Is a second civil war brewing?

[Black Diamond]

Or has it been brewing since the Obama years maybe?

Truth be told, I never gave this thought much credence when Gunny brought it up. Now I'm starting to wonder.

[michiganFats]

I think Civil War is the wrong term for it, I call it insurrection. Coup might also work.

[pete311]

Or has it been brewing since the Obama years maybe?

Truth be told, I never gave this thought much credence when @Gunny (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=30) brought it up. Now I'm starting to wonder.

lol trying to pin this on Obama. Shit has been going on since the beginning.

[revelarts]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?

[Black Diamond]

lol trying to pin this on Obama. Shit has been going on since the beginning.
I asked a question, faggot.

[Abbey Marie]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?

Rev, you need to ask the libs this question. They are the ones who have been angry since Trump got elected. They are the ones who show their hate for this country by often violently protesting at very turn. They are the ones carrying signs calling our President a Nazi. They are the ones who promise rebellion and revolution.

[Gunny]

Or has it been brewing since the Obama years maybe?

Truth be told, I never gave this thought much credence when @Gunny (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=30) brought it up. Now I'm starting to wonder.It's never really ended. The demographics may be a bit different that North v South, but the underlying reasons remain unchanged, currently represented by Progressive/Leftist fascists as the North and Conservatives and their coattail riders the Neocons who will sell out before they'll fight. Prize is the same: Power and control of the government leading to control of all resources.

The left is winning the war of the words through the MSM just as the North's propaganda waged a relentless war on the American psyche for decades prior to the actual war. In the end, those that valued their freedom and their way of life saw no other choice but to rebel and fight. Sound familiar?

The US Revolution was fought why? Wealthy colonialists didn't want to pay their taxes. They wanted their own rules. Barely, they won. First thing they did was tax whiskey. At least it wasn't imported British tea :rolleyes:.

The South rebelled against the North for similar reasons. The North demanded high import/export tariffs to force the South to feed their mills instead of the much more lucrative European market. Whoever controlled Congress controlled the tariff laws. North and South was evenly split into slave and free states which kept Congress equally represented by both sides. "Slavery" was just the buzzword of the day. It was an economic means of breaking the South.

Same goes now. The Progressive left uses every dishonest trick in the book and has created these false moral high grounds as a means of alienating the Right, even from itself, and gaining control to implement their fascist agenda. Right now, they've been working with all diligence to erase independent thought and identity. Southern statues/monuments are just part of the end game.

In the end, there are those that are going to say "f*ck this" and fight the idiots.

Looks like a do-over from those who would rather destroy history than learn from it.

[Black Diamond]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?
When did I ever say abortion wouldn't contribute to a civil war ? Assuming we are talking north vs south, you do a survey the south will be far more against it than the north. And people are rabid on both sides of that issue. I can see killing over it.

[revelarts]

Rev, you need to ask the libs this question. They are the ones who have been angry since Trump got elected. They are the ones who show their hate for this country by often violently protesting at very turn. They are the ones carrying signs calling our President a Nazi. They are the ones who promise rebellion and revolution.

Gunny and Black Diamond ARE LIBERALS!!??!!
they're the only ones here talking about civil war, Heck I KNOW I read some people on the right talking civil war if HILLARY won. do you remember that Abbey?
:unsure:

As far as Protesting goes that what Americans have a right to do. No matter what their crazy ideas.
VIOLENCE, however, should be off the table at "protest" no matter which POV is promoting it.
But it doesn't take a civil war to stop violent protest does it?

in general part of the problem seems to be that their seems to be little middle ground ... or at least little middle ground that people of all sides are willing to acknowledge and build from.

all sides idea of compromise seems to be my way or nothing. the left is COMPLETELY blind and getting stupider in their ideas of what's acceptable behavior and thoughts. And too many on Right are retreating into the arms of racism and selective blindness to real issues as a response.
while many larger gov't and corporate corruptions go completely unadressed. people are incensed over Flags, Anthem's and Confederate statutes.

[Gunny]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?I am. Those statues are our history. But it isn't "statues" I'll fight over. The statues are another excuse by the enemies of the Constitution you so always claim to revere to take away our Rights as free people. Our Right to think for ourselves and our Right to freely express ourselves. Our Right to not have a bunch of morons making laws and rules that are stupid, inhuman, hypocritical and unconstitutional.

You're always on your soapbox bitching about Constitutional Rights in your warped eyes, but you aren't willing to fight for them? Sheep. No, worse than a sheep. Sheep don't know any better.

And mostly I'd fight to the death for the Right for you and all the other jackasses that "know what's best for me" to leave me the fuck alone. I don't need you nor your goofy-ass government that is becoming harder and harder to distinguish from the progressive left/Dems/RINOs.

I've been willing to put myself in the line of fire for a cause before. You can't be first, but you CAN be next.

Ask me another question.

[aboutime]

rev. Sounds like you approve of RE-WRITING History to me. We can't have another civil war. That would mean...the next generation of SNOWFLAKES, LIBERAL CRYBABIES, DUMMIES, HATERS would have more statues to TAKE DOWN because they are INSULTED BY BEING REMINDED OF THEIR HATRED.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I've been fighting my entire life it seems. Would I fight the assclowns now trying to destroy us, this nation--

YOU DAMN STRAGHT I WOULD AND THEY WOULDNT LIKE HOW I'D DO IT EITHER!

I'd fight for my family AND FOR MY PRINCIPLES AND HEAVEN HELP ANYBODY THAT GOT IT MY WAY WHILE I WAS ON A RAMPAGE..
DA TRUUF ==== NUFF SAID--I DONT LIE......

I HAVE FOUGHT ALL MY LIFE FOR FOLKS TO LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE..
Gunny knows what that means, Southern men want --------to just leave them the hell alone..

A fact..... -Tyr

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?
Ever heard the old saying, "the straw that broke the camels back?"

Each incident by itself might not be worth starting a second civil war over, but put them all together and they are. You can only push someone so far before they're ready to knock your teeth out. I think people are right on the edge. I think most decent Americans are fed up to their gills. This democrat propaganda machine and it's 24/7 hysterical lying and trashing of our duly elected president is wearing most people thin.

[aboutime]

To be honest with you. I believe people like you would love to see another civil war in the United States. Your hatred of nearly EVERYONE who doesn't agree with you, could be your only reason to do so.

Call me racist if you want. I've been called worse, and it only makes me search for more TRUTH to disprove the hatred, ignorance, and stupidity of our society today that is FAILING in intelligence, wisdom, common sense, and Honesty.

Hypocrisy leads the way. So, I will happily await your response to my words, and to see how you TRY to prove me wrong.

[revelarts]

Ever heard the old saying, "the straw that broke the camels back?"

