Putin 'losing' war in Ukraine, forcing annexation referendum to secure 'political vic

[Gunny]

What does it matter to the rest of the World if Russians vote to annex parts of Ukraine ? Is this supposed to give his illegal war of aggression some sort of legal standing in the international community? This guy is either a super-genius with an endgame no one is seeing, or as dumb as it comes.

Bearing in mind the longer he occupies part of Ukraine the more accepting the Western, 2-second attention span accepts the situation as being how it is :rolleyes:

https://www.foxnews.com/world/putin-losing-war-ukraine-forcing-annexation-referendum-secure-political-victory-keane-says

[fj1200]

What does it matter to the rest of the World if Russians vote to annex parts of Ukraine ? Is this supposed to give his illegal war of aggression some sort of legal standing in the international community? This guy is either a super-genius with an endgame no one is seeing, or as dumb as it comes.

Bearing in mind the longer he occupies part of Ukraine the more accepting the Western, 2-second attention span accepts the situation as being how it is :rolleyes:

https://www.foxnews.com/world/putin-losing-war-ukraine-forcing-annexation-referendum-secure-political-victory-keane-says

Isn't it the people in those regions voting? I think if they vote then it gives them the "right" to take more aggressive defensive actions. In theory...

[Gunny]

Isn't it the people in those regions voting? I think if they vote then it gives them the "right" to take more aggressive defensive actions. In theory...Depends on whether or not you want to turn a blind eye to the truth in favor of the results of a "vote". Russia has been in the Donbas region backing anti-Ukraine rebel forces since 2016. Anyone who didn't flee the violence between then and now would certainly have fled the invasion/occupation of regular Russian military forces.

Who does that leave to vote? Russians and pro-Russian Ukrainians. I'm sure the Democrats here in the US see nirvana in Putin's way of voting even if they publicly state otherwise.

[fj1200]

Depends on whether or not you want to turn a blind eye to the truth in favor of the results of a "vote". Russia has been in the Donbas region backing anti-Ukraine rebel forces since 2016. Anyone who didn't flee the violence between then and now would certainly have fled the invasion/occupation of regular Russian military forces.

Who does that leave to vote? Russians and pro-Russian Ukrainians. I'm sure the Democrats here in the US see nirvana in Putin's way of voting even if they publicly state otherwise.

No argument here. Just a way to make it be over. No more proxy war that could become even worse than it currently is.

[Gunny]

No argument here. Just a way to make it be over. No more proxy war that could become even worse than it currently is.Caving to Putin is not going to end anything. He wants it all. Appeasing him will be no different than appeasing Hitler.

The piece of land known as Ukraine has been the battlefield between East and West since at least the Golden Horde. It's the battleground between ethnicities and the Great Schism. Right or wrong, Russia sees it as part of Russia. Putin keeps leaving out the fact it was part of Russia originally by choice in the south, and Russian invasion in the north. Originally, they were the the same people, the Rus. Putin also conveniently leaves out the fact the Rus occupied some, all and/or different part of Ukraine when Moscow was a fishing village burned to the ground then occupied by the Mongols.

Anyway, the people are different. Russians are predominantly Rus/Mongol/Asian. Ukrainians are predominantly Slavs, Pols, Fins and Scandinavian. Stalin tried to erase them in 35-ish. What was left was turned into state-owned collective farms, and only Russian was allowed to be taught in schools.
Putin wants to reinstall Stalinism.

It's in everyone's interest short and long term to stop him where he is.

[Gunny]

As an aside, I just heard Ted Cruz say "Ukraine". Only a Texan could butcher a word like that :laugh: He says it "yew-KRAINE" with a good drawl on the "yew" :laugh:

Sounds perfectly normal to me. Y'all talk funny though :)

[fj1200]

Caving to Putin is not going to end anything. He wants it all. Appeasing him will be no different than appeasing Hitler.

The piece of land known as Ukraine has been the battlefield between East and West since at least the Golden Horde. It's the battleground between ethnicities and the Great Schism. Right or wrong, Russia sees it as part of Russia. Putin keeps leaving out the fact it was part of Russia originally by choice in the south, and Russian invasion in the north. Originally, they were the the same people, the Rus. Putin also conveniently leaves out the fact the Rus occupied some, all and/or different part of Ukraine when Moscow was a fishing village burned to the ground then occupied by the Mongols.

Anyway, the people are different. Russians are predominantly Rus/Mongol/Asian. Ukrainians are predominantly Slavs, Pols, Fins and Scandinavian. Stalin tried to erase them in 35-ish. What was left was turned into state-owned collective farms, and only Russian was allowed to be taught in schools.
Putin wants to reinstall Stalinism.

It's in everyone's interest short and long term to stop him where he is.

Again, no argument here. But a pause leaves time for a build up and also hoping that Putin doesn't do anything really stupid.

I certainly don't know the answer.

[Gunny]

Again, no argument here. But a pause leaves time for a build up and also hoping that Putin doesn't do anything really stupid.

I certainly don't know the answer.
Read a rather lengthy NYT article. Don't ask hw. I don't pay for it. Maybe it was "Freebie Sunday" or something. One thing the leftist media has over the right is infrastructure.

Apparently, Putin is drafting almost all the Tatars out of Crimea. Ukraine is calling that genocide because 90% of Crimean conscripts are Tatars. Ukrainians in Russia-occupied territory are being forced into the Russian Army. The threat is if they don't go, they'll get sent anyway without weapons. That's besides the Russians he's drafting.

That's just the info. I know what I'd be thinking with a bunch of troops I had to hold to at gunpoint to be on my side :cuckoo: All it takes is one good rebel leader and guess who gets shot first? Not really a guess. I've always been against draftees for that very reason, but held at gunpoint? Stupid. It does show how little value Putin places on human life.

NATO is going to end up in this.