Why Hamas Must Be Destroyed

[Kathianne]

They lie.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-moral-duty-to-destroy-hamas-ba626a41?st=sipmw1ujwjrpzp7&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink


The Moral Duty to Destroy HamasIsrael is entitled to do whatever it takes to uproot this evil, depraved culture that resides next to it.
By Walter E. Block and Alan G. Futerman
Oct. 11, 2023 2:09 pm ET






(5 min)


https://images.wsj.net/im-866019/?width=700&height=700


A synagogue desecrated by Arab rioters in Hebron, August 1929. PHOTO: GETTY IMAGES
A mob of Islamist Arabs incited by Jew-hatred entered the town and killed as many Jews as they could find. They went door to door, broke into the homes of their victims, and slaughtered innocent men, women and children. These gangs raped, mutilated and tortured them while screaming “Kill the Jews!”


That was 94 years ago, on Saturday, Aug. 24, 1929, in Hebron. The picture is essentially the same, only that then the Arab riots that included this massacre ended with 133 Jews murdered. This time, it is several times as many, and we don’t know the final figure.


OPINION: FREE EXPRESSION
Free Expression
Hamas' Terror and Israel at War


Given that the events are virtually the same, the question is: Why? There was no state of Israel in 1929. There were no “occupied” territories, no “settlers.” There was no “blockade.” No security fence, no checkpoints, nothing. If the excuses of today’s murderers did not exist at that time, what did exist? A deep, maniacal, murderous and utterly destructive hatred of Jews—the same essential factor operating today, to which all other excuses are subservient.


It has been the policy of the state of Israel not to show what its enemies do to its citizens. That both kept the victims’ dignity and prevented the demoralization of Israelis. But it also avoided letting the world see clearly what kind of threat Israelis were dealing with. What kind of true evil they are fighting against. Now that is clear. The videos showing mass murder; the kidnapping of children, elderly and women; the storming of a music festival to shoot and kill whatever person they could find; and the stories of rape, execution and utter destruction are there for the world to see.

...

[Kathianne]

"This is the worst week for anti-Semites since Soros was a boy."

Reminds me of Gunny and NightTrain

https://donsurber.substack.com/p/palestine-woke-the-world-up?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=1115457&post_id=137869157&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=b84x2&utm_medium=email


Palestine woke the world upThis is the worst week for anti-Semites since Soros was a boy.
OCT 12, 2023


Palestinian goons launched a horrific and well-staged attack on Israel this weekend that included the gang rapes of women, the beheading of babies and the burning of Jews alive. The horror exposed just what decolonization and the rest of the lefty euphemisms for wiping out the West are.


All the talk about intersectionality, diversity, equity and inclusiveness really mean torturing and killing white people. The actions by Hamas — Palestine’s other name — finally showed the world what their true goal is and what their methods are. The left used to say by any means necessary. The terrorists say by the worst means possible. That is what terrorists do: they attack innocents in horrific fashion to terrorize people into submission.


Paragliding into a Rave for Peace to rape and kill women was only for starters. We learned later that in one town they beheaded babies.


Israelis are uniting behind Netanyahu like never before because they know they either win this war or die.


The Times of Israel reported, “An agreement is reached to bring Benny Gantz’s opposition National Unity party into an emergency government amid the war with Hamas in Gaza following days of negotiations, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Gantz announced in a joint statement.


“A small war cabinet to direct the war with Hamas will be created, as demanded by Gantz, which will include just Netanyahu, Defense Minister Yoav Gallant, and Gantz.


“Former IDF general National Unity MK Gadi Eisenkot together with Minister Ron Dermer will serve as observers in the war cabinet.


“For the duration of the war, five members of the National Unity party will be added to the broader security cabinet which operates under every government — Gantz, Eisenkot, MK Gideon Sa’ar and two others yet to be determined.


“A position in the war cabinet has been left open for Opposition Leader Yair Lapid, who has refused to join the government if the far-right Religious Zionism and Otzma Yehudit parties remain in it.”


