View Full Version : Basing on jimnyc thread (My report card)
A thread of the tread 'My report card' inspired my memories about education in the Soviet Union in 50s-60s. Perhaps you would be interested.
In the USSR any education was free and obligatory for everybody.
There were 10 grades in Soviet school. 1-4 - the primary school, 5-10 - the secondary school.
The grading system was based on the 5-mark scale, although in fact in 3-mark scale, where 3-satisfactory, 4-good, 5-excellent marks. All the subjects were obligatory for everybody with no exclusions.
The subjects in primary school were: reading, writing, the basics of the Russian language include primary Grammar (writing summaries and dictations), arithmetics, drawing, singing, physical education, environmental studies. Four classes a day.
The subjects in secondary school were: Russian language oral and written (Grammar and Rules), Russian and Foreign Literature (writing compositions on the studied literary works: novels, plays, poems; studying by heart extracts from plays and poems, monologues), foreign language (English,French or German), mathematics (algebra, geometry, trigonometry), elements of higher mathematics, Physics (mechanics, optics, electricity), chemistry (organic, inorganic), astronomy, engineering drawing, musical literacy, occupational classes (carpentry plumbing, radio installer, housekeeping for girls), physical and political geography, history (from ancient history to the present day history, Russian/Soviet and foreign of some main countries), social science, botany, biology.
To graduate the school a pupil have to take the exams on the following subjects: Russian written (composition), Literature, mathematics, physics, chemistry, foreign language.
A person who had annual excellent marks on ALL the subjects when studying in secondary school awarded a Golden Medal which gives the privilege to enter almost any Institute without entrance exams. That time high education was free for every student too. The students who studied without 'satisfactory marks' were granted scholarships.
Everything is written from memory. I hope that nothing is omitted.
Hope it will give you some clue of our childhood we suffered in communist Russia. http://s19.rimg.info/aee19e2775457d135efdf745e7d94e15.gif (http://smayliki.ru/smilie-1224821991.html)
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 09:48 AM
An honest question from me, Balu :
Which system do you, personally, prefer? Do you think Russian children these days have it better or do you think you had it better, on a whole?
An honest question from me, Balu :
Which system do you, personally, prefer? Do you think Russian children these days have it better or do you think you had it better, on a whole?
In my view, the current education system is terrible. It prepares uneducated food consumers only, the persons who know too few and not taught to think and who are sure that the Earth has a shape of a suit-case (a joke). And this is not only my personal point of view.
The main drawback is that nowadays the school graduates don't take entrance exams to enter Institute. I am sorry for the tautology.
jimnyc
12-05-2016, 10:06 AM
Balu, forgive me if this was answered already, as I'm often a horrible reader!!
Are you posting straight English from your own knowledge? Or are you writing in Russian and then using something to convert it to English for you? I'm really just curious as it's no issue to read your writing at all. Can I assume that you took English while in school then?
Did they make you drink vodka while you were in grammar school? I kid, I kid!! :)
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 10:08 AM
In my view, the current education system is terrible. It prepares uneducated food consumers only, the persons who know too few and not taught to think and who are sure that the Earth has a shape of a suit-case (a joke). And this is not only my personal point of view.
The main drawback is that nowadays the school graduates don't take entrance exams to enter Institute. I am sorry for the tautology.
I'm not sure if it's a universal trait among older generations to feel that way about current educational standards, but it's a prevalent attitude here in America, as well, that the educational system is sub-par comparative to 20 years ago or 50 years ago. I feel the same way about our system as you do as I look around and see what high school and college age kids are doing.
I suspect that we are reading news articles showing the absolute worst of students when every generation has idiots that celebrate their ignorance, and the diligent students are overlooked because it doesn't garner enough attention for the story.
I'm not sure if it's a universal trait among older generations to feel that way about current educational standards,
It not just educational standers, old people think everything was better back when everything was worse.
Balu, forgive me if this was answered already, as I'm often a horrible reader!!
Are you posting straight English from your own knowledge? Or are you writing in Russian and then using something to convert it to English for you? I'm really just curious as it's no issue to read your writing at all. Can I assume that you took English while in school then?
Did they make you drink vodka while you were in grammar school? I kid, I kid!! :)
This is my English I was taught at school, in the Institute and further. I hate all these 'translators' and forbid my grand children even to look at its side.
