Iraqi Man Thrown Off Plane for Speaking Arabic Wants Southwest Airlines to Apologize

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/iraqi-man-thrown-off-plane-195400013.html?nhp=1

Iraqi Man Thrown Off Plane for Speaking Arabic Wants Southwest Airlines to Apologize
[Mic]
Tom McKay
April 16, 2016

An Iraqi-born refugee thrown off a Southwest Airlines flight wants the airline to apologize for singling him out.

26-year-old University of California, Berkeley student Khairuldeen Makhzoomi says he spoke Arabic on the phone with his uncle while his plane waited to take off from Los Angeles International Airport, SFGate reported. Soon after, he says, a female passenger looked at him and left her seat; moments later, Southwest Airlines employees told him he must leave the plane.

Security and police officers questioned him upon exiting the aircraft, then called in the FBI. Makhzoomi was then questioned further and subject to a series of searches and a pass by police canines. "This is what Islamophobia looks like," Makhzoomi told the officers, according to SFGate.

Southwest Airlines later refunded his ticket, though it told SFGate its employees had made a "collaborative decision rooted in established procedure" regarding "potentially threatening comments made aboard our aircraft."

According to NBC News, Makhzoomi fled Iraq in 2002 after dictator Saddam Hussein's regime killed his father and recently attended "a dinner at the Los Angeles World Affairs Council with Secretary-General of the United Nations Ban Ki-moon."

Instead of money, he told NBC, "All I need is an apology, to say 'We are sorry we singled you out because [of] one person who felt threatened.'"

Following terror attacks in San Bernardino, California; Paris; Istanbul; and Brussels, Belgium, Islamophobic sentiment has risen in both Europe and the U.S. — an atmosphere of distrust made worse by certain Republican candidates' discourse on the presidential campaign trail.

"Since 9/11, we've seen a steady increase in anti-Muslim bias and dissemination of fear about Muslims in the United States. That trend has really spiked during this current electoral season," UC Berkeley associate professor of anthropology Charles Hirschkind told the Daily Californian. "Candidates have said things like 'Muslims should not be allowed to immigrate to this country' ... These kinds of statements really ramp up both the level of fear and also the level of bias and prejudice and racism that Muslims face."

I believe that a lot of this type of thing is planned and executed to cower the airlines and other businesses into greater submission and lead them into setting special policies to favor and cater to the muzzies.
CAIR and other muslim loving terrorist allies here are knee deep in doing such things.
Also in making headlines that give the obama excuses to act with Executive Orders since he controls by way of his official powers airlines and their policies to a very great extent.-Tyr

[tailfins]

I believe that a lot of this type of thing is planned and executed to cower the airlines and other businesses into greater submission and lead them into setting special policies to favor and cater to the muzzies.
CAIR and other muslim loving terrorist allies here are knee deep in doing such things.
Also in making headlines that give the obama excuses to act with Executive Orders since he controls by way of his official powers airlines and their policies to a very great extent.-Tyr

Southwest Airlines employees speak Arabic, whodathunkit! So exactly what threatening statements were made?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Southwest Airlines employees speak Arabic, whodathunkit! So exactly what threatening statements were made?
Where is your concern for these muslim attacks upon any policy designed to be more alert and cautious in protecting innocent airline passengers from muslim terrorism?
Did I miss it???
Or did I just note the lack thereof??
Airline should ban him from its future flights.
As he was more than likely executing a previously planned muslim strategy to garner extra special favorable treatment for Arabs/muslims..
More than likely the obama is already cutting new regulations to install by Federal order such favoritism .--Tyr

[NightTrain]

Sounds like another setup like Clock Bomb Boy last year. That guy knew what he was doing and how it looked.

Coincidence that he's from Berkeley?

[aboutime]

Actually. The idiot was just using his phone to ask "WHERE'S THE SNACKBAR!"

http://icansayit.com/images/allahcandy.jpg

[Gunny]

I just think it's too bad they didn't wait to get to altitude before throwing his ass off.

[tailfins]

Where is your concern for these muslim attacks upon any policy designed to be more alert and cautious in protecting innocent airline passengers from muslim terrorism?
Did I miss it???
Or did I just note the lack thereof??
Airline should ban him from its future flights.
As he was more than likely executing a previously planned muslim strategy to garner extra special favorable treatment for Arabs/muslims..
More than likely the obama is already cutting new regulations to install by Federal order such favoritism .--Tyr

Here's an idea that crossed my mind: Train airline staff to take less drastic actions for holders of TSA pre-check cards. That will show that the holder has undergone a background check. There has to be some balance. I could see asking the passenger for identification and additional screening, but kicking them off the flight seems extreme.

[Gunny]

Here's an idea that crossed my mind: Train airline staff to take less drastic actions for holders of TSA pre-check cards. That will show that the holder has undergone a background check. There has to be some balance. I could see asking the passenger for identification and additional screening, but kicking them off the flight seems extreme.

You know how easy it is to take down aircraft? All you really have to do is bust out a window. Civilian pilots aren't taught to fly under combat conditions and civilian birds are too big to maneuver. One person can take a plane down in a second.

I'm all for tossing them off. I'd rather read about some whiner getting tossed off than 200+ people being murdered.

[fj1200]

Awesome, another one of these.


I'm all for tossing them off. I'd rather read about some whiner getting tossed off than 200+ people being murdered.

What was the rational basis for concern?

[aboutime]

Awesome, another one of these.



What was the rational basis for concern?


That's really a good, funny one fj. You trying to convince yourself that the word rational works for you?:laugh:

[Gunny]

Awesome, another one of these.



What was the rational basis for concern?

You can think how you wish. Fact is, I won't turn my back to ANY Arab knowingly. I don't trust them, and I suspect every one of them. It's only rational until you're blown up or shot in the back. THEN, if you're ready, you're "prepared" and saved people. Until then, there are always those like you that will argue I'm paranoid.

And guess where I learned that lesson? Wasn't from martial arts, the Corps nor being in the ME. I learned it from reading Louis L'Amour westerns. Only takes a second of not paying attention to get dead.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You can think how you wish. Fact is, I won't turn my back to ANY Arab knowingly. I don't trust them, and I suspect every one of them. It's only rational until you're blown up or shot in the back. THEN, if you're ready, you're "prepared" and saved people. Until then, there are always those like you that will argue I'm paranoid.

And guess where I learned that lesson? Wasn't from martial arts, the Corps nor being in the ME. I learned it from reading Louis L'Amour westerns. Only takes a second of not paying attention to get dead.

Thats why when in a restaurant to eat, I will not be seated with my back to the door.
I've been jumped from behind in bars/clubs before, more than once.
Gives the attacker far too much advantage as the first hits are massive in a fight to bring victory.
Luckily my quick reflexes and hard head saved me each time but still stitches in the head aint no fun..
Neither head shaved to sew up the long gash from the hit with a beer bottle,
I was rather vain about my great hair as a young man. Da'wimmin just loved it.. ;)-Tyr

[Elessar]

Sounds like another setup like Clock Bomb Boy last year. That guy knew what he was doing and how it looked.

Coincidence that he's from Berkeley?

It boils down to:

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks
like a duck, might just be a duck.

Profiling? Maybe. But safety for others?
Which is more important?

The Arabic's and Muslims created this environment.
He should have known better if he was in the U.S. for
a while.

Of course, UC Berkeley is not known for logical thought.

[Black Diamond]

We will become more and more lax until there's another 9/11 or worse.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

We will become more and more lax until there's another 9/11 or worse.

