Land Management

[indago]

Journalists Jack Healy and Kirk Johnson wrote for The New York Times 10 January 2016:
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Ken Ivory, a Republican state representative from Utah, has been roaming the West with an alluring pitch to cattle ranchers, farmers and conservatives upset with how Washington controls the wide-open public spaces out here: This land is your land, he says, and not the federal government’s. Mr. Ivory, a business lawyer from suburban Salt Lake City, does not fit the profile of a sun-scoured sagebrush rebel. But he is part of a growing Republican-led movement pushing the federal government to hand over to the states millions of acres of Western public lands... The idea, which would radically reshape the West, is one that resonates with the armed group of ranchers and antigovernment activists who seized control of a wildlife refuge in Oregon more than a week ago. Ammon Bundy, the crew’s leader and the scion of a Nevada ranching family steeped in disputes with the federal government, said he and his sympathizers had gone to Oregon to give the refuge back to local ranchers.

Many conservatives — Mr. Ivory among them — criticized Mr. Bundy’s gun-toting tactics, but their grievances and goals are nearly identical.

...In July 2014, Senator Ted Cruz of Texas proposed preventing the federal government from owning more than half of any state’s land. (Five states are more than half federal land, according to a Congressional Research Service report.) And Representative Cresent Hardy, Republican of Nevada, whose district includes a ranch run by Mr. Bundy’s father, introduced a measure that would block the government from buying any new land unless it could pass a balanced budget.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/11/us/the-larger-but-quieter-than-bundy-push-to-take-over-federal-land.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0)

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Journalists Jack Healy and Kirk Johnson wrote for The New York Times 10 January 2016:
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Ken Ivory, a Republican state representative from Utah, has been roaming the West with an alluring pitch to cattle ranchers, farmers and conservatives upset with how Washington controls the wide-open public spaces out here: This land is your land, he says, and not the federal government’s. Mr. Ivory, a business lawyer from suburban Salt Lake City, does not fit the profile of a sun-scoured sagebrush rebel. But he is part of a growing Republican-led movement pushing the federal government to hand over to the states millions of acres of Western public lands... The idea, which would radically reshape the West, is one that resonates with the armed group of ranchers and antigovernment activists who seized control of a wildlife refuge in Oregon more than a week ago. Ammon Bundy, the crew’s leader and the scion of a Nevada ranching family steeped in disputes with the federal government, said he and his sympathizers had gone to Oregon to give the refuge back to local ranchers.

Many conservatives — Mr. Ivory among them — criticized Mr. Bundy’s gun-toting tactics, but their grievances and goals are nearly identical.

...In July 2014, Senator Ted Cruz of Texas proposed preventing the federal government from owning more than half of any state’s land. (Five states are more than half federal land, according to a Congressional Research Service report.) And Representative Cresent Hardy, Republican of Nevada, whose district includes a ranch run by Mr. Bundy’s father, introduced a measure that would block the government from buying any new land unless it could pass a balanced budget.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/11/us/the-larger-but-quieter-than-bundy-push-to-take-over-federal-land.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0)

Federal government has no damn business "owning" that land.
Greed and power/control is why they keep it.--Tyr

[indago]

Journalist Scott Sonner wrote for The Associated Press 19 January 2016:
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Siding with the government in a decades-old battle over grazing rights, a federal appeals court overturned a lower-court ruling in favor of a Nevada rancher and strongly admonished a judge in Reno for abusing his power and exhibiting personal bias against U.S. land managers. In a pair of decisions issued on Friday, the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals ruled the late Wayne Hage of Tonopah and his family were guilty of trespassing cattle on federal land illegally without a grazing permit and should be subject to fines. The appellate court based in San Francisco also determined that U.S. District Judge Robert Clive Jones had no legal basis to find employees of the Bureau of Land Management and Forest Service in contempt of court for doing their jobs. In remanding the case back to the lower court in Reno, a three-judge panel of the 9th Circuit took the unusual step of ordering a different district judge to handle the case.

...The former bankruptcy judge from Las Vegas appointed by President George W. Bush in 2003 has drawn attention in recent years with a number of high-profile rulings reversed by the 9th Circuit. His rejection of same-sex marriage in Nevada in 2012 was overturned on appeal in 2014. Other reversals include his dismissal last year of a suit against Nevada state officials accused of violating federal voting laws, and his refusal in 2012 to pull "None of These Candidates" off Nevada's ballots.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEVADA_RANCHER_9TH_CIRCUIT?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-01-19-18-37-27)

[indago]

A review of the Oregon occupiers — Citizens for Constitutional Freedom — perspective...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1JzuQf4DMU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mI9IlziWphY

[indago]

Journalist Terrance Petty wrote for The Associated Press 8 February 2016:
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The last four occupiers of an Oregon wildlife refuge have posted a series of defiant videos in which one of them calls FBI agents losers, shows a defensive perimeter they have built and takes a joyride in a government vehicle. The videos were posted Sunday on a YouTube channel called Defend Your Base, which the armed group has been using to give live updates.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_RANCHING_STANDOFF?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-02-08-20-48-18)

That's stupid! The Feds are not going to tolerate that. The occupiers are going to pay dearly for that.