When I used English intensively I often caught myself that I start thinking in English. But this is not the only language I was taught.
But now I am out of practice, so to check spelling sometimes I have to consult a dictionary.
In any case I am very glad that I am able to understand all on this board and learn a lot as I do not rely on corrupt Media. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/friends.gif
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 10:19 AM
It not just educational standers, old people think everything was better back when everything was worse.
Well, sometimes it's quite justified, I think.
But I have noticed a rose-colored-glasses perspective when viewing the past and I'm guilty of it too, even though I'm aware of it. The curious thing is that it transcends generations, political views, nationality, race, religion, etc.
jimnyc
12-05-2016, 10:23 AM
This is my English I was taught at school, in the Institute and further. I hate all these 'translators' and forbid my grand children even to look at its side.
When I used English intensively I often caught myself that I start thinking in English. But this is not the only language I was taught.
But now I am out of practice, so to check spelling sometimes I have to consult a dictionary.
In any case I am very glad that I am able to understand all on this board and learn a lot as I do not rely on corrupt Media. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/friends.gif
Dang, very good! I don't speak anything but English, and even that's not too good at times! :) I don't know why, I had thought you were using some translator this whole time. You actually write better than a LOT of people born and raised here in America.
I feel like you do about the media. Years back I would purposely tune into the news on TV at dinner time, and then again at like 11 at night before bed. I was naive and thought it was all factual and truth. Now I very rarely watch the news anymore. I visit news sites from around the world. I visit both conservative and liberal news sites. I want to read ALL of the news, and then you can figure out what is truth and what is not that way. And yep, we're starting to find out more news and more truth from smaller places, smaller agencies, twitter, facebook - places where those posting such things aren't doing so for money or any other interest. Well, some anyway.
jimnyc
12-05-2016, 10:27 AM
Well, sometimes it's quite justified, I think.
But I have noticed a rose-colored-glasses perspective when viewing the past and I'm guilty of it too, even though I'm aware of it. The curious thing is that it transcends generations, political views, nationality, race, religion, etc.
No doubt. In 20-30 years Noir too will be thinking or saying the same thing. Nothing wrong with that though. I think, some folks think their time was harder, or better, because they lived it. kind of like music. People will often listen to a certain time, and then carry that music with them forever. And then the newer generations of music sound funny to them. Some today don't know Led Zep, Floyd or other major bands from the past. And I'm confident Noir would run circles around me discussing today's music.
In my view, the current education system is terrible. It prepares uneducated food consumers only, the persons who know too few and not taught to think and who are sure that the Earth has a shape of a suit-case (a joke). And this is not only my personal point of view.
The main drawback is that nowadays the school graduates don't take entrance exams to enter Institute. I am sorry for the tautology.
To clarify my point.
I hate the system of education basing on questionnaire, where you are to choose a proper answer.
I don't agree with IQ value, as this shows nothing of qualities a man differs from a hard disk jf a computer. In such a competition the computer will always win. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/smile3.gif
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 10:32 AM
To clarify my point.
I hate the system of education basing on questionnaire, where you are to choose a proper answer.
I don't agree with IQ value, as this shows nothing of qualities a man differs from a hard disk jf a computer. In such a competition the computer will always win. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/smile3.gif
Multiple Choice vs. Essay?
Dang, very good! I don't speak anything but English, and even that's not too good at times! :) I don't know why, I had thought you were using some translator this whole time. You actually write better than a LOT of people born and raised here in America.
I feel like you do about the media. Years back I would purposely tune into the news on TV at dinner time, and then again at like 11 at night before bed. I was naive and thought it was all factual and truth. Now I very rarely watch the news anymore. I visit news sites from around the world. I visit both conservative and liberal news sites. I want to read ALL of the news, and then you can figure out what is truth and what is not that way. And yep, we're starting to find out more news and more truth from smaller places, smaller agencies, twitter, facebook - places where those posting such things aren't doing so for money or any other interest. Well, some anyway.
Thank you for you words, Jim.
