PDA

View Full Version : To Hell With 'Proportional'



Kathianne
10-02-2024, 06:52 PM
The best way to end the war is to destroy the head of the snake:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/biden-us-opposes-israel-hitting-iran-nuclear-sites-response-should-be-proportional/



Biden: US opposes Israel hitting Iran nuclear sites, response should be ‘proportional’President says Israel has right to hit back and that G7 leaders agreed to sanction Iran over missile attack; cabinet said holding off on response pending coordination with Washington
By Jacob Magid, Follow
ToI Staff and Agencies
3 October 2024, 1:33 am
21
US President Joe Biden speaks to reporters before boarding Air Force One at Joint Base Andrews in Maryland on October 2, 2024. (Mandel Ngan / AFP)
US President Joe Biden speaks to reporters before boarding Air Force One at Joint Base Andrews in Maryland on October 2, 2024. (Mandel Ngan / AFP)
US President Joe Biden said Wednesday that he opposes Israel striking Iran’s nuclear facilities in retaliation for Iran’s ballistic missile attack, telling reporters that Jerusalem has a right to respond but that it should do so “proportionally.”


Biden did say that sanctions would be imposed against Iran and that he discussed the idea with the leaders of the G7 countries in a joint call earlier Wednesday.


“We’ll be discussing with the Israelis what they’re going to do, but all seven of us agree that they have a right to respond but they should respond proportionally,” Biden told reporters before boarding Air Force One. “Obviously, Iran is way off course.”


Drone strike in Tel Aviv
Keep Watching








Israel is reportedly mulling an attack on Iran’s nuclear or oil facilities as part of the retaliation for Tuesday’s attack, which saw Iran fire 181 ballistic missiles at Israel, sending most of the country into bomb shelters and causing considerable damage but only one known fatality — a Palestinian man in the West Bank.


Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu declared soon after the attack that Iran had made “a big mistake” and would “pay the price.”


Get The Times of Israel's Daily Edition
by email and never miss our top stories
Newsletter email address
Your email
Get it
By signing up, you agree to the terms
Speaking to reporters in Washington, Biden urged Israel to respond “proportionally” to the attack. Asked whether he backs a strike on Iranian nuclear sites, Biden responded: “The answer is no.”




Members of Israel’s Home Front Command and police forces inspect a crater left by an exploded projectile at a heavily-damaged school building in Israel’s southern city of Gedera on October 1, 2024, after Iran launched a barrage of missiles at Israel (Menahem KAHANA / AFP)
In a meeting after the attack Tuesday evening, Israel’s cabinet had determined to respond forcefully, but to first coordinate with Washington, according to Channel 12.


The Kan public broadcaster cited diplomatic sources as saying Israel’s response would not lead to regional war and reported that the US presidential election next month was a factor in Israeli deliberations.


Advertisement


Missiles launched from Iran towards Israel are seen over Jerusalem, on October 1, 2024. (Noam Revkin Fenton/Flash90)
After the G7 meeting, the White House said Biden had coordinated the multilateral rollout of new sanctions on Iran, and that he and the body “unequivocally condemned Iran’s attack against Israel.”


IDF Chief of Staff Lt. Gen. Herzi Halevi said Wednesday that Israel would respond to the Iranian attack, and noted that the military has the capability to “reach and strike any point in the Middle East.”


“Those of our enemies who have not understood this until now, will understand it soon,” he said in a video statement, during a visit to the Tel Nof Airbase.


“Iran fired about 200 missiles at the State of Israel yesterday. Iran attacked civilian areas and endangered the lives of many civilians. Thanks to proper civilian behavior and high-quality defense, the damage is relatively small,” Halevi noted. But, he added, “We will respond; we know how to locate important targets; we know how to strike accurately and powerfully.”




IDF Chief of Staff Lt. Gen. Herzi Halevi speaks in a video statement from the Tel Nof Airbase in central Israel, October 2, 2024. (Israel Defense Forces)
US Deputy Secretary of State Kurt Campbell said the Biden administration was seeking to align its position with Israel on any response to Iran’s attack, but also recognized the Middle East was on a “knife’s edge” and that a broader escalation could imperil both Israeli and US interests.


Speaking at a virtual event hosted by Washington-based think tank Carnegie Endowment, Campbell repeated the US view that what Tehran has undertaken was “deeply irresponsible” and that there must be a “return message.”


Advertisement
“I think we tried to underscore our support for some of the actions that Israel has taken,” he added.


“We have real wariness about an extended or substantial ground set of operations in Lebanon,” Campbell said, echoing the White House’s misgivings over Israel’s limited invasion of Lebanon Monday.




