WikiLeaks Vault 7 Leak Claims CIA Bugs ‘Factory Fresh’ iPhones

[jimnyc]

WikiLeaks Vault 7 Leak Claims CIA Bugs ‘Factory Fresh’ iPhones

A new WikiLeaks Vault 7 leak titled “Dark Matter” claims, with unreleased documents, that the Central Intelligence Agency has been bugging “factory fresh” iPhones since at least 2008. WikiLeaks further claims that the CIA has the capability to permanently bug iPhones, even if their operating systems are deleted or replaced.

The documents are expected to be released in the next 24-hours. The announced was made after a “press briefing” that WikiLeaks promoted on its Twitter.

Rest here - http://heavy.com/news/2017/03/wikileaks-vault-7-leak-cia-bugs-iphones-factory-fresh-darkmatter-darkseaskies/

[pete311]

That would mean it was in the hardware. If that is the case then China is involved and Apple must know. Sounds a bit far fetched at the moment.

[jimnyc]

That would mean it was in the hardware. If that is the case then China is involved and Apple must know. Sounds a bit far fetched at the moment.

That was my first thought too - "how is it FACTORY fresh..."

I tend to doubt that, quite frankly. But I DO believe that perhaps they somehow have gotten access to updates and such, and have ways to back end into the phones. I seriously doubt Apple would help, seeing as they fought the govt. already.

[Gunny]

That was my first thought too - "how is it FACTORY fresh..."

I tend to doubt that, quite frankly. But I DO believe that perhaps they somehow have gotten access to updates and such, and have ways to back end into the phones. I seriously doubt Apple would help, seeing as they fought the govt. already.There's no mystery here. Even if you think you are disabling your GPS you ain't. They can turn it back on without you knowing. They can also track which cell towers you ping off of. If you're going to commit a crime, leave the electronics at home.

Unless they changed the rules, technically, the CIA cannot operate within the US or against US citizens. We all know they do unless you live under a mushroom in the middle of Arkansas ... 0h wait ... didn't we have a president from there? Apparently they sell cigars ....:laugh2:

[jimnyc]

There's no mystery here. Even if you think you are disabling your GPS you ain't. They can turn it back on without you knowing. They can also track which cell towers you ping off of. If you're going to commit a crime, leave the electronics at home.

Unless they changed the rules, technically, the CIA cannot operate within the US or against US citizens. We all know they do unless you live under a mushroom in the middle of Arkansas ... 0h wait ... didn't we have a president from there? Apparently they sell cigars ....:laugh2:

Yeah, I know. I don't give a crap if they monitor me. And yups, if I'm about to commit my usual crimes, I leave ways to track me at home that day. :dance:

[Black Diamond]

i think we are all wiretapped. A computer gathers everything you say on the phone; everything you type online. If you say something bad that threatens national security, the president, etc, it alerts the NSA. Computer is programmed to look for words and phrases. Then the NSA evaluates what was said (computers don't understand context yet).

This is all fine and good if you have people at the top with scruples. Those who don't have an enemies list. Those who cannot be compromised.

[Gunny]

Yeah, I know. I don't give a crap if they monitor me. And yups, if I'm about to commit my usual crimes, I leave ways to track me at home that day. :dance:

I can get two word commentary out of my 4 years old granddaughter. I think pete is comming a crime, phone in hand, and posting.:laugh2:

[aboutime]

PLEASE, EVERYBODY. Think about this.

Why should anyone be surprised with anything we hear about how the Govt. gathers information about US?
NOW, the reality.....WHO GAVE US OUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER?
Who collects our Taxes every April 15th?

NUFF SAID. Think!

[Gunny]

PLEASE, EVERYBODY. Think about this.

Why should anyone be surprised with anything we hear about how the Govt. gathers information about US?
NOW, the reality.....WHO GAVE US OUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER?
Who collects our Taxes every April 15th?

NUFF SAID. Think!


I think we're dinosaurs, AT. I get the idea ComSec is above the concept level of most people nowadays. They can't keep their mouths shut for sh*t, then cry like babies when someone repeats what their blabber mouth hung on the laundry line.

