The First Gulf War

[Gunny]

High_Plains_Drifter

I assume your comment in the other thread concerned whether or not "we won our war". We did. End of story. Our mission was to remove Saddam Hussein/Iraq from Kuwait. That is exactly what we did. There wasn't any more to it than THAT.

President Bush had to make a deal with the other Arab nations involved, and deja vu Turkey who balked until the last second. We had unrestricted use of Arab airspace, and bases in Saudi Arabia and Bahrain in return for a promise that ALL we did was remove Saddam from Kuwait. It was no deal if President Bush did not agree to not go after Saddam and Iraq. As it was, we used Iraqi space, not Turkish, Syrian or Kuwaiti space for the "no fly" zone we imposed on Saddam afterward and we blew up anything in it that was Iraqi.

Once we had shoved his running ass troops back into Iraq and destroyed everything we could get away with, we were done as far as mission accomplishment was concerned.

The reasons for the Second Gulf War/Iraq War were completely different other than Saddam constantly flaunted the cease-fire agreement.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

@High_Plains_Drifter (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=3558)

I assume your comment in the other thread concerned whether or not "we won our war". We did. End of story. Our mission was to remove Saddam Hussein/Iraq from Kuwait. That is exactly what we did. There wasn't any more to it than THAT.

President Bush had to make a deal with the other Arab nations involved, and deja vu Turkey who balked until the last second. We had unrestricted use of Arab airspace, and bases in Saudi Arabia and Bahrain in return for a promise that ALL we did was remove Saddam from Kuwait. It was no deal if President Bush did not agree to not go after Saddam and Iraq. As it was, we used Iraqi space, not Turkish, Syrian or Kuwaiti space for the "no fly" zone we imposed on Saddam afterward and we blew up anything in it that was Iraqi.

Once we had shoved his running ass troops back into Iraq and destroyed everything we could get away with, we were done as far as mission accomplishment was concerned.

The reasons for the Second Gulf War/Iraq War were completely different other than Saddam constantly flaunted the cease-fire agreement.
Actually no, it wasn't. I've just never been a big fan of ANY of the Bushes, Jeb being the one I despise the most. I can see where you might like them a little more than others, since they and you are from TX.

I think they're all NWO, and I have no use for them. In fact this Bush that just passed away mentioned his NWO agenda before congress. His "read my lips, no new taxes" comment wasn't much of winner either, since raise taxes is exactly what he did.

I just didn't want to be a complete jerk and disrespect the man in his death thread, so I kept my comment very mundane.

[Gunny]

Actually no, it wasn't. I've just never been a big fan of ANY of the Bushes, Jeb being the one I despise the most. I can see where you might like them a little more than others, since they and you are from TX.

I think they're all NWO, and I have no use for them. In fact this Bush that just passed away mentioned his NWO agenda before congress. His "read my lips, no new taxes" comment wasn't much of winner either, since raise taxes is exactly what he did.

I just didn't want to be a complete jerk and disrespect the man in his death thread, so I kept my comment very mundane.I don't like them better because they are "from Texas". I consider GWB and Jeb to be neocons. I liked GHWB because he was a good CinC. He gave his generals a mission and let it rip. And we won. Funny how that works, huh? He didn't impress nor unimpress me otherwise. Ronald Reagan is a hard act to follow especially if you have no personality.

I have HUGE respect that he was a Naval aviator on a carrier in WWII. That's walking the walk in my book.

He was FAR preferable to act that followed him ...

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I don't like them better because they are "from Texas". I consider GWB and Jeb to be neocons. I liked GHWB because he was a good CinC. He gave his generals a mission and let it rip. And we won. Funny how that works, huh? He didn't impress nor unimpress me otherwise. Ronald Reagan is a hard act to follow especially if you have no personality.

I have HUGE respect that he was a Naval aviator on a carrier in WWII. That's walking the walk in my book.

He was FAR preferable to act that followed him ...
That's why I said "yes and no." I think he had respectable qualities and then some that I didn't like at all... pretty much all there is to it.

[aboutime]

Why can't we all just give it a rest? Why does EVERY thread have to end up being an argument.

REMEMBER? We have a 1st Amendment, and can all have opinions, idea's, and insist things should be one way or another. But Holy Crap guys. A Former President, the Oldest living, just passed away, and there's an instant reason to tell everybody why you did, or didn't like him???

I thought we didn't like that kind of stuff...coming from Democrats, Liberals, and Snowflakes??

