I don't understand gender identity

[gabosaurus]

We had this workshop thing this morning to work out how counselors were going to deal with the problems relating to gender identity. There were two speakers, a guy who discussed ethics and a "woman" who was not really a women but somewhere in between (big WTF). Here I thought I was a liberal and all and have found out that I'm really not. Because, to me, girls who look like girls are girls. Boys who look like boys are boys. I could care less if you are gay or lesbian. None of my business. But if I'm the bathroom monitor during lunch, don't come telling me that you "feel like a woman" and want to use the girl's bathroom. Homie don't play that game. The alleged female person was horrified that I didn't understand "gender feelings." I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls. And if another girl asks you for a tampon, you damn better have one on you. I discussed this with my very liberated and modern high school age daughter last night. I figured she would understand these things. Instead, she told me that girls get "creeped out" at the thought of any guys in a girls restroom. She does know a transgender guy who wants to be a girl at school. But, strangely enough, he is OK with using the boys restroom. Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.

[Noir]

Some weird points in this, example-


I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls.

Are girls forced to wear skirts at the school?

[hjmick]

We had this workshop thing this morning to work out how counselors were going to deal with the problems relating to gender identity. There were two speakers, a guy who discussed ethics and a "woman" who was not really a women but somewhere in between (big WTF). Here I thought I was a liberal and all and have found out that I'm really not. Because, to me, girls who look like girls are girls. Boys who look like boys are boys. I could care less if you are gay or lesbian. None of my business. But if I'm the bathroom monitor during lunch, don't come telling me that you "feel like a woman" and want to use the girl's bathroom. Homie don't play that game. The alleged female person was horrified that I didn't understand "gender feelings." I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls. And if another girl asks you for a tampon, you damn better have one on you. I discussed this with my very liberated and modern high school age daughter last night. I figured she would understand these things. Instead, she told me that girls get "creeped out" at the thought of any guys in a girls restroom. She does know a transgender guy who wants to be a girl at school. But, strangely enough, he is OK with using the boys restroom. Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.



Maybe it's the beer, perhaps the hydrocodone (root canal...), but I have to say, there's nothing wrong with your POV. Especially as a mother of a teenage girl.


One thing I discovered being a parent, your views on certain things change, especially as your children grow older. Sometimes your views don't change, but you tolerate the alternative view because it's in the best interest of your child. Sometimes you just don't care because it's in the best interest of your kid...

For instance, I'm not particularly fond of the idea of abortion. I'm not militant about it by any means, but I have three daughters. One who is nowhere close to being ready to be a mother, one who is, and one who should never, ever be. To my mind, I am glad that the option exists for them, though I would never vocalize it as an option, except to the third and oldest daughter. I know I may catch some heat for this view, but until you've walked a mile in my shoes, bugger off...

So, no, Gabo, there is nothing wrong with harboring ideas and values that may not particularly jibe with what you consider "liberal values." You may be turning moderate in your old age and there's nothing wrong with that. It happens to the best of us, just look at me... I lean to the right on many issues, but I tend to be a tad more liberal on the social side.


Though this does beg the question... How does your view on this topic affect your feeling about artists (Bruce Springsteen) boycotting North Carolina?





Remember: “A boy of 15 who is not a democrat is good for nothing, and he is no better who is a democrat at 20.” - John Adams

[jimnyc]

We had this workshop thing this morning to work out how counselors were going to deal with the problems relating to gender identity. There were two speakers, a guy who discussed ethics and a "woman" who was not really a women but somewhere in between (big WTF). Here I thought I was a liberal and all and have found out that I'm really not. Because, to me, girls who look like girls are girls. Boys who look like boys are boys. I could care less if you are gay or lesbian. None of my business. But if I'm the bathroom monitor during lunch, don't come telling me that you "feel like a woman" and want to use the girl's bathroom. Homie don't play that game. The alleged female person was horrified that I didn't understand "gender feelings." I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls. And if another girl asks you for a tampon, you damn better have one on you. I discussed this with my very liberated and modern high school age daughter last night. I figured she would understand these things. Instead, she told me that girls get "creeped out" at the thought of any guys in a girls restroom. She does know a transgender guy who wants to be a girl at school. But, strangely enough, he is OK with using the boys restroom. Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.

