Global outcry against Russia escalates as horrifying stories emerge of Ukraine atroci

[Gunny]

Satellite imagery shows bodies laid in Bucha streets for weeks, contradicting Russian claims



https://a57.foxnews.com/livenews.foxnews.com/images/2022/04/624/351/f35a689f54bea29ed5ce018b04265418.png?tl=1&ve=1
(Satellite image ©2022 Maxar Technologies)


High-resolution satellite imagery from Maxar Technologies collected over Bucha, Ukraine, corroborates recent social media videos and photos that show bodies lying out in the streets for weeks.
The images contradict Russia's claim (https://t.me/MFARussia/12230) that the bodies appeared on the city streets after “all Russian units withdrew completely from Bucha” around March 30.
Other images show a probable mass grave on the grounds of the Church of St. Andrew and Pyervozvannoho All Saints.
Russia dismissed the images as "another hoax" and demanded an emergency meeting of the U.N. Security Council regarding “provocations of Ukrainian radicals” in Bucha.
The massacre at Bucha has prompted outrage from Western leaders, including President Biden, who accused Russian President Vladimir Putin of committing "a war crime," and called for him to be put on trial.

Posted by Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com/live-news/ukraine-russia-live-updates-04-04-2022

Was up to me, Moscow would be wishing it still looked this good. Unacceptable. But Biden's on it. More sanctions coming :rolleyes:

[Gunny]

Biden soundbyte: Was it something Presidential and worthy? "Remember you criticized me for calling Putin a war criminal" :rolleyes:

That's right Joe. Show the World you're just another leftwingnut victim. It's all about Joe :rolleyes:

I despise terminal victim pussies.

[revelarts]

but is it true

how many times in the past several years has the media and our gov't fed us...um.. less than truthful information?

We're still looking for those babies on floor from the incubators in Kuwait.

[Gunny]

but is it true

how many times in the past several years has the media and our gov't fed us...um.. less than truthful information?

We're still looking for those babies on floor from the incubators in Kuwait.Guess it's a good thing I don't use our MSM and/or government for info, huh?:rolleyes:

You think you got everything all figured out. Even me. You don't know shit. I was in Kuwait. Even got a medal in a box somewhere in my closet that says so. Nobody's looking for anything except people like you that don't know your ass from a hole in ground on the subject.

It took me 20 years to get that shit out of my head and you aren't worth letting it back in. Don't let your ignorance make a fool of you, rev.

[revelarts]

Guess it's a good thing I don't use our MSM and/or government for info, huh?:rolleyes:

You think you got everything all figured out. Even me. You don't know shit. I was in Kuwait. Even got a medal in a box somewhere in my closet that says so. Nobody's looking for anything except people like you that don't know your ass from a hole in ground on the subject.

It took me 20 years to get that shit out of my head and you aren't worth letting it back in. Don't let your ignorance make a fool of you, rev.


What are you talking about?
All I'm saying is that we can't be sure WHAT Russia has done because the US Gov't, Ukraine and the Media lies so much.
You're a sharp guy with lots of real experience not sure how the point i was making got past you.

And sent you into your war box to dig out your medals.
Don't let your medals make you believe you know it all Gunny.

[Gunny]

What are you talking about?
All I'm saying is that we can't be sure WHAT Russia has done because the US Gov't, Ukraine and the Media lies so much.
You're a sharp guy with lots of real experience not sure how the point i was making got past you.

And sent you into your war box to dig out your medals.
Don't let your medals make you believe you know it all Gunny.

Guess that point zoomed over your head :rolleyes: I could care less about the medals. That's why they're in a box in the closet :rolleyes:

Don't let your paranoia and suspicion of your own shadow make you believe you know it all, rev. The vast majority of things are what they are.

I'll stick with dealing with reality. It's worked so far.

[BoogyMan]

Mass graves in 2022. I would have thought that we would never see such a thing ever again in the history of mankind knowing what the 20th century had wrought and yet here we are, watching as a power-mad zealot crushes his way through Ukraine leaving death and ruin in his wake.