That is the plan that they are implementing in attacking any and all cautionary security policies put into place by businesses(AIRLINES)..
THATS THE HELP BEING GIVEN TO THE MUSLIM TERRORISTS BY THEIR SO-CALLED MODERATE BROTHERS AND SISTERS!
Thus giving their puppet the obama an excuse to issue Executive Orders(unconstitutional laws) to grant special status to them so they can have victories in future attacks.
Any relaxation will most likely be increased by this sustained and organized campaign the bastards are now running on us all.
BAN THE BASTARD FROM FLYING AND TELL THEM ALL-(ARABS/MUZZIES) TO KISS ASS IS WHAT SHOULD BE DONE.
STOP BRINGING IN THE MURDERING BASTARDS AS IF THEY ARE HIGH QUALITY GUESTS/IMMIGRANTS..-TYR

[Black Diamond]

That is the plan that they are implementing in attacking any and all cautionary security policies put into place by businesses(AIRLINES)..
THATS THE HELP BEING GIVEN TO THE MUSLIM TERRORISTS BY THEIR SO-CALLED MODERATE BROTHERS AND SISTERS!
Thus giving their puppet the obama an excuse to issue Executive Orders(unconstitutional laws) to grant special status to them so they can have victories in future attacks.
Any relaxation will most likely be increased by this sustained and organized campaign the bastards are now running on us all.
BAN THE BASTARD FROM FLYING AND TELL THEM ALL-(ARABS/MUZZIES) TO KISS ASS IS WHAT SHOULD BE DONE.
STOP BRINGING IN THE MURDERING BASTARDS AS IF THEY ARE HIGH QUALITY GUESTS/IMMIGRANTS..-TYR

I am just wondering WHEN.

[Gunny]

I am just wondering WHEN.

Well, one of us can hold the door while the other pushes. :laugh:

[sundaydriver]

I guess there's nothing scarier to some than a brown man wearing a tie flying back to college after having dinner with the U.N. Secretary-General saying something that they can't understand. Obviously the database and security screening the same as all passengers isn't enough for the busy body woman that reported him and the guy was then also interrogated by the FBI and refused further service by the airline. I don't think an apology is inappropriate.

[Abbey Marie]

The article does not tell us what the passenger said, nor if the woman understood the language.

[sundaydriver]

The article does not tell us what the passenger said, nor if the woman understood the language.

The WP & others report that the woman heard the word martyr, the student denied that and since the woman could not detail any of the conversation a good guess would be no on her Arabic skills. I fully realize that some will say that I'm foolish or just sticking up for the muzzies but really it's about peoples unfounded fears and the others that stoke them.

[Gunny]

I guess there's nothing scarier to some than a brown man wearing a tie flying back to college after having dinner with the U.N. Secretary-General saying something that they can't understand. Obviously the database and security screening the same as all passengers isn't enough for the busy body woman that reported him and the guy was then also interrogated by the FBI and refused further service by the airline. I don't think an apology is inappropriate.

I guess there's nothing scarier than having them shoot at you and knowing how they think. I wouldn't apologize for shit. You walk and quack like a duck, you're a f-ing duck. I ain't waiting around until you kill me or especially my family. I'd kick then of the plane in mid flight. Then have my wonderful airline meal of dried out whatever.

[fj1200]

You can think how you wish. Fact is, I won't turn my back to ANY Arab knowingly. I don't trust them, and I suspect every one of them. It's only rational until you're blown up or shot in the back. THEN, if you're ready, you're "prepared" and saved people. Until then, there are always those like you that will argue I'm paranoid.

And guess where I learned that lesson? Wasn't from martial arts, the Corps nor being in the ME. I learned it from reading Louis L'Amour westerns. Only takes a second of not paying attention to get dead.

The only outcome of your argument is that nobody speaking Arabic or overtly identifiable Muslim can fly on an airplane. That is clearly not a realistic scenario.

[Gunny]

The only outcome of your argument is that nobody speaking Arabic or overtly identifiable Muslim can fly on an airplane. That is clearly not a realistic scenario.

And? Last I checked, nobody that wasn't Arabic wasn't trying to fly them into buildings. They also probably didn't shoot your best friend. You're on the wrong sheet of music on this one. I can smell them. They eat weird crap so it's easy.

I'll go back to my original statement. If I piss off one raghead protecting the lives of 200+ people, I'll take the hit.

[sundaydriver]

I'll go back to my original statement. If I piss off one raghead protecting the lives of 200+ people, I'll take the hit.

Situational awareness, natural wariness, and common sense serve me better than unnecessary fear & hate.

[Black Diamond]

And? Last I checked, nobody that wasn't Arabic wasn't trying to fly them into buildings. They also probably didn't shoot your best friend. You're on the wrong sheet of music on this one. I can smell them. They eat weird crap so it's easy.

I'll go back to my original statement. If I piss off one raghead protecting the lives of 200+ people, I'll take the hit.
Political correctness will destroy America and the West in general.

[fj1200]

And? Last I checked, nobody that wasn't Arabic wasn't trying to fly them into buildings. They also probably didn't shoot your best friend. You're on the wrong sheet of music on this one. I can smell them. They eat weird crap so it's easy.

I'll go back to my original statement. If I piss off one raghead protecting the lives of 200+ people, I'll take the hit.

None of that disputes my point. And last I checked airplanes are not falling from the sky.


Political correctness will destroy America and the West in general.

Ignorance will destroy it first. What good is it to have an America if we undermine its basis for existence?

[Black Diamond]

None of that doesn't dispute my point. And last I checked airplanes are not falling from the sky.



Ignorance will destroy it first. What good is it to have an America if we undermine its basis for existence?

One could ask Abraham Lincoln and FDR the same question.

[Black Diamond]

None of that doesn't dispute my point. And last I checked airplanes are not falling from the sky.



Ignorance will destroy it first. What good is it to have an America if we undermine its basis for existence?
Last I looked, skyscrapers weren't collapsing and people weren't jumping to the sidewalk at 120 mph. Oh wait.

[fj1200]

One could ask Abraham Lincoln and FDR the same question.

One could.


Last I looked, skyscrapers weren't collapsing and people weren't jumping to the sidewalk at 120 mph. Oh wait.

Did you just look out your window because I haven't seen that happen in quite some time?

[Black Diamond]

One could.



Did you just look out your window because I haven't seen that happen in quite some time?

Jumpers have been erased from history. Should be required viewing for all college students. They can go to their safe space afterwards. I am curious to see if viewing the jumpers plunge to their deaths would trouble them more than seeing" Donald Trump 2016" written in chalk.

[fj1200]

Jumpers have been erased from history. Should be required viewing for all college students. They can go to their safe space afterwards. I am curious to see if viewing the jumpers plunge to their deaths would trouble them more than seeing" Donald Trump 2016" written in chalk.

Are they any different than those who demand their own "safe space" if a Muslim dares buy a plane ticket?

[Black Diamond]

Are they any different than those who demand their own "safe space" if a Muslim dares buy a plane ticket?

I'd tell you to ask the jumpers but they're not here.

[fj1200]

I'd tell you to ask the jumpers but they're not here.

That would be like asking Sandy Hook/Virginia Tech/Kalamazoo/etc. victims about gun control.

[Black Diamond]

That would be like asking Sandy Hook/Virginia Tech/Kalamazoo/etc. victims about gun control.

Possibly. And they may/probably have varying answers.

[fj1200]

Possibly. And they may/probably have varying answers.

Exactly. Which is why we look to the rule of law and our founding documents for answers to big questions and not the bad thing that happened yesterday.

[Black Diamond]

Exactly. Which is why we look to the rule of law and our founding documents for answers to big questions and not the bad thing that happened yesterday.

The attention folks seem to give to the poor Muslims needs to be balanced with the horror of the World Trade Center. Those who compare FDR to Hitler because of Japanese camps need to imagine if the rape of Nanking had become the rape of San Francisco....

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

The WP & others report that the woman heard the word martyr, the student denied that and since the woman could not detail any of the conversation a good guess would be no on her Arabic skills. I fully realize that some will say that I'm foolish or just sticking up for the muzzies but really it's about peoples unfounded fears and the others that stoke them.


I fully realize that some will say that I'm foolish or just sticking up for the muzzies but really it's about peoples unfounded fears and the others that stoke them.

You do??

What the hell is unfounded about this thread (link given below) and its multiple thousands of attacks and tens of thousands of deaths HOSS??

Refute those sourced links/ document facts or else admit your blithering ignorance or your willful blindness!!

