Voter Suppression Verified!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Psychoblues]

It’s a damn shame that Americans have to put up with this.



Previously undisclosed documents detail how Republican operatives, with the knowledge of several White House officials, engaged in an illegal, racially-motivated effort to suppress tens of thousands of votes during the 2004 presidential campaign in a state where George W. Bush was trailing his Democratic challenger, Senator John Kerry.

The documents also contain details describing how Bush-Cheney 2004 campaign officials, and at least one individual who worked for White House political adviser Karl Rove, planned to stop minorities residing in Cuyahoga County from voting on election day.

The efforts to purge voters from registration rolls was spearheaded by Tim Griffin, a former Republican National Committee opposition researcher. Griffin recently resigned from his post as interim US attorney for Little Rock Arkansas. His predecessor, Bud Cummins, was forced out to make way for Griffin.

Another set of documents, 43 pages of emails, provided to Truthout by the PBS news program "NOW," contains blueprints for a massive effort undertaken by RNC operatives in 2004, to challenge the eligibility of voters expected to support Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry in states such as Nevada, New Mexico, Florida and Pennsylvania…….

More: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/printer_072607A.shtml

I’m voting for accuracy, efficiency and respect.

[avatar4321]

Psycho, i know this is hard for you to understand, but the government is supposed to be suppressing votes from people who are trying to vote multiple times.

I know that really hurts you're attempts to commit voting fraud and hurts your chances to win elections. But its still illegal.

[Psychoblues]

And I know this hurts you as well, a'21.



Psycho, i know this is hard for you to understand, but the government is supposed to be suppressing votes from people who are trying to vote multiple times.

I know that really hurts you're attempts to commit voting fraud and hurts your chances to win elections. But its still illegal.

I only respect votes that are validly cast but I respect each and every one. Is that clear to you?

[musicman]

Psycho, i know this is hard for you to understand, but the government is supposed to be suppressing votes from people who are trying to vote multiple times.

I know that really hurts you're attempts to commit voting fraud and hurts your chances to win elections. But its still illegal.

Correct. I was IN Ohio - voting - in 2004. The personnel at my polling place were on edge; they'd been TOLD to be on the lookout for Florida voters, trying to falsify residency in Ohio. This was a statewide alert, BTW. I've never seen anything like it - before or since; their eyes were PEELED for fraud. Sounds to me like somebody knew something.

[Psychoblues]

Sadly, your paranoia is only of your own. Care to cite a single example of multiple voting in Ohio or was your paranoia unfounded? Now, as you say, "Peel them eyes" and get back with me on something credible.

[musicman]

Sadly, your paranoia is only of your own. Care to cite a single example of multiple voting in Ohio or was your paranoia unfounded? Now, as you say, "Peel them eyes" and get back with me on something credible.

Consider, for a moment, the glorious possibility that an alert, aware Ohio (paranoid, you might call them), clamped the lid on pretty damned tight - pretty damned quick. I was THERE, man; those folks were ready.

[Psychoblues]

Have you ever heard of Greg Palast?



Consider, for a moment, the glorious possibility that an alert, aware Ohio (paranoid, you might call them), clamped the lid on pretty damned tight - pretty damned quick. I was THERE, man; those folks were ready.

He has a heck of a lot of very well documented information that I think you are totally unaware of.

[musicman]

Have you ever heard of Greg Palast?




He has a heck of a lot of very well documented information that I think you are totally unaware of.

He's a liberal hack "journalist" with an ax to grind. He dusts off the same horseshit story every four years (I'm not kidding; he's already got "The Fix is in For 2008" in the works!). What's his information - that Florida law differs from Connecticut law on the matter of felons voting? That exit polls can differ from ACTUAL polls? Surely you don't consider him objective or dispassionate.

[Psychoblues]

I didn't get it that way. I think he does a very good job of painting both predominant parties with the same brush. How are you so sure he is a "hack journalist with an axe to grind."

[musicman]

I didn't get it that way. I think he does a very good job of painting both predominant parties with the same brush. How are you so sure he is a "hack journalist with an axe to grind."

I certainly don't consider Wikipedia the last word on anything; it's contributor-driven (and, thus, useless as an objective reporter of fact), and - for my money - notorious for lurching toward the left. But - for the purposes of this discussion - so much the better. Check out this guy's Wikipedia entry, and show me some of his teeth marks on Democrats. Then we'll count 'em up.

[Psychoblues]

You get it just like I did, mm. Greg Palast is a bite on the ass for all the crooks that call and employ themselves as politicians.


I certainly don't consider Wikipedia the last word on anything; it's contributor-driven (and, thus, useless as an objective reporter of fact), and - for my money - notorious for lurching toward the left. But - for the purposes of this discussion - so much the better. Check out this guy's Wikipedia entry, and show me some of his teeth marks on Democrats. Then we'll count 'em up.

What is "Wikipedia"?

[musicman]

You get it just like I did, mm. Greg Palast is a bite on the ass for all the crooks that call and employ themselves as politicians.

Yeah - as long as they're Republicans.


What is "Wikipedia"?

Twenty-five - just like downtown.

[Psychoblues]

I can quote you thousands of condemnations of Democrats by Greg Palast. He is an even keeled commentator. He is also a third way supporter much like Ross Perot and Ralph Nader and I don't abide that philosophy.




Yeah - as long as they're Republicans.



Twenty-five - just like downtown.

Twenty-five + U2 = :pee:

[musicman]

I can quote you thousands of condemnations of Democrats by Greg Palast. He is an even keeled commentator.

You're out of your tree.

[red states rule]

It’s a damn shame that Americans have to put up with this.



Previously undisclosed documents detail how Republican operatives, with the knowledge of several White House officials, engaged in an illegal, racially-motivated effort to suppress tens of thousands of votes during the 2004 presidential campaign in a state where George W. Bush was trailing his Democratic challenger, Senator John Kerry.

The documents also contain details describing how Bush-Cheney 2004 campaign officials, and at least one individual who worked for White House political adviser Karl Rove, planned to stop minorities residing in Cuyahoga County from voting on election day.

The efforts to purge voters from registration rolls was spearheaded by Tim Griffin, a former Republican National Committee opposition researcher. Griffin recently resigned from his post as interim US attorney for Little Rock Arkansas. His predecessor, Bud Cummins, was forced out to make way for Griffin.

Another set of documents, 43 pages of emails, provided to Truthout by the PBS news program "NOW," contains blueprints for a massive effort undertaken by RNC operatives in 2004, to challenge the eligibility of voters expected to support Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry in states such as Nevada, New Mexico, Florida and Pennsylvania…….

More: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/printer_072607A.shtml

I’m voting for accuracy, efficiency and respect.

How libs define provisional ballot (it makes sure Dems win elections)

Provisional Ballot \pro-visz’uhn-al bal-uht\ n: a means by which Democrat voters can cast two or more “votes” in a hotly contested political election. If Democrats lose the first ballot count (which they inevitably do), then a legal challenge can be mounted calling for all provisional ballots (i.e. extra Democrat votes) to be added to the final count; also known as a means by which expired people, undocumented workers, and oppressed animals (otherwise known as “pets”) can express their right to vote Democrat in a democracy.


Democracy \duh-mock’crass-ee\ n: a form of government in which members of the Democrat Party retain eternal power; during elections or election recounts in which Democrats are losing, it is said that ‘the very principles of our democracy are in peril’ or ‘Republicans have undermined the very foundation of our democracy’.

http://rushlimbaughshow.blogspot.com/2006/02/liberal-dictionary-featured-word_26.html

[Psychoblues]

It's not difficult to figure out that you are only out for yourself, rsr.





How libs define provisional ballot (it makes sure Dems win elections)

Provisional Ballot \pro-visz’uhn-al bal-uht\ n: a means by which Democrat voters can cast two or more “votes” in a hotly contested political election. If Democrats lose the first ballot count (which they inevitably do), then a legal challenge can be mounted calling for all provisional ballots (i.e. extra Democrat votes) to be added to the final count; also known as a means by which expired people, undocumented workers, and oppressed animals (otherwise known as “pets”) can express their right to vote Democrat in a democracy.


Democracy \duh-mock’crass-ee\ n: a form of government in which members of the Democrat Party retain eternal power; during elections or election recounts in which Democrats are losing, it is said that ‘the very principles of our democracy are in peril’ or ‘Republicans have undermined the very foundation of our democracy’.

http://rushlimbaughshow.blogspot.com/2006/02/liberal-dictionary-featured-word_26.html

Have you read the Post Whore thread? This time, last time, what's the difference?

[red states rule]

It's not difficult to figure out that you are only out for yourself, rsr.






Have you read the Post Whore thread? This time, last time, what's the difference?

I am out for the US - libs are out for their party

Sorry if you don't like how libs view things.

[Psychoblues]

It is only your observation that I reflect, rsr.



I am out for the US - libs are out for their party

Sorry if you don't like how libs view things.

Don't like it? Tuff Shit.

[red states rule]

It is only your observation that I reflect, rsr.




Don't like it? Tuff Shit.

You are the one having a hissy fit over my posts. Take your meds and drink some warm milk

[Psychoblues]

Get over yourself. No inclination by me to have a hissy fit over anything you have written.