This is not the reaction the Gaza City Bombers expected. They thought they were dividing and demoralizing Israel with their ruthless attack. The opposite occurred.


The Palestinian script was familiar. They attack, Israel stops them, they roll out fake footage of Israeli response and gain sympathy, demand a cease fire and get what they want. Propaganda blooms like dandelions in the spring.


There was the father who carried his “dead daughter” across the rubble in Gaza.


After that video was shot and posted on Twitter, she miraculously recovered and she began taking off her gray death makeup.


But the Pallywood propaganda did not work this time because people in the civilized world have had it — even in Massachusetts. RNC Research tweeted, “At a pro-Israel rally, Democrat Sen. Ed Markey calls for ‘de-escalation,’ even amid the unspeakable crimes committed against innocent Israelis by Hamas terrorists.


“The crowd immediately starts booing him.”


Pocahontas looked like she needed a tomahawk — the drink.


On the night of the attack, Ambassador Nikki Haley tweeted, “This is not just an attack on Israel — this was an attack on America.


“Finish them, Netanyahu.


“They should have hell to pay for what they have just done.”


CNN's Jake Tapper said on the air, “These last few days have been a real eye-opening period for a lot of people — a lot of Democrats, a lot of progressives — in terms of antisemitism on the left.”


Bari Weiss explained the reaction to Palestinian terrorism. She said on MSNBC, “The Nazis tried to hide their war crimes. Hamas is livestreaming theirs.”


The anti-Semitic left is hiding in a cone of silence.


Breitbart reported, “None of the ten most-followed celebrity Instagram accounts has shown support for Israel in the four days following Hamas’ bloody attacks on Jewish people that have so far claimed more than 1,100 Israeli lives.


“At the same time, many of these same stars publicly voiced their support for Black Lives Matter in the recent past.


“Celebrities including Beyoncé, Dwayne ‘The Rock’ Johnson, as well as various members of the Kardashian clan have all remained conspicuously silent in the past four days when it comes to backing Israel. The exception is Kylie Jenner, who posted a pro-Israel message following Saturday’s bloody attacks, only to delete it shortly thereafter following an onslaught of negative comments.


“Other famous faces whose Instagram profiles rank in the top ten are Selena Gomez, Ariana Grande, and soccer stars Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi.”




Ah yes, the Black Liberation Movement — that is what BLM really is — used a picture of a paraglider to show its support of Palestinians raping women. I have news for BLM. The terrorists will keep the BLM alive long enough to bury the bodies of the others before forcing BLM to dig their own mass grave. That’s what their fellow Nazis did in World War 3. They know how to use those M4s Biden/Obama gave them in the surrender of Afghanistan.


But while some celebrities cower, others stand up. TDS sufferer Michael Rapaport wasn’t shy with his feelings about the attack.


He said, “Only is it acceptable to celebrate publicly the destruction, the rape, the beheading, the murder of children, women, and the elderly when it comes to Jewish people. Anybody that’s celebrating the terrorist attack that happened on Saturday is a sick fuck. You celebrate that. You cheer that. You dance in the streets, thinking that’s dope, that’s acceptable, that’s humane. You’re a sick fuck.”


CAIR whined, “CAIR-Chicago Reports Spike in Hate Messages, Community Concerns Received After Outbreak of Mideast Violence.”


That is a healthy reaction to CAIR’s unwavering support of Palestinian atrocities because two days earlier, Voice of America interviewed Robert McCaw, government affairs director of CAIR.


He said, “While all reasonable people do want this violence to stop, and every human life has value — whether it's Palestinian or Israeli — but the only way to permanently stop this violence is to end the occupation. Because I believe, similar to Ukraine, Americans and the international community would like to side with the oppressed, not the oppressor.


“The international community's refusal to hold the radical far-right Israeli apartheid government accountable for escalating human rights abuses and theft of Palestinian land has only emboldened more abuses. And you know, led to this violence. It had not happened in a vacuum but had been led up to this point.”


It is OK to tell CAIR, I don’t like you. The First Amendment protects hate speech — even the anti-Semitic rantings of Palestinians in Dearborn and other Third World enclaves in America.