I am rally glad that I have no language barrier as an obstacle for understanding and searching for the Truth. It becomes the most evident when abroad and are able to contact directly, as to speak via ANY interpreter is similar to running on artificial limbs on the lawn, trying to feel by your feet Morning grass with dew. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/smile3.gif
Drummond
12-05-2016, 10:48 AM
No doubt. In 20-30 years Noir too will be thinking or saying the same thing. Nothing wrong with that though. I think, some folks think their time was harder, or better, because they lived it. kind of like music. People will often listen to a certain time, and then carry that music with them forever. And then the newer generations of music sound funny to them. Some today don't know Led Zep, Floyd or other major bands from the past. And I'm confident Noir would run circles around me discussing today's music.
I suspect, Jim, that Noir was trying to slip a game of political one-upmanship past you, in commenting as he did.
Back in the 1960's, the UK's education system had a shake-up. Introduced then - by our LABOUR Government (of course !) - was our 'Comprehensive Education System', designed to put education more firmly under State control.
I remember its introduction well. I, myself, was educated by a Grammar school, one fortunate enough to stay outside the Comprehensive system (because of a quirk of how exactly the school was funded). After one year of its introduction, with other Grammar schools in the area subsumed under the new Comprehensive 'regime', local teachers were clamouring to leave their jobs in order to teach at MY school .... over sixty of them, just within a couple of miles' radius ....
So come on, Noir ... wax lyrical about the educational 'utopia' that 'is' our Comprehensive system .... you know you want to ....
Multiple Choice vs. Essay?
In my time when I was getting my driving license I had to tell the proper answer orally and solve the road situation on a crossway manually, moving the vehicles on junction layout. The proper answers ant solutions were 100% proof of your knowledge and understanding.
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 11:01 AM
In my time when I was getting my driving license I had to tell the proper answer orally and solve the road situation on a crossway manually, moving the vehicles on junction layout. The proper answers ant solutions were 100% proof of your knowledge and understanding.
Absolutely that is a better test.
It's faster and easier doing multiple choice, which is why that's the standard nowadays.
Absolutely that is a better test.
It's faster and easier doing multiple choice, which is why that's the standard nowadays.
Cramming correct answers on the exam ticket does not mean to know, with all the further consequences on the road. It is already the matter of the QUALITY. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/sad.gif
NightTrain
12-05-2016, 11:15 AM
Cramming correct answers on the exam ticket does not mean to know, with all the further consequences on the road. It is already the matter of the QUALITY. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/sad.gif
I agree 100%.
Elessar
12-05-2016, 01:48 PM
I agree 100%.
California got to the point that the only thing being taught was how to clear the
multiple 'evaluation exams'. They were not teaching substance, they were teaching
how to pass those measurement exams the state demanded. Those tests only measured
the school, not the student.
Yet, even if a student were to grade poorly or fail, they are no longer held back.
They are still allowed to proceed to the next higher grade, because to hold them
back would "hurt their self-esteem". So failing students have no incentive to do
better and progress.
Abbey Marie
12-05-2016, 03:11 PM
Balu, is English the most popular second language in school?
Balu, is English the most popular second language in school?
Yes. Nowadays it is, thanks to computers.
Recently there were some changes in studying languages at school - it is obligatory to study two languages. And the most likely the popular 2nd foreign language will be Chinese.
Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
12-05-2016, 05:35 PM
It not just educational standers, old people think everything was better back when everything was worse.
That is simply not true. Some old people have profited by their experiences and greater amount of years learning.
For you to broadly say that -- "everything"-- was worse, is a huge indication of your bias/brainwashing methinks.
We that actually lived then and live now can make that comparison with a far better degree of knowledge based upon life experience whereas you must attempt to do so with-or without(?) anything other than what you have been told or have read(even if its propaganda or liberally rewritten history)..
Educational standards were far,far higher and far more often achieved in the 1920's through the end of 1950's.
In some areas such as the South- the massive decay hadnt hit high gear until after the 1980's.
You could let Goggle be your friend and actually learn the truth if you cared to an did the proper research.
Or just continue to eat liberal pie and drink the massively doctored up liberal kool-aid.--Tyr
We that actually lived then and live now can make that comparison with a far better degree of knowledge based upon life experience...Educational standards were far,far higher and far more often achieved in the 1920's through the end of 1950's.
