View Full Version : why i am against the death penalty
actsnoblemartin
09-21-2007, 08:40 PM
I am a jew for the record, and i believe god gives life, and only he should be the one to take it.
also, Killing someone, even if they are a terrorist, child molester or rapist, does not bring back those they killed or undue the damage they created
Also, I believe a life sentence.. Losing ones freedom forever, is a far better punishment then a quick painless death.
I respect peoples opinions on this issue, including those who disagree with me on this issue.
darin
09-21-2007, 08:54 PM
great! :)
Death Penalty is a necessary evil because of evil
Dilloduck
09-21-2007, 08:58 PM
great! :)
Death Penalty is a necessary evil because of evil
Too damn expensive, too many people gripe, puts em on ice in case some new evidence miraculously appears, and still prevents them from ever doing it again.
PostmodernProphet
09-21-2007, 09:04 PM
most people don't like the reason I am opposed to the death penalty......I changed my views on it after a woman who had been on death row for 28 years became a Christian.....I am glad she was given time to change.....
Gaffer
09-22-2007, 04:05 PM
The sooner they are dead the less evil they can perform. And there is absolutely no chance they will get out to do more.
82Marine89
09-22-2007, 04:09 PM
An eye for an eye baby. An eye for an eye.
Cheyenne
09-22-2007, 04:19 PM
The Bible speaks of the death penalty. And people were put to death without a lengthy trial; nor was it painless.
The Bible speaks of the death penalty. And people were put to death without a lengthy trial; nor was it painless.
Yup.. under the law - they did all kinds of things we no longer do...
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h260/beck72761/alienhiliary.gif
Cheyenne
09-22-2007, 04:29 PM
Yup.. under the law - they did all kinds of things we no longer do...The Law was never done away with. Some of the right & rituals have been. But The Law has always been since Creation.
I am a jew for the record, and i believe god gives life, and only he should be the one to take it.
also, Killing someone, even if they are a terrorist, child molester or rapist, does not bring back those they killed or undue the damage they created
Also, I believe a life sentence.. Losing ones freedom forever, is a far better punishment then a quick painless death.
I respect peoples opinions on this issue, including those who disagree with me on this issue.
Do you believe in the Torah? I have one and am pretty sure the death penalty is in there.
retiredman
09-22-2007, 08:59 PM
Do you believe in the Torah? I have one and am pretty sure the death penalty is in there.
so's slavery...
times change.
executing one innocent man is cruel and unusual. period. there are enough instances of people who have been convicted and sentenced to death who were later exonerated to prove the fallibility of the system.
put them in a small cell with a mat on the floor to sleep on, a hole in the corner to shit in, a faucet to wash, and a pipe running across the ceiling with a coil of rope hanging on the wall in case they don't want to prolong their own miserable life any longer.
so's slavery...
times change.
executing one innocent man is cruel and unusual. period. there are enough instances of people who have been convicted and sentenced to death who were later exonerated to prove the fallibility of the system.
put them in a small cell with a mat on the floor to sleep on, a hole in the corner to shit in, a faucet to wash, and a pipe running across the ceiling with a coil of rope hanging on the wall in case they don't want to prolong their own miserable life any longer.
I was not speaking to you.
Go to your corner......
Missileman
09-22-2007, 09:39 PM
so's slavery...
times change.
executing one innocent man is cruel and unusual. period. there are enough instances of people who have been convicted and sentenced to death who were later exonerated to prove the fallibility of the system.
put them in a small cell with a mat on the floor to sleep on, a hole in the corner to shit in, a faucet to wash, and a pipe running across the ceiling with a coil of rope hanging on the wall in case they don't want to prolong their own miserable life any longer.
Did you really just argue that it's okay for someone wrongly accused to wind up dead as long as he offs himself?
retiredman
09-23-2007, 10:34 AM
of course not...if I were wrongfully convicted, I would hope for a new trial on appeal.