Palestinians in Gaza — who overwhelmingly support Hamas and its rival Hezbollah — have buyer’s remorse over raping women and beheading babies.


Sheren Falah Saab reported in Haaretz, “‘At First We Were Ecstatic’: Gazans Respond to Hamas Attack, Calling It a Historic Day.


“Surprised by the abductions, Gazans quickly realized that the number of fatalities and hostages in Israel would lead to a very severe retaliation. ‘It will be a collective punishment’ Gaza resident said.”


There is nothing collective about this punishment. There are no innocents in Gaza. That unnamed Gaza resident and her 2.3 million neighbors have been chanting “Death to Israel” for five decades. This weekend the message finally got through to Israelis and the civilized world that the Palestinians mean exactly what they say.


Ed Morrissey wrote, “They want Jerusalem back, and Israel pushed back to its 1948 borders — as a start. Their real mission is clear from the Palestinian protest chant From the river to the sea — the eradication of Israel entirely. That very much includes making everyone they see as settlers into legitimate targets of violence, children and babies included. Raping and pillaging are embraced as well by the Gazans.


“So why should anyone object when Israel responds by defeating and subjugating Gaza in the barbaric war their government launched and they cheered?”


Exactly. This is a death match. Has anyone seen Jericho lately?


The Palestinian attack was so massive and coordinated that some people believe Mossad and the CIA knew but did nothing in an attempt to bring Netanyahu down. Conspiracy theories these days have a winning streak of truthfulness lately, but when it comes to government, never discount the power of incompetence.


Insider reported, “Retired U.S. Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton called the deadly attacks a ‘classic failure of technology,’ given the strength of Israel’s defenses.


“Speaking to CNN on Saturday, Leighton highlighted the surveillance techniques that Israel uses in Gaza, including cameras and monitoring radio and telephone communications.


“But Leighton said Hamas found ways around those systems.”


They went off the grid.


Leighton said, “What Hamas did, what their leadership did, was apparently they moved off of the normal modern communications links that we take for granted every day, and went back to what you did in the 19th century: face-to-face meetings, they went and used couriers instead of going in and using the telephone or the cell phone.”


In the end, the incompetence of Palestinian leadership is brought the civilized world down on them. They indulged themselves in a 7th century barbarism that revealed to the world who they are. That may appeal to Iran but Americans have had it.


I tweeted on Saturday, “Level Gaza.”


It looks like Bibi took my advice.

[Kathianne]

This sounds about right:

https://hotair.com/headlines/2023/10/11/how-israel-got-ambushed-n584131


How Israel got ambushedYAAKOV KATZ FROM FREE PRESS 8:20 PM on October 11, 2023
As Hamas leader Baraka bragged on TV, “We made them think that Hamas was busy governing Gaza and that it wanted to focus on the 2.5 million Palestinians (in Gaza) and has abandoned the resistance altogether. All the while. . . Hamas was preparing for this big attack.


“The Israelis are known to love life,” he continued. “We, on the other hand, sacrifice ourselves. We consider our dead to be martyrs. The thing any Palestinian desires the most is to be martyred for the sake of Allah, defending his land.”


Until the weekend, everyone in Jerusalem and Washington believed the terrorist group cared more about the survival of its regime than all-out war.


After an attack in the south and now in the north, Israel is waking up to its inherent vulnerability.


[And ironically, this will lead Israel to do what it should have done 17 years ago — wipe out Hamas. Would they have had the political will and diplomatic support to achieve that then, though? I would guess not, but after this barbarous attack, those days are over. And Israel isn’t the only country that should have scales falling from their eyes about Hamas after this, too, and almost certainly Hezbollah as well. — Ed]





https://www.thefp.com/p/how-israel-got-ambushed

[jimnyc]

And yet I have seen no one but a small handful of people actually condemn hamas terrorists themselves. They blame Israel for getting here and then blame them for escalation.

Some will say these scumbags are "freedom fighters" or whatever. Do freedom fighters normally attack innocent women and children and grandparents? NO, no way they are anything but terrorist scum.

