification. But, as you noted, he dodges, and fails to intelligently discuss anything. I applaud your attempts though.

I will answer the question even though my posts have nothing to do with the question asked. I would say if you average your civilian scum bags with civilians who are highly competent, military = civilian. However the upper eschlon of civilian contractors that make all the cool $hit the military uses are way above military members in intellegence. So did I answer your loaded question ok, I agree if you average the civilian population as a whole it probably about equals out because after all military members are made up of the civilian population.

Mr. P

03-10-2008, 09:14 PM

I will answer the question even though my posts have nothing to do with the question asked. I would say if you average your civilian scum bags with civilians who are highly competent, military = civilian. However the upper eschlon of civilian contractors that make all the cool $hit the military uses are way above military members in intellegence. So did I answer your loaded question ok, I agree if you average the civilian population as a whole it probably about equals out because after all military members are made up of the civilian population.

I wonder if our upper echelon can write anything close to coherent?

rppearso

03-10-2008, 09:32 PM

I wonder if our upper echelon can write anything close to coherent?

The military upper echelon are the same people with basket weaving degrees that have more time in. I will agree there are SOME smart people in the military, I believe an admiral helped invent the tommy gun which is pretty cool, he invented it with a civilian that pegwinn would probably call a pouge but the civilian did not have a hyped up title he was just a smart guy doing his thing without all the melodramatics of the military.

rppearso

03-10-2008, 09:36 PM

Basicly I dont like to be denigrated and yelled at so I would not recommend the military to anyone else just like I wouldent recommend a fraternity that hazed to anyone.

Kathianne

03-10-2008, 09:39 PM

Basicly I dont like to be denigrated and yelled at so I would not recommend the military to anyone else just like I wouldent recommend a fraternity that hazed to anyone.

I don't know of anything to say other than 'whatever.' You should not be addressing the young, as you haven't a clue yourself to where you've been or why.

TheStripey1

03-10-2008, 10:15 PM

5stringJeff

03-11-2008, 08:06 AM

Pale Rider

03-11-2008, 11:23 AM

I absolutely oppose mandatory service for all. If people don't want to serve their country, they should not be forced to.

Unless we need it, like when the regular troops we have are stretched so thin and combat tours are tripled or quadrupled, ahem.... like they are now. If people don't like that, I would suggest voting out the war mongers.

5stringJeff

03-11-2008, 11:38 AM

Unless we need it, like when the regular troops we have are stretched so thin and combat tours are tripled or quadrupled, ahem.... like they are now. If people don't like that, I would suggest voting out the war mongers.

If we "need it" in such circumstances, then citizen militia groups should suffice to protect the country until the Army can redeploy stateside. But, I agree that in general, we should reduce our overseas troop strength.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 04:10 PM

If we "need it" in such circumstances, then citizen militia groups should suffice to protect the country until the Army can redeploy stateside. But, I agree that in general, we should reduce our overseas troop strength.

If by citizen milita groups you are refering to the national guard they too are deployed right along with the regular army and are treated just like the regular army so they can not be relyed upon to defend us at home they are subject to deployments just like the regular army and reserves. When that changes then I agree you have an argument. If you are refering to random people who own firearms then I think you will be sorely disappointed at the disproportionate number of people who dont own significant enough firepower to really do anything (ie something more substantial than a 9mm hand gun and a .22 rifle), cost of firearms are very high for anything capable of laying down the smack (ie PTR-91, barret M82, LWRC, etc) there are also more legal barriers to owning a useful defense firearm than there ever has been in most states, some states still believe in the right to bare arms but most dont and have all sorts of convoluted regulations to make firearms owner ship more of a pain in the a$$ than its worth, time has value and most smart people dont want to waste it. So if something happened on our soil we would have the police force and what ever national gaurd happen to be here assuming all there equipment is not in iraq in which case they might just stay home and let the police force deal with it. If people dont live in reality pretty soon it will all come tumbling down.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 04:23 PM

I'm in favor of Mandatory Military Service for ALL Americans.