So far all you muslim appeasing assholes have fled or else totally ignored that thread and its documented evidence revealing the truth, the reality about Islam...
So do not in your arrogance and blithering liberal ignorance give me that line about " unfounded fears", tens of thousands of murdered people are not unfounded fears Hoss!!--Tyr

Link--


http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?37131-Most-recent-muslim-terrorist-attacks

[fj1200]

The attention folks seem to give to the poor Muslims needs to be balanced with the horror of the World Trade Center. Those who compare FDR to Hitler because of Japanese camps need to imagine if the rape of Nanking had become the rape of San Francisco....

I'm sorry but that's a ridiculous analogy. What benchmark do you suggest that we use to kick off one Muslim or a family off of a plane when Muslims fly every day? And the Rape of Nanking was in no way done by a minuscule minority, it was done by an occupying military force.

[Black Diamond]

I'm sorry but that's a ridiculous analogy. What benchmark do you suggest that we use to kick off one Muslim or a family off of a plane when Muslims fly every day? And the Rape of Nanking was in no way done by a minuscule minority, it was done by an occupying military force.

I wasn't making an analogy this time, at least not intentionally. I am illustrating that committing "the illegal" or "the unconstitutional" doesn't necessarily make one the bad guy.

Also, I would like to know what the airline's policy is. And what was it specifically that made the passenger uncomfortable? Does she speak Arabic?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Political correctness will destroy America and the West in general.

Just as it was intended to do when devised , promoted and now mandated by force(both government and privately induced) in many instances!
A solid and undeniable dem party/liberal/leftist creation ..-Tyr

[fj1200]

I wasn't making an analogy this time, at least not intentionally. I am illustrating that committing "the illegal" or "the unconstitutional" doesn't necessarily make one the bad guy.

Also, I would like to know what the airline's policy is. And what was it specifically that made the passenger uncomfortable? Does she speak Arabic?

It seemed like an analogy. :poke: I'm pretty confident that I can find copious posts where the unconstitutional is done and treason is claimed. Nevertheless we were attacked and we made changes and created bureaucracies. Rightly, wrongly, or not Constitutionally correctly we now have Homeland Security and intelligence apparatus to keep up "safe" and it's done a decent job where we don't need to be scared of every Muslim on a Plane (screenplay in development).

It doesn't seem like the airline has a policy though I'm sure that they do.

[Black Diamond]

It seemed like an analogy. :poke: I'm pretty confident that I can find copious posts where the unconstitutional is done and treason is claimed. Nevertheless we were attacked and we made changes and created bureaucracies. Rightly, wrongly, or not Constitutionally correctly we now have Homeland Security and intelligence apparatus to keep up "safe" and it's done a decent job where we don't need to be scared of every Muslim on a Plane (screenplay in development).

It doesn't seem like the airline has a policy though I'm sure that they do.
Well if five people say it's constitutional, no matter what their motivations are, it must be constitutional and not treason.

As for the screenplay, Lincoln was the most disappointing film in history. I was hoping it would examine Lincoln's butchery of the Constitution, why he did it, and whether or not it was appropriate under the circumstances.

[Black Diamond]

It seemed like an analogy. :poke: I'm pretty confident that I can find copious posts where the unconstitutional is done and treason is claimed. Nevertheless we were attacked and we made changes and created bureaucracies. Rightly, wrongly, or not Constitutionally correctly we now have Homeland Security and intelligence apparatus to keep up "safe" and it's done a decent job where we don't need to be scared of every Muslim on a Plane (screenplay in development).

It doesn't seem like the airline has a policy though I'm sure that they do.

Both instances discuss "the illegal" and/or "the unconstitutional". I'm sure you want this airline's policy taken to Court? I can guarantee you they have a policy.

[Gunny]

Situational awareness, natural wariness, and common sense serve me better than unnecessary fear & hate.

Uh huh. Guess what? I don't fear sh*t. It's a strength AND a weakness. There have been times when if I'd been afraid I wouldn't have done some of the screwy sh*t I have done. Situational awareness at 20,000 just means you are aware you're going to die when someone pulls crap. Common sense means you remove the possible threat beforehand. This is the same lame argument people use with gays. "You must be a homophobe and hate them." Bzzzt. Wrong. Knowing they are unnatural only requires education, not hate nor fear.

Same goes with Arabs. Money says I know more about them and their religion than YOU ever will. I've only lived around them off and on since I was 2. I think I have an education and perspective that surpasses yours. Add to that I am trained to assess threats. Probably got you beat on that one too. You're a threat? You ain't riding with me. Simple as that.

[jimnyc]

I think we should ask the Muslims if they would like to play a game! Then maybe let them on the plane, but only if they can put their head in the multi bladed meat slicer and survive. :) If not, bombs away!!

http://i.imgur.com/Ne4YGcw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/YPxez9p.jpg

[Gunny]

I think we should ask the Muslims if they would like to play a game! Then maybe let them on the plane, but only if they can put their head in the multi bladed meat slicer and survive. :) If not, bombs away!!

http://i.imgur.com/Ne4YGcw.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/YPxez9p.jpg

If that thing on the tricycle is YOU, you ain't getting on my plane either, f*cker. :laugh:

[jimnyc]

If that thing on the tricycle is YOU, you ain't getting on my plane either, f*cker. :laugh:

Cmon man, tell me you've never seen the movie series "Saw"? If that creepy little bastard pops out and asks if you would like to play a game, you're dead already!

[Gunny]

Cmon man, tell me you've never seen the movie series "Saw"? If that creepy little bastard pops out and asks if you would like to play a game, you're dead already!

I think I saw part of one once. I don't watch horror flicks made after the maybe 60s. The only one I ever remember seeing was the original Jason one, and that was by accident. I don't like blood and gore just for its own sake. I'll watch a 20s or 30s horror flick in a minute. So no, I don't know who the guy on the trike is.

[Black Diamond]

I think I saw part of one once. I don't watch horror flicks made after the maybe 60s. The only one I ever remember seeing was the original Jason one, and that was by accident. I don't like blood and gore just for its own sake. I'll watch a 20s or 30s horror flick in a minute. So no, I don't know who the guy on the trike is.scream was OK. But it ain't psycho or the exorcist.

[Gunny]

scream was OK. But it ain't psycho or the exorcist.

Okay .. true story ...

I've never seen the Exorcist. I've never seen Halloween. I think the most current horror flick I've seen is Salem's Lot. Had it on once when i was starching up my shirts n jeans. And yes, I AM one of "those" Texans. I don't think I've actually seen Psycho. I haven't watched TV in years. It's background noise. I've been to the theatre maybe 3 times since the 80s. They shut down the drive ins and I was outty.

I usually have on some forensic crap. Or some news. NCIS. I might watch a basketball game like when the Spurs just blew the doors off whoever they were playing last night. And with their bench players. :laugh:

Anyway, I honestly think I haven't seen a current horror movie in 30 years.

[Black Diamond]

Okay .. true story ...

I've never seen the Exorcist. I've never seen Halloween. I think the most current horror flick I've seen is Salem's Lot. Had it on once when i was starching up my shirts n jeans. And yes, I AM one of "those" Texans. I don't think I've actually seen Psycho. I haven't watched TV in years. It's background noise. I've been to the theatre maybe 3 times since the 80s. They shut down the drive ins and I was outty.

I usually have on some forensic crap. Or some news. NCIS. I might watch a basketball game like when the Spurs just blew the doors off whoever they were playing last night. And with their bench players. :laugh:

Anyway, I honestly think I haven't seen a current horror movie in 30 years.
Most horror these days is crap. I liked Halloween and the shining to add a couple to the list. Although the novel the shining was far more terrifying. I haven't seen Salem's lot but the book was disappointing. Exorcist I haven't watched in 20 years and am afraid to watch it again. That was f-ed up.