[Gunny]

They lie.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-moral-duty-to-destroy-hamas-ba626a41?st=sipmw1ujwjrpzp7&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalinkWho is lying? I thought the article was pretty good.

[Kathianne]

Who is lying? I thought the article was pretty good.

1929, Israel didn't exist, it's not about land, attacks precede.

[revelarts]

Seems Israel consistently propped up (had a hand in creating) Hamas
From the 1970s as a counter force to the PLO.
To divide the Palestinians and to have an excuse to deny agreeing to any peace plans.
At one point an Israeli Gen said they needed to stop. But he was ignored.
Even in 2019 Netanyahu talked about supporting Hamas as the right plan.

Not saying that Iran or others haven't done their part, but it seems like Alqeada and other terror groups where the nations feeding them also felt the bite from them.
Seems they were also "important allies in the region"(?) or at least "the enemy of my enemy" that deserved support ...for strategic reasons.
you know
"real politics"
"real world"
"rules don't apply in war"
"they have to support one enemy (nazis/hamas) who hate them against another, who also hate them, to live"
"can't apply morals" etc

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2023/10/tho-bishop/hamas-israel-and-the-collapse-of-the-fiat-global-order/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcY2Fa8Fx4I


2018
https://www.filmsforaction.org/watch/blowback-how-israel-helped-create-hamas/

[revelarts]

Clinton & GWBush admin's role in the early 2000s

2008 article
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2008/04/gaza200804

"After failing to anticipate Hamas’s victory over Fatah in the 2006 Palestinian election, the White House cooked up yet another scandalously covert and self-defeating Middle East debacle: part Iran-contra, part Bay of Pigs. With confidential documents, corroborated by outraged former and current U.S. officials, the author reveals how President Bush, Condoleezza Rice, and Deputy National-Security Adviser Elliott Abrams backed an armed force under Fatah strongman Muhammad Dahlan, touching off a bloody civil war in Gaza and leaving Hamas stronger than ever....
...

Vanity Fair has obtained confidential documents, since corroborated by sources in the U.S. and Palestine, which lay bare a covert initiative, approved by Bush and implemented by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Deputy National Security Adviser Elliott Abrams, to provoke a Palestinian civil war. The plan was for forces led by Dahlan, and armed with new weapons supplied at America’s behest, to give Fatah the muscle it needed to remove the democratically elected Hamas-led government from power. (The State Department declined to comment.)

But the secret plan backfired, resulting in a further setback for American foreign policy under Bush. Instead of driving its enemies out of power, the U.S.-backed Fatah fighters inadvertently provoked Hamas to seize total control of Gaza.

Some sources call the scheme “Iran-contra 2.0,” recalling that Abrams was convicted (and later pardoned) for withholding information from Congress during the original Iran-contra scandal under President Reagan. There are echoes of other past misadventures as well: the C.I.A.’s 1953 ouster of an elected prime minister in Iran, which set the stage for the 1979 Islamic revolution there; the aborted 1961 Bay of Pigs invasion, which gave Fidel Castro an excuse to solidify his hold on Cuba; and the contemporary tragedy in Iraq.

Within the Bush administration, the Palestinian policy set off a furious debate. One of its critics is David Wurmser, the avowed neoconservative, who resigned as Vice President Dick Cheney’s chief Middle East adviser in July 2007, a month after the Gaza coup.

Wurmser accuses the Bush administration of “engaging in a dirty war in an effort to provide a corrupt dictatorship [led by Abbas] with victory.” He believes that Hamas had no intention of taking Gaza until Fatah forced its hand. “It looks to me that what happened wasn’t so much a coup by Hamas but an attempted coup by Fatah that was pre-empted before it could happen,” Wurmser says...
...
...
Under Bill Clinton, Dahlan (Fatah leader) says, commitments of security assistance “were always delivered, absolutely.” Under Bush, he was about to discover, things were different. At the end of 2006, Dayton promised an immediate package worth $86.4 million—money that, according to a U.S. document published by Reuters on January 5, 2007, would be used to “dismantle the infrastructure of terrorism and establish law and order in the West Bank and Gaza.” U.S. officials even told reporters the money would be transferred “in the coming days.”
Most Popular

The cash never arrived. “Nothing was disbursed,” Dahlan says. “It was approved and it was in the news. But we received not a single penny.”