Kurt Campbell, then-US National Security Council Coordinator for Indo-Pacific Affairs, Senate hearing to confirm his appointment as Deputy Secretary of State, on Capitol Hill in Washington, December 7, 2023. (AP Photo/Mariam Zuhaib)
Israel says its ground operation close to the border in southern Lebnanon aims to remove the threat posed by Iran’s Lebanese proxy Hezbollah, whose relentless rocket fire since October 8 has forced tens of thousands of northern residents from their homes.


Linda Thomas-Greenfield, Washington’s ambassador to the United Nations, said at a briefing at the UN Security Council Wednesday, “The Iranian regime will be held responsible for its actions.”


“And we strongly warn against Iran – or its proxies – taking actions against the United States, or further actions against Israel,” she added.


US National Security Adviser Jake Sullivan on Tuesday had similarly warned Iran of “severe consequences” for its attacks, saying the US would work with Israel to ensure as much, though he did not elaborate.


“The time for empty calls for de-escalation is over,” Israeli UN Ambassador Danny Danon told the emergency UN Security Council meeting on Wednesday.


“This is no longer a matter of words,” he said. “Iran is a very real and present danger to the world, and if they are not stopped, the next wave of missiles will not be aimed solely at Israel.”


Advertisement


Israeli security forces at the scene where a missile fired from Iran hit a school in the town of Gedera, October 1, 2024. (Liron Moldovan/Flash90)
Speaking before Danon, the Iranian ambassador claimed Iran had to launch the missiles at Israel to “restore balance” after a recent series of significant Israeli strikes targeting its regional proxies.


“Each act of restraint taken by Iran has only emboldened Israel to commit greater crimes and more acts of aggression,” said Amir Saeid Iravani. “Consequently, Iran’s response was necessary to restore balance and deterrence.”


Russia’s UN envoy Vassily Nebenzia praised Iran for its “exceptional” restraint in recent months, and said the missile attack on Israel could not be “presented as though all of this happened in a vacuum.”




Linda Thomas-Greenfield, United States Ambassador to the United Nations, at the UN headquarters in New York, September 30, 2024. (AP Photo/Ted Shaffrey)
Iran said the Tuesday attack — its second-ever direct assault on Israel — was in retaliation to the killing of Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah and Revolutionary Guard Gen. Abbas Nilforoushan, both killed in an Israeli airstrike last week in Beirut. It also mentioned Ismail Haniyeh, a top leader in Hamas who was assassinated in Tehran in July in a suspected Israeli attack.


The State Department on Tuesday flatly rejected Iran’s claim that its attack was in response to the violation of its sovereignty in the killing of Haniyeh. “This event had nothing to do with Iran’s sovereignty. It has to do with the fact that a number of the terrorist organizations that Iran has set up for years as a way to undermine and attack the State of Israel have been weakened first over the past few months and then most recently over the past few weeks,” spokesman Matthew Miller said, highlighting the killing of Nasrallah.


“To the extent that any Iranian officials have been killed in the past few days in Lebanon or in Syria, it’s because they were meeting with terrorist leaders,” he said.


Shrapnel from the Tuesday missile attack killed a Palestinian man in the West Bank and injured two Israelis, while buildings were damaged in various parts of the country. The army on Wednesday acknowledged some missiles had hit airbases, but said the impact was “ineffective.”


Advertisement
Iranian President Masoud Pezeshkian said in a press conference in Qatar Wednesday that Tehran was “not looking for war,” but pledged a stronger response if Israel retaliates for the missile attack.


Iran launched its first-ever direct attack on Israel the night of April 13-14. That strike came in response to an alleged Israeli airstrike on an Iranian diplomatic facility in Damascus on April 1.




Emergency and security personnel search the rubble at the site of strikes that hit a building annexed to the Iranian embassy in Syria’s capital Damascus, on April 1, 2024. (Louai Beshara/AFP)
Israel was believed to have responded to the missile-and-drone strike with an airstrike on Iran’s nuclear facility in Natanz, near the city of Isfahan.


Shiite militias in Iran’s “Axis of Resistance” network have also attacked Israel from Iraq and Yemen, in addition to Hezbollah in Lebanon. The attacks began amid the war in Gaza, sparked when thousands of Hamas-led terrorists stormed southern Israel on October 7 to kill nearly 1,200 people and take 251 hostages, mostly civilians.


Hamas, a Sunni Palestinian terror group, is also part of the so-called Axis of Resistance.

fj1200
10-02-2024, 08:21 PM
This is all very interesting. So much going on.