[Russ]

I believe that a lot of this type of thing is planned and executed to cower the airlines and other businesses into greater submission and lead them into setting special policies to favor and cater to the muzzies.
CAIR and other muslim loving terrorist allies here are knee deep in doing such things.
Also in making headlines that give the obama excuses to act with Executive Orders since he controls by way of his official powers airlines and their policies to a very great extent.-Tyr

Tyr, I'm thinking that the news isn't telling us the whole story. I'm thinking he wasn't thrown off the plane just for speaking Arabic, he was probably thrown off the plane for saying something like "I'm gonna blow up all the infidels" in Arabic.

[Black Diamond]

Tyr, I'm thinking that the news isn't telling us the whole story. I'm thinking he wasn't thrown off the plane just for speaking Arabic, he was probably thrown off the plane for saying something like "I'm gonna blow up all the infidels" in Arabic.

This.

[Gunny]

Tyr, I'm thinking that the news isn't telling us the whole story. I'm thinking he wasn't thrown off the plane just for speaking Arabic, he was probably thrown off the plane for saying something like "I'm gonna blow up all the infidels" in Arabic.

It's like I always say .... personal responsibility. You're going to get on a plane speaking Arabic you can plan on half of us reaching for knives and the staff throwing you off. I'd say they got lucky the latter happened. You start that Arab jibberish around me and I'm looking at two things: you and what I can use as a weapon.

All this talk from certain people that don't sh*t. I ain't no damned negotiator. I'm just the reckoning. I know my role and I play it well. And I'm damned sure not risking a plane load of civilians over your hurt little feelings.

[Elessar]

Situational awareness, natural wariness, and common sense serve me better than unnecessary fear & hate.

That is all Gunny is saying, based on experience.

[Elessar]

That would be like asking Sandy Hook/Virginia Tech/Kalamazoo/etc. victims about gun control.

That is idiotic hyperbole

[Elessar]

It seemed like an analogy. :poke: I'm pretty confident that I can find copious posts where the unconstitutional is done and treason is claimed. Nevertheless we were attacked and we made changes and created bureaucracies. Rightly, wrongly, or not Constitutionally correctly we now have Homeland Security and intelligence apparatus to keep up "safe" and it's done a decent job where we don't need to be scared of every Muslim on a Plane (screenplay in development).



Much of what you wrote is barely even correct.
I've written about this before, but you must not have read
it or acknowledged it.

[Gunny]

That is all Gunny is saying, based on experience.

I feel like I'm talking to the choir now. I don't need to explain this to you. You rode around on a cutter.

The first thing I do with ANYONE that gets near me is measure their reach, what hand they use, and how out out of shape they are. My GF and my daughters/granddaughters are allowed in my space. Everyone and everything else is a potential threat to me.

All it takes is that one unsecured line to break loose and put your ass in the drink. So you're damned right I'm always watching.

[Black Diamond]

Much of what you wrote is barely even correct.
I've written about this before, but you must not have read
it or acknowledged it.
what isn't correct?

[Noir]

Sounds like another setup like Clock Bomb Boy last year. That guy knew what he was doing and how it looked. Coincidence that he's from Berkeley?

What exactly did he 'know that he was doing' by speaking Arabic?

I'm also quite fond of the idea that people believe that a Muslim terrorist would phone someone to discuss his plan, or talk about his Martyrdom etc on a phone, in public, in the place he is going to carry out his attack xD

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I feel like I'm talking to the choir now. I don't need to explain this to you. You rode around on a cutter.

The first thing I do with ANYONE that gets near me is measure their reach, what hand they use, and how out out of shape they are. My GF and my daughters/granddaughters are allowed in my space. Everyone and everything else is a potential threat to me.

All it takes is that one unsecured line to break loose and put your ass in the drink. So you're damned right I'm always watching.




The first thing I do with ANYONE that gets near me is measure their reach, what hand they use, and how out out of shape they are.

As do I.. IT IS SECOND NATURE TO ME AND IN A CROWDED ROOM I LOOK TO SEE WHO MAY BE ALLIED TO WHOM , LONG BEFORE ANY
SHIT MAY GO DOWN.
THAT WAY IF I AM ENGAGING ONE IN A FIGHT I KNOW TO ALSO WATCH THE OTHER ONE'S MOVEMENTS..
HAS SAVED MY THEN VERY YOUNG ASS MORE THAN A FEW TIMES..
True fighters know to do this and once its ingrained IN YOU---it never goes away.. A solid gold fact..-Tyr

[sundaydriver]

You do??

What the hell is unfounded about this thread (link given below) and its multiple thousands of attacks and tens of thousands of deaths HOSS??

Refute those sourced links/ document facts or else admit your blithering ignorance or your willful blindness!!

So far all you muslim appeasing assholes have fled or else totally ignored that thread and its documented evidence revealing the truth, the reality about Islam...
So do not in your arrogance and blithering liberal ignorance give me that line about " unfounded fears", tens of thousands of murdered people are not unfounded fears Hoss!!--Tyr

Link--


It's been clear that anything short of hatred of all Muslims is immoral to you and you justify your hatred by listing atrocities committed by terrorists and anyone that doesn't respond is an appeaser. Yeah, who isn't aware by now of what's wrong in the Arab world and probably all feel the same about terrorists and extremists ideology. Unfounded fears just keep growing and that's not for me. After flying between the US and Europe for years I doubt I've ever been on a plane without someone speaking Arabic, wearing a head covering, etc. and I'm still here although at times there were certain people i felt the need to keep an eye on and not all were Arabs. I'm not going to be afraid of all because of some so get used to it.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

It's been clear that anything short of hatred of all Muslims is immoral to you and you justify your hatred by listing atrocities committed by terrorists and anyone that doesn't respond is an appeaser. Yeah, who isn't aware by now of what's wrong in the Arab world and probably all feel the same about terrorists and extremists ideology. Unfounded fears just keep growing and that's not for me. After flying between the US and Europe for years I doubt I've ever been on a plane without someone speaking Arabic, wearing a head covering, etc. and I'm still here although at times there were certain people i felt the need to keep an eye on and not all were Arabs. I'm not going to be afraid of all because of some so get used to it.
Well- bravo to you and I APPLAUD YOUR COURAGE AND STEADFASTNESS.

YOU COULD SHOW THE SAME RESPECT TOWARDS ME INSTEAD OF CRYING OUT THAT MY WORDS OF INFORMATION, CAUTION AND REFUTATION OF GOVERNMENT/MEDIA PROPAGANDA LAUDING MUSLIMS IS FEAR ON MY PART.
I AM TOO OLD , TOO TIRED AND TOO DAMN MEAN TO FEAR MUCH AT ALL.
MY ONLY FEAR IS FOR MY FAMILY'S FUTURE SAFETY.
I'D FIGHT A DAMN GRIZZLY BEAR WITH WITH MY BARE HANDS OR A BROOMSTICK TO INSURE THAT.

I DOCUMENT IN A MASSIVELY LONG THREAD, (LINK GIVEN HERE NUMEROUS TIMES) TENS OF THOUSANDS OF MURDERS BY THESE FFING ANIMALS WHICH YOU AND OTHERS IGNORED AND SEEM TO DISMISS AS IRRELEVANT AND/OR FALSE.
Such willful blindness serves only the barbaric murdering cult of Islam , yet you quite apparently can not even see that easily seen fact.

Tis' not I that is stubborn and blind my friend...
Have at your defiance not to yield to fear and I CELEBRATE YOU FOR IT
BUT DO NOT CRY FEAR IS UPON OTHERS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY SEEK TO INFORM ABOUT THE DARK AND GROWING MENACE TO OUR NATION AND THE WORLD AT LARGE!

Information is most often the key to survival, one rarely survives when being totally ignorant of a very dangerous life threatening and dedicated threat.

I respect your bravery but I will not yield to -nor will I ever ignore-- false accusations, mistaken perceptions about my character, honesty and honor!
No honorable man ever would nor would any true fighter.. I am both... -Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

I suspect that historically, people faced with increasing acts of unreasonable hatred and terror, reacted in all sorts of ways, from sundaydriver's to Tyr's. The book I'm reading currently gives a good view of how the French reacted to Germany's first pre-WWII rumblings. Some were very worried, some said Germany would treat them fairly. And we know how that turned out. Not to go exclusively the Nazi-analogy; it's just on my mind right now. I am sure we can find many similar situations throughout history.