Certainly, you have missed your warm milk and meds. You were deprived as a baby, weren't you? Tit's just obsess you, don't they?

[red states rule]

Get over yourself. No inclination by me to have a hissy fit over anything you have written.

Certainly, you have missed your warm milk and meds. You were deprived as a baby, weren't you? Tit's just obsess you, don't they?

Back to the insults and personal attacks

Happens whenever gacts goes against the liberal in a debate

Which happens often

[red states rule]

Speaking of election fraud


Convicting Democrats is New St. Louis Pastime

At least 16 St. Louis area Democrats have been found guilty of election crimes in the last 7 months!


Sheila Thomas hugs Defense Attorney Paul Sims yesterday. Thomas was convicted of conspiracy and vote fraud and faces up to five years in prison for each charge.

The jury in the East St. Louis vote fraud case gave out guilty verdicts for all five defendents yesterday in the biggest vote fraud case in the St. Louis area's history:

Convicted of one count of conspiracy to commit vote fraud during the Nov. 2 election was Charlie Powell Jr., head of the city's powerful Democratic Central Committee and a former city council member. He faces five years in prison.

Convicted of conspiracy and vote fraud and facing five years on each count were:

• Kelvin Ellis, a Democratic precinct committeeman and former East St. Louis city government department head who served a federal prison term for extortion in the early 1990s.

• Yvette Johnson, secretary to the city Democratic organization.

• Democratic precinct committeemen Sheila Thomas and Jesse Lewis.

Rudy McIntosh lost his job as a police officer last month. He testified against the defendents in the vote fraud case. He has lost his job in the police department.

The undercover tapes obtained by Rudy McIntosh convinced the jurors of guilt.

With the authorities still investigating this may not be the end of the indictments.

Democrats are saying the convictions announced Wednesday do not represent their party.

I beg to differ!!

In the last 7 months in the St. Louis Metro Area here is a slice of what we have witnessed:

Nov. 18: Nine precinct committeemen appear before a federal grand jury probing vote fraud during the Nov. 2 election.

December: In St. Louis Six volunteers pleaded guilty in December of dozens of election law violations for filling out the cards with names of the dead and other bogus information. One still faces charges.

January 21: Kelvin Ellis, a top administrator at East St. Louis City Hall, was indicted for plotting to kill a witness in the year long East St. Louis, Illinois federal vote fraud investigation.

February 10: In St. Louis Nonaresa Montgomery was found guilty by a jury of perjury in a trial in St. Louis Circuit Court in the St. Louis vote fraud trial.

March 22: Precinct committeemen Leroy Scott Jr., 46; Lillie Nichols, 51; Terrance R. Stith, 43; and his wife, precinct worker Sandra Stith, 54; plead guilty to one count each of vote-buying.

March 23: The chairman of the East St. Louis Democratic Central Committee and councilman Charles Powell Jr. is charged with conspiracy to commit election fraud. Charged with conspiracy as well as election fraud are East St. Louis City Hall employees Jesse Lewis, Sheila Thomas, Kelvin Ellis, and Yvette Johnson.

June 29: All five defendants are convicted on all counts.

That comes out to 16 different Democrats convicted of election violations in the last 7 months in the St. Louis area!

That does not include all of the convictions.

And, one Democrat is still being held for attempted murder (trial scheduled for Oct. 17) of a government witness!

http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2005/03/esl-democrat-leaders-charged.html

[avatar4321]

cant help but notice that Psycho didnt have any defense for his position after facts were pointed out.

[Yurt]

cant help but notice that Psycho didnt have any defense for his position after facts were pointed out.

what is this "facts" you speak of, it is not a reason, it is not a why, what is this "facts?"

[glockmail]

Correct. I was IN Ohio - voting - in 2004. The personnel at my polling place were on edge; they'd been TOLD to be on the lookout for Florida voters, trying to falsify residency in Ohio. This was a statewide alert, BTW. I've never seen anything like it - before or since; their eyes were PEELED for fraud. Sounds to me like somebody knew something. Gee. You think that Ohioans who own places in Florida don't vote absentee in one state and in person in the other? I'm sure it happens all the time.

[nevadamedic]

It’s a damn shame that Americans have to put up with this.



Previously undisclosed documents detail how Republican operatives, with the knowledge of several White House officials, engaged in an illegal, racially-motivated effort to suppress tens of thousands of votes during the 2004 presidential campaign in a state where George W. Bush was trailing his Democratic challenger, Senator John Kerry.

The documents also contain details describing how Bush-Cheney 2004 campaign officials, and at least one individual who worked for White House political adviser Karl Rove, planned to stop minorities residing in Cuyahoga County from voting on election day.

The efforts to purge voters from registration rolls was spearheaded by Tim Griffin, a former Republican National Committee opposition researcher. Griffin recently resigned from his post as interim US attorney for Little Rock Arkansas. His predecessor, Bud Cummins, was forced out to make way for Griffin.

Another set of documents, 43 pages of emails, provided to Truthout by the PBS news program "NOW," contains blueprints for a massive effort undertaken by RNC operatives in 2004, to challenge the eligibility of voters expected to support Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry in states such as Nevada, New Mexico, Florida and Pennsylvania…….

More: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/printer_072607A.shtml

I’m voting for accuracy, efficiency and respect.

This shows what kind of an idiot you are. Nevada has had all of the electronic votes copied onto paper before the election of 2004, pushed through by Senator Ensign the Republican Senator from our state. THen he just passed a bill in the Senate to have that paper trail required in every voring booth in the state. So shut the Fuck up.

[nevadamedic]

Speaking of election fraud


Convicting Democrats is New St. Louis Pastime

At least 16 St. Louis area Democrats have been found guilty of election crimes in the last 7 months!


Sheila Thomas hugs Defense Attorney Paul Sims yesterday. Thomas was convicted of conspiracy and vote fraud and faces up to five years in prison for each charge.

The jury in the East St. Louis vote fraud case gave out guilty verdicts for all five defendents yesterday in the biggest vote fraud case in the St. Louis area's history:

Convicted of one count of conspiracy to commit vote fraud during the Nov. 2 election was Charlie Powell Jr., head of the city's powerful Democratic Central Committee and a former city council member. He faces five years in prison.

Convicted of conspiracy and vote fraud and facing five years on each count were:

• Kelvin Ellis, a Democratic precinct committeeman and former East St. Louis city government department head who served a federal prison term for extortion in the early 1990s.

• Yvette Johnson, secretary to the city Democratic organization.

• Democratic precinct committeemen Sheila Thomas and Jesse Lewis.

Rudy McIntosh lost his job as a police officer last month. He testified against the defendents in the vote fraud case. He has lost his job in the police department.

The undercover tapes obtained by Rudy McIntosh convinced the jurors of guilt.

With the authorities still investigating this may not be the end of the indictments.

Democrats are saying the convictions announced Wednesday do not represent their party.

I beg to differ!!

In the last 7 months in the St. Louis Metro Area here is a slice of what we have witnessed:

Nov. 18: Nine precinct committeemen appear before a federal grand jury probing vote fraud during the Nov. 2 election.

December: In St. Louis Six volunteers pleaded guilty in December of dozens of election law violations for filling out the cards with names of the dead and other bogus information. One still faces charges.

January 21: Kelvin Ellis, a top administrator at East St. Louis City Hall, was indicted for plotting to kill a witness in the year long East St. Louis, Illinois federal vote fraud investigation.

February 10: In St. Louis Nonaresa Montgomery was found guilty by a jury of perjury in a trial in St. Louis Circuit Court in the St. Louis vote fraud trial.

March 22: Precinct committeemen Leroy Scott Jr., 46; Lillie Nichols, 51; Terrance R. Stith, 43; and his wife, precinct worker Sandra Stith, 54; plead guilty to one count each of vote-buying.

March 23: The chairman of the East St. Louis Democratic Central Committee and councilman Charles Powell Jr. is charged with conspiracy to commit election fraud. Charged with conspiracy as well as election fraud are East St. Louis City Hall employees Jesse Lewis, Sheila Thomas, Kelvin Ellis, and Yvette Johnson.

June 29: All five defendants are convicted on all counts.

That comes out to 16 different Democrats convicted of election violations in the last 7 months in the St. Louis area!

That does not include all of the convictions.

And, one Democrat is still being held for attempted murder (trial scheduled for Oct. 17) of a government witness!

http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2005/03/esl-democrat-leaders-charged.html

Democrat's accused of fraud? Who would have thought. :laugh2:

[glockmail]

This shows what kind of an idiot you are. Nevada has had all of the electronic votes copied onto paper before the election of 2004, pushed through by Senator Ensign the Republican Senator from our state. THen he just passed a bill in the Senate to have that paper trail required in every voring booth in the state. So shut the Fuck up.
Nice smack-down. :salute: But don't hold your breath waiting for a response.

[nevadamedic]

Nice smack-down. :salute: But don't hold your breath waiting for a response.

I won't.

[nevadamedic]

You are the one having a hissy fit over my posts. Take your meds and drink some warm milk

He's drinking something warm and white but I don't think it's milk! :laugh2:

[red states rule]

cant help but notice that Psycho didnt have any defense for his position after facts were pointed out.

