Russian Agent May Have Limited Mental Capacity After Nerve Attack

[Gunny]

March 22, 2018
By Michael Holden and Gabriela Baczynska
LONDON/BRUSSELS (Reuters) – A military-grade nerve toxin attack on former Russian double agent Sergei Skripal and his daughter may have left them with compromised mental capacity and it is unclear whether they will recover, a British judge said on Thursday.
Britain has said Russia used a Soviet-era chemical weapon called Novichok to attack Skripal and his daughter Yulia in the first known offensive use of such a weapon on European soil since World War Two. Russia has denied any involvement.
Britain is asking other European Union states to crack down together on Russian spy networks, though there is unlikely to be a concerted response at an EU summit in Brussels on Thursday, a French source said.
A London court gave permission for blood samples to be taken from the Skripals for examination by chemical weapons inspectors to confirm the conclusion of Britain’s Porton Down military research laboratory.
An unidentified doctor who is treating the Skripals said they were both heavily sedated and unable to communicate, and that it was not possible to assess when or to what extent either may regain mental capacity, according to the court’s ruling.
“The precise effect of their exposure on their long term health (http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/#) remains unclear, albeit medical tests indicate that their mental capacity might be compromised to an unknown and so far unascertained degree (http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/#),” Judge David Williams said in his ruling.
Skripal, once a colonel in Russia’s GRU military intelligence service, and his 33-year-old daughter were found slumped unconscious on a bench outside a shopping center in the southern English city of Salisbury on March 4.
They were both in a physically stable condition and were being treated “on the basis they would wish to be kept alive”, the doctor said, according to Williams’s ruling at the London’s Court of Protection, which makes decisions about the welfare of people who are unable to do so themselves.
Williams said the application to take the samples (http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/#) had been made urgently on Tuesday. Both Skripal and his daughter were critical but stable, although he added: “It is not inconceivable that their condition could rapidly deteriorate”
Judge Williams said an unidentified analyst from Porton Down had given evidence that blood samples taken from the Skripals indicated exposure to a nerve agent. “The samples tested positive for the presence of a Novichok class nerve agent or closely related agent,” his ruling said.
A policeman who fell ill after helping the Skripals was released from hospital on Thursday after more than two weeks of treatment, officials said.
EU HELP?
Britain is asking other European states to crack down together on Russian spy networks that could be preparing similar attacks, diplomats said.
Prime Minister (http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/#) Theresa May would urge coordinated action by EU states at the summit and try to persuade the bloc’s leaders to condemn Russia over the Salisbury attack.
“Russia staged a brazen and reckless attack against the United Kingdom,” May told reporters on arriving at the summit. “It’s clear that the Russian threat does not respect borders and indeed the incident in Salisbury was a pattern of Russian aggression against Europe and its near neighbors.”
In the worst crisis between London and Moscow since the Cold War, May has expelled 23 Russian diplomats whom she says were spies. Russia has ordered out 23 British diplomats.
Lithuanian President Dalia Grybauskaite said she was already considering expelling Russian spies from her territory.
INSULT TO RUSSIA
Diplomats stressed May was not seeking a formal EU strategy.
Reluctance from countries – Greece and Hungary among them – means a draft joint (http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/#) statement by EU leaders now says only that they take “extremely seriously” London’s assessment that it was highly likely Russia was responsible for the attack.
Russia’s ambassador to London, Vladimir Yakovenko, said on Thursday that, had Novichok been used, the Skripals would have died.
Yakovenko rebuked British Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson for comparing Russia’s hosting of the soccer World Cup this summer with Nazi Germany’s hosting of the Olympics in 1936.
In Moscow, President Vladimir Putin discussed Britain’s “unfriendly and provocative” policy at a session of the national security council, RIA news agency quoted the Kremlin as saying.
(Additional reporting by Elizabeth Piper, Robin Emmott, Richard Lough, Jean-Baptiste Vey, Writing by Gabriela Baczynska and Guy Faulconbridge, Editing by Richard Balmforth, Andrew Heavens and David Stamp)
http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/

Wow. Indefinitely sedated. THAT alone is enough to screw your head up good. Got THAT tee shirt. Wonder how they decide "when" to bring them out from under it? If they are in stable condition, not sure what is the delay.

Isn't that kind of like pulling the plug to see if they live?

[Drummond]

http://www.oann.com/britain-seeks-european-help-against-russian-spy-networks-diplomats/

Wow. Indefinitely sedated. THAT alone is enough to screw your head up good. Got THAT tee shirt. Wonder how they decide "when" to bring them out from under it? If they are in stable condition, not sure what is the delay.

Isn't that kind of like pulling the plug to see if they live?