Gunny, I have to admit I heard POTATUS’s comment and I had to leave the room. I immediately thought exactly like you, does this old fool ever consider anything but himself?

I fear we face harder times than any I have ever seen. With the current view of what Putin is up to being much larger than what was originally thought and with him facing a world looking to put him in on trial I see him fighting with everything he has at his disposal.

[revelarts]

I do not know what's true or not.
But i will not buy anything either way until we get some independent verification.


Ok, seems we've got more than enough reason to take the media and our gov't reports with a HUGE grain of salt when they accuse another country or horrors.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FPMAkDJX0AA1YI3?format=png&name=small

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOOw7rsXMAM_w0r?format=jpg&name=small

"Babies on bayonets!"
"the Lusitania had no weapons!"


And Meanwhile ... 6+ months ago in Yemen we're helping our good friends in Saudi Arabia do this... "to the children".

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOPFVVaXsAEiTmg?format=jpg&name=small

[revelarts]

Not to mention

"THE CLEAR EARMARKS OF RUSSIAN PROPAGANDA"
"Right Out of the Russian Playbook!"
"Signed by 51 U.S. intelligence EXPERTS!"


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FONdeMIXMAAUzVp?format=jpg&name=small

[SassyLady]

Propaganda is coming from all sides and right now it's hard to choose what to believe. I don't believe MSM about anything anymore.

I truly believe there are atrocities being committed on both sides. Reporters on the ground saying Ukrainian military are killing their own civilians. Russia using crematoriums and mass graves.

Either way ... War is tragic on all participants.

[Gunny]

Mass graves in 2022. I would have thought that we would never see such a thing ever again in the history of mankind knowing what the 20th century had wrought and yet here we are, watching as a power-mad zealot crushes his way through Ukraine leaving death and ruin in his wake.

Gunny, I have to admit I heard POTATUS’s comment and I had to leave the room. I immediately thought exactly like you, does this old fool ever consider anything but himself?

I fear we face harder times than any I have ever seen. With the current view of what Putin is up to being much larger than what was originally thought and with him facing a world looking to put him in on trial I see him fighting with everything he has at his disposal.

Putin is not going to stop until he is stopped. His only advantage is the threat of nuclear weapons. It's certainly not his 3rd rate military. He tried to use a simple pincers movement to envelop Ukraine from Kyiv east. He should have stuck to his Mongol roots and just bulldozed forward. He'd have had better success. He's escalated to indiscriminate destruction and killing out of frustration.

The war is on. The West just isn't participating in its own defense, standing on the "Ukraine's not NATO" bullshit line. He's not done. He's just regrouping, consolidating his forces. He's not trying to "de-Nazify/de-criminal' Ukraine. He's determined to "de-Westernize" Ukraine. Stalin did it by starving 3 million Ukrainian peasants while their grain was sold by the Soviets, and relocating millions to the interior of Russia. He crushed the Ukrainian people into submission and appointed his own government.

The longer it takes the West to just deal with it, the more there is going to be to deal with.

How many people died taking back Western Europe because Hitler wasn't stopped when he got started? It wasn't anybody's -- especially the USs -- business :rolleyes:

[Gunny]

Russia got kicked off the UN's "Human Rights Council". For whatever the Hell that means to anybody that cares what the UN has to say. When he addressed the UN, Zelenskiy said the UN needed to do something besides talk or disband if it couldn't do what it promised as far as national security is concerned. Been saying that for years.

24 countries voted against the resolution kicking Russia off the council. That's 24 too many dumbasses. Trump was erroneously about canceling NATO, but he would have been correct, IMO, for canceling the UN. It truly is useless.

[jimnyc]

Putin is not going to stop until he is stopped. His only advantage is the threat of nuclear weapons. It's certainly not his 3rd rate military. He tried to use a simple pincers movement to envelop Ukraine from Kyiv east. He should have stuck to his Mongol roots and just bulldozed forward. He'd have had better success. He's escalated to indiscriminate destruction and killing out of frustration.