When does he ever?

[red states rule]

On 'Colbert', Bob Shrum Blames Others for Campaign Flops; Hints Bush Stole Ohio in '04
By Joe Steigerwald | July 27, 2007 - 17:03 ET
Bob Shrum, the Democratic political strategist who has only slightly fewer losses on his resume than the Philadelphia Phillies, appeared on the Colbert Report last night to tout his book, “No Excuses: Confessions of a Serial Complainer,” err, I mean, “No Excuses: Confessions of a Serial Campaigner.”

Colbert, who was pretending to be gravely hurt and wearing a fake cast on his arm, was ushered in by wheelchair. Shrum, not missing an opportunity to shill for the Democrats, quipped:

“I hope all the suffering has made you more inclined to support national health insurance, so everybody can get the same kind of risk care you do.”

Clever as ever Mr. Shrum. But that was only the beginning.

Colbert immediately turned his attention to what Shrum, the Susan Lucci of political campaigning, is best known for, losing.

A transcript of Colbert and Shrum’s conversation follows. Colbert’s show is designed as a satirical homage to Bill O’Reilly and usually makes fun of conservatives and certainly Shrum knows this. Even so, he’s dead serious about his Bush-stole-Ohio charge.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/joe-steigerwald/2007/07/27/colbert-interview-shrum-blames-everyone-self-campaign-failures

[Psychoblues]

My, my. You 2 bit nightstalkers are so clever. Do you have change for a buck?

I have not seen any answer to my questions yet or any verified evidense of voter fraud presented in the manner in which it was so paranoidly expected. Voter caging was well at work in Ohio, Florida, New Mexico and other states. I am presently on a campaign to notify and re-enfranchise those that have been so deliberately disenfranchised, particularly the troops.

[avatar4321]

My, my. You 2 bit nightstalkers are so clever. Do you have change for a buck?

I have not seen any answer to my questions yet or any verified evidense of voter fraud presented in the manner in which it was so paranoidly expected. Voter caging was well at work in Ohio, Florida, New Mexico and other states. I am presently on a campaign to notify and re-enfranchise those that have been so deliberately disenfranchised, particularly the troops.

oh so you are going after Al Gore for throwing out the military vote in Florida? Its a bit late for that isnt it? especially when you didnt care about their votes then.

Like I said before, convicted felons and people who are registered in multiple jurisdictions arent supposed to be allowed to vote. I know this is a difficult concept for you to understand, but we dont have a system in place that allows you democrats to vote early and often.

[nevadamedic]

My, my. You 2 bit nightstalkers are so clever. Do you have change for a buck?

I have not seen any answer to my questions yet or any verified evidense of voter fraud presented in the manner in which it was so paranoidly expected. Voter caging was well at work in Ohio, Florida, New Mexico and other states. I am presently on a campaign to notify and re-enfranchise those that have been so deliberately disenfranchised, particularly the troops.

You convienently left out Nevada from this one. You must hate being proven wrong on a regular basis.

[nevadamedic]

oh so you are going after Al Gore for throwing out the military vote in Florida? Its a bit late for that isnt it? especially when you didnt care about their votes then.

Like I said before, convicted felons and people who are registered in multiple jurisdictions arent supposed to be allowed to vote. I know this is a difficult concept for you to understand, but we dont have a system in place that allows you democrats to vote early and often.

The Democrat's want Convicted Felons to be able to vote............ Hell that would be a ton of vote for them.

[nevadamedic]

Press Release of Senator Ensign

Wednesday, July 25, 2007



Washington, D.C. – Senator John Ensign today introduced the Voting Integrity and Verification Act of 2007 (VIVA). The legislation requires that touch-screen voting machines provide a voter-verified paper trail to guarantee voting accuracy.

“Individuals participating in our democracy need to be ensured that their votes are accurately counted,” said Ensign. “Nevada was the first state in the nation to use voter-verified paper trails in 2004, and it was a tremendous success. Voting is a fundamental element for the continued success of our nation, and we do not want to jeopardize this right if a machine malfunctions.”

Ensign lost his first bid for the United States Senate by a thin margin of several hundred votes. During the recount, the accuracy of the paperless voting machines could not be verified. In the 2004 election, Nevada upgraded its voting machines to use voter-verified paper trails. Nevada’s post-election audit of 60,000 electronic ballots after instituting the voter-verified paper trail showed 100% accuracy.

“I have witnessed first hand what happens when there is not a paper trail to determine the accuracy of a voting machine,” said Ensign. “Nearly everyone in America has had a cell phone quit working or a computer crash, and we cannot afford to risk losing votes because of an electronic glitch.”

Ensign also supported the Help America Vote Act, which was signed into law by the President in 2002. This bill provided states with funds to replace aging voting machines. VIVA adds to his previous legislation by requiring a paper voting record.

http://ensign.senate.gov/record.cfm?id=279736&

It must suck for Psychoblues being wrong all the time. This proves your little theroy wrong since it is a Republican Senator who fought to get a paper trail.:slap:

[avatar4321]

The Democrat's want Convicted Felons to be able to vote............ Hell that would be a ton of vote for them.

I can think of a few exceptions.

[nevadamedic]

I can think of a few exceptions.

???????

[Psychoblues]

You little namby pamby jerks ain't got a damn clue as to what a valid and legitamate vote really is, do you? All your shit slinging is only upon yourselves.

[red states rule]

My, my. You 2 bit nightstalkers are so clever. Do you have change for a buck?

I have not seen any answer to my questions yet or any verified evidense of voter fraud presented in the manner in which it was so paranoidly expected. Voter caging was well at work in Ohio, Florida, New Mexico and other states. I am presently on a campaign to notify and re-enfranchise those that have been so deliberately disenfranchised, particularly the troops.

You have not gotten an answer because your "proof" is a pile of shit

Dems on the other hand have been caught over and over again committing fraud

Libs are so arrogant they can never admit when they lose an election. Their egos stop them facing the truth when voter reject their liberalsim

They lie and say the election was stolen or the voters were to stupid to understand the complex issues and solutions libs were offering

[red states rule]

My, my. You 2 bit nightstalkers are so clever. Do you have change for a buck?

I have not seen any answer to my questions yet or any verified evidense of voter fraud presented in the manner in which it was so paranoidly expected. Voter caging was well at work in Ohio, Florida, New Mexico and other states. I am presently on a campaign to notify and re-enfranchise those that have been so deliberately disenfranchised, particularly the troops.

ACORN Vote-Registration Fraud in WA: Are There 2004 Ramifications?
By Tom Blumer | July 29, 2007 - 15:08 ET
ACORN (The Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) has been busted again (video is available at the link; HT Michelle Malkin):

(AP) King County prosecutors filed felony charges Thursday against seven people in what a top official described as the worst case of voter-registration fraud in state history, while the organization they worked for agreed to keep a better eye on its employees and pay $25,000 to defray costs of the investigation.

The seven submitted about 1,800 registration cards last fall on behalf of the liberal Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, or ACORN, which had hired them at $8 an hour to sign people up to vote, according to charging documents filed in Superior Court.


The video buys into the whitewash that only low-level employees were involved. The national track record of ACORN would indicate otherwise.

Other than the AP article excerpted, there has been almost no national coverage of this story. A New York Times search on "Washington ACORN" shows nothing recent. The same keyword search at the Washington Post? Only the AP story, with no indication that it made the Post's print edition. This Google News search on the same keywords shows that the AP story received relatively little play, especially outside of Washington State.

Wait a minute ..... wasn't the Evergreen State the site of a hotly contested gubernatorial election with serious allegations of vote fraud in 2004?

Indeed it was, and ACORN was, "oddly enough," possibly involved. Brad Shannon of the Olympian, whose story is carried here in the Seattle Times, appears to be the only person even trying to connect some dots:

The BIAW (the Building Industry Association of Washington) has criticized the work of elections officials in King County, where most of the questioned voting took place in the 2004 gubernatorial race. Democratic Gov. Chris Gregoire eventually edged out Republican Dino Rossi by 133 votes after two recounts and Rossi's court challenge, which detailed allegations of vote fraud and improper voting by felons.

..... BIAW also is in court to seek documents from Pierce County related to the county's elections office and ACORN registrations. Pierce elections officials and prosecutors did not return phone calls Friday.

McCabe said 300 registrations in the Pierce County case are from "the exact same address. It turns out to be a homeless shelter." Residents are allowed to stay at the shelter for 30 days, and only one person voted from that address in 2004, which makes it unlikely so many would have registered there, McCabe said.


So did the other 299 phantoms simply not vote, or did a number of the 300 potential "voters" have their cards changed to new addresses, vote, and not get caught? That would appear to be a pretty important question, and may only scratch the surface of what extra-legal acts could have transpired to give Gregoire her victory margin.

Apparently, the private BIAW, doing work no prosecutor or, with rare exception, any media outlet is interested in, is the only entity that cares about these things.

That contrasts quite sharply with Old Media treatment of the objectively less controversial (on the facts, not the Florida Supreme Court's abuse of its powers) 2000 presidential vote in Florida.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/tom-blumer/2007/07/29/acorn-vote-registration-fraud-wa-are-there-2004-ramifications

[Psychoblues]

Still shit slinging with nothing to protect yourselves from the wet fart blowback. Shame on you. I'm very glad that none of you are actual veterans of any United States War.

