Trump calls for Muslim border ban ...

[Drummond]

Reported just minutes ago on the domestic BBC News channel, on our 10PM news, and which appears to be a breaking news story ... a report which says that Donald Trump has called for a total, complete ban on Muslims entering the US !

According to the report, Trump has called for this in response to large numbers of Muslims having hatred towards America.

They switched over to a report from the BBC's Washington correspondent, Nick Bryant ... who began his report by waving an A4 sheet of paper in front of the camera - which he said was a Press release from Donald Trump's HQ ... and said that when it first arrived in their Inboxes about an hour ago, it was thought to be a joke .. nobody took it seriously, thinking it was an attempt to parody Trump and couldn't be for real. But they've since confirmed that it's genuine.

'A total and complete shutdown on Muslims entering the US, until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on'. This is Bryant's quote from the Press release.

Bryant goes on to say that it's been 'condemned as racist demagoguery' by a number of groups there, not least from a number of Muslim groups in America, who've said 'We are now entering into the realms of the fascist'.

The White House has commented ... says that 'This statement is contrary to US values'.

Bryant concludes his report by saying that this type of comment from Trump usually propels him into a front-runner position in the race to the White House .. but - Bryant concludes by saying 'Many people will say this isn't the road to the White House, but this is the gutter'.

Bryant doesn't SAY who'd say that .. I get the impression that this is a bit of ad-hoc 'balanced' reporting (as balanced as it gets from the BBC) slung into the mix by Bryant's team. The report ended.

A quick disapproving scowl from Huw Edwards (anchorman for the News show) .. they sometimes don't bother to hide such things .. and he moved on to the next item.

Folks, a comment from me .. I'm impressed ! I'm sure British politicians wouldn't have the freedom to arrange such a ban, even if they were ever inclined to implement one !! I'll no doubt be learning of some White House vitriol on this one in the days to come ...

[Black Diamond]

The road to the White House usually goes through the gutter. Nothing new there.

[Elessar]

It is hardly racist. Islam is NOT a race.

What he had done was speak up for the feelings of a lot of Americans who
have no other outlet. People are concerned and Obama is useless.

The Denier-in-Chief is spineless and refused to take control 3 years
ago when this threat began to grow.

Against American values?? Got to stop the leaks sometime, and
that means Mexicans and Central American Illegals as well

[Drummond]

The road to the White House usually goes through the gutter. Nothing new there.

Well .. I approve !!!

It's a bit like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted .. I'm sure that America has more than 'enough' Muslims already, ban or no ban. Still, the implementation of one surely can't do any harm, either.

Seeing if Trump has improved his ratings once more should be highly interesting, and if he has, whether Obama's mob are willing to learn anything from that (I somehow doubt it very much). It should add an interesting factor to the race for the Presidency.

[Drummond]

It is hardly racist. Islam is NOT a race.

What he had done was speak up for the feelings of a lot of Americans who
have no other outlet. People are concerned and Obama is useless.

The Denier-in-Chief is spineless and refused to take control 3 years
ago when this threat began to grow.

Against American values?? Got to stop the leaks sometime, and
that means Mexicans and Central American Illegals as well

Perhaps Obama feels he can sell the message to the People that being 'pro-Muslim' (or at any rate, never daring to annoy them) is somehow, of itself, consistent with American values ?

That would be fully in line with the British Leftie approach, where the expectation always was that you should defer to whatever they want, on pain of being a 'bigot' or 'racist' if you don't.

[Perianne]

Well .. I approve !!!

It's a bit like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted .. I'm sure that America has more than 'enough' Muslims already, ban or no ban. Still, the implementation of one surely can't do any harm, either.

Seeing if Trump has improved his ratings once more should be highly interesting, and if he has, whether Obama's mob are willing to learn anything from that (I somehow doubt it very much). It should add an interesting factor to the race for the Presidency.

If a country has one, that is one too many. They should get their own countries and stay there.

[Drummond]

If a country has one, that is one too many. They should get their own countries and stay there.:clap::clap::clap:

Can't help but agree. Having any around is useless at best, harmful (in the extreme ?) at worst.

Over here, when they're not planting bombs or giving hatespeech rants at or outside mosques, they prove themselves to be expert at claiming State benefit payouts. As much as they hate the country they're in, somehow, this fails to translate to comparable hatred for our money.

.... 'strange', that ....

[Elessar]

Well .. I approve !!!

It's a bit like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted .. I'm sure that America has more than 'enough' Muslims already, ban or no ban. Still, the implementation of one surely can't do any harm, either.

Seeing if Trump has improved his ratings once more should be highly interesting, and if he has, whether Obama's mob are willing to learn anything from that (I somehow doubt it very much). It should add an interesting factor to the race for the Presidency.

I am not yet fully in Trump's corner. He is a bit bombastic.

However, if he does stick to his guns and makes it, I can
see him cleaning house in an instant - no prisoners taken.

[Black Diamond]

I am not yet fully in Trump's corner. He is a bit bombastic.

However, if he does stick to his guns and makes it, I can
see him cleaning house in an instant - no prisoners taken.
I doubt I will be in his corner until he wins the nomination.

[Elessar]

If a country has one, that is one too many. They should get their own countries and stay there.

I won't go that far, M'Lady. Just get rid of or reject the
ones that refuse to assimilate.

We should not kowtow to a minority that refuses to
be a part of this nation. That opinion applies to all
immigrants as well as the Black Live Matter idiots.

[Elessar]

I doubt I will be in his corner until he wins the nomination.

Time will tell...he needs a strong VP candidate that might grab him
by his lapels and says "Look, Sir. You need to back off some". :laugh:

[Drummond]

I won't go that far, M'Lady. Just get rid of or reject the
ones that refuse to assimilate.

We should not kowtow to a minority that refuses to
be a part of this nation. That opinion applies to all
immigrants as well as the Black Live Matter idiots.

Sounds good on the face of it. However, some of the terrorists who've already launched attacks seemed, beforehand, to 'have assimilated'. The '7/7' London bombing of a decade ago was led by a schoolteacher who nobody had even though of as 'religious', much less 'radicalised'.

Fact is, you can never be sure of these things. Waiting around to be sure may mean waiting until it's too late ...

[Elessar]

Sounds good on the face of it. However, some of the terrorists who've already launched attacks seemed, beforehand, to 'have assimilated'. The '7/7' London bombing of a decade ago was led by a schoolteacher who nobody had even though of as 'religious', much less 'radicalised'.

Fact is, you can never be sure of these things. Waiting around to be sure may mean waiting until it's too late ...

That is quite true.

They are sneaky and snaky.!

[gabosaurus]

Reported just minutes ago on the domestic BBC News channel, on our 10PM news, and which appears to be a breaking news story ... a report which says that Donald Trump has called for a total, complete ban on Muslims entering the US !


http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/07/donald-trump-ban-all-muslims-entering-us-san-bernardino-shooting

My response is: *** Edited by Admin ***

[Drummond]

Finally, a link I can offer .. it took a while for the BBC's website to catch up with their broadcasts !

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-35035190


Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump has called for a "total and complete" halt to Muslims entering the US, in the wake of the deadly California shootings.He said that polling showed a "hatred" by Muslims towards Americans that could put the nation at risk.

The border shutdown should remain "until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on".

The White House swiftly criticised Mr Trump's statement as "un-American".

It is contrary to US values and its national security interests, a statement said.

Last week, a Muslim couple believed to have been radicalised opened fire and killed 14 people at a health centre in San Bernardino.

Mr Trump's statement to reporters on Monday said polling firms like the Center for Security Policy had data that showed a hatred by a significant number of Muslims against Americans.

"Without looking at the various polling data, it is obvious to anybody the hatred is beyond comprehension. Where this hatred comes from and why, we will have to determine.

"Until we are able to determine and understand this problem and the dangerous threat it poses, our country cannot be the victims of horrendous attacks by people that believe only in Jihad, and have no sense of reason or respect for human life."

Here's some biased commentary from a BBC man, from the same link ....


Again and again during his campaign, Donald Trump has grabbed the Republican Party by the neck and dragged it to the anti-immigration, nativist right.

With his call for a halt to all Muslim entry into the US - reportedly even for simple tourism - he has set down yet another marker that will force his fellow candidates to stand with him or risk his dismissive ire.

Mr Trump was ridiculed when he launched his White House bid by accusing Mexico of sending its "rapists and criminals" into the US, and yet the New Yorker shot up in the polls.

He was denounced after suggesting that some mosques should be closed and Muslims in the US monitored, but he solidified his status as the party's frontrunner. In the end his hardline positions became largely accepted, if not embraced, by his fellow candidates.

Now he is being roundly condemned for his border-closing proposal. Will this finally be a bridge too far?

Perhaps.

Early reports, however, show his supporters welcoming this latest pronouncement. Such is the state of the 2016 presidential campaign season so far.

[Drummond]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/07/donald-trump-ban-all-muslims-entering-us-san-bernardino-shooting

My response is: *** Edited by Admin ***

This is your answer to a politician who defies your own brand of politics, Gabby ?

Looking on the 'bright' side .. if your lot succeeded in their gun control aims, it wouldn't really matter either way, now, would it ?

[Black Diamond]

This is your answer to a politician who defies your own brand of politics, Gabby ?

Looking on the 'bright' side .. if your lot succeeded in their gun control aims, it wouldn't really matter either way, now, would it ?

Compassionate "liberals"

[Elessar]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/07/donald-trump-ban-all-muslims-entering-us-san-bernardino-shooting

My response is: *** Edited by Admin ***

That, M'Lady is pretty foul and sounds like a direct threat to a candidate.

You had better tread lightly and retract that comment, Gabby.

[Black Diamond]

That, M'Lady is pretty foul and sounds like a direct threat to a candidate.

You had better tread lightly, Gabby.

That's no lady.

[Drummond]

Compassionate "liberals":laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

[Elessar]

That's no lady.

Too many years involved with Federal LE to ignore that.
I reported it.

That is horseshit....I might not like Obama or Clinton, but that is a veiled threat
statement...not good for this forum.

[gabosaurus]

That, M'Lady is pretty foul and sounds like a direct threat to a candidate.

You had better tread lightly, Gabby.

I am not threatening anyone. Trump is doing the threatening. His discourse is drawn directly from old Hitler speeches.
Like I have said before, if I could question Trump in person, I would ask him where he is planning to put the concentration camps and whether he plans on using gas or ovens.

There has been a lot of foul comments made about Obama (and other Dems) in this forum over the last eight years or so. I believe Trump deserves equal treatment.
Even my father-in-law, the most conservative of all Republicans, recognizes Trump as Hitler incarnate. Trump is stoking the fans of hatred and discontent the same way Hitler did in his rise to power. Listen to some of Hitler's early speeches and you will recognize Trump's current vitriol.
I have studied that period of 20th century Germany all my life. I know when it is happening.

How many of you have ever fantasized about going back in time to post-WWI Germany and taking out Hitler before he came to power?
You don't have to fantasize about Trump. He is standing before you in real time.

Truth be told, I wouldn't harm anyone not threatening my family. But there are a lot of off balance nutcases out there and a lot of accessible guns.

[LongTermGuy]

Pay attention and WATCH...LISTEN...DIGEST....

3:31

`Islamic Scholar Outlines Islam's Intentions for America`



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JJeVLTGYX8

[Elessar]

I am not threatening anyone. .

Bullshit!

Wishing for a Sirhan Sirahan or John Hinkley is not a veiled threat?
You do not have to try to preach to me. What you pulled out of your ass was
wrong.

They were assassins...is that what you want?

As I said...tread lightly. I do not put up with that as being a retired
Federal Officer.

Reported to Jimmy.

[gabosaurus]

It is not a veiled threat at all. Just a warning. Preaching hatred pisses people off. This country has a vast amount of lunatic fringe. You become too public with your extreme views and people take notice.
Look what happened to John Kennedy, Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King. Not to mention Reagan. Even the Pope.
Remember the words of Martin Niemoller now or regret it later.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[Elessar]

It is not a veiled threat at all. Just a warning. Preaching hatred pisses people off. This country has a vast amount of lunatic fringe. You become too public with your extreme views and people take notice.
Look what happened to John Kennedy, Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King. Not to mention Reagan. Even the Pope.
Remember the words of Martin Niemoller now or regret it later.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

NO! Your wish for assassins is plain wrong.

When will you Libs learn to watch your mouth?

That was a veiled threat to a candidate, and you know it.
It is in print for all to see.

Screw the other excuses. What you put out is simply fukkin wrong.

I do not care about who 'came for you' in some fantasy.
Don't put this forum in jeopardy for your loose tongue, Gabby.

[revelarts]

this thread is far to disturbing for comment

[gabosaurus]

NO! Your wish for assassins is plain wrong.
When will you Libs learn to watch your mouth?
That was a veiled threat to a candidate, and you know it.
It is in print for all to see.
Screw the other excuses. What you put out is simply fukkin wrong.
I do not care about who 'came for you' in some fantasy.
Don't put this forum in jeopardy for your loose tongue, Gabby.

When will Trump learn to watch his mouth? That is the question. What he puts out is simply fukkin wrong.

If years of past comments about Obama (and others) haven't taken down this forum, I doubt my comments about Trump will.
Trump wants people dead. I do not.

[Perianne]

...Even my father-in-law, the most conservative of all Republicans...

I am not your father-in-law.

[gabosaurus]

I am not your father-in-law.

Good to hear. One of him is more than enough. :cool:

[revelarts]

i have to say this.

for those that can't seem to see the problem here may i suggest you try replacing the word "Muslims" with "Jews" or "christians" or "militia" or "whites" or "hindus" or "cancer patients" "handicapped" 'feeble minded" name your potential problem population for the next presidents to ban, deport, quarantine... remove.

the Germans believed they had "good reasons" to fear (be angry at) it's Jewish citizens and the "international Jew" and wanted them gone too right?

[Elessar]

When will Trump learn to watch his mouth? That is the question. What he puts out is simply fukkin wrong.

If years of past comments about Obama (and others) haven't taken down this forum, I doubt my comments about Trump will.
Trump wants people dead. I do not.

Then why the comment?
Wishing for the presence of two assassins is not a veiled threat?

Try again, Gabby.

[PixieStix]

i have to say this.

for those that can't seem to see the problem here may i suggest you try replacing the word "Muslims" with "Jews" or "christians" or "militia" or "whites" or "hindus" or "cancer patients" "handicapped" 'feeble minded" name your potential problem population for the next presidents to ban, deport, quarantine... remove.

the Germans believed they had "good reasons" to fear (be angry at) it's Jewish citizens and the "international Jew" and wanted them gone too right?

The Jews didn't go around terrorizing people. THAT is the difference. Islam is hateful and evil. It come straight from the pit of hell, it is more like fascism than you care to admit.

The Islamic leaders and scholars have declared war on the entire world for the sake of their god. And you don't see a problem with letting them into our country, do you want to be part of helping them fulfill their evil acts on innocent people?

[LongTermGuy]

The Jews didn't go around terrorizing people. THAT is the difference. Islam is hateful and evil. It come straight from the pit of hell, it is more like fascism than you care to admit.

The Islamic leaders and scholars have declared war on the entire world for the sake of their god. And you don't see a problem with letting them into our country, do you want to be part of helping them fulfill their evil acts on innocent people?

Well said...and God Bless Israel for fighting / defending it self from muslim terrorist scum ....

[Black Diamond]

Well said...and God Bless Israel for fighting / defending it self from muslim terrorist scum ....

You don't think Trump is Hitler?

[LongTermGuy]

You don't think Trump is Hitler?


​No...I feel `o` and Hillary are worse...and their lemming supporters...who are doing more.. "long-term"...damage

*God Bless Donald Trump for standing up to Deceitful fools and Liberal "PC" Ignorance...:salute:

[Elessar]

i have to say this.

for those that can't seem to see the problem here may i suggest you try replacing the word "Muslims" with "Jews" or "christians" or "militia" or "whites" or "hindus" or "cancer patients" "handicapped" 'feeble minded" name your potential problem population for the next presidents to ban, deport, quarantine... remove.

the Germans believed they had "good reasons" to fear (be angry at) it's Jewish citizens and the "international Jew" and wanted them gone too right?

The subject in the present is Muslims.
Try to keep up.

[Drummond]

this thread is far to disturbing for comment

Truth frequently is, for the Left.

[Drummond]

i have to say this.

for those that can't seem to see the problem here may i suggest you try replacing the word "Muslims" with "Jews" or "christians" or "militia" or "whites" or "hindus" or "cancer patients" "handicapped" 'feeble minded" name your potential problem population for the next presidents to ban, deport, quarantine... remove.

the Germans believed they had "good reasons" to fear (be angry at) it's Jewish citizens and the "international Jew" and wanted them gone too right?

-- Totally diversionary, with the intention to demonise to the maximum extent. [Leftie fayre, to be sure ...]

Trump is addressing what he argues is a measure of threat. JEWS don't threaten America, nor do CHRISTIANS .. never mind any of the others you mention. And there is, to say the very least, a clear and proven basis for perceiving a real and ongoing threat !! 9/11 wasn't a product of your other groupings, nor was 7/7, nor was the Atocha bombing in Spain, nor was Bali, Tunisia, more recently Paris (much less the extremely recent attack in San Bernardino, which has raised the latest alertness to a specific anti-US threat !).