The war is on. The West just isn't participating in its own defense, standing on the "Ukraine's not NATO" bullshit line. He's not done. He's just regrouping, consolidating his forces. He's not trying to "de-Nazify/de-criminal' Ukraine. He's determined to "de-Westernize" Ukraine. Stalin did it by starving 3 million Ukrainian peasants while their grain was sold by the Soviets, and relocating millions to the interior of Russia. He crushed the Ukrainian people into submission and appointed his own government.

The longer it takes the West to just deal with it, the more there is going to be to deal with.

How many people died taking back Western Europe because Hitler wasn't stopped when he got started? It wasn't anybody's -- especially the USs -- business :rolleyes:

Yup, and I don't see anyone dealing with it, other than maybe sending some weapons.

I have no doubt that horrors and war crimes are happening over there. But can't say for certain the totality nor who is responsible for each and every death. I'm more than quite certain of Putin's guilt in many, many aspects. But I would never ever trust the media to tell us the truth. I prefer some foreign input all wrapped into one, and videos too. And none of this happens without Putin's invasion.

[Gunny]

Yup, and I don't see anyone dealing with it, other than maybe sending some weapons.

I have no doubt that horrors and war crimes are happening over there. But can't say for certain the totality nor who is responsible for each and every death. I'm more than quite certain of Putin's guilt in many, many aspects. But I would never ever trust the media to tell us the truth. I prefer some foreign input all wrapped into one, and videos too. And none of this happens without Putin's invasion.

To clarify, I don't trust our media. They're too busy covering "important" stuff like partisan, political infighting of their own creation. And telling us what a leader Gilligan Joe is:rolleyes:

In general, I watch French, Brit, German and Australia news for actual updates. They're on the ground. Sadly, our best coverage is from CNN because it has the media infrastructure. Both Fox and CNN just have to put US political spin in anything Ukraine. It's bullshit, and shameful.

I consider "fact" what all individually report that is the same details of events. Most of the European news has some video.

[jimnyc]

To clarify, I don't trust our media. They're too busy covering "important" stuff like partisan, political infighting of their own creation. And telling us what a leader Gilligan Joe is:rolleyes:

In general, I watch French, Brit, German and Australia news for actual updates. They're on the ground. Sadly, our best coverage is from CNN because it has the media infrastructure. Both Fox and CNN just have to put US political spin in anything Ukraine. It's bullshit, and shameful.

I consider "fact" what all individually report that is the same details of events. Most of the European news has some video.

Speaking of Germany, just read an article that they intercepted communications of Russians speaking about killing people after questioning them.

Plus add in Mariupol before this and it's clear. I don't see Ukrainians slaughter and cutting off heads of their own people. Russian soldiers did that before with Chechnyans.

[Gunny]

Speaking of Germany, just read an article that they intercepted communications of Russians speaking about killing people after questioning them.

Plus add in Mariupol before this and it's clear. I don't see Ukrainians slaughter and cutting off heads of their own people. Russian soldiers did that before with Chechnyans.

War crimes taking place either comes from the top, or it is a complete breakdown in leadership. Getting your ass kicked by farmers doesn't sit well with soldiers, even though, it isn't the people's fault.

Poorly trained and poorly led troops will commit crimes out of frustration and anger and it is contagious.

Then, there's "following orders". It is "unlawful to carry out an unlawful order" in the US military. I doubt there is any such thing in Russia. You do what you're told or get shot there.

Russians, as well as Ukrainians who are ALL "Kyivan Rus" then "Rus-Mongol" are a hard, brutal people that live hard brutal lives. Our worldview is not theirs.

Not excusing bad behavior; rather, trying to explain it.