[red states rule]

Still shit slinging with nothing to protect yourselves from the wet fart blowback. Shame on you. I'm very glad that none of you are actual veterans of any United States War.

Truth hurts, eh?

Libs are the first ones to scream "the election was stolen" when they lose - I did not hear any whining from the Republicans when they lost last November

[Psychoblues]

Who were the crybabies screaming "STOP THE VOTE COUNTING!!!!!!!" in Florida in 2000?

I guess you forgot about all that!!!!!!!

[red states rule]

Who were the crybabies screaming "STOP THE VOTE COUNTING!!!!!!!" in Florida in 2000?

I guess you forgot about all that!!!!!!!

Because Al wanted to cherry pick the places where they would do the recount

BTW - the liberal media went down and did their own recount - Bush won that one as well

[PostmodernProphet]

dealt with this issue on another board....Truthout wasn't too concerned with getting the truth out....read through the 43 emails and there was nothing that even remotely supported the articles claims.....

[glockmail]

You have not gotten an answer because your "proof" is a pile of shit

Dems on the other hand have been caught over and over again committing fraud

Libs are so arrogant they can never admit when they lose an election. Their egos stop them facing the truth when voter reject their liberalsim

They lie and say the election was stolen or the voters were to stupid to understand the complex issues and solutions libs were offering

This is a good summary of lib's attitude since the last two presidential elections. :salute:

[red states rule]

This is a good summary of lib's attitude since the last two presidential elections. :salute:

I did not hear of any conservatives whining how the 06 election was stolen

We lost, and tried to figure out why

[red states rule]

More whining from the left

Democrats Plan to Assess Voting State by State

By JACQUELINE PALANK
Published: August 2, 2007

The Democratic Party will announce on Thursday a state-by-state effort to identify potential problems in how elections are administered before the 2008 presidential election
In the 2000 and 2004 elections, there were widespread instances of voters being turned away from the polls because of a shortage of voting machines or the illegal removal of their names from registration lists. And despite changes made in federal election law in 2002, the 2004 election demonstrated that many states and localities were not enforcing them.

The committee will ask staff members to interview election officials in the country’s more than 3,000 counties, said Anna Martinez, director of the committee’s voting rights institute. Ms. Martinez said the interviews would address type of voting machines, how many are sent to a polling place and how absentee ballot requests and voter registrations are handled.

The 2002 law expanded the government’s role in regulating elections and voter registration.

“Our candidates need to know how elections work in every single precinct,” said Howard Dean, the Democratic Party chairman. “That is an enormous advantage when you’re going up against a party that is essentially a vote suppressor.”

The Republican National Committee said it also tried to ensure compliance. “We’re aware of the law and work with our state parties to make sure they not only understand the law but have the resources they need to comply with the law,” said Tracey Schmitt, press secretary for the Republican committee.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/02/us/politics/02dems.html

[PostmodernProphet]

We lost, and tried to figure out why

after watching the Republican congress spend money like drunken Democrats, it wasn't that hard to figure out.....

[red states rule]

after watching the Republican congress spend money like drunken Democrats, it wasn't that hard to figure out.....

Dems are breaking that record - and they are raising taxes by over $400 billion to cover part of the increased spending

[actsnoblemartin]

Ive heard of democrats using dead people, and illegals to vote, does that link give any proof, and if so what. Bud, im willing to hear ya, just tell me what the link is gonna give me please ok?


Sadly, your paranoia is only of your own. Care to cite a single example of multiple voting in Ohio or was your paranoia unfounded? Now, as you say, "Peel them eyes" and get back with me on something credible.

[red states rule]

Ive heard of democrats using dead people, and illegals to vote, does that link give any proof, and if so what. Bud, im willing to hear ya, just tell me what the link is gonna give me please ok?

To libs, winning is all that matters. The ends justify the means

[Psychoblues]

And you think "Right" is always right?



To libs, winning is all that matters. The ends justify the means

Gobble this, easy now.

:pee:

[red states rule]

And you think "Right" is always right?




Gobble this, easy now.

:pee:

They are right much more then the kook left

The Dems do have record low approval numbers - lower then the Republicans had before the voters fired them last Nov

[Psychoblues]

Dems are perpetually dissatisfied, rsr. Have you ever heard the quote by Will Rogers? "I belong to no organized party, I am a Democrat."




They are right much more then the kook left

The Dems do have record low approval numbers - lower then the Republicans had before the voters fired them last Nov

November 2006 proved your ass wrong and your post proves you stupid.

Give 2008 a good look and get back with me in 2009.

[nevadamedic]

Dems are perpetually dissatisfied, rsr. Have you ever heard the quote by Will Rogers? "I belong to no organized party, I am a Democrat."





November 2006 proved your ass wrong and your post proves you stupid.

Give 2008 a good look and get back with me in 2009.

Since I know you get off on getting a Golden Shower.........:pee:

[Psychoblues]

If you ever knew anything about Psychoblues you would know completely different, nm. But, you don't know much about anything, do you?




Since I know you get off on getting a Golden Shower.........:pee:

How do you like this? :pee::pee::pee:, Are you as much the happy camper now as you were when you told all those lies?

[red states rule]

Dems are perpetually dissatisfied, rsr. Have you ever heard the quote by Will Rogers? "I belong to no organized party, I am a Democrat."





November 2006 proved your ass wrong and your post proves you stupid.

Give 2008 a good look and get back with me in 2009.

Even San Fran Nan's numbers in her home town are tanking

You wil be one the kook libs screaming how the 08 election was stolen

[Psychoblues]

Ahhhhhh!!!!!! The smell of Victory For The Real People is in the air!!!!!!!!!

2006 is only a premonition of the complete victory of 2008.

[nevadamedic]

Ahhhhhh!!!!!! The smell of Victory For The Real People is in the air!!!!!!!!!

2006 is only a premonition of the complete victory of 2008.

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2: Thanks I needed a good laugh tonight :laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

[Psychoblues]

Glad you liked it!!!!!!!!!!!



:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2: Thanks I needed a good laugh tonight :laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

The smell of wet dick always gets you family values types excited!!!!!!!!!!!

[manu1959]

You little namby pamby jerks ain't got a damn clue as to what a valid and legitamate vote really is, do you? All your shit slinging is only upon yourselves.


let me guess ...it is only valid if you like the result...

[Psychoblues]

I can't and don't speak for all Democrats but my understanding of the party and with which I agree that the results should be verified, accurate and reflect the will of the peoples.




let me guess ...it is only valid if you like the result...

If you have a problem with that I would suggest you take it up with your Doctor if your health plan will approve it.

[nevadamedic]

I can't and don't speak for all Democrats but my understanding of the party and with which I agree that the results should be verified, accurate and reflect the will of the peoples.





If you have a problem with that I would suggest you take it up with your Doctor if your health plan will approve it.

Your understanding of the Democratic party is distorted just like your understanding of life. I can understand why you dont speak for all Democrats as you would give them a worse name then they already have and congratulations thats next to impossible to do!

[Psychoblues]

Like I said,,,,,



Your understanding of the Democratic party is distorted just like your understanding of life. I can understand why you dont speak for all Democrats as you would give them a worse name then they already have and congratulations thats next to impossible to do!


Your doctor can give you far better counsel than anything I can relate to you in this venue.

Get help for yourself, nm. I am sorry that I cannot provide for you.

[nevadamedic]

Glad you liked it!!!!!!!!!!!




The smell of wet dick always gets you family values types excited!!!!!!!!!!!

Once again Mr. Liar your hipocracy shows. You need to quit defending gay people when you turn around and try and insult someone buy calling them gay. You know you talk about sucking d$%^ so much that I think that is what your into, I have never heard a man tak so much about wieners in my life.

[nevadamedic]

Like I said,,,,,





Your doctor can give you far better counsel than anything I can relate to you in this venue.

Get help for yourself, nm. I am sorry that I cannot provide for you.

Ok Mr. Liar

[Psychoblues]

Why did you edit your own quote, nm? I'll repeat it for you and for all to see.

"Once again Mr. Liar your hipocracy shows. You need to quit defending gay people when you turn around and try and insult someone buy calling them gay. You know you talk about sucking d$%^ so much that I think that is what your into, I have never heard a man tak so much about wieners in my life."



Ok Mr. Liar

How about licking this one? :pee:

[nevadamedic]

Why did you edit your own quote, nm? I'll repeat it for you and for all to see.

"Once again Mr. Liar your hipocracy shows. You need to quit defending gay people when you turn around and try and insult someone buy calling them gay. You know you talk about sucking d$%^ so much that I think that is what your into, I have never heard a man tak so much about wieners in my life."




How about licking this one? :pee:

Another Gay insult by Mr. Liar Gay Defender, fucking hipocrit.

[manu1959]

I have never heard a man tak so much about wieners in my life." How about licking this one? :pee:

CAN YOU SAY GOLDEN SHOWER PROJECTION........HMMMMMMMMMMMM

[nevadamedic]

I have never heard a man tak so much about wieners in my life." How about licking this one? :pee:

CAN YOU SAY GOLDEN SHOWER PROJECTION........HMMMMMMMMMMMM

It's also pretty sick......................