Actual innocence breeds hope. True guilt will not.
I do not think that the state should kill anyone given the historical data which proves we HAVE sentenced innocent persons to death and suggests that we most probably have executed some. That, by my way of thinking, is cruel and unusual.
I have no sympathy for murderers and rapists. I DO, however, have profound sympathy for innocent citizens sentenced to death for crimes they did not commit.
Said1
09-23-2007, 10:35 AM
Did you really just argue that it's okay for someone wrongly accused to wind up dead as long as he offs himself?
Either way, pretty shitty treatment for someone who 'might' be innocent.
retiredman
09-23-2007, 10:40 AM
Either way, pretty shitty treatment for someone who 'might' be innocent.
infinitely better than death...which is, unfortunately, irreversible, even with the discovery of new evidence.
Said1
09-23-2007, 10:51 AM
infinitely better than death...which is, unfortunately, irreversible, even with the discovery of new evidence.
Mehbe.
I'm sure there was a women somewhere who was accused of tampering with DNA evidence. Some people died, who were later found to be innocent. Scary shit.
retiredman
09-23-2007, 11:14 AM
exactly. killing an innocent citizen is cruel and unusual.
manu1959
09-23-2007, 11:33 AM
I am a jew for the record, and i believe god gives life, and only he should be the one to take it.
also, Killing someone, even if they are a terrorist, child molester or rapist, does not bring back those they killed or undue the damage they created
Also, I believe a life sentence.. Losing ones freedom forever, is a far better punishment then a quick painless death.
I respect peoples opinions on this issue, including those who disagree with me on this issue.
with respect to murder, i believe that when one takes all the rights and freedoms of another....they should lose theirs as well......
a life sentance still allows them to breath, eat, see, read, learn and live.....
nope.....
retiredman
09-23-2007, 01:03 PM
with respect to murder, i believe that when one takes all the rights and freedoms of another....they should lose theirs as well......
a life sentance still allows them to breath, eat, see, read, learn and live.....
nope.....
and if there weren't that nasty little "problem" of innocents being convicted and sentenced to die, I might be more inclined to agree with you.
Missileman
09-23-2007, 03:11 PM
of course not...if I were wrongfully convicted, I would hope for a new trial on appeal.
Actual innocence breeds hope. True guilt will not.
I do not think that the state should kill anyone given the historical data which proves we HAVE sentenced innocent persons to death and suggests that we most probably have executed some. That, by my way of thinking, is cruel and unusual.
I have no sympathy for murderers and rapists. I DO, however, have profound sympathy for innocent citizens sentenced to death for crimes they did not commit.
put them in a small cell with a mat on the floor to sleep on, a hole in the corner to shit in, a faucet to wash, and a pipe running across the ceiling with a coil of rope hanging on the wall in case they don't want to prolong their own miserable life any longer.
So exactly how do you determine who gets a suicide rope in their cell?
IMO, depriving an innocent person of their freedom is no worse than depriving them of their life, because in essence they are both the same thing. The appeals process for people on death row, the hoops that have to be jumped through in order to execute someone make it much more likely that an innocent person would be wrongfully imprisoned than wrongfully executed. The death penalty should be more than punishment for the guilty. If properly used, it would also serve as a deterrent. The threat of prison time alone has not slowed the crime rate.
retiredman
09-23-2007, 03:28 PM
depriving an innocent man of his freedom is NOT the same as depriving him of his life for one reason: it is reversible.
Missileman
09-23-2007, 03:32 PM
depriving an innocent man of his freedom is NOT the same as depriving him of his life for one reason: it is reversible.
Really? When did they invent a time machine to give this guy his missing years back?
retiredman
09-23-2007, 03:54 PM
Really? When did they invent a time machine to give this guy his missing years back?
they cannot give him his missing years back, but they can give him his FREEDOM back....
as opposed to the death penalty where they cannot give an executed man his LIFE back.
Are you being argumentative just for the sake of being argumentative, or are you really this obtuse?
Missileman
09-23-2007, 05:48 PM
they cannot give him his missing years back, but they can give him his FREEDOM back....
as opposed to the death penalty where they cannot give an executed man his LIFE back.
Are you being argumentative just for the sake of being argumentative, or are you really this obtuse?
You have to operate the system with the mindset that it works like it's supposed to or you might as well throw open the doors and let everyone out. And you can argue all you want, but wrongfully locking an innocent person up with a bunch of psychotic animals for years and years is depriving them of their life too. That loss of life is just as irreversible as death. The abuses they might suffer from other inmates are irreversible also.
retiredman
09-23-2007, 07:18 PM
You have to operate the system with the mindset that it works like it's supposed to or you might as well throw open the doors and let everyone out. And you can argue all you want, but wrongfully locking an innocent person up with a bunch of psychotic animals for years and years is depriving them of their life too. That loss of life is just as irreversible as death. The abuses they might suffer from other inmates are irreversible also.
and has our system works like it is supposed to? How many death row inmates had their sentences commuted by the Governor of Illinois because DNA had proven them innocent? How many had already "rode the spike" before they had a chance to be freed? Is that really a system that is working like it is supposed to?
As I said...I have no extraordinary compassion for murderers and rapists. I do have compassion for wrongly convicted citizens. As long as a man's fate is in the hands of twelve fallible humans, I would prefer that those twelve only be able to incarcerate and not murder innocent citizens....because incarceration can stop and individuals can be released. Innocent dead citizens can only rot alongside the guilty ones.
And to suggest that taking five or ten years of a man's life - and then exoncerating him and letting him breathe free for decades is the same as killing a man is laughable
Missileman
09-23-2007, 08:00 PM
and has our system works like it is supposed to? How many death row inmates had their sentences commuted by the Governor of Illinois because DNA had proven them innocent? How many had already "rode the spike" before they had a chance to be freed? Is that really a system that is working like it is supposed to?
As I said...I have no extraordinary compassion for murderers and rapists. I do have compassion for wrongly convicted citizens. As long as a man's fate is in the hands of twelve fallible humans, I would prefer that those twelve only be able to incarcerate and not murder innocent citizens....because incarceration can stop and individuals can be released. Innocent dead citizens can only rot alongside the guilty ones.
And to suggest that taking five or ten years of a man's life - and then exoncerating him and letting him breathe free for decades is the same as killing a man is laughable
What if he remains in prison until he dies from old age? What if he is killed by another inmate? What if he gets infected with HIV from a prison rape and dies from AIDs the day he's released from prison?
The point I'm trying to make is that imprisonment of the innocent is just as bad as the execution of the innocent and is no good reason to not use the death penalty in cases where it should apply.
retiredman
09-23-2007, 08:05 PM
What if he remains in prison until he dies from old age? What if he is killed by another inmate? What if he gets infected with HIV from a prison rape and dies from AIDs the day he's released from prison?
The point I'm trying to make is that imprisonment of the innocent is just as bad as the execution of the innocent and is no good reason to not use the death penalty in cases where it should apply.
and the point I am making is that I disagree. Imprisonment of the innocent is bad...it's terrible...but it is not as bad as death. I guarantee you that if you were to ask those Illinois inmates who had been on death row if they thought that incarceration was as bad as execution, they would all say no.
and remember....in each of those Illinois cases, the courts and juries of peers all thought that THOSE cases were ones where the death penalty should apply. oops.
I am a jew for the record, and i believe god gives life, and only he should be the one to take it.
also, Killing someone, even if they are a terrorist, child molester or rapist, does not bring back those they killed or undue the damage they created
Also, I believe a life sentence.. Losing ones freedom forever, is a far better punishment then a quick painless death.
I respect peoples opinions on this issue, including those who disagree with me on this issue.
Great, you are for more of my tax dollars going to keep this bastard alive year after year after year. It would cost exactly 4.99 to smoke any death row jackoff in America.............I would donate the .12 ga and pay for the box of 20 #6 shot, should take only 1 shot to the head. In fact you could kill 20 jackoffs for 4.99, about 25 cents a jackoff, thats a good price.
Go back to chewing on cherrywood.
If you are innocent but get locked up still after a jury trial that is just bad fucking luck, the dice came up snake eyes for you. Those people should quit their pissing and moaning and accept their lot in life....................not that there are any innocents locked up.
HotPinkConsevative
11-18-2007, 10:02 AM
I am a jew for the record, and i believe god gives life, and only he should be the one to take it.
also, Killing someone, even if they are a terrorist, child molester or rapist, does not bring back those they killed or undue the damage they created
Also, I believe a life sentence.. Losing ones freedom forever, is a far better punishment then a quick painless death.
I respect peoples opinions on this issue, including those who disagree with me on this issue.
You're right killing the terroist, child molester or rapest doesn't undo what they did, but it keeps them from killing raping others.
HotPinkConsevative
11-18-2007, 10:10 AM
with respect to murder, i believe that when one takes all the rights and freedoms of another....they should lose theirs as well......
a life sentance still allows them to breath, eat, see, read, learn and live.....
nope.....
and actually, most life sentences in reality, just last for about 20-40 years, so they aren't really a life sentence.
Guernicaa
11-18-2007, 12:37 PM
great! :)
Death Penalty is a necessary evil because of evil
Although probably not as likely to happen in todays courts, many, many, many innocent people have been put to death in America's history.
Hobbit
11-18-2007, 01:52 PM
Although probably not as likely to happen in todays courts, many, many, many innocent people have been put to death in America's history.
Such as?
Now, my official position is that I'm undecided on this issue, though I lean in favor of the death penalty, because it has a 0 recidivism rate. However, I love watching anti-death penalty advocates claim that it shouldn't be done because it's cruel and horrible and that innocents may suffer, then suggest an alternative that they state would be worse and more cruel than the death penalty. Make up your mind. Is it too cruel or not cruel enough.
As for prison sentences being reversible, that's a convenient little lie that we tell ourselves to make us feel better when a guilty man is convicted. Once you go to prison for any significant stretch, your life as you knew it is over and done. There's no going back. Sure, you can release a person if you later find that person to be innocent, but that 'returns them to normal' about as much as waking up a long-term coma patient to tell them they're confined to a wheelchair. Yeah, they're not in prison anymore, but that's a pretty small upside considering what must then be overcome. The whole business reminds me of a line from Rita Hayworth and the Shawshank Redemption, "They send you here for life, and that's exactly what they take, the part that counts, anyway."
manu1959
11-18-2007, 02:05 PM
most people don't like the reason I am opposed to the death penalty......I changed my views on it after a woman who had been on death row for 28 years became a Christian.....I am glad she was given time to change.....
everyone finds god on death row......
manu1959
11-18-2007, 02:06 PM
Although probably not as likely to happen in todays courts, many, many, many innocent people have been put to death in America's history.
how many is....many many many.....name ten.....
PostmodernProphet
11-18-2007, 03:16 PM
how many is....many many many.....name ten.....
actually, Manu....in the last 30 years 124 people on death row have been found to be innocent because of the advances in DNA testing.....do you suspect that errors in the system only began thirty years ago?.....
http://www.aclu.org/capital/
manu1959
11-18-2007, 03:47 PM
actually, Manu....in the last 30 years 124 people on death row have been found to be innocent because of the advances in DNA testing.....do you suspect that errors in the system only began thirty years ago?.....
http://www.aclu.org/capital/
his claim was innocent people have been put to death......name ten .....
your argument that we now have a better system ..... means you have no worry that innocent people will be put to death.....so much for that argument....
therfore.....i think anyone that takes all the rights from another human should have all their right taken as well.....
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.