Trump pardons Arpaio

[jimnyc]

Good for him!!

...

Trump pardons ex-sheriff convicted of defying judge's order

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Donald Trump on Friday pardoned former sheriff Joe Arpaio, the retired Arizona lawman who was convicted for intentionally disobeying a judge's order in an immigration case.

The White House said the 85-year-old ex-sheriff of Arizona's Maricopa County was a "worthy candidate" for a presidential pardon.

The action came several days after Trump, at a rally in downtown Phoenix, strongly hinted that he intended to issue a pardon.

"So was Sheriff Joe was convicted for doing his job?" Trump asked supporters. "I'll make a prediction. I think he's going to be just fine, OK."

Arpaio, who became linked to Trump during the campaign for their hardline immigration views, was convicted of a misdemeanor for intentionally defying a judge's order to stop his traffic patrols that targeted immigrants.

Rest - https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/trump-pardons-ex-sheriff-convicted-defying-judges-order-000929236--politics.html

[Kathianne]

and they say Trump is not a politician. Busy Friday night dump with Hurricane taking all the oxygen:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/25/friday-night-news-dump-trump-pardons-arpaio-seb-gorka-resigns/


Friday Night News Dump: Trump Pardons Arpaio As Seb Gorka Resigns; Update: Fired?ED MORRISSEYPosted at 9:19 pm on August 25, 2017

[Gunny]

I'm glad there were some good Teva sandal adds in the middle of the page. Made it interesting.

[Black Diamond]

I'm glad there were some good Teva sandal adds in the middle of the page. Made it interesting.
That's....


not the ad I saw.

[jimnyc]

and they say Trump is not a politician. Busy Friday night dump with Hurricane taking all the oxygen:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/25/friday-night-news-dump-trump-pardons-arpaio-seb-gorka-resigns/

The discussion of pardoning Arpaio has been around for a few months, I don't think they used it as any type of pawn.

[Bilgerat]

And the triggering of the liberal snowflakes will create my favorite cologne



http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10818&stc=1

[Kathianne]

The discussion of pardoning Arpaio has been around for a few months, I don't think they used it as any type of pawn.

and Gorka? Seriously, think he was smart to do it on Friday afternoon.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Of course Sheriff Joe was following the law, what he ignored was an order from an activist judge appointed by obama telling him to IGNORE the law, which should have resulted in the judge being tried and convicted for.. treason maybe... not Sheriff Joe for faithfully following the law.

President Trump did good. Arpio being convicted was an absolute travesty of justice by the illegal alien coddling obama administration. In fact, I believe it was an attempted to silence him because no one did more to expose the fraud obama put forth as being born in Hawaii than Sheriff Joe. Barry wanted to shut him up.

[jimnyc]

and Gorka? Seriously, think he was smart to do it on Friday afternoon.

I think Gorka finally had enough, enough of the trashing, enough of liberals going after his wife. Enough of liberals going after his son. He may have had some help in making the final decision in going out the door, but I do think it was more of a resignation.

Arpaio I think was more or less a done deal. My opinion is that he wanted to do so at the rally, but was held back by someone in his group, telling him it wasn't the place and time.

But I think both events were going to happen AND that both were telegraphed long in advance.

I will say though, it just seems to be the day of reckoning, political folks and news have been on Fridays for the longest time. And yeah, it IS to help avoid the news and limelight as well. But it shouldn't be a surprise in the slightest to anyone, and should have been fully expected by everyone anyway.

[Abbey Marie]

I don't see Trump as a guy who tries to downplay his decisions. Or who listens to any adviser who tells him he should.

[jimnyc]

I don't see Trump as a guy who tries to downplay his decisions. Or who listens to any adviser who tells him he should.

That's true too. But if he spoke out publicly and did it a different way, he would have been the bad guy anyway and been accused of doing something in the wrong manner. I truly believe that many will find fault with what he does, no matter the decision, even if they are opposite decisions of one another.

But yeah, I don't see him as being the sneaky type trying to make decisions behind folks backs. Perhaps others in charge may make decisions for him, and things go the way they want it to, as they think it's what's best. But that would be bad too, he would be blamed for others having too much influence over the presidency. :laugh:

[Abbey Marie]

Could even some lib folks be getting tired of their frothing hatred of Trump?
We had cocktails last night with a very liberal friend. She normally speaks scornfully of Trump every time I see her. Last night she never mentioned his name, even when it would have been relevant, and told us she rarely watches the news or reads the newspaper any more. She said she's tired of hearing about political stuff.

[jimnyc]

Of COURSE the idiots at MSNBC and Washington Post are going to go racist instantly, and proclaim it's unconstitutional. But it's NOT. Just because he doesn't do what the insiders want and follow THEIR way, doesn't mean it's not constitutional. And because he pardoned a man that gave 50 years of his life to the servicing his country - I don't think pardoning a dang misdemeanor is so horrid as the haters will make it sound. It was a great decision, and had NOTHING to do with race, or somehow meaning Trump supports racism or harassment or whatever other terms they can think of.

---

WaPo’s Rampell: Arpaio Pardon ‘A Direct Attack on Our Constitution’ and Judicial Independence

On Friday’s broadcast of MSNBC’s “All In,” Washington Post columnist Catherine Rampell argued President Trump’s pardon of former Maricopa County, AZ Sheriff Joe Arpaio (R) is an attack on the Constitution and the independence of the judiciary.

Rampell said, “If there was any doubt in anyone’s mind that law and order was code for making it easier to harass people of color, this is confirmation. I would also point out that this is a direct attack on our Constitution and on the independence of our federal judiciary. You remember, there was a lot of concern during the campaign about the fact that he attacked a judge of Mexican descent, Judge Curiel, right? … This is so much worse. Because the crime that he is being pardoned for is effectively not following the Constitution. Because a judge determined what his officers were doing was harassment, was discrimination. He refused the court’s order. And this is Trump saying to the public, ‘You know what, I agree. We shouldn’t listen to what judges say.'”

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2017/08/25/wapos-rampell-arpaio-pardon-direct-attack-constitution-judicial-independence/

[jimnyc]

Could even some lib folks be getting tired of their frothing hatred of Trump?
We had cocktails last night with a very liberal friend. She normally speaks scornfully of Trump every time I see her. Last night she never mentioned his name, even when it would have been relevant, and told us she rarely watches the news or reads the newspaper any more. She said she's tired of hearing about political stuff.

Or perhaps just being nice, or thought ahead and didn't want to ruffle their OWN feathers and see themselves get angry over nothing?

It's possible what you say, but the die hard liberals and the hatred I've seen in the past year, I can't imagine that going away so quickly and easily.

(not your friends) - but I think with SO much hatred we've seen in the past year - it doesn't magically pop out of nowhere. I think some folks have hatred inside of them for certain things, and then certain things bring it out. :(

[Abbey Marie]

Or perhaps just being nice, or thought ahead and didn't want to ruffle their OWN feathers and see themselves get angry over nothing?

