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View Full Version : Someone Please Tell The Administration That 'A Two State Solution' Is Off The Table



Kathianne
12-16-2023, 02:09 PM
Honestly, only the Biden folks keep mentioning it. Now Iran is making it plain:

https://www.memri.org/reports/saadollah-zarei-member-editorial-board-iranian-regime-mouthpiece-kayhan-palestinian-islamic#


Recently, Sa'adollah Zarei, who is on the editorial board of the Iranian regime mouthpiece Kayhan, and Ramazan Sharif, who heads the Intifada and Quds Central Headquarters of the Islamic Propaganda Coordination Council and is spokesman of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC), both expressed opposition to the "two-state solution" for Israel and Palestine proposed by countries in the West for after the Israel-Hamas war is over.

In his November 1, 2023 article in the regime mouthpiece Kayhan, titled "Establishing the Palestinian Resistance's Right To Arms," Zarei argued that raising the possibility of two states is irrelevant and aimed at thwarting the path to forcing a ceasefire on Israel. Discussing the meaning of Palestine, he noted that Iranian Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei defined its territory as "from the river to the sea," and said that "this is in line with the Palestinian cause and the destruction of Israel."


Zarei, who is also part of Iran's ideological circles, called for arming the Palestinian resistance, i.e. Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), with advanced air, ground, and sea weapons systems so that they can carry out the vision of Tehran's Islamic Revolutionary regime: annihilating the state of Israel.


Warning Qatar, as a representative of Hamas, not to consent to political negotiations that will legitimize the two-state solution as part of its negotiations with the U.S, Zarei went on to state that Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas is not a legitimate representative of the Palestinians, and that the leaders of the Palestinian resistance are Hamas and the PIJ – which are proxies of Iran.


This report presents the statements of Iranian officials Sa'adollah Zarei and Ramazan Sharif on this issue:


Kayhan Editorial Board Member Zarei: "The Two-State Solution Means Straying From The Path To Stopping The War [In Gaza]"


"...Another issue is the 'Palestinian cause.' Palestine, put simply, is bordered by Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt, and as the Leader [Khamenei] said, [its territory stretches] 'from the river to the sea' (the Mediterranean to the Jordan River). This is in line with the Palestinian cause and the destruction of Israel – the issue that is sought by the resistance front, including jihadi groups and the Palestinian masses.


"This [definition of] Palestine is historical and has sources. There is the Palestine of the UN Resolution of 1948 [sic – he is referring to the Partition Plan of 1947] which encompassed [only] 43% of its land, with that territory being noncontiguous. This Palestine is legal, as was of course emphasized in UN Security Council Resolutions 242 and 338. There is [also] the Palestine of the Oslo Accords, which encompasses approximately 22% of the territories, noncontiguously, and of course, the usurper regime [i.e. Israel] did not accept this, violating the Oslo Accords, and this is the political Palestine. When international forums and major Arab governments talk about 'occupied Palestine,' they are talking about this 22%.


"Now, during the war to aid the Palestinians and face [Israel's] aggression, some are talking about reviving the Oslo plan to administer Palestine, which is really a betrayal of the Palestinian ideology. The Oslo [plan] outline of 1993, which was translated in the 2002 Beirut Summit into the 'Arab [Peace] Initiative,' was defeated and lost its relevance with the rise of the resistance [created by Iran]. What is being heard about now in the Biden administration and in the governments of Europe, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Jordan, Turkey, Qatar, and so on is political Palestine, not Palestine in its full sense as we know it.


"The political process is the unavoidable fate of the war that was launched with extreme cruelty against Gaza by the usurper [Israeli] regime. In addition, this process began in Doha a few days ago, where the Qatari government and the American administration are negotiating on either side of the table. During the discussion of the Gaza war and the ceasefire, the Americans want to drag the process towards the Oslo Accords, using this to prolong Israel's shameful life.