Any notion that the money could be transferred quickly and easily had died on Capitol Hill, where the payment was blocked by the House Subcommittee on the Middle East and South Asia. Its members feared that military aid to the Palestinians might end up being turned against Israel.

Dahlan did not hesitate to voice his exasperation. “I spoke to Condoleezza Rice on several occasions,” he says. “I spoke to Dayton, to the consul general, to everyone in the administration I knew. They said, ‘You have a convincing argument.’ We were sitting in Abbas’s office in Ramallah, and I explained the whole thing to Condi. And she said, ‘Yes, we have to make an effort to do this. There’s no other way.’ ” At some of these meetings, Dahlan says, Assistant Secretary Welch and Deputy National-Security Adviser Abrams were also present.

The administration went back to Congress, and a reduced, $59 million package for nonlethal aid was approved in April 2007. But as Dahlan knew, the Bush team had already spent the past months exploring alternative, covert means of getting him the funds and weapons he wanted. The reluctance of Congress meant that “you had to look for different pots, different sources of money,” says a Pentagon official.

A State Department official adds, “Those in charge of implementing the policy were saying, ‘Do whatever it takes. We have to be in a position for Fatah to defeat Hamas militarily, and only Muhammad Dahlan has the guile and the muscle to do this.’ The expectation was that this was where it would end up—with a military showdown.” There were, this official says, two “parallel programs”—the overt one, which the administration took to Congress, “and a covert one, not only to buy arms but to pay the salaries of security personnel....”

[revelarts]

https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1712764955466850304/pu/vid/avc1/854x480/qJ5PqYyP0Z9-aRTh.mp4?tag=12

4 minutes video
Former Israeli intel officer who worked in Gaza wonders how attack could have happen.
Bret Weinstein talks to Efrat Fenigson an independent Journalist, Podcaster, Israeli Citizen & Covid dissident.
In the wake of the October 7th terrorist attacks on Israel, she has provided insight into the situation from inside Israel on X (Twitter). Bret and Efrat discuss the current state of affairs and the situation unfolding as we speak.

Due to the timely nature of this episode, it is important to note that this was filmed at 8PM Israel time on October 10, 2023, and released several hours later.

It is also of note that at the end of this recording, Efrat hears the sounds of rockets going off nearby. However there was also construction noise near Bret during the entire duration of the episode, not to be confused with sounds of war.

Note: Hamas was founded in 1987, not 1967 as was inadvertently stated.



Full interview
well worth the time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_IAH7PnS_E

[Kathianne]

https://www.axios.com/2023/10/21/israel-hamas-cyanide-weapon-instructions


21 hours ago - WorldScoop: Israel says it found Hamas files with instructions for making cyanide-based weapon
Barak Ravid


An armed member of the Izz al-Din al-Qassam Brigades. Photo: Yousef Masoud/SOPA Images/LightRocket via Getty Images


The Israeli military found a USB key with instructions for the production of a "cyanide dispersion device" on the body of a Hamas operative who participated in the Oct. 7 terrorist attack, according to two Israeli officials and a copy of a classified Israeli Foreign Ministry cable obtained by Axios.


The big picture: It is not clear from the file whether Hamas had any serious or operational plan for using makeshift chemical weapons or whether the group had attempted to produce them.


Behind the scenes: The Israeli Foreign Ministry's weapons of mass destruction non-proliferation department sent a classified cable to Israeli embassies in dozens of capitals worldwide, including Washington, on Thursday under the headline: "Hamas intention of using chemical weapons."


The authenticity of the Hamas file could not be independently confirmed by Axios, but Israeli officials have previously said they wouldn't share information with allies if they didn't think it was authentic and reliable.
The Israeli Foreign Ministry declined to comment.
A Hamas spokesperson did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
Israeli intelligence traced the origin of the document to a 2003 Al-Qaeda manual, the Israeli Foreign Ministry said in the cable.