No service, no civilian privileges... which equates to having a job, a driver's license or entering into contracts... nothing... zip... zero... zilch...

naaaaaaaaadaaaaaaaaa...

I know, I know, neva hatchi, GI... but... I can dream, can't I?

So what would we do with the people that dont satisfactorly complete there military term, where would we deport them too, oh I know maybe would set up concentration camps for them and we could have put albert enstine (enstine was opposed to the military and through that brainless following of orders was stupid so maybe thats a good place for him, after all if hitler dident get him maybe the us government should have) there and warrner von braun and that is just the start then we could be a third world country, yep sounds like a good idea.

Nukeman

03-11-2008, 06:31 PM

So what would we do with the people that dont satisfactorly complete there military term, where would we deport them too, oh I know maybe would set up concentration camps for them and we could have put albert enstine (enstine was opposed to the military and through that brainless following of orders was stupid so maybe thats a good place for him, after all if hitler dident get him maybe the us government should have) there and warrner von braun and that is just the start then we could be a third world country, yep sounds like a good idea.

WORKS FOR ME JACKASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!:coffee:

5stringJeff

03-11-2008, 07:04 PM

If by citizen milita groups you are refering to the national guard they too are deployed right along with the regular army and are treated just like the regular army so they can not be relyed upon to defend us at home they are subject to deployments just like the regular army and reserves. When that changes then I agree you have an argument. If you are refering to random people who own firearms then I think you will be sorely disappointed at the disproportionate number of people who dont own significant enough firepower to really do anything (ie something more substantial than a 9mm hand gun and a .22 rifle), cost of firearms are very high for anything capable of laying down the smack (ie PTR-91, barret M82, LWRC, etc) there are also more legal barriers to owning a useful defense firearm than there ever has been in most states, some states still believe in the right to bare arms but most dont and have all sorts of convoluted regulations to make firearms owner ship more of a pain in the a$$ than its worth, time has value and most smart people dont want to waste it. So if something happened on our soil we would have the police force and what ever national gaurd happen to be here assuming all there equipment is not in iraq in which case they might just stay home and let the police force deal with it. If people dont live in reality pretty soon it will all come tumbling down.

The National Guard, being a part of the US Army, is not the militia. Many states have volunteer militia; the unorganized militia consists of all male citizens 18-64.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 08:37 PM

WORKS FOR ME JACKASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!:coffee:

Or we could just flee to other nations that are smart enough to recognize the extreme importance of scinetists and engineers and you would be living in a 3rd world nation fighting with spears getting smart bombs dropped on your stupid a$$ that were built by the engineers and scientists you displaced. So it works for me as well so it would be a win-loose situation where you loose, I can work with that. I recall this exact scenario happening about 70 yrs ago in europe, I guess history is bound to repeat itself maybe you can help make it happen nukeman maybe iceland will be the next USA they may have the politics but not the land mass or natural resources but then again neither does japan, am I going to fast for your pea brain nuke man.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 08:49 PM

The National Guard, being a part of the US Army, is not the militia. Many states have volunteer militia; the unorganized militia consists of all male citizens 18-64.

Orgainized milita seperate from federal influance while maintaining state ties and adaquate funding dont really exist anymore and the ones that do are subject to civilian firearms regulations and do not get special use exemptions (ie the LE only rights) nor do they get the funding to maintain such equipment. The unorganized militia by in large does not exist either, back in the day everyone had a weapon capable of engaging the enemy in a meaningfull manner now days like I said before such weapons are extremely expensive and many states have very stringent barriers to owning such weapons. So if the rubber ever met the road and you were relying on the "unorganized militia" or even the few states that have non funded semi orgainized militia you would be screwed. What am I going to do shoot at a tank with my .308, maybe if I had a barret M82 with armor piercing rounds and a thermal scope now we are talking and we are talking a price tag of 8K for the gun and ~ 8-10K for the thermal scope because im not going to have air support or artilery like an infantry unit might have so I need to get er done with what I have because the national assets will be broken down in iraq, I would rather by a nice sea doo ski boat or a down payment on my extra 300 plane. Are you catching my drift, if we had a system set up like switzerland we would do well.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 08:54 PM

I don't know of anything to say other than 'whatever.' You should not be addressing the young, as you haven't a clue yourself to where you've been or why.