[manu1959]

It's also pretty sick......................

hey it is a message board......

[nevadamedic]

hey it is a message board......

It's still sick................

[Psychoblues]

Just how do you consider me gay, a liar or a hypocrit, mr. shithead idiot no job nevada poster?



Another Gay insult by Mr. Liar Gay Defender, fucking hipocrit.

I asked you not once but several times for evidence of any lies I have told on this board and you cannot produce them. You ridicule my life experience and I am left to imagine your own. You are a lonely sole, nm. And I suspect you will remain so.

[nevadamedic]

Just how do you consider me gay, a liar or a hypocrit, mr. shithead idiot no job nevada poster?




I asked you not once but several times for evidence of any lies I have told on this board and you cannot produce them. You ridicule my life experience and I am left to imagine your own. You are a lonely sole, nm. And I suspect you will remain so.

Ok let me break this down for you since long paragraphs confuse you.

Gay: Everyother post you make is #ock sucker this D$%^ sucker that or about doing guys. It's pretty sick.

Hipocrit: let's see you defend Gay people across the board then the first chance you get you use it as an attack like it is some evil, aweful and disgusting thing and if thats not a hipocrit I sure as hell dont know what is.

No job eh? You might want to check out a couple of my most recent posts moron.

:fu:

[Psychoblues]

You and your obsessions with being the only one here can go away at any time, nm.



It's still sick................

But, even then, you are truly a very sick individual. Have you spoken with your doctor as I advised you months ago?

[nevadamedic]

You and your obsessions with being the only one here can go away at any time, nm.




But, even then, you are truly a very sick individual. Have you spoken with your doctor as I advised you months ago?

Nope Mr. Liar noone listens to you. You are pretty good for amusement when we are board and thats about all.

[Psychoblues]

You talk a lot of shit, nm.




Ok let me break this down for you since long paragraphs confuse you.

Gay: Everyother post you make is #ock sucker this D$%^ sucker that or about doing guys. It's pretty sick.

Hipocrit: let's see you defend Gay people across the board then the first chance you get you use it as an attack like it is some evil, aweful and disgusting thing and if thats not a hipocrit I sure as hell dont know what is.

No job eh? You might want to check out a couple of my most recent posts moron.:fu:

Give it up. you can't back up a damn thing you say.

[nevadamedic]

You talk a lot of shit, nm.





Give it up. you can't back up a damn thing you say.

:laugh2: Have another drink dumbshit because I just did and I even broke it down for you and you still didn't understand. Have you ever been tested for mental retardation? If not I think you should be...............

[Psychoblues]

I asked for specifics and you told outright lies.



:laugh2: Have another drink dumbshit because I just did and I even broke it down for you and you still didn't understand. Have you ever been tested for mental retardation? If not I think you should be...............

Nothing new for you. Have you any real doubt about mental retardation or are you just after sympathy?

[nevadamedic]

I asked for specifics and you told outright lies.




Nothing new for you. Have you any real doubt about mental retardation or are you just after sympathy?

Talk about a Bait and Switch Mr. Liar.

[Psychoblues]

I can accept that you have nothing to say about voter suppression.



Talk about a Bait and Switch Mr. Liar.

But I find your obsession with homosexual actions of Republicans in leadership quite remarkable.

[nevadamedic]

I can accept that you have nothing to say about voter suppression.




But I find your obsession with homosexual actions of Republicans in leadership quite remarkable.

Your the one who keeps bringing up all things homosexual dipshit.

[glockmail]

.....

But I find your obsession with homosexual actions of Republicans in leadership quite remarkable.
Why do liberals always use "gay" as an insult?

[truthmatters]

4

[avatar4321]

once again, preventing people from voting multiple times is not voter supression. its upholding the law.

Why is that so difficult for you liberals to understand?

And just so you know we are supposed to prevent the dead from voting too.

[truthmatters]

4

[Psychoblues]

Republicans stifle votes in any way they can. They completely understand that free and fair voting will leave them to speak only amongst themselves.



That is not what they did.

What they did and got caught for is keeping legal voters off the voting rolls which means they were kept from voting at all.

They were caught and punished.

If they did it to you would you ovte for them the next time?

Given the original Republican platform it is only White, Men, Property Owners and no others that should be allowed to vote on any issue. What is anti-American about that? Seriously?

[BoogyMan]

Wow, it is a good thing liberals would never be involved in such tactics then isn't it? Oh......wait......



Source Link: http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/davidpostman/archives/2007/07/settlement_in_phony_voter_registration_case.html

Settlement in phony voter registration case

Posted by David Postman at 11:59 AM

A liberal group whose workers submitted fraudulent voter registration forms has agreed to a legal settlement with King County that says if the problem is repeated in the future the group could face criminal prosecution.

Keith Ervin has a story here that says people working for ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, admitted to filling out registration forms with names they took out of phone books while sitting in the Seattle Public Library. The phony names were purged this morning by the King County Canvassing Board.

But ACORN has also agreed to a lengthy agreement with King County about how it will work to avoid allowing any fraudulent signatures in any future voter registration drives. ACORN has agreed to a series of safeguards to monitor signature drives and to alert officials to any suspect registrations. The organization will also pay $25,000 to King County by Aug. 10 to reimburse for costs of the investigation.

The agreement governs ACORN's activities until 2013 and covers training, oversight, management issues, quality control, how to handle suspect registrations. The agreement says:

a. ACORN agrees that submission of registrations that have been fraudulently collected by an ACORN employee and not reviewed pursuant to the quality control procedures, or willfully turning in fraudulent cards, may constitute grounds for criminal prosecution of ACORN as a corporate entity unless such cards have been segregated by ACORN pursuant to the requirements of section 7 of this agreement.
b. ACORN agrees that violations of the terms of this agreement may be used as evidence in the State of Washington in future criminal prosecutions against ACORN employees, ACORN management, or ACORN as a corporate entity.

[truthmatters]

4

[actsnoblemartin]

I am against corruption period, because corruption hurts both republicans and democrats, sadly, it seems democrats look the other way when one of their own gets caught, and bashs us when we do it.

I would like to say, i dont find it hypocritical to passionently stand for something, and then be human, and make a mistake.

I dont see the democratic living by moral code of honor. Relax peeps, im talking about the party.


Sadly, your paranoia is only of your own. Care to cite a single example of multiple voting in Ohio or was your paranoia unfounded? Now, as you say, "Peel them eyes" and get back with me on something credible.

[truthmatters]

4

[Psychoblues]

Do you think many here would rather ignore that little indiscretion on the part of the official Republican operation?



No I just dont want it called what it is not.

These guys were punished right?

Why was no one punished in the Florida Felons list fiasco?

Have you ever read any of the works of Greg Palast? He kicks the asses of both dominant American Parties for that and much more!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[JohnDoe]

Do you think many here would rather ignore that little indiscretion on the part of the official Republican operation?




Have you ever read any of the works of Greg Palast? He kicks the asses of both dominant American Parties for that and much more!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yes, he is an investigative reporter that goes after whoever is in power, he went after the clinton admin as well as this one.

[Gunny]

Do you think many here would rather ignore that little indiscretion on the part of the official Republican operation?




Have you ever read any of the works of Greg Palast? He kicks the asses of both dominant American Parties for that and much more!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ignoring contrived alarmist bullshit seems rather logical. Miss Voting Rules here seems to think it's horrible to try and regulate voting and cut down on attempted fraud with voter IDs, but has no problem with dual-registered Democrats.

It's not a crime disallowing unlawful/double votes. There are rules. You know that. Don't adhere to them, your vote gets tossed. Simple as that.

[avatar4321]

Ignoring contrived alarmist bullshit seems rather logical. Miss Voting Rules here seems to think it's horrible to try and regulate voting and cut down on attempted fraud with voter IDs, but has no problem with dual-registered Democrats.

It's not a crime disallowing unlawful/double votes. There are rules. You know that. Don't adhere to them, your vote gets tossed. Simple as that.

but then they would have a harder time cheating.

[Gunny]

but then they would have a harder time cheating.

It's just amazing how blatantly obvious TM's partisanship is on the subject.

[avatar4321]

It's just amazing how blatantly obvious TM's partisanship is on the subject.

what's really amazing is she doesnt realize it. Its all of us that are out there.

[Gunny]

what's really amazing is she doesnt realize it. Its all of us that are out there.


True enough. That was my point, guess I left it off.:laugh2:

[JohnDoe]

she said she was against double voting, that it was a crime, but she ASKED that you show a case where it did occur....?

where are the facts or statistics that SHOW rampant voter fraud, via double voting, or stealing someone else's identity occurs?

[JohnDoe]

and if it is dead people voting, then this should be fixed SIMPLY by purging the dead people off the voting rolls when they die.

[PostmodernProphet]

good lord, I assumed this thread was still going because it had drifted off topic......what is left to discuss about the original issue?

[Psychoblues]

The lies that the scoundrels of voting fraud tell keep it up for posterity and defense. Have you ever read anything by Greg Palast? He kicks the asses of ALL that participate in voting fraud.