[revelarts]

US Publicizing Bad Intelligence in Information War Against Russia
The US Has No Evidence Russia Was Preparing a Chemical Attack Despite Claims

https://news.antiwar.com/2022/04/06/the-us-has-no-evidence-russia-was-preparing-a-chemical-attack-despite-claims/
The US has no evidence Russia was preparing a chemical weapons attack despite claims from Biden officials
by Dave DeCamp Posted on April 6, 2022Categories NewsTags Russia

In recent weeks, US officials, including President Biden, claimed that Russia was considering using chemical weapons in Ukraine. But three US officials told NBC News this week that there is no evidence Russia had moved any chemical weapons near Ukraine and that the claims were part of an information war against Moscow.

The US officials said that the Biden administration has been sharing declassified intelligence that wasn’t “rock solid.” The NBC report said that multiple US officials acknowledged that the US has used information as a weapon against Russia “even when confidence in the accuracy of the information wasn’t high.”

The report said the US has used “low confidence” information, like the chemical weapons claims, as a “deterrent effect.” One official told NBC that by sharing the information, the US is just “trying to get inside Putin’s head.”

Another example of the US sharing bad intelligence is the claim that Putin is being misinformed by his advisors about the war in Ukraine, which first surfaced in media reports last week. Two US officials told NBC that the intelligence about Putin’s inner circle lying to him “wasn’t conclusive” and was “based more on analysis than hard evidence.”...


NBC news:
In a break with the past, U.S. is using intel to fight an info war with Russia, even when the intel isn't rock solid
https://archive.ph/9ORR9
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/us-using-declassified-intel-fight-info-war-russia-even-intel-isnt-rock-rcna23014
It was an attention-grabbing assertion that made headlines around the world: U.S. officials said they had indications suggesting Russia might be preparing to use chemical agents in Ukraine.
President Joe Biden later said it publicly. But three U.S. officials told NBC News this week there is no evidence Russia has brought any chemical weapons near Ukraine. They said the U.S. released the information to deter Russia from using the banned munitions.
It’s one of a string of examples of the Biden administration’s breaking with recent precedent by deploying declassified intelligence as part of an information war against Russia. The administration has done so even when the intelligence wasn’t rock solid, officials said, to keep Russian President Vladimir Putin off balance. Coordinated by the White House National Security Council, the unprecedented intelligence releases have been so frequent and voluminous, officials said, that intelligence agencies had to devote more staff members to work on the declassification process, scrubbing the information so it wouldn’t betray sources and methods.
Observers of all stripes have called it a bold and so far successful strategy — although not one without risks....

So the U.S. Gov't LIES about Russia & Putin as a matter of policy.
got it.
Exactly as I thought.

next Russian "WAR CRIMES!!" news you hear or think you "see"... take with grain of salt.

We should always ask,
can we get a little evidence to go with that war propaganda please?

[Gunny]

US Publicizing Bad Intelligence in Information War Against Russia
The US Has No Evidence Russia Was Preparing a Chemical Attack Despite Claims

https://news.antiwar.com/2022/04/06/the-us-has-no-evidence-russia-was-preparing-a-chemical-attack-despite-claims/
The US has no evidence Russia was preparing a chemical weapons attack despite claims from Biden officials
by Dave DeCamp Posted on April 6, 2022Categories NewsTags Russia

In recent weeks, US officials, including President Biden, claimed that Russia was considering using chemical weapons in Ukraine. But three US officials told NBC News this week that there is no evidence Russia had moved any chemical weapons near Ukraine and that the claims were part of an information war against Moscow.

The US officials said that the Biden administration has been sharing declassified intelligence that wasn’t “rock solid.” The NBC report said that multiple US officials acknowledged that the US has used information as a weapon against Russia “even when confidence in the accuracy of the information wasn’t high.”

The report said the US has used “low confidence” information, like the chemical weapons claims, as a “deterrent effect.” One official told NBC that by sharing the information, the US is just “trying to get inside Putin’s head.”

Another example of the US sharing bad intelligence is the claim that Putin is being misinformed by his advisors about the war in Ukraine, which first surfaced in media reports last week. Two US officials told NBC that the intelligence about Putin’s inner circle lying to him “wasn’t conclusive” and was “based more on analysis than hard evidence.”...