Each incident by itself might not be worth starting a second civil war over, but put them all together and they are. You can only push someone so far before they're ready to knock your teeth out. I think people are right on the edge. I think most decent Americans are fed up to their gills. This democrat propaganda machine and it's 24/7 hysterical lying and trashing of our duly elected president is wearing most people thin.


O yes sir, I have heard the saying "the straw that broke the camels back", I've mentioned before in regards to police harrassing and killing innocent people (of all races) and why "all of sudden" blacks and others began protesting after seemingly legit incidents. It wasn't Obama and it wasn't Freddy Gray or whoever... It was the build-up of decades of tension and abuse that final broke.
As the declaration of independence says "After a long train of abuses...."
But most folks are protesting peacefully and sitting down at ball games NOT threatening a civil war even though there are actual DEAD innocent people on boths side already.

BUt hey BD I have to ask, are the folks on the right "snowflakes" and to thin skinned to take verbal abuse from the left? I mean the right has the White House and the Congress, so what are folks whining about that the media isn't nice? Did you expect the media to treat Trump FAIRLY? c'mon i know you didn't.

But we have to be honest too BD, Trump has stuck his foot in it more than once.


And i'd agree that a lot of the left has left nearly all reason. Even some on the left can't take how far into stupid it's gone.
rather than assume the worse and the most extreme of them all represents the whole and talk about WAR, why not, find those with at least LESS crazy and start to move the ball back.... peacefully.
If Trump could keep his head and not take everything so personal and run off at the mouth so much. If he had good sense and could stay on PROJECT, he'd probably get more done...DESPITE the left's fit's.

[revelarts]

As faar as my personal opinion about Confederate statues Go, Frankly I really DON'T CARE either way.
I think it's a WASTE of time for EITHER Side to bother themselves about them.
And really, it just looks like an easy issue for some politicians to play off of.
And I suspect that if you ask 100 random Americans, of all races, who Robert E Lee is that more than HALF wouldn't even know. If you asked which war he fought in many wouldn't know that either.

I think it's a WASTE of Officials time and people's efforts to do anything other than maintain the Historical markers statues etc.. Good bad and ugly. History is history.

But not because these statues are such great teaching tools or because "HISTORY WILL BE LOST" if a statue is taken down.:rolleyes: No "history is lost/erased" if a statue is removed. But Maybe some on the left are so crazy that they want to remove the Confederates from the history books too. They've removed a lot of the Christian motives and background from history books already....(any CIVIL WAR talk over that BTW?) But I think it's a bit hyperbolic to say that if a statute is removed "HISTORY is LOST" or changed.

But again i don't particularly like the idea, but i don't think it's WAR worthy AT ALL... even as a "last straw".
Seems people should be able to talk about something like the fate of a statue.

to me It's like people splitting a Church over whether or not to remove the church steeple and bell.
If it stays or goes .. it doesn't really make a difference to the purpose of Jesus Christ and the Church.
But if Deacon White's Granma helped pay for that Bells trip from England and Deacon Black's father's back was ruined by that stinkin' bell. They might have FEELINGS strong enough to FIGHT... or split the church over.
I've got no taste for a fight on those grounds myself.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

O yes sir, I have heard the saying "the straw that broke the camels back", I've mentioned before in regards to police harrassing and killing innocent people (of all races) and why "all of sudden" blacks and others began protesting after seemingly legit incidents. It wasn't Obama and it wasn't Freddy Gray or whoever... It was the build-up of decades of tension and abuse that final broke.
As the declaration of independence says "After a long train of abuses...."
But most folks are protesting peacefully and sitting down at ball games NOT threatening a civil war even though there are actual DEAD innocent people on boths side already.

BUt hey BD I have to ask, are the folks on the right "snowflakes" and to thin skinned to take verbal abuse from the left? I mean the right has the White House and the Congress, so what are folks whining about that the media isn't nice? Did you expect the media to treat Trump FAIRLY? c'mon i know you didn't.

But we have to be honest too BD, Trump has stuck his foot in it more than once.


And i'd agree that a lot of the left has left nearly all reason. Even some on the left can't take how far into stupid it's gone.
rather than assume the worse and the most extreme of them all represents the whole and talk about WAR, why not, find those with at least LESS crazy and start to move the ball back.... peacefully.
If Trump could keep his head and not take everything so personal and run off at the mouth so much. If he had good sense and could stay on PROJECT, he'd probably get more done...DESPITE the left's fit's.
I can give every republican president from the past, like Bush, that took everything the left could dish out and never said a word back. I saw him as weak. Why does anyone have to take this 24/7 trashing from the democrat propaganda wing and never say anything back? I'll tell ya what, you wouldn't stand there and let someone bash the hell otta you day after day after day after day, I don't care who you are, you're going to get pissed. Well the democrat propaganda wing isn't used to having a republican talk back. They're not supposed to do that. They're supposed to tuck tail and cower like all the rest of the republicans do and have done for ages.

So now we have president with a pair of BALLS. He doesn't fit the mold. He doesn't play by the rules. He's actually giving what he gets, and the left CAN'T STAND IT. They are in a state of SHOCK and COMPLETE AND TOTAL MELT DOWN, but ya know what, president Trump talks like the majority of Americans do. He says what the majority of Americans are thinking. That's why he got elected, and that's why NONE of his base is leaving him, even though the democrats are pumping poll after poll trying to convince us otherwise. Do they think we've already forgotten the EPIC POLLING FAILURE saying Hitlery was a SHOE IN? These so called polls are a lie and a farce.

I love president Trump. He's a man's man and doesn't take any shit, and I absolutely LOVE IT. And if the democrats think they're 24/7 frothing at the mouth trashing of him is making us all turn on him, they are RUDELY MISTAKEN, it makes us stand behind him even more.

And I'll also add that these republicans that are distancing themselves from him, they're pure PANDERING, GUTLESS COWARDS, and I wouldn't piss on them if the were on fire. I wish the majority of them would be voted out.

No one said pushing back against the democrat propaganda wing and the Washington establishment was going to be pretty. No one said it was going to be easy, but at least we have a president with the BALLS to TRY.

[Black Diamond]

O yes sir, I have heard the saying "the straw that broke the camels back", I've mentioned before in regards to police harrassing and killing innocent people (of all races) and why "all of sudden" blacks and others began protesting after seemingly legit incidents. It wasn't Obama and it wasn't Freddy Gray or whoever... It was the build-up of decades of tension and abuse that final broke.
As the declaration of independence says "After a long train of abuses...."
But most folks are protesting peacefully and sitting down at ball games NOT threatening a civil war even though there are actual DEAD innocent people on boths side already.