Then why do you post, do you feel you need to post just "because". Why dont you debate what I said, it was about as simple as it gets, a one sentence simple explaination.

rppearso

03-11-2008, 09:00 PM

Mr. P

03-11-2008, 09:19 PM

Orgainized milita seperate from federal influance while maintaining state ties and adaquate funding dont really exist anymore and the ones that do are subject to civilian firearms regulations and do not get special use exemptions (ie the LE only rights) nor do they get the funding to maintain such equipment. The unorganized militia by in large does not exist either, back in the day everyone had a weapon capable of engaging the enemy in a meaningfull manner now days like I said before such weapons are extremely expensive and many states have very stringent barriers to owning such weapons. So if the rubber ever met the road and you were relying on the "unorganized militia" or even the few states that have non funded semi orgainized militia you would be screwed. What am I going to do shoot at a tank with my .308, maybe if I had a barret M82 with armor piercing rounds and a thermal scope now we are talking and we are talking a price tag of 8K for the gun and ~ 8-10K for the thermal scope because im not going to have air support or artilery like an infantry unit might have so I need to get er done with what I have because the national assets will be broken down in iraq, I would rather by a nice sea doo ski boat or a down payment on my extra 300 plane. Are you catching my drift, if we had a system set up like switzerland we would do well.

Yeah I do, again you have no CLUE and yer gonna run, again, and claim superiority.

There are hundreds of thousands of veterans in this country that DID complete their training. They also own firearms, and yes. they know how to use them. Do to their training they also know how to stop a tank without a high tech weapon. Make explosive devises and generally just make life miserable for any enemy before they kill them. They can drop you just as dead with a single shot .22LR as with an AK or M-16.

These folks haven't forgotten their training, and while the "intellectually elite" head for the hills with the women and children, these folks would form in mass to protect the country, if it was under attack, believe it!

DragonStryk72

03-12-2008, 01:56 AM

Yeah I do, again you have no CLUE and yer gonna run, again, and claim superiority.

There are hundreds of thousands of veterans in this country that DID complete their training. They also own firearms, and yes. they know how to use them. Do to their training they also know how to stop a tank without a high tech weapon. Make explosive devises and generally just make life miserable for any enemy before they kill them. They can drop you just as dead with a single shot .22LR as with an AK or M-16.

These folks haven't forgotten their training, and while the "intellectually elite" head for the hills with the women and children, these folks would form in mass to protect the country, if it was under attack, believe it!

I know you're trying to reason with RP, I understand, I was there too man, but you've gotta just let it go. He's not going to back anything up, he's not going to contribute anything. Just act as though he isn't there, just some warped voice in your head.

Pale Rider

03-12-2008, 02:25 AM

BTW pale rider, I spent 2 yrs in the national guard and 2 years in AFROTC enough to know alot of people in the military dont have it going on upstairs. I think this site needs some controls on the reputation, granted I have talked down about the militry hard but I have always backed it up, if people fail to recognize that its not my fault. basicly all you have to do is say me not like his opinion so me neg rep me not care about logic me just neg rep and flame and post ignorant one liners, its almost like shooting baby ducks in a bucket.

Even as incoherent as your post is, I still smell a rat. First off, I don't believe your claim that you were in AFROTC for a second. I takes a pretty sharp individual to get in there, and if you're not, you get washed out.

You're just a military hater, admit it.

Nukeman

03-12-2008, 07:35 AM

Or we could just flee to other nations that are smart enough to recognize the extreme importance of scinetists and engineers .