Okay, back to the topic...

No, you have a LONG way to go before losing that identity that is carved extremely deep into stone. :laugh:

What you have done is recognized something as common sense. Common sense also makes us want to keep the rest rooms separate, and even more so if you think of a child being involved. I've heard some say (not here) that "why does it matter, there are bathroom stalls for the ladies anyway"

Really? The cuckoos, they won't think twice about bringing in recording devices and trying from below or over the top, or just trying to find ways to watch themselves. Never underestimate these weirdos.

[Black Diamond]

Okay, back to the topic...

No, you have a LONG way to go before losing that identity that is carved extremely deep into stone. :laugh:

What you have done is recognized something as common sense. Common sense also makes us want to keep the rest rooms separate, and even more so if you think of a child being involved. I've heard some say (not here) that "why does it matter, there are bathroom stalls for the ladies anyway"

Really? The cuckoos, they won't think twice about bringing in recording devices and trying from below or over the top, or just trying to find ways to watch themselves. Never underestimate these weirdos.
Lynch has their back.


http://www.syracuse.com/us-news/index.ssf/2016/05/loretta_lynch_north_carolina_bathroom_law_jim_crow _laws.html

[gabosaurus]

Are girls forced to wear skirts at the school?

Of course not. What I meant to say is, if you want to use the girls restroom, you need to look like a girl.

When I was in college, I went to a few occasions where you didn't know who the girls were. Some of the drag queens were very convincing. Same with some of the male impersonators. If a drag queen is going to the womens restroom, who would know?

Which brings me to Target. I can't imagine many places more secure than Target. They have cameras everywhere. They have security everywhere. Regardless of their stated "policy," a guy going into a girls restroom better have a good reason.

[aboutime]

Okay, back to the topic...

No, you have a LONG way to go before losing that identity that is carved extremely deep into stone. :laugh:

What you have done is recognized something as common sense. Common sense also makes us want to keep the rest rooms separate, and even more so if you think of a child being involved. I've heard some say (not here) that "why does it matter, there are bathroom stalls for the ladies anyway"

Really? The cuckoos, they won't think twice about bringing in recording devices and trying from below or over the top, or just trying to find ways to watch themselves. Never underestimate these weirdos.



jim.....therein lies the basic problem. Common Sense, and Logic, with morality has just about totally been replaced by POLITICAL CORRECTNESS, and the WHINING of the IGNORANT to backup their WHINING.

[Noir]

Of course not. What I meant to say is, if you want to use the girls restroom, you need to look like a girl.

So you have no problem with anyone using a designated toilet as long as they are 'passable' as whatever sex you think they should be?

[Atticus Finch]

Since the libs and the PC crowd have created a bizzaro world where anything goes I have decided that I'm not playing along.I'll stay in the world that I grew up in where people still had a since of morality, dignity, and propriety.And so I've also decided if you try to invade my world with your non-sensical bullshit I will attempt tp seprate your mind from your body.That is all.

[revelarts]

.... Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.

In some left leaning crowds Yes you are indeed a full on heretic.
And a hatful ignorant bigot in need of de-programing from evil old patriarchal and christian morals.

And you should not be allowed to vote based on your views because they are obviously ONLY religiously motivated with no ground in reason, fact or current fashion and therefore are verboton.

[revelarts]

Plus Biologly doesn't count here only Psychology.
If they believe it, no matter WHAT the clear Biology says, then people must legally recognize it as real and accommodate it ... unless of course your beliefs are Christian that is.

[Trigg]

So you have no problem with anyone using a designated toilet as long as they are 'passable' as whatever sex you think they should be?


that does appear to be what she is saying, and what is wrong with that????