[revelarts]

Isn't there base code below the operating system level?
Also aren't even most "factory fresh" hard drives running some minimal software?

As far as Apple knowing about it. well when the whistle blower came out and talked about the NSA Splitters at AT&T offices the only ones at the company that apparently knew about those were "need to know" employees.

Plus I suspect that if many people here worked in some key areas of tech company and were approached by a representative of the CIA or NSA or the Defense Dept. who flashed a badge, had an America 1st lapel pin and said "SON you want to PROTECT YOUR COUNTRY from foreign devils don'tcha?" several would snap to attention and do whatever they were asked, and never mumble a word of it. But what about those that wouldn't? Well do you think the gov't might have ways of influencing people's decisions in those areas.

one last scenario.
"Factor Fresh" do you folks remember the STUXSNET virus that the U.S. and Israel used to literally mechanically disable the Iranian centrifuges? those Iranian computers that ran those machines were completely OFF the grid, isolated from all outside networks. but the U.S. and Israeli spies were able to get people inside those highly secure facilities to Physically load destructive software. Is it that hard to imagine the CIA getting Chinese Apple factory workers ...who are so low paid and overworked that some kill themselves on the job... to HELP the CIA..US Gov't.. from time to time.... for some small compensation?

BTW I'm vaguely remembering a story i read sometime before 2010, about an Intel whistle blower who came forward to a newspaper reporter. During an initial meeting they were driving down a road talking and the Reporters I-phone rang. the Intel whistle blower grabbed the phone and tossed it out the window, and reminded him that he'd never not talk to him if he had a phone especially an I-phone.

it's vague memory and i doubt I'd be able to dig up the story but it struck at the time so it stuck. the only phones over the years that i've heard that are fairly secure are blackberries. so much so that the saudi Gov't or maybe Dubai, band the use of them because they couldn't track and or break into them at one point. I read some business news writers talk about not taking phones to China or Germany and several other countries and that many Business executives don't carry their personal/Biz phones overseas because they know they have been/can be hacked not only by foreign gov'ts but also other businesses in biz espionage.




https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/03/technology/nso-group-how-spy-tech-firms-let-governments-see-everything-on-a-smartphone.html?_r=0

How Spy Tech Firms Let Governments See Everything on a Smartphone

By NICOLE PERLROTH (https://www.nytimes.com/by/nicole-perlroth)<time class="dateline" datetime="2016-09-07T16:52:11-04:00" itemprop="dateModified" content="2016-09-07T16:52:11-04:00" style="white-space: nowrap; font-size: 0.6875rem; line-height: 0.75rem; font-family: nyt-cheltenham-sh, georgia, 'times new roman', times, serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); margin-left: 0px;">SEPT. 2, 2016</time>
Continue reading the main story (https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/03/technology/nso-group-how-spy-tech-firms-let-governments-see-everything-on-a-smartphone.html?_r=0#story-continues-1)SAN FRANCISCO — Want to invisibly spy on 10 iPhone (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/i/iphone/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) owners without their knowledge? Gather their every keystroke, sound, message and location? That will cost you $650,000, plus a $500,000 setup fee with an Israeli outfit called the NSO Group. You can spy on more people if you would like — just check out the company’s price list.
The NSO Group is one of a number of companies that sell surveillance tools (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/30/technology/governments-turn-to-commercial-spyware-to-intimidate-dissidents.html) that can capture all the activity on a smartphone, like a user’s location and personal contacts. These tools can even turn the phone into a secret recording device.
Since its founding six years ago, the NSO Group has kept a low profile. But last month, security researchers caught its spyware trying to gain access (http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2016/08/26/world/europe/ap-eu-iphone-spyware.html) to the iPhone of a human rights activist in the United Arab Emirates. They also discovered a second target, a Mexican journalist who wrote about corruption in the Mexican government....

[aboutime]

Isn't there base code below the operating system level?
Also aren't even most "factory fresh" hard drives running some minimal software?

As far was Apple knowing about it. well when the whistle blower came out and talked about the NSA Splitters at AT&T offices the only ones at the company that apparently knew about those were "need to know" employees.