"Of course, the Palestinians did not permit Doha to continue the talks to revive this process. According to them, negotiations should focus only on stopping the war and exchanging the imprisoned Palestinians for the [Israeli] hostages. The Palestinians have almost 6,000 prisoners [in Israeli prisons] who are serving lengthy sentences, including dozens of women and hundreds of children. These are people from the West Bank imprisoned for crimes connected to the resistance movement over the last two decades. This is even though there is no general or specific legal ruling permitting the usurping regime to [arrest and imprison] them. On the other hand, hundreds of Israelis, about half of whom are soldiers, were captured by Hamas under the legal principle of 'the right to self-determination' – one example of which is resisting the occupier [Israel].




Sa'adollah Zarei, international affairs expert (Source: ISNA, Iran, March 31, 2023)


"With the political process, legally and according to UN Resolutions 242 and 338, the Palestinian side has the upper hand. This is in addition to the fact that acts of 'resistance' are permissible by law, while the actions of the Israeli regime, which include bombing Gaza and arresting Palestinians who live in the West Bank, are in violation of [such laws]. In fact, the Palestinian side should make no concessions, and the Zionist regime should demand no concessions in order to free its usurping prisoners.


"Of course, since the Palestinian side accepted the release of the usurping [Israeli] prisoners in exchange for the release of all the [Palestinian] prisoners, the side [negotiating] in the name of Palestine, which is sitting at the [negotiating] table in Doha, may at most negotiate on two issues of a ceasefire – and not a temporary ceasefire, as proposed by the Americans and the Europeans. Here the American side must agree to stop the war that it is orchestrating and supplying.


"In addition to the legal discussion and the rights of the Palestinian people, we are seeing, in the statements of the Americans, Europeans, and some Arab countries, early whispers of a return to the two-state solution. This has nothing to do with the current war, because this war was not launched to establish two governments, and the major parties participating in the war were not pleased with the issue.


"Politically, entering a discussion on the two-state solution means straying from the path to stopping the war [in Gaza]. [This] discussion is not the goal of the usurping regime [Israel], but since it prolongs the war, it benefits the Israeli side. In other words, as soon as Qatar enters a discussion of two states [Israel and Palestine] that is initiated by other [countries], it is joining the opposing side by postponing the Palestinian cause.


"In the view of the Palestinian resistance, the [negotiating] table at Doha should be set up based on the decisive and documented victory of the Palestinian side on October 7. As a rule, the defeated party cannot set conditions for the victor or have future processes accommodate its interests and needs. Israel and all the members of the front represented by America in Doha must know that the issue of the negotiations and its indicators are the rights of the Palestinian nation, including the right to self-determination which has been withheld from it for the past 75 years.


"The usurping Israel and America should know that international law, as well as over 13 million [Palestinian] people inside and outside Palestine, are defending the power and arms of the resistance, and see them as an inseparable part of Palestinian rights. In a situation where the usurping regime [Israel] is equipped with both conventional and nonconventional weapons, and is breaking all international laws and rights, how can it ask the winning side to give up its conventional weapons or ban its acquisition of weapons in the West Bank, East Jerusalem, and the northern part of Palestine (1948)? The PIJ, Hamas, and the other armed groups have the right to be provided with fighters, weapons, and military facilities, just as the occupying and defeated regime [Israel] does.


"According to the 'two-state' plan and the agreement in Oslo, the Palestinian people do not have the right to purchase, possess, carry, or use weapons. [Only] carrying light weapons was permitted for the Palestinian Authority police, which was set up under Israel's military authority. The Palestinians need to be given the right to acquire and use weapons to the same extent as the Israeli army, that is, to maintain fighters and advanced air, ground, and sea weapons systems. If the world does not agree to this by peaceful means, the Palestinian side will turn to qualitative and quantitative development of its own weapons, and will fill in its military gaps.