Incidentally, I don't believe Trump said his proposed ban would be permanent ! He just wants one, he says, for as long as it takes 'to find out what the hell is going on'. And even THIS, creates such division and controversy, 'prompting' talk of assassins !!

So, who's the real 'extremist' in all this ? REALLY ?

I fail to see how Trumps' concern, his approach to it, is less than eminently reasonable.

[Noir]

To quote a song a heard recently that seems rather apt given some of the responses in this thread - 'We've learned from history, so we get to go around again.' - The fact that these kinda comments help rather than hinder Trumps campaign is cause for concern.

[Drummond]

You don't think Trump is Hitler?

Judging from what I've heard just over the last hour (sources: LBC News, specifically the James O'Brien show; the BBC's news output; Sky News) ... our media, certainly the rabidly Left-wing O'Brien, they're all going 'ape' over Trump's comment. The BBC labels it - i.e just gives it a news categorisation - as 'Trump's Tirade'.

And, yes. O'Brien calls it both 'fascism' and 'Hitlerism' from Trump. This is an excuse for attack that THE LEFT has wasted little time in launching.

Look at this dispassionately. Attacks have been happening, for a very long time now, by Islamist terrorists. We now have arguably the worst of the lot, ISIS, well funded, with international reach, who've already committed some of the worst terrorist atrocities ever seen. We now have a current outbreak of attacks happening .. the two recent ones being Paris and San Bernardino, just in recent weeks.

What has Trump done ? 'Shockingly', he's actually REACTED, and with what, precisely ? Note this carefully - no, not EVEN with a call for a PERMANENT ban on Muslims entering your country, but just one that, as I understand this, acts as a holding position until such time as the nature, level, extent, of threat, is properly assessed and, presumably, guarded against !!

Really 'shocking' stuff, eh ? Just going THIS far sees Trump demonised as 'Hitler', and gets a Leftie, here, talking about assassins !!

I suggest - regardless of however much anyone wants to further indulge in demonisation activity, be it here, &/or the wider media - that the REAL extremism here is that which we see from the Left, who'll go to the most massive extremes to demonise someone just for calling for defensive, precautionary measures against a known, provable, and ongoing threat, one that's killing innocent people !!!!!

[Drummond]

To quote a song a heard recently that seems rather apt given some of the responses in this thread - 'We've learned from history, so we get to go around again.' - The fact that these kinda comments help rather than hinder Trumps campaign is cause for concern.

Americans having real concern for their country's welfare, and wanting to support someone who meets that concern head-on with something more than mere politically-convenient platitudes .... you come up with 'We've learned from history, so we get to go around again' as a response ?

Could it be that TRUMP has learned from history ? From 9/11 ? 7/7 ? Or the more recent 'history' of Paris, or now, San Bernardino ?

Noir, would you prefer to see politicians fight for power who've no interest in ever learning from such history, who'll trade their mandates to serve the People, for a more convenient ostrich posing .. in the hope that, with the right spin, they can convert it into populist voting ? And in the meantime .. NOTHING REALLY USEFUL IS DONE TO STOP INNOCENT PEOPLE FROM BEING BUTCHERED BY TERRORISM .. ??

Do tell, Noir ...

[Drummond]

This is from one of the UK's more RIGHT WING publications ... the Daily Express. Even THEY characterise reaction to Trump's statements with the word 'shock' ... their headline ...

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/624995/Donald-Trump-ban-Muslims-America-US-ISIS-Islamic-State-San-Bernardino-immigration-Obama


Shock as Donald Trump says US should ban all Muslims in response to San Bernardino
But, let's consider what Trump is reported as actually SAYING ...



“Without looking at the various polling data, it is obvious to anybody the hatred is beyond comprehension. “Where this hatred comes from and why we will have to determine.

“Until we are able to determine and understand this problem and the dangerous threat it poses, our country cannot be the victims of horrendous attacks by people that believe only in jihad, and have no sense of reason or respect for human life.”
Very 'Hitleresque' of him .. eh ?

[Drummond]

Pay attention and WATCH...LISTEN...DIGEST....

3:31

`Islamic Scholar Outlines Islam's Intentions for America`



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JJeVLTGYX8




Slavery and butchery in prospect. With a 'best possible' alternative of paying a tax for daring to not fully believe in Islam ....

... now, when did I last see any of this broadcast by the BBC .. ???

The post I'm responding to could have received a particular response. From a Leftie, say, who's start speculating, in however veiled a way, about the relevance of 'assassins' to address the proponent of what was said in that clip ...

Ah, but no. Instead, Lefties prefer to concentrate on TRUMP to demonise and vent their prejudices against ...

[revelarts]

The Jews didn't go around terrorizing people. THAT is the difference. Islam is hateful and evil. It come straight from the pit of hell, it is more like fascism than you care to admit.

The Islamic leaders and scholars have declared war on the entire world for the sake of their god. And you don't see a problem with letting them into our country, do you want to be part of helping them fulfill their evil acts on innocent people?

hmmm, well the Germans believed otherwise

"...For hundreds of years Germany was good enough to receive these elements (Jews), although they possessed nothing except infectious political and physical diseases. What they possess today, they have to by far the largest extent gained at the cost of the less astute German nation by the most reprehensible manipulations....

...The world has sufficient space for settlement, but we must once and for all get rid of the opinion that the Jewish race was only created by God for the purpose of being in a certain percentage a parasite living on the body and the productive work of other nations. The Jewish race will have to adapt itself to sound constructive activity as other nations do, or sooner or later it will succumb to a crisis of an inconceivable magnitude....

...If the international Jewish financiers in and outside Europe should succeed in plunging the nations once more into a world war, then the result will not be the bolshevization of the earth, and this the victory of Jewry,...

...The nations are no longer willing to die on the battlefield that this unstable international race (Jews) may profiteer from a war or satisfy its Old Testament vengeance. The Jewish watchword, 'Workers of the world, unite!' will be conquered by a higher realization, namely, 'Workers of all classes and of all nations, recognize your common enemy!...'"

The Jewish Question speech 1939

[Jeff]

I am not threatening anyone. Trump is doing the threatening. His discourse is drawn directly from old Hitler speeches.
Like I have said before, if I could question Trump in person, I would ask him where he is planning to put the concentration camps and whether he plans on using gas or ovens.

There has been a lot of foul comments made about Obama (and other Dems) in this forum over the last eight years or so. I believe Trump deserves equal treatment.
Even my father-in-law, the most conservative of all Republicans, recognizes Trump as Hitler incarnate. Trump is stoking the fans of hatred and discontent the same way Hitler did in his rise to power. Listen to some of Hitler's early speeches and you will recognize Trump's current vitriol.
I have studied that period of 20th century Germany all my life. I know when it is happening.

How many of you have ever fantasized about going back in time to post-WWI Germany and taking out Hitler before he came to power?
You don't have to fantasize about Trump. He is standing before you in real time.

Truth be told, I wouldn't harm anyone not threatening my family. But there are a lot of off balance nutcases out there and a lot of accessible guns.

OOO Hell that does it, your father in law hates, him well hell so do I. :rolleyes:


Funny how you want to compare Trump to Hitler but thought it was wrong when folks did it to Obama.

[fj1200]

Constitution: We hardly knew ye.

[Perianne]

Constitution: We hardly knew ye.

The Constitution was written for regular people.

[fj1200]

The Constitution was written for regular people.

If you were conservative you might have known that.

[Perianne]

If you were conservative you might have known that.

Quit changing quotes. It is of poor taste.

[Gunny]

Reported just minutes ago on the domestic BBC News channel, on our 10PM news, and which appears to be a breaking news story ... a report which says that Donald Trump has called for a total, complete ban on Muslims entering the US !

According to the report, Trump has called for this in response to large numbers of Muslims having hatred towards America.

They switched over to a report from the BBC's Washington correspondent, Nick Bryant ... who began his report by waving an A4 sheet of paper in front of the camera - which he said was a Press release from Donald Trump's HQ ... and said that when it first arrived in their Inboxes about an hour ago, it was thought to be a joke .. nobody took it seriously, thinking it was an attempt to parody Trump and couldn't be for real. But they've since confirmed that it's genuine.

'A total and complete shutdown on Muslims entering the US, until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on'. This is Bryant's quote from the Press release.

Bryant goes on to say that it's been 'condemned as racist demagoguery' by a number of groups there, not least from a number of Muslim groups in America, who've said 'We are now entering into the realms of the fascist'.

The White House has commented ... says that 'This statement is contrary to US values'.

Bryant concludes his report by saying that this type of comment from Trump usually propels him into a front-runner position in the race to the White House .. but - Bryant concludes by saying 'Many people will say this isn't the road to the White House, but this is the gutter'.

Bryant doesn't SAY who'd say that .. I get the impression that this is a bit of ad-hoc 'balanced' reporting (as balanced as it gets from the BBC) slung into the mix by Bryant's team. The report ended.

A quick disapproving scowl from Huw Edwards (anchorman for the News show) .. they sometimes don't bother to hide such things .. and he moved on to the next item.

Folks, a comment from me .. I'm impressed ! I'm sure British politicians wouldn't have the freedom to arrange such a ban, even if they were ever inclined to implement one !! I'll no doubt be learning of some White House vitriol on this one in the days to come ...

We are "NOW entering into the realms of fascism"? The left might want to go take a long look in the mirror. They're the biggest bunch of fascists going today.

I don't know that I agree with Trump singling out just Muslims. I think we should stop emigration PERIOD. For ANY and ALL. We can't even support ourselves. Funny the left wants to change every rule in the book and read into the Constitution things it doesn't say; yet, they want to incessantly push this "land of opportunity" notion as if it's written in blood.

[fj1200]

Quit changing quotes. It is of poor taste.

So is racism and xenophobia.

[fj1200]

We are "NOW entering into the realms of fascism"? The left might want to go take a long look in the mirror. They're the biggest bunch of fascists going today.

I don't disagree but why did you quote that?

[Gunny]

So is racism and xenophobia.

So where does common sense come into play? I don't care who they are nor where they come from. We have too many people and not enough jobs. Maybe these entitled immigrants should spend more time working instead of leaching off our tax dollars and making more mouths to feed?

And like it or not, it is neither racist nor xenophobic to point out that it is the minorities in this country doing it. It's just fact. Non-politically correct fact, but fact nonetheless. The only people that actually have to work around here are white.

[fj1200]

So where does common sense come into play? I don't care who they are nor where they come from. We have too many people and not enough jobs. Maybe these entitled immigrants should spend more time working instead of leaching off our tax dollars and making more mouths to feed?

And like it or not, it is neither racist nor xenophobic to point out that it is the minorities in this country doing it. It's just fact. Non-politically correct fact, but fact nonetheless. The only people that actually have to work around here are white.

Of course it isn't racist or xenophobic to point out facts so it's a good thing I wasn't doing so. :) But to your former point we should have control of our borders and who enters, etc. It also doesn't take a Constitutional Amendment to amend the '64 Immigration Act.

[revelarts]

To quote a song a heard recently that seems rather apt given some of the responses in this thread - 'We've learned from history, so we get to go around again.' - The fact that these kinda comments help rather than hinder Trumps campaign is cause for concern.
great quote here's another along that line.

"History never repeats, but it does rhyme"
Mark Twain

[Gunny]

Of course it isn't racist or xenophobic to point out facts so it's a good thing I wasn't doing so. :) But to your former point we should have control of our borders and who enters, etc. It also doesn't take a Constitutional Amendment to amend the '64 Immigration Act.

Don't hold your breath waiting on ME to disagree with you. We have and have had all the laws we need. Making another one that won't be enforced doesn't impress me. O'Reilly and his "Kate's Law" crap comes to mind. Enforce the ones we already have on the books instead of making some media sensationalism out of ONE incident. That kind of crap happens every day, but he gets on his narcissistic roll for a redundant cause and everyone gets in an uproar.

Texas put an illegal on death row for riding trains and murdering people at each stop. The laws exist already. Use them. But the Feds can't even control this "sanctuary city" crap. Why should anyone fear a paper tiger?

[Black Diamond]

So where does common sense come into play? I don't care who they are nor where they come from. We have too many people and not enough jobs. Maybe these entitled immigrants should spend more time working instead of leaching off our tax dollars and making more mouths to feed?

And like it or not, it is neither racist nor xenophobic to point out that it is the minorities in this country doing it. It's just fact. Non-politically correct fact, but fact nonetheless. The only people that actually have to work around here are white.

Talk about inconvenient Truth....

[Black Diamond]

What FDR did with Japanese citizens was more extreme than what trump is suggesting. Yet the Left puts him on a pedestal.

[Gunny]

What FDR did with Japanese citizens was more extreme than what trump is suggesting. Yet the Left puts him on a pedestal.

Trump is actually not that smart. He doesn't think things through before opening his mouth. I'd call for a moritorium on ALL immigration. Tht way, even if no one likes the idea, they can't accuse him of singling anyone out.

Personally, I'd send them all to Iraq and the DNC with them. He's screwing up strategically by alienating too many people. I know plenty of people on the right like him because of his tugh talk, but those "plenty of people" aren't going to win a general election. They don't represent the majority and neither does Trump.

[jimnyc]

I feel so badly for these folks.




I'm over it. Send 'em packing!

[Black Diamond]

Constitution: We hardly knew ye.

How well did Lincoln and FDR know it?

[Black Diamond]

I feel so badly for these folks.




I'm over it. Send 'em packing!
Fucking bleeding heart.

[Black Diamond]

Trump is actually not that smart. He doesn't think things through before opening his mouth. I'd call for a moritorium on ALL immigration. Tht way, even if no one likes the idea, they can't accuse him of singling anyone out.

Personally, I'd send them all to Iraq and the DNC with them. He's screwing up strategically by alienating too many people. I know plenty of people on the right like him because of his tugh talk, but those "plenty of people" aren't going to win a general election. They don't represent the majority and neither does Trump.

I share your fears. I just get tired of faux rage and hypocrisy on the Left.

[Gunny]

I share your fears. I just get tired of faux rage and hypocrisy on the Left.

You forgot the MSM. I'm sick of their crap. Y'all wonder why I disappear for a few days, and my GF accuses me of controlling the TV and I haven't watched it in days. I may sound like a cliche, but I miss the "good old day". Something happened and it was done with a Page One article. Okay, I get it ... two idiots went into Nowhereville and murdered some people. I'm on the 6th day of hearing about it, and the speculation. Kill the f*ckers and move on, huh?

And then you got Gabby, who has links to every social media site in the universe. I don't even know what social media is. THIS board is social media to me. Well, I think I do have an e-mail account. I don't care what Trump nor anyone else has to say on tweet or whatever the f*ck that crap is called.

The left, through the MS are just beating the Hell out of us with their incessant BS chatter.

[Gunny]

I don't disagree but why did you quote that?

Seemed like the thing to do?:dunno:

I don't like fascists from EITHER side. It's why I don't like Trump. I blame Abraham Lincoln for this BS. He was so busy "preserving the Union" he forgot the Constitution that made it.

[Drummond]

So is racism and xenophobia.

.... and remind us: terrorists' HUMAN RIGHTS are sacrosanct, eh ....

Aha. Now, there's a surprise, FJ. The 'race card' is one that THE LEFT always play, somewhere along the line, where debates on subjects such as this are concerned (you should've heard James O'Brien, on his LBC phone-in radio show this morning .. he insists that Trump was being racist, he even spoke over a caller, then cut him off, when the caller tried to tell him that Islam was a faith and racism wasn't involved). Sure enough ... here you are, picking up on a point which O'Brien argued in favour of himself ..... the 'race card' having 'relevance' ....

[PixieStix]

Senate sub committee on immigration for a 5 year period. (That is since Obama has been in office, has skyrocketed. Much like everything else negative since he has been in our Whitehouse)

90% of these are on food stamps.........

Green Card Totals, FY09-FY13:
Pakistan (83K), Iraq (83K), Bangladesh (75K), Iran (73K), Egypt (45K), Somalia (31K), Uzbekistan (24K), Turkey (22K), Morocco (22K), Jordan (20K), Albania (20K), Lebanon (16K), Yemen (16K), Indonesia (15K), Syria (14K), Sudan (13K), Afghanistan (11K), Sierra Leone (10K), Guinea (8K), Senegal (7K), Saudi Arabia (7K), Algeria (7K), Kazakhstan (7K), Kuwait (5K), Gambia (5K), United Arab Emirates (4K), Azerbaijan (4K), Mali (3K), Burkina Faso (3K), Kyrgyzstan (3K), Kosovo (3K), Mauritania (2K), Tunisia (2K), Tajikistan (2K), Libya (2K), Turkmenistan (1K), Qatar (1K), Chad (1K)
[Note: These are the specific DHS green card totals during this time range for Muslim-majority countries which sent at least one-thousand or more migrants, and include any refugees or asylees who adjusted to LPR status.]

Something needs to give. Our leftist policies are going to kill us

http://www.sessions.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2015/11/subcommittee-chart-u-s-issued-680-000-green-cards-to-migrants-from-muslim-nations-over-the-last-five-years

[Black Diamond]

Senate sub committee on immigration for a 5 year period. (That is since Obama has been in office, has skyrocketed. Much like everything else negative since he has been in our Whitehouse)

90% of these are on food stamps.........

