MBGA Make Britain Great Again!

[jimnyc]

The initials don't work as well. Maybe a more like M.B.G.A. and make it look more official, or secretive. As if they will touch anything like that with a 100000000 foot pole! LOL

Good article though!

---

Twenty Ways Boris Johnson Can Make Britain Great Again

Today Boris Johnson has been elected leader of the Conservative party, and tomorrow he will be crowned Prime Minister.
I’m a lot more optimistic about Boris than many people seem to be. On Brexit, certainly, I think he’ll do the right thing — not least because all the other options have been exhausted.

But I’m also prepared to be disappointed.

So which will it be? Bold Boris or Useless Boris?

We’ll know soon enough. Here are some of the problems he’ll need to tackle successfully in order to fulfil his Churchillian destiny.

1. Deliver Brexit
Brexit-in-name-only won’t be enough. Theresa May tried and failed several times to get that one through and the people weren’t having it. Boris has committed to leaving the EU with or without a deal on October 31st. And if he doesn’t it will be career suicide.

Chances of Boris delivering 9/10

https://i.imgur.com/ZvZ6OHQ.png

2. DeBaathify the Conservatives
The first sign we’ll have that Boris is going to fail is if Amber Rudd appears prominently in his Cabinet. Look, Boris: I understand your desire to be liked and you fear of going out on a limb, but as Tim Stanley argues so persuasively here, now is not the time to compromise by reaching out to your enemies and bringing them into the One Nation fold.

That’s what the parliamentary Conservative party has been doing since Thatcher; that’s why it has failed so dismally — too many closet Lib Dems and Greens have been promoted at the expense of actual Conservatives. There is plenty of sound talent out there: Liz Truss; Priti Patel; Steve Baker; Esther McVey; Andrew Bridgen; Owen Paterson and, of course, the matchless Jacob Rees-Mogg.

Why spoil a good thing by rewarding holdovers from the discredited old regime who despise everything you stand for and who are only sucking up to your now because their miserable livelihoods depend on it.

Chances of Boris delivering 5/10

3. Drain the Swamp

A senior Conservative minister once complained to me that it was impossible for the Conservative government to do anything Conservative because the civil service, politicised by Tony Blair, is so irredeemably left-wing.

Same goes for all the quangos which David Cameron promised to put on the bonfire but never did. Instead, the Conservatives have only exacerbated their problems by suicidally appointing leftists – such as Green party activist Tony Juniper, head of Natural England – to run regulatory bodies that should be being run by conservatives.

The rot extends from the nauseatingly right-on (and anti-Trump, pro-EU) Foreign Office to the incompetent and biased Electoral Commission, the Charities Commission, the Information Commission and beyond, plus of course departments such as the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs which are run by doctrinaire eco-loons. This is the Deep State which really runs Britain. Unless Boris can summon the courage and will to tackle it, he will always be fighting his battles with one hand tied behind his back.

Chances of Boris delivering 4/10

https://i.imgur.com/vN2wu2U.png

4. Law and Order
Rampant knife crime, the obsession with policing hurty tweets, skateboarding displays at Extinction Rebellion protests, virtue signalling at Pride rallies, the deliberate withholding of evidence proving the innocence of young men facing rape convictions, the vindictive pursuit of journalists for doing their job, the failure to deal with Muslim rape gangs, the harassment of Tommy Robinson, the police chief who wouldn’t intervene when one of his officers was being hacked to death by an Islamic terrorist outside parliament, the millions squandered pursuing the “credible and true” claims of a deeply suspect lying paedophile about a high up paedo conspiracy including former Chief of the General Staff Field Marshall Lord Bramall and various other innocents…

Britain’s policing has become a national embarrassment which requires root and branch reform. Yes, the police need more resources to do their job: but only if it goes on beat officers pursuing actual crime rather than politically correct nonsense.

Chances of Boris delivering. Depends on his choice of Home Secretary. I’d say 6/10.

Rest - https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/07/23/delingpole-twenty-ways-boris-johnson-can-make-britain-great-again/

[Drummond]

The initials don't work as well. Maybe a more like M.B.G.A. and make it look more official, or secretive. As if they will touch anything like that with a 100000000 foot pole! LOL

Good article though!

---

Twenty Ways Boris Johnson Can Make Britain Great Again

Today Boris Johnson has been elected leader of the Conservative party, and tomorrow he will be crowned Prime Minister.
I’m a lot more optimistic about Boris than many people seem to be. On Brexit, certainly, I think he’ll do the right thing — not least because all the other options have been exhausted.

But I’m also prepared to be disappointed.

So which will it be? Bold Boris or Useless Boris?

We’ll know soon enough. Here are some of the problems he’ll need to tackle successfully in order to fulfil his Churchillian destiny.

1. Deliver Brexit
Brexit-in-name-only won’t be enough. Theresa May tried and failed several times to get that one through and the people weren’t having it. Boris has committed to leaving the EU with or without a deal on October 31st. And if he doesn’t it will be career suicide.

Chances of Boris delivering 9/10

https://i.imgur.com/ZvZ6OHQ.png

2. DeBaathify the Conservatives
The first sign we’ll have that Boris is going to fail is if Amber Rudd appears prominently in his Cabinet. Look, Boris: I understand your desire to be liked and you fear of going out on a limb, but as Tim Stanley argues so persuasively here, now is not the time to compromise by reaching out to your enemies and bringing them into the One Nation fold.

That’s what the parliamentary Conservative party has been doing since Thatcher; that’s why it has failed so dismally — too many closet Lib Dems and Greens have been promoted at the expense of actual Conservatives. There is plenty of sound talent out there: Liz Truss; Priti Patel; Steve Baker; Esther McVey; Andrew Bridgen; Owen Paterson and, of course, the matchless Jacob Rees-Mogg.

Why spoil a good thing by rewarding holdovers from the discredited old regime who despise everything you stand for and who are only sucking up to your now because their miserable livelihoods depend on it.

Chances of Boris delivering 5/10

3. Drain the Swamp

A senior Conservative minister once complained to me that it was impossible for the Conservative government to do anything Conservative because the civil service, politicised by Tony Blair, is so irredeemably left-wing.

Same goes for all the quangos which David Cameron promised to put on the bonfire but never did. Instead, the Conservatives have only exacerbated their problems by suicidally appointing leftists – such as Green party activist Tony Juniper, head of Natural England – to run regulatory bodies that should be being run by conservatives.