From your post I gather your pretty good at cutting and running!!

and you would be living in a 3rd world nation fighting with spears getting smart bombs dropped on your stupid a$$ that were built by the engineers and scientists you displaced.

So in your world the military is filled with...... let me get this straight.....IDIOTS! Who in no way have EVER contributed ANYTHING to society.

Where do you think a lot of the "engineers" get their practicle training, education and experience. The Air Force Acadamy has one of the Best propulsion and airospace engineering programs in the world...

So it works for me as well so it would be a win-loose situation where you loose, I can work with that.
I lose huh!!! Well you and your pacifist "scientist" with NO money and NO military to PROTECT you go right ahead and attempt to protect YOURSELF..

I recall this exact scenario happening about 70 yrs ago in europe, I guess history is bound to repeat itself

Really YOU recall!!!! Hmmmm.... how old are you again, because to recall something you have to have lived it!!! Am I going to fast for you and YOUR pea brain??

maybe you can help make it happen nukeman maybe iceland will be the next USA they may have the politics but not the land mass or natural resources but then again neither does japan, am I going to fast for your pea brain nuke manJapan was founded and fourished under a strict military "type" code. Also Japan has not been the "innovator" they have been great at taking a product reverse engineering it and sometimes making it better....

YOU need to realize that without the MILITARY to SPEND and PAY the salaries of these "scientist" you speak of they wouldn't have the ability to put into practice what they have learned in school. Also numb nuts if your not in a military society WHY would your scientist be building BOMBS and other armorments???

You are like a broken record that is in serious need of disposal. Ohh take a hint from others. TAKE A FUCKING ENGLISH CLASS AND LEARN TO WRITE A COHERENT SENTENCE. YOU FUCKING GENIOUS YOU!!!!

Mr. P

03-12-2008, 08:44 AM

I know you're trying to reason with RP, I understand, I was there too man, but you've gotta just let it go. He's not going to back anything up, he's not going to contribute anything. Just act as though he isn't there, just some warped voice in your head.

Oh NO, I'm not trying to reason with him. rppearso is like a pile of Bullshit that I usually step over. When I see said pile of BS, I often feel the obligation to point it out to others so they know it's there. That"s all. :)

Monkeybone

03-12-2008, 08:54 AM

BTW pale rider, I spent 2 yrs in the national guard and 2 years in AFROTC enough to know alot of people in the military dont have it going on upstairs. I think this site needs some controls on the reputation, granted I have talked down about the militry hard but I have always backed it up, if people fail to recognize that its not my fault. basicly all you have to do is say me not like his opinion so me neg rep me not care about logic me just neg rep and flame and post ignorant one liners, its almost like shooting baby ducks in a bucket.

wait...i thought that you were in the guard and you were going to go to OTS and wished that you had done AFROTC....

Nukeman

03-12-2008, 09:06 AM

wait...i thought that you were in the guard and you were going to go to OTS and wished that you had done AFROTC....Monkey, dont confuse him with his other post!! He is jsut making shit up and can't keep track of his lies..........

Monkeybone

03-12-2008, 09:21 AM

Monkey, dont confuse him with his other post!! He is just making shit up and can't keep track of his lies..........

oh my bad. me and my wanting to get things staright.

rppearso

03-12-2008, 11:22 AM

Pale Rider

03-12-2008, 12:18 PM

Lets just stick with this I think its simple enough,

Basicly I dont like to be denigrated and yelled at so I would not recommend the military to anyone else just like I wouldent recommend a fraternity that hazed to anyone. Does this cut the BS enough.

The military builds character. It takes a certain amount of guts and determination to get through it. Obviously you have neither. You openly admit your a pussy and couldn't cut it. Fine. I can live with that. The military is better off without sissies like you anyway.

Monkeybone

03-12-2008, 12:57 PM

Lets just stick with this I think its simple enough,

Basicly I dont like to be denigrated and yelled at so I would not recommend the military to anyone else just like I wouldent recommend a fraternity that hazed to anyone. Does this cut the BS enough.

is that engineer for " oops, i got mixed up in my story so i have to backpedal now and can't think of a repsonse"?