SassyLady
10-02-2024, 09:56 PM
Iran wants to eradicate Israel. Israel just wants to destroy Iran's infrastructure. Netanahu wants to leave something for the Iranian people after he liberates them. I don't think he wants to kill everyone like the Iranians want to. I say ... go for it.

Kathianne
10-03-2024, 10:44 AM
Iran wants to eradicate Israel. Israel just wants to destroy Iran's infrastructure. Netanahu wants to leave something for the Iranian people after he liberates them. I don't think he wants to kill everyone like the Iranians want to. I say ... go for it.

https://freebeacon.com/israel/last-time-iran-attacked-the-biden-harris-admin-held-back-israels-response-this-time-the-jewish-state-will-not-be-deterred/

hjmick
10-03-2024, 01:17 PM
When it comes to my feelings about Iran, I have but five words:


Four hundred and forty four.

Kathianne
10-03-2024, 02:17 PM
How about 'tit for tat?'

https://hotair.com/ed-morrissey/2024/10/03/biden-maybe-well-let-israel-hit-irans-oil-infrastructure-n3795342


Biden: Maybe We'll Let Israel Hit Iran's Oil InfrastructureEd Morrissey 12:00 PM | October 03, 2024



AP Photo/Mark Schiefelbein
To be fair, Joe Biden advised reporters that his administration does not "allow" Israel to respond to attacks. Biden and his team merely "advise" Israel.


And then apparently flap their gums about it at the first possible opportunity:


"We're discussing that. I think that would be a little... anyway," Biden told reporters at the White House when asked if he supported Israel striking Iran's oil facilities.


He also said he did not believe any Israeli strikes against Iran would come on Thursday, as the region tensely awaits a response to Tehran's massive missile attack on Israel.


"First of all, we don't 'allow' Israel, we advise Israel. And there is nothing going to happen today," Biden said when asked if he would allow Israel to retaliate against Iran.


That's funny. Biden sounded as though he had veto power yesterday when he asserted that he would oppose a strike on Iran's nuclear facilities. "The answer is no," Biden responded when asked whether that option was on the menu for an Israeli response. He also made it clear that the Israelis would have to abide by the West's ideas of proportionate response:


“We’ll be discussing with the Israelis what they are going to do,” added Biden, who spoke Wednesday morning with fellow leaders of the Group of 7 nations.


“All seven of us agree that they have a right to respond, but they should respond proportionately.”


Hmmm. Iran and its proxies -- to the extent they exist at the moment -- have launched somewhere around 25,000 missiles at Israel since October 7. Should Israel launch 25,000 strikes on targets in Iran to satisfy the G-7's idea of proportionality? How about 180 strikes aimed at population centers, the exact number that Iran launched in one series of ballistic-missle strikes? Would that pass muster with Biden?

Somehow, I doubt it would.


A strike on Iran's oil production capacity would be one obvious choice for a punishing retaliation against Tehran. Talking about it openly, however, is incredibly stupid. Oil prices jumped today after Biden let that slip, and analysts now worry about Iranian reaction to the threat:


Speaking to CNBC’s “Street Signs Europe” on Thursday, Bjarne Schieldrop, chief commodities analyst at Swedish bank SEB, said escalating tensions in the Middle East could have dramatic consequences for the market.


“If ... you really took out the oil installations in Iran, force down the exports by 2 million barrels, then the next question in the market will be what will happen now in the Strait of Hormuz? That, of course, would add a significant risk premium to oil,” Schieldrop said.


Asked the extent to which oil prices could spike in such a scenario, Schieldrop replied, “If you take out installations in Iran, easily you go to $200-plus.”


You'd better believe that the Iranians are already moving assets to punish Western nations by attempting to close the Strait of Hormuz if the Israelis strike. They can choke off oil and pressure the G-7 into concessions by doing so, or force the West to go to war to keep the Strait open.


That's why it's best to keep your mouths shut about strategic and tactical responses in wartime. That's a lesson that Biden has never learned, of course, which is why the Israelis no longer include them in such plans when they become operational.


A strike on the oil facilities certainly would do a lot of damage to Iran's economy, but it doesn't address the biggest threats facing Israel. The two biggest threats in Iran are the development of nuclear weapons and the leadership clique of the regime itself. It makes much more sense to craft a strike against those threats directly, especially since it will likely avoid any impact on civilian industries and locations. Israel chose to decapitate Hezbollah for that reason; they couldn't destroy 150,000 missiles overnight, but they could and did remove the entire command structure that controlled them. They did go after the energy and shipping infrastructure of the Houthis this week, but only because those may have been the targets on which they have good intel -- and those are fixed rather than mobile.


If Biden's talking about oil, that may be because the Israelis aren't talking about their true targets and aims in the response to come from Iran's massive attack on Israel this week.