Green Card Totals, FY09-FY13:
Pakistan (83K), Iraq (83K), Bangladesh (75K), Iran (73K), Egypt (45K), Somalia (31K), Uzbekistan (24K), Turkey (22K), Morocco (22K), Jordan (20K), Albania (20K), Lebanon (16K), Yemen (16K), Indonesia (15K), Syria (14K), Sudan (13K), Afghanistan (11K), Sierra Leone (10K), Guinea (8K), Senegal (7K), Saudi Arabia (7K), Algeria (7K), Kazakhstan (7K), Kuwait (5K), Gambia (5K), United Arab Emirates (4K), Azerbaijan (4K), Mali (3K), Burkina Faso (3K), Kyrgyzstan (3K), Kosovo (3K), Mauritania (2K), Tunisia (2K), Tajikistan (2K), Libya (2K), Turkmenistan (1K), Qatar (1K), Chad (1K)
[Note: These are the specific DHS green card totals during this time range for Muslim-majority countries which sent at least one-thousand or more migrants, and include any refugees or asylees who adjusted to LPR status.]

Something needs to give. Our leftist policies are going to kill us

http://www.sessions.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2015/11/subcommittee-chart-u-s-issued-680-000-green-cards-to-migrants-from-muslim-nations-over-the-last-five-years


:laugh:

Wow. Just wow. That number is so ridiculous it's funny.

[Abbey Marie]

Senate sub committee on immigration for a 5 year period. (That is since Obama has been in office, has skyrocketed. Much like everything else negative since he has been in our Whitehouse)

90% of these are on food stamps.........

Green Card Totals, FY09-FY13:
Pakistan (83K), Iraq (83K), Bangladesh (75K), Iran (73K), Egypt (45K), Somalia (31K), Uzbekistan (24K), Turkey (22K), Morocco (22K), Jordan (20K), Albania (20K), Lebanon (16K), Yemen (16K), Indonesia (15K), Syria (14K), Sudan (13K), Afghanistan (11K), Sierra Leone (10K), Guinea (8K), Senegal (7K), Saudi Arabia (7K), Algeria (7K), Kazakhstan (7K), Kuwait (5K), Gambia (5K), United Arab Emirates (4K), Azerbaijan (4K), Mali (3K), Burkina Faso (3K), Kyrgyzstan (3K), Kosovo (3K), Mauritania (2K), Tunisia (2K), Tajikistan (2K), Libya (2K), Turkmenistan (1K), Qatar (1K), Chad (1K)
[Note: These are the specific DHS green card totals during this time range for Muslim-majority countries which sent at least one-thousand or more migrants, and include any refugees or asylees who adjusted to LPR status.]

Something needs to give. Our leftist policies are going to kill us

http://www.sessions.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2015/11/subcommittee-chart-u-s-issued-680-000-green-cards-to-migrants-from-muslim-nations-over-the-last-five-years



Geez, now I'm officially bummed for the day.

[Black Diamond]

Geez, now I'm officially bummed for the day.

Somber senior admin....

[Perianne]

Senate sub committee on immigration for a 5 year period. (That is since Obama has been in office, has skyrocketed. Much like everything else negative since he has been in our Whitehouse)

90% of these are on food stamps.........

Green Card Totals, FY09-FY13:
Pakistan (83K), Iraq (83K), Bangladesh (75K), Iran (73K), Egypt (45K), Somalia (31K), Uzbekistan (24K), Turkey (22K), Morocco (22K), Jordan (20K), Albania (20K), Lebanon (16K), Yemen (16K), Indonesia (15K), Syria (14K), Sudan (13K), Afghanistan (11K), Sierra Leone (10K), Guinea (8K), Senegal (7K), Saudi Arabia (7K), Algeria (7K), Kazakhstan (7K), Kuwait (5K), Gambia (5K), United Arab Emirates (4K), Azerbaijan (4K), Mali (3K), Burkina Faso (3K), Kyrgyzstan (3K), Kosovo (3K), Mauritania (2K), Tunisia (2K), Tajikistan (2K), Libya (2K), Turkmenistan (1K), Qatar (1K), Chad (1K)
[Note: These are the specific DHS green card totals during this time range for Muslim-majority countries which sent at least one-thousand or more migrants, and include any refugees or asylees who adjusted to LPR status.]

Something needs to give. Our leftist policies are going to kill us

http://www.sessions.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2015/11/subcommittee-chart-u-s-issued-680-000-green-cards-to-migrants-from-muslim-nations-over-the-last-five-years


I have been warning forever that immigration is the biggest danger America faces.

[Gunny]

Geez, now I'm officially bummed for the day.

Because no one will just stand up and say "No More". These people don't go and live in any unhabitated land. They just crowd into the largest cities. There are no jobs for them. How many camel herds you think we got here? What skill set does anyone think "I own a sand dune" require?

You can call that racist all you want but it's reality. Provide the opportunities to OUR people instead of letting a bunch of idiots wearing their bath liinen on their head come and overcrowd us. You're getting killed in your country? Got more firearms than kids over there. How about instead of running like little pansies you fight for your own damned country and quit expecting us to fight for you and harbor your wuss butts?

We already got Democrats. Like we need more backwards-assed thinking folks around here.

[PixieStix]

Because no one will just stand up and say "No More". These people don't go and live in any unhabitated land. They just crowd into the largest cities. There are no jobs for them. How many camel herds you think we got here? What skill set does anyone think "I own a sand dune" require?

You can call that racist all you want but it's reality. Provide the opportunities to OUR people instead of letting a bunch of idiots wearing their bath liinen on their head come and overcrowd us. You're getting killed in your country? Got more firearms than kids over there. How about instead of running like little pansies you fight for your own damned country and quit expecting us to fight for you and harbor your wuss butts?

We already got Democrats. Like we need more backwards-assed thinking folks around here.

Islamic scholars and leaders have no honor, they will do any underhanded thing to take over the world for their god. Why can't these low lives put on a uniform and fight like men instead of using women and children and the weak to do their bidding. They are disgusting maggots

[PixieStix]

Geez, now I'm officially bummed for the day.

Yeah me too Abbey :(

[Gunny]

Islamic scholars and leaders have no honor, they will do any underhanded thing to take over the world for their god. Why can't these low lives put on a uniform and fight like men instead of using women and children and the weak to do their bidding. They are disgusting maggots

Because we'd kick their asses back into the Stone Age. If they'd come out and fight like men this would be a done deal.

[Perianne]

Islamic scholars and leaders have no honor, they will do any underhanded thing to take over the world for their god. Why can't these low lives put on a uniform and fight like men instead of using women and children and the weak to do their bidding. They are disgusting maggots

Geez, this Muslim ho looks as manly as her man. Give her a couple of hours and she would have a five o'clock shadow.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8056&stc=1

[PixieStix]

Geez, this Muslim ho looks as manly as her man. Give her a couple of hours and she would have a five o'clock shadow.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8056&stc=1


Did you hear about their bank account? They received a total of $28,500 deposited into their account. That is why he brought her here and his mother knew, I have no doubt. For God's sake she lived there.

Burn in hell farook and malik

[Perianne]

Did you hear about their bank account? They received a total of $28,500 deposited into their account. That is why he brought her here and his mother knew, I have no doubt. For God's sake she lived there.

Burn in hell farook and malik

He didn't bring her here because he was attracted to her. Geez, she is homely.

[Gunny]

Geez, this Muslim ho looks as manly as her man. Give her a couple of hours and she would have a five o'clock shadow.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8056&stc=1

Arabs are ugly. Or should I say not attractive? I've seen better looking black women and their men are tiny little screwballs that couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag. And while in real life I tend to mind my own business .. don't bring your Sharia law over here. It violates the entire intent of our Constitution.

[Gunny]

And Pix can tell you ... they killed my best friend. She blames it on a religion and I blame it on a culture. Ain't a whole bunch of forgiveness going on around here.

[PixieStix]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKosd0xJadE

[Elessar]

So is racism and xenophobia.

Just a subtle reminder that Muslim is NOT a Race.

The other is possible, but they laid their cards on the table.
Liberals and the Left refuse to read them.

[Elessar]

Islamic scholars and leaders have no honor, they will do any underhanded thing to take over the world for their god. Why can't these low lives put on a uniform and fight like men instead of using women and children and the weak to do their bidding. They are disgusting maggots

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

If they are so brave, why do they wear masks and bandannas to diguise themselves?:laugh:

[Elessar]

Because we'd kick their asses back into the Stone Age. If they'd come out and fight like men this would be a done deal.

The USA, UK, Canada, and France could make that whole region a sheet of glass in less than an hour...and I suspect Israel could
as well!

[Black Diamond]

This will certainly affect the polls.

[PixieStix]

I am a bit bothered by the fact that the media is focus on the first few words of Trumps statement.

How convenient for the other candidates to jump on this like white on rice. Ted Cruz is the only one that wasn't an opportunist.

Trump said "UNTIL OUR COUNTRIES REPRESENTATIVES FIGURES OUT WHAT"S GOING ON" The part that the media and other candidates are ignoring. Some of them are saying basically the same thing

I feel exactly the same way. It isn't Christians that have declared war on America

[jimnyc]

Trump's daughter is kinda hot. Ok, she's VERY hot!

[PixieStix]

Trump's daughter is kinda hot. Ok, she's VERY hot!

His 2 adult kids are good people too.

[Perianne]

Trump's daughter is kinda hot. Ok, she's VERY hot!

Gross. She is NOT hot.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8060&stc=1

[jimnyc]

Gross. She is NOT hot.

Yekk! That woman is scary looking. But I meant Ivanka. If people were smart they would vote Trump just so that we could see more of her. :)

[Perianne]

Yekk! That woman is scary looking. But I meant Ivanka. If people were smart they would vote Trump just so that we could see more of her. :)

I wonder why you like her????

http://www.debatepolicy.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=8061&stc=1

[jimnyc]

I wonder why you like her????

I'm sure it's the pair, the beautiful pair of alluring eyes she has. :)

She's just beautiful altogether, and a very smart gal I might add!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

i have to say this.

for those that can't seem to see the problem here may i suggest you try replacing the word "Muslims" with "Jews" or "christians" or "militia" or "whites" or "hindus" or "cancer patients" "handicapped" 'feeble minded" name your potential problem population for the next presidents to ban, deport, quarantine... remove.

the Germans believed they had "good reasons" to fear (be angry at) it's Jewish citizens and the "international Jew" and wanted them gone too right?

Why? Are those people trying to murder all non-believers Rev.?
Or trying to install some type of Sharia law ?
Or murdering gays, infidels( of any other faith, even non-faith atheists etc) ?

A comparison on replacement can not be made using those groups because they are not murdering to seize total control for a damn false god...--Tyr

[Drummond]

Here's a twist to the story that Trump will, 'I'm sure', be losing a lot of sleep over .....

There are moves in the works to ensure that Donald Trump is banned from setting foot in Britain, on the grounds of his being an 'undesirable' because he 'preaches hate'.

Here's how the Daily Telegraph reports the ongoing story (& I should explain: here, if you visit a certain site and set up an online petition, then manage to get in excess of 10,000 signatures to it, this mandates our Government to respond to it) -

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/donald-trump/12040813/Ban-Donald-Trump-from-UK-online-petition-gets-huge-support.html


Tens of thousands of people have signed an online petition calling for Donald Trump to be barred from the UK following the controversy over his anti-Muslim rhetoric.

On Tuesday night more than 24,000 people had signed, which is more than double the number needed to force the Government to respond.

The demand - drawn up before the Republican's bitterly divisive call for Muslims to be denied entry to the United States - said Mr Trump should be excluded for spreading "hate speech".

The petition was drafted by Suzanne Kelly, a community activist who spearheaded opposition to the tycoon's development of a golf course in Aberdeeenshire in Scotland. The golf course went ahead despite protests that it was being built on environmentally-sensitive sand dunes.

"The UK has banned entry to many individuals for hate speech. The same principles should apply to everyone who wishes to enter the UK," the petition reads. "If the United Kingdom is to continue applying the 'unacceptable behaviour' criteria to those who wish to enter its borders, it must be fairly applied to the rich as well as poor, and the weak as well as powerful."

Petitions put before parliament merit the Government's response once they gather 10,000 signatures. If the number of signatories passes 100,000, it could become the subject of a House of Commons debate.

Ms Kelly's petition had obtained 24,314 signatures shortly after midnight GMT on Wednesday. It was launched last month following a string of controversial comments made by the billionaire property magnet about Muslims, as well as about Mexican immigrants.

The rate of signatories adding their support appeared to accelerate significantly after Mr Trump's comments on Monday calling for an indefinite ban on Muslims being allowed to enter the US.

If Trump becomes your next President, this could get very interesting.

[Gunny]

The USA, UK, Canada, and France could make that whole region a sheet of glass in less than an hour...and I suspect Israel could
as well!

Wouldn't bother me if any or all did. I'd just kind of roll over and snuggle the other way in the pillow. :laugh:

What DOES bother me is he's dividing the right. We aren't going to win that way and Hillary will because those goose-stepping Nazi leftists are all in lockstep.

[Drummond]

For what it's worth ... I've noticed that media commentators over here are increasingly suggesting that Trump didn't really mean a word of what he said. They think he said what he did just for notoriety, to keep the headlines rolling, to keep himself in the spotlight.

There's a definite reluctance here in the UK to grasp the idea that anyone can hold the perspective that Trump evidently does, and be serious about it. Such is the extent of PC brainwashing that's been managed over here, that there's a disbelief in the very thought process involved.

[Perianne]

For what it's worth ... I've noticed that media commentators over here are increasingly suggesting that Trump didn't really mean a word of what he said. They think he said what he did just for notoriety, to keep the headlines rolling, to keep himself in the spotlight.

There's a definite reluctance here in the UK to grasp the idea that anyone can hold the perspective that Trump evidently does, and be serious about it. Such is the extent of PC brainwashing that's been managed over here, that there's a disbelief in the very thought process involved.
Drummond

What percentage of Britain is of your mindset? There are millions of people here who feel like I do on many subjects...that is, conservative.

[Abbey Marie]

I'm sure much of it is fake, but she's very pretty. And smart.


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/73/10/0c/73100c245787bcac8be06ef0ffa54482.jpg

[Drummond]

@Drummond (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=2287)

What percentage of Britain is of your mindset? There are millions of people here who feel like I do on many subjects...that is, conservative.

It's very difficult to answer that. If I went purely on appearances, I'd have to say that I know of nobody at all who thinks or says quite what I do. Such is the extent of PC indoctrination that a vast majority seem to believe what our politicians (and that's from ALL sides of the political landscape) tell us ... that 'Islam is a religion of peace', that ISIS are a fringe minority of thugs, divorced from any semblance of Islamic thinking at all.

When the Paris attack happened, the media and political reaction was exactly as expected ... people rushing to make it extremely clear that ISIS don't represent Islam. From David Cameron, to Jeremy Corbyn, to every political commentator out there, we had that message preached time, and time, and time, again. Total solidarity on this specific point seemed to exist.

It begs the question: WHY is such an effort made to resurrect that message, unless the powers-that-be think we'll be persuaded otherwise .. or, already are ?

My guess ... more people DO think like me, than they'll admit to. They stay silent because of the social climate, as well as the fact that we have 'hatespeech' laws here which denunciations of Muslims would work against, making citizens liable to, at minimum, 'police interest' if they spoke out at all strongly against Islam.

So you see my difficulty in answering. Tune in to James O'Brien's phone-in show (LBC radio, weekday mornings), and you'd have to believe that EVERYONE refused to believe that ISIS was truly Islamic. But, because of the perceived need to constantly reinforce the 'PC' message, I'm willing to bet that a substantial number entertain strong doubts but just don't give vent to them.

I'm sure I'm in a minority. What I'm not sure of is quite how small that minority is.

Our Conservatives are not your Conservatives. David Cameron championed the 'cause' of gay marriage, for example. He says he 'loves' our NHS. And he's now one of the chorus who are condemnatory of Trump.

And he leads the 'ISIS aren't at all Islamic' chorus, as well.

We had a stabbing incident at Leytonstone Tube station, east London, over the weekend ... it was treated as a terrorist incident, and for a time it dominated our news broadcasts. The attacker tried to stab people to death in the ticket hall of the station (one man was seriously injured). In doing so, he was alleged to have said 'This is for Syria'.

An onlooker at the time said 'You ain't no Muslim, bruv'. Buying into the 'religion of peace' rot, but of course.

See, for an early news report on it ...

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/leytonstone-stabbing-man-arrested-after-reports-of-knife-attack-outside-tube-station-a3130796.html


A man has been arrested after a stabbing at Leytonstone Tube station in which it is claimed he screamed "this is for Syria".

Scotland Yard were called just after 7pm to reports a man's throat was slashed in an attack inside the Tube station and other people were being threatened with a knife.

Horrific images circulating on Twitter show a pool of blood on the floor near the ticket barriers and a confrontation in the station.

A video shows witnesses shouting at the man to drop his weapon before he is apprehended by officers.