"This finding points to an intention by Hamas to use chemical weapons as part of its terror attack against civilians," the cable alleges.
The Israeli Foreign Ministry sent the original file with an English description to its embassies and in the cable asked them to privately transfer it to the embassies' host governments and not use it publicly in any way.
The Israeli Foreign Ministry in the cable instructed its diplomats to tell their counterparts that Hamas wants "to conduct attacks in a similar way that ISIS tried to do."
Between the lines: Israel has both publicly and privately shared many documents it says it found on dead Hamas attackers since Oct. 7, including information that has provided more insight into the group's planning.


Several of these documents, which were classified by Hamas as "Top Secret," allegedly included operational plans for attacking Israeli villages and military bases near the border with explicit orders to kill as many people as possible and take hostages back to Gaza.

[Gunny]

https://www.axios.com/2023/10/21/israel-hamas-cyanide-weapon-instructionsI am all for removing from this Earth anyone that uses chemical weapons.

Could somebody drag Rev kicking and screaming into the here and now. :rolleyes:

[revelarts]

I am all for removing from this Earth anyone that uses chemical weapons.

Could somebody drag Rev kicking and screaming into the here and now. :rolleyes:

I'm all for that ... as long we included ANYONE responsible for using them.
And we make sure we KNOW who really used it before they are executed or attacked.

Remember in Syria they Blamed Assad for using chemical weapons, but when all the evidence later came out it showed that he did NOT.
Somehow some folks fall into a lynch mob mentality as soon as someone is ACCUSED of or SUSPECTED of xyz.

BTW last i checked the U.S. was still using white phosphorus and DU munitions.
Many nations and international rules consider those illegal chemical & radiological weapons.
Those responsible need to be removed from the earth? I suspect gunny won't come close to saying there's a problem with those.
BTW I've been told more thn once by some folks stuff like
RULES DON"T APPLY IN WAR... if you strap up and go out there then you can talk... none of those things written on paper apply... when you're fighting for your life there are no laws... team up with NAZIs... torture .. burn villages... rape ... if you get attacked or think you MIGHT BE attacked ONE DAY anything goes.... "that's war"... etc

[revelarts]

https://video.twimg.com/amplify_video/1716088437189554176/vid/avc1/576x1024/hFjXd5Xk5H2wGGi6.mp4?tag=14
Goes along with this...


https://video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1712764955466850304/pu/vid/avc1/854x480/qJ5PqYyP0Z9-aRTh.mp4?tag=12

4 minutes video
Former Israeli intel officer who worked in Gaza wonders how attack could have happen.
Bret Weinstein talks to Efrat Fenigson an independent Journalist, Podcaster, Israeli Citizen & Covid dissident.
In the wake of the October 7th terrorist attacks on Israel, she has provided insight into the situation from inside Israel on X (Twitter). Bret and Efrat discuss the current state of affairs and the situation unfolding as we speak.

Due to the timely nature of this episode, it is important to note that this was filmed at 8PM Israel time on October 10, 2023, and released several hours later.

It is also of note that at the end of this recording, Efrat hears the sounds of rockets going off nearby. However there was also construction noise near Bret during the entire duration of the episode, not to be confused with sounds of war.

Note: Hamas was founded in 1987, not 1967 as was inadvertently stated.



Full interview
well worth the time
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_IAH7PnS_E

[Gunny]

I'm all for that ... as long we included ANYONE responsible for using them.
And we make sure we KNOW who really used it before they are executed or attacked.

Remember in Syria they Blamed Assad for using chemical weapons, but when all the evidence later came out it showed that he did NOT.
Somehow some folks fall into a lynch mob mentality as soon as someone is ACCUSED of or SUSPECTED of xyz.