"Another point in the political process is that the true representative of the vast majority of Palestine is not Mahmoud Abbas or his ilk. Instead, the clear representatives supported by the Palestinians are the leaders of the Palestinian resistance, and no other person or institution, such as the Arab League, the Organization of Islamic Cooperation, or the Gulf Cooperation Council share that right."[1]


Ramazan Sharif, Head Of The Intifada and Quds Central Headquarters of the Islamic Propaganda Coordination Council And IRGC Spokesman: "The Two-State Solution Is Never The Right Solution"


At a special meeting of the Intifada and Quds Central Headquarters of the Islamic Propaganda Coordination Council, the headquarters director and IRGC spokesman Ramazan Sharif similarly called for rejecting the two-state solution. He echoed the call of Supreme Leader Khamenei for a "democratic" referendum of all Palestinians, inside and outside Israel, and of the segment of Israel's Jewish population that was present under the British Mandate.[2] This referendum would be to decide on the future of the State of Israel, the "cancerous growth," thus ensuring its elimination through purportedly democratic means.


Sharif said: "Over the last 60 days, public opinion worldwide has borne witness that the strategy of the founder of the Islamic Revolution [Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini] was correct, accurate, and logical, and that this strategy is today shared by millions of free people across the world. The Imam [Khomeini] said: 'Israel is a cancerous growth, and until this growth is destroyed, we will witness terrible crimes.'


"We have all seen Westerners and international organizations who claim [to call for protecting] human rights remain silent over the past two months, in pursuit of their evil goals. In the Al-Aqsa Flood [operation], the failure for the Zionist regime was historic and unprecedented, and can never be rectified.




Ramazan Sharif (Source: ISNA, Iran, December 5, 2023)


"There is no doubt that the losses of the Zionist regime, as it progresses to southern Gaza, are much heavier than what it sustained in northern Gaza, because the resistance movement in southern Gaza has better maneuverability. Today the whole world bears witness that Hamas, which is a liberation organization, is fighting a regime that is armed to the teeth and has the full support of America and Europe – but it [Hamas] will triumph.


"Hamas is all of the Palestinian people. Indeed, Hamas is a way of thinking which cannot be destroyed with bombs and rockets.


"We are the main founders of [the annual International] Qods [Jerusalem] Day, and our people have understood the suffering of the Palestinian nation more than any other people in the world. We believe that the best solution to the Palestinian crisis is the healing solution of which Supreme Leader [Khamenei] spoke [i.e. to destroy Israel via referendum]. The two-state solution is never the right solution, because the Zionists are racist and extremely ambitious."[3]

Gunny
12-18-2023, 05:32 PM
Honestly, only the Biden folks keep mentioning it. Now Iran is making it plain:

https://www.memri.org/reports/saadollah-zarei-member-editorial-board-iranian-regime-mouthpiece-kayhan-palestinian-islamic#

Politicians amaze me the purposeful dumbness they insist on sticking to. They're more afraid of being called "the bad guys" or aggressors by the usual whiners than addressing the cold hard facts.

revelarts
12-28-2023, 03:33 PM
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/benjamin-netanyahu-prevented-palestinian-state-two-state-solution_n_6580a368e4b0e142c0bed60b

Benjamin Netanyahu Brags He's ‘Proud’ To Have Prevented A Palestinian State
The declaration puts Israel’s prime minister at odds with President Joe Biden’s stated goals for the region.
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said Saturday that he was “proud” to have prevented the establishment of a Palestinian state, putting him at odds with what for decades has been the United States’ policy priority for the region.

“I’m proud that I prevented the establishment of a Palestinian state because today everybody understands what that Palestinian state could have been, now that we’ve seen the little Palestinian state in Gaza,” Netanyahu said at a news conference.

He then talked about the Israeli-occupied West Bank, which he referred to using the biblical term “Judaea and Samaria.”

“Everyone understands what would have happened if we had capitulated to international pressures and enabled a state like that in Judaea and Samaria, surrounding Jerusalem and on the outskirts of Tel Aviv,” Netanyahu said.

