Clinton Gets No Love in Democrats Debate

[Pale Rider]

Clinton Gets No Love in Democrats Debate



Oct 31 01:36 PM US/Eastern
By NEDRA PICKLER
Associated Press Writer


PHILADELPHIA (AP) - In the City of Brotherly Love, there wasn't much for a sister.

Hillary Rodham Clinton's rivals ganged up on her during a two-hour Democratic presidential debate Tuesday night, putting the front-runner on defense on issues ranging from Iraq and Iran to Social Security and whether she would be electable in the general election.

Gone was the Clinton who laughed off their answers and joked about how she's lucky to be getting so much attention from all these men at her age. Clinton clearly had decided she must defend herself from rivals who are right on her heels in the leadoff voting state of Iowa and who pose a real threat to her winning the Democratic nomination.

Still, she continued her strategy of avoiding direct answers to questions: She wouldn't say how she would address Social Security; she declined to pledge whether she would stop Iran from developing a nuclear weapon, or say whether she supports giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

Instead she tried to tried to turn every issue into an argument against President Bush. She said Bush's name 25 times, more than all six of her rivals combined.

"I think we were making progress in the 1990s and I am very proud of the progress we were making until, unfortunately, the Supreme Court handed the presidency to George Bush, and we have been living with the consequences ever since," Clinton said.

Costas Panagopoulos, a Fordham University political science professor, said Clinton ran against Bush while her rivals ran against her.

"This may be a useful strategy for a front-runner, but it only reinforces her status as the Democratic front-runner," he said. "And her Democratic opponents may also be helping to solidify her leading position in the minds of voters by going full-throttle on the attack against her."

Among the most pointed criticisms of Clinton were about whether she represents the Democratic Party's best candidate for the general election.

"Will she be the person who brings about the change in this country?" 2004 vice presidential nominee John Edwards said. "You know, I believe in Santa Claus. I believe in the tooth fairy. But I don't think that's going to happen."

Illinois Sen. Barack Obama turned to Clinton and suggested she is the GOP's dream opponent. "Part of the reason that Republicans, I think, are obsessed with you, Hillary, is because that's a fight they're very comfortable having."

Chimed in Connecticut Sen. Chris Dodd, "Whether it's fair or not fair, the fact of the matter is that my colleague from New York, Senator Clinton, there are 50 percent of the American public that say they're not going to vote for her."

And even when New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson came to Clinton's defense, chiding his rivals for coming close to making personal attacks, it came with a twist of the knife. He criticized her for failing to pledge to bring all troops out of Iraq or end Bush's education program and for "saber-rattling" against Iran.

University of Missouri-Columbia professor Mitchell McKinney said he felt Clinton held up pretty well to the barrage of attacks, but she always has to be sensitive to her reputation for being too shrill.

"I do think there's been a few spots tonight when her advisers have been off stage or in the media center clenching their teeth that she's come perilously close to seeming too angry," he said. "But I think balancing this is the likely perception that there was a bit of piling on."

McKinney said Clinton grew testy when pressed on whether she agrees with a proposal her home state governor has to give driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. She first expressed support for the idea. But when Dodd objected, Clinton grew defensive and said she wasn't saying it should be done, although she recognizes why the governor is trying to do it even though she doesn't think it's "the best thing for any governor to do."

Edwards pounced. "Unless I missed something, Senator Clinton said two different things in the course of about two minutes," he said. "America is looking for a president who will say the same thing, who will be consistent, who will be straight with them."


Rest at link


http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8SKBR300&show_article=1

[PostmodernProphet]

there are 50 percent of the American public that say they're not going to vote for her

well that sucks, I was hoping the Democrats forgot about that until after the national convention.....

[Pale Rider]

well that sucks, I was hoping the Democrats forgot about that until after the national convention.....

And that's why you don't see the Republican candidates ganging up on her. They know if she gets the lib nomination, she's a sure loser. They want her nominated.

[hjmick]

She got no love, but she did get spanked. :coffee:

[typomaniac]

there are 50 percent of the American public that say they're not going to vote for her well that sucks, I was hoping the Democrats forgot about that until after the national convention.....

Of course they're not going to vote FOR her. They're going to vote AGAINST the Republican.