Well if you wanted to live through a few years of those 'far far higher' standards in 1920-1950 (let's say 5 years of it at a minimum) then you making your comparison by 'we who actually lived then' would make you atleast 76 years old. And that's comparing an education system you experienced when you were 10 years old, to one that you don't experience now.
Are you 76 years old? (Or older?)
Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
12-06-2016, 09:36 AM
Well if you wanted to live through a few years of those 'far far higher' standards in 1920-1950 (let's say 5 years of it at a minimum) then you making your comparison by 'we who actually lived then' would make you at least 76 years old. And that's comparing an education system you experienced when you were 10 years old, to one that you don't experience now.
Are you 76 years old? (Or older?)
Read my comment again, SEE QUOTE BELOW.. . I stated this, which clearly addresses your concern about my not having lived through it.
I was born in 1954, educated from 1960 to 1973, in the South. In the South, which was THE LAST AREA OF THIS NATION TO EMBRACE THE LIBERAL EDUCATION INFILTRATED WITH PROGRESSIVE IDEAS AND LAX STANDARDS.
OUR SCHOOLS DEMANDED HIGH STANDARDS AND NO FREE PASSES ON GRADES!
If you failed, you did that grade level over again. There was no ignoring failed tests in class...
We had some of the best teachers to have ever taught school children (DEDICATED AND WONDERFULLY GOOD AT THEIR JOBS), IMHO..-TYR
SO YOU SEE, I ADDRESSED THAT ISSUE EVEN BEFORE YOU TOSSED IT OUT THERE IN AN ATTEMPT TO PROP UP SOME WEAK DEFENSE OF YOUR PREVIOUS MISTAKEN COMMENT.
AND NO, I AM NOT 76 YEARS OLD- I WILL BE 63 YEARS OLD IN ABOUT 14 WEEKS.
In some areas such as the South- the massive decay hadnt hit high gear until after the 1980's.
ALSO, I DO EXPERIENCE IT NOW AS MY SON, 9 YEARS OLD IS IN SCHOOL.
AS WAS MY 28 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER ..I GOT TONS OF EXPERIENCE IN SEEING HOW DEGRADED AND DELIBERATELY FKKED UP IT IS NOW AND GETTING WORSE EVERY DAMN YEAR.
WHICH IS WHY THIS YEAR, WE PUT JUSTIN IN PRIVATE SCHOOL- SO YES I TALK THE TALK BUT I ALSO WALK THE WALK..
Drummond
12-06-2016, 09:44 AM
Well if you wanted to live through a few years of those 'far far higher' standards in 1920-1950 (let's say 5 years of it at a minimum) then you making your comparison by 'we who actually lived then' would make you atleast 76 years old. And that's comparing an education system you experienced when you were 10 years old, to one that you don't experience now.
Are you 76 years old? (Or older?)
Noir, how about addressing the point I made myself ?
In my area of London, my school escaped being subsumed into the Government-run 'Comprehensive Education System' introduced in the mid-1960's. It was just one of a handful of Grammar schools that did.
Since then, it's remained independent. Inspections of it have always produced excellent reports.
Just ONE YEAR after those other Grammar schools that WERE subsumed, many teachers applied to teach instead at MY school. Why ? Because the teaching standards hadn't been tinkered with in my school, as they had in those others. Decent teachers wanted to teach according to high standards. They therefore wanted to escape the strictures of the State system.
Leftie-run schools are 'one size fits all' establishments. They also operate according to the standards insisted for them by Government-run bodies. And when that governing body is LEFT WING ... that's just asking for trouble.
My school has its own Wikipedia page dedicated to it. Check it out ....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Latymer_School
Selected quote ....
Latymer is strong academically, performing consistently at the top of national league tables, including coming first in national value added tables and achieving the highest proportion of A* grades at GCSE among state schools in 2006. In recent years the school typically produces around 20-40 successful Oxbridge applicants annually (roughly 10-20% of each year group). Its further strengths include a long-standing tradition in music, including several orchestras and many other voice and instrumental ensembles, as well as a well-supported programme of other varied extracurricular activities.