BTW last i checked the U.S. was still using white phosphorus and DU munitions.
Many nations and international rules consider those illegal chemical & radiological weapons.
Those responsible need to be removed from the earth? I suspect gunny won't come close to saying there's a problem with those.
BTW I've been told more thn once by some folks stuff like
RULES DON"T APPLY IN WAR... if you strap up and go out there then you can talk... none of those things written on paper apply... when you're fighting for your life there are no laws... team up with NAZIs... torture .. burn villages... rape ... if you get attacked or think you MIGHT BE attacked ONE DAY anything goes.... "that's war"... etc

Keep your day job. You suck at presuming what others think:rolleyes:

A person that can't differentiate between good and bad, right and wrong has no right to judge others. You'd get everyone killed trying to talk to death these assholes firing missiles. No thanks. Sell your dreamworld to someone that's buying.

[revelarts]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ojjTGJz7w

[fj1200]

So...... because Gaza is sitting on a lot of gas and oil, known about since 1999, the Israelis tricked Hamas into a horrific attack so that they could seize its natural resources? Wow, Israel certainly plays the long game. :rolleyes:

[revelarts]

So...... because Gaza is sitting on a lot of gas and oil, known about since 1999, the Israelis tricked Hamas into a horrific attack so that they could seize its natural resources? Wow, Israel certainly plays the long game. :rolleyes:

Doesn't your work have you looking at corporations 5, 10 & 20 year plans?
for oil and other energy corps 20 year plans are common aren't they.
Countries and some global groups are trying to project & plan for everyone 100 years into the future concerning energy... and population.

But hey FJ yes, you're right. It's just crazy talk that some people would plan &/or "let no crisis go to waste" just for billions of dollars.
What am i thinking?
It's impossible.
It's all ONLY about "self defense".

[Black Diamond]

So...... because Gaza is sitting on a lot of gas and oil, known about since 1999, the Israelis tricked Hamas into a horrific attack so that they could seize its natural resources? Wow, Israel certainly plays the long game. :rolleyes:

I hope Israeli companies get control of it.

[Gunny]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ojjTGJz7wHow many decades was it Israel controlled the whole of Gaza with no idea nor mention of giving to a bunch of Arabs calling themselves Palestinian? Israel could have done whatever it wanted at any point during that half-century.

Doesn't pass the smell test:rolleyes:

[fj1200]

Doesn't your work have you looking at corporations 5, 10 & 20 year plans?
for oil and other energy corps 20 year plans are common aren't they.
Countries and some global groups are trying to project & plan for everyone 100 years into the future concerning energy... and population.

But hey FJ yes, you're right. It's just crazy talk that some people would plan &/or "let no crisis go to waste" just for billions of dollars.
What am i thinking?
It's impossible.
It's all ONLY about "self defense".

It would have only taken a five year plan to get control of the natural resources between 1999 and 2007. That Hamas hasn't made the lives of its citizens better between 2007 and 2023 all the while sitting on, apparently billions or a trillion + depending on sources, of gas and oil is yet another reason Hamas doesn't deserve to be in control.

BTW that's quite the inflammatory thumbnail for that video implying something just happened when in reality it's been almost a quarter century of knowledge. And I got that from probably 30 seconds of that video and another minute of searching the interwebs. Another example of most of youtube being utter garbage as a source for credible information.


How many decades was it Israel controlled the whole of Gaza with no idea nor mention of giving to a bunch of Arabs calling themselves Palestinian? Israel could have done whatever it wanted at any point during that half-century.

Doesn't pass the smell test:rolleyes:

But, but, someone made a video. :rolleyes:

[Gunny]

It would have only taken a five year plan to get control of the natural resources between 1999 and 2007. That Hamas hasn't made the lives of its citizens better between 2007 and 2023 all the while sitting on, apparently billions or a trillion + depending on sources, of gas and oil is yet another reason Hamas doesn't deserve to be in control.

BTW that's quite the inflammatory thumbnail for that video implying something just happened when in reality it's been almost a quarter century of knowledge. And I got that from probably 30 seconds of that video and another minute of searching the interwebs. Another example of most of youtube being utter garbage as a source for credible information.