It could be (maybe ?) that they're only stable, because they're still in their current state. Wake up, and maybe, that'd change things ?

We're not doctors, I'm thinking ...

- Anyway. Of course Theresa May is correct. Since Russia has a track record of these assassins, and also since there's no reason to suppose that ONLY the UK will eve be the target territory for them, then other countries should consider their own territories under threat as well. An international stand is no less than necessary.

It's not as though Russia will have an attack of conscience, own up to wrongdoing, and swear never to do it again.

Putin and his mob lack that basic decency.

[Gunny]

It could be (maybe ?) that they're only stable, because they're still in their current state. Wake up, and maybe, that'd change things ?

We're not doctors, I'm thinking ...

- Anyway. Of course Theresa May is correct. Since Russia has a track record of these assassins, and also since there's no reason to suppose that ONLY the UK will eve be the target territory for them, then other countries should consider their own territories under threat as well. An international stand is no less than necessary.

It's not as though Russia will have an attack of conscience, own up to wrongdoing, and swear never to do it again.

Putin and his mob lack that basic decency.My honest guess? They're secluded, and rightly so. I've suspected that for awhile.

[Drummond]

My honest guess? They're secluded, and rightly so. I've suspected that for awhile.

Could well be.

The policeman who was caught up in the attack, by the way, is no longer in danger. In fact, he's well on the way to a full recovery. We learned of a 4th victim of the nerve agent today .. being treated as an outpatient. Presumably not significantly harmed.

[Gunny]

Could well be.

The policeman who was caught up in the attack, by the way, is no longer in danger. In fact, he's well on the way to a full recovery. We learned of a 4th victim of the nerve agent today .. being treated as an outpatient. Presumably not significantly harmed.Was one of my first thoughts. They're TOO unavailable. No pics, no leaks since the 1st or second day.

Usually the dead and dying are waved daily in everyone's faces as a reminder. Just a thought anyway. Far I'm concerned whatever keeps everyone guessing works.

[Drummond]

Was one of my first thoughts. They're TOO unavailable. No pics, no leaks since the 1st or second day.

Usually the dead and dying are waved daily in everyone's faces as a reminder. Just a thought anyway. Far I'm concerned whatever keeps everyone guessing works.

I think there's a mood over here not to aggravate the situation further, unless definitely called for. There was the more recent death reported several days ago, 'constricted windpipe' or similar, the 'cause' of it .. and our police went out of their way to say they aren't connecting it to the Salisbury incident. Equally ... they're keeping these people well and truly out of harms' way, making sure there's no chance of any complications arising.

That's all well and good, from my thinking.

I'm just waiting, now, for the OPCW to finally confirm to the world at large what we already know is true about the origin of the poison used. And .. I'm expecting Russia to be arrogant enough to shrug it off, maybe dream up some fantastical alternative version to the truth rather than ever admit culpability.

Russia's sheer arrogance knows no bounds.

[Papokarlo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ig3fHMEKm5Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw8EgMUuf3A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hebWpocpBXs

[Gunny]

You REALLY think anyone is going to watch that?

Here's an idea. Try posting something short and sweet that someone can read. In English. Three videos to disclaim any knowledge of an incident is a bit much.

[Papokarlo]

You REALLY think anyone is going to watch that?

Here's an idea. Try posting something short and sweet that someone can read. In English. Three videos to disclaim any knowledge of an incident is a bit much.
can I decide for myself what to do? or will you even here with your democracy tell me how to act?

in other words, what do you care? if you want you can ban me! just like you sent 23 diplomats from the UK.)))

[Drummond]

can I decide for myself what to do? or will you even here with your democracy tell me how to act?

in other words, what do you care? if you want you can ban me! just like you sent 23 diplomats from the UK.)))

Ahem. I don't think Gunny sent anyone anywhere.

Last time I looked, the UK and US were in different parts of the world. It was the UK who expelled your 'diplomats'. Try to remain focused on relevant facts !!

I know it must be difficult .. you're used to being led by the nose by whatever propaganda comes your way.

Also, try to cope with what must be a very novel idea to you ... that Russia actually takes consequences for its actions !! Those 23 so-called diplomats shouldn't have had to leave, BUT, the UK was amply provoked into expelling them.

If or when your country takes on minimally decent international behaviour, maybe, we can have some latitude to reconsider things.

Do you think it ever will take on civilised standards ??

[Gunny]

can I decide for myself what to do? or will you even here with your democracy tell me how to act?

in other words, what do you care? if you want you can ban me! just like you sent 23 diplomats from the UK.)))Sure, As long as you follow the guidelines in the Rules for posting a new thread. No problem.