The school has strong links with other schools across the world with regular exchanges to Institution de la Sainte-Croix, Tours, France; Heisenberg Gymnasium, Gladbeck, Germany; and School 316 in St Petersburg, Russia. In addition, the school has a partnership with Mwambisi Forest Secondary School and Mwambisi Primary School in the Kibaha District of Tanzania. Pupils and staff from Latymer regularly visit, and staff from Mwambisi often visit Latymer School. There are also trips to Milan and Verona in Italy for junior sports teams, senior sports trips to Barbados, canoe trips to the Ardèche and ski trips to the French Alps. There are also geography expeditions to southern Iceland and classics trips to Sorrento, Italy every two years. Art trips go to New York City and Media Studies to Hollywood. Every summer the chamber musicians tour in Europe, with the 2009 tour taking the orchestra and choir to Tuscany in the north of Italy, where they shall perform in the major cathedrals around Florence and Pisa.
Not at all bad for a school that's NOT part of the Comprehensive education system, but an independent Grammar school ... eh, Noir ?
That is simply not true. Some old people have profited by their experiences and greater amount of years learning.
For you to broadly say that -- "everything"-- was worse, is a huge indication of your bias/brainwashing methinks.
We that actually lived then and live now can make that comparison with a far better degree of knowledge based upon life experience whereas you must attempt to do so with-or without(?) anything other than what you have been told or have read(even if its propaganda or liberally rewritten history)..
Educational standards were far,far higher and far more often achieved in the 1920's through the end of 1950's.
In some areas such as the South- the massive decay hadnt hit high gear until after the 1980's.
You could let Goggle be your friend and actually learn the truth if you cared to an did the proper research.
Or just continue to eat liberal pie and drink the massively doctored up liberal kool-aid.--Tyr
I think that the main reason is teachers themselves. What do they know, those, who were taught in 80s-90s? I am able to compare my teachers from the very beginning of 60s with these of my grand children. I called on to their school once and spoke with their form-masters. The conversation made me sad.
But my grand children are lucky as I am able additionally to teach them myself, and I have something to hand over to them from my knowledge and experience. A kind of 'home education', which was so much spread over in 19th Century in Russia. I have a lot of free time to dedicate it to my grand children and I think it is the best way to spend the rest of my life.
Tyr-Ziu Saxnot
12-06-2016, 01:07 PM
I think that the main reason is teachers themselves. What do they know, those, who were taught in 80s-90s? I am able to compare my teachers from the very beginning of 60s with these of my grand children. I called on to their school once and spoke with their form-masters. The conversation made me sad.
But my grand children are lucky as I am able additionally to teach them myself, and I have something to hand over to them from my knowledge and experience. A kind of 'home education', which was so much spread over in 19th Century in Russia. I have a lot of free time to dedicate it to my grand children and I think it is the best way to spend the rest of my life.
That is great my friend.. I retaught my daughter all through her school years, now at 28 years old, she is not only beautiful but also well educated with truth and a logically driven mind, that seeks truth, over that of convenience and complacency.
Now I have spent much time reteaching my son, yet this year because of his private schooling , I've had to do very little of that...
Whereas as far back as 22 years ago with my daughter Kashaundra it was almost a full time job each week.
Had I not dedicated so much time reteaching her, she'd have graduated high school at age 18 with about a 4th/5th grade education level (thats 4th/5th grade level as such was rated back in my day).
I am guessing in your NATIVE COUNTRY THAT IT IS NOT AS BADLY DECAYED AS IT IS HERE IN MINE..-TYR
That is great my friend.. I retaught my daughter all through her school years, now at 28 years old, she is not only beautiful but also well educated with truth and a logically driven mind, that seeks truth, over that of convenience and complacency.
Now I have spent much time reteaching my son, yet this year because of his private schooling , I've had to do very little of that...
Whereas as far back as 22 years ago with my daughter Kashaundra it was almost a full time job each week.
Had I not dedicated so much time reteaching her, she'd have graduated high school at age 18 with about a 4th/5th grade education level (thats 4th/5th grade level as such was rated back in my day).
I am guessing in your NATIVE COUNTRY THAT IT IS NOT AS BADLY DECAYED AS IT IS HERE IN MINE..-TYR
Dear Robert,
We both are almost of the same age and I am very pleased to read your posts and see what we think the same way in the human issues. And no wonder as we both are over our 60, chess-players and had our personal life experience which enables us to judge what is right and what is wrong. And Thanks to God we really have what to hand over to our children and grand children. http://www.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/friends.gif
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