By allowing men-who look like men- to walk into a woman's changing room/bathroom/lockerroom you are opening the door to perverts who HAVE ALL READY taken advantage in these situations.

[Noir]

that does appear to be what she is saying, and what is wrong with that????

It just creates and odd sort of system whereby she is alright with people who where born a man using a designated womans toilet as long as they look enough like a women. She doesn't appear then to actually have a problem transgender/sex people using the toilets they want to, it all comes down to general appearance.

[Elessar]

We had this workshop thing this morning to work out how counselors were going to deal with the problems relating to gender identity. There were two speakers, a guy who discussed ethics and a "woman" who was not really a women but somewhere in between (big WTF). Here I thought I was a liberal and all and have found out that I'm really not. Because, to me, girls who look like girls are girls. Boys who look like boys are boys. I could care less if you are gay or lesbian. None of my business. But if I'm the bathroom monitor during lunch, don't come telling me that you "feel like a woman" and want to use the girl's bathroom. Homie don't play that game. The alleged female person was horrified that I didn't understand "gender feelings." I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls. And if another girl asks you for a tampon, you damn better have one on you. I discussed this with my very liberated and modern high school age daughter last night. I figured she would understand these things. Instead, she told me that girls get "creeped out" at the thought of any guys in a girls restroom. She does know a transgender guy who wants to be a girl at school. But, strangely enough, he is OK with using the boys restroom. Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.


Reading this, I will tell you what I think. I think you are being a responsible parent to school age girls.
You'll not lose Liberal status for desiring to protect other girls and women.

I do not have anything against Gays unless they try to force their behavior on me, and it could get ugly.

But....I do believe we are born with a certain biological and physiological gender, and unless one has
undergone the surgery and hormone treatments to alter that - "You" are still what you were born as.

[Gunny]

It just creates and odd sort of system whereby she is alright with people who where born a man using a designated womans toilet as long as they look enough like a women. She doesn't appear then to actually have a problem transgender/sex people using the toilets they want to, it all comes down to general appearance.

I'll just be my usual brutal self here. If you got a d*ck, you're a boy and you use the boy's room. Gender is NOT an option. It's simple biology. You spoiled brats that want to control everything up to and including biology nowadays make me sick. You can't get a job or get of the house until you're 30 but you want to control biological fact.

Just maybe if you did get a job and get out of mommy's house y'all wouldn't have all this time to whine about stupid sh*t.

[Noir]

I'll just be my usual brutal self here. If you got a d*ck, you're a boy and you use the boy's room. Gender is NOT an option. It's simple biology. You spoiled brats that want to control everything up to and including biology nowadays make me sick. You can't get a job or get of the house until you're 30 but you want to control biological fact.

Just maybe if you did get a job and get out of mommy's house y'all wouldn't have all this time to whine about stupid sh*t.

and yet somehow I have time to whine, I guess I'm just gifted ^,^

[Gunny]

and yet somehow I have time to whine, I guess I'm just gifted ^,^

I have no idea. You don't live in this country; yet, choose to sit in judgement of everything we do here based on what you don't know. You probably post on your boss's dime.

If you have the time to whine about what is and isn't between your legs and which head you're going to use ... plant a damned garden.

[Abbey Marie]

It just creates and odd sort of system whereby she is alright with people who where born a man using a designated womans toilet as long as they look enough like a women. She doesn't appear then to actually have a problem transgender/sex people using the toilets they want to, it all comes down to general appearance.

I would guess that when Gabby said "You'd better look like a man", etc., she meant under the hood.

[gabosaurus]

I would guess that when Gabby said "You'd better look like a man", etc., she meant under the hood.

In my opinion, if you wish to "declare your identity" as a male or female, you need to dress as one and behave like one.
If you are a male, you can't just say "I'm a girl" and suddenly have everyone believe you. This is why I call BS on people like Bruce Jenner. Or whoever he/she is now.
Unless you are very rich and/or connected, you can't just walk in and say "I want a sex change." You have to look female, dress female and behave female.