Plus I suspect that if many people here worked in some key areas of tech company and were approached by a representative of the CIA or NSA or the Defense Dept. who flashed a badge, had an America 1st lapel pin and said "SON you want to PROTECT YOUR COUNTRY for foreign devils don'tcha?" several would snap to attention and do whatever they were asked, and never mumble a word of it. But what about those that wouldn't? Well do you think the gov't might have ways of influencing people's decisions in those areas.

one last scenario.
the "factor Fresh" do you folks remember the STUXSNET virus that the U.S. and Israel used to literally mechanically disable the Iranian centrifuges? those Iranian computers that ran to machines were completely OFF the grid, isolated from all outside networks. but the U.S. and Israeli spies were able to get people inside those highly secure facilities to psychically load destructive software. Is that hard to imagine the CIA getting Chinese Apple factory workers ...who are so low paid and overworked that some kill themselves on the job... to HELP the CIA..US Gov't.. from time to time.... for some small compensation?

BTW I vaguely remembering a story i read sometime before 2010, about an Intel whistle blower who came forward to a newspaper reporter. During an initial meeting they were driving down a road talking and the Reporters I-phone rang. the Intel whistle blower grabbed the phone and tossed it out the window, and reminded him that he never not talk to him if he had a phone especially an I-phone.

it's vague memory and i doubt I'd be able to dig up the story but it struck at the time so it stuck. the only phones over the years that i've heard that are fairly secure are blackberries. so much so that the saudi Gov't or maybe Dubai, band the use of them because they couldn't track and or break into them at one point. I read some business news writers talk about not taking phones to China or Germany and several other countries and that many Business executives don't carry their personal/Biz phones overseas because they know they have been/can be hacked not only by foreign gov'ts but also other businesses in biz espionage.

rev. All of that...If I May, is nothing but PIE IN THE SKY thinking now.
Since the Kennedy years, and probably back into the Eisenhower years. Americans have UNKNOWINGLY been monitored, watched, listened to, followed, and become the targets of not only Govt. agencies, but even civilian agencies.
NONE of this news is, by any means new.
I can promise you, and others. Based on my years in the military, and the access I had..which must remain just that...former access. THIS IS NOT NEW.
If you, or others need proof, or....a source....

http://www.cf2r.org/fr/notes-historiques/the-intelligence-life-of-ian-fleming.php

And everybody thought 007 was a fictional character???

[Gunny]

Isn't there base code below the operating system level?
Also aren't even most "factory fresh" hard drives running some minimal software?

As far was Apple knowing about it. well when the whistle blower came out and talked about the NSA Splitters at AT&T offices the only ones at the company that apparently knew about those were "need to know" employees.

Plus I suspect that if many people here worked in some key areas of tech company and were approached by a representative of the CIA or NSA or the Defense Dept. who flashed a badge, had an America 1st lapel pin and said "SON you want to PROTECT YOUR COUNTRY for foreign devils don'tcha?" several would snap to attention and do whatever they were asked, and never mumble a word of it. But what about those that wouldn't? Well do you think the gov't might have ways of influencing people's decisions in those areas.

one last scenario.
"Factor Fresh" do you folks remember the STUXSNET virus that the U.S. and Israel used to literally mechanically disable the Iranian centrifuges? those Iranian computers that ran those machines were completely OFF the grid, isolated from all outside networks. but the U.S. and Israeli spies were able to get people inside those highly secure facilities to Physically load destructive software. Is it that hard to imagine the CIA getting Chinese Apple factory workers ...who are so low paid and overworked that some kill themselves on the job... to HELP the CIA..US Gov't.. from time to time.... for some small compensation?

BTW I'm vaguely remembering a story i read sometime before 2010, about an Intel whistle blower who came forward to a newspaper reporter. During an initial meeting they were driving down a road talking and the Reporters I-phone rang. the Intel whistle blower grabbed the phone and tossed it out the window, and reminded him that he'd never not talk to him if he had a phone especially an I-phone.

it's vague memory and i doubt I'd be able to dig up the story but it struck at the time so it stuck. the only phones over the years that i've heard that are fairly secure are blackberries. so much so that the saudi Gov't or maybe Dubai, band the use of them because they couldn't track and or break into them at one point. I read some business news writers talk about not taking phones to China or Germany and several other countries and that many Business executives don't carry their personal/Biz phones overseas because they know they have been/can be hacked not only by foreign gov'ts but also other businesses in biz espionage.