Police confirmed a Taser had been used at the station.

According to Sky News, the alleged suspect shouted "this is for Syria" but the Met have not confirmed it.

It's a quote that Cameron has seized on, and repeated since.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3349430/You-ain-t-no-Muslim-bruv-David-Cameron-joins-legions-repeating-anti-terror-slogan-condemns-Leytonstone-knife-attack.html


David Cameron today praised the man who shouted 'you ain't no Muslim, bruv' during the alleged terror attack in Leytonstone.

The eyewitness’s defiant riposte to the senseless bloodshed at an east London Tube station on Saturday night, recorded on a video clip, has become the defining response to the atrocity.

Today the Prime Minister said the incident in which a 56-year-old man was almost killed was 'hideous' - but admitted the man who said 'you ain't no Muslim, bruv' put it 'better than I could have done'.

The Government insist on a vice-like hold on public opinion. You publicly defy it at your peril.

[gabosaurus]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well? Such as Jews or Buddhists? We would have no choice but to comply!
The Trump Sturmabteilung would make sure of that.

https://i.imgflip.com/vgce7.jpg

[Gunny]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well? Such as Jews or Buddhists? We would have no choice but to comply!
The Trump Sturmabteilung would make sure of that.

https://i.imgflip.com/vgce7.jpg

I don't agree with banning anyone's 1st Amendment Rights. You CANNOT say the same. You and the rest of your lefty cohorts spend all your time trying to tell people what to think. What's the difference?

[Drummond]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well? Such as Jews or Buddhists? We would have no choice but to comply!
The Trump Sturmabteilung would make sure of that.

https://i.imgflip.com/vgce7.jpg

Your comment comes rather close to being outright disingenuous.

For one thing, Trump has said nothing about 'banning a religion', as I'm sure you well know. ALL he's said is that he wants a ban instituted on allowing Muslims to enter America. He also made it clear that his intention was not to insist that it was permanent, but just as a comparatively interim measure, while authorities get a proper grip on what exactly is going on where Muslim America-haters are concerned.

So, do you have evidence of Jews hating America, or Buddhists doing likewise ? Evidence of Jewish or Buddhist Jihadist terrorist cells, perhaps ?

Trump has attempted to address an issue of major concern which has a very serious security concern behind it. What RESPONSIBLE President, Gabby, shies AWAY from such a responsibility ??

Cue Leftie hand-wringing political figures, seizing upon cheap excuses to demonise, as a response .. ? H'mm ?

[Perianne]

Your comment comes rather close to being outright disingenuous.

For one thing, Trump has said nothing about 'banning a religion', as I'm sure you well know. ALL he's said is that he wants a ban instituted on allowing Muslims to enter America. He also made it clear that his intention was not to insist that it was permanent, but just as a comparatively interim measure, while authorities get a proper grip on what exactly is going on where Muslim America-haters are concerned.

So, do you have evidence of Jews hating America, or Buddhists doing likewise ? Evidence of Jewish or Buddhist Jihadist terrorist cells, perhaps ?

Trump has attempted to address an issue of major concern which has a very serious security concern behind it. What RESPONSIBLE President, Gabby, shies AWAY from such a responsibility ??

Cue Leftie hand-wringing political figures, seizing upon cheap excuses to demonise, as a response .. ? H'mm ?

Drummond, you are a master poster. Thank you, sir.

[Drummond]

Drummond, you are a master poster. Thank you, sir.

Flatterer !!! :eek::cheerss:

[Elessar]

I'm sure much of it is fake, but sh'es very pretty. And smart.


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/73/10/0c/73100c245787bcac8be06ef0ffa54482.jpg

Well..she's a doll

[Elessar]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well? Such as Jews or Buddhists? We would have no choice but to comply!
The Trump Sturmabteilung would make sure of that.

https://i.imgflip.com/vgce7.jpg

That is a stretch...a very long one.
The Jews and Buddhists are not an
immediate threat. The radicalized
Muslims are.

Get a grip, Gabby.

[Elessar]

Your comment comes rather close to being outright disingenuous.

For one thing, Trump has said nothing about 'banning a religion', as I'm sure you well know. ALL he's said is that he wants a ban instituted on allowing Muslims to enter America. He also made it clear that his intention was not to insist that it was permanent, but just as a comparatively interim measure, while authorities get a proper grip on what exactly is going on where Muslim America-haters are concerned.

So, do you have evidence of Jews hating America, or Buddhists doing likewise ? Evidence of Jewish or Buddhist Jihadist terrorist cells, perhaps ?

Trump has attempted to address an issue of major concern which has a very serious security concern behind it. What RESPONSIBLE President, Gabby, shies AWAY from such a responsibility ??

Cue Leftie hand-wringing political figures, seizing upon cheap excuses to demonise, as a response .. ? H'mm ?

Spot on, Drum!

[Drummond]

Here's a twist to the story that Trump will, 'I'm sure', be losing a lot of sleep over .....

There are moves in the works to ensure that Donald Trump is banned from setting foot in Britain, on the grounds of his being an 'undesirable' because he 'preaches hate'.

Here's how the Daily Telegraph reports the ongoing story (& I should explain: here, if you visit a certain site and set up an online petition, then manage to get in excess of 10,000 signatures to it, this mandates our Government to respond to it) -

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/donald-trump/12040813/Ban-Donald-Trump-from-UK-online-petition-gets-huge-support.html



If Trump becomes your next President, this could get very interesting.

... Still a developing 'twist', this ...

The number of signatures collected has now passed the 100,000 mark, which mandates our Government to not only respond, but to now get involved in discussion in Parliament to consider such a ban.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35052505


A petition calling for Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump to be barred from entering UK has passed 100,000, meaning MPs will have to consider debating the issue.

The petition went on Parliament's e-petition website on Tuesday.

It was posted in response to Mr Trump's call for a temporary halt on Muslims entering the United States.

Any petition with more than 100,000 signatures is automatically considered for debate in Parliament.

Mr Trump is seeking the Republican nomination for next year's US presidential election.

Home Secretary Theresa May can exclude an individual if she considers their presence is "not conducive to the public good or if their exclusion is justified on public policy grounds".

Chancellor George Osborne told the Commons that the remarks by the would-be Republican nominee flew in the face of America's founding principles and "were not welcome".

But he rejected calls for the billionaire businessman to be banned from Britain.

The full text of the petition - entitled "Block Donald J Trump from UK entry" - reads: "The UK has banned entry to many individuals for hate speech. The same principles should apply to everyone who wishes to enter the UK.

"If the United Kingdom is to continue applying the 'unacceptable behaviour' criteria to those who wish to enter its borders, it must be fairly applied to the rich as well as poor, and the weak as well as powerful."

[fj1200]

Don't hold your breath waiting on ME to disagree with you. We have and have had all the laws we need.

:thumb:


What FDR did with Japanese citizens was more extreme than what trump is suggesting. Yet the Left puts him on a pedestal.

They're not very consistent. Regarding trump, I have no confidence that he would stop with his current suggestion.

[fj1200]

How well did Lincoln and FDR know it?

"We" hardly knew it. It shouldn't be a document of convenience.


... 'relevance' ...

It's sad when you think opposition to racist rhetoric is leftie.


Senate sub committee on immigration for a 5 year period. (That is since Obama has been in office, has skyrocketed. Much like everything else negative since he has been in our Whitehouse)

What was it for the previous 5 years?

[fj1200]

Just a subtle reminder that Muslim is NOT a Race.

Whew. It's a good thing that wasn't my reference.

[glockmail]

Your comment comes rather close to being outright disingenuous.

Gabs is nothing more than an internet bomb thrower. She lies about a person's position, can't defend herself so leaves the thread. Then she spouts off another lie in another thread.

Trump is right on this.

[jimnyc]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well? Such as Jews or Buddhists? We would have no choice but to comply!
The Trump Sturmabteilung would make sure of that.


Your comment comes rather close to being outright disingenuous.

For one thing, Trump has said nothing about 'banning a religion', as I'm sure you well know. ALL he's said is that he wants a ban instituted on allowing Muslims to enter America.

Drummond beat me to it. He has no desire to ban a religion. He wants to ban folks from coming into the country temporarily. Gabby sounds awfully similar to the mainstream media in twisting the way she says things. If Trump is so so so bad so many on the left say - then let him fall on his sword on his own, no?

[fj1200]

... an internet bomb thrower. She lies about a person's position, can't defend herself so leaves the thread. Then she spouts off another lie in another thread.

You've just pegged half the board. :scared:

[jimnyc]

You've just pegged half the board. :scared:

Half? How many people can you HONESTLY say LIE about another person's position, and then literally bail from a thread? I've seen it happen, no doubt, but half of us bastards? And even while it does happen, not everyone makes a habit out of it.

[glockmail]

Half? How many people can you HONESTLY say LIE about another person's position, and then literally bail from a thread? I've seen it happen, no doubt, but half of us bastards? And even while it does happen, not everyone makes a habit out of it.


Only Gabs "makes a habit of it". It's her M.O. If there was a reward for trolling, she'd win it.

[jimnyc]

Only Gabs "makes a habit of it". It's her M.O. If there was a reward for trolling, she'd win it.

She likes to twist things, like a lot of us do. But then she makes shit up or hilariously gets things wrong. And when called on it, magically disappears.

off topic - just heard that song in my head from lucky charms (i think?) "They're magically delicious!"

[Drummond]

They're not very consistent. Regarding trump, I have no confidence that he would stop with his current suggestion.

Finding yet more 'reason' to oppose Conservatives, there, FJ ?

Are you nearly as garrulous when it comes to opposing Lefties ?

[Gunny]

Half? How many people can you HONESTLY say LIE about another person's position, and then literally bail from a thread? I've seen it happen, no doubt, but half of us bastards? And even while it does happen, not everyone makes a habit out of it.

My take is she's probably busy. She's on at weird hours. So am I. I don't care for a lot of the accusations I always see. Calling people liars. Claiming they bail on threads. I can honestly say I don't bail on threads. I just don't remember most of them. If they drop out of the Top 10, I'll forget them in a second. If that would work with my first wife I'd be in Heaven.:laugh:

Gabby comes on here to instigate. She'll slack off every once in awhile. But when she's bored, she purposefully tries to instigate.

But I always hated that accusation of "running away". Crap, I have to shower and shave too. Got a 5 month old to babysit and when she ain't happy, NOBODY's happy. Come 'ba-ba time" or "hold me time" she don't give a sh*t about any of y'all. And when she wants Sesame Street, this board ain't on the screen. Then you have to factor in time. It's 3 hours earlier on the West Coast. Two hours earlier where I am. Since most everyone on this board lives in Eastern Standard Time, we're up right about bedtime for you.

And I'm not defending Gabby. I think people that purposefully try to piss others off have issues. I'm defending we ALL have stuff to do. Why I was all for the @ thing (that doesn't work for me). If you don't draw attention for me to something, I may very well miss it. I doubt I'm the only person in that boat. And I STILL get accused of what I let people get away with on USMB. Sure, I have time to babysit my PM box, babysit the Admin forum AND read 2500 posts a day in 15 minutes before work and maybe 2 hours in the evening. :rolleyes:

[Drummond]

It's sad when you think opposition to racist rhetoric is leftie.

It's sad when you keep trying to sell yourself as 'Conservative', yet find excuse after excuse to oppose them.

Must I point out the obvious to you ... in a way that suggests your attention deficit problem is kicking in once again ? Muslims - Islam - IS NOT A RACE. It refers to a 'faith', and its practitioners, who can be of many races.

Trump has voiced no opposition to any specific race, and well you know it ... IF you're arguing honestly. No, you're just trying to demonise someone of your 'own' political persuasion (except, of course, in truth, HE ISN'T ..).

[jimnyc]

Mr. Gunny, aka traitor who roots for the blue star team,

I agree, it is dumb at times. We all have time constraints and such. BUT, some do it a LOT more than others. Sometimes I'll be gone for 2 days, and then come back and kinda search my own posts to see what I missed and if any replies. I don't expect everyone to do that though. But some are worse than others. Much worse. Much much worse.

Let's be realistic. There are times I will do what I'm doing now, write in paragraph form. The goal is to debate or discuss something with someone. Offer more information than the next person, more believable information, information with more believable supporting links.

Gabby rarely offers a lot of information. She rarely offers support for her opinions. She rarely uses believable sources. Then rarely, if ever, return to the thread if you spend 10 minutes writing up such a post.

I think it's just easier to write "go away, stupid".

But she's cool in sports threads, and lounge threads and animal threads. But politics? I'd love to whip a donut and hit her in the head with it sometimes.

[glockmail]

What would happen if Trump decided to ban other religions as well?

How is this not a lie Gunny? Since she makes a habit of these type of posts, that makes her a "liar".

And no, she's not busy. She's got a part time job and milks support off her hubby. Oh, she's probably busy at night on her back or on her knees...

[Gunny]

Mr. Gunny, aka traitor who roots for the blue star team,

I agree, it is dumb at times. We all have time constraints and such. BUT, some do it a LOT more than others. Sometimes I'll be gone for 2 days, and then come back and kinda search my own posts to see what I missed and if any replies. I don't expect everyone to do that though. But some are worse than others. Much worse. Much much worse.

Let's be realistic. There are times I will do what I'm doing now, write in paragraph form. The goal is to debate or discuss something with someone. Offer more information than the next person, more believable information, information with more believable supporting links.

Gabby rarely offers a lot of information. She rarely offers support for her opinions. She rarely uses believable sources. Then rarely, if ever, return to the thread if you spend 10 minutes writing up such a post.

I think it's just easier to write "go away, stupid".

But she's cool in sports threads, and lounge threads and animal threads. But politics? I'd love to whip a donut and hit her in the head with it sometimes.

Yeah? I just didn't mention my brand new Pittsburgh Steelers key chain because I didn't want you coming down here and murdering me in the wee hours of the morning for it. Nice long black strap with "Steelers" and the US Steel symbol in gold.

My point isn't about what Gabby offers. She offers entertainment. Substance? Not so much. My point is aimed more at the people that let her piss them off and take her seriously. I say the same about FJ and the same could be said about me. They push buttons. Now how would you assume I would know about that? In a ring, if you can push your opponent's buttons and throw him off his game/make him fight YOUR fight, you win. You get a boxer to stand toe to toe with you and you're a fighter, f*cker's going down.

[jimnyc]

Yeah? I just didn't mention my brand new Pittsburgh Steelers key chain because I didn't want you coming down here and murdering me in the wee hours of the morning for it. Nice long black strap with "Steelers" and the US Steel symbol in gold.

You can't wear a Steelers key chain and root for the blue star, that shit will get you killed!!! Or at least kicked out of my house. :laugh:


My point isn't about what Gabby offers. She offers entertainment. Substance? Not so much. My point is aimed more at the people that let her piss them off and take her seriously. I say the same about FJ and the same could be said about me. They push buttons. Now how would you assume I would know about that? In a ring, if you can push your opponent's buttons and throw him off his game/make him fight YOUR fight, you win. You get a boxer to stand toe to toe with you and you're a fighter, f*cker's going down.

I could have banned her 7 years ago and 16,000 run-ins ago. She's still here. I agree with the entertainment value. When I'm down and out - I need a liberal to beat up on. She fits the bill, and it's oh so easy since she's always wrong!

[Drummond]

... Still a developing 'twist', this ...

The number of signatures collected has now passed the 100,000 mark, which mandates our Government to not only respond, but to now get involved in discussion in Parliament to consider such a ban.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35052505

Just listened to a Sky News report. According to them, the 'ban Trump from the UK' petition has now got around 225,000 signatures, so the rate at which it's collecting new ones is actually increasing. I think it's a reasonably obvious point to make that the greater the number of signatures it gets, the harder it'll be for politicians to not follow through and institute such a ban.

[Gunny]

Just listened to a Sky News report. According to them, the 'ban Trump from the UK' petition has now got around 225,000 signatures, so the rate at which it's collecting new ones is actually increasing. I think it's a reasonably obvious point to make that the greater the number of signatures it gets, the harder it'll be for politicians to not follow through and institute such a ban.

Good thing he doesn't need any UK votes.:laugh:

[fj1200]

Half? How many people can you HONESTLY say LIE about another person's position, and then literally bail from a thread? I've seen it happen, no doubt, but half of us bastards? And even while it does happen, not everyone makes a habit out of it.

Mayhap a bit of hyperbole. :laugh:


Only Gabs "makes a habit of it". It's her M.O. If there was a reward for trolling, she'd win it.

Untrue. It is sometimes used in exchange of debating issues.


:blah:

I'll need a bong hit :420: to try and figure out where I opposed a conservative.

[fj1200]

Muslims - Islam - IS NOT A RACE. It refers to a 'faith', and its practitioners, who can be of many races.

No kidding. As I posted earlier.


Whew. It's a good thing that wasn't my reference.

You should try reading everything and not only what you can twist to agree with imaginatory ravings.

[Abbey Marie]

Mayhap a bit of hyperbole. :laugh:



Untrue. It is sometimes used in exchange of debating issues.



I'll need a bong hit :420: to try and figure out where I opposed a conservative.