You post a link to support YOUR opinion/comment on the topic of your link. Just throwing links or videos out there is NOT okay, per the board owner.

AND, per the board owner, I think he already squared your ass away about posting in Russian. For your $20 "contribution" via Paypal, he will allow you 20 words in Russian.

This is NOT a democracy. It's a privately owned message board with rules agreed upon by the owner, who pays the bills, and the members. HE decides what you can and cannot post and in what manner.

I, and the rest of the staff enforce HIS rules. You should understand THAT. I don't give a damn about your problem, what or who you like, nor if you voted 3 times for Putin in one election. There are rules, I enforce the. If the last two sentences aren't clear, feel free to let me know which part you do not understand.

If you have an issue with hearing them from me, feel free to contact any other staff member so they can tell you the same thing.

Just pretend you're Crimea and I'm Putin.

[Papokarlo]

and after all this, you want to say that the EU sovereign States? ahahaha says the Minister for foreign Affairs of great Britain(2016).
https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-compares-eu-to-nazi-superstate-brexit-ukip/

Two years later, he compares Putin to Hitler. Tomorrow it will be trump. you will see...

democracy of the highest order, say what we want, freedom of speech)))
:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Elessar]

democracy of the highest order, say what we want, freedom of speech)))
:laugh::laugh::laugh:

"Freedom of Speech" on a privately owned message forum is what the OWNER determines to be appropriate.

It has nothing to with behavior out in the general public.

[Papokarlo]

"Freedom of Speech" on a privately owned message forum is what the OWNER determines to be appropriate.

It has nothing to with behavior out in the general public.
I'm talking about Boris Johnson's freedom of speech.

[Elessar]

I'm talking about Boris Johnson's freedom of speech.

If that is what you are talking about, then say so. You came across as being defiant to this forum
and its rules.

[Papokarlo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8_mVH-XQyY

[Gunny]

and after all this, you want to say that the EU sovereign States? ahahaha says the Minister for foreign Affairs of great Britain(2016).
https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-compares-eu-to-nazi-superstate-brexit-ukip/

Two years later, he compares Putin to Hitler. Tomorrow it will be trump. you will see...

democracy of the highest order, say what we want, freedom of speech)))
:laugh::laugh::laugh:

I don't recall making a request. That IS a warning. You have an issue with the rules, take it up with the owner. Since you want to make this public, I can do it for you jimnyc. Refer to my previous post. You WILL follow the rules as outlined in that post until, if or when the owner decides to the contrary.

Don't push me. And I REALLY suggest you don't push anyone else on the staff. They're a LOT quicker on the trigger than I am. Behave and follow the rules or I WILL put you in the corner nose first for a couple of days to think over the error of your ways.

[gabosaurus]

So the nerve gas attack has turned him into a Republican? :p

[Gunny]

So the nerve gas attack has turned him into a Republican? :pBrits don't have Republicans. They DO have what they call liberals.

I wonder why everyone that calls themselves "liberal" is fascist? Enquiring minds n all ....

[Papokarlo]

Brits don't have Republicans. They DO have what they call liberals.

I wonder why everyone that calls themselves "liberal" is fascist? Enquiring minds n all ....
in 2002, it seems, the Americans took out all chemical weapons from Russia. and America did not do as Russia did.
organizations around the world have confirmed that Russia is no longer a producer of chemical weapons back in 2000
under the control of the Americans it was all destroyed
you know that?

[Drummond]

in 2002, it seems, the Americans took out all chemical weapons from Russia. and America did not do as Russia did.
organizations around the world have confirmed that Russia is no longer a producer of chemical weapons back in 2000
under the control of the Americans it was all destroyed
you know that?

When the OPCW releases its findings, and confirms what we all expect to be true ... what degree of denial will you then indulge in ? Just how ridiculous will you efforts become ?

Of course, your side could just ADMIT to what they've done.

But there's far too much arrogance in them for that ... isn't there ?

[Papokarlo]

When the OPCW releases its findings, and confirms what we all expect to be true ... what degree of denial will you then indulge in ? Just how ridiculous will you efforts become ?

Of course, your side could just ADMIT to what they've done.

But there's far too much arrogance in them for that ... isn't there ?
. if it were the results in London, the newspaper headlines would be full of now, all the news channels since morning till night trumpeted the evidence. London and throughout its history behaves as it behaves

[Drummond]

. if it were the results in London, the newspaper headlines would be full of now, all the news channels since morning till night trumpeted the evidence. London and throughout its history behaves as it behaves

Yes, we do.

We stand up to aggressors. We stand up to self-styled bullies.

As you're now seeing (.. or is the Russian media not reporting this ?), there are many other countries willing to do the very same.