I have been to gay clubs. I have seen men who looked more female than a lot of females. I have also seen women look as masculine as many men. This is why the whole "bathroom law" thing is a farce. Are you going to cameras and security checking underneath the hood?

[Noir]

If you have the time to whine about what is and isn't between your legs and which head you're going to use ... plant a damned garden.

Sadly we have a concrete garden, however we do have a small bounty of potted Fruit, Veg, and herbs (:


I would guess that when Gabby said "You'd better look like a man", etc., she meant under the hood.

and how can you tell that by looking at a clothed person?

[gabosaurus]

If you have the time to whine about what is and isn't between your legs and which head you're going to use ... plant a damned garden.

Some men haven't been capable of using either head for quite some time now... :rolleyes:

[Gunny]

In my opinion, if you wish to "declare your identity" as a male or female, you need to dress as one and behave like one.
If you are a male, you can't just say "I'm a girl" and suddenly have everyone believe you. This is why I call BS on people like Bruce Jenner. Or whoever he/she is now.
Unless you are very rich and/or connected, you can't just walk in and say "I want a sex change." You have to look female, dress female and behave female.

I have been to gay clubs. I have seen men who looked more female than a lot of females. I have also seen women look as masculine as many men. This is why the whole "bathroom law" thing is a farce. Are you going to cameras and security checking underneath the hood?

I've got two daughters and 2 nieces. Two granddaughters. A GF who has two daughters and a granddaughter. I seem to be the only guy. I don't want ANY of them in the bathroom with some dude. I don't care what it wants to call itself. I don't want to be in the bathroom with you. They have the very same stuff in the boy's room they do in the girl's room. This is making an issue out of nothing.

[Gunny]

Sadly we have a concrete garden, however we do have a small bounty of potted Fruit, Veg, and herbs (:



and how can you tell that by looking at a clothed person?

And WHO is the veggie guy here? I've got 6 tomato plants, 2 squash, 6 rosebushes, and all the GF's annuals to deal with daily. And I'm not even a farmer redneck. I'm a cowboy redneck. 3 different gardens.

[Gunny]

Some men haven't been capable of using either head for quite some time now... :rolleyes:

Just wait. Y'all females like to gripe about us thinking with the wrong head. You ain't got nothing I've never seen nor had before and it's highly overrated. You'll find out when the old man gets older. Using that thang as a weapon don't work past about 45. I've got a remote, TV and a buttload of bluerays. :laugh:

[Abbey Marie]

Sadly we have a concrete garden, however we do have a small bounty of potted Fruit, Veg, and herbs (:



and how can you tell that by looking at a clothed person?

You usually can't. Which is why this whole bathroom thing is ludicrous and potentially dangerous.

[Gunny]

You usually can't. Which is why this whole bathroom thing is ludicrous and potentially dangerous.

To me. this is another of those contrived political issues from leftwingnut goofballs. I'm actually desensitized to the issue. I've lived with all girls since I got married except for a brief span of time. I lso grew up in a different era. We had mass showers and no stalls when I was in school. And you can imagine what the Corps is like. I remember the first time I took my second wife camping and I said go right behind that bush, check for snakes and squat. :laugh: It means nothing to me. Been in the field with female Marines.

At the same time, I can see the danger to the situation with these airheads and predators in public. I'm totally against it. We are not born unisexual nor transexual. Guys are guys and girls are girls. Y'all are just as gross to me as you think we are.

How bad is it though we can't even secure our own border yet want to legislate who can crap where? I'll tell you right now I would as soon burst as sit on a public toilet. This county's becoming insane.