The rot extends from the nauseatingly right-on (and anti-Trump, pro-EU) Foreign Office to the incompetent and biased Electoral Commission, the Charities Commission, the Information Commission and beyond, plus of course departments such as the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs which are run by doctrinaire eco-loons. This is the Deep State which really runs Britain. Unless Boris can summon the courage and will to tackle it, he will always be fighting his battles with one hand tied behind his back.

Chances of Boris delivering 4/10

https://i.imgur.com/vN2wu2U.png

4. Law and Order
Rampant knife crime, the obsession with policing hurty tweets, skateboarding displays at Extinction Rebellion protests, virtue signalling at Pride rallies, the deliberate withholding of evidence proving the innocence of young men facing rape convictions, the vindictive pursuit of journalists for doing their job, the failure to deal with Muslim rape gangs, the harassment of Tommy Robinson, the police chief who wouldn’t intervene when one of his officers was being hacked to death by an Islamic terrorist outside parliament, the millions squandered pursuing the “credible and true” claims of a deeply suspect lying paedophile about a high up paedo conspiracy including former Chief of the General Staff Field Marshall Lord Bramall and various other innocents…

Britain’s policing has become a national embarrassment which requires root and branch reform. Yes, the police need more resources to do their job: but only if it goes on beat officers pursuing actual crime rather than politically correct nonsense.

Chances of Boris delivering. Depends on his choice of Home Secretary. I’d say 6/10.

Rest - https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/07/23/delingpole-twenty-ways-boris-johnson-can-make-britain-great-again/

Thanks for this, Jim.

Boris has a high probability of shining in his post, once the Brexit issue is behind us. Until it is, he'll be walking a minefield.

He's inheriting the set of circumstances which Theresa May couldn't overcome, and which made her own task impossible.

Boris has more to contend with. He still has pro-Remainers in the Conservative ranks, people who've decimated the Conservatives' whole ability to credibly function in the Commons. Boris's electoral 'majority' (this includes the automatic assumption that the DUP will be on his side) when it comes to getting any measures agreed by Commons votes, is wafer-thin at best. And that includes the assumption that no Conservative will rebel against Boris's direction, at all !

But those Remainers have shown their willingness to vote as THEY want, not as the leadership wants. This is why Theresa May had to go for protracted talks with Labour, to get them on her side, at least to a degree. The DUP hated the Backstop part of her exit deal, so would not support her. Too many Conservatives were willing to rebel. She kept losing votes, badly.

Boris will have the same difficulties.

Philip Hammond (Chancellor) is set to resign rather than serve under Boris. His resignation should be announced tomorrow. Alan Duncan (who disagreed so strongly with Boris over Darroch) already has done. Rory Stewart either has resigned, or has threatened it (he was a strong pro-deal election candidate, and he can't serve under an Administration preparing to go the 'no deal exit' route).

Between those three, Boris faces seeing his 'majority' wiped out altogether.

The BBC has had some fun today over Boris's impending 'coronation'.

They point out that Theresa May's resignation duty includes her formally recommending to the Queen who her successor will be. In so doing, she assures that the successor will lead her Government in her place. 'Constitutionally' ... if she's unable to give an assurance that the Government can function as one, and receive due leadership ... then, this could trigger a General Election in its place (presumably involving Theresa remaining in-post as a caretaker PM until the election decides things).

So, the BBC's proposal was that Theresa May could, legitimately, stop Boris in his tracks.

Nobody seriously believes Mrs May will do that, because she'd directly threaten the Government if she did. But, a spokesperson on the BBC tried to suggest it could happen, as Boris is bleeding too much support to viably lead.

That, folks, is just how precarious all of this is !! Boris Johnson has headaches ahead of him that will be worse than Theresa May ever had (such as, does he prorogue Parliament to stop it defying him ??).

Watch this space ! There's much political drama yet to come, before Brexit is done 'n' dusted. Far more !

[Kathianne]

Drummond, first he has to get that ship released! Seriously, good thoughts for his great performance.

[Drummond]

@Drummond (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=2287), first he has to get that ship released! Seriously, good thoughts for his great performance.

Indeed.

But he has massive headaches ahead of him. It's one thing for a Party to like a candidate enough to give electorally convincing support for the leadership role. It's quite another for Boris to find a way of neutralising the rebellious wing of his Party, which he must do, if he's to keep the voting base he needs.

With Alan Duncan (sour grapes over Darroch, also his not liking Boris's leadership style) resigning already, at just the PROSPECT of Boris winning ... and, Philip Hammond having publicly declared in an Andrew Marr BBC interview that he'd resign on Wednesday if Boris was the victor ... he's not yet managed to stop rebellions from happening.

He literally cannot afford one more rebellion beyond these ones. If they continue, Boris risks not being able to lead, any more than Theresa May has been able to of late.

[Kathianne]

Indeed.

But he has massive headaches ahead of him. It's one thing for a Party to like a candidate enough to give electorally convincing support for the leadership role. It's quite another for Boris to find a way of neutralising the rebellious wing of his Party, which he must do, if he's to keep the voting base he needs.

With Alan Duncan (sour grapes over Darroch, also his not liking Boris's leadership style) resigning already, at just the PROSPECT of Boris winning ... and, Philip Hammond having publicly declared in an Andrew Marr BBC interview that he'd resign on Wednesday if Boris was the victor ... he's not yet managed to stop rebellions from happening.

He literally cannot afford one more rebellion beyond these ones. If they continue, Boris risks not being able to lead, any more than Theresa May has been able to of late.

Can't they just go out for drinks?

[Drummond]

Can't they just go out for drinks?:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

I think they do. It's called the House of Commons.

It's a great thought !!

I suppose it's not impossible to imagine that Boris's sheer personality will carry him through. Well ... maybe.

But watch the news. If Hammond was telling the truth, news of his resignation will be announced within the next 12 hours or so. He could act as a catalyst for more.

Under Theresa May, Party consensus fractured badly. A fairly small minority in the Conservative Party continued to be 'Remainers'. Far more were divided over her 'deal'. Some liked it. Some thought it distinctly dodgy. Some thought it was too pro-EU. The Backstop was a sticking point, because even legal advice said that the EU could use it to keep ties between us and the EU alive, and for an indeterminate period.