Claims that 'America' took Russia's nerve agents are, to say the least, inaccurate (you surely know that ?). The OPCW was the body involved ... and they, I understand, are UN-run.

Consequently, it seems to me that they are the ideal agency to adjudicate Russia's culpability. Which will be why we cooperated in full with their ongoing investigation.

Papokarlo, I'm just waiting, now, for your denial when the OPCW releases its findings. We know it's coming .. because, to your way of thinking, Russia 'is innocent' ... because ... and JUST because ... Russia says so !!

[Papokarlo]

Yes, we do.

We stand up to aggressors. We stand up to self-styled bullies.

As you're now seeing (.. or is the Russian media not reporting this ?), there are many other countries willing to do the very same.

Claims that 'America' took Russia's nerve agents are, to say the least, inaccurate (you surely know that ?). The OPCW was the body involved ... and they, I understand, are UN-run.

Consequently, it seems to me that they are the ideal agency to adjudicate Russia's culpability. Which will be why we cooperated in full with their ongoing investigation.

Papokarlo, I'm just waiting, now, for your denial when the OPCW releases its findings. We know it's coming .. because, to your way of thinking, Russia 'is innocent' ... because ... and JUST because ... Russia says so !!
I'm still waiting for the investigation into MH17, investigation on Iraq, I'm waiting for the investigation on Libya, I'm waiting for the investigation of chemical weapons in Syria, I await the investigation for the former Yugoslavia. I'm waiting on the Skripal investigation... how many people died in these VS one Skripal

[jimnyc]

I don't recall making a request. That IS a warning. You have an issue with the rules, take it up with the owner. Since you want to make this public, I can do it for you jimnyc. Refer to my previous post. You WILL follow the rules as outlined in that post until, if or when the owner decides to the contrary.

Don't push me. And I REALLY suggest you don't push anyone else on the staff. They're a LOT quicker on the trigger than I am. Behave and follow the rules or I WILL put you in the corner nose first for a couple of days to think over the error of your ways.

Papakarlo:

We don't very often get serious around here. We have written rules, but rarely do we need to be hard asses about anything. This is a small but family type oriented site. It is a 100% written in English site. You still have 100% freedom to speak your views too. Just don't be a spammer or troll, and you'll be fine.

[Papokarlo]

Papakarlo:

We don't very often get serious around here. We have written rules, but rarely do we need to be hard asses about anything. This is a small but family type oriented site. It is a 100% written in English site. You still have 100% freedom to speak your views too. Just don't be a spammer or troll, and you'll be fine.
I'm not a spammer or a Troll, I'm just saying I'm still waiting to investigate all these cases that I wrote about above. how many still wait 10-20 years...

[Gunny]

I'm not a spammer or a Troll, I'm just saying I'm still waiting to investigate all these cases that I wrote about above. how many still wait 10-20 years...Which are deflections from whether or not the nerve gas used in Great Britain originated in Russia. Your argument is with the Hague and or Prime Minister May. You can argue your point with Drummond all day since he is the resident Brit. The rest of us don't see a reason in this case to question our leadership that is backing a NATO ally, nor the accusation being made since the responses from Russia have been unsatisfactory.

[Papokarlo]

Which are deflections from whether or not the nerve gas used in Great Britain originated in Russia. Your argument is with the Hague and or Prime Minister May. You can argue your point with Drummond all day since he is the resident Brit. The rest of us don't see a reason in this case to question our leadership that is backing a NATO ally, nor the accusation being made since the responses from Russia have been unsatisfactory.
11 EU countries did not support Theresa may, and will not expel diplomats until the end of the investigation

and you're persistently trying to drag the dissenters into Theresa May's boat.

I will remind it-11 EU countries.

I tell you that 11 countries boycotted Theresa may, and you tell me about the fact that Putin is to blame.))

this is not the scenario that Britain wanted.

[Gunny]

11 EU countries did not support Theresa may, and will not expel diplomats until the end of the investigation

and you're persistently trying to drag the dissenters into Theresa May's boat.

I will remind it-11 EU countries.

I tell you that 11 countries boycotted Theresa may, and you tell me about the fact that Putin is to blame.))

this is not the scenario that Britain wanted.So? 11 EU countries aren't supporting May. If they are NATO members, then they will have to answer to NATO for it, not me.

Since the UK is ditching the EU, it surprises me NOT that they are unwilling to support the UK. Some people can't breathe without including politics and getting cheap back stabs. Kind of like the issue at hand, isn't it?

Misusing the word "boycott" to suit your argument is a no sell. disagreeing is NOT boycotting. Two separate definitions. Keep scratching through the sand though. You're beginning to sound like Hillary Clinton.