Change the Primary system!

[Russ]

I have to say that our Primary voting system totally sucks, and really needs to be changed.

Here's a summary of what's happened so far, which is fairly typical for a Presidential race:

The Republicans started out with 17 candidates, most of whom are fairly impressive. I include in this list: Bush, Carson, Cruz, Kasich, Rubio, Trump, Christie, Fiorina, Paul, Huckabee, Santorum, Pataki, Graham, Jindal, Walker, Perry, and Gilmore.

The Democrats started out 5 candidates, most of whom are impressive idiots. I'm including Clinton, Sanders, O'Malley, Webb, and Chafee. You could also include Biden, who probably would have been better than these five. (as would Bubbles the Chimp)

Iowa and New Hampshire are now over, as also are the campaigns of all but the first 5 Republicans and all but the first 2 Dems. And Carson's campaign is on life support. Iowa contains about 0.9% of the US population. New Hampshire contains about 0.3% of the US population. So together they have about 1% of the country's population, but have managed to eliminate 12 out of 17 Republicans, without any of the rest of us getting to consider them. Not to mention eliminating 3 Dem candidates, along with Biden and Bubbles. Pretty much Iowa and NH get to eliminate over 2/3 of the candidates before the rest of us get a chance to participate.

This primary system needs to be changed, and I say do this:
1. Divide the country in regions - Northeast, MidAtlantic, South, Midwest, Southwest, North, and WestCoast
2. The primary season should be a series of primaries by region, not by state, each primary 2 weeks apart.
3. The order of the regions can the same every cycle, or could shift.

The benefits of this would be that we all get to have an opinion on all the candidates, and all the campaigning wouldn't just be in Iowa and NH for over a year. Also, the candidates would have to stay on message, instead of just shaking hands in NH, and promising crop subsidies to Iowa.

Anyone agree?

[NightTrain]

Actually, I was kind of hoping that Biden would jump in. He's fine when he's focused and following his script... it's when he's presented with a question from left field that doom comes from his mouth, making PR people fling themselves from skyscrapers. I wanted him in just for the entertainment value.


Anyway, I agree with your idea, Russ. More than 2 states should have a hand in whittling down candidates, and that's what is happening. Christie could be one of the leaders in the race right now if other states had had a say in how it shapes up. And momentum is a powerful thing for drawing more money and generating enthusiasm in these races.

On the other hand... by having the early States be in the spotlight and seeing how each individual candidate operates and responds to situations, could the argument could be made that the majority of the country has the benefit of actually seeing them in action and being more informed?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I have to say that our Primary voting system totally sucks, and really needs to be changed.

Here's a summary of what's happened so far, which is fairly typical for a Presidential race:

The Republicans started out with 17 candidates, most of whom are fairly impressive. I include in this list: Bush, Carson, Cruz, Kasich, Rubio, Trump, Christie, Fiorina, Paul, Huckabee, Santorum, Pataki, Graham, Jindal, Walker, Perry, and Gilmore.

The Democrats started out 5 candidates, most of whom are impressive idiots. I'm including Clinton, Sanders, O'Malley, Webb, and Chafee. You could also include Biden, who probably would have been better than these five. (as would Bubbles the Chimp)

Iowa and New Hampshire are now over, as also are the campaigns of all but the first 5 Republicans and all but the first 2 Dems. And Carson's campaign is on life support. Iowa contains about 0.9% of the US population. New Hampshire contains about 0.3% of the US population. So together they have about 1% of the country's population, but have managed to eliminate 12 out of 17 Republicans, without any of the rest of us getting to consider them. Not to mention eliminating 3 Dem candidates, along with Biden and Bubbles. Pretty much Iowa and NH get to eliminate over 2/3 of the candidates before the rest of us get a chance to participate.

This primary system needs to be changed, and I say do this:
1. Divide the country in regions - Northeast, MidAtlantic, South, Midwest, Southwest, North, and WestCoast
2. The primary season should be a series of primaries by region, not by state, each primary 2 weeks apart.
3. The order of the regions can the same every cycle, or could shift.

The benefits of this would be that we all get to have an opinion on all the candidates, and all the campaigning wouldn't just be in Iowa and NH for over a year. Also, the candidates would have to stay on message, instead of just shaking hands in NH, and promising crop subsidies to Iowa.

Anyone agree?

I think it a brilliant solution to a big problem on our side.
As to the other side, the ffing loons.
In NH, Sanders won the dem primary in a landslide yet the Hildbeast got more delegates!
That is the lib/dem built in cheating by Super delegates.. Insures that the party leadership can knock out
any undesirable(by their dictatorial decree) candidate. However, definitely insures that the people's choice can be easily overrode by the dem top leaders( Gods/Tyrants that they be)...--Tyr

[Russ]

I think it a brilliant solution to a big problem on our side.
As to the other side, the ffing loons.
In NH, Sanders won the dem primary in a landslide yet the Hildbeast got more delegates!
That is the lib/dem built in cheating by Super delegates.. Insures that the party leadership can knock out
any undesirable(by their dictatorial decree) candidate. However, definitely insures that the people's choice can be easily overrode by the dem top leaders( Gods/Tyrants that they be)...--Tyr

Thanks, Tyr, and I agree that the whole superdelegate system is just a way for the party to pick their candidate over the will of the primary voters.