[Pale Rider]

Of course they're not going to vote FOR her. They're going to vote AGAINST the Republican.

That still doesn't mean she, personally, will get votes. People can vote against Republicans and not for her.

[typomaniac]

That still doesn't mean she, personally, will get votes. People can vote against Republicans and not for her.

Absolutely. But when only two parties have a de facto lock on the electorate ( :mad: ), you end up with only the losing candidate deserving to lose, and the winner usually wins only by default. An excellent example is when Perot decided to run in 92.

[Pale Rider]

Absolutely. But when only two parties have a de facto lock on the electorate ( :mad: ), you end up with only the losing candidate deserving to lose, and the winner usually wins only by default. An excellent example is when Perot decided to run in 92.

And that makes this election very interesting. Because if people vote against the repubs, and not for hillary, and repubs do the same thing, as I will if Giuliani is the nominee, I'll vote repub, but not for him, this race could get real interesting real quick.

So if hillary is the dem candidate, and giuliani is the repub, the election could go either way, because people on both sides will be doing the same thing. Voting their party but not for their candidate.

My choices have been the same for almost a year now...

1.) Tancredo
2.) Hunter
3.) Paul

Anybody else but one of those for prez, and I'll write Tancredo in.

[Guernicaa]

Let us not forget the quote of the night though, and this should warn Republicans while they still have the chance to choose differently:

"And the irony is, Rudy Giuliani, probably the most underqualified man since George Bush to seek the presidency, is here talking about any of the people here. Rudy Giuliani... I mean, think about it! Rudy Giuliani. There's only three things he mentions in a sentence -- a noun, a verb, and 9/11. There's nothing else! There's nothing else! And I mean this sincerely. He's genuinely not qualified to be president."
-Joe Biden

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/10/30/biden-rudys-sentences-c_n_70509.html

Barack Obamas gonna get the nomination and hes going to slap the Republican across the face.

[Pale Rider]

Let us not forget the quote of the night though, and this should warn Republicans while they still have the chance to choose differently:

"And the irony is, Rudy Giuliani, probably the most underqualified man since George Bush to seek the presidency, is here talking about any of the people here. Rudy Giuliani... I mean, think about it! Rudy Giuliani. There's only three things he mentions in a sentence -- a noun, a verb, and 9/11. There's nothing else! There's nothing else! And I mean this sincerely. He's genuinely not qualified to be president."
-Joe Biden

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/10/30/biden-rudys-sentences-c_n_70509.html

Barack Obamas gonna get the nomination and hes going to slap the Republican across the face.


Well... he's no doubt more qualified to be President than hillary, but you don't have to convince me not to vote for him. I'm not. He's a liberal.

But you're right, the rest of the Republican party better get that before it's too late.

I don't know about any slapping.

[PostmodernProphet]

Voting their party but not for their candidate.

this ignores the fact that neither party has enough members to get their candidate elected simply along party lines.....you need to win over the independants.....and in that scenario, the candidate with the highest negative factor loses......

[Pale Rider]

this ignores the fact that neither party has enough members to get their candidate elected simply along party lines.....you need to win over the independants.....and in that scenario, the candidate with the highest negative factor loses......

I don't know if that will hold true in this election. Because they estimate as high as one third of Republican voters such as myself say they will not vote for giuliani.

[actsnoblemartin]

thats good :))

Let her get nailed,probably the only time she will :lol:



Clinton Gets No Love in Democrats Debate



Oct 31 01:36 PM US/Eastern
By NEDRA PICKLER
Associated Press Writer


PHILADELPHIA (AP) - In the City of Brotherly Love, there wasn't much for a sister.

Hillary Rodham Clinton's rivals ganged up on her during a two-hour Democratic presidential debate Tuesday night, putting the front-runner on defense on issues ranging from Iraq and Iran to Social Security and whether she would be electable in the general election.

Gone was the Clinton who laughed off their answers and joked about how she's lucky to be getting so much attention from all these men at her age. Clinton clearly had decided she must defend herself from rivals who are right on her heels in the leadoff voting state of Iowa and who pose a real threat to her winning the Democratic nomination.