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

Yes I have and he does kick ass and he goes after WHOEVER is in power just like our reporters used to do.

This tread is very likely why Rove and Griffen both resigned because it will catch up to them and they will be prosicuted and I will celibrate the day they go to jail for this completely ANTI AMERICAN activity

I wouldn't go buy you party hat just yet. :laugh2:

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

I dont need a party hat. I just need Americas best interests over party interests to find it a good thing that those who would seek to keep legal voters from voting being prosicuted a happy occation.

How about a plan that keeps illegal voters from voting too ? Got a problem with that?

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

Before you throw money at a problem wouldnt you like to know if the problem even exsists?

All the studies done on this type of fraud show it is vertuallly non exsistant.

Another lie from the "truth" person.

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

See a real debat would include proof of such claims

go for it-----I hear there's an opening. :laugh2:

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

I did not think you could produce any.
Thanks for proving my point.

You silly shit--I was talking about the debate that is being discussed between a liberal and a conservative. I think you should be the liberal and debate you points and see how you fare.

[truthmatters]

4

[manu1959]

See a real debat would include proof of such claims

"debat" = bat from mexico

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

What is the point we discuss on here and debate things already?

WE ? You got a frog in your pocket or something? You don't debate anything. You just obliviously post shit as fast as you find it.

[Gunny]

she said she was against double voting, that it was a crime, but she ASKED that you show a case where it did occur....?

where are the facts or statistics that SHOW rampant voter fraud, via double voting, or stealing someone else's identity occurs?

Wrong answer. After the fact bullshit leads to little fantasy plans such as the Gore bid to swipe the 2000 election, and you libs would be screaming loudest.

And please link me to where TM said she was against double voting; which, completely contradicts her allegation that New Orleans officials are somehow disenfanchising voters who are re-registered elsewhere by cancelling out their New Orleans (LA) registration.

[Gunny]

and if it is dead people voting, then this should be fixed SIMPLY by purging the dead people off the voting rolls when they die.

You mean like purging people off the rolls who show to be registered elsewhere?:poke:

[Gunny]

I dont need a party hat. I just need Americas best interests over party interests to find it a good thing that those who would seek to keep legal voters from voting being prosicuted a happy occation.

No, you need THIS one: :tinfoil:

[Gunny]

See a real debate would include proof of such claims


:smoke:

What would YOU know about a real debate?

[Gunny]

"debat" = bat from mexico

Fantasy Island.:laugh2:

[Gunny]

Do you have anything of substance to say?

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

[BoogyMan]

It’s a damn shame that Americans have to put up with this.

....

I’m voting for accuracy, efficiency and respect.

Don't come in here pretending like liberals don't do vote fraud, ever heard of ACORN?

What a shame.



Source: http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/davidpostman/archives/2007/07/settlement_in_phony_voter_registration_case.html

A liberal group whose workers submitted fraudulent voter registration forms has agreed to a legal settlement with King County that says if the problem is repeated in the future the group could face criminal prosecution.

Keith Ervin has a story here that says people working for ACORN, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, admitted to filling out registration forms with names they took out of phone books while sitting in the Seattle Public Library. The phony names were purged this morning by the King County Canvassing Board.

But ACORN has also agreed to a lengthy agreement with King County about how it will work to avoid allowing any fraudulent signatures in any future voter registration drives. ACORN has agreed to a series of safeguards to monitor signature drives and to alert officials to any suspect registrations. The organization will also pay $25,000 to King County by Aug. 10 to reimburse for costs of the investigation.

The agreement governs ACORN's activities until 2013 and covers training, oversight, management issues, quality control, how to handle suspect registrations. The agreement says:

a. ACORN agrees that submission of registrations that have been fraudulently collected by an ACORN employee and not reviewed pursuant to the quality control procedures, or willfully turning in fraudulent cards, may constitute grounds for criminal prosecution of ACORN as a corporate entity unless such cards have been segregated by ACORN pursuant to the requirements of section 7 of this agreement.
b. ACORN agrees that violations of the terms of this agreement may be used as evidence in the State of Washington in future criminal prosecutions against ACORN employees, ACORN management, or ACORN as a corporate entity.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

And yet you whine in another thread when efforts are made to stop fraud, even if it is a small case. You can't have it both ways. How someone can make so many claims of being against fraud and then whine when a republican makes an effort to put a halt to possible fraud is beyond me.

[JohnDoe]

And yet you whine in another thread when efforts are made to stop fraud, even if it is a small case. You can't have it both ways. How someone can make so many claims of being against fraud and then whine when a republican makes an effort to put a halt to possible fraud is beyond me.


good morning Jim,

There is only so much money and a limited focus from the public...

Do you PRETEND that having a picture id is going to solve all voter fraud problems and use all of your tax moneys to rectify that or do you use your money and resources to prevent OVERWHELMING voter fraud...electronic voting with no paper trails, Fellon lists that only have 1/3 of the people on the list as Actual Felons, caging schemes, dead voters etc....?

pretending that spending our tax dollars on voter id's with pictures won't solve ONE SINGLE overwelming voter FRAUD ISSUE...not one imo...

If we solved our REAL voter fraud issues and used our monies to take care of that and there was money left over to issue picture id's to everyone then fine... though I still see it as a waste, I don't see how having a picture would stop voter fraud....when fake id's in the day of the Computer are a dime a dozen.

If you don't want dead people to vote, THEN REMOVE the dead people from the voter rolls, they won't be able to vote....BUT NO ONE is discussing this measure....why? Why are they pretending a picture id would help when it won't for this..... and what about those that vote absentee, who do not have a photo id to vote?

We are being SCAMMED in to believing that a photo ID or National ID card is going to stop fraud and I don't buy in to it....

jd

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

Asking for ID to vote won't cost anyone a single penny, other than those that might need to get an ID if they don't have one already. Ask me if I have any sympathy for someone who doesn't have an ID already and might have to spend up to $5 to get one.

[jimnyc]

Defending the right to vote is not whining and I bet our founding fathers would not call it such.
If there were real fraud proven in these cases I woul fight it , there is not fraud proven.

Do you jail your neighbor on the left of you because the neighbor on your right might steal from you?

There has been no fraud proven to stop.
There is good evidence such measures keep perfectly legal voters from voting.

How can you ask people to give up their right to vote because Jim thinks there may be fraud but he cant prove anything is wrong?

I really dont think you would do that.

They aren't being asked to give up their right to vote, they're being asked to provide ID. Anyone crying about having to provide ID gets zero sympathy from me. In fact, I'll likely laugh at them for being so irresponsible.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

Do you think your lack of sympathy overrides the constitutional right to vote?

Why should we force ID on people to solve a nothing? There is nothing to solve ,there is no problem so why do anything ? Why throw tax money at something that does not even exsist and yet study show will decrease the legal voter turn out?

How is asking for ID and then allowing that person to vote afterwards denying them their constitutional rights? And you don't think illegals have registered AND voted in the past? Think again.

Texas rep John Culberson stated it briefly and very effectively:


Our elections are too important to allow the possibility of fraudulent and illegal voting practices and that is why I supported H.R. 4844, the Federal Election Integrity Act of 2006. This bill would ensure that state and local governments have effective means to prevent non-citizen immigrants from illegally registering and voting in federal elections.

The Federal Election Integrity Act would require voters in federal elections to provide a photo ID by 2008. By 2010, voters would be required to provide a photo ID that can only be obtained with proof of citizenship. Federal law already makes it a crime for non-citizens to vote in federal elections and this bill would give state and local governments the tools they need to enforce the law. H.R. 4844 is important legislation and will preserve the democratic integrity of our electoral process.

[truthmatters]

[4

[jimnyc]

Dont you think someone should have to prove something is actually wrong before we throw money at the problem?

Do you think government should just act on rumors?

Illegals voting in elections is a fact, not a rumor. No money is being thrown at the problem. How many times do you need to be told it's not costing me a damn penny to have someone else provide ID to vote?

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

Because the courts ahve determined that the cost is in essance a fee to vote and the gov must provide the the IDs for free at a cost to the gov.

The paperwork and employee time to effect the programs also cost money.

I don't care about "in essence", the bottom line is that it doesn't cost me a penny to have someone else provide ID. And cost to implement? Open wallet, show ID, then vote. No cost, and about 5 seconds of time.

But I suppose you think there's no need to ensure illegal aliens don't vote as they've done in the past.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

I notice you conveniently fail to address the issue of requiring proper photo ID's to keep non-citizens from voting.

Why do you want non-citizens to break the law and vote?

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

It will not keep non citizens from voting because this is not a problem so there is nothing to prevent.

Are you stating for the record that non-citizens voting hasn't be a problem? I want to see it on record before I make you look foolish again.

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

Can you prove it has been a problem big enough to warrent the change?

ANY voter fraud for whatever length of time is TOOO BIG.

[jimnyc]

Can you prove it has been a problem big enough to warrent the change?

ANY problem with voter fraud warrants change. With that said, start with this article. MANY more can be found, this was just the first on the list of my search.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=leg_testimony_june222006

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

FAIR gets a large protion of it funding from a white supremacy group.

What an idiot! I don't care if they got funding from Ted Bundy - facts are facts! Can you dispute the facts on record? No, you can't, so you'd rather try and change the subject.