This is at least the second time you've stated an excuse for a bong hit. I think maybe you don't really need an excuse.
:laugh2:

And you can kill two birds with one stone:

http://cityrag.com/photos/uncategorized/pringles.jpg

[Gunny]

This is at least the second time you've stated an excuse for a bong hit. I think maybe you don't really need an excuse.
:laugh2:

And you can kill two birds with one stone:

http://cityrag.com/photos/uncategorized/pringles.jpg

Nope. I PURPOSEFULLY hit that sucker. :laugh2:

[fj1200]

This is at least the second time you've stated an excuse for a bong hit. I think maybe you don't really need an excuse.
:laugh2:

And you can kill two birds with one stone:

http://cityrag.com/photos/uncategorized/pringles.jpg

:laugh:

I should have pulled a Costanza, "That's it for me everybody, have a great night and I'll see you tomorrow" after the first one. And I don't think I said I had one, only that I would need one. ;)

EDIT: And your picture didn't pull up for me for some reason. :(

[Drummond]

I'll need a bong hit :420: to try and figure out where I opposed a conservative.

... and there's your problem. Not being a Conservative, you can't identify Conservative thinking with any degree of confidence ... much less actually produce any.

So, you equate something one could identify as an anti-Muslim thought with 'racism'. Well, that's common amongst Lefties.

So, you fight to argue in favour of so-called 'terrorist human rights'. Again, that's common amongst Lefties.

As is the refusal to ever acknowledge that terrorists, and demonstrably, AREN'T human !!

[Never heard of a 'bong hit', by the way, and so the reference isn't understood. I'm assuming it's something uniquely American.]

[Gunny]

Trump and cohorts are going to get Hillary elected. No one's on the same sheet of music. No one stands for anything but themselves, and he's the worst of all. This is about the Office of the President of the United States, NOT Donald Trump. He's divided the right in more directions than a gyroscope.

Meanwhile, the left is going to goose-step in and vote for Hillary. A lousy front that presents ONE front is STILL better than a divided one.

[PixieStix]

The GOP is pissing me off over this. I called them and told them if they don't stop siding with the left, that I am going to denounce them and become an Independent.

[Gunny]

The GOP is pissing me off over this. I called them and told them if they don't stop siding with the left, that I am going to denounce them and become an Independent.

I already am. Registered in 3 states, matter of fact. Wonder if I should play Democrat and vote in all 3?:laugh:

[Trigg]

hey @gabby you forgot about this big old racist hate monger er.


http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/261062/carter-banned-iranians-coming-us-during-hostage-daniel-greenfield




During the Iranian hostage crisis, Carter issued a number of orders to put pressure on Iran. Among these, Iranianswere banned from entering (http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1980/4/8/carter-cuts-ties-with-iran-ppresident/) the United States unless they oppose the Shiite Islamist regime or had a medical emergency.

ourth, the Secretary of Treasury [State] and the Attorney General will invalidate all visas issued to Iranian citizens for future entry into the United States, effective today. We will not reissue visas, nor will we issue new visas, except for compelling and proven humanitarian reasons or where the national interest of our own country requires. This directive will be interpreted very strictly.

Carter orders 50,000 Iranian students in US to report to immigration office with view to deporting those in violation of their visas. On 27 December 1979, US appeals court allows deportation of Iranian students found in violation.

[fj1200]

... :blah: ...

I'm sorry was there an argument in there or just your typical lying and prattling on?

[fj1200]

hey @gabby you forgot about this big old racist hate monger er

There is a functional difference between Muslims and Iranians and especially a country that has just committed an act of war.

[PixieStix]

I already am. Registered in 3 states, matter of fact. Wonder if I should play Democrat and vote in all 3?:laugh:


I am registered in 3 States also. But I doubt I could get away with that, because I am a Republican, have been since I turned 18. :coffee:

[Perianne]

It's sad when you keep trying to sell yourself as 'Conservative', yet find excuse after excuse to oppose them.

Must I point out the obvious to you ... in a way that suggests your attention deficit problem is kicking in once again ? Muslims - Islam - IS NOT A RACE. It refers to a 'faith', and its practitioners, who can be of many races.

Trump has voiced no opposition to any specific race, and well you know it ... IF you're arguing honestly. No, you're just trying to demonise someone of your 'own' political persuasion (except, of course, in truth, HE ISN'T ..).

I understand what you are saying, Drummond. Rather than argue with my staunch conservative positions, when he gets frustrated he just calls me a racist. Typical of a liberal, or at least a faux-conservative.

Here is widsom: if one disagrees with me, Drummond, and some other great conservatives on this board, you should examine your self-identified "conservatism". I speak the truth. And I always have.

He should be grateful for great conservative women like me and Margaret Thatcher. I miss her. RIP.

[Perianne]

I am registered in 3 States also. But I doubt I could get away with that, because I am a Republican, have been since I turned 18. :coffee:

I love you, PixieStix.

[fj1200]

... my staunch conservative positions, when he gets frustrated he just calls me a racist.

Racism isn't conservatism no matter how staunch you are. I'm not sure I recall any conservative positions from you. :dunno:

[Perianne]

I understand what you are saying, @Drummond (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=2287). Rather than argue with my staunch conservative positions, when he gets frustrated he just calls me a racist. Typical of a liberal, or at least a faux-conservative.
...



Racism isn't conservatism no matter how staunch you are. I'm not sure I recall any conservative positions from you. :dunno:

Exhibit #243.

[jimnyc]

There is a functional difference between Muslims and Iranians and especially a country that has just committed an act of war.

Just a note of correction, Iranians ARE muslims. While many differences between the sunni and shia, both still muslims.

[Trigg]

There is a functional difference between Muslims and Iranians and especially a country that has just committed an act of war.


True, Carter banned the citizens of a specific country. But he also targeted students and mandated that 50,000 of them report to immigration offices. In all 15,000 Iranians were forced to leave the US.

Would he be called a racist and fear monger er today????? I believe so.

[PixieStix]

True, Carter banned the citizens of a specific country. But he also targeted students and mandated that 50,000 of them report to immigration offices. In all 15,000 Iranians were forced to leave the US.

Would he be called a racist and fear monger er today????? I believe so.

No he wouldn't. Because he was and still is a stupid liberal

[Perianne]

No he wouldn't. Because he was and still is a stupid liberal

I read yesterday where that liberal sack of crap (Carter) is getting cancer treatment from a drug made in Israel. What a hypocrite.

[Drummond]

I understand what you are saying, @Drummond (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=2287). Rather than argue with my staunch conservative positions, when he gets frustrated he just calls me a racist. Typical of a liberal, or at least a faux-conservative.

Here is widsom: if one disagrees with me, Drummond, and some other great conservatives on this board, you should examine your self-identified "conservatism". I speak the truth. And I always have.

Yes. Conservatives are grounded in realism, @Perianne (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=2722). FJ has failed to grasp that. He, like other Lefties, prefers propaganda to truth.

He also prefers to attack Conservatives, rather than find common cause with them. It seems you're his latest target of choice, Peri (again).


He should be grateful for great conservative women like me and Margaret Thatcher. I miss her. RIP.

Same here !! I miss her. Her contribution was a priceless one.

Along came FJ, a while ago, claiming then that he was the 'Ultimate Thatcherite', later modified to read 'One True Thatcherite'. But to even make that claim is to denigrate all other Thatcherites out there, something no TRUE Thatcherite would ever do.

FJ's as bogus as it gets. QED.

[Drummond]

I'm sorry was there an argument in there or just your typical lying and prattling on?

An argument involves more than one person (inmates of nuthouses excepted, I suppose). All I'm seeing from you is trolling.

[gabosaurus]

How prevalent is Muslim violence in the U.S.? How often are Muslims involved in killing sprees?
The Washington Post put together a map tracking all mass killings since Jan. 1 of this year. They also coded in which murder sprees involved Muslim suspects.
As I have said before, I was more frightened by old white guys and biker gangs than Muslims.

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/12348295_10100542307913059_447384034_n.jpg

[PixieStix]

How prevalent is Muslim violence in the U.S.? How often are Muslims involved in killing sprees?
The Washington Post put together a map tracking all mass killings since Jan. 1 of this year. They also coded in which murder sprees involved Muslim suspects.
As I have said before, I was more frightened by old white guys and biker gangs than Muslims.

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/12348295_10100542307913059_447384034_n.jpg

Maybe you should move to Syria then. There are a lot of white guys and bikers in our nation. And I am pretty sure they aren't going anywhere. Maybe you should convert to Islam?

[PixieStix]

gabosaurus

This is for you. Any way you cut it. It is not Islamophobia when they really are trying to kill you.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry3NzkAOo3s

[gabosaurus]

The old white guys won't be that dangerous once serious gun control laws are enacted. Which they will be if/when the Dems retain the White House in 2016.
I am in favor of forcing all bikers to register and placing all known biker hangouts under 24-hour surveillance.

My daughter is becoming one of those ever dangerous Christian Muslims. She and Pakistani girl across the street caused considerable consternation last year by posting pictures on facebook and Instagram of the two of them reading the Bible while sitting on a Muslim prayer rug.
This year, I suggested a picture of them reading the Quran in front of a Nativity scene. My husband is not sold on the idea. :terror:

[Abbey Marie]

I have serious a problem with a map that is supposed to track Muslim attacks, but doesn't even register the World Trade Center bombing #1, 9-11, or the Boston Marathon bombers. Shootings count but massive bombings don't?! Quite dishonest.

Not to mention all of the attacks overseas. Don't they count either? Remember Mr Klinghoffer?

Give them time, Gabby, they are just getting started here. And ask Israelis whom they worry about.

[Jeff]

I don't agree with banning anyone's 1st Amendment Rights. You CANNOT say the same. You and the rest of your lefty cohorts spend all your time trying to tell people what to think. What's the difference?

Well lets be fair Gunny. only if Obama tells them what to think do they do this, they have trouble thinking for themselves.

[Kathianne]

I must say, if the goal is to elect Hillary, this has been a brilliant maneuver. Instead of the media focusing on Obama's inane speech, promising to keep at the admitted failure of dealing with ISIS, the focus is on THE DONALD. Absolutely brilliant.

[jimnyc]

The old white guys won't be that dangerous once serious gun control laws are enacted. Which they will be if/when the Dems retain the White House in 2016.
I am in favor of forcing all bikers to register and placing all known biker hangouts under 24-hour surveillance.

My daughter is becoming one of those ever dangerous Christian Muslims. She and Pakistani girl across the street caused considerable consternation last year by posting pictures on facebook and Instagram of the two of them reading the Bible while sitting on a Muslim prayer rug.
This year, I suggested a picture of them reading the Quran in front of a Nativity scene. My husband is not sold on the idea. :terror:

Post the pictures of her and the neighbor. We can tell a lot by the data as to exactly when it was taken. Quite frankly, yes, I am calling you out on this once again. And if you're going to say no, then stop using your kid as a tool within an argument. I don't believe what you're saying. But you can prove me wrong... Should take 5 seconds to copy and put it here. I call BS yet again on the storyteller.

[jimnyc]

I must say, if the goal is to elect Hillary, this has been a brilliant maneuver. Instead of the media focusing on Obama's inane speech, promising to keep at the admitted failure of dealing with ISIS, the focus is on THE DONALD. Absolutely brilliant.

That would only hold true of one believes Trump can't get the nomination and then the general. I'm not yet ready to say. I do think he can win the nomination though. I just think indicators point to him having a tough time beating Hillary, but not a stretch.

But I agree. I would rather not have to worry as much, or even think of a "stretch", when it comes to placing another Clinton in office.

But I think if someone were to overtake Trump now, they will need a lot of folks to unite behind another candidate, and sadly I don't see that happening. Carson was pulling up side by side for awhile, but then dropped. Personally, I hope Cruz comes back to the thick of things, or even wins. I like him a REAL lot. I think ultimately he would do better in the general as well.

[Kathianne]

That would only hold true of one believes Trump can't get the nomination and then the general. I'm not yet ready to say. I do think he can win the nomination though. I just think indicators point to him having a tough time beating Hillary, but not a stretch.

But I agree. I would rather not have to worry as much, or even think of a "stretch", when it comes to placing another Clinton in office.

But I think if someone were to overtake Trump now, they will need a lot of folks to unite behind another candidate, and sadly I don't see that happening. Carson was pulling up side by side for awhile, but then dropped. Personally, I hope Cruz comes back to the thick of things, or even wins. I like him a REAL lot. I think ultimately he would do better in the general as well.

I hope to have been wrong all this time. I said from the outset that Trump is liberal, has been on nearly all the key indicators-economic and social. He 'arises' just when it's obvious that the road Obama has been on is not going to sell in 2016. So, he uses bombast very effectively, though if one really listens, the truth does come out. (Good ones need to be able to get back, for example.)

While I do blame Obama for opening the door on this, the GOP has as usual added to his allure. In spite of his use of hitting every hot button issue with rhetoric guaranteed to create both discussion and active loyalty to what they think he's standing for, not one of the candidates have focused on the issues he brings up, rather they go for attack on the speaker.

At this point he will either win the nomination or go 3rd party, either way the results will be Hillary.

I do hope I'm wrong.

[jimnyc]

I do hope I'm wrong.

I hope I'm wrong on every nightmare I envision with the witch getting in!!

The thing is, I don't think the GOP are enemies, but it's coming off that way. If someone wants Trump to be the nominee, and another person Bush - that's cool. We should be happy with our options, and the ability to have so long to see who they are, and have all of our votes counted in making the person we all want to go against shrillary. I know I'm not an enemy to anyone - but the left. I'm open ears on all candidates and open ears as to what it will take to win the next election. I can say who my "favorite" is, but sometimes we know that a little less than our favorite is still better than the beotch.

In other words, I'll be at the ballot box no matter who gets the nod. But me alone won't take the election. EVERYONE on the right needs to come out. But reality also needs to be around starting in March - and seeing all of the indicators, as to who at the top is having the best chance against her.

[pete311]

I have serious a problem with a map that is supposed to track Muslim attacks, that doesn't even register the World Trade Center bombing #1, 9-11, or the Boston Marathon bombers. Shootings count but massive bombings don't?! Quite dishonest.

The graphic clearly states it's data from 1 year. That makes it even more disturbing.

[pete311]

If someone wants Trump to be the nominee, and another person Bush - that's cool. We should be happy with our options, and the ability to have so long to see who they are, and have all of our votes counted in making the person we all want to go against shrillary.

The problem is that Trumps rhetoric severely divides conservatives voters instead of unify. That is why the GOP is in crisis. 25% of mild conservatives and nearly every independent will not vote for Trump. To win the general electron Trump will have to backtrack on a lot of what he's said. That would make him a flip flopper of epic proportions. Either way. Hillary is in the white house.

[jimnyc]

The graphic clearly states it's data from 1 year. That makes it even more disturbing.

Nearly 30,000 terror attacks around the world by Islam since 9/11, now THAT is disturbing.

[jimnyc]

The problem is that Trumps rhetoric severely divides conservatives voters instead of unify. That is why the GOP is in crisis. 25% of mild conservatives and nearly every independent will not vote for Trump. To win the general electron Trump will have to backtrack on a lot of what he's said. That would make him a flip flopper of epic proportions. Either way. Hillary is in the white house.

Signs of a divided party would be like 5 candidates running at 10%. We have someone running away with things by all indicators, up until this point. IF any of these polls are to be believed at all - where are the votes/support for all of the candidates that are better than Trump? If so many don't like him, then why are they quiet at poll time? Or is Trump himself running the polls?

[pete311]

Signs of a divided party would be like 5 candidates running at 10%. We have someone running away with things by all indicators, up until this point. IF any of these polls are to be believed at all - where are the votes/support for all of the candidates that are better than Trump? If so many don't like him, then why are they quiet at poll time? Or is Trump himself running the polls?

Iowa polling is fairly speculative because of the low sampling. I believe Cruz is very close to Trump now.

[jimnyc]

Iowa polling is fairly speculative because of the low sampling. I believe Cruz is very close to Trump now.

Latest AVERAGES I could find:

Presidential: CBS/NY Times Trump +19

South Carolina - Trump +8

South Carolina FOX News - Trump +20

New Hampshire - Trump +18

And yep - Iowa - Cruz 24 and Trump is at 19 Then again, who won Iowa in 2012 and 2008? Huckabee and Paul got the delegates.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Signs of a divided party would be like 5 candidates running at 10%. We have someone running away with things by all indicators, up until this point. IF any of these polls are to be believed at all - where are the votes/support for all of the candidates that are better than Trump? If so many don't like him, then why are they quiet at poll time? Or is Trump himself running the polls?

TRUMP HAS BEEN THE FRONT RUNNER SINCE THE START..
Now even republicans are joining the dems in their attacks on Trump as a way they think to aid their choice!
To me this is a grave error--helping the ffing dems destroy him and if he was so damn weak against hillary why would the dems be attacking him so much?
I view it as a bad mistake to help the traitorous dems destroy any of our guys!!!
And have great displeasure that any of us would do such a thing!
Trump is hitting back at Republican leadership thats desperately trying to sabotage him!
So that they can put in Bush, the illegal mexican loving bastard and a go along to get along worm(a damn globalist!)!
Some people need to wake up IMHO...--TYR

[revelarts]

@gabosaurus (http://www.debatepolicy.com/member.php?u=111)

This is for you. Any way you cut it. It is not Islamophobia when they really are trying to kill you.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry3NzkAOo3s
Well the point she made was that there ARE over 1 billion peaceful muslims... but there are millions "radicalized".
If you want to use that as a cover for some personal "Islamophobia" I guess no one can stop you.