Sorry I put the photo up. I was just remembering a good day, during a time when many of us were actually AFRAID we might not come home at the time.

That's my two cents.

[Gunny]

Why can't we all just give it a rest? Why does EVERY thread have to end up being an argument.

REMEMBER? We have a 1st Amendment, and can all have opinions, idea's, and insist things should be one way or another. But Holy Crap guys. A Former President, the Oldest living, just passed away, and there's an instant reason to tell everybody why you did, or didn't like him???

I thought we didn't like that kind of stuff...coming from Democrats, Liberals, and Snowflakes??

Sorry I put the photo up. I was just remembering a good day, during a time when many of us were actually AFRAID we might not come home at the time.

That's my two cents.Ummm ... all we do here is argue? There IS that.

My opinion of GHWB is and was the same with or without the photo, so you can let yourself off the hook. I also made a separate thread (this one) to discuss what I thought may have been an issue.

I was one of those afraid of not coming home so I have more than just a personal interest in the topic of THIS thread. The other thread is free and clear of the topic of this one.

[Drummond]

Why can't we all just give it a rest? Why does EVERY thread have to end up being an argument.

REMEMBER? We have a 1st Amendment, and can all have opinions, idea's, and insist things should be one way or another. But Holy Crap guys. A Former President, the Oldest living, just passed away, and there's an instant reason to tell everybody why you did, or didn't like him???

I thought we didn't like that kind of stuff...coming from Democrats, Liberals, and Snowflakes??

Sorry I put the photo up. I was just remembering a good day, during a time when many of us were actually AFRAID we might not come home at the time.

That's my two cents.

Pardon my posting on this, as a Brit. But I see Aboutime's point. A former President has just died. Why not let this moment be one of respectful remembrance, of - after all - a good, decent, patriot, who served his country well. There are better times than this for any critical analysis (in my humble opinion).

[Black Diamond]

Is believe the question that's been raised is should we have gone to Baghdad in 1991. We completed the mission. Agreed. But should the mission have been different

[Black Diamond]

Pardon my posting on this, as a Brit. But I see Aboutime's point. A former President has just died. Why not let this moment be one of respectful remembrance, of - after all - a good, decent, patriot, who served his country well.

The President has his own thread.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I didn't start this thread... I was just answering after being called out and confronted... :dunno:

But if I don't like the guy, I'm not going to pretend that I do. Gunny seemed upset so I figured I better clear the air, and I thought we did that rather well.

[Gunny]

HPD made a comment I apparently took other than he meant it. Far from being disrespectful of President Bush, I actually paid him a compliment in my comment in his RIP thread. He said that wasn't it and that was it.

Now anyone with enough time to waste can go back to the 2002 or 3 on USMB up to this date on this board and find how many "RIP" threads I have bothered to comment in. President Bush's might be 2. Or 3. Give-or-take. I think one of them was to dis the dead guy.

Is there some mourning period before we can talk about dead guys, or what?

[CSM]

....

Is there some mourning period before we can talk about dead guys, or what?

I am half dead... you can make half-assed comments about me if you want... do it while I am still half alive so I can enjoy them too!

[Gunny]

I am half dead... you can make half-assed comments about me if you want... do it while I am still half alive so I can enjoy them too!Kind of hard to comment on you since for as long as I've known you, you have conducted yourself exactly as I expect to see or hear from a Sergeant Major.

ALTHOUGH ... if you want some half-ass comment, I DO recall you posting something once that made my brain do a back flip. You play video games on the internet? So I'm picturing in my mind this Sergeant Major, decked out in deuce gear, compass and K-Bar strapped to his harness, shotgun slung over the shoulder, ten penny cigar stub clamped firmly between his teeth ... hunched over his keyboard blowing up virtual tanks :laugh2:

I don't get the "dead" thing. If we were half as nice to people while they were still alive as after they die we wouldn't need armies.

I'm abrasive and piss people off and I know it. I actually don't do it on purpose usually. I just have this thing about pretending to be someone I'm not. So when I kick the bucket, I don't want a bunch of people making out like I walked on water and turned it into wine and if I find one "RIP" after my damned name I swear I'll come back and rip someone's lungs out.

I realize it shocks people to hear me say it, but I am not some miserable old fuck that hates everything, regardless how I come across. I've had a blast for most of my life, minus a hiccup here and there. So no need to feel sorry for me. Odds are good I'll go out doing something I shouldn't be and have fun doing it, and that's as it should be. Have a party. Smoke 'em if you got 'em and if you still drink have a shot a Jack. None of that whiny-ass shit. And if you don't like me? I don't want anything after I'm dead I never got in life so pretend on your own time.