BUt hey BD I have to ask, are the folks on the right "snowflakes" and to thin skinned to take verbal abuse from the left? I mean the right has the White House and the Congress, so what are folks whining about that the media isn't nice? Did you expect the media to treat Trump FAIRLY? c'mon i know you didn't.

But we have to be honest too BD, Trump has stuck his foot in it more than once.


And i'd agree that a lot of the left has left nearly all reason. Even some on the left can't take how far into stupid it's gone.
rather than assume the worse and the most extreme of them all represents the whole and talk about WAR, why not, find those with at least LESS crazy and start to move the ball back.... peacefully.
If Trump could keep his head and not take everything so personal and run off at the mouth so much. If he had good sense and could stay on PROJECT, he'd probably get more done...DESPITE the left's fit's.
Removing and defacing monuments isn't verbal abuse. The gap between cultures is widening. The Right doesn't have the senate. See McCain and Obamacare skinny repeal.
All cops in Freddie gray case were exonerated. Several of them by black juries and black judges. So the riots and looting the blacks did which Obama blamed republicans for were all for nothing.

I never thought the press would be on trumps side. This conflict isn't all about race, as I indicated.

I wonder how long an nfl player would last if, instead of wearing pig socks, he wore wizard socks.

[Black Diamond]

As faar as my personal opinion about Confederate statues Go, Frankly I really DON'T CARE either way.
I think it's a WASTE of time for EITHER Side to bother themselves about them.
And really, it just looks like an easy issue for some politicians to play off of.
And I suspect that if you ask 100 random Americans, of all races, who Robert E Lee is that more than HALF wouldn't even know. If you asked which war he fought in many wouldn't know that either.

I think it's a WASTE of Officials time and people's efforts to do anything other than maintain the Historical markers statues etc.. Good bad and ugly. History is history.

But not because these statues are such great teaching tools or because "HISTORY WILL BE LOST" if a statue is taken down.:rolleyes: No "history is lost/erased" if a statue is removed. But Maybe some on the left are so crazy that they want to remove the Confederates from the history books too. They've removed a lot of the Christian motives and background from history books already....(any CIVIL WAR talk over that BTW?) But I think it's a bit hyperbolic to say that if a statute is removed "HISTORY is LOST" or changed.

But again i don't particularly like the idea, but i don't think it's WAR worthy AT ALL... even as a "last straw".
Seems people should be able to talk about something like the fate of a statue.

to me It's like people splitting a Church over whether or not to remove the church steeple and bell.
If it stays or goes .. it doesn't really make a difference to the purpose of Jesus Christ and the Church.
But if Deacon White's Granma helped pay for that Bells trip from England and Deacon Black's father's back was ruined by that stinkin' bell. They might have FEELINGS strong enough to FIGHT... or split the church over.
I've got no taste for a fight on those grounds myself.
Those monuments mean something to southerners. Southern pride is real. And no it's not all about slavery. Defacing and removing monuments is the cherry on the sundae for some folks who have had enough of what has happened the last 8 years... Some of which you pointed out. Gays and trannies on every tv program and promoted by the president, gay marriage forced down their throats, the military and the entire country emasculated, apologizing to our enemies, Abortion being more apparent with the selling body parts for lamborghinis ....and yes transgender bathrooms.
World War I was started because of a guy and his wife got shot. But there were underpinnings.

[Gunny]

O yes sir, I have heard the saying "the straw that broke the camels back", I've mentioned before in regards to police harrassing and killing innocent people (of all races) and why "all of sudden" blacks and others began protesting after seemingly legit incidents. It wasn't Obama and it wasn't Freddy Gray or whoever... It was the build-up of decades of tension and abuse that final broke.
As the declaration of independence says "After a long train of abuses...."
But most folks are protesting peacefully and sitting down at ball games NOT threatening a civil war even though there are actual DEAD innocent people on boths side already.

BUt hey BD I have to ask, are the folks on the right "snowflakes" and to thin skinned to take verbal abuse from the left? I mean the right has the White House and the Congress, so what are folks whining about that the media isn't nice? Did you expect the media to treat Trump FAIRLY? c'mon i know you didn't.

But we have to be honest too BD, Trump has stuck his foot in it more than once.


And i'd agree that a lot of the left has left nearly all reason. Even some on the left can't take how far into stupid it's gone.
rather than assume the worse and the most extreme of them all represents the whole and talk about WAR, why not, find those with at least LESS crazy and start to move the ball back.... peacefully.
If Trump could keep his head and not take everything so personal and run off at the mouth so much. If he had good sense and could stay on PROJECT, he'd probably get more done...DESPITE the left's fit's.Use a little common sense and historical knowledge. The crazies are always the ones that start wars. Then they let someone else fight them, and criticize how they do it. The way it goes. The US Civil and the American Revolution were not started by quiet, moderate people. They were started by the fruitloops of their day talking shit just as the fruitloops of our day are all over the media, internet, our mail, stores .... you name it.

Let's ban Jesus from Christmas (you know, derived from "Christ's Mass"? Let's ban whites. Let's ban Southerners. Let's ban any-fucking-body our little game doesn't agree with. You find me some common sense and moderation the progressive left's agenda and someone reasonable and open-minded on the left that will listen.

Get your audience right. THEY are the ones destroying the nation while WE sit and watch and grit out teeth. There will be a boiling point. Then words will be replaced by force. You can call me names all day long. When you put your hand on me I'm taking it off at the shoulder.

[aboutime]

Maybe somebody can finally explain to me, a 70 year old...WHY, in 2017, all of a sudden, every one of those statues in so many states...have instantly become so OFFENSIVE?

Memory serves me, that Most of those statues have been in place, Longer than most of us living today....have been on the Earth.

So, would someone please like to share why ALL OF THE IGNORANCE, STUPIDITY, and HATRED is suddenly bubbling up after WE THE PEOPLE, finally get a PRESIDENT who isn't afraid to TELL THE TRUTH, and EXPOSE THE LIARS, and FREAKS AMONG US???

[Black Diamond]

Maybe somebody can finally explain to me, a 70 year old...WHY, in 2017, all of a sudden, every one of those statues in so many states...have instantly become so OFFENSIVE?

Memory serves me, that Most of those statues have been in place, Longer than most of us living today....have been on the Earth.

So, would someone please like to share why ALL OF THE IGNORANCE, STUPIDITY, and HATRED is suddenly bubbling up after WE THE PEOPLE, finally get a PRESIDENT who isn't afraid to TELL THE TRUTH, and EXPOSE THE LIARS, and FREAKS AMONG US???
PC idealist leftist crap.

[michiganFats]

The short version? In my opinion?

In 2016 white voters voted as bloc, or close to it, for the first time and that scares the hell out of whoever has been trying to undermine our society so they're kicking their program into overdrive.