[indago]

From The Associated Press 11 February 2016:
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Cliven Bundy, the father of the jailed leader of the Oregon refuge occupation and who was the center of a standoff with federal officials in Nevada in 2014, was arrested in Portland, the FBI said. ...No charges were listed and his projected release date was listed as unknown.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_RANCHING_STANDOFF_CLIVEN_BUNDY?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-02-11-04-07-08)

[indago]

From the New York Times 24 March 2016:
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The United States Fish and Wildlife Service will spend about $4 million to clean, repair and upgrade the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Burns, which was the site of a 41-day armed occupation by ranchers. Photographs shared by federal officials show that the ranchers left a mess. Repairing damage and removing debris is expected to take until early summer. In all, the standoff will cost the agency about $6 million, with about $2 million spent during the takeover, including the costs of moving the refuge’s 17 employees out of town for safety to live in hotels for weeks, the director, Dan Ashe, said.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/25/us/oregon-4-million-to-clean-area-seized-by-ranchers.html?ref=todayspaper)

[Elessar]

The Federal Government does own the land, saying it belongs to all the people and not
a select few. That helps prevent over development and abuse to the U.S. People's property.

The Feds could sell it if they so wish, but lots of that land is intended to be left alone for the
native critters to survive. That it is allowed for free-range livestock is a boon to the people.

[indago]

The Federal Government does own the land, saying it belongs to all the people and not
a select few. That helps prevent over development and abuse to the U.S. People's property.

The Feds could sell it if they so wish, but lots of that land is intended to be left alone for the
native critters to survive. That it is allowed for free-range livestock is a boon to the people.


Ken Ivory, Utah State Representative, has been promoting State stewardship of the public lands, "upset with how Washington controls the wide-open public spaces".

[Elessar]

Ken Ivory, Utah State Representative, has been promoting State stewardship of the public lands, "upset with how Washington controls the wide-open public spaces".

One of the first agencies to get money-raped to support more welfare programs is the Department of the Interior.
Many National Parks, Monuments, Forests, and Preserves are struggling because of budget cuts.

The BLM (Bureau of Land Management) is hurting badly and cannot staff the vast amount of land it is responsible for,
which is well over half of the public land in the Western States.

[indago]

One of the first agencies to get money-raped to support more welfare programs is the Department of the Interior.
Many National Parks, Monuments, Forests, and Preserves are struggling because of budget cuts.

The BLM (Bureau of Land Management) is hurting badly and cannot staff the vast amount of land it is responsible for,
which is well over half of the public land in the Western States.

If they can't handle it, they should let it go!

[Elessar]

If they can't handle it, they should let it go!

To whom?

Private parties or state supported persons who would abuse it, as has
been seen many times?

No...leave it to the people, and stop the Liberal's money grabbing from agency budgets.

[indago]

To whom?

I've already posted that...

[Elessar]

I've already posted that...

And I answered.

You were not specific, just vague. Saying "Just let it go" is not a specific answer.

[indago]

From The Associated Press 26 March 2016:
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Officials say threats against police and public officials that started within hours of the Jan. 26 death of ranching standoff leader Robert "LaVoy" Finicum have continued. One anonymous caller threatened to kill Gov. Kate Brown the day after Finicum died. Earlier this month, authorities documented up to 80 threats against police officers and others...

..."We're going to shoot to kill," one anonymous caller said in a message left for Brown. "You killed an unarmed rancher, so now one of you must die," said another caller to her office. ...One email demanded the release of refuge occupiers jailed on federal charges. It also demanded indictments for the officers involved in Finicum's death. If that doesn't happen, the writer said, "I am going to begin returning fire."

...Oregon State Police are investigating the threats.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_RANCHING_STANDOFF_THREATS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-03-26-16-14-00)

[indago]

From The Associated Press 4 April 2016:
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The actions of two rural Oregon sheriffs during an armed standoff at a national wildlife refuge were striking: one worked with federal officials to end the siege while the other questioned the FBI's authority and offered words of support for the occupiers.

Sheriff Dave Ward of Harney County, where the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge is located, cooperated with federal and state police, urging standoff leader Ammon Bundy and his followers to stand down and respect the law.

Meanwhile in Grant County, immediately to the north, Sheriff Glenn Palmer called the occupiers "patriots." When Bundy and others were arrested during a Jan. 26 traffic stop, they were on their way to his county. An Arizona rancher who police fatally shot when they say he reached for a gun shouted he was on his way to meet Palmer.