Thanks for playing, you lose and look like a fool again. Come back and try again tomorrow! :laugh2:

[Dilloduck]

FAIR gets a large protion of it funding from a white supremacy group.

Try to follow along with what's being asked.

[truthmatters]

4

[JohnDoe]

I notice you conveniently fail to address the issue of requiring proper photo ID's to keep non-citizens from voting.

Why do you want non-citizens to break the law and vote? how does a photo id keep non citizens from voting? How would that work?

(offtopic) and jim, i have been trying, but i can't find anything on how the military counts iraqi deaths and how it changed...in print, other than sources that would not be acceptable to you! fyi

jd

[jimnyc]

Where is FAIRs study on illegals voting?

I could not find one in there, they presented no evidence that I saw?

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest. I knew you had comprehension issues for quite some time now. But let's set that aside for now.

Do a little reading on how easy it is for a non-citizen to vote if they wanted to. Why wouldn't you want to put measures in place to ensure this doesn't happen?

[JohnDoe]

What an idiot! I don't care if they got funding from Ted Bundy - facts are facts! Can you dispute the facts on record? No, you can't, so you'd rather try and change the subject.

Thanks for playing, you lose and look like a fool again. Come back and try again tomorrow! :laugh2:
Yet you deny an article from the LATIMES from me as NOT a legitimate source? :slap: ;)

btw, I read the article and it did give an example near the bottom for TM to go back and look at that described a situation where over 700 illegals voted...


But that STILL does not answer my questions to you about how would a picture id to vote, stop this illegal voting from happening? We have states that issue picture id's and driver's licences to both legal and illegal aliens and neither should or do, have the right to vote in this country.... that is right, even if you are a legal immigrant, you can't vote....

so, how precisely will a picture id required to vote help us? It won't, something else has to be done...I don't really know what, and this is up to each individual state, not the fed's decision to make, I don't believe?

And how will a gvt picture id help with absentee voters?

jd

[truthmatters]

[4

[jimnyc]

Yet you deny an article from the LATIMES from me as NOT a legitimate source?

I could have searched the archives from congress and cited the story from there but didn't have the time. You did notice at the top that what I cited was a transcript of testimony to Congress, no?


btw, I read the article and it did give an example near the bottom for TM to go back and look at that described a situation where over 700 illegals voted...

Thank you



But that STILL does not answer my questions to you about how would a picture id to vote, stop this illegal voting from happening? We have states that issue picture id's and driver's licences to both legal and illegal aliens and neither should or do, have the right to vote in this country.... that is right, even if you are a legal immigrant, you can't vote....

Yes, we still have a handful of states that are allowing illegals to get drivers licenses, and this too needs to be put to a stop. The article I cited shows the loopholes that exist that allow this to happen and it is easily corrected, IMO.


so, how precisely will a picture id required to vote help us? It won't, something else has to be done...I don't really know what, and this is up to each individual state, not the fed's decision to make, I don't believe?

And how will a gvt picture id help with absentee voters?

Require SS numbers to get said ID's, and cross reference them to ensure the person is a legal resident. I don't have an answer for the absentee issue but obviously that needs to be closely scrutinized as well and have something put in place to ensure voting is within compliance.

[jimnyc]

Can you show me to the part or post it ?

Are you serious? You just couldn't read the article and find this? It's not like it's 100 pages long!

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

What article?

I give up! You are certifiable! :laugh2:

[truthmatters]

I give up! You are certifiable! :laugh2:

I looked through the FAIR site and they have no proof of any illegals voting.

I am asking JD where the article she was talking about is I cant find it.

[jimnyc]

I looked through the FAIR site and they have no proof of any illegals voting.

I am asking JD where the article she was talking about is I cant find it.

If you're asking her a question, why did you quote me and ask "what article"? And the testimony to congress clearly outlines the illegal voting issue and a search can be done on those specifics if you so desire.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

I just went through that whole page again and they do not give any proof of what they claim.

Where are the referances to the cases they state?

I'm not going to outline the whole thing for you as you fail to comprehend anything I post. But here's one snippet. Are you stating the US Rep perhaps lied?


"Task force Chairman [U.S. Representative] Vernon J. Ehlers, R-Mich., said investigators had found concrete evidence of 748 illegal votes by noncitizens, not enough to throw Sanchez's victory into doubt."

[Gunny]

good morning Jim,

There is only so much money and a limited focus from the public...

Do you PRETEND that having a picture id is going to solve all voter fraud problems and use all of your tax moneys to rectify that or do you use your money and resources to prevent OVERWHELMING voter fraud...electronic voting with no paper trails, Fellon lists that only have 1/3 of the people on the list as Actual Felons, caging schemes, dead voters etc....?

pretending that spending our tax dollars on voter id's with pictures won't solve ONE SINGLE overwelming voter FRAUD ISSUE...not one imo...

If we solved our REAL voter fraud issues and used our monies to take care of that and there was money left over to issue picture id's to everyone then fine... though I still see it as a waste, I don't see how having a picture would stop voter fraud....when fake id's in the day of the Computer are a dime a dozen.

If you don't want dead people to vote, THEN REMOVE the dead people from the voter rolls, they won't be able to vote....BUT NO ONE is discussing this measure....why? Why are they pretending a picture id would help when it won't for this..... and what about those that vote absentee, who do not have a photo id to vote?

We are being SCAMMED in to believing that a photo ID or National ID card is going to stop fraud and I don't buy in to it....

jd

Freakin' absurd. Obviously having a voter ID is going to make it a lot harder for someone to vote in another person's name, be they living or dead. And NO ONE so far has said voter ID's will solve ALL voter fraud issues. That's something you've just made up to try an sell a bogus argument.

No one's being scammed because no one's selling it the way you are trying to play it off. If included in a package of measures, it damned-sure can keep fraud at a minimum.

I'll bet dollars to donuts you didn't whine-n-cry about the tax dollars that got blown with that little circus Gore created in 2000 ....

[Gunny]

It will not keep non citizens from voting because this is not a problem so there is nothing to prevent.

Simply amazing. Stick your head in a hole in the ground and pretend it isn't happening because it doesn't suit your partisan argument for it to.:bs1:

[Gunny]

Are you serious? You just couldn't read the article and find this? It's not like it's 100 pages long!

LMAO. Poor jim ... beseiged by dizbots.:laugh2:

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

Those are the facts.

Just as it's a fact that non US citizens have voted in prior elections.

Why do you want non citizens to have the ability to vote in the US?

[Gunny]

Gunny all the studies done on this type of fraud say it next to nil in exsistance.
Its spending money to impliment and pay for IDs(the law says you cant require people to pay for them to vote) and the programs which include mailig the people notices.
Why do you want to spend tax dollars on a fraud type which does not effect elections?

The tax dollars spent to recount went to waste because a recount was started and then ordered stopped because Bush did not want the votes recounted.

Those are the facts.

Is that so? Then explain why it is you lefties are always crying "voter fraud" ...

You tried to hold up the 2000 election in FL, and the 2004 election in OH. Now you want to sell it otherwise because quite frankly, the steps being taken will probably hurt fraud being perpetrated by lefties far more than the right.

As has already been pointed out, ONE case of voter fraud is voter fraud and should be addressed. The only thing you've made obvious throughout this thread and the others on this issue is that you think anything done to those YOU assume are a liberal majority to ensure there is no voter fraud is somehow not worth the effort because YOU assume it is inconsequential.

Your partisan agenda couldn't be more obvious if you posted it at Times Square.

[Gunny]

Just as it's a fact that non US citizens have voted in prior elections.

Why do you want non citizens to have the ability to vote in the US?

Note: She accused Republicans of wrongdoing in LA for purging dual-registered voters because she assumes that since they were Ktrina refugees, the majority would vote "D."

On this one she's assuming it disenfranchises black voters in Georgia, more historical "D" votes.

If a Republican wins the election in 2008, just WHO do you suppose will be the FIRST on here with voter fraud conspiracy theories?

She's as obvious as a heart attack.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

There is ample evidence that something has been wrong with elections for years now and I find it interestig the only type you are concerned with is the kind of which there is not proof for.

I've provided proof for you.

Why do you hate my proof so much?

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

What is your proof ?

The site you gave states things but gives no proof of their exsistance.

I dont trust people who hate others of color to tell the truth.

They need to provide links to what they claim.

Where are the news stories and the court papers?

I already gave it to you! You have to be the most dense person on the planet!


"Task force Chairman [U.S. Representative] Vernon J. Ehlers, R-Mich., said investigators had found concrete evidence of 748 illegal votes by noncitizens, not enough to throw Sanchez's victory into doubt."

Here's more on it:

http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1998/02/13/cq/sanchez.html

[Gunny]

There is ample evidence that something has been wrong with elections for years now and I find it interestig the only type you are concerned with is the kind of which there is not proof for.

Wrong. I am interested in in minimizing it at evey level and every front. Unlike you, who are interested in minimizing it only at the level and front you assume works in favor of the Democrats.

[jimnyc]

Wrong. I am interested in in minimizing it at evey level and every front. Unlike you, who are interested in minimizing it only at the level and front you assume works in favor of the Democrats.