Pale Rider

03-14-2008, 09:01 AM

If we "need it" in such circumstances, then citizen militia groups should suffice to protect the country until the Army can redeploy stateside. But, I agree that in general, we should reduce our overseas troop strength.

I grew up with the draft. Although my father, brother and I all volunteered, brother and I both during the Veit Nam war, the draft was always there. I see nothing wrong with it and think we should have it now. Or military is far too small for the all the war they're expected to fight. It's my opinion that if Guard and Reserves are called to duty to fight in a war on foreign soil, we need to reenact the draft.

rppearso

03-14-2008, 05:51 PM

I grew up with the draft. Although my father, brother and I all volunteered, brother and I both during the Veit Nam war, the draft was always there. I see nothing wrong with it and think we should have it now. Or military is far too small for the all the war they're expected to fight. It's my opinion that if Guard and Reserves are called to duty to fight in a war on foreign soil, we need to reenact the draft.

I would definatly agree with this they need to restart the draft, however, the draft is extremely politically charged right now. Bare in mind that when you draft you get a bunch of people who dont want to be there and you loose your signed on the dotted line argument, which is the biggest argument troop handlers make when dealing with people who dont want to be there.

Gunny

03-15-2008, 11:21 AM

BTW pale rider, I spent 2 yrs in the national guard and 2 years in AFROTC enough to know alot of people in the military dont have it going on upstairs. I think this site needs some controls on the reputation, granted I have talked down about the militry hard but I have always backed it up, if people fail to recognize that its not my fault. basicly all you have to do is say me not like his opinion so me neg rep me not care about logic me just neg rep and flame and post ignorant one liners, its almost like shooting baby ducks in a bucket.

Wow. Two years in the Guard and AFROTC. :bow2:

The closest you came to reality was Army basic training; otherwise, you don't know shit and your comments qualify as nothing more than unsubstantiated specualtion.

pegwinn

03-15-2008, 01:00 PM

Guns, the best thing is to put RP on the ignore listing. Then everythime you see his name there is a factual comment next to it.

Several vets have tried to engage with him. Problem is he is mired in a world where his Mama tole him that he could be anything he wanted to be. When proven wrong, he snapped.

rppearso

03-15-2008, 04:11 PM

Wow. Two years in the Guard and AFROTC. :bow2:

The closest you came to reality was Army basic training; otherwise, you don't know shit and your comments qualify as nothing more than unsubstantiated specualtion.

And basic training was absolute hell, and being in the guard was not that great either so why should I recommend joining the military to anyone, if you want to thats fine im just telling you I would not recommend it. I am not sure why I am getting flamed, I hated it and thats my opinion. That is why I said this OP should be renamed to you better encourage people to join and if not you better have a reason so good that even pegwin would agree, I thought this discussion board was about stating your opinion, not everyone is cut out for the military so why should everyone join. I think I am going to start a new thread regarding the draft, it would be interesting to see peoples opinions.

Gunny

03-15-2008, 04:36 PM

And basic training was absolute hell, and being in the guard was not that great either so why should I recommend joining the military to anyone, if you want to thats fine im just telling you I would not recommend it. I am not sure why I am getting flamed, I hated it and thats my opinion. That is why I said this OP should be renamed to you better encourage people to join and if not you better have a reason so good that even pegwin would agree, I thought this discussion board was about stating your opinion, not everyone is cut out for the military so why should everyone join. I think I am going to start a new thread regarding the draft, it would be interesting to see peoples opinions.

I assume since you quoted me, that you are asking why *I* am flaming you; to which, I will respond with: WHAT flame?

I have not denied your opinion. In proper context, I agree wholeheartedly with the MSgt that if you're going to have an opinion against joining the military, it should be based on something a bit more substantial than your personal distaste for it.

I agree with your opinion that not everyone is cut out to be in the military, and I am certainly not making an argument that "everyone" should join.