I guess my my overall feeling is that views like Tyr's should be given respect and heeded. If he is correct, we will be very sorry if we don't.

[NightTrain]

What exactly did he 'know that he was doing' by speaking Arabic?

Are you serious? I know you're smarter than this, Noir, but I'll play along.


“I was very excited about the event, so I called my uncle to tell him about it,” the 26-year-old told The New York Times.

Makhzoomi told his uncle that he had asked a question about Islamic State (IS, formerly ISIS/ISIL) at the event, and used the phrase “inshallah” (God willing) at the end of the conversation.

So, this guy gets on a full American airliner and decides that he needs to call his Uncle in Iraq RIGHT NOW about an event that occurred earlier this month.

Naturally, this conversation happens in Arabic, raising red flags for all the surrounding passengers.

Pushing this further, this genius actually mentions Islamic State in his conversation with his Uncle as the other passengers listen much more closely in alarm.

Clearly enjoying the reactions around him, including the terrified woman staring at him, he continues his conversation and includes infamous islamic phrases to ratchet up the alarm to other passengers.


Now, I don't think that this knucklehead is actually a terrorist, but he certainly knows that his very presence on a commercial aircraft causes at least a small amount of concern due to the atrocities committed by other young arab men. Right or wrong, it does.

He plays on this deliberately to scare the hell out of the others, and he did so deliberately, most likely to create a big news story to get his 15 minutes and he could whine about Islamophobia to anyone with a camera, of which there were many.

The FBI needs to put his dumb ass on the No Fly List. We're not allowed to say the word 'Bomb' even in jest, talking about ISIS in arabic on a damn airplane prior to takeoff should carry the same penalties.

[sundaydriver]

Well- bravo to you and I APPLAUD YOUR COURAGE AND STEADFASTNESS.

YOU COULD SHOW THE SAME RESPECT TOWARDS ME INSTEAD OF CRYING OUT THAT MY WORDS OF INFORMATION, CAUTION AND REFUTATION OF GOVERNMENT/MEDIA PROPAGANDA LAUDING MUSLIMS IS FEAR ON MY PART.
I AM TOO OLD , TOO TIRED AND TOO DAMN MEAN TO FEAR MUCH AT ALL.
MY ONLY FEAR IS FOR MY FAMILY'S FUTURE SAFETY.
I'D FIGHT A DAMN GRIZZLY BEAR WITH WITH MY BARE HANDS OR A BROOMSTICK TO INSURE THAT.

I DOCUMENT IN A MASSIVELY LONG THREAD, (LINK GIVEN HERE NUMEROUS TIMES) TENS OF THOUSANDS OF MURDERS BY THESE FFING ANIMALS WHICH YOU AND OTHERS IGNORED AND SEEM TO DISMISS AS IRRELEVANT AND/OR FALSE.
Such willful blindness serves only the barbaric murdering cult of Islam , yet you quite apparently can not even see that easily seen fact.

Tis' not I that is stubborn and blind my friend...
Have at your defiance not to yield to fear and I CELEBRATE YOU FOR IT


BUT DO NOT CRY FEAR IS UPON OTHERS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY SEEK TO INFORM ABOUT THE DARK AND GROWING MENACE TO OUR NATION AND THE WORLD AT LARGE!

Information is most often the key to survival, one rarely survives when being totally ignorant of a very dangerous life threatening and dedicated threat.

I respect your bravery but I will not yield to -nor will I ever ignore-- false accusations, mistaken perceptions about my character, honesty and honor!
No honorable man ever would nor would any true fighter.. I am both... -Tyr

Sorry to hear about you being so old & tired. Here's to hoping that when you get to my age you will feel better. :laugh:

As for my being brave, not all that much and just because I don't rail about what I can't do much about doesn't mean that I agree with or just accept the problems associated with Islam. Terrorism, not melding into society, and preaching hatred I don't accept and I know that I never posted that I did. Although false insinuations and accusations I have posted rebuttals against. Again for ignoring your "long informative thread" I've already read the majority by the time you copy/paste them and it isn't new information to me so I have need to jump in and yell YEAH,ME TOO!. Yes information is important if the information is good & applicable but not when it becomes just a fixation.
]

[fj1200]

Well if five people say it's constitutional, no matter what their motivations are, it must be constitutional and not treason.

As for the screenplay, Lincoln was the most disappointing film in history. I was hoping it would examine Lincoln's butchery of the Constitution, why he did it, and whether or not it was appropriate under the circumstances.

Yes, if five people say it's Constitutional then it's Constitutional; That's the way it works. And the opposite of Constitutional is not treason.

I didn't see the movie.


Both instances discuss "the illegal" and/or "the unconstitutional". I'm sure you want this airline's policy taken to Court? I can guarantee you they have a policy.

I can't really grant much credence to an argument that makes the leap to the Rape of Nanking; do all of our policies get justified because of any horror we'd like to raise? No, that's not how policies get justified. Nevertheless I grant that there is illegal and there is unconstitutional; Not everything illegal is unconstitutional but everything unconstitutional is illegal. FDR wasn't Hitler for so many reasons but his action was unconstitutional. We've already addressed the dangers of flying on a plane which makes it unnecessary to toss any Muslim off a plane that speaks his native tongue.

As to the airlines policy I'm unconcerned if it goes to court, they breached contract at the least IMO pending their policy, but if it does have a policy then it should likely be implemented consistently.

[fj1200]

Tyr, I'm thinking that the news isn't telling us the whole story. I'm thinking he wasn't thrown off the plane just for speaking Arabic, he was probably thrown off the plane for saying something like "I'm gonna blow up all the infidels" in Arabic.

Unless there is an Arabic speaker sitting next to them, how would they know? Of course saying that in any language will get someone kicked off the plane.


That is idiotic hyperbole

I was responding to an inconsistent, IMO, argument. Pay attention please.


Much of what you wrote is barely even correct.
I've written about this before, but you must not have read
it or acknowledged it.

Yes, what isn't correct?


what isn't correct?

:)

[fj1200]

I suspect that historically, people faced with increasing acts of unreasonable hatred and terror, reacted in all sorts of ways, from sundaydriver's to Tyr's. The book I'm reading currently gives a good view of how the French reacted to Germany's first pre-WWII rumblings. Some were very worried, some said Germany would treat them fairly. And we know how that turned out. Not to go exclusively the Nazi-analogy; it's just on my mind right now. I am sure we can find many similar situations throughout history.

I guess my my overall feeling is that views like Tyr's should be given respect and heeded. If he is correct, we will be very sorry if we don't.

Should anti-Jewish views in 1930s Germany have been respected and heeded without challenge?

[Abbey Marie]

Should anti-Jewish views in 1930s Germany have been respected and heeded without challenge?

Nice try there, fj. Unless the Jews were, unbeknownst to anyone, blowing up buildings, beheading people, and calling for Jihad, not a good analogy.

[Abbey Marie]

“I was very excited about the event, so I called my uncle to tell him about it,” the 26-year-old told The New York Times.
Makhzoomi told his uncle that he had asked a question about Islamic State (IS, formerly ISIS/ISIL) at the event, and used the phrase “inshallah” (God willing) at the end of the conversation.


So, this guy gets on a full American airliner and decides that he needs to call his Uncle in Iraq RIGHT NOW about an event that occurred earlier this month.

Naturally, this conversation happens in Arabic, raising red flags for all the surrounding passengers.

Pushing this further, this genius actually mentions Islamic State in his conversation with his Uncle as the other passengers listen much more closely in alarm.