It's possible what you say, but the die hard liberals and the hatred I've seen in the past year, I can't imagine that going away so quickly and easily.

(not your friends) - but I think with SO much hatred we've seen in the past year - it doesn't magically pop out of nowhere. I think some folks have hatred inside of them for certain things, and then certain things bring it out. :(

Could be. In her case, she's too nice to be full of hatred. But she is Scottish, so the liberal European roots run deep.

[jimnyc]

Could be. In her case, she's too nice to be full of hatred. But she is Scottish, so the liberal European roots run deep.

It's surely not all liberals. I have a few lib friends, that seem casual and not as demanding and full of hatred as others. They stick to their beliefs, just don't have the hatred.

But it's hard to deny what we all saw since the election!

[hjmick]

I heard that Trump pardoned Arpaio because Arpaio had proof that Trump's birth certificate is a fake and that he was actually born in Russia...

[pete311]

You guys are hilarious. Tribalism at it's best.

[jimnyc]

You guys are hilarious. Tribalism at it's best.

Unga Bunga, me support trump, me racist, me love you long time any way, me hungry, me need more coffee. Unga Bunga.

I don't care if the person is a democrat or a republican. I don't care if the person is asian, white, black or blue. I don't care where the person is from in America. If someone works in a capacity of law enforcement, has placed their life on the line a time or 2, has dedicated much of their time to helping their country, against illegal immigration and such - and did so for FIFTY YEARS - then I don't care who the person is - I simple don't take issue with a pardon over a stinking misdemeanor conviction. If it were a felony and jail time of length was mandatory, then there's a debate. But to simply help keep "clean" the record of an 85 year old man who worked 50 years in law enforcement?

Yeah, me funny, me tribal wacko, unga bunga.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I heard that Trump pardoned Arpaio because Arpaio had proof that Trump's birth certificate is a fake and that he was actually born in Russia...
Link?

[jimnyc]

Link?

Me thinkee that 'ol HJ was just making a joke, so no linkie to come I would imagine.

[jimnyc]

Been reading a few more articles - and some tweets... And SO SO SO SO many of them start with:

So what this says is
So what Trump is saying is
So what Trump is stating to supremacists/racists

MUCH of them are claiming all kinds of things about what Trump is actually stating. Hell, a few went as far as to talk about secret handshakes and what not with racist groups.

How about this: he pardoned a man for a misdemeanor, because he earned it with his 50 years of service.

WHY does it HAVE TO mean and state more? How about this: folks are claiming it means this, or it means that, to support THEIR agendas and accusations.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Me thinkee that 'ol HJ was just making a joke, so no linkie to come I would imagine.
I was joking too. But I think he was giving me a dig because I believe the obama CofB scan is a pathetic forgery... and so does Sheriff Arpaio.

[jimnyc]

My point - and it's NOT defending racism, unless you want to make accusations. It's defending a man of a record at 85 for his service to our country. I saw no discussion about race or defense of it. Only those wanting to see it as such and then running with it.

--

Sunday on CNN’s “State of the Union,” Univision anchor Jorge Ramos said President Donald Trump’s pardon of former Maricopa County, AZ Sheriff Joe Arpaio was “defending racism.”

Ramos said, “By pardoning Arpaio President Trump is defending racism. Arpaio violated the Constitution. He discriminated against Latinos. He was convicted of criminal contempt of court.”

[jimnyc]

Oy vey, and look at the idiot of the century. I'm sorry, but this woman is truly a scumbag piece of shit.

--

Maxine Suggests POTUS Pardoned Arpaio Because Trump Part of KKK

Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA) suggested that President Donald Trump pardoned former Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio on Friday because Trump is a part of the KKK.

“I’m not surprised Trump pardoned racial profiler Arpaio,” she tweeted. “White Nationalists, KKK, & Duke celebrated Trump’s election b/c he is one of them!”

After Charlottesville, Waters called the White House the “white supremacists’ house.”

She has also been leading the charge to impeach Trump, saying that she is “not running for anything except the impeachment of Trump,” revealing she and other Democrats are “organizing” to bring Trump down, and leading crowds in “impeach 45” chants.

Rest - http://www.breitbart.com/california/2017/08/27/maxine-suggests-potus-pardoned-arpaio-trump-part-kkk/

[High_Plains_Drifter]

My point - and it's NOT defending racism, unless you want to make accusations. It's defending a man of a record at 85 for his service to our country. I saw no discussion about race or defense of it. Only those wanting to see it as such and then running with it.

--

Sunday on CNN’s “State of the Union,” Univision anchor Jorge Ramos said President Donald Trump’s pardon of former Maricopa County, AZ Sheriff Joe Arpaio was “defending racism.”

Ramos said, “By pardoning Arpaio President Trump is defending racism. Arpaio violated the Constitution. He discriminated against Latinos. He was convicted of criminal contempt of court.”
Yup, which we all know is pure horse hockey. Sheriff Arpaio was told by an obama appointed activist judge to IGNORE parts of FEDERAL and state immigration LAW, and the Sheriff decided not to. So obama had a shit fit that Sheriff Joe ignored him, and went on a 3 year long vendetta to hang him, finally getting him charged with a misdemeanor... I mean... big deal.

But this whole thing was about obama doing everything in his power, and OUTSIDE his power, to flood America with illegal aliens and muslims, and Sheriff Joe defied him. Sheriff Joe decided to follow the LAW, not obama's illegal E.O.

Arpaio should be given the Medal of Honor.

[michiganFats]

Been reading a few more articles - and some tweets... And SO SO SO SO many of them start with:

So what this says is
So what Trump is saying is
So what Trump is stating to supremacists/racists

MUCH of them are claiming all kinds of things about what Trump is actually stating. Hell, a few went as far as to talk about secret handshakes and what not with racist groups.

How about this: he pardoned a man for a misdemeanor, because he earned it with his 50 years of service.

WHY does it HAVE TO mean and state more? How about this: folks are claiming it means this, or it means that, to support THEIR agendas and accusations.

Even if the pardon was politically motivated who cares? The prosecution and conviction was also politically motivated. What's good for the goose...

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Oy vey, and look at the idiot of the century. I'm sorry, but this woman is truly a scumbag piece of shit.

--

Maxine Suggests POTUS Pardoned Arpaio Because Trump Part of KKK

Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA) suggested that President Donald Trump pardoned former Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio on Friday because Trump is a part of the KKK.

“I’m not surprised Trump pardoned racial profiler Arpaio,” she tweeted. “White Nationalists, KKK, & Duke celebrated Trump’s election b/c he is one of them!”

After Charlottesville, Waters called the White House the “white supremacists’ house.”

She has also been leading the charge to impeach Trump, saying that she is “not running for anything except the impeachment of Trump,” revealing she and other Democrats are “organizing” to bring Trump down, and leading crowds in “impeach 45” chants.

Rest - http://www.breitbart.com/california/2017/08/27/maxine-suggests-potus-pardoned-arpaio-trump-part-kkk/
That woman truly should be THROWN OUT OF OFFICE. And if we had more than ONE republican that actually had a pair in his sack, they should fight back against this absolutely unhinged kind of rhetoric. We have one black wanting the president to be ASSASSINATED, and another calling him the KKK.

Now who are the real RACISTS?

[Kathianne]

There have been other undeserved pardons, Marc Rich comes to mind, not to mention Clinton's brother and brother-in law. Presidents can pardon anyone.

With that said, the prosecution wasn't 'politically motivated,' he really was in contempt and he really did oversee an unlawful stop order on those who 'looked Hispanic.' Prisoners were really mistreated.

[michiganFats]

There have been other undeserved pardons, Marc Rich comes to mind, not to mention Clinton's brother and brother-in law. Presidents can pardon anyone.

With that said, the prosecution wasn't 'politically motivated,' he really was in contempt and he really did oversee an unlawful stop order on those who 'looked Hispanic.' Prisoners were really mistreated.

They went after him after he started in with the birther stuff, not before. Yes, they went after him for political reasons.

Prisoners everywhere think they're mistreated. Some of them actually might be.

[Kathianne]

They went after him after he started in with the birther stuff, not before. Yes, they went after him for political reasons.

Prisoners everywhere think they're mistreated. Some of them actually might be.


You're free to think whatever you like. I only am basing it on what folks around here in AZ are saying and what I read in local papers. I don't trust the MSM on this and certainly not those that think Trump does nothing wrong other than a tweet or two where he should have been a bit more circumspect or something.

[michiganFats]

You're free to think whatever you like. I only am basing it on what folks around here in AZ are saying and what I read in local papers. I don't trust the MSM on this and certainly not those that think Trump does nothing wrong other than a tweet or two where he should have been a bit more circumspect or something.

I didn't say Arpaio didn't do it, I said I think the decision to go after him for it was political.

[Kathianne]

I didn't say Arpaio didn't do it, I said I think the decision to go after him for it was political.

I don't know about that, but a quick search shows courts have been ruling against him since 2008 and the county had to make settlements at substantial costs in every case brought.

[michiganFats]

I don't know about that, but a quick search shows courts have been ruling against him since 2008 and the county had to make settlements at substantial costs in every case brought.

Actually he's got a colorful history doesn't he? Going back even before 2008. All I mean is the feds didn't bother with him until after he started focusing on illegal aliens and then the hammer drops after he started in with the birtherism. He did things the feds could have gotten involved with before he started in on the illegals but they didn't. Even so, I'm glad he wasn't Sheriff here.

[pete311]

I didn't say Arpaio didn't do it, I said I think the decision to go after him for it was political.

Makes no difference. Apparently the law doesn't matter anymore.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Makes no difference. Apparently the law doesn't matter anymore.
Tell that to the little muslim dog turd that just got thrown out of the white house and his illegal executive orders to ignore federal immigration laws, and his activist judge he appointed to enforce his illegal E.O.

The only thing Arpaio is truly guilty of is not bowing down to the ass clown obama that wanted to flood the US with illegal aliens.

[pete311]

Tell that to the little muslim dog turd that just got thrown out of the white house and his illegal executive orders to ignore federal immigration laws, and his activist judge he appointed to enforce his illegal E.O.

The only thing Arpaio is truly guilty of is not bowing down to the ass clown obama that wanted to flood the US with illegal aliens.

Yeah that's what I thought. Sad.

[Bilgerat]

https://scontent-mia3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/21106501_1503398089706593_3113755640304111126_n.jp g?oh=411ca4f1e8f9bf6feab5c793f9edc700&oe=5A1F3D4C

[pete311]

https://scontent-mia3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/21106501_1503398089706593_3113755640304111126_n.jp g?oh=411ca4f1e8f9bf6feab5c793f9edc700&oe=5A1F3D4C


Wonderful juvenile bullsht

[michiganFats]

Makes no difference. Apparently the law doesn't matter anymore.

Pete, you're 34 right? I hope you're not just now figuring out that politics plays a large part in many decisions government officials make.

[pete311]

Pete, you're 34 right? I hope you're not just now figuring out that politics plays a large part in many decisions government officials make.

Link?

[aboutime]

Wonderful juvenile bullsht



Only an OVERGROWN juvenile would come here to type that for all to see.

[Kathianne]

This is pretty much the norm of what I've heard and read locally in AZ, I get that others not from around here see him differently. I did before I moved here:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/


Sheriff Joe Arpaio is no conservative and no hero, no matter what President Trump says



From IL I saw him fighting 'illegal immigration,' not committing a waste of tax payer monies, intimidating citizens, and basically just pumping up his own ego, damning anyone who got in his way.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

This is pretty much the norm of what I've heard and read locally in AZ, I get that others not from around here see him differently. I did before I moved here:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/


From IL I saw him fighting 'illegal immigration,' not committing a waste of tax payer monies, intimidating citizens, and basically just pumping up his own ego, damning anyone who got in his way.
When I was living in Phoenix, 2001-04, he was very popular. My parents lived in Apache Junction for 7 years and he got reelected every time.

Things change though. Apparently now the illegal aliens and liberals outnumber the conservatives in Phoenix. Another typical huge city cess pool. I couldn't stand living there. Millions of peole living in a huge frying pan out in the middle of the dessert. I couldn't wait to get out of there. I might have stayed in Reno if it weren't for the earth quakes.

I think Sheriff Arpaio is a good man. I think he loves America and was simply trying to keep people out that don't belong here, and the tide just finally turned against him where he was employed. Doesn't mean he was wrong.

[Kathianne]

When I was living in Phoenix, 2001-04, he was very popular. My parents lived in Apache Junction for 7 years and he got reelected every time.

Things change though. Apparently now the illegal aliens and liberals outnumber the conservatives in Phoenix. Another typical huge city cess pool. I couldn't stand living there. Millions of peole living in a huge frying pan out in the middle of the dessert. I couldn't wait to get out of there. I might have stayed in Reno if it weren't for the earth quakes.

I think Sheriff Arpaio is a good man. I think he loves America and was simply trying to keep people out that don't belong here, and the tide just finally turned against him where he was employed. Doesn't mean he was wrong.

I haven't a problem with going after illegals. I do though understand that there are way more legal Mexicans, who've been here longer than most of Phoenix. They are citizens and shouldn't be targeted every day. That is what he was doing.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I haven't a problem with going after illegals. I do though understand that there are way more legal Mexicans, who've been here longer than most of Phoenix. They are citizens and shouldn't be targeted every day. That is what he was doing.
I don't think I'd say he "targeted" them. When the majority of people that are here illegally, especially in Phoenix, are Mexican, it just makes sense when they have an encounter with law enforcement to ask them if they have any proof of citizenship. How else are they going to know?

[Kathianne]

I don't think I'd say he "targeted" them. When the majority of people that are here illegally, especially in Phoenix, are Mexican, it just makes sense when they have an encounter with law enforcement to ask them if they have any proof of citizenship. How else are they going to know?

Not what was done, it was targeted and was near daily. It was intimidating to citizens. We can disagree on how things should be, but not on what was done.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Not what was done, it was targeted and was near daily. It was intimidating to citizens. We can disagree on how things should be, but not on what was done.
I guess I just never heard anything he did that I would consider targeting.

Do you have an example?

[Kathianne]

I guess I just never heard anything he did that I would consider targeting.

Do you have an example?
Read the article at the link I posted.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I haven't a problem with going after illegals. I do though understand that there are way more legal Mexicans, who've been here longer than most of Phoenix. They are citizens and shouldn't be targeted every day. That is what he was doing.
Well, I'll take all the claims from USA Today with a grain of salt. They're about as left of left as you can get. Every link they use as a source is either themselves or another left leaning website or document.

I think extreme times require extreme measures, and the illegal alien influx during obama's terms as president were more horrendous and harmful to America than anything Sheriff Arpaio did. Obama threw the door open for illegal aliens, and the sheriff was trying to keep it in check.

[Kathianne]

Well, I'll take all the claims from USA Today with a grain of salt. They're about as left of left as you can get. Every link they use as a source is either themselves or another left leaning website or document.

I think extreme times require extreme measures, and the illegal alien influx during obama's terms as president were more horrendous and harmful to America than anything Sheriff Arpaio did. Obama threw the door open for illegal aliens, and the sheriff was trying to keep it in check.

Whatever, you won't find any backing from the sites you seem to find acceptable. As I said in my OP, the article is reflective of what locals say and I've read in the papers here.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Whatever, you won't find any backing from the sites you seem to find acceptable. As I said in my OP, the article is reflective of what locals say and I've read in the papers here.
Well, I was a local, and so were my parents, and none of the people I knew while living in the Phoenix area disliked Sheriff Joe.

Course we're talking 13 years ago. I'm sure things have changed and it's obvious Phoenix has gotten more liberal. I guess they prefer illegals to enforcement. Pretty typical for liberals since they do rely on the illegal to vote for them... obama even encouraged it... yes it's YOUTUBE... but it's coming directly from the person's own mouth...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCLO0WBvhF8

[Kathianne]

Well, I was a local, and so were my parents, and none of the people I knew while living in the Phoenix area disliked Sheriff Joe.

Course we're talking 13 years ago. I'm sure things have changed and it's obvious Phoenix has gotten more liberal. I guess they prefer illegals to enforcement. Pretty typical for liberals since they do rely on the illegal to vote for them... obama even encouraged it... yes it's YOUTUBE... but it's coming directly from the person's own mouth...



I'm not in Phoenix, way north of there. There's plenty of Mexicans around, probably some illegals. The folks here though, mostly are native Arizonians. They don't mind the Mexicans, but do the illegals. For the most part though, they aren't for extra-legal actions.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I'm not in Phoenix, way north of there. There's plenty of Mexicans around, probably some illegals. The folks here though, mostly are native Arizonians. They don't mind the Mexicans, but do the illegals. For the most part though, they aren't for extra-legal actions.
I don't mind Mexicans either. In fact I like Mexico and Mexican culture, especially the food. It's a shame it's one of the most lawless nations on the planet though because I'd love to vacation down there, like in some little gulf beach town. I have Mexican friends even here in Wisconsin. It is ONLY the ones here illegally that I have a problem with, and Mexicans aren't the only ones here illegally either. If I had my choice of who to give amnesty to as far as illegals, it would be Mexicans, I mean they are our neighbor. I wish there was a better solution to preventing them from sneaking into our country other than a wall too but, I haven't heard one yet.

[Kathianne]

I don't mind Mexicans either. In fact I like Mexico and Mexican culture, especially the food. It's a shame it's one of the most lawless nations on the planet though because I'd love to vacation down there, like in some little gulf beach town. I have Mexican friends even here in Wisconsin. It is ONLY the ones here illegally that I have a problem with, and Mexicans aren't the only ones here illegally either. If I had my choice of who to give amnesty to as far as illegals, it would be Mexicans, I mean they are our neighbor. I wish there was a better solution to them sneaking into our country than a well too but, I haven't heard one yet.

My feelings exactly. I much more distrust the Asians-whether Oriental or mid-Eastern than I do Mexicans. Hell, even most of the violent gangs are Columbian, not Mexican.

Even in the homogeneous suburb I was raised, there were Mexicans that had been there a long time. Legally. The 'legal' entry was likely before there even were immigration requirements from early 20th C. In AZ that is much more true. There are probably more generations of legal Mexicans here, than Caucasians. Shared border. That doesn't mean that the illegals aren't a problem regarding security and law enforcement. It does equate though to a substantial portion of the citizens sharing characteristics with illegals. That is where the heavy handed and questionable tactics of Sheriff Joe become a source of disagreement here. In fact, I'd say that the 'liberals' in Phoenix probably were more behind the approval of profiling than those who'd been in the area for a long time. CA influx is turning the state purple.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

CA influx is turning the state purple.
Yup... that's a shame. AZ used to be pretty conservative.

Same thing happening in MT. My sister's family has lived there for about 45 years and they absolutely hate it. You should hear my cowboy nephew go on and on about all the California liberals that have moved into the Ennis area. They go to these areas to get away from California, but then they bring their liberal agenda with them... so why did they leave California?

[jimnyc]

Wonderful juvenile bullsht

And yet 100% factual, on the spot. He released TERRORISTS and some went right back to their terrorizing ways. Barely a peep from the left.

Pardon a MISDEMEANOR and the left loses their lunch AND last night's dinner. He wasn't even "released" from anything.

Terrorist running free = Aok

Former sheriff having minor record wiped clean = unacceptable to the left and must be dealt with!! :rolleyes::rolleyes:

[jimnyc]

I think Sheriff Arpaio is a good man. I think he loves America and was simply trying to keep people out that don't belong here, and the tide just finally turned against him where he was employed. Doesn't mean he was wrong.

Well said! I love 'ol Joe and think he's a fine man that did all he could. :clap:

[Kathianne]

And yet 100% factual, on the spot. He released TERRORISTS and some went right back to their terrorizing ways. Barely a peep from the left.

Pardon a MISDEMEANOR and the left loses their lunch AND last night's dinner. He wasn't even "released" from anything.

Terrorist running free = Aok

Former sheriff having minor record wiped clean = unacceptable to the left and must be dealt with!! :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Not exactly. There was that link earlier, https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/

and now this: https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/28/trump-wrong-to-pardon-arpaio-but-other-presidents-worse-jonathan-turley-column/606223001/?platform=hootsuite

As the Turley article points out, 'unchecked power' tends to be used in 'unchecked ways.' Trump not being the worst, damning with faint praise.

[jimnyc]

He targeted illegals, and the majority of course were Mexican and other latinos. Like many other places, the crying began that he was targeting people, which IMO is a load of shit. No different than those who continually complain in NY about how blacks and others are targeted for searches and arrests. And mind you, 99 out of 100 times they have drugs on them, are drunk or DID commit a crime. But how DARE the police arrest more criminals of one race!! Even if they make up the majority of the population in certain areas. Many just want the police to disappear in certain areas so that they don't get harassed. And then they will be the first to complain that the police aren't doing their jobs. :rolleyes:

I think Joe did a standup job of going after illegals, and criminals. And then in trouble for failing to ensure those beneath him weren't in compliance.

I'm glad Trump pardoned him.

[jimnyc]

Not exactly. There was that link earlier, https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/

and now this: https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/28/trump-wrong-to-pardon-arpaio-but-other-presidents-worse-jonathan-turley-column/606223001/?platform=hootsuite

As the Turley article points out, 'unchecked power' tends to be used in 'unchecked ways.' Trump not being the worst, damning with faint praise.

What is 'not exactly'? I'm confused? Specifics?

[jimnyc]

Not exactly. There was that link earlier, https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/

and now this: https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/28/trump-wrong-to-pardon-arpaio-but-other-presidents-worse-jonathan-turley-column/606223001/?platform=hootsuite

As the Turley article points out, 'unchecked power' tends to be used in 'unchecked ways.' Trump not being the worst, damning with faint praise.

Without specifics, all I see is an article/opinion from someone who thought the pardon was wrong? Are you talking about this guys opinion, or what I stated about the terrorists?

[Kathianne]

That it's no more than the 'misdemeanor' not a big deal. Rule of law is a big deal. Not abusing one's authority is a big deal.

[jimnyc]

That it's no more than the 'misdemeanor' not a big deal. Rule of law is a big deal. Not abusing one's authority is a big deal.

No one is denying that rule of law is a great thing - but that's what pardons are there for. EVERY pardon is looking beyond the crime, seeing the person and other factors, and then, well pardoning that person. If anyone deserves it, it's a man with a misdemeanor AND 50 years of service.

That it IS a misdemeanor DOES lessen things. That's why we have so many levels of crimes, including felony/misdemeanor and then levels even of each specific crime. Point is, on that scale, this is about as low as it can go for such a crime. Also, pardoning it has nothing to do with anyone saying the rule of law doesn't exist - except hearing that from those who don't like Trump - because surely neither he or Joe said that.

[Kathianne]

No one is denying that rule of law is a great thing - but that's what pardons are there for. EVERY pardon is looking beyond the crime, seeing the person and other factors, and then, well pardoning that person. If anyone deserves it, it's a man with a misdemeanor AND 50 years of service.

That it IS a misdemeanor DOES lessen things. That's why we have so many levels of crimes, including felony/misdemeanor and then levels even of each specific crime. Point is, on that scale, this is about as low as it can go for such a crime. Also, pardoning it has nothing to do with anyone saying the rule of law doesn't exist - except hearing that from those who don't like Trump - because surely neither he or Joe said that.

We disagree. I don't like Trump, doesn't make this right. In any case, got to read this:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/28/joe-arpaio-might-primary-jeff-flake/

:laugh2:

[jimnyc]

We disagree. I don't like Trump, doesn't make this right. In any case, got to read this:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/28/joe-arpaio-might-primary-jeff-flake/

:laugh2:

What part do you disagree with? That it's a misdemeanor? That it's the lowest form of charge for that crime? That it can in fact be pardoned? That a man with 50 years of service to his country is worthy of tossing a misdemeanor?

Sure, he was wrong, and charged/convicted. He WAS convicted, no one denies such.

I compare something like this, to presidents pardoning en masse when leaving, or like Obama did when releasing tons of folks in prison! For a president to remove a record, of someone NOT in jail, and that person is a 50 year police officer - I see barely a comparison, and the other is done all the time.

--

I really don't see him running at 85, but I give the old codger credit for even thinking about it! And if he ran, and if Trump went to bat for him, he may even have a chance. But I still say it doesn't happen.

[Kathianne]

What part do you disagree with? That it's a misdemeanor? That it's the lowest form of charge for that crime? That it can in fact be pardoned? That a man with 50 years of service to his country is worthy of tossing a misdemeanor?

Sure, he was wrong, and charged/convicted. He WAS convicted, no one denies such.

I compare something like this, to presidents pardoning en masse when leaving, or like Obama did when releasing tons of folks in prison! For a president to remove a record, of someone NOT in jail, and that person is a 50 year police officer - I see barely a comparison, and the other is done all the time.

--

I really don't see him running at 85, but I give the old codger credit for even thinking about it! And if he ran, and if Trump went to bat for him, he may even have a chance. But I still say it doesn't happen.


He really should have been charged at a higher level, in all honesty. It was prosecutorial discretion, taking into many of the same factors like age and service cited by his apologists. That is where we disagree, but on this topic, we're not going to change each other's minds, so I figured, what the heck.

If Sheriff Joe runs against Flake, it will be hilarious and really do think Allah is calling the likely outcome correctly.

[jimnyc]

He really should have been charged at a higher level, in all honesty. It was prosecutorial discretion, taking into many of the same factors like age and service cited by his apologists. That is where we disagree, but on this topic, we're not going to change each other's minds, so I figured, what the heck.

If Sheriff Joe runs against Flake, it will be hilarious and really do think Allah is calling the likely outcome correctly.

I make NO apologies/excuses for illegal actions. But I simply am willing to see a pardon for such a person that has devoted so much time to the country, and the crime is/can be deserving of a pardon. Hell, the overwhelming majority of pardons/expungement and such things like that out there are mostly for much worse crimes, hence so many of them being in jail.

The unfortunate fact is, every person ever pardoned is a criminal of some sort. EVERY one of them. So our county, and our presidents, have a long history of pardoning various individuals they see worthy. And hell, I suppose if we were to make a massive list of those given a pardon, folks that are not in jail, and have committed misdemeanors, would be much more towards the bottom of the list.

[Kathianne]

I make NO apologies/excuses for illegal actions. But I simply am willing to see a pardon for such a person that has devoted so much time to the country, and the crime is/can be deserving of a pardon. Hell, the overwhelming majority of pardons/expungement and such things like that out there are mostly for much worse crimes, hence so many of them being in jail.

The unfortunate fact is, every person ever pardoned is a criminal of some sort. EVERY one of them. So our county, and our presidents, have a long history of pardoning various individuals they see worthy. And hell, I suppose if we were to make a massive list of those given a pardon, folks that are not in jail, and have committed misdemeanors, would be much more towards the bottom of the list.

But, 'he was just charged for doing his job...'

[jimnyc]

But, 'he was just charged for doing his job...'

I am not sure what this means? And appears to be a quote of sorts you are saying? Not from me! Not sure why you're saying such towards me. I know he did something, and I disagree with others about how bad it was, but I never said he was simply doing his job.

[Kathianne]

I am not sure what this means? And appears to be a quote of sorts you are saying? Not from me! Not sure why you're saying such towards me. I know he did something, and I disagree with others about how bad it was, but I never said he was simply doing his job.

From the 'rally' in Phoenix regarding Sheriff Joe. 'Just doing his job...'

[jimnyc]

I know Trump is only like 8 months in, but a picture on FB had me look up stats finally and put things in perspective. Trump DOES have like 400 applications towards the following though, but I'm only posting numbers I can find about finalized.

These are how many pardons and commutations the past 5 presidents have made. Of course 4 of them and their jobs are over, while Trump has plenty of time to add to his statistics.

--

Ronald Reagan

393 pardons in total
13 sentences commuted
38 pardons denied
8 commuted sentences denied

George HW Bush

74 pardons
3 commuted sentences
25 pardons denied
111 commuted denied

Bill Clinton

396 pardons in total
61 sentences commuted
0 denied pardons
116 denied commuted sentences

George W. Bush

32 pardons
5 sentences commuted
1,729 pardons denied
1,208 commuted sentences denied

Barack Obama

212 pardons in total
1,715 commuted sentences

Donald Trump

1 finalized pardons



http://i.imgur.com/V2ofjn8.jpg

[Kathianne]

Jim, did you see the articles about his having the right to pretty much give unlimited, unexplained pardons or commutations? I'm not questioning that. As I think it was Turley, no doubt there were worse pardons, such as Marc Rich, Billy Bob or whatever Clinton's brother's name was, and Hillary's brother.

[Bilgerat]

The Presidential Pardon you should be mad about.

What was Obama thinking when he ordered the release of Oscar Lopez Rivera? During the 1970s, Lopez Rivera headed a Chicago-based cell of the Armed Forces of National Liberation (FALN), which waged a futile but violent struggle to win Puerto Rican independence.
The FALN claimed responsibility for more than 120 bombings between 1974 and 1983 in a wave of senseless destruction that killed six and injured dozens. In 1981, a federal court in Chicago sentenced Lopez Rivera, then 37, to 55 years for seditious conspiracy, armed robbery, interstate transportation of firearms and conspiracy to transport explosives with intent to destroy government property.

Notably, the seditious-conspiracy charge was not some "thought crime," as Lopez Rivera's lawyer has said: The indictment listed 28 Chicago-area bombings, some of which caused injuries, as "overt acts" in support of the conspiracy.

FBI agents discovered dynamite, detonators and firearms at two residences occupied by Lopez Rivera. At trial, a cooperating witness from the FALN testified that Lopez Rivera personally trained him in bomb-making.

So Lopez Rivera is neither a low-level offender nor a nonviolent one. Nor, crucially, is he repentant.

He defiantly challenged the legitimacy of the court that tried him. Shortly after entering federal prison at Leavenworth, Kan., he and FALN members on the outside hatched an escape plan; the FBI foiled it by arresting Lopez Rivera's would-be helpers, who were armed with guns and explosives. A conviction for that escape attempt added 15 years to his sentence.


More here; http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-oscar-lopez-rivera-bombings-clemency-20170119-story.html

[jimnyc]

Jim, did you see the articles about his having the right to pretty much give unlimited, unexplained pardons or commutations? I'm not questioning that. As I think it was Turley, no doubt there were worse pardons, such as Marc Rich, Billy Bob or whatever Clinton's brother's name was, and Hillary's brother.

Yup, of course the loud mouth is going to proclaim he has the power to run the universe and does as he pleases. I'm more concerned with what he ACTUALLY does. I don't think he'll be going on a pardoning spree and doing so for folks that aren't deserving. I think he states such things to piss folks off aka the lefties and the establishment folks. I don't even think he believes such stuff. I'm more than confident that while he states things that piss people off, he speaks with WH and personal attorneys and knows more of what he can and cannot do, more than what he leads others to believe. I think in the end he actually pardons/commutes less than others.... and I don't think we see another pardon 'like' this one again.

[Kathianne]

Yup, of course the loud mouth is going to proclaim he has the power to run the universe and does as he pleases. I'm more concerned with what he ACTUALLY does. I don't think he'll be going on a pardoning spree and doing so for folks that aren't deserving. I think he states such things to piss folks off aka the lefties and the establishment folks. I don't even think he believes such stuff. I'm more than confident that while he states things that piss people off, he speaks with WH and personal attorneys and knows more of what he can and cannot do, more than what he leads others to believe. I think in the end he actually pardons/commutes less than others.... and I don't think we see another pardon 'like' this one again.

I don't really care, as it seems that those with money/power pretty much get away with anything. I've not 'wailed' about his pardon, just saying why I don't like it or many in AZ either. Never mistake a rally in a state for what they people in the state think is right.

His 'appearances' which he thrives on are for those that literally worship him. It's not 'Republicans' there, it's Trump supporters.

[michiganFats]

I don't really care, as it seems that those with money/power pretty much get away with anything. I've not 'wailed' about his pardon, just saying why I don't like it or many in AZ either. Never mistake a rally in a state for what they people in the state think is right.

His 'appearances' which he thrives on are for those that literally worship him. It's not 'Republicans' there, it's Trump supporters.

You're there and I"m not...good enough...

[Gunny]

My point - and it's NOT defending racism, unless you want to make accusations. It's defending a man of a record at 85 for his service to our country. I saw no discussion about race or defense of it. Only those wanting to see it as such and then running with it.

--

Sunday on CNN’s “State of the Union,” Univision anchor Jorge Ramos said President Donald Trump’s pardon of former Maricopa County, AZ Sheriff Joe Arpaio was “defending racism.”

Ramos said, “By pardoning Arpaio President Trump is defending racism. Arpaio violated the Constitution. He discriminated against Latinos. He was convicted of criminal contempt of court.”I see it as righting a wrong, regardless who it is. Arpaio was convicted for upholding the law. That's just TOO simple.

[Kathianne]

I see it as righting a wrong, regardless who it is. Arpaio was convicted for upholding the law. That's just TOO simple.

I think you're wrong on this. Glad though that you didn't get swept away though.

[Gunny]

I think you're wrong on this. Glad though that you didn't get swept away though.I'm hardly wrong. Let's assume I had followed an order in combat that defied the law. You'd STILL be looking for my a$$ UNDER Ft Leavenworth.

Civilians think they can pick and choose which laws they obey or not. Why bother with them? The military is clear: it is unlawful to carry out an unlawful order.

The immigration laws are likewise clear. Obama instructed law enforcement officers to not enforce the law. If anyone should be brought to trial it's HIM.

[Kathianne]

I'm hardly wrong. Let's assume I had followed an order in combat that defied the law. You'd STILL be looking for my a$$ UNDER Ft Leavenworth.

Civilians think they can pick and choose which laws they obey or not. Why bother with them? The military is clear: it is unlawful to carry out an unlawful order.

The immigration laws are likewise clear. Obama instructed law enforcement officers to not enforce the law. If anyone should be brought to trial it's HIM.

One, this isn't a military issue. Two, IF you faked an assassination attempt, you'd likely be in jail. Three, he swore to uphold the laws of AZ, defying a court order is a breach of that oath.

Of course, that's what 'real men' do I guess, according to some.

In any case, still glad you're safe.

[michiganFats]

One, this isn't a military issue. Two, IF you faked an assassination attempt, you'd likely be in jail. Three, he swore to uphold the laws of AZ, defying a court order is a breach of that oath.

Of course, that's what 'real men' do I guess, according to some.

In any case, still glad you're safe.

He's not wrong. The law is the law. Is it illegal to be here without permission?

[Kathianne]

He's not wrong. The law is the law. Is it illegal to be here without permission?

Is it legal to defy a court order? Is it responsible as an elected official to cause many lawsuits that the city must choose to settle, totaling hundreds of thousands or more of dollars?

So yes, you're all wrong. Happily so.

[Gunny]

One, this isn't a military issue. Two, IF you faked an assassination attempt, you'd likely be in jail. Three, he swore to uphold the laws of AZ, defying a court order is a breach of that oath.

Of course, that's what 'real men' do I guess, according to some.

In any case, still glad you're safe.Doesn't matter if it is a military issue. The correlation is valid. It IS an issue of the law. Any law issue by the State of Arizona that contradicts Federal law is defying the US government. Last I checked, the US Govt trumps state law. Isn't THAT what we fought a Civil War over? Immigration is a national issue, so sayeth the US government. A State official cannot supersede it. You saying the CSA was right?

Real men do what is right. Law enforcement officials enforce the law or their purpose for being doesn't exist.

[Kathianne]

Doesn't matter if it is a military issue. The correlation is valid. It IS an issue of the law. Any law issue by the State of Arizona that contradicts Federal law is defying the US government. Last I checked, the US Govt trumps state law. Isn't THAT what we fought a Civil War over? Immigration is a national issue, so sayeth the US government. A State official cannot supersede it. You saying the CSA was right?

Real men do what is right. Law enforcement officials enforce the law or their purpose for being doesn't exist.

We agree immigration is a national power. Unlawfully executing those laws is not legal, by definition. AZ laws were not contrary to federal laws, including the rights of citizens to move about freely. He impeded that, in spite of repeatedly being told he was wrong. In spite of costing the county huge amounts of money.

You can applaud, as I said I saw things differently with what I was seeing in IL. Here, it's different, as local issues usually are.

[Gunny]

We agree immigration is a national power. Unlawfully executing those laws is not legal, by definition. AZ laws were not contrary to federal laws, including the rights of citizens to move about freely. He impeded that, in spite of repeatedly being told he was wrong. In spite of costing the county huge amounts of money.

You can applaud, as I said I saw things differently with what I was seeing in IL. Here, it's different, as local issues usually are.Obama telling law enforcement to not enforce the law is unlawful.

A State judge ruling contrary to law is unlawful. Technically, he has no jurisdiction over Federal law and should have bumped it up to US court.

The Right of citizens to move freely does not, by definition include ILLEGAL aliens. They are not, by definition "citizens".

I never have liked Arpaio. I think he's a heavy-handed pompous bluejay and quite a few things he did may have been legally questionable. Just not on this.

[Kathianne]

Obama telling law enforcement to not enforce the law is unlawful. we agree


A State judge ruling contrary to law is unlawful. Technically, he has no jurisdiction over Federal law and should have bumped it up to US court. he does have a right to rule on execution of the law, on a state official. The courts ruling was not questioned.


The Right of citizens to move freely does not, by definition include ILLEGAL aliens. They are not, by definition "citizens". Certainly includes legal citizens, many legal citizens in AZ of Mexican ancestry.


I never have liked Arpaio. I think he's a heavy-handed pompous bluejay and quite a few things he did may have been legally questionable. Just not on this.

[Kathianne]

I've been watching the news, while reading news. Thought I heard Trump wrong, though it was just after I heard him speaking so nicely on Texas. Oh well, guess my hearing wasn't totally off:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/28/trump-arpaio-pardon-pretty-much-rich-rosenberg-pardons-right/


Trump: Arpaio Pardon Pretty Much The Same As The Rich, Rosenberg Pardons, Right?

ED MORRISSEYPosted at 6:01 pm on August 28, 2017

Not really, no, but bear with Donald Trump for a moment. Apparently surprised by the backlash over his pardon of Joe Arpaio on Friday, Trump told a joint press conference covering the visit of Finland’s president that “I stand by my pardon of Sheriff Joe.” In doing so, Trump criticized the pardons of predecessors Bill Clinton and Barack Obama, even when they weren’t exactly pardons:

...


If the benchmark is the Marc Rich pardon, well, everything is going to clear that bar. Unlike Arpaio, or the “Weathered” Underground figure Susan Rosenberg and drug dealer Carlos Vignali, none of these fled the country to avoid prosecution before getting a clemency action. Rich was indeed the worst of the worst, but, er … does Trump really want to resort to a comparison to Rich? Does Arpaio appreciate that comparison?


There’s a problem with the others mentioned by Trump in this press conference — none of them were pardons. Susan Rosenberg and Carlos Vignali got their sentences commuted by Bill Clinton, not pardons. Those clemency actions sprung them from jail, but they did not remove their convictions from the record. The same is true for two clemency actions cited by Trump supporters during Barack Obama’s presidency — Bradley/Chelsea Manning and FALN terrorist Oscar López Rivera (http://hotair.com/archives/2017/01/17/obama-commutes-sentence-of-former-faln-member-oscar-lopez-rivera/). As bad as both those decisions were, they only commuted sentences. The judgment of the American justice system remains on them, but not Arpaio. (Like Arpaio, though, Rosenberg, Manning, and López Rivera weren’t terribly repentant either.)


Perhaps Trump wanted to make the point that the media treated those clemency actions differently, and were holding him to a different standard. But that’s not really true; the Rich pardon got an enormous amount of press, almost all of it negative, which overshadowed the Clintons’ exit from the White House. The Rosenberg commutation probably got somewhat more positive coverage than Arpaio’s, thanks to the media’s ongoing love affair with The Sixties, but the Vignali commutation was part of a Department of Justice review of Clinton’s last-minute clemency actions (http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-13/news/0103130210_1_carlos-vignali-horacio-vignali-clinton-pardons) for potential corruption:

...

Trump’s not doing himself or Arpaio any favors with these comparisons. Also, if Trump expects to get a boost in Arizona with this pardon, he may well be disappointed. FiveThirtyEight noted the problem (https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-the-arpaio-pardon-make-trump-more-unpopular/) on Saturday:

...


As the polls above show, a lot of people nationally didn’t have an opinion of a potential Arpaio pardon one way or the other. But a poll taken this week in Arizona, where people know Arpaio best, offers Trump little hope if he’s banking that voters nationwide will like his pardon more as they get to know more about Arpaio. OH Predictive Insights found (http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/phoenix/2017/08/21/poll-arizonans-oppose-sheriff-joe-arpaio-pardon-president-donald-trump-phoenix-rally/586957001/) that just 21 percent of Arizonans favored the pardon while 50 percent were against it. That is consistent with the fact that Arpaio lost re-election last year (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/11/09/501388042/maricopa-sheriff-joe-apraio-loses-reelection-fight) after being charged (https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/18/us/sheriff-joe-arpaio-arizona.html?mcubz=0) with criminal contempt, though he had not yet been convicted (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/07/31/540629884/ex-sheriff-joe-arpaio-convicted-of-criminal-contempt). Still, the large margin of public disagreement with Trump’s decision to pardon Arpaio is somewhat surprising given that both Maricopa County (http://uselectionatlas.org/RESULTS/statesub.php?year=2016&fips=4013&f=0&off=0&elect=0) and Arizona (http://uselectionatlas.org/RESULTS/state.php?year=2016&fips=4&f=0&off=0&elect=0) overall narrowly went for Trump last year. This implies that Arpaio rubbing off on Trump could hurt the president both in this key swing state and nationwide as Arpaio becomes better known outside his home state.



If you want to know why Arizonans opposed the pardon 21/55 before Trump made it official, read this USA Today column (https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/27/sheriff-joe-arpaio-no-conservative-no-hero-no-matter-what-trump-says-jon-gabriel-column/606012001/) from conservative activist and Arizona native Jon Gabriel. The contempt conviction, ExJon writes, was akin to “busting Al Capone on tax evasion.”

[aboutime]

ARPIAO was nothing more than an OBAMA PAY-BACK job from a Liberal Judge who also was known for hating Arpaio. The WITCH HUNT was stopped by the President.

Anyone who doesn't like it? TOUGH. Do you think Trump cares what you think?

He's the President...what are you? Arpaio did his job, did it well, followed the Laws, and was nearly punished for doing so. Unlike Obama who broke the law, and only got to go to Hawaii to play golf.

[Bilgerat]

Watched Eboni Williams tonight. Some Anti-Trumper was on the show braying how this pardon"will not stand"

Ms. Williams kindly informed the harpy that the Pardon privileges enjoyed by the POTUS are absolute and irrevocable.

So, if I may be so bold.

If you have a problem with this pardon, just do what most law abiding citizens did with the pardons by "Slick Willie" and "Obayme"




http://ptsd-sspt.weebly.com/uploads/4/7/7/2/47722273/64737863_orig.jpg

[Kathianne]

Watched Eboni Williams tonight. Some Anti-Trumper was on the show braying how this pardon"will not stand"

Ms. Williams kindly informed the harpy that the Pardon privileges enjoyed by the POTUS are absolute and irrevocable.

So, if I may be so bold.

If you have a problem with this pardon, just do what most law abiding citizens did with the pardons by "Slick Willie" and "Obayme"




http://ptsd-sspt.weebly.com/uploads/4/7/7/2/47722273/64737863_orig.jpg



Yep, it will stand, just like all the others before.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I think Arpaio could beat Flake... but at 85, I doubt Joe will run. I like the guy. A hard ass is the best kind of person to have for sheriff... IMO.

[Gunny]

I think Arpaio could beat Flake... but at 85, I doubt Joe will run. I like the guy. A hard ass is the best kind of person to have for sheriff... IMO.The episode on Investigation Discovery was on this AM about Arpaio. There's a difference between hardass and asshole. He crosses the line, IMO.

He flat-out states he puts prisoners in pink boxers to piss them off. Uncalled for.

He puts them in GP tents in the desert. I've lived in them (the tents, not his jail). Also been stationed in the desert. That's inhumane.

Two meals a day? had to live on THAT in the desert a time or two or three also. Add the work on top? I'm surprised he hasn't killed anyone yet.

A prisoner would be better off killing a guard and going to prison than staying in that jail.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

The episode on Investigation Discovery was on this AM about Arpaio. There's a difference between hardass and asshole. He crosses the line, IMO.

He flat-out states he puts prisoners in pink boxers to piss them off. Uncalled for.

He puts them in GP tents in the desert. I've lived in them (the tents, not his jail). Also been stationed in the desert. That's inhumane.

Two meals a day? had to live on THAT in the desert a time or two or three also. Add the work on top? I'm surprised he hasn't killed anyone yet.

A prisoner would be better off killing a guard and going to prison than staying in that jail.
My son was in a bad spot in his life while he lived in Phoenix, shortly after he got out of the Army, was a party animal, got back to back DUI's and spent time in Joe's "tent city" wearing the "pink underwear." It had the desired effect on him. He didn't want to go back and cleaned up his act. I don't know if inviting him down from WI was a good thing to do or not, but it was a learning experience for him. He's married now, nice wife, got a kid, B.A. degree in IT/Networking, good job, good life going on and lives pretty clean.

[Gunny]

My son was in a bad spot in his life while he lived in Phoenix, shortly after he got out of the Army, was a party animal, got back to back DUI's and spent time in Joe's "tent city" wearing the "pink underwear." It had the desired effect on him. He didn't want to go back and cleaned up his act. I don't know if inviting him down from WI was a good thing to do or not, but it was a learning experience for him. He's married now, nice wife, got a kid, B.A. degree in IT/Networking, good job, good life going on and lives pretty clean.I have no problem with him being pardoned. I think it was the right decision.

I DO have a problem with treating human beings as sub-human, even if they are prisoners. Execute them and be done with it. Torturing them is hardly anything to brag about.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I have no problem with him being pardoned. I think it was the right decision.

I DO have a problem with treating human beings as sub-human, even if they are prisoners. Execute them and be done with it. Torturing them is hardly anything to brag about.
Well I'll tell ya, Gunny... I worked in a supermaximum prison for awhile in Boscobel, WI. It isn't a supermax anymore but it was when it opened. Anyway, I started there long before they even got any prisoners. They were just finishing the construction on it, and I was a Maintenance Mechanic III. But to get to the point... what I saw for cells in that place, a 2' high concrete slab for a bed with little 2" thick pathetic excuse for a mattress and a stainless steel toilet, sink, shower combination deal, all inside a tiny little 6' x 8' concrete room with no windows, not even bars for a door but a solid steel door with a tiny little window and the view was the cell corridor, what you could see of it... give me the hot tent and pink underwear any day, because I'd die within days being locked up in a room like that supermax prison, and I'm serious, I would either go stark raving, slobbering, screaming, shit smearing, insane or die if I was locked up in a room like that. At least in the tent and pink underwear you're outside, you can see the sun, you can breath fresh air, you can move around, you're not in some tiny little sterile cell with no outside stimulus at all. That's what I would call torture. I'd rather be shot than put in a prison like that.