You're missing the point, Rev. Sure, someone can hack my account. They'll get to read all my DP posts. I don't even shop on line. I have ONE email account I check about every 6 months. IF you are going to put the info out there ? Expect it to be used against you. Only a couple of people on this board know any actual factual information about me. Look at how I, and most of the vets --and I can only speak for them insofar as the board is concerned -- post. We talk a lot and tell you absolutely NOTHING that isn't common knowledge.

You think there's not somebody listening to you? Doesn't matter whether or not you think it's legal. Talk to the wrong people and say the wrong words. You're head will pop right up on the radar screen. You might not like it, but it's for a greater good.

Point is, if you keep your mouth shut, no one knows anything.

[Black Diamond]

You're missing the point, Rev. Sure, someone can hack my account. They'll get to read all my DP posts. I don't even shop on line. I have ONE email account I check about every 6 months. IF you are going to put the info out there ? Expect it to be used against you. Only a couple of people on this board know any actual factual information about me. Look at how I, and most of the vets --and I can only speak for them insofar as the board is concerned -- post. We talk a lot and tell you absolutely NOTHING that isn't common knowledge.

You think there's not somebody listening to you? Doesn't matter whether or not you think it's legal. Talk to the wrong people and say the wrong words. You're head will pop right up on the radar screen. You might not like it, but it's for a greater good.

Point is, if you keep your mouth shut, no one knows anything.
the bolded assumes those looking will not use what you say for political reasons. Or to smear and ruin you. It assumes those watching have scruples.

[aboutime]

the bolded assumes those looking will not use what you say for political reasons. Or to smear and ruin you. It assumes those watching have scruples.

Black Diamond. I suspect gunny did that BOLD with 'tongue in cheek'. We all know...there is no such thing...anymore, called scruples. Not from the Govt.:laugh:

[revelarts]

rev. All of that...If I May, is nothing but PIE IN THE SKY thinking now.
Since the Kennedy years, and probably back into the Eisenhower years. Americans have UNKNOWINGLY been monitored, watched, listened to, followed, and become the targets of not only Govt. agencies, but even civilian agencies.
NONE of this news is, by any means new.
I can promise you, and others. Based on my years in the military, and the access I had..which must remain just that...former access. THIS IS NOT NEW.
If you, or others need proof, or....a source....



the options i mentioned for how they might do it are not pie in the sky.
But I have no problem understanding that the gov't has been spying on as many people as it possible could for a LONG time.

Back in the 1980s i was told about the "project echelon" which tapped the OLD phone system and was a somewhat international project.

but of course when i told folks about that I was called a "conspiracy theorist". But surp[rise surprise it was real.
It's still amazing to me that after all of the public revelations that many people find this or that revelation " HARD TO BELIEVE". I'm not sure why it's "hard to believe" that the U.S. gov't is illegally spying on U.S. citizens and corps in by hook and by crook, everyday.
the head of the Homeland security I believe told everyone that the internet of things is/will be spying on us in our homes in VARIOUS ways.
I mean Who has to say it before "IT"S EASY TO BELIEVE" that the gov't are creeps and daily acting corruptly?

[jimnyc]

Isn't there base code below the operating system level?
Also aren't even most "factory fresh" hard drives running some minimal software?

As far was Apple knowing about it. well when the whistle blower came out and talked about the NSA Splitters at AT&T offices the only ones at the company that apparently knew about those were "need to know" employees.

Plus I suspect that if many people here worked in some key areas of tech company and were approached by a representative of the CIA or NSA or the Defense Dept. who flashed a badge, had an America 1st lapel pin and said "SON you want to PROTECT YOUR COUNTRY for foreign devils don'tcha?" several would snap to attention and do whatever they were asked, and never mumble a word of it. But what about those that wouldn't? Well do you think the gov't might have ways of influencing people's decisions in those areas.

one last scenario.
"Factor Fresh" do you folks remember the STUXSNET virus that the U.S. and Israel used to literally mechanically disable the Iranian centrifuges? those Iranian computers that ran those machines were completely OFF the grid, isolated from all outside networks. but the U.S. and Israeli spies were able to get people inside those highly secure facilities to Physically load destructive software. Is it that hard to imagine the CIA getting Chinese Apple factory workers ...who are so low paid and overworked that some kill themselves on the job... to HELP the CIA..US Gov't.. from time to time.... for some small compensation?