Thank you! This is what I was asking for in my first post. I had a strong suspicion that the complaining passenger didn't do so just because this guy was speaking in Arabic. Isn't it fascinating when the details finally come to light?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Sorry to hear about you being so old & tired. Here's to hoping that when you get to my age you will feel better. :laugh:

Age is not the primary deciding factor(in my case). Often it is the trials, tribulations and HARD PACE FOR 40+ YEARS A BODY HAS HAD TO ENDURE.
Living tough , hard ,wild and fast eventually catches up to a person.
Not that I am weak (as I am not- neither physically or mentally, not yet anyways) but having a ticker with a problem aint no damn picnic--even for a tough old dog..
62 years old sure isn't a picnic if the heart problems limit ones ability to go forward full blast as life has accustomed.--Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Nice try there, fj. Unless the Jews were unbeknownst to anyone, blowing up buildings, beheading people, and calling for Jihad, not a good analogy.

Strawman arguments like straw dogs bark loudly but have no bites. Usually the lib/dems send ém out by the truckloads to their followers
to spew forth when needed. Just my observation on such when presented at another forum hat I sometimes visit and joust with the lib/dems there...
Such people are pretty much the same , all live in a dangerous fantasy world with eyes and ears closed..
And extremely belligerent to those presenting truth....-Tyr

[jimnyc]

If I heard someone speaking loudly in Arabic, and then I hear them speaking of Islamic State - I'm giving him one to the jaw just prior to giving him a suplex slam and holding him down. Fuck him and all of Islam if I'm wrong, but if my ass is flying without a parachute, I'm not taking any chances. It's like a "no discussing islamic state while flying" rule.

[NightTrain]

Yeah, like I said earlier... this guy knew exactly what he was doing. His goal was to scare the hell out of the passengers and then claim victimhood.

Berkeley has taught him well on the setup and execution of being a victim. Just like the Clock Bomb Boy.

[fj1200]

Nice try there, fj. Unless the Jews were, unbeknownst to anyone, blowing up buildings, beheading people, and calling for Jihad, not a good analogy.

You're the one who brought up the Nazis. Do any of the following arguments posted here sound familiar?


Background: The Nazis were always worried about those Germans who did not accept anti-Semitism. In this article from the party monthly for propagandists, the writer provides ten responses to the most common objections they encountered to Nazi anti-Semitic measures. These were arguments intended for everyday use in conversation with fellow citizens.The source: Kurt Hilmar Eitzen, “Zehn Knüppel wider die Judenknechte,” Unser Wille und Weg (6) 1936, pp. 309-310.
<center style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Times New Roman'; font-size: medium;">Ten Responses to Jewish Lackeysby Kurt Hilmar Eitzen</center>There are still Jewish lackeys today who attempt to disrupt our storm attack on the Jewish world rulers, trying to stop us or even cause us to fall. The following hints show how one can reply to these arguments by our opponents, or even turn their arguments against them.
Argument 1: “You say that religion is a private matter. But you fight against the Jewish religion!” Counterargument: “Actually, the Jewish religion is nothing other than a doctrine to preserve the Jewish race.” (Adolf Hitler). “In resisting all government attempts to nationalize them, the Jews build a state within the state (Count Helmuth von Moltke). “To call this state a ‘religion’ was one of the cleverest tricks ever invented.” (Adolf Hitler). “From this first lie that Jewry is a religion, not a race, further lies inevitably follow.” (Adolf Hitler).
Argument 2: “There are decent Jews, after all!” — Counterargument: “This little phrase ‘after all’ proves that they are rare exceptions of no significance to our battle against Jewry as a whole. But Martin Luther saw four hundred years ago that this “decency,” proven by charitable deeds done in as public a manner as possible, is nothing but a hidden cost of business, to repaid a thousand times by uneducated Germans. “Know, dear Christian, and have no doubts about it, that next to the Devil you have no more bitter, poisonous and determined enemy than a genuine Jew. . . If they do something good for you, it is not because they love you, but because they need room to live with us, so they have to do something. But their heart remains as I have said!”
Argument 3: “The Jew has better prices than the German businessman.” — Counterargument: Any crook can sell junk. Jewish crooks have driven thousands of German businessmen to bankruptcy with the glittering trash in their department store palaces. When someone does get good products more cheaply from the Jews than from Germans, it is only because the united Jewish firms force down prices from the manufacturers, which means reducing workers’ wages. He who has bought good products cheaply from the Jew should never forget that the curse of a German worker and the tears of his hungry children come with them!

Argument 4: “There are also ‘white Jews’ [i.e., Gentiles who are as bad as Jews]. — Counterargument: “That speaks against the Jews, not for them! The fact that one calls the crooks among us ‘white Jews’ is proof that being a Jew implies something bad. Otherwise, one would call crooked Jews ‘yellow Christians.’ The fact that there are so many ‘white Jews’ among us proves that the destructive Jewish spirit has already infected wide circles of our population. It is a warning to us that we have to take up the battle against the Jewish world plague everywhere.” (Joseph Goebbels). That is why Point 24 of our party program states: “The party battles the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and outside of us.”
Argument 5: “Mr. Levi is not a Jew, since he has been baptized!” — Counterargument: As we have already shown, Jewry is not a religion. The Führer pointed that out in a sarcastic manner during the period of struggle [1919-1933] when he said that it was a peculiar sort of religion when one could smell its adherents from a great distance! No, a Jew always remains a Jew. Chaim Herz Bückeberg, better known as “Heinrich Heine,” joked: “Are these long noses a kind of uniform that allows the God King Jehovah to recognize his old body guard, even if they have deserted?” “I have no desire to convert the Jews,” Martin Luther wrote, “since that is impossible.” A Jew remains a Jew. “In case of need, a dose of baptismal water saves both business and Jewry at the same time!” (Adolf Hitler).

Argument 6: “It is true that Mr. Moses Freundenstein is a Jew, but his parents and grandparents lived here. He is one of our old established citizens.” — Counterargument: Just as a goat does not become a horse, even if his father and grandfather were in the same stall, a Jew can never become a German, even if his ancestor came to Germany as a peddler in Varus’ army [during the Roman era].
Argument 7: “The Jew is a human being, too!” — Counterargument: “Of course the Jew is a human being too. None of us has ever doubted it. But a flea is also an animal. But not a very pleasant one. Since a flea is not a pleasant animal, we have no duty to protect and defend it, to take care of it so that it can bite and torment and torture us. Rather, we make it harmless. It is the same with the Jews.” {Joseph Goebbels).
Argument 8: “Everything with a human face is equal.” — Counterargument: Thirteen years ago, theStürmer carried a cartoon. In it, a miserable pig looked up from his sty to a royal lion. “Everything with an animal face is equal!” But what did the lion growl in reply? “That’s what you swine would like to think!”
Argument 9: “Anti-Semitism is only something for idiots!” Counterargument: One no longer hears this lie in National Socialist Germany. But one still reads it in the Jewish emigre press abroad, and Jews whisper it here and perhaps some Jewish lackeys still think that. We smile in response, and note that the Jews have never produced a single creative man, but that all great men in every country have been implacable opponents of the Jews. Some “intellectuals” may be distressed when one doubts their understanding, but we will follow the battle cry against Judah that all of the great men of our past have made!


Argument 10: “Can you live with the uproar and accept responsibility for the misery that the laws of the Third Reich bring to thousands of Jewish families?” — Counterargument: “It is almost a miracle that absolutely nothing has happened to Jews in Germany, but rather that only gradually the rights they stole from the Germans in politics and culture have been restored.” (Alfred Rosenberg). But even if a few hundred Jewish families in Germany really did have to go hungry, what is that against the many millions of German families that the Jew murdered over the course of centuries through wars, revolutions, and civil strife, not to mention those ruined through usury and fraud. “In the battle between the races, there is no truce. If you are determined finally to defend yourself, German people, then be pitiless!” (Adolf Hitler).
http://research.calvin.edu/german-propaganda-archive/responses.htm

[fj1200]

Strawman arguments like straw dogs bark loudly but have no bites.

And all you can do is merely yap.

[Elessar]

what isn't correct?

I'll go through this drill again. I used to have to do all sorts of searches for
Wants and Warrants, vessel or people info on lookout lists. If one of the agencies
had a hit on one of them, it took EPIC to get permission to get the info shared
in many cases.