Some wanted a straight exit, minus a deal, and that wing grew with the belief that we couldn't negotiate anything else without passing the deal instead ... which had failed ratification THREE times.

Boris might be on the opposite side of the argument, but however you view this, there are too many potential rebels for any vote in the Commons to be likely to succeed. This is why Boris's failure to reject proroguing Parliament is a problem, too. Suspending Parliament, so it can't meet and pass motions which legally ties Boris's hands, is a potential likelihood. The one thing the Commons IS sure of, is that they'll stop Boris doing that.

Jeremy Corbyn has indicated he'll -- when 'the time is right' -- push for a 'No Confidence' vote in Boris in the Commons. If that coincides with Boris being unpopular because he's tried the proroguing route .. Boris stands to lose. Then, hello General Election !!

It's not beyond the bounds of possibility that Corbyn will win one ... extremist Leftie that he is. If that happens, Boris will be rounded on by his own Party. Goodbye, Boris's career. Very possibly, also .. goodbye Brexit, with Corbyn obeying Party policy to take the 'Remain' route, and either hold a second Referendum (at minimum requiring a hefty further delay) or, he'll just rescind Article 50 (which is the ONE thing the EU agrees we can unilaterally do ... not surprisingly !!) and CANCEL Brexit.

He could argue that a Labour victory, with its now being a pro-Remain Party, delivers a mandate for stopping Brexit entirely.

So: don't imagine that, even with Boris in charge, the very future of Brexit is less than precarious. Boris will do his best, but it may not be good enough.

We have to hope that it is. If anybody can pull this off ... it's Boris.

[Kathianne]

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

I think they do. It's called the House of Commons.

It's a great thought !!

I suppose it's not impossible to imagine that Boris's sheer personality will carry him through. Well ... maybe.

But watch the news. If Hammond was telling the truth, news of his resignation will be announced within the next 12 hours or so. He could act as a catalyst for more.

Under Theresa May, Party consensus fractured badly. A fairly small minority in the Conservative Party continued to be 'Remainers'. Far more were divided over her 'deal'. Some liked it. Some thought it distinctly dodgy. Some thought it was too pro-EU. The Backstop was a sticking point, because even legal advice said that the EU could use it to keep ties between us and the EU alive, and for an indeterminate period.

Some wanted a straight exit, minus a deal, and that wing grew with the belief that we couldn't negotiate anything else without passing the deal instead ... which had failed ratification THREE times.

Boris might be on the opposite side of the argument, but however you view this, there are too many potential rebels for any vote in the Commons to be likely to succeed. This is why Boris's failure to reject proroguing Parliament is a problem, too. Suspending Parliament, so it can't meet and pass motions which legally ties Boris's hands, is a potential likelihood. The one thing the Commons IS sure of, is that they'll stop Boris doing that.

Jeremy Corbyn has indicated he'll -- when 'the time is right' -- push for a 'No Confidence' vote in Boris in the Commons. If that coincides with Boris being unpopular because he's tried the proroguing route .. Boris stands to lose. Then, hello General Election !!

It's not beyond the bounds of possibility that Corbyn will win one ... extremist Leftie that he is. If that happens, Boris will be rounded on by his own Party. Goodbye, Boris's career. Very possibly, also .. goodbye Brexit, with Corbyn obeying Party policy take the 'Remain' route, and either hold a second Referendum (at minimum requiring a hefty further delay) or, he'll just rescind Article 50 (which is the ONE thing the EU agrees we can unilaterally do ... not surprisingly !!) and CANCEL Brexit.

He could argue that a Labour victory, with its now being a pro-Remain Party, delivers a mandate for stopping Brexit entirely.

So: don't imagine that, even with Boris in charge, the very future of Brexit is less than precarious. Boris will do his best, but it may not be good enough.

We have to hope that it is. If anybody can pull this off ... it's Boris.

Wow and we think our differences are contact sports! Seems like you all have worse fighting within your parties. We're freakin' amateurs. :laugh2:

[Drummond]

Wow and we think our differences are contact sports! Seems like you all have worse fighting within your parties. We're freakin' amateurs. :laugh2::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

On the plus side ... conditions such as these are rare in our politics. A lot of this has come about thanks to (a) disgusting EU opportunism / intransigence .. combined with (b) a Prime Minister who proved to be a very weak individual.

She SEEMED strong. She promised tough negotiating .. a 'don't mess with me' style. She promised that if we were given a bad deal, she'd consider no deal was preferable.

What really happened was that the EU prevaricated, forced through a dodgy deal THEY preferred, when time was growing short .. then, Theresa May refused to do anything else but force its acceptance as best she could.

She tried three times. Her 'no deal better than a bad deal' promise was junked. She totally focused on getting it ratified and was incapable of taking any other line. She failed. She lost her job.

Theresa proved to be weak. I think Boris will mean what he says and be strong. The EU won't like it !! They're bound to react badly. Then, 'no deal' will loom.

Parliament won't like that, either. The fireworks will start in earnest, complete with Corbyn trying for his own 'Callaghan' moment.

We had Jim Callaghan losing power in 1978 after a Commons 'no confidence' motion. We've had States of Emergency declared because of crippling strikes (Noir never refers to such Union-created strife, does he ?). We had a Parliamentary furore when Tony Blair sided with GW Bush over the 2003 Iraq War. But you have to go back decades to see comparable dysfunctionality in our Parliament.

Strong leadership does a lot to mitigate them. Boris will provide that. Will it be enough ? Arguable !!

I can promise one thing.

It'll be full of laughs, if Boris has anything to do with it. Even if he loses out, we might as well see the funny side ... we'll at least go down laughing.:rolleyes::rolleyes::cool::cool::cool:

[Drummond]

Boris hasn't even officially become PM yet .. Mrs May is tendering her resignation later today.

But the opposing acrimony has already started.

The first example of this - but, I'm sure, not the last, by a VERY long shot - has been issued by the Scottish National Party (Left-wing nationalists governing Scotland).

Here it is ...

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/snp-warns-brexit-could-force-out-boris-johnson-as-prime-minister-1-4968493


The SNP has said that Boris Johnson could be the shortest serving prime minister of the UK in history if he railroads ahead with his plans of inflicting a “do or die” Brexit outcome that will result in lasting economic and social harm.

This would see him achieve the unwanted record of becoming the prime minister who has served for the total shortest period in office – a record currently held by George Canning, who lasted 119 days in the role from 12 April 1827 to 8 August 1827 before his untimely death at the age of 57.