Netanyahu also took aim at the Palestinian Authority, the governing authority in Palestinian-controlled areas of the West Bank. He described the Oslo Accords ― the 1993 diplomatic agreements between Israel and the Palestinian Liberation Organization that led to the creation of the Palestinian Authority ― as a “mistake,” and said he had “inherited” the agreements.

Reaction to Netanyahu’s remarks was swift.

“So all those promises to world leaders about his commitment to a 2 state solution were a bunch of lies,” Martin Indyk, the United States’ former ambassador to Israel, wrote on X, formerly known as Twitter. “And all those enablers who swore Bibi was serious about peace have some explaining to do.”

The United States has for decades prioritized the “two-state solution,” which would involve the creation of a sovereign Palestinian state, facilitated by various land swaps and other concessions from both sides. U.S. President Joe Biden has repeatedly called for a two-state solution in recent months.

“As we strive for peace, Gaza and the West Bank should be reunited under a single governance structure, ultimately under a revitalized Palestinian Authority, as we all work toward a two-state solution,” Biden wrote in The Washington Post on Nov. 18.

Sen. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.) characterized Netanyahu’s comments as a “direct response” to Biden’s calls for a two-state solution.

“[Netanyahu] has continued to weaken the Palestinian Authority — this is the organization that recognized Israel’s right to exist decades and decades ago,” Van Hollen said Sunday on ABC’s “This Week.” “Instead of trying to find peace or at least preventing the conditions on the ground from changing with additional settlements to allow a two-state solution, he has shut the door on that effort.”

Netanyahu has long tried to undercut the prospect of a two-state solution. Ahead of winning reelection in 2015, for example, he declared: “I think that anyone who is going to establish a Palestinian state today and evacuate lands is giving attack grounds to the radical Islam against the state of Israel.”

Netanyahu and others in Israel’s hard-right governing coalition have for years supported the expansion of Israeli settlements in the occupied West Bank, a major obstacle to any peace talks. Hundreds of thousands of Israelis now live on land that might otherwise be considered part of a potential future Palestinian state. In 2019, Netanyahu claimed to have told then-President Donald Trump that he would not agree to evacuate “a single person” from Israeli settlements in the West Bank. Earlier this year, he reportedly said during a meeting with lawmakers that Israel needed to “crush” Palestinian ambition for an independent state....

So basically Netanyahu never wanted a 2-state solution. It was never on the table.
And Israel promoted the radical Hamas to make it it an easier sell, to refuse to negotiate for a 2-State solution.
And Hamas acted as predicted against the people of Israel giving the gov't an even more tangible excuse NOT to negotiate.

Just to give a broader context to the history.

Kathianne
12-28-2023, 04:57 PM
I disagree with your interpretation. He basically was saying a bullet was dodge by the Gazans own decisions. He's glad they chose to not have a state, as they've proven what neighbors they are and would be.

revelarts
12-28-2023, 07:32 PM
I disagree with your interpretation. He basically was saying a bullet was dodge by the Gazans own decisions. He's glad they chose to not have a state, as they've proven what neighbors they are and would be.

“I’m proud that I prevented the establishment of a Palestinian state because today everybody understands what that Palestinian state could have been, now that we’ve seen the little Palestinian state in Gaza,”

I don't see how my "interpretation" is off.
He says he's proud he prevented it.

I'm trying to read it honestly and not making it better or worse than it is.
Please quote him specifically where he makes it sound like what you describe.
"...I'M PROUD THAT I PREVENTED THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A PALESTINIAN STATE...".

I guess the best we can honestly say to get close to your interpretation is to say that he's
Lying about being proud & Lying about his own efforts in preventing the establishment.

We can pretend or hope that he meant what you say he meant but that's not close to what he said.

Kathianne
12-29-2023, 09:05 AM
“I’m proud that I prevented the establishment of a Palestinian state because today everybody understands what that Palestinian state could have been, now that we’ve seen the little Palestinian state in Gaza,”

I don't see how my "interpretation" is off.
He says he's proud he prevented it.