[Gunny]

Maybe somebody can finally explain to me, a 70 year old...WHY, in 2017, all of a sudden, every one of those statues in so many states...have instantly become so OFFENSIVE?

Memory serves me, that Most of those statues have been in place, Longer than most of us living today....have been on the Earth.

So, would someone please like to share why ALL OF THE IGNORANCE, STUPIDITY, and HATRED is suddenly bubbling up after WE THE PEOPLE, finally get a PRESIDENT who isn't afraid to TELL THE TRUTH, and EXPOSE THE LIARS, and FREAKS AMONG US???Part of the process for progressive left fascists. Shame you for your identity, then remove it and replace it one of their choosing. Worked for Hitler.

[Gunny]

The short version? In my opinion?

In 2016 white voters voted as bloc, or close to it, for the first time and that scares the hell out of whoever has been trying to undermine our society so they're kicking their program into overdrive.Excellent point. Spot on. They're insecurity slip is showing.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

PC idealist leftist crap.
Radical democrat trash.

[Black Diamond]

Part of the process for progressive left fascists. Shame you for your identity, then remove it and replace it one of their choosing. Worked for Hitler.
i watched a sermon by a pastor who said if a population's identity is taken away, they are easier to conquer. Goes along with what you said.

[Gunny]

i watched a sermon by a pastor who said if a population's identity is taken away, they are easier to conquer. Goes along with what you said.It's a simple tactic. The Marine Corps uses it. So do US prisons. Shave your head, put everyone in the same suit and you're there.

Any vet here can tell you that once you got your shave and brand new uniform, you didn't know who was shit for nothing for a couple of weeks. You narrowed it down to x number of fat, short, tall and skinny privates, and black, white and Hispanic ones. Otherwise, everyone was the same and had the same uniforms and equipment. Then you start marching around in formation to commands. You can sleepwalk through it by the time boot camp is over.

Erasing white history is the same. They see it as a way to gain and control power. It's worked effectively since the US Civil War. They're not going to abandon a successful tactic over a setback. They got complacent thinking Hitlery was a shoe-in and as Michigan Fats says, they're doubling down now. They aren't going to quit until stopped.

[Gunny]

Who wants to bet all the channels that show so-called documentaries bust out all their Klan propaganda in the near future and re-hash all that crap. Agree with us, or you're a racist Klansman. Couldn't be I don't "agree with us" because "us" is stupid?

[michiganFats]

Who wants to bet all the channels that show so-called documentaries bust out all their Klan propaganda in the near future and re-hash all that crap. Agree with us, or you're a racist Klansman. Couldn't be I don't "agree with us" because "us" is stupid?

I won't take that bet because they will. I'm also sure that they aren't just going to focus on the violence, they'll focus on the many people who were Klan members just because a lot of other people were or joined for political or professional reasons and then say that they were just as responsible for the violence and hatred as the people who actually carried attacks out. The message being, you Trump voters are Klansmen.

[aboutime]

Saul Alinsky’s 12 Rules for Radicals.

1. “Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have.“ Power is derived from 2 main sources – money and people. “Have-Nots” must build power from flesh and blood.

2. “Never go outside the expertise of your people.“ It results in confusion, fear and retreat. Feeling secure adds to the backbone of anyone.

3. “Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.“ Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty.

4. “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.“ If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules.

5. “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.“ There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions.

6. “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.“ They’ll keep doing it without urging and come back to do more. They’re doing their thing, and will even suggest better ones.

7. “A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag.“ Don’t become old news.

8. “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.“ Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new.

9. “The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.“ Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist.

10. “If you push a negative hard enough, it will push through and become a positive.“ Violence from the other side can win the public to your side because the public sympathizes with the underdog.

11. “The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative.“ Never let the enemy score points because you’re caught without a solution to the problem.

12. “Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.“ Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions.

[michiganFats]

I've heard of this but never bothered to look it up. This is what all the fuss is about? This is just politics 101.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Who wants to bet all the channels that show so-called documentaries bust out all their Klan propaganda in the near future and re-hash all that crap. Agree with us, or you're a racist Klansman. Couldn't be I don't "agree with us" because "us" is stupid?
That's when you turn the channel, or just shut the TV off and play some music.

[Kathianne]

That's when you turn the channel, or just shut the TV off and play some music.

Yep, or pick up a book. ;)

[Gunny]

Yep, or pick up a book. ;)Watching the Voice kiddie version :).

[michiganFats]

That's when you turn the channel, or just shut the TV off and play some music.

It doesn't matter. The MSM will pick it up and run with it.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

It doesn't matter. The MSM will pick it up and run with it.
Let 'em... they've been tuned out at my pad for decades.

Everybody should tune them out, unless they're fans of Heir Goebbels.

[michiganFats]

Let 'em... they've been tuned out at my pad for decades.

Everybody should tune them out, unless they're fans of Heir Goebbels.

You're right, no MSM links in this forum, that's for sure.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

You're right, no MSM links in this forum, that's for sure.
MSM = DEMOCRAT PROPAGANDA WING.

The democrats don't run their party, their media does.

[Kathianne]

You're right, no MSM links in this forum, that's for sure.

Actually links are good, it's up to each of us to use our discernment and judgement. It's always seemed to me that the best way to deal with a 'source' or 'story' that seems iffy is to use it as the base of looking up information from other sources. Takes moments to confirm or debunk what was said in most cases.

[michiganFats]

Actually links are good, it's up to each of us to use our discernment and judgement. It's always seemed to me that the best way to deal with a 'source' or 'story' that seems iffy is to use it as the base of looking up information from other sources. Takes moments to confirm or debunk what was said in most cases.

My point was you can't get away from it. If the documentaries Gunny mentioned were made for political reasons then whether you watch the Hitler Channel or not you would still know about the documentary and most likely comment on it because there would be a thread started here about it.

[Kathianne]

My point was you can't get away from it. If the documentaries Gunny mentioned were made for political reasons then whether you watch the Hitler Channel or not you would still know about the documentary and most likely comment on it because there would be a thread started here about it.

Sure you can, just choose not to watch.

I used to love the History Channel, but that was over a decade ago. It changed, I haven't. Same with the GOP or those calling themselves conservatives. Our definitions are very different. Nearly everyone here considers themselves conservative, yet there are so many things that we don't have in common.

[michiganFats]

Sure you can, just choose not to watch.

I used to love the History Channel, but that was over a decade ago. It changed, I haven't. Same with the GOP or those calling themselves conservatives. Our definitions are very different. Nearly everyone here considers themselves conservative, yet there are so many things that we don't have in common.

You've never commented on a thread started by someone referencing something that was on TV you didn't watch?

[Kathianne]

You've never commented on a thread started by someone referencing something that was on TV you didn't watch?

I was responding to 'you can't get away from it.' You can.

[michiganFats]

I was responding to 'you can't get away from it.' You can.

And you're wrong. If you come here, you can't.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Sure you can, just choose not to watch.

I used to love the History Channel, but that was over a decade ago. It changed, I haven't. Same with the GOP or those calling themselves conservatives. Our definitions are very different. Nearly everyone here considers themselves conservative, yet there are so many things that we don't have in common.
But earlier in our discussion you listed things we have in common, and as a conservative I can tell you, my beliefs haven't deviated in decades.

You just have a different belief system. You see things differently than others. I would go as far as to say it's because of those who surround you. You all probably believe the same things and see things in the same way. I swear it's got something to do with the way our brains are wired first and then outside influence.

[Kathianne]

But earlier in our discussion you listed things we have in common.

You just have a different belief system. You see things differently than others. I would go as far as to say it's because of those you who surround you. You all probably believe the same things and see things in the same way. I swear it's got something to do with the way our brains are wired first and then outside influence.

Hell, I'm just likely ornery, there's very few people I agree with on more than a few issues.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Hell, I'm just likely ornery, there's very few people I agree with on more than a few issues.
Well that would make two of us.

The difference being with our conversation is I don't want to gouge your eye balls out just because we disagree, and I doubt you do I.

That's the way it should be.

[Kathianne]

Well that would make two of us.

The difference being with our conversation is I don't want to gouge your eye balls out just because we disagree, and I doubt you do I.

That's the way it should be.

I always come back to the difference between the Constitutional Republic our country was founded upon and benefited from for many years. That is the system I want. What most fail to recognize, though from the get go it was emphasized, was the 'goodness' of the people being a requirement.

Not perfect people, flaws are the nature of people. The system can deal with flaws.

The requirement was that people would be vigilant and keep the public good in mind. There wouldn't always be agreement, consider the Whiskey Rebellion that someone brought up earlier or maybe just the tax?

Or the Bonus Army. Deserving and desperate? Without a doubt. Justified in demands? Not so much. Reasonable government response? Not so much.

FDR's court packing scheme.

So many challenges, yet eventually the crisis were addressed and solutions reached. Most often by compromise once order was restored.

Maybe this too will happen, though the 'public good' seems missing to me, everyone wants what they want, only what they want.

[Kathianne]

Well that would make two of us.

The difference being with our conversation is I don't want to gouge your eye balls out just because we disagree, and I doubt you do I.

That's the way it should be.

I'm not into eye gouging, I promise. I'm not normally a violent sort, quite the opposite.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I always come back to the difference between the Constitutional Republic our country was founded upon and benefited from for many years. That is the system I want. What most fail to recognize, though from the get go it was emphasized, was the 'goodness' of the people being a requirement.

Not perfect people, flaws are the nature of people. The system can deal with flaws.

The requirement was that people would be vigilant and keep the public good in mind. There wouldn't always be agreement, consider the Whiskey Rebellion that someone brought up earlier or maybe just the tax?

Or the Bonus Army. Deserving and desperate? Without a doubt. Justified in demands? Not so much. Reasonable government response? Not so much.

FDR's court packing scheme.

So many challenges, yet eventually the crisis were addressed and solutions reached. Most often by compromise once order was restored.

Maybe this too will happen, though the 'public good' seems missing to me, everyone wants what they want, only what they want.
I'm afraid we're past the point of either side peacefully agreeing to anything. The battle lines have been drawn. The left wants our president gone, the right won't have any of it, and there is no reconciliation of any sort in sight, only more ire.

I said long ago, 10 years ago, that another civil war was brewing. I think it's already started. The only thing left is the shooting.

[Kathianne]

I'm afraid we're past the point of either side peacefully agreeing to anything. The battle lines have been drawn. The left wants our president gone, the right won't have any of it, and there is no reconciliation of any sort in sight, only more ire.

I said long ago, 10 years ago, that another civil war was brewing. I think it's already started. The only thing left is the shooting.

Yep, no itching here. Go for it.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Yep, no itching here. Go for it.
The only way this ole boy is doing any shooting is if someone is shooting at me.

Sorry, Kath... that ain't itching, it's called protecting your own, and I don't appreciate you insinuating I was about to do anything different. I certainly haven't made any nasty little quips like that to you. I thought we were keeping this amiable.

[Kathianne]

The only way this ole boy is doing any shooting is if someone is shooting at me.

Sorry, Kath... that ain't itching, it's called protecting your own, and I don't appreciate you insinuating I was about to do anything different. I certainly haven't made any nasty little quips like that to you. I thought we were keeping this amiable.

I was responding to MF, his post, not you.

In any case, the idea of shooting because of an impeachment, not shots being fired. It's confusing.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I was responding to MF, his post, not you.

In any case, the idea of shooting because of an impeachment, not shots being fired. It's confusing.
Well you quoted and replied to me.

You getting tired and not paying attention?

[Kathianne]

Well you quoted and replied to me.

You getting tired and not paying attention?

I am getting tired and you are right, I was responding to your post, that didn't put a caveat about being shot at first. Sorry for mixing things up, to MF too!

Like I said, it's confusing, shoot in response to being shot or shooting because there is no peaceful response possible?

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I am getting tired and you are right, I was responding to your post, that didn't put a caveat about being shot at first. Sorry for mixing things up, to MF too!

Like I said, it's confusing, shoot in response to being shot or shooting because there is no peaceful response possible?
Would you stand still and let someone shoot at you?

Would you not defend your home if someone was there to kill you and take what is your's?

That's what I'm saying.

I'm too old to go marching off and join some insurrection or rebellion. The only thing I'll do is protect my home and hope the outcome is something I can live with, providing I'm still alive.

[Kathianne]

Would you stand still and let someone shoot at you?

Would you not defend your home if someone was there to kill you and take what is your's?

That's what I'm saying.

I'm too old to go marching off and join some insurrection or rebellion. The only thing I'll do is protect my home and hope the outcome is something I can live with, providing I'm still alive.

I believe that we have the right of self-defense. I don't think that having a difference of opinion is war causing. I agree totally that if someone is attacking you or your property, self-defense is warranted. Shooting at you, coming at you with a knife, entering your home or attempting to; taking what belongs to you, all qualify. Standing on the sidewalk yelling that Trump sucks and so does anyone who supports him? No. Same with impeachment, whether or not it ever comes and whether or not he's convicted.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I believe that we have the right of self-defense. I don't think that having a difference of opinion is war causing. I agree totally that if someone is attacking you or your property, self-defense is warranted. Shooting at you, coming at you with a knife, entering your home or attempting to; taking what belongs to you, all qualify. Standing on the sidewalk yelling that Trump sucks and so does anyone who supports him? No. Same with impeachment, whether or not it ever comes and whether or not he's convicted.
But the condition of the nation is far past just standing and shouting. There's violence, destruction, virtual anarchy, and leftists cities are having their law enforcement stand back and watch. I have no idea if it would ever spill all the way out here in the sticks, I could get lucky and avoid it all.

But impeachment... for what? What has he done wrong? Other than try and tell the truth and get something done in a cess pool of establishment, bought and paid for, could care less about your or I, hacks?

[Kathianne]

But the condition of the nation is far past just standing and shouting. There's violence, destruction, virtual anarchy, and leftists cities are having their law enforcement stand back and watch. I have no idea if it would ever spill all the way out here in the sticks, I could get lucky and avoid it all.

But impeachment... for what? What has he done wrong? Other than try and tell the truth and get something done in a cess pool of establishment, bought and paid for, could care less about your or I, hacks?

I already said I've yet to see anything that warrants impeachment. I said the same over and over again regarding Obama. I didn't like him, his policies either. He still was within the powers of his office.

It's not just the lefties that are getting a 'pass' from the police, indeed I'd argue that the politicians are causing a stand down so they can capitalize on the violence of whichever side they choose.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I already said I've yet to see anything that warrants impeachment. I said the same over and over again regarding Obama. I didn't like him, his policies either. He still was within the powers of his office.

It's not just the lefties that are getting a 'pass' from the police, indeed I'd argue that the politicians are causing a stand down so they can capitalize on the violence of whichever side they choose.
You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before. Rahm Emanuel
Read more at: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/r/rahmemanue409199.html

[Kathianne]

You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before. Rahm Emanuel
Read more at: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/r/rahmemanue409199.html

My point, both sides are trying to create their crisis.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

My point, both sides are trying to create their crisis.
Again... I only see one side trying to do that.

They want to remove American history. They are the ones creating the controversy. I know you see it differently, but, that's where we're at.

However, just to keep the peace and avoid any furthering of violence, I would say move the statues, whatever, to a museum dedicated to that, even put it in a private place, and if you still have a problem with that, then you truly are not reasonable, then you really are interested in one thing and one thing only, erasing the history of America, and someone like that should be denounced by every American standing.

[Kathianne]

Again... I only see one side trying to do that.

They want to remove American history. They are the ones creating the controversy. I know you see it differently, but, that's where we're at.

However, just to keep the peace and avoid any furthering of violence, I would say move the statues, whatever, to a museum dedicated to that, even put it in a private place, and if you still have a problem with that, then you truly are not reasonable, then you really are interested in one thing and one thing only, erasing the history of America, and someone like that should be denounced by every American standing.

We finally have agreement! LOL!

[Kathianne]

I am going to quiet down and get some sleep, before I go though I wanted to post this link to an article that I agree with in the main:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-08-16/charlottesville-and-the-gasps-of-weak-fascism


Charlottesville and the Gasps of Weak Fascism

Trump's equivocations are indefensible. But they don't herald a new era of white supremacy. By Eli Lake





There is no question that President Donald Trump's shifting reactions to the domestic terrorism (https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-08-15/bury-the-confederacy-for-good) in Charlottesville, Virginia, has been odious. While he condemned the murder of Heather Heyer (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/13/us/heather-heyer-charlottesville-victim.html), his equivocations, hedges and moral equivalency in the last three days signal a quiet approval of white supremacists. "What about the alt-left?"

This is particularly odious because of America's shameful history of slavery and the subjugation of black citizens. It is our original sin. And we expect our modern presidents to help clean the stain, not excuse it. A vast majority of Americans understand this. They know that Ku Klux Klansmen have no place in our politics today.

That said, it's important to understand what the terror in Charlottesville is not. It is not a return of Jim Crow. Nor is it the face of the new right, despite the bigots' call for unity. It is not the dawn of American fascism either.

Rather it is the growl and gasp of a hateful and hopeless fringe. Consider the terrorist, James Fields Jr. He dropped out of the army. He had until recently lived with his mom. He grew up in a fatherless home. He had trouble making friends. He suffered from the same kind of alienation that drives young men and women to join the Islamic State. Indeed he chose to murder his victim by ramming his car at full speed into a crowd, the same technique used by the radical Muslims in Europe his movement deplores.

It's important at this particular moment to remember that terrorism and street fights are the recourse of the weak. Radical movements that cannot advance their agenda through the ballot will choose bloodshed. But this does not mean their agenda will succeed. If American history is any guide, they never do.

From the anarchists in the turn of the 20th century to the Weather Underground of the 1970s, violent radical movements have failed. The chances that the bigots in Charlottesville can bring back segregation are as non-existent as those that husband-and-wife shooters of San Bernardino, California, had in heralding an era of America Sharia.

...





Just thought of his opening lines, so went back and highlighted 'what it is not...'

Someone mentioned they only read the first words, sometimes you got to hit the 3rd paragraph...

[High_Plains_Drifter]

I am going to quiet down and get some sleep, before I go though I wanted to post this link to an article that I agree with in the main:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-08-16/charlottesville-and-the-gasps-of-weak-fascism
Here we go... :rolleyes:

The parting shot... :laugh:

GOOD NIGHT!

[pete311]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10790&stc=1

[Gunny]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10790&stc=1Real nice. The Neocons would compromise on their own birthdays. The left won't compromise on demanding changes to suit their socialist agenda. The asshole in the middle just gets his ass kicked by both sides. Trump's a good example. And no, I DON'T like him. But why he would want to put himself in the position of being between a bunch of pussies that won't support him and a bunch of thugs that think he can't be President because they don't like him beats me.

[revelarts]

Again... I only see one side trying to do that.

They want to remove American history. They are the ones creating the controversy. I know you see it differently, but, that's where we're at.

However, just to keep the peace and avoid any furthering of violence, I would say move the statues, whatever, to a museum dedicated to that, even put it in a private place, and if you still have a problem with that, then you truly are not reasonable, then you really are interested in one thing and one thing only, erasing the history of America, and someone like that should be denounced by every American standing.


this evening my wife professionally catered and we sat in on an event that commemorated the landing the 1st Africans slaves to "the new world" in Virginia.
They had a historical documentary and 2 black historians, (one a Princeton graduate) who moderated a Q and A after the film.

the question of confederate monuments came up and both men agreed that Museums and or museum grounds are appropriate, and strongly denounced the destruction of statues and monuments. There seemed to be consensus nodding agreement to that view in t audience of not quite 200 people. A 95% black audience which included the black mayor of the city and a former congressman, also black. One of the historians ... as you might expect of a historian... really didn't like the idea of destruction of historical markers or statues but added just as strongly that at these monuments and statues that a full picture be presented and not just an aggrandizement of these figures or their deeds. Or only speaking of the good things they've done.

I don't know of any blacks myself that want to REMOVE history.
frankly some are very well aware of the history and will tell people about the confederacy in much of it's horrid detail. Not so much the 'glory'.
They don't want to erase it. Some just don't want it "celebrated" by the state as if it's benign and wonderful.
Museums are PERFECT.


Again we can't find out what most people think from just listening to the fringes.
And we SHOULD NOT assume the worse of others views or motives.
As Trump said, ideally we should all love each other.

[revelarts]

also,
One of the historians mention that he had just driven cross country with his wife, and at one point they passed by a "NATHAN BEDFORD FOREST STATE PARK",... look him up.

seems to me if any place Needs a name change that is a candidate.

[Black Diamond]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=10790&stc=1
Funny you left out the leftists' billy clubs.

[Gunny]

also,
One of the historians mention that he had just driven cross country with his wife, and at one point they passed by a "NATHAN BEDFORD FOREST STATE PARK",... look him up.

seems to me if any place Needs a name change that is a candidate.Why? I'm related to him, junior. He was a brilliant cavalry commander. See where this is going? Southerners respect their families. He fought for what he believed was right AT THE TIME. You revisionists want to hold everyone from a different world to your standards of today.

No wonder none of you dolts ever learn a thing.

[revelarts]

here's a perspective that i have some agreement with.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyX-KSj9uPc

[Abbey Marie]

this evening my wife professionally catered and we sat in on an event that commemorated the landing the 1st Africans slaves to "the new world" in Virginia.
They had a historical documentary and 2 black historians, (one a Princeton graduate) who moderated a Q and A after the film.

the question of confederate monuments came up and both men agreed that Museums and or museum grounds are appropriate, and strongly denounced the destruction of statues and monuments. There seemed to be consensus nodding agreement to that view in t audience of not quite 200 people. A 95% black audience which included the black mayor of the city and a former congressman, also black. One of the historians ... as you might expect of a historian... really didn't like the idea of destruction of historical markers or statues but added just as strongly that at these monuments and statues that a full picture be presented and not just an aggrandizement of these figures or their deeds. Or only speaking of the good things they've done.

I don't know of any blacks myself that want to REMOVE history.
frankly some are very well aware of the history and will tell people about the confederacy in much of it's horrid detail. Not so much the 'glory'.
They don't want to erase it. Some just don't want it "celebrated" by the state as if it's benign and wonderful.
Museums are PERFECT.


Again we can't find out what most people think from just listening to the fringes.
And we SHOULD NOT assume the worse of others views or motives.
As Trump said, ideally we should all love each other.

Rev IMO, you and your wife being Christian puts you in a group who think with eternity in mind. Whole different ball of wax.

[Kathianne]

Rev IMO, you and your wife being Christian puts you in a group who think with eternity in mind. Whole different ball of wax.

It helps. However I saw something today that makes a bunch of sense and speaks to my experiences. It was something like, "Turn off the news, put down the paper, and get off the computer. Go talk to your neighbors. See if you don't feel differently about the state of the country today."

Nearly everyone we live by, work with, interact with in our day-to-day lives are fine. Some might be great. Few are looking to bash one over the head. The fact that we all get along in a reasonable fashion speaks volumes about all of our choices not to actively hurt each other.

[SassyLady]

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war over Confederate statute's staying up or being taken down?

Show of hands, how many are willing to go to war because someone sits down for the national anthem in complaint of poor treatment by police?

Show of hands, how many people willing to go to full ground war over men in woman's bathrooms?


Seems to me if those on the right to want to go to war over things It be for things like abortion and selling baby parts
For sending troops into illegal useless wars, for the gov't spying on all of every U.S. citizens communications, Limiting free speech, gov't corruption etc etc


So what's the new "civil war" to be about EXACTLY?

I will go to war gladly if books start burning.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I will go to war gladly if books start burning.

Liberals long ago had certain books banned from schools, Mark Twain's Huckleberry Finn , Tom Sawyer, etc.
Banned because of the language the author used to describe blacks...
We got a glimpse of what was to come way back then..
These people never stop--unless forced to stop...
And it is they_leftists/libs/dems) that are prone to use violence and ANY MEANS NECESSARY TO OVERCOME THEIR OPPOSITION
all the while painting that proclivity for violence as a conservative trait..

If they end up forcing a war--they will be smashed here in the South.
My generation cut their baby teeth on shooting guns, as soon as we could walk past our own backyard to hunt--with real guns--not toys...-Tyr

[michiganFats]

Has anyone taken a peek at a high school history book lately? You don't have to burn books when you can just rewrite them. Anyone reading that book who didn't know better would think that the modern day progressive viewpoint has been culturally dominant from the very beginning.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

here's a perspective that i have some agreement with.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyX-KSj9uPc
Sheezuz... that sons a bitch sounds half out of his freakin' mind, like in need of a visit from home land security.

[aboutime]

We may just be doomed to repeat it! ( https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/George_Santayana)

Why American schools no longer teach American History...http://nypost.com/2017/01/22/why-schools-have-stopped-teaching-american-history/

[darin]

what I don't get is - there are folks here and other places who seem to LIKE the idea. :(

[BoogyMan]

Civil conflict is an idiotic idea, but it would seem that it is the object of many folks dreams both left and right. The hate that divides America is heartbreaking and I fear that the loons have truly taken over the asylum.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Civil conflict is an idiotic idea, but it would seem that it is the object of many folks dreams both left and right. The hate that divides America is heartbreaking and I fear that the loons have truly taken over the asylum.

Many of us speaking about that possibility do so because if pushed a bridge too far-- they that sow the wind will reap a smashing whirlwind in return.
Has nothing to do with that being our wish..
Lets be clear on that but has to do with us warning that the scum now marching with hate, violence and their eager agenda to destroy our history, our pride, our respect for our ancestors may push us too far..
Last time we (Southerners ) were pushed too far-- the results were not to the liking of the pushers even if they did eventually triumph-- they paid a damn high cost. Tyr

[Black Diamond]

Many of us speaking about that possibility do so because if pushed a bridge too far-- they that sow the wind will reap a smashing whirlwind in return.
Has nothing to do with that being our wish..
Lets be clear on that but has to do with us warning that the scum now marching with hate, violence and their eager agenda to destroy our history, our pride, our respect for our ancestors may push us too far..
Last time we (Southerners ) were pushed too far-- the results were not to the liking of the pushers even if they did eventually triumph-- they paid a damn high cost. Tyr
I don't even know if it would be north vs south. You may have those in the north who would side with you. Like a Viet Cong.

[aboutime]

IF, and only IF...anyone in the United States of America attempted to cause, initiate, or use Force to Further Divide this nation. Those responsible would be punished under the Constitution as Anarchists, or members of any group who attempted a Coup upon the Government of the United States. Therefore. Those who take part in any attempt to create a CIVIL WAR (uprising) intended to Divide the nation, would be violating Federal Laws, and could be arrested, and tried in a Federal Court.


By Alex Zakrzewski
3/23/2016 • American History Magazinehttp://www.historynet.com/a-second-u-s-civil-war-inevitable-or-impossible.htm

It will soon be more than one hundred and fifty years since the end of the American Civil War and the nation is once again seemingly irreparably divided. Extreme partisan politics between Republicans and Democrats has created what the President himself has called “a poisonous political climate” that has gridlocked Washington, polarized the electorate and reduced political debate to nothing more than petty mudslinging and ad hominem attacks. Is America merely going through a troubled time or, as some right-wing commentators have been claiming for years, is the country on the verge of a second civil war?

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Why else do you think the left has such extreme hatred of guns?

We all know the answer to that.

You can't fully subjugate a populous that is armed to the teeth.

[Gunny]

what I don't get is - there are folks here and other places who seem to LIKE the idea. :(I'll be clear. I responded to a question in the OP. It didn't say anything about tailoring said answer to the most wishful opinion. The division is clear, as is the violence. That isn't "wanting" it. It's seeing what's there.

There's too much wishful thinking going on. Like, a dialogue. That would assume there was a division and 2-or-more sides..Who's going to admit THAT?

IMO. anyone threatened by a statue needs to stand under it and push. THEN it might hurt you. Otherwise, these crybabies need to go back to serving their Big Mac's and STFU.

[Little-Acorn]

I think Civil War is the wrong term for it, I call it insurrection. Coup might also work.

"Temper Tantrum" is the phrase that comes to mind.

What else would you call the actions of a small number of immature, whining crybabies who can never get their facts straight?

[darin]

What else would you call the actions of a small number of immature, whining crybabies who can never get their facts straight?


We might also call them

http://www.billboard.com/files/media/Democrat-banner-2016-billboard-620.jpg

[michiganFats]

"Temper Tantrum" is the phrase that comes to mind.

What else would you call the actions of a small number of immature, whining crybabies who can never get their facts straight?

I think you're right when it comes to some of the people protesting, they're mad and they don't really know why in many cases and are having a tantrum. Facebook is full of these types of people. I think their movement as a whole though is well thought out and are pursuing specific goals so in the case of their leadership it's not a tantrum, it's insurrection now that antifa is regularly armed.

[Black Diamond]

From Facebook: Are we the only country in history to start a second Civil War because we're offended by the first one? Merica.d

[High_Plains_Drifter]

From Facebook: Are we the only country in history to start a second Civil War because we're offended by the first one? Merica.d
Sometimes simplicity just has a way of reaching up and slapping you in the face.

I'd have to say though, it's only a small handful of mostly paid anarchists and professional rioters that are causing the vast majority of unrest. If George Soros died today and his money to these groups ended, 90% of all this insurrection and statue removal and vandalism would end. If they put all these removals up to a public referendum, I believe removing them wouldbe voted down in the majority of cases. This will all come around to bite the democrats in the ass next year at the ballot box. People will not forget this.

[Abbey Marie]

My tiny sampling from FB leads shows me that even my Trump-hating/liberal friends think it's going too far. Maybe there is hope yet.

[Gunny]

My tiny sampling from FB leads shows me that even my Trump-hating/liberal friends think it's going too far. Maybe there is hope yet.Of course it's going too far. Now define "too far". Where does the Right to be a violent mob when you don't like or agree with something overstep the Law? You don't have a right to riot, loot attack other people and/or destroy property. You have the right to assemble and peaceably demonstrate. If laws are not enforced, there IS no law.

Looking at the two directions such actions can go in, they don't seem to be heading toward a peaceful solution; rather, more and more violence.

There IS a breaking point.

[Kathianne]

My tiny sampling from FB leads shows me that even my Trump-hating/liberal friends think it's going too far. Maybe there is hope yet.

Both extremes have some that are itching for fights. The left also has the anarchists that are primarily interested in destroying government and all signs of capitalism, as that funds the government.

In most cases it's been the left creating the chaos, the right extreme occasionally throwing a few punches in return.

Charlottesville was different. I think much of it lies at the feet of whomever told the police to stand down. The politicos in the state are now fighting that blame out.

[aboutime]

From Facebook: Are we the only country in history to start a second Civil War because we're offended by the first one? Merica.d


Black Diamond. If we really think about it. The only reason so many are still offended by the first one is...Today's, across the board, lack of education, irresponsibility, disrespect, and selfishness fueled by FREE STUFF, DRUGS, ALCOHOL, POT, and LAWLESSNESS that was approved, sanctioned, and pushed by the Clinton, and Obama administrations where they taught their followers that the CONSTITUTION was just an Old Rag they needed to TEAR UP if it offended those WHINERS.

[revelarts]

Why? I'm related to him, junior. He was a brilliant cavalry commander. See where this is going? Southerners respect their families. He fought for what he believed was right AT THE TIME. You revisionists want to hold everyone from a different world to your standards of today.

No wonder none of you dolts ever learn a thing.

Well, seeing that he was also one of the founders and the 1st leader of the one of the country's 1st and worse terrorist organizations, the KKK,
It seems to me inappropriate to name a State Park after him.

and seeing that slavery and race prejudice had been a known moral horror for 100s of years BEFORE the civil war, as attested to by the writings and ACTIONS of various revolutionary heroes, But Nathan and his friends somehow could not SEE their own moral failings in that area even After the abolitionist ...religious and secular... had explained it every light possible, elections and laws had been lost over it, the war had been lost over it, and 400+ years of slaves running away to attain their freedom. (In the nation where FREEDOM is promoted as it's HIGHEST ideal). Somehow he and others were so pitifully blind to the evil of the oppression other human beings and so full of hate that they put on mask and terrorized and murdered those that didn't see it their way.

so sorry gunny, I don't see why he should honored in any way. He should be in the history books definitely, but not honored.

But of course if you think Osama Ben Laden should be honored with a state park in New York in a few years too.
since "He was a brilliant .. commander" and " He was from a different world" and shouldn't be held "to your standards of today" and "He fought for what he believed was right AT THE TIME."
I mean If those are the ONLY or real criteria we're using then ... sure OK.
And every recent rioter in needs a park named after them, or at least marker, since they terrorized for what they believed in right?


Seems we still have quite a ways to go if some folks can't understand why a STATE PARK should NOT be named after a founder and 1st leader of the KKK.