Johnson would see his first 99 days in office take him up to 31 October – the date he has committed to take the UK out of the EU with or without a deal.

With the former foreign secretary looking set to succeed Theresa May this week, Ian Blackford MP warned that the SNP would not sit idly by as Johnson disregards democracy and continues to sideline Scotland’s voice and interests through the Brexit process.

The SNP’s Westminster leader also called on MPs from across Westminster to work with the SNP to ensure that Johnson’s “nightmare” plans to drag the UK out of the EU do not become reality – calling for every option to be on the table.

The warnings follow on from a vote in parliament last week where MPs voted by a substantial majority to stop the next prime minister pushing through a no-deal Brexit by shutting down parliament.

The SNP has also raised serious concerns over an undemocratic Tory coronation whereby a few thousand Tory activists would choose the UK’s next prime minister, rather than the public.

Pete Wishart, the SNP’s shadow leader of the House, introduced a bill in Westminster last week that would require a parliamentary vote on any future prime minister.

Such hostile positioning overlooks that Scotland took part in the 2016 Referendum, and that they voted as a constituent part of the UK as a whole. This defies their charge of being 'dragged' out of the EU. Yet, now ... they're unhappy. These Lefties somehow manage to 'forget' the terms by which they voted.

The SNP want Scotland to leave the UK. If Brexit successfully happens, they'll then press hard for a second Independence Referendum. If all that is successful, they've said they'll immediately re-apply for EU membership for their own country.

The BBC report on this shows that Nicola Sturgeon (leader of the SNP) gives her full backing to the above.

[Kathianne]

Boris hasn't even officially become PM yet .. Mrs May is tendering her resignation later today.

But the opposing acrimony has already started.

The first example of this - but, I'm sure, not the last, by a VERY long shot - has been issued by the Scottish National Party (Left-wing nationalists governing Scotland).

Here it is ...

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/snp-warns-brexit-could-force-out-boris-johnson-as-prime-minister-1-4968493



Such hostile positioning overlooks that Scotland took part in the 2016 Referendum, and that they voted as a constituent part of the UK as a whole. This defies their charge of being 'dragged' out of the EU. Yet, now ... they're unhappy. These Lefties somehow manage to 'forget' the terms by which they voted.

The SNP want Scotland to leave the UK. If Brexit successfully happens, they'll then press hard for a second Independence Referendum. If all that is successful, they've said they'll immediately re-apply for EU membership for their own country.

The BBC report on this shows that Nicola Sturgeon (leader of the SNP) gives her full backing to the above.

Egads.

[Drummond]

Egads.

Hah. This is only the first opening shot in what will become a very protracted and extremely angst-filled, acrimonious battle.

Nobody over here imagines that Boris will just be able to sail through difficulties and achieve his goal without an extremely nasty battle being involved. Jeremy Corbyn WILL try to bring him down, and his Government, and force a General Election ... he's said as much. You won't see it happen yet .. Corbyn will bide his time, see factions form, see disquiet reach the proper pitch. Then, he'll act.

Parliament, for a long time now, has frustrated the progress Brexit SHOULD have achieved. Each rebel MP has stood in unashamed opposition to the democratic Brexit promise, as was voted for. Labour even changed its core direction recently, and came out officially as pro-Remain, totally disregarding the Referendum vote. Those MP's defy the electorate. Boris wants Parliament to be stopped from continuing with that.

But Parliament, in a rare act of agreement these days, has already voted to resist any / all attempts Boris might make to stop them continuing on as they have, by proroguing Parliament.

It's important. Parliament could vote to dictate to Boris what his actions towards the EU should be .. Mrs May was governed by one such voted-in demand that she attend Brussels to attempt renegotiation.

So: Boris has one hell of a battle on his hands, to do, and achieve, what he sets out to do. It's all barely begun. But I suspect it'll be so bad that British politics will have barely seen its like, in its history ...

[Kathianne]

Hah. This is only the first opening shot in what will become a very protracted and extremely angst-filled, acrimonious battle.

Nobody over here imagines that Boris will just be able to sail through difficulties and achieve his goal without an extremely nasty battle being involved. Jeremy Corbyn WILL try to bring him down, and his Government, and force a General Election ... he's said as much. You won't see it happen yet .. Corbyn will bide his time, see factions form, see disquiet reach the proper pitch. Then, he'll act.

Parliament, for a long time now, has frustrated the progress Brexit SHOULD have achieved. Each rebel MP has stood in unashamed opposition to the democratic Brexit promise, as was voted for. Labour even changed its core direction recently, and came out officially as pro-Remain, totally disregarding the Referendum vote. Those MP's defy the electorate. Boris wants Parliament to be stopped from continuing with that.

But Parliament, in a rare act of agreement these days, has already voted to resist any / all attempts Boris might make to stop them continuing on as they have, by proroguing Parliament.

It's important. Parliament could vote to dictate to Boris what his actions towards the EU should be .. Mrs May was governed by one such voted-in demand that she attend Brussels to attempt renegotiation.

So: Boris has one hell of a battle on his hands, to do, and achieve, what he sets out to do. It's all barely begun. But I suspect it'll be so bad that British politics will have barely seen its like, in its history ...


I have to say, your system is rather Byzantine.

[Drummond]

I have to say, your system is rather Byzantine.

By that, do you mean overly complicated ? Or are you thinking of 'little Caesars' trying to protect their own pockets of overly-enjoyed power ??

What we have here, at its root, is 'simply' this -- here's a history of the issue:

Calls to leave the EU have existed for many years. A newspaper campaign concentrated and amplified those calls (not sure, but I think the Daily Express was responsible). After a while, an actual political Party formed to represent them ('UKIP').

An MEP election was held, and we were all amazed to see how well UKIP did in it.

The 'Establishment' was stunned.

It became obvious that demands to leave weren't fading. We had (we were due for one) a General Election. Labour absolutely refused to grant a Referendum, in its Manifesto. UKIP demanded one, but lacked the voter base to win electoral support to arrange it themselves (they still weren't a 'main' Party). The LibDems opposed one (no surprise there). The Conservatives ... promised to hold one, in return for proper voter support.

The Conservatives won the election. David Cameron said he'd honour the promise.