[Atticus Finch]

We had this workshop thing this morning to work out how counselors were going to deal with the problems relating to gender identity. There were two speakers, a guy who discussed ethics and a "woman" who was not really a women but somewhere in between (big WTF). Here I thought I was a liberal and all and have found out that I'm really not. Because, to me, girls who look like girls are girls. Boys who look like boys are boys. I could care less if you are gay or lesbian. None of my business. But if I'm the bathroom monitor during lunch, don't come telling me that you "feel like a woman" and want to use the girl's bathroom. Homie don't play that game. The alleged female person was horrified that I didn't understand "gender feelings." I told her that if a guy wants to use the girls bathroom, he better be wearing a skirt. Because girls want to be with the girls. And if another girl asks you for a tampon, you damn better have one on you. I discussed this with my very liberated and modern high school age daughter last night. I figured she would understand these things. Instead, she told me that girls get "creeped out" at the thought of any guys in a girls restroom. She does know a transgender guy who wants to be a girl at school. But, strangely enough, he is OK with using the boys restroom. Am I going to lose my liberal standing over my failure to understand gender identity? I still hug trees and all.You are an old school lib gabosaurus you still retain some semblance of common sense and decency.This new crop of indoctrinated from birth progressives are a whole other animal....they will be our undoing....God help us.

[gabosaurus]

I attempt to understand people. It's not as simple as it used to be.

[Elessar]

I attempt to understand people. It's not as simple as it used to be.

Don't try to over analyze...or analyze without a face-to-face encounter.

Training Officer Candidates and Recruits I had to understand people; and yes, it has become difficult at times.
Some Recruit stares at me and says "My Mommy told me I do not have to listen to people like You". Well good
luck working on my small boat crew, buoy deck, or underway on a cutter. You'll be scrubbing dishes for 4 years!

I do agree with this restroom / locker room issue with you, though.

[gabosaurus]

Training those who join the military is different from evaluating civilians. With the volunteer military, pretty much everyone who joins is of a similar mindset. Though I do agree the Coast Guard might be different than other branches of the military.

If you are born gay and your family is not of the accepting type (say, hard core religious or conservative), you are facing a life long struggle. Do you accept your compulsion to be gay or lesbian, knowing your family and friends could totally disown you and break contact? Or do you repress your feeling?
Put this in your own feelings. Suppose one of your own kids came out as gay or lesbian. How would you respond?

[Elessar]

Training those who join the military is different from evaluating civilians. With the volunteer military, pretty much everyone who joins is of a similar mindset. Though I do agree the Coast Guard might be different than other branches of the military.

If you are born gay and your family is not of the accepting type (say, hard core religious or conservative), you are facing a life long struggle. Do you accept your compulsion to be gay or lesbian, knowing your family and friends could totally disown you and break contact? Or do you repress your feeling?
Put this in your own feelings. Suppose one of your own kids came out as gay or lesbian. How would you respond?

You're a bit off-track. I had to evaluate civilians when I was teaching swimming and lifesaving. Then I did the same thing
in the CG and even moreso when running or managing a Search and Rescue or Law Enforcement Case.

Your second paragraph? I never gave it a thought. I raised my son to be conservative yet open-minded. He is as
tolerant as I am when it comes to LGBT...just don't force it on him/us. He had to be, going to college at Humbolt State.
Arcata CA is a mecca for LGBT, and some can be pretty pushy or aggressive.

[Trigg]

My opinion on the bathroom/changing room/locker room. If the people walking in LOOK like they belong in their chosen bathroom than I don't see a problem. Heck I've seen transgender people in New Orleans, and it's almost impossible to tell they aren't really woman.

Locker rooms and changing rooms are a different story. When they're changing in a room full of women/men their plumbing better match. I would not want to explain why a "woman" has a penis to a young child.


My problem is the perverts who will decide they're "women" for a day just to get a peek, or a video of a naked woman. Which, coincidentally has already happened at numerous collages.

[gabosaurus]

Trigg, I totally get your point. When my daughter first asked about the bathroom thing and identify, my brother in law told her "there is no question that a kick in the groin won't answer."


You're a bit off-track. I had to evaluate civilians when I was teaching swimming and lifesaving. Then I did the same thing
in the CG and even moreso when running or managing a Search and Rescue or Law Enforcement Case.

My mistake then. That is a different matter already.