Exactly. I don't give a rats ass who is benefiting from the fraudulent votes, they need to do what they can to stop it regardless. TM thinks voter fraud is acceptable so long as it's in small amounts.

[Gunny]

Exactly. I don't give a rats ass who is benefiting from the fraudulent votes, they need to do what they can to stop it regardless. TM thinks voter fraud is acceptable so long as it's in small amounts.

Ever have that baseball hanging by a string from your tree in the back yard? You can hit home run after home run and the ball still just hangs there. I'm beginning to equate arguing with "certain people" to THAT.:laugh2:

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

No one is benifiting from illegals voting because its vurtually non exsistant.

Who has benifited from the voting machines which cant make a record of the votes we cast?

Who benifited from the Felons lis tin Florida?

Who benifited from making people stand in line for 11 hours in Ohio to vote?

Who benifited from the thousands of votes knocked out in 1981 and 1986 by vote caging?

You refuse to discuss real vote fraud and applaud the new attempts at knocking voters off the rolls with this sham.

Why ?

Don't change the subject now that you've been proven wrong. We already stated ALL instances of fraud need to be stopped, it's only YOU that are deciding which forms of fraud are valid and which aren't.

Illegals and non-citizens voting DOES exist and it needs to be curtailed, no matter how small you may think it may be.

[truthmatters]

4

[jimnyc]

Changed the subject?

proven wrong?

never happened

Sure, you keep thinking that! Your denial about the existence of non-citizens voting is plastered all over this thread. My proof that it does in fact exist is right there for all to see.

Why do you hate to look intelligent?

[Trigg]

Sure, you keep thinking that! Your denial about the existence of non-citizens voting is plastered all over this thread. My proof that it does in fact exist is right there for all to see.

Why do you hate to look intelligent?



:clap: :laugh2:

[truthmatters]

4

[Dilloduck]

http://tinyurl.com/29a9dj


This is what is really happening while you talk of unsubstanciated rumors


Resurrecting Jim Crow: The Erratic Resume of the Voting Section Chief
A collaborative effort by ePluribus Staff Writers: Cho, Standingup, wanderindiana, Aaron Barlow & Roxy
07 May 2007
When John K. Tanner replaced Joe Rich as section chief of the Justice Department's Voting Section in 2005, a breathtaking politicization -- already under way after Alex Acosta was put in charge of the Civil Rights Division -- accelerated sharply. The exodus of talent, expertise, and knowledge of civil rights law in the two years under Tanner's stewardship is numbing.Roughly 50% of the staff1 -- attorneys, including many of the top litigators, researchers and analysts -- have left, and Tanner has waged an aggressive effort to remake the section in his own image -- not an image that most people who promote the core mission of the Voting Rights Act, which the Section is primarily responsible for enforcing, would support.
Why it matters
Forty years ago, black and white Americans were murdered for trying to stop Jim Crow. Thugs, drunken good old boys and miscreants pulled the trigger, lit the torch, yanked the rope.
Courageous men and women like Medgar Evers, James Chaney, Andrew Goodman, Michael Schwerner, and Viola Liuzzo fought and lost their lives to get rid of the Jim Crow laws that deprived African-Americans of the right to vote.
Eventually, with the passage of the 1965 Voting Rights Act, the voting rights of every American citizen were secured.

But Jim Crow, like the Dark Lord in the popular Harry Potter children's books, never completely died. And the resurrection, assisted by the seeding of political appointees and agreeable new hires within the very government institutions designed to protect the civil rights of Americans, is now dangerously close at hand.
Tanner, the new Section Chief, who received his law degree by attending American University night school, cites his early civil rights bona fides in a recent FLA-Law piece "'I would go into the projects and knock on doors and take people to the federal registrars,' explained Tanner, who met [Martin Luther] King during this time."
Yet according to many insiders, Tanner -- who was born and spent his early years in Alabama, graduating in 1967 from Indian Springs School near Birmingham -- has in just a little over 2 years essentially gutted the ability of the Voting Section to protect the voting rights of these most vulnerable members of our society.
Partisan Politics in the DoJ Civil Rights Division
Bob Kengle, in an May 1st interview, "Former DoJ Official: I left Due to Institutional Sabotage," reports that:
[...] by late 2004, I did not believe that I could ensure that following the law and facts would remain a higher priority than partisan favoritism. This was based partly upon my expectation that the Administration, if returned to office, would feel less constraint against heavy-handed management and biased enforcement than had been the case in the aftermath of the controversial 2000 election. To put it bluntly, before 2004 the desire to politicize the Voting Section's work was evident, but it was tempered by a recognition that there were limits to doing so. That such constraints diminished over time is evidenced by the well-known and ham-fisted handling of decisions involving Texas' congressional redistricting plan in late 2003 and Georgia's voter ID law in 2005.
Critics point to both of these widely-known instances (the 2003 Texas congressional redistricting plan and the Georgia voter ID law in 2005) as evidence that the political appointees or "front office" and their all too obliging protégés were using redistricting and voter suppression to manipulate elections.
According to Department of Justice sources, during the 2003 Texas redistricting, while Joe Rich was still Section Chief, the career staff unanimously decided the proposed plan was discriminatory. However, when the "front office" overruled, Rich refused to sign the recommendation for preclearance, taking a principled stand for civil rights law. As Steve Bickerstaff, professor of law at the University of Texas noted in his book Lines in the Sand: Congressional Redistricting in Texas and the Downfall of Tom DeLay: "Within a week of receiving the recommendation (i.e., on Friday, December 19 [2003]), [Principal Deputy Assistant Attorney General] Sheldon Bradshaw sent the Texas secretary of state a letter containing the simple standard wording for a preclearance letter: 'The Attorney General does not interpose any objection,'" allowing the redistricting to go ahead. According to sources, it is extremely rare that the front office, not the Section Chief or career attorneys, would sign such a letter. Other sources suggest that at the time Tanner was actively, if not openly, seeking to be Section Chief.
By 2005 and the Georgia voter ID law, Tanner had succeeded in his quest for promotion. In striking contrast to Rich's behavior with Texas, Tanner went against the near unanimous recommendations of the career staff, instead falling in line with the desires of the political appointees.
Tanner's memo, supposedly representing the analysis of the Voting Section, went against the recommendations of four of the five attorneys and analysts to provide "preclearance" or approval for the State of Georgia to institute the new voter ID law. Toby Moore, former Voting Section political geographer, told McClatchy last month that Tanner "doctored the memo ... reversing many of our findings."
The sole approving attorney was a recent hire from a third-tier law school, the University of Mississippi, Joshua Rogers who had been in the Voting Section just two months. He was given a cash award based on his work on the Georgia Voter ID law.
Although the Georgia law was subsequently struck down as unconstitutional. and unable to withstand judicial scrutiny, a side effect of Tanner's process was to establish a new policy that hamstrung the Voting Section career staff who were dedicated to upholding voter rights.
Out with the old and in with the new -- The Section 5 Preclearance Process
As Dan Eggen reported in 2005 Staff Opinions Banned In Voting Rights Case.
Under Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act of 1965, Georgia, Texas and other states with a history of discriminatory election practices are required to receive approval from the Justice Department or a federal court for any changes to their voting systems. Section 5 prohibits changes that would be "retrogressive," or bring harm to, minority voters.

For decades, staff attorneys have made recommendations in Section 5 cases that have carried great weight within the department and that have been passed along to senior officials who make a final determination, former and current employees say.

Preventing staff members from making such recommendations is a significant departure and runs the risk of making the process appear more political, experts said.
Sources have compared the "old" process to the new for ePluribus Media:
By taking away this ability to make written recommendations for objections, Tanner essentially eliminated the audit trail and made it impossible for Voting Section analysts and attorneys to say "we recommended an objection, but we were overruled." The only person who gets to make a recommendation now is Tanner. The funny thing is Voting Section analysts still make recommendations NOT to object. In fact, they make a hundred or so every week. But they can't recommend an objection. Instead of writing a "Section 5 Recommendation Memorandum," recommending an objection, they are now forced to write a "Memorandum of Section 5 Analysis," which gives arguments both for and against objection. If the front office decides not to object, or if Tanner himself decides not to object, they can say "well, we found the arguments against objection more compelling."
In sum, after John Tanner changed the memorandum policy, Voting Section analysts and attorneys could no longer make written recommendations that the Department object to a change in a state's voter laws that would infringe on minorities' voting rights. They could only 1) recommend that no objection be made or 2) provide arguments for and against objection. The ability to recommend an objection in writing has been completely stripped.

Actually these are some facts about what happened as interpreted by the authors of the article. BTW--is an election without a paper trail legit?

[Nukeman]

Actually these are some facts about what happened as interpreted by the authors of the article. BTW--is an election without a paper trail legit?
Only if the Dems win!!!!!!!!!:laugh2:

[Psychoblues]

Your response makes no sense, Nm.



Only if the Dems win!!!!!!!!!:laugh2:

The Democrats are demanding a paper trail, win, lose or draw. It is only the conservatives and the makers of the voting machines that contribute heavily to conservative candidates that are against the principle of verified voting. Hell, if the Repukes had their way only rich white property owners could vote at all. How many of us does that leave out?