Prior to 9-11, each one of those Intel or LE agencies had their own little
Empire and held their cards close to the chest.

It was not the fault of any president at all before this event. It was
status quo.

After 9-11, the investigation found that several agencies had hints or clues
to the hijackers, but none of it was shared with each other.

The GWB administration put a screeching halt to that Empire mentality,
demanding that each one share with the collective. Had all those hints
and clues been put in one pot, 9-11 might not have happened.

There is nothing unconstitutional about the existing Intel and LE stance,
after GWB put it into effect. Check the Code of Federal Regulations,
which is The Law.

One of the lingering questions, though, is why Bill Clinton's administration
declined the Saudi's offer of Bin Laden's head on a platter after the
Al Quida attacks during his term.

Obama spiked the football over Bin Laden's killing, but it was GWB's
mechanism that made it happen.

[Black Diamond]

Yeah, like I said earlier... this guy knew exactly what he was doing. His goal was to scare the hell out of the passengers and then claim victimhood.

Berkeley has taught him well on the setup and execution of being a victim. Just like the Clock Bomb Boy.

Obama should invite this guy to the White House.

[Black Diamond]

I'll go through this drill again. I used to have to do all sorts of searches for
Wants and Warrants, vessel or people info on lookout lists. If one of the agencies
had a hit on one of them, it took EPIC to get permission to get the info shared
in many cases.

Prior to 9-11, each one of those Intel or LE agencies had their own little
Empire and held their cards close to the chest.

It was not the fault of any president at all before this event. It was
status quo.

After 9-11, the investigation found that several agencies had hints or clues
to the hijackers, but none of it was shared with each other.

The GWB administration put a screeching halt to that Empire mentality,
demanding that each one share with the collective. Had all those hints
and clues been put in one pot, 9-11 might not have happened.

There is nothing unconstitutional about the existing Intel and LE stance,
after GWB put it into effect. Check the Code of Federal Regulations,
which is The Law.

One of the lingering questions, though, is why Bill Clinton's administration
declined the Saudi's of of Bin Laden's head on a platter after the
Al Quida attacks during his term.

Obama spiked the football over Bin Laden's killing, but it was GWB's
mechanism that made it happen.

One of the hijackers was pulled over for speeding in Maryland. He was wanted by the FBI. Today it would show up on police data system in his cruiser. Not then. Who knows what they could have unraveled had they been able to share information.

[Abbey Marie]

If I heard someone speaking loudly in Arabic, and then I hear them speaking of Islamic State - I'm giving him one to the jaw just prior to giving him a suplex slam and holding him down. Fuck him and all of Islam if I'm wrong, but if my ass is flying without a parachute, I'm not taking any chances. It's like a "no discussing islamic state while flying" rule.


Seriously; how is that any different from talking on the plane about a bomb?

But, hey, we will PC our way into making it the airline's fault for taking precautions.

[Black Diamond]

Nice try there, fj. Unless the Jews were, unbeknownst to anyone, blowing up buildings, beheading people, and calling for Jihad, not a good analogy.

Maybe he wasn't making an analogy :cool:

[Abbey Marie]

Maybe he wasn't making an analogy :cool:


??

[Black Diamond]

??

Inside joke between Fj and myself.

[Elessar]

One of the hijackers was pulled over for speeding in Maryland. He was wanted by the FBI. Today it would show up on police data system in his cruiser. Not then. Who knows what they could have unraveled had they been able to share information.

You are correct!

Back in the day, it would take as much as an hour to get that data.

Now, through NCIC, it can be gotten in less than a minute - another
GWB credit.

[Elessar]

Seriously; how is that any different from talking on the plane about a bomb?

But, hey, we will PC our way into making it the airline's fault for taking precautions.

Too many people get butt-hurt over perceived violations of personal "Rights", when
the safety of all is in question.

[Black Diamond]

Too many people get butt-hurt over perceived violations of personal "Rights", when
the safety of all is in question.

Some folks foget you don't have the right to fly.

[Abbey Marie]

You're the one who brought up the Nazis. Do any of the following arguments posted here sound familiar?


http://research.calvin.edu/german-propaganda-archive/responses.htm


My bringing up a subject does not give leave for you to make a poor analogy.

None of what you posted changes your analogy into a good one. No matter how vilely they were being described by Nazis, Jews simply were not calling for jihad, nor were they blowing up buildings or beheading people. They were going about their business. When you can state that Muslims are not doing those things, you will have a point. I also think it is unfair to imply that people who want to fight ISIS/ISIL, are doing so out of Nazi-level bigotry and hatred, instead of self-protection.

[Black Diamond]

My bringing up a subject does not give leave for you to make a poor analogy.

None of what you posted changes your analogy into a good one. No matter how vilely they were being described by Nazis, Jews simply were not calling for jihad, nor were they blowing up buildings or beheading people. They were going about their business. When you cam state that Muslims are not doing those things, you will have a point. I also think it is unfair to imply that people who want to fight ISIS/ISIL, are doing so out of Nazi-level bigotry and hatred, instead of self-protection.
Maybe all of us who want to be safe are Nazis at heart.

[Gunny]

If I heard someone speaking loudly in Arabic, and then I hear them speaking of Islamic State - I'm giving him one to the jaw just prior to giving him a suplex slam and holding him down. Fuck him and all of Islam if I'm wrong, but if my ass is flying without a parachute, I'm not taking any chances. It's like a "no discussing islamic state while flying" rule.

You must be a wuss. A left to the jaw would make that suplex pointless. If I hit your ass, you ain't coming back up anytime soon. I punch brick walls for fun.

I TOTALLY agree with the rest. Sue me later. You ain't getting on a damned plane with me. Didn't somebody mention common sense? Crap. How much common sense is involved in speaking Arabic and mentioning the Islamic state on a freaking airplane post-9/11? I don't walk into gay bars wearing Wranglers, boots and a straw. I mean, WTF?

He brought this on himself. Tough sh*t.

[fj1200]

I'll go through this drill again.

Thanks but nothing I said was incorrect. Was it a complete picture? No and it wasn't meant to be.

[fj1200]

Seriously; how is that any different from talking on the plane about a bomb?

But, hey, we will PC our way into making it the airline's fault for taking precautions.

No difference at all.

[fj1200]

My bringing up a subject does not give leave for you to make a poor analogy.

None of what you posted changes your analogy into a good one. No matter how vilely they were being described by Nazis, Jews simply were not calling for jihad, nor were they blowing up buildings or beheading people. They were going about their business. When you can state that Muslims are not doing those things, you will have a point. I also think it is unfair to imply that people who want to fight ISIS/ISIL, are doing so out of Nazi-level bigotry and hatred, instead of self-protection.

But it was not a poor analogy. It's about propaganda. Most Muslims have no interest in what you describe yet here we are being told about how each and every one of them is gonna get us. Do we have to be concerned? Of course, but we don't need to be foolish.

And FWIW I'm not implying anything about those who want to fight ISIS, I am making pointed criticisms against people who give ignorant knee-jerk responses ad infinitum. And again, I didn't bring up the Nazis.

[Black Diamond]

No difference at all.

Well they certainly don't allow you to talk about bombs. If they're the same, the airline was right in telling him to leave.

[Gunny]

Thanks but nothing I said was incorrect. Was it a complete picture? No and it wasn't meant to be.

And? My point remains the same as well. You start speaking in Arabic and talking jihadi BS post-9/11 in an airport, you're asking for it. Personal accountability.

[Black Diamond]

Yes, if five people say it's Constitutional then it's Constitutional; That's the way it works. And the opposite of Constitutional is not treason.

I didn't see the movie.



I can't really grant much credence to an argument that makes the leap to the Rape of Nanking; do all of our policies get justified because of any horror we'd like to raise? No, that's not how policies get justified. Nevertheless I grant that there is illegal and there is unconstitutional; Not everything illegal is unconstitutional but everything unconstitutional is illegal. FDR wasn't Hitler for so many reasons but his action was unconstitutional. We've already addressed the dangers of flying on a plane which makes it unnecessary to toss any Muslim off a plane that speaks his native tongue.