By the way, I love the "Hildebeast" reference. I hope you don't mind if I steal that one for future posts, not to mention conversations at home. :thumb:

[tailfins]

Thanks, Tyr, and I agree that the whole superdelegate system is just a way for the party to pick their candidate over the will of the primary voters.

By the way, I love the "Hildebeast" reference. I hope you don't mind if I steal that one for future posts, not to mention conversations at home. :thumb:

You don't have to steal the Hildebeast reference. It belongs the the G. Gordon Liddy radio program.

http://tunein.com/radio/The-G-Gordon-Liddy-Show-p20256/

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You don't have to steal the Hildebeast reference. It belongs the the G. Gordon Liddy radio program.

http://tunein.com/radio/The-G-Gordon-Liddy-Show-p20256/

A simple matter of Free Speech TF....
I am sure that Russ already knows he did not need permission(mine or anybody else's) to use that word. It was a way of very saying nice and descriptive word of the beast named Hillary Clinton.
That you thought to inform him, says so much about your character and level of understanding, civility and conversing with other people.
However, you being petty, and thinking I was getting undue credit you felt the great and compelling need to spit out that info..
Now thats funny... :laugh::laugh::laugh:--Tyr

[Russ]

You don't have to steal the Hildebeast reference. It belongs the the G. Gordon Liddy radio program.

http://tunein.com/radio/The-G-Gordon-Liddy-Show-p20256/

My strong suspicion is that G Gordon Liddy stole it from Tyr, not the other way around.

[Elessar]

My strong suspicion is that G Gordon Liddy stole it from Tyr, not the other way around.

Now that is amusing! :laugh:

[Perianne]

My favorite description of her is "Lizard Queen". I don't know who originated it.

[fj1200]

Anyone agree?

Disagree. It should be a slow winnowing process. A larger region process you describe would favor the money candidates.

[Gunny]

Disagree. It should be a slow winnowing process. A larger region process you describe would favor the money candidates.

It needs to be changed. Right now it looks like a bad puppet show.

[Abbey Marie]

Disagree. It should be a slow winnowing process. A larger region process you describe would favor the money candidates.

Lol, there's a shocker!

[fj1200]

It needs to be changed. Right now it looks like a bad puppet show.

That's not because of the process.


Lol, there's a shocker!

Every time someone comes up with changes and campaign finance or other types "reform" it ends up benefiting the current power structure and incumbents are further solidified.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Lol, there's a shocker!

:laugh:, and who would have expected different from fj?
Russ comments on his proposed solution to our obvious primary problem(which means a positive remedy and improvement for the Republican party ) and little fj comes along and disagrees.
I would have never expected fj to agree with anything that improves the Republican party.-Tyr

[fj1200]

I would have never expected fj to agree with anything that improves the Republican party.-Tyr

Your fallacy easily identified. How does it improve the Republican party?

[Russ]

Disagree. It should be a slow winnowing process. A larger region process you describe would favor the money candidates.

Lol! That first word, "Disagree", should be embedded in your avatar, FJ. :rolleyes:

I have to disagree with your disagreement. I think the process I suggested would still be a winnowing process, but would remove the 'Iowa and New Hampshire' pandering and/or random dartboard factor that seems to dominate the current process, and replace it with something much better. What's wrong with the candidates having to appeal to a statistically significant and unbiased group of voters during their first primaries?

:salute:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Your fallacy easily identified. How does it improve the Republican party?

NO, ITS YOUR PROCLIVITY IDENTIFIED.
As to your question, must everything be explained to you like you are a child???
Ask Russ that question , but were I he, I would tell ya to go pound sand and for a host of reasons...--Tyr

[fj1200]

... I would tell ya to go pound sand and for a host of reasons...--Tyr

Because you'd rather post in your typical punkish way and not have to defend your position?

[fj1200]

Lol! That first word, "Disagree", should be embedded in your avatar, FJ. :rolleyes:

I have to disagree with your disagreement. I think the process I suggested would still be a winnowing process, but would remove the 'Iowa and New Hampshire' pandering and/or random dartboard factor that seems to dominate the current process, and replace it with something much better. What's wrong with the candidates having to appeal to a statistically significant and unbiased group of voters during their first primaries?

:salute:

Considering the question you asked... :poke: Unless of course you were just looking for rote praise.

Of course it's still a winnowing process, no disagreement there, but forcing candidates to campaign in regions that are overly large will decidedly favor the big money/name recognition candidates; That's a perfect corollary to campaign finance reform IMO. Just because the first caucus and primaries are centered in two states doesn't mean that candidates are not appealing to larger demographics and are not being exposed and influenced by national issues. I don't think it truly is a random process, it's a process that forces candidates to hone their message and prove that they can get it and win votes.

It is different but I don't see how your example equates to "better." How does it improve the Republican party? ;)

[Kathianne]

Personally I don't think that 'primary reform' should be focused on in the midst of an election, especially one as weird as this one. Right now the focus, imo, should be on getting someone who can take on whomever in November.

[jimnyc]

The more I look the more I don't like this system either. In a lot of election seasons, the latter half of the country didn't have really any say in who got nominated.

I think the primary should be identical to how the general is ran. Then let them campaign and have the general vote exactly 6 months later. But this primary system is weird, and sucks.