Celebrate the life instead of carrying on about YOUR loss.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Kind of hard to comment on you since for as long as I've known you, you have conducted yourself exactly as I expect to see or hear from a Sergeant Major.

ALTHOUGH ... if you want some half-ass comment, I DO recall you posting something once that made my brain do a back flip. You play video games on the internet? So I'm picturing in my mind this Sergeant Major, decked out in deuce gear, compass and K-Bar strapped to his harness, shotgun slung over the shoulder, ten penny cigar stub clamped firmly between his teeth ... hunched over his keyboard blowing up virtual tanks :laugh2:

I don't get the "dead" thing. If we were half as nice to people while they were still alive as after they die we wouldn't need armies.

I'm abrasive and piss people off and I know it. I actually don't do it on purpose usually. I just have this thing about pretending to be someone I'm not. So when I kick the bucket, I don't want a bunch of people making out like I walked on water and turned it into wine and if I find one "RIP" after my damned name I swear I'll come back and rip someone's lungs out.

I realize it shocks people to hear me say it, but I am not some miserable old fuck that hates everything, regardless how I come across. I've had a blast for most of my life, minus a hiccup here and there. So no need to feel sorry for me. Odds are good I'll go out doing something I shouldn't be and have fun doing it, and that's as it should be. Have a party. Smoke 'em if you got 'em and if you still drink have a shot a Jack. None of that whiny-ass shit. And if you don't like me? I don't want anything after I'm dead I never got in life so pretend on your own time.

Celebrate the life instead of carrying on about YOUR loss.
Exactly... that's pretty much where I'm at. I don't care who you are. I don't think any one person is any more important than another in the eyes of God. We ALL are born and die the SAME. So if I didn't like you while you were alive, don't expect me to gush over you when you die. I'm more than likely to say, good, I'm glad the sons a bitch is dead, and if that's someone else's comment when I die, then so be it. You're not going to hurt my feelings, I'M DEAD! So why pretend?

But like I say, there where some things I liked about Bush senior, and some things I didn't. So as not to totally disrespect the man in the other thread, I simply said "yes and no."

I guess you and I wear our feelings on our sleeves @Gunny (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=30), and I also guess that can get us in trouble sometimes. People are getting less and less tolerant of FRANK SPEECH. I guess you have to "put on airs" while speaking in public, and keep your less than complimentary comments to yourself, or only when speaking to someone in private. But, I'm not very good at holding back. I'm usually the one to say what others are thinking but are afraid to say, and yes, it's got me in trouble plenty of times. I don't like to beat around the bush. If there's a problem, I like to cut right to the heart of the matter. That's why you calling me out here didn't phase me one bit. I can appreciate the direct manner. Identify the problem and solve it, one way or the other.

[Gunny]

Exactly... that's pretty much where I'm at. I don't care who you are. I don't think any one person is any more important than another in the eyes of God. We ALL are born and die the SAME. So if I didn't like you while you were alive, don't expect me to gush over you when you die. I'm more than likely to say, good, I'm glad the sons a bitch is dead, and if that's someone else's comment when I die, then so be it. You're not going to hurt my feelings, I'M DEAD! So why pretend?

But like I say, there where some things I liked about Bush senior, and some things I didn't. So as not to totally disrespect the man in the other thread, I simply said "yes and no."

I guess you and I wear our feelings on our sleeves @Gunny (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=30), and I also guess that can get us in trouble sometimes. People are getting less and less tolerant of FRANK SPEECH. I guess you have to "put on airs" while speaking in public, and keep your less than complimentary comments to yourself, or only when speaking to someone in private. But, I'm not very good at holding back. I'm usually the one to say what others are thinking but are afraid to say, and yes, it's got me in trouble plenty of times. I don't like to beat around the bush. If there's a problem, I like to cut right to the heart of the matter. That's why I you calling me out here didn't phase me one bit. I can appreciate the direct manner. Identify the problem and solve it, one way or the other.

I DON'T talk in public. I HAVE TO on this board otherwise I'm thinking the that whole communication thing wouldn't work very well.:laugh: In RL, I don't talk to people much beyond business and keep my opinions to myself. Not so much because I care what they think of them but more because nowadays you're usually talking to a hitch post anyway. It's hard to marry up the two -- that I don't talk in RL but run my mouth all over this board -- but that is how it is.