Still, she continued her strategy of avoiding direct answers to questions: She wouldn't say how she would address Social Security; she declined to pledge whether she would stop Iran from developing a nuclear weapon, or say whether she supports giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

Instead she tried to tried to turn every issue into an argument against President Bush. She said Bush's name 25 times, more than all six of her rivals combined.

"I think we were making progress in the 1990s and I am very proud of the progress we were making until, unfortunately, the Supreme Court handed the presidency to George Bush, and we have been living with the consequences ever since," Clinton said.

Costas Panagopoulos, a Fordham University political science professor, said Clinton ran against Bush while her rivals ran against her.

"This may be a useful strategy for a front-runner, but it only reinforces her status as the Democratic front-runner," he said. "And her Democratic opponents may also be helping to solidify her leading position in the minds of voters by going full-throttle on the attack against her."

Among the most pointed criticisms of Clinton were about whether she represents the Democratic Party's best candidate for the general election.

"Will she be the person who brings about the change in this country?" 2004 vice presidential nominee John Edwards said. "You know, I believe in Santa Claus. I believe in the tooth fairy. But I don't think that's going to happen."

Illinois Sen. Barack Obama turned to Clinton and suggested she is the GOP's dream opponent. "Part of the reason that Republicans, I think, are obsessed with you, Hillary, is because that's a fight they're very comfortable having."

Chimed in Connecticut Sen. Chris Dodd, "Whether it's fair or not fair, the fact of the matter is that my colleague from New York, Senator Clinton, there are 50 percent of the American public that say they're not going to vote for her."

And even when New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson came to Clinton's defense, chiding his rivals for coming close to making personal attacks, it came with a twist of the knife. He criticized her for failing to pledge to bring all troops out of Iraq or end Bush's education program and for "saber-rattling" against Iran.

University of Missouri-Columbia professor Mitchell McKinney said he felt Clinton held up pretty well to the barrage of attacks, but she always has to be sensitive to her reputation for being too shrill.

"I do think there's been a few spots tonight when her advisers have been off stage or in the media center clenching their teeth that she's come perilously close to seeming too angry," he said. "But I think balancing this is the likely perception that there was a bit of piling on."

McKinney said Clinton grew testy when pressed on whether she agrees with a proposal her home state governor has to give driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. She first expressed support for the idea. But when Dodd objected, Clinton grew defensive and said she wasn't saying it should be done, although she recognizes why the governor is trying to do it even though she doesn't think it's "the best thing for any governor to do."

Edwards pounced. "Unless I missed something, Senator Clinton said two different things in the course of about two minutes," he said. "America is looking for a president who will say the same thing, who will be consistent, who will be straight with them."


Rest at link


http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8SKBR300&show_article=1

[PostmodernProphet]

I don't know if that will hold true in this election. Because they estimate as high as one third of Republican voters such as myself say they will not vote for giuliani.

actually, I think it proves my point....it means he has a high negative factor....its a question of calculating the groups.....if Clinton gets 90% of the Democrats but 10% of the Independents.....and Giuliani gets 60% of the Republicans but 90% of the Independents.....who knows.....

[Pale Rider]

actually, I think it proves my point....it means he has a high negative factor....its a question of calculating the groups.....if Clinton gets 90% of the Democrats but 10% of the Independents.....and Giuliani gets 60% of the Republicans but 90% of the Independents.....who knows.....

That's why this election, with no incumbent running, and some very polarizing candidates as well, anything can happen. Calling it is a crap shoot.

[PostmodernProphet]

not only that but you still have the electoral college situation.....

let's say Clinton improves the Dems lead in California and New York to 99% and Guliani looses support in the states that went for Bush so he only wins them by 51% instead of 70%.....then you still have a Republican president......

[actsnoblemartin]

She doesnt deserve kid gloves, she is the front runner.

She duck and dodged that question on illegals, like a boxers.

very :lame2: on her part.

She has three positions on every issue

The wrong one , the popular one, and the one the audience wants to hear



Clinton Gets No Love in Democrats Debate



Oct 31 01:36 PM US/Eastern
By NEDRA PICKLER
Associated Press Writer


PHILADELPHIA (AP) - In the City of Brotherly Love, there wasn't much for a sister.

Hillary Rodham Clinton's rivals ganged up on her during a two-hour Democratic presidential debate Tuesday night, putting the front-runner on defense on issues ranging from Iraq and Iran to Social Security and whether she would be electable in the general election.