But i would like to comment on the way she argued here. I get it. It's not all bad...
But there are serious flaws in it.

here's the thing
1st people on the left and right don't use the that argument format consistently. the speaker in the video said in reply to the muslim woman's comment on peaceful muslims..
"there were millions of peaceful germans but the NAZIs drove the agenda...
there were millions of peaceful Japanese...
there were millions of peaceful Russians...
...But those peaceful ones were irrelevant..."
She said there we millions Arabs in the U.S. but it only took -less than 20- to do 911

So we can also say...
there are millions of peaceful men but thousands are rapist and pedophiles so the peaceful and kind men are irrelevant....
...there were millions of peaceful POLICE but many cops are corrupt, violent and killers therefore the goods are irrelevant and should speak out more against the bad ones....
...there were millions of peaceful white people but some are racist so the non racist are irrelevant and need to speak out more against racism....

If it's good for the goose the argument it HAS TO APPLY to ALL other large groups as well. If we're honest that is.
(But if we just want to be partisan or fearful of groups, well then logic and reason don't apply anyway)

the problem is clear the peaceful MAJORITY of the groups AREN'T Irrelevant and the Groups OVERALL should not only be spoken of or thought of as represented by the negative minority. But human nature likes to be LAZY and lump wholes groups into "good" or "bad". Especially if the are different from our group "regular people" in any way.
Rather than ... as Kathianne's post noted... do the HARD work of PINPOINTING the real problem people -within any group- and targeting them specifically for correction or more.

so basically her argument has problems.
1. she fails to narrow the focus down to the problem elements within a larger group --targeting NAZIs instead of "Germans".--
2. she fails to acknowledge the strength and allies for good in the majority of any large group.

[pete311]

I view it as a bad mistake to help the traitorous dems destroy any of our guys!!!


Your delusion is that he's one of your guys. Trump has no principles other than his ego and bank account. I still think he's playing everyone for fools.

[jimnyc]

TRUMP HAS BEEN THE FRONT RUNNER SINCE THE START..
Now even republicans are joining the dems in their attacks on Trump as a way they think to aid their choice!
To me this is a grave error--helping the ffing dems destroy him and if he was so damn weak against hillary why would the dems be attacking him so much?
I view it as a bad mistake to help the traitorous dems destroy any of our guys!!!
And have great displeasure that any of us would do such a thing!
Trump is hitting back at Republican leadership thats desperately trying to sabotage him!
So that they can put in Bush, the illegal mexican loving bastard and a go along to get along worm(a damn globalist!)!
Some people need to wake up IMHO...--TYR

Republicans, Dems and folks around the world. The lack of political correctness has woken everyone up. They don't like someone who speaks the truth, and speaks his mind just like one of us.

Look at things this way. After the attack in Paris, many went crazy about the refugee issue, as far as many countries not wanting anymore, any many, many folks saying even more than that. And let's not be crazy - we ALL know that's the same as "muslims" or those coming from dangerous areas and similar. And no one complained to the world powers. But Trump states it more forcefully, and he should be drawn and quartered for it.

As an example. If I said "After the events abroad as of late, we will be temporarily halting incoming refugees and all but certain visas". Or I could say "After the events abroad as of late, we will be temporarily halting incoming refugees from Muslim countries and those from countries on any watch list for terrorism". Cant use that word "muslim" though, just like Obama has trouble with "radical islam".

[jimnyc]

Your delusion is that he's one of your guys. Trump has no principles other than his ego and bank account. I still think he's playing everyone for fools.

I've got like 9 or 10 MAJOR issues that he has laid out, that I fully agree with. Are those lack of principles? Is he lying to me? Are these plans of his solely for my money? These plans to elect Hillary?

[Drummond]

Just listened to a Sky News report. According to them, the 'ban Trump from the UK' petition has now got around 225,000 signatures, so the rate at which it's collecting new ones is actually increasing. I think it's a reasonably obvious point to make that the greater the number of signatures it gets, the harder it'll be for politicians to not follow through and institute such a ban.

Update - the number of people appending their support to this petition just keeps on rising. Well over 400,000, now .. it seems to be on course for being the most supported such petition the site running them has ever had.

http://home.bt.com/news/uk-news/ban-donald-trump-from-uk-e-petition-passes-360000-signatures-11364028061875


A petition calling for Donald Trump to be banned from the UK is set to become the most popular ever on the Government's website.

Hundreds of thousands of people rushed to sign after Mr Trump suggested Muslims should be barred from the US.

More than 400,000 people have backed the "Block Donald J Trump from UK entry" call, with more than six signatures per second at its peak, and it is on track to beat the current record of 446,482 signatures on a petition calling for the UK to accept more asylum seekers and increase refugee support.

Suzanne Kelly, who originally lodged the document, said it was "one of many little acts of defiance" against Mr Trump.

The 54-year-old from Aberdeen said: "I started the petition on 28 November. It was after the petition was lodged that Mr Trump made his anti-Muslim remarks. These confirmed for me that what I did in starting this petition was right.

"Is there a group this man hasn't made hateful remarks about? In a presidential candidate, this is unacceptable.

"For me freedom of speech comes with responsibility. There is great power in words, which the UK government recognises in its anti-hate speech principles. I am gratified so many people feel as I do."

The surge in signatures came as British politicians lined up to condemn the property tycoon and reality TV star's remarks.

Mr Trump provoked widespread anger and ridicule after demanding a block on Muslims entering the US and claiming parts of London were "so radicalised" that police were "afraid for their own lives".

Downing Street has made clear that David Cameron regards the Republican presidential hopeful's comments as "divisive, unhelpful and quite simply wrong".

Chancellor George Osborne branded them "nonsense", but dismissed calls for Mr Trump to be excluded from the UK, saying it was better for his views to be challenged in debate.

London mayor Boris Johnson said Mr Trump was unfit for office.

"I think Donald Trump is clearly out of his mind if he thinks that's a sensible way to proceed," he said.

"You can't ban people going to the US in that way, or indeed to any country.

"What he's doing is playing the game of the terrorists and those who seek to divide us. That is exactly the kind of reaction they hope to produce.

"When Donald Trump says there are parts of London that are no-go areas, I think he is betraying a quite stupefying ignorance that makes him frankly unfit to hold the office of the president of the United States."

Mr Johnson joked: "I would invite him to come and see the whole of London and take him round the city, except that I wouldn't want to expose Londoners to any unnecessary risk of meeting Donald Trump."

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon stripped Mr Trump of his membership of the GlobalScot business network, saying that he was no longer fit to act as a business ambassador for Scotland.

He has also been relieved of his honorary degree from Robert Gordon University (RGU) in Aberdeen, where he was awarded a doctorate of business administration in October 2010, following a separate petition set up by Ms Kelly on campaigning website 38 Degrees.

The call for Mr Trump to be barred from the UK will now be considered for debate by MPs in the House of Commons, having exceeded six-figure support.

The petitions committee is not due to meet again until January 5.

Asked whether she would act to exclude Mr Trump from visiting the UK, Home Secretary Theresa May said: "We never comment on individual cases.

"What I would say is this - I think it is up to politicians to ensure that we work to bring communities together, rather than seeking to divide them."

Interesting to learn that Suzanne Kelly, the person lodging the petition, was NOT initially inspired to do that because of Trump's anti-Muslim immigration comment ! She was acting from other grudges (or maybe a political agenda ?), it seems.

[pete311]

I've got like 9 or 10 MAJOR issues that he has laid out, that I fully agree with. Are those lack of principles? Is he lying to me? Are these plans of his solely for my money? These plans to elect Hillary?

All this attention is great for his ego and bank account no matter the result. He's a businessman, not a politician. Hillary wins and he goes back to playing billionaire.

[NightTrain]

Your delusion is that he's one of your guys. Trump has no principles other than his ego and bank account. I still think he's playing everyone for fools.


The fact that he has liberals like you and Gabby running around like Muppets with their hair on fire makes me think that he's the right guy.

Every instinct you possess is 180 degrees off.

[jimnyc]

Well the point she made was that there ARE over 1 billion peaceful muslims... but there are millions "radicalized".
If you want to use that as a cover for some personal "Islamophobia" I guess no one can stop you.

But i would like to comment on the way she argued here. I get it. It's not all bad...
But there are serious flaws in it.

here's the thing
1st people on the left and right don't use the that argument format consistently. the speaker in the video said in reply to the muslim woman's comment on peaceful muslims..
"there were millions of peaceful germans but the NAZIs drove the agenda...
there were millions of peaceful Japanese...
there were millions of peaceful Russians...
...But those peaceful ones were irrelevant..."
She said there we millions Arabs in the U.S. but it only took -less than 20- to do 911

So we can also say...
there are millions of peaceful men but thousands are rapist and pedophiles so the peaceful and kind men are irrelevant....
...there were millions of peaceful POLICE but many cops are corrupt, violent and killers therefore the goods are irrelevant and should speak out more against the bad ones....
...there were millions of peaceful white people but some are racist so the non racist are irrelevant and need to speak out more against racism....

If it's good for the goose the argument it HAS TO APPLY to ALL other large groups as well. If we're honest that is.
(But if we just want to be partisan or fearful of groups, well then logic and reason don't apply anyway)

the problem is clear the peaceful MAJORITY of the groups AREN'T Irrelevant and the Groups OVERALL should not only be spoken of or thought of as represented by the negative minority. But human nature likes to be LAZY and lump wholes groups into "good" or "bad". Especially if the are different from our group "regular people" in any way.
Rather than ... as Kathianne's post noted... do the HARD work of PINPOINTING the real problem people -within any group- and targeting them specifically for correction or more.

so basically her argument has problems.
1. she fails to narrow the focus down to the problem elements within a larger group --targeting NAZIs instead of "Germans".--
2. she fails to acknowledge the strength and allies for good in the majority of any large group.

We can also say this, we can also say that.

Why not deal with the elephant in the room, and reality? Why change things to "We can also say"? Can you think of another religion that has about 300-500,000 radicals? People that want other nations dead? Other folks dead?

Instead of always changing things up to see things alternatively - why don't we look at reality, and what it is these radicals and terrorists are doing around the world? And yes, while the "minority", 300,000 people is still a LOT.

And as to your argument, since you critiqued hers - how many people need to die at the hands of Islam before a tougher approach is taken, while we sit on our hands taking the nice way?

[jimnyc]

All this attention is great for his ego and bank account no matter the result. He's a businessman, not a politician. Hillary wins and he goes back to playing billionaire.

That hardly answered my questions, but honestly, I didn't expect any different. Anyway, he's just fine on the issues, you just disagree with them is all.

And quite frankly, I DON'T WANT a politician in there, look at what these fucks have been doing since forever. Time for a change, time for someone tough.

[Drummond]

All this attention is great for his ego and bank account no matter the result. He's a businessman, not a politician. Hillary wins and he goes back to playing billionaire.

You keep on saying that, don't you ? Is this a case of 'if I say it enough times, maybe it has a chance of becoming true' .. ?

If you were confident about that, I suggest that you'd have no need to keep trying to ram that message home. I think you're worried that Trump's message is resonating with too many Americans for your liking.

That's it .. isn't it ? Trump has you worried. You have a candidate who makes Americans think about their security .. this, versus a Democrat opposition that tries, perpetually, to make people dangerously complacent about it.

[pete311]

The fact that he has liberals like you and Gabby running around like Muppets with their hair on fire makes me think that he's the right guy.

Every instinct you possess is 180 degrees off.

Your "right guy" is someone who will certainly lose to Hillary? Nice.

[revelarts]

We can also say this, we can also say that.
Why not deal with the elephant in the room, and reality? Why change things to "We can also say"? Can you think of another religion that has about 300-500,000 radicals? People that want other nations dead? Other folks dead?
Instead of always changing things up to see things alternatively - why don't we look at reality, and what it is these radicals and terrorists are doing around the world? And yes, while the "minority", 300,000 people is still a LOT.
And as to your argument, since you critiqued hers - how many people need to die at the hands of Islam before a tougher approach is taken, while we sit on our hands taking the nice way?
Since her argument was posted as GOOD REASONS for generic Islamophobia it seems someone should critique it right?

And jim, It's not true that people AREN'T talking a radical Islam. (obama's not a people here).
everyone in the world is talking about it. the problem is people are assuming all Muslims are bad or "radicalized"
(never mind defining what "radicalized" means)

and it not a "change of subject" it's getting to the REAL problem of the subject, radical Islamic terrorism.
NARROWING DOWN the true DANGEROUS radicals. From people who have bad beliefs of various degree but are not physical threats.
There are still NAZIs in germany and the U.S. should we ban Mein Kmapf and round up these people. there are GERMANS in the U.S. they all might be Nazis.

As a Christian I want ALL of Islam to disappear... by conversions.
But on the islamic terrorist question to talk about destroying Islam by gov't means with bans and armies and generally pissing on all muslims is worthless, counter productive and lazy.

[Drummond]

I have serious a problem with a map that is supposed to track Muslim attacks, that doesn't even register the World Trade Center bombing #1, 9-11, or the Boston Marathon bombers. Shootings count but massive bombings don't?! Quite dishonest.

Not to mention all of the attacks overseas. Don't they count either? Remember Mr Klinghoffer?

Give them time, Gabby, they are just getting started here. And ask Israelis whom they worry about.

Exactly. The timeframe for Gabby's map is a VERY convenient one, isn't it ?

Imagine another such map, charting terrorism on French soil over, say, the year 2014. Such a map would fail to register either the Charlie Hebdo massacre (January 2015) or the one from a couple of weeks ago. Maybe such a map would falsely suggest that France is comparatively free from concerns about Islamic terrorism .. ?

Why is it that the Left tries so hard to put people to sleep about terrorism concerns, anyway ? How many MORE such incidents will have to happen, how many more deaths must there be, before that stops ??

[pete311]

That hardly answered my questions, but honestly, I didn't expect any different. Anyway, he's just fine on the issues, you just disagree with them is all.

And quite frankly, I DON'T WANT a politician in there, look at what these fucks have been doing since forever. Time for a change, time for someone tough.

Trump is not the answer. The world is moving more international and more open minded. Trump is looking to isolate and close minds. Election day we will find out which one more people want to live in. Until then...

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Well the point she made was that there ARE over 1 billion peaceful muslims... but there are millions "radicalized".
If you want to use that as a cover for some personal "Islamophobia" I guess no one can stop you.

But i would like to comment on the way she argued here. I get it. It's not all bad...
But there are serious flaws in it.

here's the thing
1st people on the left and right don't use the that argument format consistently. the speaker in the video said in reply to the muslim woman's comment on peaceful muslims..
"there were millions of peaceful germans but the NAZIs drove the agenda...
there were millions of peaceful Japanese...
there were millions of peaceful Russians...
...But those peaceful ones were irrelevant..."
She said there we millions Arabs in the U.S. but it only took -less than 20- to do 911

So we can also say...
there are millions of peaceful men but thousands are rapist and pedophiles so the peaceful and kind men are irrelevant....
...there were millions of peaceful POLICE but many cops are corrupt, violent and killers therefore the goods are irrelevant and should speak out more against the bad ones....
...there were millions of peaceful white people but some are racist so the non racist are irrelevant and need to speak out more against racism....

If it's good for the goose the argument it HAS TO APPLY to ALL other large groups as well. If we're honest that is.
(But if we just want to be partisan or fearful of groups, well then logic and reason don't apply anyway)

the problem is clear the peaceful MAJORITY of the groups AREN'T Irrelevant and the Groups OVERALL should not only be spoken of or thought of as represented by the negative minority. But human nature likes to be LAZY and lump wholes groups into "good" or "bad". Especially if the are different from our group "regular people" in any way.
Rather than ... as Kathianne's post noted... do the HARD work of PINPOINTING the real problem people -within any group- and targeting them specifically for correction or more.

so basically her argument has problems.
1. she fails to narrow the focus down to the problem elements within a larger group --targeting NAZIs instead of "Germans".--
2. she fails to acknowledge the strength and allies for good in the majority of any large group.

The head immunes itself from being hit by using its tentacles to fight. That over 1 billion almost fully support the fighting, they are taught not to expose that fact to we infidels.
Please inform yourself better about Islam the Koran and the command to murder any infidel, etc.
For it this case, you preach a damn liberal bullshit line Rev.
Islam can only be stopped by the very things you just condemned!!!
The real problem is the entire religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
God, I am sick of so many supposedly intelligent people that speak about Islam while not having a damn clue of its goals, its unbreakable command to use violence and murder.--Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

All this attention is great for his ego and bank account no matter the result. He's a businessman, not a politician. Hillary wins and he goes back to playing billionaire.

His bank account was doing just fine before he ran, he is spending a lot of it on the campaign, and he is most likely losing a lot of Dem New York associates with his non-PC stances. Your logic is flawed.

[pete311]

Exactly. The timeframe for Gabby's map is a VERY convenient one, isn't it ?