Cameron was a staunch Remainer. He was sure the 'Remain in the EU' vote would win out. To him ... he was lancing a boil, by bringing everything to a head, so that Brexit could be buried once and for all.

But, Brexit, won.

The shock was very great.

Wholesale resignations happened ... within 24 hours, Cameron resigned as PM, saying he couldn't in good conscience lead the UK out of the EU.

Ed Miliband, Labour Leader, also resigned his leadership role, within an hour or 2 of Cameron (he'd campaigned against Brexit, and any Referendum).

I think that the LibDem leader also resigned.

Brexit has never been an easy process ... and old grudges and ideological oppositions linger on. The People Had Spoken ... they'd just spoken with the opposite message to the one everybody expected.

So, here we are. Little in our history has created such shock or division. And now, Parliament is charged with doing The Peoples' Will.

So far, it's not exactly done a good job of it.

And neither, it seems, does it particularly want to.

Enter Boris on to the scene. He'll have the fight of his life on his hands. That's guaranteed. He thinks the Voice of the People matters, and besides, he wants the electorate to start backing the Conservatives once more (they chiefly got the blame for Mrs May's failure) !

[Kathianne]

By that, do you mean overly complicated ? Or are you thinking of 'little Caesars' trying to protect their own pockets of overly-enjoyed power ??

What we have here, at its root, is 'simply' this -- here's a history of the issue:

Calls to leave the EU have existed for many years. A newspaper campaign concentrated and amplified those calls (not sure, but I think the Daily Express was responsible). After a while, an actual political Party formed to represent them ('UKIP').

An MEP election was held, and we were all amazed to see how well UKIP did in it.

The 'Establishment' was stunned.

It became obvious that demands to leave weren't fading. We had (we were due for one) a General Election. Labour absolutely refused to grant a Referendum, in its Manifesto. UKIP demanded one, but lacked the voter base to win electoral support to arrange it themselves (they still weren't a 'main' Party). The LibDems opposed one (no surprise there). The Conservatives ... promised to hold one, in return for proper voter support.

The Conservatives won the election. David Cameron said he'd honour the promise.

Cameron was a staunch Remainer. He was sure the 'Remain in the EU' vote would win out. To him ... he was lancing a boil, by bringing everything to a head, so that Brexit could be buried once and for all.

But, Brexit, won.

The shock was very great.

Wholesale resignations happened ... within 24 hours, Cameron resigned as PM, saying he couldn't in good conscience lead the UK out of the EU.

Ed Miliband, Labour Leader, also resigned his leadership role, within an hour or 2 of Cameron (he'd campaigned against Brexit, and any Referendum).

I think that the LibDem leader also resigned.

Brexit has never been an easy process ... and old grudges and ideological oppositions linger on. The People Had Spoken ... they'd just spoken with the opposite message to the one everybody expected.

So, here we are. Little in our history has created such shock or division. And now, Parliament is charged with doing The Peoples' Will.

So far, it's not exactly done a good job of it.

And neither, it seems, does it particularly want to.

Enter Boris on to the scene. He'll have the fight of his life on his hands. That's guaranteed. He thinks the Voice of the People matters, and besides, he wants the electorate to start backing the Conservatives once more (they chiefly got the blame for Mrs May's failure) !


So right now and for the recent past, nearly all your governing is revolving around Brexit?

Is it October that is the 'hard date,' of exit?

[Drummond]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1157039/piers-morgan-twitter-boris-johnson-tory-leadership-brexit


BREXITEER Piers Morgan has thrown his weight behind Boris Johnson, after the blond’s victory triggered “horror” from “liberal snowflakes”.

The Good Morning Britain host took to Twitter to share his delight at complaints about Mr Johnson scooping 66 percent of backing from Tory members in the leadership race. He was today crowned leader of the Conservatives and will be Britain’s next Prime Minister today after a meeting with the Queen. Mr Morgan said: “The more the usual insufferably self-righteous, PC-crazed, virtue-signalling liberal snowflake suspects scream with horror about Boris, the more I’m warming to the idea of him as Prime Minister.

“Like Trump, he has a commendable talent for sending them all completely nuts.”

He posted the infamous image of Mr Johnson stuck on a zip-wire from a few years back.

In the image, he is wearing a full suit, blue helmet and waving two Union Jack flags while efforts are made to get him down.

Mr Morgan’s tweet prompted further comparisons to be made between Mr Johnson and President Trump, a close friend of the outspoken host and the new Tory leader.

It emerged a hashtag has been doing the rounds - #NotMyPM - in the hours after the victory for Mr Johnson.

President Trump had a similar one called #NotMyPOTUS when he was elected in 2016.

Replying to Mr Morgan’s tweet, one follower said: “Boris will put some bite back in the bulldog..... a bonus is watching the streets flood with liberal, lefties and assorted muppets tears.”

Another added: “I’m loving the left wing tears.”

[Kathianne]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1157039/piers-morgan-twitter-boris-johnson-tory-leadership-brexit


I just read his Wiki bio, not that it's necessarily accurate, but a start. Colorful seems a bit of an understatement.

[Drummond]

So right now and for the recent past, nearly all your governing is revolving around Brexit?

Is it October that is the 'hard date,' of exit?

Must go to bed soon.

Answering:

Brexit has dominated everything for many months. Government ticks along doing other things, as it must, but no major policy initiatives have been worked on, no major bills passed on other matters (at least, our media hasn't covered much on other subjects) for a considerable time. Divisions and enmities caused by Brexit have been crippling.

With Boris going full pelt, all this will intensify, as all his opposition will fight him tooth and nail.

October is the LATEST 'hard date'. We had one for the end of March, but the Commons managed to throw so many political spanners in the works, defying Theresa May and her 'deal', that March came and went with nothing achieved.

This has caused fury amongst hardline Brexiters, who blame May's stubborn tunnel-vision for creating the intractable conditions.

The EU set other dates. Mid-April, to leave minus a deal. If progress was made ... another exit date of May 22nd existed instead. But it was made clear to the EU that April couldn't be met either ... Mrs May asked for more time. Consensus was that the EU might give us until Christmas.

The EU instead gave us until 31st October.

It's the EU who set our deadlines for us. They run this, they dictate the pace of our exiting. Boris, working with this latest deadline, has seized upon it because he knows it'll do irreparable damage to the Conservatives if we fail to meet this one, too.