I will point out again that rather than run off on another subject in President Bush's RIP thread, I created this one which definitely has little to do with the thread title anymore :laugh:

One thing that gets me is people will talk all day behind someone's back; yet, once they're dead won't say one bad word about them like they can hear in death what they couldn't in life. The whole topic of how we as a society (Western) treat and revere our dead has ALWAYS just blown me away. This isn't something new with me.

When I see "Elvis Presley or whoever (RIP)" I want to spin through the ceiling. He's been dead since I had long hair and smoked weed. Suppose he's reading some post from wherever he is on some message board looking SPECIFICALLY for the "RIP" after his name? :laugh:

Like I said, don't get it.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I DON'T talk in public. I HAVE TO on this board otherwise I'm thinking the that whole communication thing wouldn't work very well.:laugh: In RL, I don't talk to people much beyond business and keep my opinions to myself. Not so much because I care what they think of them but more because nowadays you're usually talking to a hitch post anyway. It's hard to marry up the two -- that I don't talk in RL but run my mouth all over this board -- but that is how it is.

I will point out again that rather than run off on another subject in President Bush's RIP thread, I created this one which definitely has little to do with the thread title anymore :laugh:

One thing that gets me is people will talk all day behind someone's back; yet, once they're dead won't say one bad word about them like they can hear in death what they couldn't in life. The whole topic of how we as a society (Western) treat and revere our dead has ALWAYS just blown me away. This isn't something new with me.

When I see "Elvis Presley or whoever (RIP)" I want to spin through the ceiling. He's been dead since I had long hair and smoked weed. Suppose he's reading some post from wherever he is on some message board looking SPECIFICALLY for the "RIP" after his name? :laugh:

Like I said, don't get it.
I go out in public myself as little as possible. Large crowds irritate the hell otta me. It's a good thing a guy like me lives in a little town with nothing much around other than nature and farms. I wasn't always like this though. When I was younger I lived in some pretty big cities, but as I got older I just got less and less tolerant of stupid people, and people just in general. I don't follow the crowd, I don't follow trends, I don't want or need to follow anyone, and if something you're doing irritates me, I just want to get the hell away from you, and most things city slickers do irritates me, not to mention the vast majority of them are liberal leftists. Everything I've done in life I've done by myself. Joining the military, moving vast distances, making big changes, I never had someone to fall back on or hold my hand. I took the chances alone, agonized the defeats by myself and celebrated the victories by myself. I just don't NEED anyone around me for support, companionship or otherwise. But like you, whether anyone knows it or not, I've loved my life, I've also "had a blast." It's been one big adventure, and there's very little about it I'd change, and being alone just suits my nature. It's not a bad thing. I'm better suited to be alone. Living with someone is actually quite hard for me. The best kind of girlfriend to have is... one that GOES HOME to her own place... :laugh:

[CSM]

Kind of hard to comment on you since for as long as I've known you, you have conducted yourself exactly as I expect to see or hear from a Sergeant Major.

ALTHOUGH ... if you want some half-ass comment, I DO recall you posting something once that made my brain do a back flip. You play video games on the internet? So I'm picturing in my mind this Sergeant Major, decked out in deuce gear, compass and K-Bar strapped to his harness, shotgun slung over the shoulder, ten penny cigar stub clamped firmly between his teeth ... hunched over his keyboard blowing up virtual tanks :laugh2:

I don't get the "dead" thing. If we were half as nice to people while they were still alive as after they die we wouldn't need armies.

I'm abrasive and piss people off and I know it. I actually don't do it on purpose usually. I just have this thing about pretending to be someone I'm not. So when I kick the bucket, I don't want a bunch of people making out like I walked on water and turned it into wine and if I find one "RIP" after my damned name I swear I'll come back and rip someone's lungs out.

I realize it shocks people to hear me say it, but I am not some miserable old fuck that hates everything, regardless how I come across. I've had a blast for most of my life, minus a hiccup here and there. So no need to feel sorry for me. Odds are good I'll go out doing something I shouldn't be and have fun doing it, and that's as it should be. Have a party. Smoke 'em if you got 'em and if you still drink have a shot a Jack. None of that whiny-ass shit. And if you don't like me? I don't want anything after I'm dead I never got in life so pretend on your own time.

Celebrate the life instead of carrying on about YOUR loss.

and you sound and act just like a Gunny would be expected to....CSM material...lol

[High_Plains_Drifter]

and you sound and act just like a Gunny would be expected to....CSM material...lol
I'd walk through hell and back with either one of you sons a bitches... :beer: