Robert mueller chosen as special counsel

[Black Diamond]

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/doj-appoints-special-counsel-in-wake-of-comey-developments/

[aboutime]

I suspect. No matter how long it takes for an investigation. The DEMOCRATS will almost instantly claim that Mueller is a Liar, and that his Special FINDINGS do not fit with the Demands of the Dems.???

Actually. NO NEED TO START BETTING. We all know the TRUTH won't please Dems at all.

[Kathianne]

This is not a good thing, IMO. Once again, a special prosecutor is looking for criminal activity and if they don't find it on the original inquiry, they tend to look at other things-think about how 'White Water' morphed into Lewinski.

I posted a link a day or two ago that was by I think Andrew McCarthy that gave arguments why a 'special committee' would be a better choice.

I was wrong on the author, it was David Frum:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/05/a-special-prosecutor-is-not-the-answer/526662/

[pete311]

This is not a good thing, IMO.

If you are on the side of truth, it's a good thing. Whatever it may be.

[Black Diamond]

This is not a good thing, IMO. Once again, a special prosecutor is looking for criminal activity and if they don't find it on the original inquiry, they tend to look at other things-think about how 'White Water' morphed into Lewinski.

I posted a link a day or two ago that was by I think Andrew McCarthy that gave arguments why a 'special committee' would be a better choice.

I was wrong on the author, it was David Frum:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/05/a-special-prosecutor-is-not-the-answer/526662/
this could lead to Hillarys head on a stick. Or Obama's.

[Black Diamond]

If you are on the side of truth, it's a good thing. Whatever it may be.
Depends on the special prosecutor. Some would turn this into a witch hunt. I don't see mueller doing that.

[aboutime]

If you are on the side of truth, it's a good thing. Whatever it may be.


PETEY....You are really good at Double-talking. Which version of the word TRUTH would you prefer? Your DNC made-up, so-called, liberal facts, or ACTUAL, PROVEN FACTS?

We all know by now. You have repeated what you call FACTS (lies of liberals) for so long. They (the lies) actually became what you MUST believe in order to be welcomed by other EASILY-LED liberals.

[Gunny]

Special Counsel to a 3-ring circus based nothing. Sure as Hell want THAT on my resume.:rolleyes: What a total joke this sh*t's become.

[Black Diamond]

Special Counsel to a 3-ring circus based nothing. Sure as Hell want THAT on my resume.:rolleyes: What a total joke this sh*t's become.
Mueller is in the twilight of his career. Plus think of the book deals.

[Gunny]

Mueller is in the twilight of his career. Plus think of the book deals.

Still nothing but a bunch of crap. HERE is what Trump is guilty of ... firing a member of the Washington bureaucracy. Not the elected officials. The bloodsuckers doing as little as possible to collect a check. They don't change with each administration Thay are petty, vindictive, and don't like their boat rocked.

Last time it happened Clinton deleted Linda Tripp's position and moved her to different job which a demotion in position. The result of THAT was Monica-gate. Tripp suddenly decided she had a conscience and the people should know. We'd have never heard of it had Clinton not demoted her. Oh, and she didn't take a cut in pay. Not how it works for those civilian government employees.

And before anyone (pete) starts running his suck, I WAS stationed in DC and I know how the system works.

[Kathianne]

Things could not continue as they have the past 10 days, the WH had to get back to business. What's wrong with a 'special prosecutor' is there is no end that can be seen. In this case it's even worse, as it's starting point is the 'election and Russians' and goes from there. Totally open-ended:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/05/robert-mueller-will-serve-as-special-prosecutor-on-russia/527121/


...

Rosenstein wrote in an order (https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/967231/download) that Mueller is authorized to take over the investigation that Comey confirmed to Congress in a March hearing. That includes “any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump” and “any matters that arose or may arise from directly from the investigation.” It also gives Mueller authority to look into other crimes noted under a statute that establishes the special counsel, “such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses; and to conduct appeals arising out of the matter being investigated and/or prosecuted.”


<gpt-ad id="boxright1" targeting-pos="boxright1" class="ad ad-boxright ad-loaded" lazy-load="2" data-object-pk="3" data-object-name="boxright" data-google-query-id="CImxu_Gg-NMCFc1_Ygodp9AGnA" style="display: block; clear: none; position: absolute; right: 0px; top: 0px; transform: translateY(-50%);"><iframe id="google_ads_iframe_/4624/TheAtlanticOnline/channel_politics_3" title="3rd party ad content" name="google_ads_iframe_/4624/TheAtlanticOnline/channel_politics_3" width="300" height="600" scrolling="no" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0" frameborder="0" style="border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; vertical-align: bottom;"></iframe>
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<section id="article-section-3" style="width: 630px; margin: 0px auto; max-width: 630px; padding-right: 330px;">If he believes it is necessary, Mueller “is authorized to prosecute federal crimes arising from the investigation of these matters.”


</section>...

[Kathianne]

Well the starting point seems to be Flynn and Manafort and has been ongoing for months:

http://theweek.com/speedreads/699710/manafort-flynn-are-reportedly-major-figures-fbi-russia-probe

[Gunny]

Things could not continue as they have the past 10 days, the WH had to get back to business. What's wrong with a 'special prosecutor' is there is no end that can be seen. In this case it's even worse, as it's starting point is the 'election and Russians' and goes from there. Totally open-ended:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/05/robert-mueller-will-serve-as-special-prosecutor-on-russia/527121/

It's a waste of time, effort and money and lends credibility to the left/MSM throwing sh*t against the wall.

[Kathianne]

It's a waste of time, effort and money and lends credibility to the left/MSM throwing sh*t against the wall.

and yet there were so many times that Trump could have not thrown gasoline, but did.

[Gunny]

and yet there were so many times that Trump could have not thrown gasoline, but did.

I don't blame him a bit. I'm not all about running with every accusation made as if it was a make a break issue. I am REAL sick of everyone beating this same dead horse saying the same things day in and day out. It's like some live just to find fault -- ANY fault -- with everything he does. If he doesn't do anything, they just make something up. Y'all nag worse than my grandmother, mother and daughter combined.

Now we get to listen to an ongoing forever investigation into ever step he takes. What a bunch of crap.

[Kathianne]

I don't blame him a bit. I'm not all about running with every accusation made as if it was a make a break issue. I am REAL sick of everyone beating this same dead horse saying the same things day in and day out. It's like some live just to find fault -- ANY fault -- with everything he does. If he doesn't do anything, they just make something up. Y'all nag worse than my grandmother, mother and daughter combined.

Now we get to listen to an ongoing forever investigation into ever step he takes. What a bunch of crap.

He agrees with you, but there's a price for doing what he's done. I do agree with this not being the best way to address the problem, it will be a waste of money and time. If he 'succeeds' in finding someone to prosecute, it will damage the country further than a mere 'investigation.'

[Black Diamond]

He agrees with you, but there's a price for doing what he's done. I do agree with this not being the best way to address the problem, it will be a waste of money and time. If he 'succeeds' in finding someone to prosecute, it will damage the country further than a mere 'investigation.'
What if this leads to the prosecution of hillary or Obama?

[Neo]

I suspect. No matter how long it takes for an investigation. The DEMOCRATS will almost instantly claim that Mueller is a Liar, and that his Special FINDINGS do not fit with the Demands of the Dems.???

Actually. NO NEED TO START BETTING. We all know the TRUTH won't please Dems at all.



What's the spread & the over under? :laugh2:

[Kathianne]

What if this leads to the prosecution of hillary or Obama?

I'd never say, 'Never,' but unlikely since she's not in office.

This just was so preventable and I'm amazed that there was no one that could get through to him.

[Neo]

What if this leads to the prosecution of hillary or Obama?


Now THAT'S something I'd bet some coin on, it'll NEVER, I repeat, NEVER happen.

Don't believe me(?), just ask Seth Rich...Oh wait, you can't. He was shot dead in what D.C. detectives ruled as a ROBBERY. Nothing of his was taken, other than his life.

That's murder, not robbery. The real question is why?

Bwahahahahahahaha! :coffee::laugh:

Did I mention that I hate the St. Louis Cardinals? Heh.

[Black Diamond]

Now THAT'S something I'd bet some coin on, it'll NEVER, I repeat, NEVER happen.

Don't believe me(?), just ask Seth Rich...Oh wait, you can't. He was shot dead in what D.C. detectives ruled as a ROBBERY. Nothing of his was taken, other than his life.

That's murder, not robbery. The real question is why?

Bwahahahahahahaha! :coffee::laugh:

Did I mention that I hate the St. Louis Cardinals? Heh.
If they get all of comeys memos or if trump has tapes (big if)

hillary and Obama are far from innocent. Again memo to chucky: Be careful what you wish for.

[NightTrain]

If they get all of comeys memos or if trump has tapes (big if)

hillary and Obama are far from innocent. Again memo to chucky: Be careful what you wish for.



"I accept this responsibility and will discharge it to the best of my ability," Mueller said in a statement

The broad mandate, beyond any specific Trump-Russia connection, also covers "any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation."



Oh, my.

Guess who is intricately tangled up in those emails? I suspect Hillary, Huma, Podesta and Mook just spent several million in retaining the best lawyers money can buy.

Trump just called their bluff. Let the chips fall where they may.

I need to research Mueller and see what kind of cop he is.... hopefully he's hardcore.

[NightTrain]

Now THAT'S something I'd bet some coin on, it'll NEVER, I repeat, NEVER happen.

Don't believe me(?), just ask Seth Rich...Oh wait, you can't. He was shot dead in what D.C. detectives ruled as a ROBBERY. Nothing of his was taken, other than his life.

That's murder, not robbery. The real question is why?

Bwahahahahahahaha! :coffee::laugh:

Did I mention that I hate the St. Louis Cardinals? Heh.

Neo, good to see you again. How's tricks?

[Kathianne]

Did anyone here, much less the President and his entire staff, not know the media was against him at least by January 20th? Seriously?

Now I know many like that President Trump throughout the election was strong, tough, not a politician, would shake things up, would drain the swamp, would lock her up, etc. Many others found his extreme use of 'great,' his bragging about money, his slamming of other presidents including GW, etc., not so endearing.

Yet, to the applause of his core, he continued in many of these types of statements and behaviors after the inauguration. With the stock market going up and more than a few businesses racing to say, "America First" and saying they'd be 'coming home,' he gained some support from those that wanted the best for the country. There were others that were determined to 'resist' and wanted to do anything to get him removed from office. It was easy enough to laugh and ridicule while things were going along for a month or two, when EO's signed and others repealed were going through at a rapid rate. Then came the courts frustrating him on immigration EO, citing his election rhetoric. I and many who are not part of the 'core' understood the legalities, but that doesn't change what happened and likely won't unless the 2nd round makes it to SCOTUS. That was followed by healthcare, when his frustration showed with trying to force Republicans to force it through by a deadline he set. In a pique he said, "Moving onto tax reform," just ignoring the warning from Ryan and others that they would not be able to neutralize the spending without savings from healthcare reform. So, he had to try again, (like immigration reform). Now healthcare is in the Senate where Republicans are saying they will come up with their own plan-no date in sight.

Throughout this period, he kept up his animosity with the press, the investigations by FBI, criticizing the intelligence community as a whole, while railing about the leaks. He berated his press secretary on his suits nearly from the first day. All the while he kept at slamming folks through twitter. He wonders now why it seems so many are out to 'get him?'

I seriously thought he'd either be 'great' or a 'disaster,' but never thought he was suited to the Presidency. Things became a whole lot harder for him to succeed today, with the naming of a special prosecutor. Most people are going to see 'special prosecutor' and feel there's something seriously wrong, otherwise why would this be happening, even before Memorial Day.

I don't think it's beyond the pale to think that there's a possibility that partial reason would be the manner in which Comey was fired and treated following that. It involved using Rod Rosenstein as the first named reason for the firing. Guess who named the prosecutor?

How this will all play out is beyond my guessing powers. I think it's safe to say though, that a change in how the President treats others, whether as individuals or as a group improves, he'll have a better chance.

[BoogyMan]

Nancy Pelosi is already beating the drum of Mueller not being enough (http://thehill.com/homenews/house/333958-pelosi-calls-for-independent-commission-after-special-counsel-appointment).

And another.... (https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2017/live-updates/trump-white-house/trump-comey-and-russia-how-key-washington-players-are-reacting/democrats-say-special-counsel-doesnt-go-far-enough/?utm_term=.7bae3d47ed19)

[Kathianne]

Nancy Pelosi is already beating the drum of Mueller not being enough (http://thehill.com/homenews/house/333958-pelosi-calls-for-independent-commission-after-special-counsel-appointment).

And another.... (https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2017/live-updates/trump-white-house/trump-comey-and-russia-how-key-washington-players-are-reacting/democrats-say-special-counsel-doesnt-go-far-enough/?utm_term=.7bae3d47ed19)

The Democrats and those that are aligned with 'resist' will only settle for Trump gone. It shouldn't happen, it's dangerous. No doubt in my mind that the 'leaks' are hurting the administration, but the real threat is any truth of things contained and very seriously, what Trump tweets. No, they don't matter to his core, but most are not part of the core.

I just read something I found pretty close to my assessment, but it's from "Politico" and many will not like that 'source' though as I said earlier in another post, that says more about them than the article. So, I'll post the link that I wasn't going to post.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/17/trump-white-house-on-edge-238482


White House on edge: 'We are kind of helpless'
Recent scandals have left White House staff feeling besieged.
By JOSH DAWSEY and MATTHEW NUSSBAUM 05/17/2017 12:01 AM EDT

It was, in the words of one senior White House official, the worst day of Trump’s presidency.

White House officials spent early Tuesday wondering who was leaking details of President Donald Trump’s classified conversations with Russian officials about intelligence shared by the Israelis, and moving to contain the fallout ahead of Trump’s planned trip to Jerusalem next week. They spent the evening facing a report that, before he fired FBI director James Comey, Trump directly asked him to stop investigating the Trump campaign’s Russia ties — and worrying what else might yet be revealed.

...

Top White House officials learned of the looming New York Times story about a memo Comey wrote detailing Trump’s request two hours before it went online. Aides rushed to ask Trump what he had actually told Comey. But the White House had no memos or tapes of the meeting to rebut the claims, several officials said. Trump didn’t even give an entire readout of his conversation, leaving staffers “actually unaware of what happened,” one official said.

“It’s not like we were in on the meeting,” this person said. “We had no idea. We still don’t really know what was said.”

Another official laughed when asked if Trump had really “taped” the meeting, as he’s suggested on Twitter: “If so, none of us have heard the tape.” (ME: This may be very good news for the administration.)

...

But inside the White House, there was a struggle to get any surrogates on TV because no one knew what to say or how to defend the story, one White House adviser said. At one point in the evening, Fox News host Bret Baier told viewers that “there are not Republicans willing to go on camera tonight as of yet.”

...

There was a growing realization that Trump had made a number of missteps that hurt him with the intelligence community — and likely with Comey.

Two people familiar with White House discussions said Trump was determined to write a line in the letter firing Comey saying that the FBI director had given him three assurances he wasn’t under investigation. The words, said one White House adviser, “probably will cause him more heartbreak than anything else.” The line, this person said, had worried White House officials after it was printed — but few people saw the letter before it went out.

...

Another person said White House aides learned about Trump’s comments criticizing Comey as a “showboat” as he said them on the air with Lester Holt of NBC— and showed up last Friday morning to the office to see his tweet about “tapes” of Comey’s meetings.

Aides were in meetings in the West Wing while the tweets reverberated, and then Trump walked into the Oval Office.

“They’re in a bad situation,” said one adviser who has known Trump for years. “If people wanted the Comey situation to go away, he did nothing to help that happen.”

Inside the White House on Tuesday night, there was a decision to neither put anyone on TV nor to put out a statement with someone’s name on it. Officials huddled to discuss the upcoming foreign trip, with specifics still not set, and concerns that the adventure will be overshadowed by news in Washington.

White House officials said there would be no more comments Tuesday evening.

“And we are hoping the president doesn’t tweet,” one said. “Fingers crossed.”

[Black Diamond]

The Democrats and those that are aligned with 'resist' will only settle for Trump gone. It shouldn't happen, it's dangerous. No doubt in my mind that the 'leaks' are hurting the administration, but the real threat is any truth of things contained and very seriously, what Trump tweets. No, they don't matter to his core, but most are not part of the core.

I just read something I found pretty close to my assessment, but it's from "Politico" and many will not like that 'source' though as I said earlier in another post, that says more about them than the article. So, I'll post the link that I wasn't going to post.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/17/trump-white-house-on-edge-238482
How did John Dean find out about Nixons secret taping system?

[Kathianne]

How did John Dean find out about Nixons secret taping system?

From what I remember, (I was in hs), he found out after the fact.

So, if the speculation you're going for is that Trump is hiding that from his staff, Ok then. He's got a problem with that, who will those outside of his core believe, Trump or Comey? If Trump didn't say what Comey claims he did and Trump says, "Aha! I have recording!" He'll have to produce all recordings per laws passed after Watergate. I believe that Chaffetz already said yesterday that he'll subpoena any recordings 'if they exist.' Now it's just a matter of time until the special counsel will also. So, he'll be in that position shortly, 'either produce them or he can't use them to prove his innocence'.

[Gunny]

He agrees with you, but there's a price for doing what he's done. I do agree with this not being the best way to address the problem, it will be a waste of money and time. If he 'succeeds' in finding someone to prosecute, it will damage the country further than a mere 'investigation.'

No sale. Obama made unconsti8tutional law and Hillaray flat out violated it. Nothing addressed by the current crop of whiners. Nothing done.

Yet all of a sudden the Dems and Trump-haters are "there's a price to pay". Where were all these crying moonbats when Pelosi weht to meet with Assad against the President's express wishes she nt do so? Obamacare? Benghazi? Hitlery' setting herself up in the unsecure internet business?

So Trump fired Comey. Big damned deal. People get fired every day. Trump talked to russians. As the Head dilomat, chief negotiator and spokesman for this Nation IT'S HIS JOB TO SPEAK TO FOREIGN REPRESENTATIVES. HELL-FUCKING-O?

I hate those fascists on the left even more than I did before, if that's possible. And those who don't like Trump giving passive support by repeating every article and accusation as if they are fact are right in line behind them.

And I don't even like Trump. I find railroad jobs despicable.

[Kathianne]

No sale. Obama made unconsti8tutional law and Hillaray flat out violated it. Nothing addressed by the current crop of whiners. Nothing done.

Yet all of a sudden the Dems and Trump-haters are "there's a price to pay". Where were all these crying moonbats when Pelosi weht to meet with Assad against the President's express wishes she nt do so? Obamacare? Benghazi? Hitlery' setting herself up in the unsecure internet business?

So Trump fired Comey. Big damned deal. People get fired every day. Trump talked to russians. As the Head dilomat, chief negotiator and spokesman for this Nation IT'S HIS JOB TO SPEAK TO FOREIGN REPRESENTATIVES. HELL-FUCKING-O?

I hate those fascists on the left even more than I did before, if that's possible. And those who don't like Trump giving passive support by repeating every article and accusation as if they are fact are right in line behind them.

And I don't even like Trump. I find railroad jobs despicable.

Then other core members and yourself will be happy to know he is blasting away on Twitter this morning. No stopping the digging. I'm sad for the country.

[Black Diamond]

Then other core members and yourself will be happy to know he is blasting away on Twitter this morning. No stopping the digging. I'm sad for the country.
Well it is a witch hunt. Do you think Obama would have started this probe to begin with if Hillary had won ?

[Gunny]

Then other core members and yourself will be happy to know he is blasting away on Twitter this morning. No stopping the digging. I'm sad for the country.Me and what other "core members"?

My point is zooming over your head same as it did with your pointless vote for that moron from NM. This is an easy read. The left/Dems and and anti-Trumpies are going to keep a constant 3-ring circus running for 3 more years, distracting everyone from business.

You're damned right I wouldn't take the BS. I'm sick of it on this board. I can't imagine if I was President on the world stage. I wouldn't take this bullshit laying down either.

You say you feel sorry for this country; yet, you have done what you can to undermine keeping the real threat to it out. You voted 3rd party. And you can't wait to jump on every accusation against Trump. Then you say but you hope he succeeds. Not with support like he's getting. He'll be lucky to survive.

So whose side are you REALLY on?

This isn't about Trump. I can't stand him personally. You never seem to acknowledge that glaringly obvious point. THE Trumpies don't discuss him with me. This is about keeping idiots like Pelosi, Waters, Rangel, Hillary et al and their fascist ideology out of power. I'l say it again .... THAT is the big picture and supercedes petty little personal differences because THAT is what will save this. Giving voice to the opposition does not.

[NightTrain]

Mueller has an impressive resume :


• Born August 7, 1944 in New York City


• Graduated from Princeton University in 1966 and received a master's degree in international relations from New York University the following year


• Served as a Marine Corps officer in Vietnam for three years, receiving a Bronze Star and Purple Heart, among other medals


• Graduated from the University of Virginia School of Law in 1973


• Worked for 12 years (1976-1988) as an investigator and prosecutor for U.S. Attorney offices in Northern California and Boston


• Joined the Justice Department in 1989 as an assistant to then-Attorney General Richard Thornburgh. During his three-year tenure leading the DOJ's criminal division, Mueller oversaw the prosecutions of Panamanian dictator.


• Manuel Noriega and crime boss John Gotti, as well as the investigation into the bombing of Pan Am Flight 103.


• After two years as a partner at the Boston law firm of Hale and Dorr, Mueller rejoined public service in 1995 and went on to work for the U.S. Attorney's offices in Washington D.C. and Northern California.


• Was nominated to be FBI Director by President George W. Bush on July 5, 2001 and officially assumed that position on Sept. 4. During his tenure, Mueller helped turn the FBI from a criminal investigative bureau into a counterterrorism and counterintelligence unit.


• In 2004, Mueller, along with then-Deputy Attorney General James Comey, threatened to resign over the Bush administration's program of warrantless surveillance. Bush ultimately agreed to changes in the program and both men stayed on.


• Mueller left the FBI on Sept. 4, 2013, having served two years beyond his ten-year term at the request of President Barack Obama. He is the second longest-serving FBI director in the bureau's history, behind only J. Edgar Hoover.


• Since leaving the FBI, Mueller has been a partner at the Washington D.C. law firm WilmerHale. He was expected to resign from the firm after being appointed special counsel to the FBI's Russia investigation.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/05/17/who-is-robert-mueller-ex-fbi-chief-to-oversee-russia-probe-as-special-counsel.html


He's handled some very large & complex cases and has demonstrated that he'll call them as he sees them. Since we're going this route, I don't think anyone else would be more qualified.

The democrats had better have their house in order, because that's where this is all going to lead back to - and just in time for the 2018 elections. :coffee:

[Kathianne]

Me and what other "core members"?

My point is zooming over your head same as it did with your pointless vote for that moron from NM. This is an easy read. The left/Dems and and anti-Trumpies are going to keep a constant 3-ring circus running for 3 more years, distracting everyone from business.

You're damned right I wouldn't take the BS. I'm sick of it on this board. I can't imagine if I was President on the world stage. I wouldn't take this bullshit laying down either.

You say you feel sorry for this country; yet, you have done what you can to undermine keeping the real threat to it out. You voted 3rd party. And you can't wait to jump on every accusation against Trump. Then you say but you hope he succeeds. Not with support like he's getting. He'll be lucky to survive.

So whose side are you REALLY on?

This isn't about Trump. I can't stand him personally. You never seem to acknowledge that glaringly obvious point. THE Trumpies don't discuss him with me. This is about keeping idiots like Pelosi, Waters, Rangel, Hillary et al and their fascist ideology out of power. I'l say it again .... THAT is the big picture and supercedes petty little personal differences because THAT is what will save this. Giving voice to the opposition does not.


I don't like Trump, thought he would cause many problems, which he is. With that said, I want him to succeed in policies. That can't happen when he makes it all about him, which he does. He picks fights at every turn, even when it's unnecessary like Comey. He fired him, fine. He just couldn't shut up about him. So, he got a response, shocking. If he did the same to you bet it would have been much more than Comey did.

You only think you detest him, etc., other than Rick, who goes out of his way to find items he uses to sell the positives, you are the biggest defender. Sorry, I don't vote for someone when I think they'll be a disaster. That is what I thought of Trump. That is what I thought of Hillary. Thus I voted for someone who wouldn't win, but I still voted. Let the statisticians keep track of how many are starting to say, "Pox on all of them."

[Gunny]

I don't like Trump, thought he would cause many problems, which he is. With that said, I want him to succeed in policies. That can't happen when he makes it all about him, which he does. He picks fights at every turn, even when it's unnecessary like Comey. He fired him, fine. He just couldn't shut up about him. So, he got a response, shocking. If he did the same to you bet it would have been much more than Comey did.

You only think you detest him, etc., other than Rick, who goes out of his way to find items he uses to sell the positives, you are the biggest defender. Sorry, I don't vote for someone when I think they'll be a disaster. That is what I thought of Trump. That is what I thought of Hillary. Thus I voted for someone who wouldn't win, but I still voted. Let the statisticians keep track of how many are starting to say, "Pox on all of them."

Where exactly do I defend Trump? Is that what they call calling bullshit against bogus allegations these days?

Doesn't matter if you voted. Your vote was selfish and could have cost an election that put Hillary in office. That is you putting your idealism ahead of the big picture, the welfare of this Nation, and may very well have cost us this Nation as we know it in its entirety. That's making this Nation all about YOU.

Aiding and abetting unproven accusations pulled out of the a-hole du jour is hardly wanting Trump to succeed.

Make no mistake ... I do NOT defend the man. This isn't about Trump to me. It's about squashing Dems and keeping them out. When I got handed a weapon the Gunny didn't ask whether or not I wanted that particular one. I had to use what was given me.

We got Trump. Get over it. I think he's being stupid. I;d blow off all y'all's accusations and continue to move forward.

[Kathianne]

Where exactly do I defend Trump? Is that what they call calling bullshit against bogus allegations these days?

Doesn't matter if you voted. Your vote was selfish and could have cost an election that put Hillary in office. That is you putting your idealism ahead of the big picture, the welfare of this Nation, and may very well have cost us this Nation as we know it in its entirety. That's making this Nation all about YOU.

Aiding and abetting unproven accusations pulled out of the a-hole du jour is hardly wanting Trump to succeed.

Make no mistake ... I do NOT defend the man. This isn't about Trump to me. It's about squashing Dems and keeping them out. When I got handed a weapon the Gunny didn't ask whether or not I wanted that particular one. I had to use what was given me.

We got Trump. Get over it. I think he's being stupid. I;d blow off all y'all's accusations and continue to move forward.

I did not vote out of selfishness, that would be someone claiming Trump was terrible, but would vote for him to spite others. I don't think though that is what you did. You like many things about him, you've defended him when only the core doesn't recognize he's not gone off the reservation, he's blowing it up.

You are trying to split hairs when saying you don't support the 'man', it's a man that is doing what he's doing and he now is President of the United States of America. You helped elect him.

[Black Diamond]

I did not vote out of selfishness, that would be someone claiming Trump was terrible, but would vote for him to spite others. I don't think though that is what you did. You like many things about him, you've defended him when only the core doesn't recognize he's not gone off the reservation, he's blowing it up.

You are trying to split hairs when saying you don't support the 'man', it's a man that is doing what he's doing and he now is President of the United States of America. You helped elect him.
And the left is innocent in this matter? Every time a dem gets a microphone in his/her face, the words collision and Russia are uttered. Then coverup. This was begun by Obama in an attempt to delegitimize the election of trump and the presidency of trump. And the dems picked up the torch after he left.

[Kathianne]

And the left is innocent in this matter? Every time a dem gets a microphone in his/her face, the words collision and Russia are uttered. Then coverup. This was begun by Obama in an attempt to delegitimize the election of trump and the presidency of trump. And the dems picked up the torch after he left.

No, the left is certainly firing up the Democrats in Congress, they are acting against the interests of the country. I give them no quarter, I foolishly expected better from the more 'logical' right. My bad.

[Gunny]

I did not vote out of selfishness, that would be someone claiming Trump was terrible, but would vote for him to spite others. I don't think though that is what you did. You like many things about him, you've defended him when only the core doesn't recognize he's not gone off the reservation, he's blowing it up.

You are trying to split hairs when saying you don't support the 'man', it's a man that is doing what he's doing and he now is President of the United States of America. You helped elect him.

Sure you did. The choice was Trump or Hillary. Hillary is evil. She had to be kept out no matter what or the Supreme Court and who knows what else would have fallen to the Dems. You threw your vote away for selfish reasons claiming to stand on some principle nobody gives a crap about. You only get to have those principles with freedom which the left wants to take away. I voted for McCain and I can't stand the idiot.

I'm not splitting hairs. I support the position. I'm not a civilian like you. You salute the rank, not the man.

[Gunny]

No, the left is certainly firing up the Democrats in Congress, they are acting against the interests of the country. I give them no quarter, I foolishly expected better from the more 'logical' right. My bad.

Really? Seems to me if you expect better, you should act better. Trump is being attcked by the Dems AND the right. And I DO agree in expecting better. I expect better of people than sniping at the representative of their own party along with a bunch of loser Dems.

[Kathianne]

Sure you did. The choice was Trump or Hillary. Hillary is evil. She had to be kept out no matter what or the Supreme Court and who knows what else would have fallen to the Dems. You threw your vote away for selfish reasons claiming to stand on some principle nobody gives a crap about. You only get to have those principles with freedom which the left wants to take away. I voted for McCain and I can't stand the idiot.

I'm not splitting hairs. I support the position. I'm not a civilian like you. You salute the rank, not the man.


Sorry Gunny, you do not get to tell me that I can only vote for one of two, when there are over a dozen on the ballot. I would not vote for someone I thought would not be a good president, which was either of the 'two' candidates you by some unknown power, think you can decree.

Facing the reality of one of those two being elected, I chose to vote for 'not one of those two.' No, wouldn't want that person elected, it was totally a lose/lose election choice.

Who's fault was that? Thank gosh we don't have a Rubio or Cruz or Walker or any of the others. We got Trump-but not with my vote.

Oh for the record, I don't give a crap whether or not anyone else give a crap about my principles. :laugh2:

You keep voting for people you don't like, it makes tons of sense.

[Black Diamond]

No, the left is certainly firing up the Democrats in Congress, they are acting against the interests of the country. I give them no quarter, I foolishly expected better from the more 'logical' right. My bad.
Yeah but you keep saying this is trumps fault. Obama started this crap.

And imagine if in 2009, every time a republican had a microphone in their face they said the words "Obama", "Kenya" and "birth certificate" somewhere in every sentence.

Hell. Maybe they should have done that. Maybe we wouldn't have Obamacare.

[Black Diamond]

Really? Seems to me if you expect better, you should act better. Trump is being attcked by the Dems AND the right. And I DO agree in expecting better. I expect better of people than sniping at the representative of their own party along with a bunch of loser Dems.
It's not her party.

[Kathianne]

Yeah but you keep saying this is trumps fault. Obama started this crap.

And imagine if in 2009, every time a republican had a microphone in their face they said the words "Obama", "Kenya" and "birth certificate" somewhere in every sentence.

Hell. Maybe they should have done that. Maybe we wouldn't have Obamacare.

Holy Hell! Trump won! Handily. Legally. He got the job!

When Obama won, the 'right' extreme was full of things like Kenya! Muslim! Birth Certificate! Obama laughed and ignored and pushed through Obamacare. They kept at it for years, he did not respond-sometimes surrogates made fun of the noisemakers, having them go crazy. Trump should have treated the crazies the same. He didn't.

Then he moved from the crazies to going nutters on intel community, media!, going full blown crazy over leaks, while apparently going after his own staff. You all keep talking about 'Obama leftovers' but why doesn't Trump have those people gone and replaced? That might be a better use of his time than tweeting, don't you think?

Well guess where the leaks are likely coming from? Staff and intel folks. It's Washington, the only thing there's more of than bars are reporters.

[Black Diamond]

Holy Hell! Trump won! Handily. Legally. He got the job!

When Obama won, the 'right' extreme was full of things like Kenya! Muslim! Birth Certificate! Obama laughed and ignored and pushed through Obamacare. They kept at it for years, he did not respond-sometimes surrogates made fun of the noisemakers, having them go crazy. Trump should have treated the crazies the same. He didn't.

Then he moved from the crazies to going nutters on intel community, media!, going full blown crazy over leaks, while apparently going after his own staff. You all keep talking about 'Obama leftovers' but why doesn't Trump have those people gone and replaced? That might be a better use of his time than tweeting, don't you think?

Well guess where the leaks are likely coming from? Staff and intel folks. It's Washington, the only thing there's more of than bars are reporters.
Links to republican congressmen and senators saying "Muslim", "Kenyan"" birth certificate" I'll wait.

[Black Diamond]

Holy Hell! Trump won! Handily. Legally. He got the job!

When Obama won, the 'right' extreme was full of things like Kenya! Muslim! Birth Certificate! Obama laughed and ignored and pushed through Obamacare. They kept at it for years, he did not respond-sometimes surrogates made fun of the noisemakers, having them go crazy. Trump should have treated the crazies the same. He didn't.

Then he moved from the crazies to going nutters on intel community, media!, going full blown crazy over leaks, while apparently going after his own staff. You all keep talking about 'Obama leftovers' but why doesn't Trump have those people gone and replaced? That might be a better use of his time than tweeting, don't you think?

Well guess where the leaks are likely coming from? Staff and intel folks. It's Washington, the only thing there's more of than bars are reporters.
And then you may want to tell the democrats who are trying to push the idea trump and Putin stole the election what you said im your first sentence.

[Kathianne]

It's not her party.

As the saying goes, "I didn't leave the party, the party left me." Bottom line is that I found myself in the strange position of seeing a train wreck was coming, but just couldn't get on it. I pretty quickly realized that Trump would likely win, though it seemed impossible. That he actually won POTUS position, well that was something.

I just wish he'd be the person so many thought he would. I didn't get 'it,' but truly hoped I'd have to say that I would vote for him in 2020. No, I didn't expect him to be gracious or act 'Presidential,' but did think he'd get it together enough to get things done. It may still happen, but it doesn't look like it now.

Last night a letter was released from WH in Trump's name, basically said that he hoped that the special counsel would find, as he knows is the case, that there was no collusion with his campaign and Russians and it would be done in an expedited manner.

Today he's calling it a witch hunt on twitter and whining at the unfairness of it all.

[Kathianne]

And then you may want to tell the democrats who are trying to push the idea trump and Putin stole the election what you said im your first sentence.

and Trump and his core should be thanking the appointment of a special counsel, no matter how feigned the thanks, that there is this chance to prove them liars.

Again, I don't think this should have happened, but one cannot be tossing crap the way Trump does and be shocked when other branches assert their 'powers,' no matter how unfair it may seem.

[Black Diamond]

As the saying goes, "I didn't leave the party, the party left me." Bottom line is that I found myself in the strange position of seeing a train wreck was coming, but just couldn't get on it. I pretty quickly realized that Trump would likely win, though it seemed impossible. That he actually won POTUS position, well that was something.

I just wish he'd be the person so many thought he would. I didn't get 'it,' but truly hoped I'd have to say that I would vote for him in 2020. No, I didn't expect him to be gracious or act 'Presidential,' but did think he'd get it together enough to get things done. It may still happen, but it doesn't look like it now.

Last night a letter was released from WH in Trump's name, basically said that he hoped that the special counsel would find, as he knows is the case, that there was no collusion with his campaign and Russians and it would be done in an expedited manner.

Today he's calling it a witch hunt on twitter and whining at the unfairness of it all.
His tweet is actually correct this time.

[Gunny]

Sorry Gunny, you do not get to tell me that I can only vote for one of two, when there are over a dozen on the ballot. I would not vote for someone I thought would not be a good president, which was either of the 'two' candidates you by some unknown power, think you can decree.

Facing the reality of one of those two being elected, I chose to vote for 'not one of those two.' No, wouldn't want that person elected, it was totally a lose/lose election choice.

Who's fault was that? Thank gosh we don't have a Rubio or Cruz or Walker or any of the others. We got Trump-but not with my vote.

Oh for the record, I don't give a crap whether or not anyone else give a crap about my principles. :laugh2:

You keep voting for people you don't like, it makes tons of sense.

I didn't tell you who to vote for. You can toss that red herring out when you want. I DO have as much right to my opinion as you do yours. You can also forget THAT particular "reality" argument. Reality is you gambled with putting Hillary in office. You make some imortance of "you voted". You as well not have.

ANd if you're feeling lonely in the boat, don't. My daughter voted for the same socialist moron you did.

And if you didn't give a crap, you wouldn't bother putting them on the board.

[Kathianne]

Links to republican congressmen and senators saying "Muslim", "Kenyan"" birth certificate" I'll wait.

I specified where the catcalls were coming from, not chasing your strawman. Trump certainly enjoyed getting on radio or TV to speak about those tidbits. Shocking that there are Obama supporters that harbor hostility, much like so many of Trumps supporters are getting so tired of it.

I have important reasons for wanting Trump to lead the country successfully-we all do. What I don't have is a personal reason for defending indefensible behaviors.

[Black Diamond]

I specified where the catcalls were coming from, not chasing your strawman. Trump certainly enjoyed getting on radio or TV to speak about those tidbits. Shocking that there are Obama supporters that harbor hostility, much like so many of Trumps supporters are getting so tired of it.

I have important reasons for wanting Trump to lead the country successfully-we all do. What I don't have is a personal reason for defending indefensible behaviors.
How is it a straw man? Dems are pushing the idea trumps election was illegitimate. No different from Birthers saying Obama's election was illegitimate. Difference is I don't remember republican members of congress and senate saying Obama was illegitimate, but today democrat members of congress and senate s imply it left and right about trump.

[Kathianne]

How is it a straw man? Dems are pushing the idea trumps election was illegitimate. No different from Birthers saying Obama's election was illegitimate. Difference is I don't remember republican members of congress and senate saying Obama was illegitimate, but today democrats imply it left and right about trump.

I think one would need to look at the type of people who made up the majority at the time of the Republican Party. They would not be applauding congressional members that acted the way Schumer, Waters, Pelosi, etc., are. That's not true of the far left. It may no longer be true of many of those now a majority or at least significant segment of the Republican Party.

I'm pretty sure that there is now a schism amongst those that consider themselves 'Republicans.' That will eventually sort itself out.

[Black Diamond]

And while I agree with trumps tweet about a witch hunt, the tweeting should stop. congress should refuse to pass anything until trump closes his fucking account.

[Kathianne]

And while I agree with trumps tweet about a witch hunt, the tweeting should stop. congress should refuse to pass anything until trump closes his fucking account.

Unlike Trump's EO regarding immigration and his firing of Comey, I'm pretty sure that your suggestion would not be legal, it would be a first amendment violation.

He should do so because it's the right thing to do.

[Black Diamond]

Unlike Trump's EO regarding immigration and his firing of Comey, I'm pretty sure that your suggestion would not be legal, it would be a first amendment violation.

He should do so because it's the right thing to do.
I was afraid of minor details like that. :cool:

[Russ]

I don't like the idea of the Special Counsel because, like several people said, once they are appointed they will feel like they have to find something. However, given that one was appointed, I think Mueller is a good choice. Members of both parties are saying they respect him and he will be good.

If it does nothing more than get the investigation to come to a conclusion within a few 3 months, then I think it is a good thing.

I am conservative and support Trump, but would be fine with a fair investigation, even if it finds something terrible and even if it causes Trump to resign. I can live with that. I don't think the same can be said about Dems, though. I would bet the farm that if the investigation concludes in Trump's favor, then Dems will howl like banshees, say "it's not fair" and "its a coverup" about a million times, call for Mueller's head (even though they are praising him now), and start a new bunch of protests demanding that a new replacement special counsel be appointed. Dems are such hypocritical twits!