Enter the EU's new EU Commission President, saying that the EU could extend the deadline further if it was asked to. Boris understands the massive harm it'd do if he agreed (Hunt might have gone for it). He's sticking to his guns.

He has to. He has the future of the Conservative Party's very credibility at stake.

Naturally, his enemies have enormous reason to see him fail. This is all a part of why Boris will have a titanic struggle ahead of him.

[Kathianne]

Must go to bed soon.

Answering:

Brexit has dominated everything for many months. Government ticks along doing other things, as it must, but no major policy initiatives have been worked on, no major bills passed on other matters (at least, our media hasn't covered much on other subjects) for a considerable time. Divisions and enmities caused by Brexit have been crippling.

With Boris going full pelt, all this will intensify, as all his opposition will fight him tooth and nail.

October is the LATEST 'hard date'. We had one for the end of March, but the Commons managed to throw so many political spanners in the works, defying Theresa May and her 'deal', that March came and went with nothing achieved.

This has caused fury amongst hardline Brexiters, who blame May's stubborn tunnel-vision for creating the intractable conditions.

The EU set other dates. Mid-April, to leave minus a deal. If progress was made ... another exit date of May 22nd existed instead. But it was made clear to the EU that April couldn't be met either ... Mrs May asked for more time. Consensus was that the EU might give us until Christmas.

The EU instead gave us until 31st October.

It's the EU who set our deadlines for us. They run this, they dictate the pace of our exiting. Boris, working with this latest deadline, has seized upon it because he knows it'll do irreparable damage to the Conservatives if we fail to meet this one, too.

Enter the EU's new EU Commission President, saying that the EU could extend the deadline further if it was asked to. Boris understands the massive harm it'd do if he agreed (Hunt might have gone for it). He's sticking to his guns.

He has to. He has the future of the Conservative Party's very credibility at stake.

Naturally, his enemies have enormous reason to see him fail. This is all a part of why Boris will have a titanic struggle ahead of him.

Thanks for all that. I know it's not even the surface, but a start in understanding. I do think the politics of Europe are not as straight forward as ours, which is scary in and of itself.

[Drummond]

I just read his Wiki bio, not that it's necessarily accurate, but a start. Colorful seems a bit of an understatement.

Definitely an understatement ! Boris is as unorthodox (for all sorts of reasons) as it gets. 'Lovable rogue' is the sort of persona Boris has managed to craft for himself. Highly controversial at times. Gaffe prone. At times, he offends. But always, there's his disarming manner, too, and with mischievous gags never very far away.

Trust me .. if the American media make the effort to keep him in its spotlight (I think they will) .. none of you will be short of entertainment.

Like I say ... if it all goes 'belly up', and Boris fails ... well, he'll at least have entertained us all while he does.

Try to imagine, if it's possible to, a self-deprecating, polite Donald Trump, who bumbles through speeches and plays them for laughs instead of going for a more forthright, bombastic tone. Boris has all of Trump's drive and determination, and a formidable ego; and despite his manner, can and will bulldoze through difficulties and challenges.

Yes. He's one hell of a contradiction.

But a funny one.

[Noir]

Can't they just go out for drinks?

Boris is a particularly odious character, it doesn’t surprise me at all that multiple ministers would give up their positions rather than work with him.

It remains to be seen if the Tories would rather go to general election than carry out the will of his executive. Fearing for their jobs I suspect most will support him despite all else.

[Kathianne]

Boris is a particularly odious character, it doesn’t surprise me at all that multiple ministers would give up their positions rather than work with him.

It remains to be seen if the Tories would rather go to general election than carry out the will of his executive. Fearing for their jobs I suspect most will support him despite all else.

Yet, he seems to have won the position by a substantial margin. In that case, aren't the ministers obliged to follow the will of the people?

[Noir]

Yet, he seems to have won the position by a substantial margin. In that case, aren't the ministers obliged to follow the will of the people?

No, ministers have no such obligations.

[Kathianne]

No, ministers have no such obligations.

So in your type of government, the ministers (legislators?) do not work for the people? They make their own decisions, without taking into consideration what the people want?

[Drummond]

So in your type of government, the ministers (legislators?) do not work for the people? They make their own decisions, without taking into consideration what the people want?:clap::clap::clap::clap:

I've just started watching this little dialogue you have going with Noir, and with interest.

My only current comment, Kathianne ... POINT VERY WELL MADE.

Let's see where this conversation leads, then. I'll stay out of it for the moment (besides, I'm occupied watching Prime Minister's Questions from the Commons, being relayed live).

[Noir]

So in your type of government, the ministers (legislators?) do not work for the people? They make their own decisions, without taking into consideration what the people want?

Consideration and obligation are not the same thing.

A ministers primary duty is to push executive policy, obviously it’s in their interest to do so in a way that is popular with their electorate if they want to win re-election, but their is no obligation.

[Kathianne]

Consideration and obligation are not the same thing.

A ministers primary duty is to push executive policy, obviously it’s in their interest to do so in a way that is popular with their electorate if they want to win re-election, but their is no obligation.

So they are appointed?

[Noir]

So they are appointed?

Yes. Cabinet Ministers are appointment by the Prime Minister to form their Executive. Ministers are almost always elected MPs, but you get the odd Lord etc being given Minsters posts too.

Its part of the mess of the British Political system that we have no real separation between the Legislature and the Executive.

[Drummond]

That's it, then ? Dialogue over, folks ?

Ok, I'll offer my own comments.

Noir relies heavily on technical exactitudes (for want of a better way of putting it) to make his case. His is a valid case ... sort of.

Let's say a General Election is called. What's involved, and what does it result in, for Commons operability, as a whole ?

In chronological order:

An election is called. Party 'lines' are drawn up, i.e each Party refines and stipulates in its Manifesto what candidates for that Party will represent when they canvass for votes.

They go out, canvassing. 'Vote for me', they say. 'This is what I'm representing'. Support me, & in doing so, validate me, my position as your MP. Every such MP will sell this, but from a context of the MP pledging to serve the constituents' interests as well as can be done.

The MP's who are voted in, duly take their seats in the Commons. When they do, they represent their Party's mandates, its policy direction, & any whipped directives handed down.

They also have a responsibility, though, to raise questions in the House representative of constituent concerns.

Realistically, though, their first duties are defined by loyalty to Party. Loyal MP's obey it.

But rebels do not. A properly functioning Party machinery will discipline an errant MP showing unacceptable divergence from Party wishes, and all being well, the errant conduct ceases. All is then 'well'.