As to the airlines policy I'm unconcerned if it goes to court, they breached contract at the least IMO pending their policy, but if it does have a policy then it should likely be implemented consistently.
Did five people say FDRs actions were unconstitutional?

[Gunny]

Did five people say FDRs actions were unconstitutional?

Actually, throwing their asses off the plane IS addressing the issue.

[Black Diamond]

Actually, throwing their asses off the plane IS addressing the issue.

I completely agree. But something tells me airlines won't be able to continue this sort of thing. Courts will rule in favor of the terrorists.

[Gunny]

I completely agree. But something tells me airlines won't be able to continue this sort of thing. Courts will rule in favor of the terrorists.

Yeah, I agree. I keep wondering just when our laws became suicide contracts for ordinary people while the rights of dumbasses and dirtbags are protected.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Update--Airline now explains much....--Tyr



http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/southwest-has-an-explanation-for-why-it-kicked-an-arabic-speaker-off-its-plane/ar-BBrYCc1?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=SK2ADHP

Southwest has an explanation for why it kicked an Arabic-speaker off its plane 3 / 19

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Khairuldeen Makhzoomi works in his office in Berkeley, Calif., Monday, April 18, 2016. © Provided by Quartz Khairuldeen Makhzoomi works in his office in Berkeley, Calif., Monday, April 18, 2016.

Southwest Airlines has released a statement on why it removed Khairuldeen Makhzoomi, a Iraqi asylee and student at the University of California, Berkeley, from a flight on April 6. It says the passenger who reported Makhzoomi for making comments in Arabic that were “perceived to be threatening” during a phone conversation with his uncle in Baghdad was also an Arabic-speaker.

The nuance is important because many people on social media assumed that Makhzoomi was singled out for racist reasons, or for simply speaking Arabic. The airline says, “It was the content of the passenger’s conversation, not the language used, that prompted the report leading to our investigation.”

It is unclear, however, just how much Arabic the passenger who reported him speaks, or whether Southwest knew it, then or now. Multiple requests to the airline seeking to clarify this have yet to be returned.

Since the beginning, it’s been suggested that a linguistic misunderstanding was to blame. In the first report of the incident, Makhzoomi told the The Daily Californian that, after being taken off the plane, “[h]e learned the passenger thought she had heard the word ‘Shahid,’ meaning martyr, which is associated with jihad and has been associated with terrorists.”

But shahid—literally “witness” in Quranic Arabic—has a much wider connotation than that. Among Palestinians, for instance, anybody killed by Israeli security forces, and, in some cases even by the Palestinian security forces, is often called a shahid, whether militant or civilian or even a child. Around the world, Muslims may refer to someone who has died in natural disasters, in childbirth, of drowning, or even of stomach illness as a shahid.

News reports have also picked up (paywall) on Makhzoomi’s mention of the fact that he ended the phone call by saying he would call again when he landed “inshallah,” or “God willing.” In Arabic, inshallah is used liberally in all sorts of settings; for some Arabic-speakers, it’s practically a grammatical marker of the future tense.

The guy speaking ARABIC AT THE LEAST SHOWED VERY POOR JUDGEMENT, at the worst did so to arouse suspicion and cause an incident.
His conversation warranted investigation..
Since when does his single right to speak Arabic or rather being questioned for doing so -- overpower the security and safety of the majority of other passengers??
Only a damn liberal or else a fool would claim that it does IMHO...

HE KNEW WHAT HE WAS DOING..
I bet the entire conversation he had on the phone was rehearsed beforehand.
They should ban him from flying and ship him home on a damn boat..--Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

I suspect we will have to go through an extended period where we must look out for ourselves. Like many of you do already.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I suspect we will have to go through an extended period where we must look out for ourselves. Like many of you do already.

Buy guns and ammo, learn how to safely and accurately use them.
Self-defense very likely one day will be entirely upon each individual/family.
Best advice I can give you my friend..

Years ago I taught my daughter, she shoots expert.
In fact ,as good as, or better than her husband.
Teaching my son too.
Will be a great feat if I can teach him to be a better shot than me.
I dearly hope that I can as that is exactly what my father and grandfather did with me.....
And told me that was their goal-- to make me the best shoooooooooooooter in the family!
THEY SUCCEEDED, much to two of my older brothers's dismay.- :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: --Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

Buy guns and ammo, learn how to safely and accurately use them.
Self-defense very likely one day will be entirely upon each individual/family.
Best advice I can give you my friend..--Tyr


Thank you, Tyr. I wish we lived nearer. I know that we would look out for each other.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Thank you, Tyr. I wish we lived nearer. I know that we would look out for each other.

Yes, with bells on my friend. I have over a dozen friends here that already stated if hell breaks loose they are rushing over to my house to be protected.
I told them just bring plenty of goooooooooood food and water as I got the guns ammo and the know how...
Extra guns being fired would be a plus even if they hit nothing ..
First few waves ff attackers/pillagers will be looking for --soft easy targets ..
Will not be a damn thing soft about where I'll be, except maybe the ground where their dead body hits.-Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

Yes, with bells on my friend. I have over a dozen friends here that already stated if hell breaks loose they are rushing over to my house to be protected.
I told them just bring plenty of goooooooooood food and water as I got the guns ammo and the know how...
Extra guns being fired would be a plus even if they hit nothing ..
First few waves ff attackers/pillagers will be looking for --soft easy targets ..
Will not be a damn thing soft about where I'll be, except maybe the ground where their dead body hits.-Tyr


I'll bring my turkey cutlets in lime and butter sauce for starters. But I think Kath is a much better cook!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I'll bring my turkey cutlets in lime and butter sauce for starters. But I think Kath is a much better cook!
Bring Kat too and Russ and I can pay chess between firefights during the lulls in battle.
And turkey I do dearly love to eat, my favorite sandwich is turkey on rye with tomato slices(two), onion, cheese and doused heavily with Louisiana hot sauce.
Second one after that , just substitute three slices of fried balogna, the good , thick-cut kind not that crap balogna.-Tyr

[fj1200]

Well they certainly don't allow you to talk about bombs. If they're the same, the airline was right in telling him to leave.

Yup. You don't start talking about ISIS on an airplane.


And? My point remains the same as well. You start speaking in Arabic and talking jihadi BS post-9/11 in an airport, you're asking for it. Personal accountability.

What you quoted was not in reference to this.


Did five people say FDRs actions were unconstitutional?

Actually EO 9066 was found Constitutional 6-3 (I learned something new) but detainment without cause was unconstitutional.


On December 18, 1944, the Supreme Court (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Court_of_the_United_States) handed down two decisions on the legality of the incarceration under Executive Order 9066. Korematsu v. United States (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korematsu_v._United_States), a 6–3 decision upholding a Nisei's conviction for violating the military exclusion order, stated that, in general, the removal of Japanese Americans from the West Coast was constitutional. However, Ex parte Endo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex_parte_Endo) unanimously declared that loyal citizens of the United States, regardless of cultural descent, could not be detained without cause. In effect, the two rulings held that, while the eviction of U.S. citizens in the name of military necessity was legal, the subsequent incarceration was not — thus paving the way for their release.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans


I completely agree. But something tells me airlines won't be able to continue this sort of thing. Courts will rule in favor of the terrorists.

Um, courts will not rule in favor of terrorists on an a plane.

[Gunny]

Yup. You don't start talking about ISIS on an airplane.



What you quoted was not in reference to this.



Actually EO 9066 was found Constitutional 6-3 (I learned something new) but detainment without cause was unconstitutional.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internment_of_Japanese_Americans



Um, courts will not rule in favor of terrorists on an a plane.

Sorry. No sale. I'd throw his ass out the hatch in mid-flight.

[jimnyc]

Imagine going on a muslim run airline. And you speak of muhammad being a pedophile. I wonder what the differences in reactions would be? And how the airlines themselves would handle it? And whether Al MuhadaPedo would issue an apology or not?