Imagine another such map, charting terrorism on French soil over, say, the year 2014. Such a map would fail to register either the Charlie Hebdo massacre (January 2015) or the one from a couple of weeks ago. Maybe such a map would falsely suggest that France is comparatively free from concerns about Islamic terrorism .. ?

Why is it that the Left tries so hard to put people to sleep about terrorism concerns, anyway ? How many MORE such incidents will have to happen, how many more deaths must there be, before that stops ??

You are intolerable. If you want to show other stats make your own damn map. The map clearly explains it's purpose, no deception other than the conspiracy you create yourself.

Love how you care so much about a few terrorist attacks when 13,000 people have been shot dead with a gun. No outrage there?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Your delusion is that he's one of your guys. Trump has no principles other than his ego and bank account. I still think he's playing everyone for fools.

As a dumbass lib your opinion has no value to me.
If he that weak etc, you libs would be silent and pray he was nominated.
And the fact both parties leadership wants him destroyed speaks volumes as both party leaderships are totally corrupt and should be in jail as we speak! -Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

The graphic clearly states it's data from 1 year. That makes it even more disturbing.


As I said, it's a dishonest map, with an obviously cherry-picked timeline. To ignore those three bombings makes the argument silly.

[pete311]

His bank account was doing just fine before he ran, he is spending a lot of it on the campaign, and he is most likely losing a lot of Dem New York associates with his non-PC stances. Your logic is flawed.

"His bank account was doing just fine" - your irrelevant opinion

"he is spending a lot of it on the campaign" - report in october that Trump was getting enough donations to end self funding

"likely losing a lot of Dem New York associates with his non-PC stances" - speculation

[jimnyc]

Since her argument was posted as GOOD REASONS for generic Islamophobia it seems someone should critique it right?

And jim, It's not true that people AREN'T talking a radical Islam. (obama's not a people here).
everyone in the world is talking about it. the problem is people are assuming all Muslims are bad or "radicalized"
(never mind defining what "radicalized" means)

and it not a "change of subject" it's getting to the REAL problem of the subject, radical Islamic terrorism.
NARROWING DOWN the true DANGEROUS radicals. From people who have bad beliefs of various degree but are not physical threats.
There are still NAZIs in germany and the U.S. should we ban Mein Kmapf and round up these people. there are GERMANS in the U.S. they all might be Nazis.

As a Christian I want ALL of Islam to disappear... by conversions.
But on the islamic terrorist question to talk about destroying Islam by gov't means with bans and armies and generally pissing on all muslims is worthless, counter productive and lazy.

I would prefer we monitor from within. Take a very, very keen eye on who we are letting into the country. Seal the borders even further to make sure they can't get in. The good folks can come in, but the bad can't. And it should be kept at bay until our government is capable of making a distinction between the 2.

[pete311]

As I said, it's a dishonest map, with an obviously cherry-picked timeline. To ignore those three bombings makes the argument silly.

It's not dishonest. It clearly states it's for 2015. If you want a map for 5 years, make that map. If you want a map for 10 years, make the map. So you're saying a map has to fit your agenda in order to not be dishonest. Nice!

[Gunny]

Well the point she made was that there ARE over 1 billion peaceful muslims... but there are millions "radicalized".
If you want to use that as a cover for some personal "Islamophobia" I guess no one can stop you.

But i would like to comment on the way she argued here. I get it. It's not all bad...
But there are serious flaws in it.

here's the thing
1st people on the left and right don't use the that argument format consistently. the speaker in the video said in reply to the muslim woman's comment on peaceful muslims..
"there were millions of peaceful germans but the NAZIs drove the agenda...
there were millions of peaceful Japanese...
there were millions of peaceful Russians...
...But those peaceful ones were irrelevant..."
She said there we millions Arabs in the U.S. but it only took -less than 20- to do 911

So we can also say...
there are millions of peaceful men but thousands are rapist and pedophiles so the peaceful and kind men are irrelevant....
...there were millions of peaceful POLICE but many cops are corrupt, violent and killers therefore the goods are irrelevant and should speak out more against the bad ones....
...there were millions of peaceful white people but some are racist so the non racist are irrelevant and need to speak out more against racism....

If it's good for the goose the argument it HAS TO APPLY to ALL other large groups as well. If we're honest that is.
(But if we just want to be partisan or fearful of groups, well then logic and reason don't apply anyway)

the problem is clear the peaceful MAJORITY of the groups AREN'T Irrelevant and the Groups OVERALL should not only be spoken of or thought of as represented by the negative minority. But human nature likes to be LAZY and lump wholes groups into "good" or "bad". Especially if the are different from our group "regular people" in any way.
Rather than ... as Kathianne's post noted... do the HARD work of PINPOINTING the real problem people -within any group- and targeting them specifically for correction or more.

so basically her argument has problems.
1. she fails to narrow the focus down to the problem elements within a larger group --targeting NAZIs instead of "Germans".--
2. she fails to acknowledge the strength and allies for good in the majority of any large group.

Here we go ...AGAIN. Islamaphobia? Phobia is FEAR. People like you are as bad as the MSM with your sensationalizing things and giving them an incorrect definition.

How about it is common sense and logic to not let poisonous snakes live in your house? I'm not afraid of them but I'm not going to invite them in to kill me.

As far as your "peaceful" Muslims go ... they need to get off their asses and police their own like all the damned rest of us have to instead of sitting around waiting for everyone else to do it for them.

[pete311]

Trumps campaign is basically a book tour.

Trump's twitter feed 30min ago

"I am signing copies of my book CRIPPLED AMERICA. Order yours now--makes a great holiday gift! "

you guys are blind

[jimnyc]

Trump is not the answer. The world is moving more international and more open minded. Trump is looking to isolate and close minds. Election day we will find out which one more people want to live in. Until then...

Are you voting GOP or DEM?

Trump may not be what YOU want, but that hardly makes him what you say. Guaran-fucking-teed he has more friends ALREADY around the world than Obama does, just on his business connections alone. And at least we won't look weak, where Obama has brought us. If the people would prefer a woman with a lifetime record of scandals and lying, and now a criminal, so be it. That would say more about the nation, and the left, than it would Trump.

[Abbey Marie]

Exactly. The timeframe for Gabby's map is a VERY convenient one, isn't it ?

Imagine another such map, charting terrorism on French soil over, say, the year 2014. Such a map would fail to register either the Charlie Hebdo massacre (January 2015) or the one from a couple of weeks ago. Maybe such a map would falsely suggest that France is comparatively free from concerns about Islamic terrorism .. ?

Why is it that the Left tries so hard to put people to sleep about terrorism concerns, anyway ? How many MORE such incidents will have to happen, how many more deaths must there be, before that stops ??

Well-said about the map.

I've recently asked the bolded question, too. I can't wrap my head around their determination to put their heads in the sand on a life and death issue. And do they not understand that Islam will have zero tolerance for their beloved causes? Maybe it's a simple case of hating Christians more, therefore the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

[Abbey Marie]

It's not dishonest. It clearly states it's for 2015. If you want a map for 5 years, make that map. If you want a map for 10 years, make the map. So you're saying a map has to fit your agenda in order to not be dishonest. Nice!


Lol, no. I'm saying map has to fit reality. And thereby not operate as a misleading tool to promote an agenda.

[DLT]

Reported just minutes ago on the domestic BBC News channel, on our 10PM news, and which appears to be a breaking news story ... a report which says that Donald Trump has called for a total, complete ban on Muslims entering the US !

According to the report, Trump has called for this in response to large numbers of Muslims having hatred towards America.

They switched over to a report from the BBC's Washington correspondent, Nick Bryant ... who began his report by waving an A4 sheet of paper in front of the camera - which he said was a Press release from Donald Trump's HQ ... and said that when it first arrived in their Inboxes about an hour ago, it was thought to be a joke .. nobody took it seriously, thinking it was an attempt to parody Trump and couldn't be for real. But they've since confirmed that it's genuine.

'A total and complete shutdown on Muslims entering the US, until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on'. This is Bryant's quote from the Press release.

Bryant goes on to say that it's been 'condemned as racist demagoguery' by a number of groups there, not least from a number of Muslim groups in America, who've said 'We are now entering into the realms of the fascist'.

The White House has commented ... says that 'This statement is contrary to US values'.

Bryant concludes his report by saying that this type of comment from Trump usually propels him into a front-runner position in the race to the White House .. but - Bryant concludes by saying 'Many people will say this isn't the road to the White House, but this is the gutter'.

Bryant doesn't SAY who'd say that .. I get the impression that this is a bit of ad-hoc 'balanced' reporting (as balanced as it gets from the BBC) slung into the mix by Bryant's team. The report ended.

A quick disapproving scowl from Huw Edwards (anchorman for the News show) .. they sometimes don't bother to hide such things .. and he moved on to the next item.

Folks, a comment from me .. I'm impressed ! I'm sure British politicians wouldn't have the freedom to arrange such a ban, even if they were ever inclined to implement one !! I'll no doubt be learning of some White House vitriol on this one in the days to come ...

Trump is calling for war-time measures (and yes, we ARE at war with radical Islamists) that have already been implemented and carried out by two former Democrat presidents. But the lamestream leftist media lies and pretends that it is a radical "new" idea. They lie, of course, and many of the LIV, stuckonstupid sheeple will believe the lies.

[pete311]

Here we go ...AGAIN. Islamaphobia? Phobia is FEAR. People like you are as bad as the MSM with your sensationalizing things and giving them an incorrect definition.

How about it is common sense and logic to not let poisonous snakes live in your house? I'm not afraid of them but I'm not going to invite them in to kill me.

As far as your "peaceful" Muslims go ... they need to get off their asses and police their own like all the damned rest of us have to instead of sitting around waiting for everyone else to do it for them.

You are afraid to be killed by muslims. That is a phobia.

How about you get off your ass and stop the 13,000 annual gun deaths in our own country?

[pete311]

Are you voting GOP or DEM?

Trump may not be what YOU want, but that hardly makes him what you say. Guaran-fucking-teed he has more friends ALREADY around the world than Obama does, just on his business connections alone. And at least we won't look weak, where Obama has brought us. If the people would prefer a woman with a lifetime record of scandals and lying, and now a criminal, so be it. That would say more about the nation, and the left, than it would Trump.

I am a moderate. If Trump is the nominee then I vote for anyone else. If someone else is the nominee I am undecided.

[pete311]

Lol, no. I'm saying map has to fit reality. And thereby not operate as a misleading tool to promote an agenda.

Yes it fits the reality for the timeline it clearly states.

[jimnyc]

As we were told when someone posted a video here...

Has anyone CONFIRMED all of those pretty little blue dots? :rolleyes:

Also, have the attacks that have been stopped and the folks arrested prior to their actions been taken into account? Suppose for a second that only 5 of these were successful:

Bush administration (First term)
<tbody>
Date
Target
Description
Arrest location
Suspect(s)
Status


December 22, 2001
American Airlines Flight 63 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Airlines_Flight_63)
A man was put into custody after attempting to detonate (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_shoe_bomb_plot) a shoe bomb (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoe_bomb).[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-1)
Paris (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris,_France) to Miami (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami,_Florida)
Richard Colvin Reid (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Colvin_Reid)
Serving a life sentence without parole (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_sentence_without_parole) [2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-2)


May 8, 2002
?
A man was arrested after returning from Pakistan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan) for allegedly attempting to build a dirty bomb (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirty_bomb).[3] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-3)
Chicago, Illinois (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago)
José Padilla (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_%28prisoner%29)
Sentenced to 17 years in prison [4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-4)


March 13, 2003
Brooklyn Bridge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooklyn_Bridge)
A man was arrested and accused of giving aid to al-Qaeda and attempting to destroy the Brooklyn Bridge [5] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-5)
Columbus, Ohio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus,_Ohio)
Iyman Faris (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iyman_Faris)
Sentenced to 20 years in Prison [6] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-6)


June 2003
?
Eleven members of the Virginia Jihad Network (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Jihad_Network) were arrested and accused of training for holy war around the globe.[7] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-7)
Northern Virginia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Virginia)
Ali al-Timimi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_al-Timimi), Ali Asad Chandia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Asad_Chandia), et al.
All sentenced to 20 or less years in prison [8] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-8)


August 2004
New York Stock Exchange (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Stock_Exchange), World Bank (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Bank_group), International Monetary Fund (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Monetary_Fund), and the Citigroup Center (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citigroup_Center)
Security in the United States was put on high alert after a plot (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_financial_buildings_plot) to destroy the New York Stock Exchange (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Stock_Exchange) and other financial institutions in New Jersey and Washington surfaces.[9] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-9)
United Kingdom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom)
Dhiren Barot (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhiren_Barot)
Sentenced to life in prison [10] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-10)


August 28, 2004
34th Street-Herald Square (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34th_Street-Herald_Square_%28New_York_City_Subway%29) subway station
Two men were arrested after attempting to bomb the New York City Subway (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Subway) on the day before the 2004 Republican National Convention (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Republican_National_Convention)[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-11)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York,_New_York)
Shahawar Matin Siraj (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shahawar_Matin_Siraj) and James Elshafay
Sentenced to 30 years in prison [12] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-12)


August 2004
Pakistani (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan) diplomat
Two men were arrested at an Albany mosque after attempting to gain possession of a shoulder-fired grenade launcher (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grenade_launcher) to assassinate a Pakistani (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan) diplomat.[13] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-13)
Albany, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albany,_New_York)
Yassin Aref (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yassin_Aref) and Mohammed Hossain (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Hossain)
Both sentenced to 15 years in prison [14] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-14)

</tbody>
Bush administration (Second term)
<tbody>
Date
Target
Description
Arrest location
Suspect(s)
Status


June 2005
?
A man and his father were arrested after lying to the FBI (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI) about involvement in a jihadist camp in Pakistan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan).[15] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-15)
Lodi, California (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lodi,_California)
Hamid and Umer Hayat (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamid_and_Umer_Hayat)
Hamid was sentenced to 24 years in prison [16] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-16)


August 2005
Los Angeles-area military bases, synagogues and other places
Four men running an Islamic prison gang were arrested after allegedly attempting to destroy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Los_Angeles_bomb_plot) Los Angeles-area places.[17] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-17)
Los Angeles, California (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles,_California)
Kevin James (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_James_%28terrorist%29), et al.
James sentenced to 16 years in prison [18] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-18)


December 2005
Williams Natural Gas (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Williams_Companies) (Wyoming (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyoming)), Transcontinental Pipeline (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcontinental_Pipeline), Standard Oil (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil) refinery
A man was arrested on suspicion that he had plans to destroy several sites.[19] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-19)
Pennsylvania (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania)
Michael Curtis Reynolds (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Curtis_Reynolds)
Sentenced to 30 years in prison [20] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-20)


February 2006
Troops in Iraq, Toledo, Ohio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo,_Ohio) citizens
Three men were arrested for allegedly planning to build bombs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo_terror_plot) for use by terrorists in Iraq (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq).[21] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-21)
Toledo, Ohio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toledo,_Ohio)
Mohammad Zaki Amawi, et al.
Amawi was sentenced to 20 years in prison, the others 13 and 8 years, respectively.[22] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-22)


April 2006
Washington D.C. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_D.C.)-area buildings
Two men from the U.S. state of Georgia, were arrested after videotaping Washington-area buildings and sending the tapes to a London (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London)-based jihadist website.[23] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-23)
Toronto, Ontario (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto,_Ontario)
Syed Haris Ahmed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syed_Haris_Ahmed) and Ehsanul Islam Sadequee
Ahmed sentenced to 13 years in prison, Sadequee sentenced to 17.[24] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-24)


June 2006
Sears Tower (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sears_Tower) and FBI offices
Seven men were arrested after allegedly plotting to bomb (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Sears_Tower_plot) Sears Tower (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sears_Tower) and FBI offices.[25] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-25)
Miami, Florida (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami,_Florida), Atlanta, Georgia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanta,_Georgia)
Narseal Batiste, et al.
Five of the men were convicted. Batiste was sentenced to 13 years in prison.[26] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-26)


July 2006
PATH (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Authority_Trans-Hudson) tunnels
A man was arrested after allegedly attempting to bomb (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_River_bomb_plot) New York and New Jersey subway tunnels and flood the financial district.[27] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-27)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City)
Assem Hammoud (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assem_Hammoud)



May 7, 2007
Fort Dix (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Dix)
Six men were arrested after attempting an attack on the Fort Dix (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Dix_plot) military base.[28] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-28)
Fort Dix, New Jersey (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Dix,_New_Jersey)
Dritan Duka, et al.
Four of the men received life sentences, one man received five years in prison and the other received 33 [29] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-29)


June 3, 2007
John F. Kennedy International Airport (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy_International_Airport)
Four men were arrested in New York after a plot is revealed to bomb the fuel line of JFK airport (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_John_F._Kennedy_International_Airport_attack_ plot).[30] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-30)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York,_New_York)
Abdul Kadir (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdul_Kadir_%28politician%29), et al.
Kadir sentenced to life imprisonment.[31] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-31)

</tbody>
Obama administration (First term)
<tbody>
Date
Target
Description
Arrest location
Suspect(s)


May 20, 2009
New York City Synagogues/ U.S. Military Aircraft (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Bronx_terrorism_plot)
Four men were arrested in New York after a plot (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_New_York_terrorism_plot) is revealed to blow up two synagogues and shoot down a U.S. Military Aircraft.[32] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-32)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City)
James Cromitie (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Cromitie), et al.