But, but, someone made a video. :rolleyes:Israel paid Hamas to attack a bunch of Israeli and tourist civilians so Israel could destroy Hamas and take back the land they gave them to begin with. Got it. The logic is just oozing out this one :halo9:

[revelarts]

Israeli Haaretz:
"Police confirm military helicopter fired at Hamas on the Nova festival, hitting some participants. Video suggests Apache helicopters killed fleeing civilians. "
for defense.

also check into the Hannibal policy

[Gunny]

Israeli Haaretz:
"Police confirm military helicopter fired at Hamas on the Nova festival, hitting some participants. Video suggests Apache helicopters killed fleeing civilians. "
for defense.

also check into the Hannibal policyHad there been no Hamas terrorists waging war against unarmed noncombatants, there would have been no need for a military helicopter to fire anything and no one would have been hurt.

See how that works?

[revelarts]

Had there been no Hamas terrorists waging war against unarmed noncombatants, there would have been no need for a military helicopter to fire anything and no one would have been hurt.

See how that works?

Right, no problem, a few Israelis as collateral damage and all that. "friendly fire". I hear ya.
no problem.
I see how it works.

[SassyLady]

Right, no problem, a few Israelis as collateral damage and all that. "friendly fire". I hear ya.
no problem.
I see how it works.

Yes Rev ... that's how it works. Doesn't mean it's ideal but it's reality. Those terrorists that were killed were kept from killing even more innocents.

What would you have done? Let the terrorists continue killing the innocents at the festival? Because I guarantee you that not killing them would not have kept those that were killed by friendly fire from dying that day.

[revelarts]

Yes Rev ... that's how it works. Doesn't mean it's ideal but it's reality. Those terrorists that were killed were kept from killing even more innocents.

What would you have done? Let the terrorists continue killing the innocents at the festival? Because I guarantee you that not killing them would not have kept those that were killed by friendly fire from dying that day.

1st of all, it seems that since they have this elaborate system at the broader that they should never have been able to get that far.
(many Israelis are asking about this as well)
2nd, Look, I'm no military genius but If i'm in a helicopter gunship i'm not firing into a crowd of civilians or shooting rockets into random cars hoping to kill a few bad guys who road in on motorcycles.

If everyone else here is fine with it and think that was THE BEST way for the one of THE BEST militaries in the world to handle it, ok fine.
We just disagree.
I wasn't there, no one here was either.
So we may never know.

[Kathianne]

1st of all, it seems that since they have this elaborate system at the broader that they should never have been able to get that far.
(many Israelis are asking about this as well)
2nd, Look, I'm no military genius but If i'm in a helicopter gunship i'm not firing into a crowd of civilians or shooting rockets into random cars hoping to kill a few bad guys who road in on motorcycles.

If everyone else here is fine with it and think that was THE BEST way for the one of THE BEST militaries in the world to handle it, ok fine.
We just disagree.
I wasn't there, no one here was either.
So we may never know.

I think this is one of those events that is more than unfortunate, but yes, was necessary. Indeed the Israeli people and their military needs to hear why these hundreds or more terrorists were able to cross into Israel. These paraglider riders and motorcyclists had some of that info, both written and go pros. Then there were the atrocities committed, also gained from the go pros, phones, and other info found on bodies of both innocents and terrorists.

There are some crossovers between military and the less lethal police departments, this was one

[Gunny]

1st of all, it seems that since they have this elaborate system at the broader that they should never have been able to get that far.
(many Israelis are asking about this as well)
2nd, Look, I'm no military genius but If i'm in a helicopter gunship i'm not firing into a crowd of civilians or shooting rockets into random cars hoping to kill a few bad guys who road in on motorcycles.

If everyone else here is fine with it and think that was THE BEST way for the one of THE BEST militaries in the world to handle it, ok fine.
We just disagree.
I wasn't there, no one here was either.
So we may never know.Nice know it all then brush off. I'd have done the same as the pilot if I thought I could save some innocents by killing murderous thugs, even at the risk of harming some civilians. I don't have to be there. I can tell you what I'm trained to do in similar situations. Minus orders otherwise, I'm doing something you hate for anyone to be allowed to do -- use my judgement. That's how it works.