Gone was the Clinton who laughed off their answers and joked about how she's lucky to be getting so much attention from all these men at her age. Clinton clearly had decided she must defend herself from rivals who are right on her heels in the leadoff voting state of Iowa and who pose a real threat to her winning the Democratic nomination.

Still, she continued her strategy of avoiding direct answers to questions: She wouldn't say how she would address Social Security; she declined to pledge whether she would stop Iran from developing a nuclear weapon, or say whether she supports giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

Instead she tried to tried to turn every issue into an argument against President Bush. She said Bush's name 25 times, more than all six of her rivals combined.

"I think we were making progress in the 1990s and I am very proud of the progress we were making until, unfortunately, the Supreme Court handed the presidency to George Bush, and we have been living with the consequences ever since," Clinton said.

Costas Panagopoulos, a Fordham University political science professor, said Clinton ran against Bush while her rivals ran against her.

"This may be a useful strategy for a front-runner, but it only reinforces her status as the Democratic front-runner," he said. "And her Democratic opponents may also be helping to solidify her leading position in the minds of voters by going full-throttle on the attack against her."

Among the most pointed criticisms of Clinton were about whether she represents the Democratic Party's best candidate for the general election.

"Will she be the person who brings about the change in this country?" 2004 vice presidential nominee John Edwards said. "You know, I believe in Santa Claus. I believe in the tooth fairy. But I don't think that's going to happen."

Illinois Sen. Barack Obama turned to Clinton and suggested she is the GOP's dream opponent. "Part of the reason that Republicans, I think, are obsessed with you, Hillary, is because that's a fight they're very comfortable having."

Chimed in Connecticut Sen. Chris Dodd, "Whether it's fair or not fair, the fact of the matter is that my colleague from New York, Senator Clinton, there are 50 percent of the American public that say they're not going to vote for her."

And even when New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson came to Clinton's defense, chiding his rivals for coming close to making personal attacks, it came with a twist of the knife. He criticized her for failing to pledge to bring all troops out of Iraq or end Bush's education program and for "saber-rattling" against Iran.

University of Missouri-Columbia professor Mitchell McKinney said he felt Clinton held up pretty well to the barrage of attacks, but she always has to be sensitive to her reputation for being too shrill.

"I do think there's been a few spots tonight when her advisers have been off stage or in the media center clenching their teeth that she's come perilously close to seeming too angry," he said. "But I think balancing this is the likely perception that there was a bit of piling on."

McKinney said Clinton grew testy when pressed on whether she agrees with a proposal her home state governor has to give driver's licenses to illegal immigrants. She first expressed support for the idea. But when Dodd objected, Clinton grew defensive and said she wasn't saying it should be done, although she recognizes why the governor is trying to do it even though she doesn't think it's "the best thing for any governor to do."

Edwards pounced. "Unless I missed something, Senator Clinton said two different things in the course of about two minutes," he said. "America is looking for a president who will say the same thing, who will be consistent, who will be straight with them."


Rest at link


http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8SKBR300&show_article=1

[manu1959]

yea....this comming from a man that proves every 4 years he is not qualified....

fuck knows why he keeps getting elected to the post he has..


Let us not forget the quote of the night though, and this should warn Republicans while they still have the chance to choose differently:

"And the irony is, Rudy Giuliani, probably the most underqualified man since George Bush to seek the presidency, is here talking about any of the people here. Rudy Giuliani... I mean, think about it! Rudy Giuliani. There's only three things he mentions in a sentence -- a noun, a verb, and 9/11. There's nothing else! There's nothing else! And I mean this sincerely. He's genuinely not qualified to be president."
-Joe Biden

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/10/30/biden-rudys-sentences-c_n_70509.html

Barack Obamas gonna get the nomination and hes going to slap the Republican across the face.

[manu1959]

I don't know if that will hold true in this election. Because they estimate as high as one third of Republican voters such as myself say they will not vote for giuliani.

true but giuliani will get a block of liberal republicans and conservative democrats....that you guys wouldn't...

[Yurt]

Of course they're not going to vote FOR her. They're going to vote AGAINST the Republican.

universal health care :poke:

try to learn how to spell communist right