Your second paragraph? I never gave it a thought. I raised my son to be conservative yet open-minded. He is as
tolerant as I am when it comes to LGBT...just don't force it on him/us. He had to be, going to college at Humbolt State.
Arcata CA is a mecca for LGBT, and some can be pretty pushy or aggressive.

I have met those who believe that you can't be conservative and open minded. But I know different because my husband is like that. He holds strict conservative values, but he is tolerant of a viewpoint.
My point on being open minded is that you need to be accepting of your own kids and their friends. I have met too many parents who want to mold their kids in their own image. They will follow your teachings at home, but will likely be resentful later in life.

[Gunny]

Don't try to over analyze...or analyze without a face-to-face encounter.

Training Officer Candidates and Recruits I had to understand people; and yes, it has become difficult at times.
Some Recruit stares at me and says "My Mommy told me I do not have to listen to people like You". Well good
luck working on my small boat crew, buoy deck, or underway on a cutter. You'll be scrubbing dishes for 4 years!

I do agree with this restroom / locker room issue with you, though.

I TOTALLY get THAT Elessar. About 80 recruits per platoon. 40 Marines per company. If you can't read them, somebody gets hurt. You got KNOW who is going on mess duty just to keep them away. The worst were the morale-busters. Constantly whining to anyone that would listen. I can whip a fatass into shape. Hard to change a crybaby.

[Gunny]

Training those who join the military is different from evaluating civilians. With the volunteer military, pretty much everyone who joins is of a similar mindset. Though I do agree the Coast Guard might be different than other branches of the military.

If you are born gay and your family is not of the accepting type (say, hard core religious or conservative), you are facing a life long struggle. Do you accept your compulsion to be gay or lesbian, knowing your family and friends could totally disown you and break contact? Or do you repress your feeling?
Put this in your own feelings. Suppose one of your own kids came out as gay or lesbian. How would you respond?

One, the Coasties are no different than the rest of us.

Two, given what you know of me, how do you think my gay younger daughter feels? She knows I don't approve. Still my daughter. We don't discuss the issue. No one's born gay. That's just BS. Her man-hating mother made her that way. We've been divorced since 93 and she STILL trashes me to my kids. Environment creates gays, not biology. I'm not even sure she is actually my daughter since the ex decided to be Ms Party Girl. But she thinks she is and that's all that matters.

You don't have to dislike the person to disapprove of the behavior.

[Gunny]

You're a bit off-track. I had to evaluate civilians when I was teaching swimming and lifesaving. Then I did the same thing
in the CG and even moreso when running or managing a Search and Rescue or Law Enforcement Case.

Your second paragraph? I never gave it a thought. I raised my son to be conservative yet open-minded. He is as
tolerant as I am when it comes to LGBT...just don't force it on him/us. He had to be, going to college at Humbolt State.
Arcata CA is a mecca for LGBT, and some can be pretty pushy or aggressive.

That sounds like herding cats. :laugh:

[Kathianne]

Training those who join the military is different from evaluating civilians. With the volunteer military, pretty much everyone who joins is of a similar mindset. Though I do agree the Coast Guard might be different than other branches of the military.

If you are born gay and your family is not of the accepting type (say, hard core religious or conservative), you are facing a life long struggle. Do you accept your compulsion to be gay or lesbian, knowing your family and friends could totally disown you and break contact? Or do you repress your feeling?
Put this in your own feelings. Suppose one of your own kids came out as gay or lesbian. How would you respond?


The killer in Orlando was a registered Democrat, so I guess you are going with 'hard core religious?' There are no 'hard core' religious Democrats? Or Conservatives that would be accepting of their children if gay?

[Elessar]

I TOTALLY get THAT @Elessar (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=3442). About 80 recruits per platoon. 40 Marines per company. If you can't read them, somebody gets hurt. You got KNOW who is going on mess duty just to keep them away. The worst were the morale-busters. Constantly whining to anyone that would listen. I can whip a fatass into shape. Hard to change a crybaby.