NBC news:
In a break with the past, U.S. is using intel to fight an info war with Russia, even when the intel isn't rock solid
https://archive.ph/9ORR9
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/us-using-declassified-intel-fight-info-war-russia-even-intel-isnt-rock-rcna23014
It was an attention-grabbing assertion that made headlines around the world: U.S. officials said they had indications suggesting Russia might be preparing to use chemical agents in Ukraine.
President Joe Biden later said it publicly. But three U.S. officials told NBC News this week there is no evidence Russia has brought any chemical weapons near Ukraine. They said the U.S. released the information to deter Russia from using the banned munitions.
It’s one of a string of examples of the Biden administration’s breaking with recent precedent by deploying declassified intelligence as part of an information war against Russia. The administration has done so even when the intelligence wasn’t rock solid, officials said, to keep Russian President Vladimir Putin off balance. Coordinated by the White House National Security Council, the unprecedented intelligence releases have been so frequent and voluminous, officials said, that intelligence agencies had to devote more staff members to work on the declassification process, scrubbing the information so it wouldn’t betray sources and methods.
Observers of all stripes have called it a bold and so far successful strategy — although not one without risks....

So the U.S. Gov't LIES about Russia & Putin as a matter of policy.
got it.
Exactly as I thought.

next Russian "WAR CRIMES!!" news you hear or think you "see"... take with grain of salt.

We should always ask,
can we get a little evidence to go with that war propaganda please?:rolleyes:

Says right up there in your second link: Biden admin accused Russia of preparing to use chem weapons to deter Russia from using them. Russia has already repeatedly threatened to use nukes.

Your first link is hardly objective. Cherrypicking half-truths to support a conclusion. Why didn't Biden think of that?:rolleyes:

[revelarts]

:rolleyes:

Says right up there in your second link: Biden admin accused Russia of preparing to use chem weapons to deter Russia from using them. Russia has already repeatedly threatened to use nukes.

Your first link is hardly objective. Cherrypicking half-truths to support a conclusion. Why didn't Biden think of that?:rolleyes:


yes, because the Biden administration always tells the truth... and has good motives.
Not just millions in familia financial interest in the region.
And the administration & deep state aren't working with the globalist to secure "America":rolleyes: as the lead in a New World Order.

Okey Doke. got it.

[Gunny]

yes, because the Biden administration always tells the truth... and has good motives.
Not just millions in familia financial interest in the region.
And the administration & deep state aren't working with the globalist to secure "America":rolleyes: as the lead in a New World Order.

Okey Doke. got it.Sound tactics. Don't have to agree with them. In fact, DoD has pretty much told Biden in a mealy-mouth way to stop crowing about feeding Ukraine information. It compromises the ability to gather, assimilate and analyze intel.

OTOH, the Dems are masters at preempting the "enemy" (Republicans, We, the People") by taking a next obvious move, announcing it via the MSM, while twisting it into one of their conspiracy theories. It has worked pretty flawlessly in silencing the right in this country. Sucks for us here at home, but might as well roll with it if it's screwing up Putin's plans.

Putin has lied at every turn, trying to twist Ukraine into the bad guys. Look at YOU. You're buying the BS. Putin is the one that started crying about the chemical weapons first. Easily construed into a false flag by following the logic.

Try sticking to one topic instead of trying to run a smoke screen by jumping in and out of more than one, cherrypicking your way through. I mentioned early on Putin starting this shit and the West's reactions was going to play into globalist hands, just as I did the same in regard to the Dems using COVID to further their socialist agenda. In both cases, it's because they are being allowed to.

Actions have consequences. No matter how you want to spin it, Russia invaded Ukraine. Otherwise the opportunity isn't there. From the looks of it from MY "Fool on the Hill" position, I don't see Putin being at all concerned with any NWO other than he considers the West in its entirety, regardless packaging, as a decadent, immoral society and an enemy to Russia. Can't say he's all wrong on that one. Only that it doesn't justify war because no one invaded Russia.