BTW I'm vaguely remembering a story i read sometime before 2010, about an Intel whistle blower who came forward to a newspaper reporter. During an initial meeting they were driving down a road talking and the Reporters I-phone rang. the Intel whistle blower grabbed the phone and tossed it out the window, and reminded him that he'd never not talk to him if he had a phone especially an I-phone.

it's vague memory and i doubt I'd be able to dig up the story but it struck at the time so it stuck. the only phones over the years that i've heard that are fairly secure are blackberries. so much so that the saudi Gov't or maybe Dubai, band the use of them because they couldn't track and or break into them at one point. I read some business news writers talk about not taking phones to China or Germany and several other countries and that many Business executives don't carry their personal/Biz phones overseas because they know they have been/can be hacked not only by foreign gov'ts but also other businesses in biz espionage.

The hardware IS something to consider. The processors and other chips have to come from somewhere, and they will interact with the OS, or can anyway. And it makes more sense, initially to me anyway. Apple, as a company, doesn't seem to fond of discussing their various layers of protection and encryption.

[aboutime]

the options i mentioned for how they might do it are not pie in the sky.
But I have no problem understanding that the gov't has been spying on as many people as it possible could for a LONG time.

Back in the 1980s i was told about the "project echelon" which tapped the OLD phone system and was a somewhat international project.

but of course when i told folks about that I was called a "conspiracy theorist". But surp[rise surprise it was real.
It's still amazing to me that after all of the public revelations that many people find this or that revelation " HARD TO BELIEVE". I'm not sure why it's "hard to believe" that the U.S. gov't is illegally spying on U.S. citizens and corps in by hook and by crook, everyday.
the head of the Homeland security I believe told everyone that the internet of things is/will be spying on us in our homes in VARIOUS ways.
I mean Who has to say it before "IT"S EASY TO BELIEVE" that the gov't are creeps and daily acting corruptly?




rev. I can end all of this, right here, right now. Anyone who doesn't think the govt isn't watching, listening, or has control over us....shouldn't be afraid to disclose their SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER, right here.

So. To any member reading this. If you think I am full of it for saying this....

TELL US YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER......HERE:______________ _____ __________

[Black Diamond]

rev. I can end all of this, right here, right now. Anyone who doesn't think the govt isn't watching, listening, or has control over us....shouldn't be afraid to disclose their SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER, right here.

So. To any member reading this. If you think I am full of it for saying this....

TELL US YOUR SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER......HERE:______________ _____ __________
I heard a radio commercial for life lock or one of those. The guy gives his name and social security number in the commercial. I don't know if I would have that much confidence in a product

[aboutime]

I heard a radio commercial for life lock or one of those. The guy gives his name and social security number in the commercial. I don't know if I would have that much confidence in a product


I wouldn't either. Next time you hear that commercial. Try to get the number. I'd be willing to bet. It isn't a number that is in use....unless an ILLEGAL has it.
I don't think, even LIFELOCK would take that chance posting a real number.

But I still dare anyone who thinks the Govt. doesn't know what they are doing.. to post their number here. I hope they don't, but then again. In today's UNINFORMED, UNDEREDUCATED society. Ya never know anymore!:lol:

[revelarts]

I heard a radio commercial for life lock or one of those. The guy gives his name and social security number in the commercial. I don't know if I would have that much confidence in a product

that is pretty bold. i kinda of think of it like Home Security.
I can put several of the BEST locks on each steel reinforced, and barred door, have bullet proof 3triple locked windows, steel rebar in the walls and cameras on the inside and out and expensive stuff hidden well or in bolted down safes.
that WILL keep most... even professional... crooks from getting in, much less getting anything.
But if the gov't wants in, they're coming in.