One of the worst things I had to do, as Senior Instructor at the TRACEN Gym, was telling a kid who was really
dedicated that he or she was not physically or mentally qualified to finish Basic Training.

The staff Corpsman and I (as a Physical Education major and Water Safety Instructor) would monitor
and evaluate each and every initial failure. We found one that slipped through MEPS and initial medical
screening that was born without the left pectoralis major muscle! I did not even let him take the initial swim test.
This lad really wanted to serve, but would have been a hazard to himself, let alone he could not pass most of the
initial physical screening. Our Chief sent him back to his CC (Drill Sgt to You) for recommendation for release from the service.

Just one example....kid had great motivation...but facts are facts.

[Elessar]

That sounds like herding cats. :laugh:

Actually in some ways it was. The easiest age groups to teach initial swimming
are from 3-6 years years old: and, believe it or not, Senior Citizens.
Little ones have few fears unless someone instilled them in them. I told the
parents of this age group that after the first day, it would be best for them to
leave so the child did not have that 'need to cling to mommy or daddy'.

Seniors? They may have had some phobias but they were wise enough to
listen and trust us.

[Gunny]

One of the worst things I had to do, as Senior Instructor at the TRACEN Gym, was telling a kid who was really
dedicated that he or she was not physically or mentally qualified to finish Basic Training.

The staff Corpsman and I (as a Physical Education major and Water Safety Instructor) would monitor
and evaluate each and every initial failure. We found one that slipped through MEPS and initial medical
screening that was born without the left pectoralis major muscle! I did not even let him take the initial swim test.
This lad really wanted to serve, but would have been a hazard to himself, let alone he could not pass most of the
initial physical screening. Our Chief sent him back to his CC (Drill Sgt to You) for recommendation for release from the service.

Just one example....kid had great motivation...but facts are facts.


Actually in some ways it was. The easiest age groups to teach initial swimming
are from 3-6 years years old: and, believe it or not, Senior Citizens.
Little ones have few fears unless someone instilled them in them. I told the
parents of this age group that after the first day, it would be best for them to
leave so the child did not have that 'need to cling to mommy or daddy'.

Seniors? They may have had some phobias but they were wise enough to
listen and trust us.

Some people are just stupid. You can't fix that. Even the ones who call themselves conservative and wouldn't know the meaning of the word if it landed on their heads. The people here in NM are anything BUT conservative. Kids who don't leave home until they're 30. People taking credit for doing shit they don't. No personal responsibility whatsoever. Yet, according to them, they are "conservatives". My dying ass. Not unless you shift the paradigm WAY left. Then it's everyone else's fault. :rolleyes:

I can't believe this state is right next door to Texas. Crap. We're responsible for our own junk. I'm sick of self-serving whiners. There's a world out there. Get a damned clue.

[gabosaurus]

Gunny, dear, not every family throws their kids out on the street when they turn 18. :rolleyes:
There are many cultures where you don't leave home until you get married. It's part of the "extended family" thing. You take care of your kids, and later they take care of you. If you aren't married, you contribute to the family unit.
Your extended life of hardship is not everyone's life. I know it is quite difficult for you to comprehend a non-military life, but you should give it a try sometime.

[Gunny]

Gunny, dear, not every family throws their kids out on the street when they turn 18. :rolleyes:
There are many cultures where you don't leave home until you get married. It's part of the "extended family" thing. You take care of your kids, and later they take care of you. If you aren't married, you contribute to the family unit.
Your extended life of hardship is not everyone's life. I know it is quite difficult for you to comprehend a non-military life, but you should give it a try sometime.

Gabby dear, not everyone wants to suck off a tit forever. I'm an American and THAT is my culture and when we used to hold people responsible we got the f*ck out and assumed our own responsibilities. There's no extended life of hardship. I left home so I could live by my own rules, and not expect others to pay my way. Probably a novel ideal to you.

I comprehend a non-military life just fine. I'd rather be me than you. I can survive. You wouldn't know what to do if the power went off and would be waiting on some jackasses to save you.