I'm trying to read it honestly and not making it better or worse than it is.
Please quote him specifically where he makes it sound like what you describe.
"...I'M PROUD THAT I PREVENTED THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A PALESTINIAN STATE...".

I guess the best we can honestly say to get close to your interpretation is to say that he's
Lying about being proud & Lying about his own efforts in preventing the establishment.

We can pretend or hope that he meant what you say he meant but that's not close to what he said.

This:

https://www.gzeromedia.com/gzero-world-clips/how-netanyahu-used-hamas-to-avoid-talks-of-a-two-state-solution

Bottom line seeing the enemy clearly, letting them take the lead can get the debate to where the decision is made.

Gunny
12-29-2023, 09:12 AM
I disagree with your interpretation. He basically was saying a bullet was dodge by the Gazans own decisions. He's glad they chose to not have a state, as they've proven what neighbors they are and would be.

I agree. Not going for the semantical deconstruction/wordsmithing of Netanyahu's words. My take is the same as I've thought, then and now: it was never going to work because the Pali's don't want it to work. Nothing obvious (river to the sea). The continued existence of a "government" that is a terrorist organization. Hamas has continuously shown what it is all about with little deviating from the course.

Some dork thinking he's got some "A-Ha! He lied back then" moment because a politician representing his constituents went with their and international will rather than his own personal feelings is head and shoulders above what we've got in Congress or the WH nowadays.

The US, Biden admin or no, seems to have lost sight of the fact that while the US supports Israel, we ultimately do not make the final decisions. Never ceases to amaze me how opinionated people not living at sword point 24-7 can be:rolleyes:

revelarts
12-29-2023, 10:37 AM
I agree. Not going for the semantical deconstruction/wordsmithing of Netanyahu's words...

Just say you don't want to read it honestly.
& you prefer to think better of him.

I don't understand why people don't just own their crap.
Especially those who pride themselves about how tough they are.
Stand up own it, Netanyahu did.

You did the same type of thing when you made excuses for Biden's plainly saying he wanted to kill the oil pipeline.
and for Trump talking about getting the oil in Syria.
You've become spin doctor, as bad a CNN.
What's up man, just be real, it is what it is.

But hey, maybe you really believe that stuff.
that Netanyahu sincerely worked very hard for a 2 state solution. And did NOTHING to prevent it.:rolleyes:
That Biden never even had any intention or thought of stopping the pipeline.
That Trump as president had no clue about what was going on with the oil in Syria and you know better.

fine.
we disagree.

Gunny
12-31-2023, 01:03 PM
Just say you don't want to read it honestly.
& you prefer to think better of him.

I don't understand why people don't just own their crap.
Especially those who pride themselves about how tough they are.
Stand up own it, Netanyahu did.

You did the same type of thing when you made excuses for Biden's plainly saying he wanted to kill the oil pipeline.
and for Trump talking about getting the oil in Syria.
You've become spin doctor, as bad a CNN.
What's up man, just be real, it is what it is.

But hey, maybe you really believe that stuff.
that Netanyahu sincerely worked very hard for a 2 state solution. And did NOTHING to prevent it.:rolleyes:
That Biden never even had any intention or thought of stopping the pipeline.
That Trump as president had no clue about what was going on with the oil in Syria and you know better.

fine.
we disagree.

Feeling a bit hostile? Posting and drinking comes to mind:rolleyes:.

There's a difference between carrying out the will of your constituents and carrying out policy based on your personal desires. Self-explanatory.

There's no mincing words from me and you really need to get over yourself. I have been/was and still am against giving anything to so-called "Palestinians" otherwise known as Arabs claiming to own something they never did and to be something they never were. Let me know where you are confused on that.

Be that as it may, the decision is not mine and based on current circumstance, it is STILL my opinion the Arabs calling themselves Pali's, Israel and the World would be better off without an internationally recognized terrorist organization claiming to govern and act on behalf of people they merely use as a front to wage a war of terrorism with an end goal of genocide.

If you disagree the facts, logic and common sense in taking that stance, can't say I'm all that surprised:rolleyes: