This Is Why Trump Is Failing

[Kathianne]

he is an 'outsider', not a politician. He hasn't a clue how to get ideas through to legislation and seemingly gets irritated at the process. Unfortunately there is a Constitutional process and it's written to be very time consuming and burdensome. When interest is lost, nothing gets accomplished.

Yes, the link is Politico, but the contents are worth reading:

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/17/trump-confederate-fight-threatens-gop-agenda-241755

It's long, I don't know who, if anyone will bother to read, but it's past time to stop whining about how he gets so much criticism.

[pete311]

So much for the business man in the white house experiment. Could still be an interesting idea, just a shame it had to be a crook like Trump.

[aboutime]

TDS...Trump Derangement Syndrome .

The only people who insist Trump is failing are those who put their hatred of Trump, ahead of the entire nation.

[pete311]

Interesting article

Bannon's Exit Leaves Trump Untethered
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-untethered/537354/


With Bannon gone, Trump no longer has much connection to either the GOP establishment—he only recently became a Republican, and has little adherence to its traditional platform—or to the upstart faction that drove his win. Since his implicit endorsement of some white nationalism on Tuesday, he has taken criticism from Republicans unequalled since the October release of a video in which he bragged about sexually assaulting women. The Bannon firing is unlikely to sit well with Breitbart, and Joel Pollak, an editor there, tweeted (https://twitter.com/joelpollak/status/898595085247324161) “#WAR” in response. Bannon himself, with a sharp tongue and being media savvy, could also make for an unpleasant enemy on the outside.

[michiganFats]

It wasn't that long. A recurring theme in that article is the GOP complaining about instability in the administration specifically where legislative goals are concerned.

The President is not part of the legislative branch and the failure of Ryan and McConnell to gain the support they need to achieve goals highlights their incompetence, not Trump. It's Trump's fault that not all GOP Senators respect McConnell? As far as I know Trump hasn't vetoed anything, Congress needs to get him some important legislation to sign into law and if they don't that's their failure, not Trump's, unless their true purpose is to oppose Trump.

The investigation circus being aimed at Trump right now could not be happening without the support and blessing of the GOP yet they complain about that circus.

[Kathianne]

It wasn't that long. A recurring theme in that article is the GOP complaining about instability in the administration specifically where legislative goals are concerned.

The President is not part of the legislative branch and the failure of Ryan and McConnell to gain the support they need to achieve goals highlights their incompetence, not Trump. It's Trump's fault that not all GOP Senators respect McConnell? As far as I know Trump hasn't vetoed anything, Congress needs to get him some important legislation to sign into law and if they don't that's their failure, not Trump's, unless their true purpose is to oppose Trump.

The investigation circus being aimed at Trump right now could not be happening without the support and blessing of the GOP yet they complain about that circus.

They need to work together, they are not the weakest link. His looking to 'primary' those that disagree with him says all that needs saying.

Seriously the snowflake defense. I'm so pissed that my guy won and no one will get in goose step as he promised!

[pete311]

It wasn't that long. A recurring theme in that article is the GOP complaining about instability in the administration specifically where legislative goals are concerned.

The President is not part of the legislative branch and the failure of Ryan and McConnell to gain the support they need to achieve goals highlights their incompetence, not Trump. It's Trump's fault that not all GOP Senators respect McConnell? As far as I know Trump hasn't vetoed anything, Congress needs to get him some important legislation to sign into law and if they don't that's their failure, not Trump's, unless their true purpose is to oppose Trump.

The investigation circus being aimed at Trump right now could not be happening without the support and blessing of the GOP yet they complain about that circus.

Who do you replace Ryan and McConnell with that would make the needed difference?

[aboutime]

Interesting article

Bannon's Exit Leaves Trump Untethered
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/trump-untethered/537354/

More of petey's Wishful, Hatred, Thinking! Poor petey is so miserable. He comes here, trying to make everybody else just as miserable...but, laughing at him ruins his plans:lol:

[michiganFats]

They need to work together, they are not the weakest link. His looking to 'primary' those that disagree with him says all that needs saying.

Seriously the snowflake defense. I'm so pissed that my guy won and no one will get in goose step as he promised!

That does say a lot but I think we disagree on what exactly it says.

[michiganFats]

Who do you replace Ryan and McConnell with that would make the needed difference?

It won't matter, but that's not Trump's fault. The GOP doesn't want to work with him and they don't have to.

[pete311]

It won't matter, but that's not Trump's fault. The GOP doesn't want to work with him and they don't have to.

The voters will decide that next year. So far the GOP seems to think their base agrees with what they are doing. Enough to be re-elected that is.

[michiganFats]

The voters will decide that next year. So far the GOP seems to think their base agrees with what they are doing. Enough to be re-elected that is.

Why you think this is relevant I do not know.

Let me short-bus this for you. The Republicans in the Politico article are blaming Trump for a set of circumstances they themselves wanted to see happen and did make happen.

[Black Diamond]

The voters will decide that next year. So far the GOP seems to think their base agrees with what they are doing. Enough to be re-elected that is.
It's enough that trump will never be impeached.

[Kathianne]

That does say a lot but I think we disagree on what exactly it says.

We do. The problem is if you want to have someone's 'support' you've got to realize that even if they don't always agree with you, you got to have their back.

Flake for instance, has voted Trump's way nearly 100%. What he won't due is join the cult of Trump. He sees the man as fundamentally flawed, he's not alone. So was Clinton and so was Nixon.

Related: http://www.weeklystandard.com/trump-doesnt-have-a-base.-he-has-a-personality-cult./article/2009350

[pete311]

Why you think this is relevant I do not know.

Let me short-bus this for you. The Republicans in the Politico article are blaming Trump for a set of circumstances they themselves wanted to see happen and did make happen.

Let me short bus this for you. It's then the will of the voters. Repubs won't do anything to sour they're own base. The voters are turning against Trump.

[Black Diamond]

Let me short bus this for you. It's then the will of the voters. Repubs won't do anything to sour they're own base. The voters are turning against Trump.
That's what you said when the pussy video came out.

[pete311]

That's what you said when the pussy video came out.

If I am wrong we will see massive turnover next year. If not, then voters stand with the GOP base over the President.

[michiganFats]

We do. The problem is if you want to have someone's 'support' you've got to realize that even if they don't always agree with you, you got to have their back.



In your article it is the GOP complaining that Trump doesn't have their back.

[Kathianne]

In your article it is the GOP complaining that Trump doesn't have their back.

and he doesn't. I don't think he even realizes the repercussions.

[michiganFats]

and he doesn't. I don't think he even realizes the repercussions.

It's not Trumps job to write and whip legislation. They're blaming him for their own failures, if in fact they are failures. And they have not had his back since before he was even elected.

[pete311]

It's not Trumps job to write and whip legislation. They're blaming him for their own failures, if in fact they are failures. And they have not had his back since before he was even elected.

He bears some fault. I thought he was supposed to be the world's best leader and negotiator. Where is that? All we get is chaos and toxic drama.

[Kathianne]

It's not Trumps job to write and whip legislation. They're blaming him for their own failures, if in fact they are failures. And they have not had his back since before he was even elected.

It is his job to sell what he wants passed. He failed with health care. He turned his 'infrastructure discussion' into the Charlottesville mud puddle.

[michiganFats]

It is his job to sell what he wants passed. He failed with health care. He turned his 'infrastructure discussion' into the Charlottesville mud puddle.

It is not his job to do that. The GOP had 7 years to come up with something. They didn't. McConnell couldn't reel in Rand Paul. Ryan and the House wrote something so poor that they had to scrap their first attempt. That is legislative business, it has nothing to do with Trump. You already know I disagree with you on his Charlottesville comments.

[Kathianne]

It is not his job to do that. The GOP had 7 years to come up with something. They didn't. McConnell couldn't reel in Rand Paul. Ryan and the House wrote something so poor that they had to scrap their first attempt. That is legislative business, it has nothing to do with Trump. You already know I disagree with you on his Charlottesville comments.

So, why didn't Trump just say, "I want no part of this poor healthcare plan." Instead he got Interior secretary to likely lose the vote they needed. In any case, you just enjoy being on the good side.

I do wonder though, how all the new kind of 'conservatives' are going to like being the 'new Democrats' of old, like Byrd? Cause that's what the GOP is going to be from here on in.

[aboutime]

It is his job to sell what he wants passed. He failed with health care. He turned his 'infrastructure discussion' into the Charlottesville mud puddle.


Kathianne. Why don't you just admit it here? Admit you hate Trump, and stop blowing smoke up our butts. If you are as intelligent as you would want all of us to believe...I dare to say, you'd never stoop to playing the Liberal Blame game the way the NEVER TRUMPERS are doing daily.
IT IS NOT the president's job to sell what he wants passed. It IS congress' job. The only job the President has is to PROTECT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. So he has the VETO pen only to prevent Congress from overstepping their bounds per the Constitution.

You, of all people should know that. Donald Trump is not responsible to tell Hate Filled Americans what to think, do, and say. Which is a falsehood from everyone who is so IGNORANT, and FILLED WITH HATRED the results in STUPIDITY.
Stop blaming the President for Congress's gathering of WUSSIES who fear democrats, and their own careers, more than they care for YOU, ME, and OUR FAMILIES.

[Kathianne]

Kathianne. Why don't you just admit it here? Admit you hate Trump, and stop blowing smoke up our butts. If you are as intelligent as you would want all of us to believe...I dare to say, you'd never stoop to playing the Liberal Blame game the way the NEVER TRUMPERS are doing daily.
IT IS NOT the president's job to sell what he wants passed. It IS congress' job. The only job the President has is to PROTECT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. So he has the VETO pen only to prevent Congress from overstepping their bounds per the Constitution.

You, of all people should know that. Donald Trump is not responsible to tell Hate Filled Americans what to think, do, and say. Which is a falsehood from everyone who is so IGNORANT, and FILLED WITH HATRED the results in STUPIDITY.
Stop blaming the President for Congress's gathering of WUSSIES who fear democrats, and their own careers, more than they care for YOU, ME, and OUR FAMILIES.

I stand corrected. A President's job is not to lead. Got it! What the hell is he there for then?

[michiganFats]

So, why didn't Trump just say, "I want no part of this poor healthcare plan." Instead he got Interior secretary to likely lose the vote they needed. In any case, you just enjoy being on the good side.

I do wonder though, how all the new kind of 'conservatives' are going to like being the 'new Democrats' of old, like Byrd? Cause that's what the GOP is going to be from here on in.

What the heck does any of this have to do with the fact that you erroneously believe that the President is supposed to do the job of the Party Whips? You do know that each Party has specific people in Congress to do exactly that which you are claiming is Trump's job?

[Kathianne]

What the heck does any of this have to do with the fact that you erroneously believe that the President is supposed to do the job of the Party Whips? You do know that each Party has specific people in Congress to do exactly that which you are claiming is Trump's job?

I believe that the President is supposed to lead, especially the party he's the head of. McConnell likely had the votes, was concerned about AK. Next thing known, she's threatened with withdrawal of money for the state. Thus, she voted against. Not bright.

Then when he doesn't 'win' which will happen more often than not, it's everyone else's fault.

It's a fractured party, has been for years, though this campaign is likely to result in a splinter party, which may be what the country needs. There are many that will not be associated with the stench coming off this now, which was unnecessary.

[aboutime]

I stand corrected. A President's job is not to lead. Got it! What the hell is he there for then?


NEVER MIND Kathianne. Sorry I thought you might be more intelligently informed to answer. NO...The President's MAIN JOB is not to lead....if that was the case. Both houses of Congress, and both parties would be CHEERING for him.
.................................................. ..............................
The Constitution assigns the president two roles: chief executive of the federal government and Commander in Chief of the armed forces. As Commander in Chief, the president has the authority to send troops into combat, and is the only one who can decide whether to use nuclear weapons.
As chief executive, he enforces laws, treaties, and court rulings; develops federal policies; prepares the national budget; and appoints federal officials. He also approves or vetoes acts of Congress and grants pardons.
The President's Job | Scholastic.com
www.scholastic.com/browse/article.jsp?id=4684

[Kathianne]

NEVER MIND Kathianne. Sorry I thought you might be more intelligently informed to answer. NO...The President's MAIN JOB is not to lead....if that was the case. Both houses of Congress, and both parties would be CHEERING for him.
.................................................. ..............................
The Constitution assigns the president two roles: chief executive of the federal government and Commander in Chief of the armed forces. As Commander in Chief, the president has the authority to send troops into combat, and is the only one who can decide whether to use nuclear weapons.
The President's Job | Scholastic.com
www.scholastic.com/browse/article.jsp?id=4684 (http://www.scholastic.com/browse/article.jsp?id=4684)

Sorry, I thought you might have something worthwhile to add, my apologies.

[aboutime]

Sorry, I thought you might have something worthwhile to add, my apologies.


Thank you Kathianne. I now know who you really are here. Your answer could have come from petey.

[Kathianne]

Thank you Kathianne. I now know who you really are here. Your answer could have come from petey.

Oh, the arrow! Somehow I'll survive.

Seems like there's lots of remorse not being admitted.

[hjmick]

The only people who insist Trump is failing are those who put their hatred of Trump, ahead of the entire nation.




And the only people who can't admit the man is struggling, in trouble, and possibly in over his head are the ones with their heads up their asses.

[aboutime]

Oh, the arrow! Somehow I'll survive.

Seems like there's lots of remorse not being admitted.I should just tell you this
http://youtu.be/MMzd40i8TfA

[pete311]

This thread has turned into a microcosm of our current political situation.

[aboutime]

This thread has turned into a microcosm of our current political situation.

Who asked you?

[michiganFats]

I believe that the President is supposed to lead, especially the party he's the head of. McConnell likely had the votes, was concerned about AK. Next thing known, she's threatened with withdrawal of money for the state. Thus, she voted against. Not bright.

Then when he doesn't 'win' which will happen more often than not, it's everyone else's fault.

It's a fractured party, has been for years, though this campaign is likely to result in a splinter party, which may be what the country needs. There are many that will not be associated with the stench coming off this now, which was unnecessary.

If Murkowski made her decision based on that instead of the legislation at hand then I think that reflects poorly upon her. And only her.

[pete311]

Who asked you?

You are lost at sea, come back to shore.

[aboutime]

You are lost at sea, come back to shore.

Fine example for us here from petey of 'Stupid is, as Stupid does!'

[NightTrain]

Murkowski was going to vote against in any event - we all knew it from the get-go. The applied leverage (which I applaud btw) was a desperate move to coerce her to do the right thing, but she went against anyway. She's possibly the most liberal GOP Senator in the GOP right now, which is embarrassing for me. Collins is just as bad if not worse.

And I have to agree with MF - it's not Trump's arena to be GOP whip. He can assist when he wants something, but the failure lies entirely on Congress.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I believe that the President is supposed to lead, especially the party he's the head of. McConnell likely had the votes, was concerned about AK. Next thing known, she's threatened with withdrawal of money for the state. Thus, she voted against. Not bright.

Then when he doesn't 'win' which will happen more often than not, it's everyone else's fault.

It's a fractured party, has been for years, though this campaign is likely to result in a splinter party, which may be what the country needs. There are many that will not be associated with the stench coming off this now, which was unnecessary.

Sadly, the Obama set the new standard, IN THAT == the socialist mainstream media now leads the nation.
Trump now faces battling standards and groups empowered by 8 long years of that unification between Obama the socialist/Christian hating puke and the socialist Conservative/Christian /Republican hating media..
Who can deny the power of that organized media machine and its billionaire star Soros and his agenda?
Certainly rivals the power of the President as public opinion being swayed , persuades SENATORS AND CONGRESS CRITTERS TO GO AGAINST THEIR OWN PARTY'S PRESIDENT--WHICH RARELY EVER HAPPENED WITH OBAMA.

Trump is not perfect and has faults ( who doesn't?), but they are nowhere near as great as are being magnified, exaggerated about and outright lied about by media, and those vested in keeping the previous president and his damn nation weakening agenda in place, IMHO..-TYR

[Kathianne]

Related. While Trump likely wouldn't and couldn't do what Arnold did, he does face a GOP that is losing a significant portion of it's base, more than Trump is picking up from the disenfranchised Democrats and those that had given up.

He doesn't seem to care that he's driving away many who are those that usually would be bothering their representatives to vote certain ways. They are losing their party and really don't want to be associated with them.

Indeed, he appears to be actively working against Senators that have voted with him on nearly all issues, because they don't like HIM:

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/18/breitbart-bannon-exit-arnold-2-0-will-back/

Breitbart On Bannon Exit: Get Ready For Arnold 2.0ED MORRISSEYPosted at 4:41 pm on August 18, 2017


Just how devastating a political blow will Donald Trump suffer from cashiering Steve Bannon (http://hotair.com/archives/2017/08/18/axios-bannon-firing-decision-imminent/)? Breitbart’s senior editor-at-large (and my pal) Joel Pollak argues that Trump just cut off his nose to spite his face, exiling his master strategist just when Trump needed him the most. All Republicans have to look forward to, Joel predicts, is a rerun of Arnold Schwarzenegger’s betrayal in California (http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/08/18/steve-bannon-gone-trump-risks-becoming-arnold-schwarzenegger-2-0/):




When he took office in 2003 as Governor of California, “The Terminator” carried the hopes of conservatives in the Golden State, who saw him as a vehicle for their ideas, even if he was not a doctrinaire conservative himself. The faltering California Republican Party looked to Schwarzenegger to reverse its long-term decline, and Republicans elsewhere saw his success as a model from which they could learn as they courted moderate, swing-state voters.


But after struggling with intense media criticism, and after losing a key referendum on reforms to state government, Schwarzenegger gave up on his agenda, and abandoned the political base that had brought him into office. He re-invented himself as a liberal, embracing policies such as California’s controversial cap-and-trade program, which had zero effect on climate change but has chased businesses, jobs, and middle-class families out of the state.


Politically, Schwarzenegger’s gambit was a success. He won re-election in 2006. But his second term was a disaster. When he left office in 2010, the state was in a financial shambles and the California Republican Party had begun a decline from which it still has not recovered.

This isn’t quite an apt comparison, at least not yet, because there’s not much to indicate that Trump will shift positions in the same manner Schwarzenegger did. Needless to say, Trump exhibits a whimsical attitude to policy preferences, especially in the specifics, but Trump went all-in with the nationalists well before Bannon came on board the campaign. Trump had tapped into that political vein on his own, and probably against the instincts of those close to him who still remain, such as Ivanka, Jared, and so on. Bannon’s entry to the campaign may have enhanced that approach and boosted its effectiveness, but it didn’t change Trump’s course. Why would leaving change it now?


Even without Bannon, however, there’s another check on that impulse. Schwarzenegger had enough clout on both sides of the aisle to have natural allies among Democrats. He read the writing on the wall and switched sides, and in large part California Democrats were happy to embrace the Hollywood A-lister. While he had campaigned hard and tough against the Democrats in 2003, he didn’t get excessively personal, and didn’t go out of his way to embrace their anathemas. Joel recalls Schwarzenegger being the last hope of conservatives, but he was mostly the last hope of Republicans. Conservatives wanted Tom McClintock, and predicted that Schwarzenegger would ruin them.


Trump simply doesn’t have that luxury. Democrats have demonized Trump to such a degree that they don’t want to have anything to do with him, even on infrastructure. Trump has made that easy for them with his reckless rhetoric and lack of message discipline, plus his personal attacks on their leadership. They’re planning to run the anti-Trump campaign in 2018, and after the midterms need to soften him up with enough body blows to win back the White House.


If Trump cuts ties with Republicans and populists, the dystopian future he faces would parallel that of another celebrity politician: Jesse Ventura. Ventura came into office promising reform as an outsider, but wound up alienating both parties and voters with nonsensical statements and self-serving stunts. Republicans and Democrats in Minnesota called a kind of truce to work out a veto-proof budget, cutting Ventura out of the loop, and he didn’t bother to run for a second term. I warned that might be the outcome of a Trump presidency (http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Columns/2016/01/21/Trump-vs-Sanders-Get-Ready-Populist-Disaster) in January 2016 (http://hotair.com/archives/2016/01/21/new-jeb-ad-trumps-going-to-lose-to-hillary-you-know/). If he tries to pull a Schwarzenegger, he’ll wind up doing The Full Ventura instead.


Trump’s smart enough to avoid that, though we’ll see if he does. So far, the furor of Bannon’s exit seems waaaaay overblown. At least for now, it’s all inside-the-Beltway noise, the kind of story that bores the populist voters outside of DC. Most of his voters have probably only the vaguest idea of who Bannon is, let alone think of him as Trump’s minder. They don’t care who has an office inside the West Wing — they worry far more about what Washington is doing for them, and too often to them to keep track of the scorecards. Trump knows that better than anyone.

[Kathianne]

Murkowski was going to vote against in any event - we all knew it from the get-go. The applied leverage (which I applaud btw) was a desperate move to coerce her to do the right thing, but she went against anyway. She's possibly the most liberal GOP Senator in the GOP right now, which is embarrassing for me. Collins is just as bad if not worse.

And I have to agree with MF - it's not Trump's arena to be GOP whip. He can assist when he wants something, but the failure lies entirely on Congress.


Actually everything I've read had her on the fence, up until the enforcement from Interior. Imagine if you were in her shoes, you would have gone along? I doubt it.

It's the whips jobs to do what they can, they need the WH to apply pressure when necessary, but hitting the state, rather than on a committee seat, is not the way.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

you are lost at sea, come back to shore.

so says the guy, on a deserted island, drinking liberal kool-aid and either running away from the truth when presented or else is quipping back with one-liners, false personal accusations and/or more stupidity.

Where is that poll??--tyr

[Kathianne]

so says the guy, on a deserted island, drinking liberal kool-aid and either running away from the truth when presented or else is quipping back with one-liners, false personal accusations and/or more stupidity.

Where is that poll??--tyr

That's funny!

[michiganFats]

Actually everything I've read had her on the fence, up until the enforcement from Interior. Imagine if you were in her shoes, you would have gone along? I doubt it.

It's the whips jobs to do what they can, they need the WH to apply pressure when necessary, but hitting the state, rather than on a committee seat, is not the way.

This is not even close to true.

[Kathianne]

This is not even close to true.

Yeah, it is. But we're getting no where here.

[NightTrain]

Actually everything I've read had her on the fence, up until the enforcement from Interior. Imagine if you were in her shoes, you would have gone along? I doubt it.

It's the whips jobs to do what they can, they need the WH to apply pressure when necessary, but hitting the state, rather than on a committee seat, is not the way.


I should clarify : Alaskans knew she was going to side with the liberals. She IS a liberal.

[michiganFats]

Yeah, it is. But we're getting no where here.

We never will. You insist that the President should act like a whip and also maintain that a whip should rely on the White House and you're taking these positions, it seems, solely for the purpose of bashing Trump. None of what the Politico article or you have complained about is any of Trump's responsibility and I'm glad it isn't because I don't want the Executive meddling in legislative affairs to extent you seem to want to see.

[Kathianne]

I should clarify : Alaskans knew she was going to side with the liberals. She IS a liberal.

I'll take your word for it, always give credence to those on the ground in area we're talking about.