Odd, my daughter says Army basic training is easier than being my daughter.:drillsarge:

rppearso

03-16-2008, 02:27 AM

I assume since you quoted me, that you are asking why *I* am flaming you; to which, I will respond with: WHAT flame?

I have not denied your opinion. In proper context, I agree wholeheartedly with the MSgt that if you're going to have an opinion against joining the military, it should be based on something a bit more substantial than your personal distaste for it.

I agree with your opinion that not everyone is cut out to be in the military, and I am certainly not making an argument that "everyone" should join.

Odd, my daughter says Army basic training is easier than being my daughter.:drillsarge:

The flame remark was directed at many others regarding this tread. If you puruse through the thread you will see why I hated the military, it boils down to I did not like getting yelled at, sleep deprivation, etc etc which I consider hazing, if the same things were done at a fraterntiy it would be considered hazing and they would be thrown off campus, please keep in mind I am not debating the military's legal right to do what they do im just saying I was not willing to tolerate it and I dont think it makes me a bad person for quiting the military and getting out of my contract early, others may not think so but thats there opinion.

shattered

03-16-2008, 10:21 AM

The flame remark was directed at many others regarding this tread. If you puruse through the thread you will see why I hated the military, it boils down to I did not like getting yelled at, sleep deprivation, etc etc which I consider hazing, if the same things were done at a fraterntiy it would be considered hazing and they would be thrown off campus, please keep in mind I am not debating the military's legal right to do what they do im just saying I was not willing to tolerate it and I dont think it makes me a bad person for quiting the military and getting out of my contract early, others may not think so but thats there opinion.

Curious.. What did you join for? What did you think would happen? That you'd wake up whenever convenient for you, and shuffle your way to a desk for a few hours, then sit down to a steak dinner?

Gunny

03-16-2008, 10:23 AM

The flame remark was directed at many others regarding this tread. If you puruse through the thread you will see why I hated the military, it boils down to I did not like getting yelled at, sleep deprivation, etc etc which I consider hazing, if the same things were done at a fraterntiy it would be considered hazing and they would be thrown off campus, please keep in mind I am not debating the military's legal right to do what they do im just saying I was not willing to tolerate it and I dont think it makes me a bad person for quiting the military and getting out of my contract early, others may not think so but thats there opinion.

The fact that you, at the individual level, could not adapt to the military lifestyle is not, IMO, justification to hate the military itself.

pegwinn

03-16-2008, 04:27 PM

Well it's a slow day. So I unignored RP to see if he'd come round.

And basic training was absolute hell, and being in the guard was not that great either so why should I recommend joining the military to anyone, if you want to thats fine im just telling you I would not recommend it. Now, lookee here. You have made an opinion and defended it without insulting other folks. You should have taken that approach awile back.

I am not sure why I am getting flamed, I hated it and thats my opinion. That is why I said this OP should be renamed to you better encourage people to join and if not you better have a reason so good that even pegwin would agree, Heh. I like that. I have such an influence on you. You still don't get it.

I thought this discussion board was about stating your opinion, not everyone is cut out for the military so why should everyone join. I think I am going to start a new thread regarding the draft, it would be interesting to see peoples opinions. So long as you can make a point intelligently you might be surprised.

The flame remark was directed at many others regarding this tread. If you puruse through the thread you will see why I hated the military, it boils down to I did not like getting yelled at, sleep deprivation, etc etc which I consider hazing, if the same things were done at a fraterntiy it would be considered hazing and they would be thrown off campus, It's not a fraternity. Apples and Oranges. I cannot believe that someone who claims to be an engineer and a powerlifter to boot had no idea what he was getting into.

please keep in mind I am not debating the military's legal right to do what they do im just saying I was not willing to tolerate it and I dont think it makes me a bad person for quiting the military and getting out of my contract early, others may not think so but thats there opinion. It doesn't automatically make you a bad person. It makes you a quitter.

So how is everyone doing?