Palmer is a member of the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association, a group that bills itself as "the last line of defense" against a federal government they contend overreaches on gun control and other issues. They see sheriffs as the ultimate law enforcement authority in their dispute with the federal government over control of federal lands.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CONSTITUTIONAL_SHERIFFS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-04-04-02-20-30)

[Gunny]

From The Associated Press 4 April 2016:
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The actions of two rural Oregon sheriffs during an armed standoff at a national wildlife refuge were striking: one worked with federal officials to end the siege while the other questioned the FBI's authority and offered words of support for the occupiers.

Sheriff Dave Ward of Harney County, where the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge is located, cooperated with federal and state police, urging standoff leader Ammon Bundy and his followers to stand down and respect the law.

Meanwhile in Grant County, immediately to the north, Sheriff Glenn Palmer called the occupiers "patriots." When Bundy and others were arrested during a Jan. 26 traffic stop, they were on their way to his county. An Arizona rancher who police fatally shot when they say he reached for a gun shouted he was on his way to meet Palmer.

Palmer is a member of the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association, a group that bills itself as "the last line of defense" against a federal government they contend overreaches on gun control and other issues. They see sheriffs as the ultimate law enforcement authority in their dispute with the federal government over control of federal lands.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CONSTITUTIONAL_SHERIFFS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-04-04-02-20-30)

You might establish some credibility if you'd do more than cut and paste crap. We are all capable of looking up articles.

[indago]

You might establish some credibility if you'd do more than cut and paste crap. We are all capable of looking up articles.

I'm not taking credit for what was written, as anyone can plainly see, the Associated Press article was written by NICHOLAS K. GERANIOS.

[Gunny]

I'm not taking credit for what was written, as anyone can plainly see, the Associated Press article was written by NICHOLAS K. GERANIOS.

No one said you were taking credit. Guess my point zoomed right over. You rarely if ever speak for yourself. My granddaughter knows how to cut n paste someone else's work. The original entire point of these boards was to DISCUSS. Not post pictures, everyone else's articles, and other goofy crap.

And I will be on my high horse on this particular topic. If and when I post an article, I ALWAYS use it as backup to MY argument, not as a stand alone piece. The same goes on the rare occasions I post pics and/or videos. But in the end, I'm making MY argument, not someone else's.

[indago]

No one said you were taking credit. Guess my point zoomed right over. You rarely if ever speak for yourself. My granddaughter knows how to cut n paste someone else's work. The original entire point of these boards was to DISCUSS. Not post pictures, everyone else's articles, and other goofy crap.

And I will be on my high horse on this particular topic. If and when I post an article, I ALWAYS use it as backup to MY argument, not as a stand alone piece. The same goes on the rare occasions I post pics and/or videos. But in the end, I'm making MY argument, not someone else's.

I posted some highlights from the article. For the curious, a link is posted so that the whole article can be read. The link is marked "article". For those who just want to Whine'nSnivel over it, here is another link:

LINK (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?49744-The-aboutime-and-Gunny-Snivel-Thread&p=735589#post735589)

This one is marked "LINK".

[Gunny]

I posted some highlights from the article. For the curious, a link is posted so that the whole article can be read. The link is marked "article". For those who just want to Whine'nSnivel over it, here is another link:

LINK (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?49744-The-aboutime-and-Gunny-Snivel-Thread&p=735589#post735589)

This one is marked "LINK".

Whine and snivel? How about bored and actually have some computer time? I could give a crap less about your links, or your whine n snivel thread. The fact is, why don't you strap on your big boy panties and speak for yourself instead of regurgitating articles we are all capable of finding on our own if we actually gave a shit?

[indago]

Whine and snivel? How about bored and actually have some computer time? I could give a crap less about your links, or your whine n snivel thread. The fact is, why don't you strap on your big boy panties and speak for yourself instead of regurgitating articles we are all capable of finding on our own if we actually gave a shit?

When I read the article, I thought it was rather interesting, so I thought I would share it with those who would be interested. Of course, if you are not interested, don't read it. Other than that:

LINK (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?53399-Land-Management&p=808451#post808451)

[indago]

Journalist Ken Ritter wrote for The Associated Press 10 May 2016:
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Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy is suing the federal judge handling his criminal case stemming from an armed standoff with government agents, with a complaint that accuses President Barack Obama, U.S. Sen. Harry Reid and one of Reid's sons of plotting to steal Bundy's property. Bundy lawyer Joel Hansen handed a copy of the lawsuit to U.S. District Judge Gloria Navarro in open court in Las Vegas on Tuesday, and he told her that because she's a named defendant, she should remove herself from Bundy's case.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_RANCHING_STANDOFF?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-05-10-19-06-03)