Today's extraordinary shenanigans fall well outside of normality. Conservative collective responsibility and discipline broke down, with Mrs May's deeply polarising leadership creating very sharp disagreements, and clashes with personal principle. Personal principle won out in many cases, for many individual MP's, and rebellions were rife. This resulted in fractured voting .. from ALL Parties, as became evident .. and a dysfunctional mess.

This mess continues unabated.

So deeply divisive is all this, for many MP's, that rogue behaviour is rife. That behaviour might, in certain instances, come from an MP representing local Constituencies at the cost of Party direction. But also, the opposite is true. Some MP's even defy their own Constituencies, even their Parties, to follow their OWN agendas.

It's a mess. Discipline is devolved into chaos. Why ? Because MP's consider themselves answerable only, if they choose it, to themselves.

Parliament is meant to serve representative democracy. To a great extent this has broken down (depending on who you're talking about).

Noir's procedural correctness, along with a certain power-mania from some rebel MP's, has shown us that MP's aren't automatically answerable to the people they SAID, and CLAIMED, they represented. Truthfully .. Parliament is well capable of being a law unto itself, as it's proved recently.

Polarisation ... not caring about the Brexit outcome, disregarding it ... this fuels all this on the part of some MP's (depending on the position they've chosen).

The real point, is this: Parliamentary machinery, through blatant rebellion, from initial polarisation and MP's sheer egos, isn't quite operating as it normally does. Disciplinary checks and balances have become corrupted.

All this, Boris will have to contend with ... starting with MP's on his side who'd rather resign, than toe Boris's line.

--- And there you have it. Happy days !!! :rolleyes:

[Noir]

It's a mess. Discipline is devolved into chaos. Why ? Because MP's consider themselves answerable only, if they choose it, to themselves.

We’ve been over this before (you didn’t get it then, so I have little hope for now) there are several philosophy’s by which an MP can chose to be a representative - Their Party, their constituency, national opinion, personal opinion etc.

But just take any mix of the possible opinions on representation and so how easy they conflict - for example if a constituency that voted Remain had a Conservative MP, should that MP represent his constituency, or the National average of all constituencies?

[Kathianne]

Gentlemen, I'm doing my best, but truly your's is a byzantine system. It's going to take a bit to digest what you've both written.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Byzantine

4 often not capitalized
a: of, relating to, or characterized by a devious and usually surreptitious (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/surreptitious)manner of operationa Byzantine power struggle
b: intricately involved : LABYRINTHINE (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/labyrinthine)rules of Byzantine complexity

[Drummond]

WeÂ’ve been over this before (you didnÂ’t get it then, so I have little hope for now) there are several philosophyÂ’s by which an MP can chose to be a representative - Their Party, their constituency, national opinion, personal opinion etc.

But just take any mix of the possible opinions on representation and so how easy they conflict - for example if a constituency that voted Remain had a Conservative MP, should that MP represent his constituency, or the National average of all constituencies?

I think you missed my most central point (which is odd, because you should already know I'm right, from your own knowledge & observations). I've tried to explain that a breakdown in Party discipline is rife these days.

A candidate tries to sell a predetermined Party position, when canvassing for their election to Parliament. They say ... 'I represent 'X' Party. This is our manifesto, and I'll be your local representative, but loyal and representative to my Party and its principles'.

What you're claiming ignores much of that central truth, beyond which a Party candidate CANNOT stray .. not without risking eventual deselection !

What's happened now is that the balance of duties and aligned positions, to Party, to Self, to 'National Opinion', has become skewed not only from rebellion, but unchecked rebellion.

There's an order to things. That order is corrupted. THAT is the POINT.

Consider. Mrs May's only original brief was to make Brexit happen. So, she & her team initiated Article 50. So-called 'negotiations' started. Mrs May was ultimately railroaded into the EU's preferred deal.

She came back with it. Many saw it was a very bad deal. Mrs May defied everyone and insisted it was good. Individuals' 'principles' started intervening, positions started to polarise, factions formed. Mrs May's own Party voting base began to be unreliable.

So bad was the Conservative rebellion that it was uncontainable. Discipline broke down.

You're trying to simplify a situation that has many shades of complexity. What is Party direction ? Does the Party itself remain loyal to it ? Should an individual persist with loyalty, or see reason to break with it ?

How loyal was Mrs May to her OWN pledges, e.g 'A no-deal Brexit is better than a bad deal' ... when all she'd do was to peddle a bad deal, to the exclusion of all else !!

In the case of Labour, did they even have coherent policy ?? [They've only now fixed that one ...]

Remainers who are part of a Party pledged to make Brexit work, have the duty to fall behind Party policy. Mrs May was herself a Remainer, remember ... BUT, she became fanatical about making a particular version of Brexit work !

Her problem was one of fundamental weakness and political myopia, mixed in with ego, making her intractably stubborn, incapable of bending to realities and coping with them.

To answer your misleading question as directly as I can: MP's have well defined duties, first & foremost to Party loyalty.

But what marks today's dysfunctionality is the breakdown of discipline. This is why, with fracturing occurring in her own Party, and with some of Labour's people being ideologically opposed to her & all she stood for, AND, with DUP support taking a hike because of the Backstop ... she STILL thought there might be enough errant, rebel LABOUR MP's to square the circle, and get for her an electoral majority !!

So you can't quantify things as you're trying to, Noir. We are well beyond the scope of 'normal business', and all MP's doing what they're supposed to do. In today's messy climate, too much dysfunctionality rules. Sorry.

[Kathianne]

One thing that is giving me pause here, in many ways I've been moving towards 'term limits' for legislators. This mess is giving me some pause.

There seems to have been good reasons for the set up of the founders, (who no doubt were more than familiar with the British system), for the setting up terms of office, with the possibility of impeachment for cause.

Even with our political parties, it's much easier for the citizens to follow.

[Drummond]

Gentlemen, I'm doing my best, but truly your's is a byzantine system. It's going to take a bit to digest what you've both written.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Byzantine

4 often not capitalized
a: of, relating to, or characterized by a devious and usually surreptitious (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/surreptitious)manner of operationa Byzantine power struggle
b: intricately involved : LABYRINTHINE (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/labyrinthine)rules of Byzantine complexity


In your own way, you're trying for a form of quantifying a system, and MP's interactions with it, as though things were operating normally. But that doesn't characterise today's situation at all.

We have a good and relatively simple system. Normally (though it isn't perfect, and its idea of true representation is open to question) ... our system works well.

These are not normal times. Polarised positions, rebellions, none of these are normally seen, BUT, they are what's driving the level of today's dysfunctionality.

Mrs May's peddling of a dodgy deal as a 'good' one, and her reneging on her original claim of never accepting a bad deal ... that was the catalyst for it all. Why should an MP accept disciplining procedures from an authority not loyal to its own pronouncements ? Why should an MP not adopt values and be loyal to them, in defiance of corrupted ones ?

No. The system itself is fine, tried & tested over generations, usually working like a well-oiled machine. It's become corrupted to become a travesty of itself, through highly unusual circumstances. That's the truth here.

[Kathianne]

In your own way, you're trying for a form of quantifying a system, and MP's interactions with it, as though things were operating normally. But that doesn't characterise today's situation at all.

We have a good and relatively simple system. Normally (though it isn't perfect, and its idea of true representation is open to question) ... our system works well.

These are not normal times. Polarised positions, rebellions, none of these are normally seen, BUT, they are what's driving the level of today's dysfunctionality.

Mrs May's peddling of a dodgy deal as a 'good' one, and her reneging on her original claim of never accepting a bad deal ... that was the catalyst for it all. Why should an MP accept disciplining procedures from an authority not loyal to its own pronouncements ? Why should an MP not adopt values and be loyal to them, in defiance of corrupted ones ?

No. The system itself is fine, tried & tested over generations, usually working like a well-oiled machine. It's become corrupted to become a travesty of itself, through highly unusual circumstances. That's the truth here.

From the outside, with the 'abnormal times' your prime minister seems too easily in the position of losing the support and facing removal-even before a chance is actually given to complete any attempts to govern.

It seems very difficult that a prime minister to form both a cabinet or a majority since the rest of the government has much to gain in forming further position for future elections?

This country faces similar divisions within, even within the partisan parties. The safeguards though of terms of office seems to keep some of the worst tendencies at bay.

Interestingly right now these congressional inquiries are a move by the democrats to undermine said system for the President.

[Drummond]

One thing that is giving me pause here, in many ways I've been moving towards 'term limits' for legislators. This mess is giving me some pause.

There seems to have been good reasons for the set up of the founders, (who no doubt were more than familiar with the British system), for the setting up terms of office, with the possibility of impeachment for cause.

Even with our political parties, it's much easier for the citizens to follow.

Your system definitely does have its good points. I'm happy to acknowledge that yours has useful innovations over ours. Your Constitution, for example, which we lack an equivalent of.

Against that, though, is our system which better centralises power, and the wielding of it. [Your judges get away with liberties impossible in our system, as we've discussed before.]

When the central core of power starts having problems ... then, you've got a mess. Its saving grace is the sheer rarity of such messes.

This current one has human fallibility behind it, corrupting an otherwise - dare I say it - exemplary system.

Remember, by the way, we have a form (a rather cruder form) of 'impeachment', which Corbyn is preparing to implement, even now .. our 'No Confidence' vote.

But here, it's just used as a weapon with the hope in mind of destroying an opponent just because you want that opponent neutralised.

[Kathianne]

Your system definitely does have its good points. I'm happy to acknowledge that yours has useful innovations over ours. Your Constitution, for example, which we lack an equivalent of.

Against that, though, is our system which better centralises power, and the wielding of it. [Your judges get away with liberties impossible in our system, as we've discussed before.]

When the central core of power starts having problems ... then, you've got a mess. Its saving grace is the sheer rarity of such messes.

This current one has human fallibility behind it, corrupting an otherwise - dare I say it - exemplary system.

Remember, by the way, we have a form (a rather cruder form) of 'impeachment', which Corbyn is preparing to implement, even now .. our 'No Confidence' vote.

But here, it's just used as a weapon with the hope in mind of destroying an opponent just because you want that opponent neutralised.

It seems relatively easy to invoke the 'no confidence vote' and I think it can be done repeatedly? Impeachment isn't. In fact, this goofy committee appearance by Mueller today is simply an attempt to somehow convince 'the people' that an impeachment attempt by the House would be justified. Unlikely they'll succeed, but that is their hope.

[Drummond]

From the outside, with the 'abnormal times' your prime minister seems too easily in the position of losing the support and facing removal-even before a chance is actually given to complete any attempts to govern.

It seems very difficult that a prime minister to form both a cabinet or a majority since the rest of the government has much to gain in forming further position for future elections?

Not bad. Not bad at all.

It's a good analysis, as far as it goes.

Boris, actually, shouldn't have too much trouble forming his compliant Cabinet ... there are certainly enough in the Conservative Party agreeing with him for it to be possible to do.

That isn't really the difficulty.

The real problem is one of having a sufficiently large voter base to carry measures, principles, directions, that you need to have implemented.

This comes from two causes ... the extent of rebellion, and, having started out from a position of not having a good, working majority that'll provide needed stability in trying to get votes to go your way.

Contrast that with the 'good old days', under Margaret Thatcher. Her working majorities were massive, of landslide proportions.

Now, if SHE was facing rebellion (... not that anyone would dare to try it !!) ... her option would've been simple. Sack every rebel, tell them to fall in line or say goodbye to their careers (she tried that threat over Bilderberg ... separate story). She'd still have plenty of loyal MP's to vote in anything she wanted, without the hint of difficulty ... job done !! Brexit would've been done 'n' dusted, on time, maybe even ahead of time.

In 2017, Mrs May had a slim but working majority. But .. she yielded to temptation, from believing our polls. All polls suggested that Corbyn was seen as so unelectable that, if she called a General Election, she could dramatically increase her majority, AND deal a knockout blow to Corbyn.

The opposite happened. The polls were way off, and Mrs May decimated what majority she had. Her authority was so weakened that people believed she'd have to resign within days.

She scrambled around for support, finding it from the DUP. She became capable of governing once more. And, the DUP propped her up.

Then, the Godawful 'deal' emerged. DUP support promptly ended. They would never support the Backstop clause in the deal. Mrs May had no way of guaranteeing acceptance of her deal.

Then, the rebellions started, grew, took on a life of their own. Just for good measure, a mirror image of that manifested in the Labour Party.

Chaos was born ......