September 19, 2009
New York City Subway (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Subway)
Zazi, a native of Afghanistan who lived in Colorado, was arrested and convicted of plotting to bomb the New York City Subway system. He was trained by al-Qaeda in Pakistan. 5 others were also indicted on related charges. " [33] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-33)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City)
Najibullah Zazi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Najibullah_Zazi), et al.


September 24, 2009
Federal Building, Springfield, IL (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfield,_Illinois)
A 29 year old was arrested on charges that he intended to bomb the Paul Findley Federal Building in Springfieldl, IL. [34] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-34)
Springfield, Illinois (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfield,_Illinois)
Michael Finton (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_C._Finton)


September 24, 2009
Dallas skyscraper (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fountain_Place)
A 19-year-old was arrested on charges that he intended to bomb a downtown Dallas skyscraper.[35] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-35)
Dallas, Texas (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas,_Texas)
Hosam Maher Husein Smadi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hosam_Maher_Husein_Smadi)


October 16, 2009
Various overseas targets
Colleen LaRose, also known as JihadJane and Fatima LaRose, is an American citizen charged with terrorism-related crimes, including conspiracy to commit murder and providing material support to terrorists. Lars Vilks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lars_Vilks) was a named target in response to drawings of Muhammad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad).[36] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-36)
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia,_Pennsylvania)
Colleen LaRose (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colleen_LaRose), et al.


December 25, 2009
Northwest Airlines Flight 253 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_253)
A man was arrested after Northwest Airlines (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines) passengers jumped him to avoid his detonating an explosive device above the city of Detroit.[37] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-37)
Detroit, Michigan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit,_Michigan)
Abdul Farouk Abdulmutallab (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdul_Farouk_Abdulmutallab)


May 1, 2010
Times Square (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Times_Square)
A Pakistani American who attempted the May 1, 2010, Times Square car bombing. He was arrested after he had boarded Emirates Flight 202 to Dubai. On June 21, 2010, in Federal District Court in Manhattan he confessed to 10 counts arising from the bombing attempt.[38] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-38)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City)
Faisal Shahzad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faisal_Shahzad)


October 27, 2010
Arlington Cemetery station (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlington_Cemetery_station)
A Pakistani-born Virginia man was arrested and accused of casing Washington-area subway stations in what he thought was an al-Qaeda plot to bomb and kill commuters.[39] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-39)
Arlington, Virginia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlington,_Virginia)
Farooque Ahmed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farooque_Ahmed)


September 28, 2011
The Pentagon (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pentagon) and United States Capitol Building (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Capitol_Building)
Rezwan Ferdaus is a U.S. citizen, born and raised in Massachusetts, of Bangladeshi descent, who was arrested by the FBI on September 28, 2011, for allegedly plotting to attack The Pentagon and United States Capitol with remote-controlled model aircraft packed with explosives. He was also charged with supporting al-Qaeda and plotting attacks on U.S. soldiers abroad, by making IED detonators.[40] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-40)
Arlington, Virginia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlington,_Virginia); Washington, D.C. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington,_D.C.)
Rezwan Ferdaus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rezwan_Ferdaus)


January 7, 2012
Tampa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa,_Florida) and various other targets
Sami Osmakac is a man who allegedly plotted an attack, to avenge what he felt were wrongs done to Muslims, in the area around Tampa, Florida. Osmakac, an Albanian from Kosovo and a naturalized US citizen, was arrested January 7, 2012, for the alleged attack plan, which involved bombing nightclubs, detonating a car bomb, using an assault rifle, wearing an explosive belt in a crowded area, and taking hostages.[41] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-41)
Tampa, Florida (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tampa,_Florida)
Sami Osmakac (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sami_Osmakac)


February 17, 2012
United States Capitol (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Capitol)
A Moroccan man who was arrested by the FBI)for allegedly plotting to carry out a suicide bombing on the United States Capitol. El Khalifi thought he was working with al-Qaeda operatives, but was actually in contact with undercover FBI agents. He was sentenced to prison for 30 years in September 2012.[42] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-42)
Washington, D.C. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington,_D.C.)
Amine El Khalifi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amine_El_Khalifi)


October 17, 2012
New York Federal Reserve (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Federal_Reserve)
A Bangladeshi man was charged with trying to blow up the Federal Reserve building in New York. While Nafis believed he had the blessing of al-Qaeda and was acting on behalf of the terrorist group, he has no known ties, according to federal officials.[43] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-43)
New York, New York (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City)
Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Quazi_Mohammad_Rezwanul_Ahsan_Nafi s&action=edit&redlink=1)

</tbody>
Obama administration (Second term)
<tbody>
Date
Target
Description
Arrest location
Suspect(s)


September 11, 2015
9/11 Memorial event in Kansas City. Missouri (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Ryne_Goldberg#Planned_9.2F11_Anniversary_At tack_in_Kansas_City.2C_Missouri)
A Jewish American (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_American) man, Joshua Ryne Goldberg, posing as an Australian ISIS (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISIS) supporter, attempted to get an FBI confidential informant to detonate a bomb at a Kansas City, Missouri (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City,_Missouri) September 11 attacks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11_attacks) memorial event. Goldberg attempted to persuade the confidential informant to coat the shrapnel of the bomb in rat poison (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat_poison) in order to maximize casualties. [44] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-:0-44)[45] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-:1-45)[46] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-46)[47] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsuccessful_terrorist_plots_in_the_United _States_post-9/11#cite_note-:2-47)
Orange Park, Florida (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange_Park,_Florida)
Joshua Ryne Goldberg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Ryne_Goldberg)

</tbody>

[jimnyc]

Trumps campaign is basically a book tour.

Trump's twitter feed 30min ago

"I am signing copies of my book CRIPPLED AMERICA. Order yours now--makes a great holiday gift! "

you guys are blind

Are any other candidates writing books, or have wrote books?

<cite class="citation book">Clinton, Hillary Rodham (2014). Hard Choices (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_Choices). Simon & Schuster. ISBN (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Standard_Book_Number) 978-1476751443 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-1476751443).</cite>

[jimnyc]

You are afraid to be killed by muslims. That is a phobia.

How about you get off your ass and stop the 13,000 annual gun deaths in our own country?

What have YOU done about those deaths, other than whine on the internet?

[pete311]

Are any other candidates writing books, or have wrote books?

<cite class="citation book">Clinton, Hillary Rodham (2014). Hard Choices (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_Choices). Simon & Schuster. ISBN (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Standard_Book_Number) 978-1476751443 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:BookSources/978-1476751443).</cite>

She's not on active book tour while campaigning


What have YOU done about those deaths, other than whine on the internet?

I'm not the one going nutty over some muslims

[jimnyc]

She's not on active book tour while campaigning



I'm not the one going nutty over some muslims

You told someone "get off your ass" - and yet you ain't done jack shit yourself.

And my point with the books - they all do it. I wouldn't buy a single one of them. As for you and Hillary - you're not just blind, you stuck the knife in your own eyes to avoid 'really' looking at her. Bravo!

[NightTrain]

Your "right guy" is someone who will certainly lose to Hillary? Nice.


That'll be a neat trick from behind bars.

At least this election everyone knows right up front that you libs openly support criminals - just as long as there's a Commie Agenda, you don't care what the character of your Dear Leader is.

[pete311]

And my point with the books - they all do it. I wouldn't buy a single one of them. As for you and Hillary - you're not just blind, you stuck the knife in your own eyes to avoid 'really' looking at her. Bravo!

Not during campaigning. Jim your obsession with me and Hillary is bizarre. So many times I have stated I would consider Rubio or Cruz. Just because I think Hillary would mop the floor with Trump you think I like Hillary.

[Gunny]

You are afraid to be killed by muslims. That is a phobia.

How about you get off your ass and stop the 13,000 annual gun deaths in our own country?

Just remember, you asked for this ... I have and will kill THEM first. Wouldn't be the first time and I could give a rat's ass about their towel-headed backwards asses. They can't fight worth shit and shoot even worse.

There's a difference between between smart and prepared and "fear" same as there's a difference between being smart and prepared and running your suck on a message board. I also don't walk into Hells Angels meeting wearing Outlaw colors, nor do I walk into a bar in the ghetto where the only thing white in the place is me and 50 sets of eyeballs.

So how about YOU get off YOUR ass, take it over that kitty litter box in the Middle East and do something? Afraid you won't make it through boot camp?

[pete311]

That'll be a neat trick from behind bars.

At least this election everyone knows right up front that you libs openly support criminals - just as long as there's a Commie Agenda, you don't care what the character of your Dear Leader is.

Seriously you guys are fucking morons. You are blind. I don't like Hillary. I really really don't like Trump. I voted for Bush, Obama and Gary Johnson. Guess that makes me a radical lib... fucking idiots.

[NightTrain]

I am a moderate. If Trump is the nominee then I vote for anyone else. If someone else is the nominee I am undecided.


You are a moderate as much as Bruce Jenner is a woman. And about as palatable.

[pete311]

Just remember, you asked for this ... I have and will kill THEM first. Wouldn't be the first time and I could give a rat's ass about their towel-headed backwards asses. They can't fight worth shit and shoot even worse.

Some of them think the same against you. Makes you no better. Only ends in mutual destruction.

Can't fight? haha yeah... mission accomplished right? The mighty USA can't win a war in 14 years against some towel heads.

[NightTrain]

Seriously you guys are fucking morons. You are blind. I don't like Hillary. I really really don't like Trump. I voted for Bush, Obama and Gary Johnson. Guess that makes me a radical lib... fucking idiots.


You didn't vote for Bush, unless you were so stoned in the booth that your eyes were crossed and you did it accidentally.

Stop trying to create a beard. We both know you're a rabid liberal, and have been since your first nauseating post here back in the day.

[pete311]

You are a moderate as much as Bruce Jenner is a woman. And about as palatable.

You are so radical right you don't even know what moderate is

[Gunny]

Seriously you guys are fucking morons. You are blind. I don't like Hillary. I really really don't like Trump. I voted for Bush, Obama and Gary Johnson. Guess that makes me a radical lib... fucking idiots.

YOU are the moron. You let your alligator mouth override your bumblebee ass. Nothing moderate about YOU. You want to let 10k potential murderers whose very belief in life is diametrically opposed to the US Constitution? So just WHEN Mr Moderate is it we Americans get to live OUR "American Dream"? After you're done sucking everyone else off?

[pete311]

You didn't vote for Bush, unless you were so stoned in the booth that your eyes were crossed and you did it accidentally.

Stop trying to create a beard. We both know you're a rabid liberal, and have been since your first nauseating post here back in the day.

Tough I did. Anyone not radical right is a lib to you.

[Abbey Marie]

"His bank account was doing just fine" - your irrelevant opinion
Tell us how meager his bank accounts were, then.

"he is spending a lot of it on the campaign" - report in october that Trump was getting enough donations to end self funding Tell us how much he spent to ramp up, and until this point.

"likely losing a lot of Dem New York associates with his non-PC stances" - speculation
Obviously, you have no idea how liberal NYC is.

You're a riot. We are so glad that your completely baseless speculation that he is doing this for a book tour, is rock solid.

:laugh2:

[NightTrain]

You are afraid to be killed by muslims. That is a phobia.

How about you get off your ass and stop the 13,000 annual gun deaths in our own country?


No, you shithead, that's called proper reaction.

I never travel unarmed through bear country and I am cautious at all times while doing so. Does that mean I have a bear phobia?

You're as smart as Gabby, and don't have the tits to offset that massive shortcoming.

[Gunny]

You are so radical right you don't even know what moderate is

NT is radical right? I think I'm going to break a rib. :laugh2:

[pete311]

YOU are the moron. You let your alligator mouth override your bumblebee ass. Nothing moderate about YOU. You want to let 10k potential murderers whose very belief in life is diametrically opposed to the US Constitution? So just WHEN Mr Moderate is it we Americans get to live OUR "American Dream"? After you're done sucking everyone else off?

woah we got a poet here!

We already have 3 million very mostly peaceful muslims in the US and you wet your pants allowing 10k more, mostly women and children?

[NightTrain]

You are so radical right you don't even know what moderate is


Well, I suppose that in your San Francisco ass-pounding crew, you could consider yourself a 'moderate'. But that's only because you have no idea of the big picture other than bickering with your boyfriend about which shoes go with your stockings.

[pete311]

No, you shithead, that's called proper reaction.

I never travel unarmed through bear country and I am cautious at all times while doing so. Does that mean I have a bear phobia?

You're as smart as Gabby, and don't have the tits to offset that massive shortcoming.

a phobia is irrational. 99.9% of the world's muslims are harmless. that is called irrational then to fear them. get it?

[jimnyc]

Apparently the GOP that WERE polled agree with Trump to an extent. Where are all of those that disagree?

Voters Like Trump’s Proposed Muslim Ban

Despite an international uproar and condemnation by President Obama and nearly all of those running for the presidency, Donald Trump’s proposed ban on Muslims coming to the United States has the support of a sizable majority of Republicans – and a plurality of all voters.

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 66% of Likely Republican Voters favor a temporary ban on all Muslims entering the United States until the federal government improves its ability to screen out potential terrorists from coming here. Just 24% oppose the plan, with 10% undecided.

Among all voters, 46% favor a temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States, while 40% are opposed. Fourteen percent (14%) are undecided. (To see survey question wording, click here.)

Trump, the front-runner in the race for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination, proposed the ban following last week’s massacre in San Bernardino, California. Sixty-five percent (65%) of voters believe the two shooters in the incident were radical Islamic terrorists. Those individuals had entered the United States without problem and escaped detection despite several actions here suggesting that they had violent intentions.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/immigration/december_2015/voters_like_trump_s_proposed_muslim_ban

[jimnyc]

a phobia is irrational. 99.9% of the world's muslims are harmless. that is called irrational then to fear them. get it?

So up to 25% of them are radicalized, but 99.9% of them are harmless?

Lay off the Peyote Petey!

[Gunny]

woah we got a poet here!

We already have 3 million very mostly peaceful muslims in the US and you wet your pants allowing 10k more, mostly women and children?

No super-genius. Syrians have been our enemies since WWII ended and the Russians have propped them up since. You have generations of people born and bred to hate us. They're also Muslims who think they can kill anyone they want for disagreeing with them.

And I don't wet my pants, bitch but I bet I could damned sure make your all-mouth ass piss all over your-damned-self. You addressed nothing. You internet bitches think this is some game. Go out there and face off with those "peaceful" Muslims. Just make sure they shoot you because if they catch you, your head getting hacked off will be on youtube.

[NightTrain]

a phobia is irrational. 99.9% of the world's muslims are harmless. that is called irrational then to fear them. get it?


Many millions of muzzies would love to saw your idiot head off on camera and have stated that they support this sort of thing.

See the danger now, genius? Get it?

[Abbey Marie]

Yes it fits the reality for the timeline it clearly states.

So you think it's OK to be intellectually dishonest, as long as it promotes your agenda?

Never mind, I already know the answer is "yes"- you're a lib.

[pete311]

So up to 25% of them are radicalized, but 99.9% of them are harmless?

Lay off the Peyote Petey!

I don't care what any report says. There is not 300 million radical (harmful) muslims in the world. At least we need a solid definition of radical. I spent 4 months traveling the ME and never came across any harm or anti US talk.

[jimnyc]

Many millions of muzzies would love to saw your idiot head off on camera and have stated that they support this sort of thing.

See the danger now, genius? Get it?

Sadly, that's a negative, for both him and his entire ilk. We're supposed to be making friends, more now than ever. :rolleyes:

[PixieStix]

Well the point she made was that there ARE over 1 billion peaceful muslims... but there are millions "radicalized".
If you want to use that as a cover for some personal "Islamophobia" I guess no one can stop you.

But i would like to comment on the way she argued here. I get it. It's not all bad...
But there are serious flaws in it.

here's the thing
1st people on the left and right don't use the that argument format consistently. the speaker in the video said in reply to the muslim woman's comment on peaceful muslims..
"there were millions of peaceful germans but the NAZIs drove the agenda...
there were millions of peaceful Japanese...
there were millions of peaceful Russians...
...But those peaceful ones were irrelevant..."
She said there we millions Arabs in the U.S. but it only took -less than 20- to do 911

So we can also say...
there are millions of peaceful men but thousands are rapist and pedophiles so the peaceful and kind men are irrelevant....
...there were millions of peaceful POLICE but many cops are corrupt, violent and killers therefore the goods are irrelevant and should speak out more against the bad ones....
...there were millions of peaceful white people but some are racist so the non racist are irrelevant and need to speak out more against racism....

If it's good for the goose the argument it HAS TO APPLY to ALL other large groups as well. If we're honest that is.
(But if we just want to be partisan or fearful of groups, well then logic and reason don't apply anyway)

the problem is clear the peaceful MAJORITY of the groups AREN'T Irrelevant and the Groups OVERALL should not only be spoken of or thought of as represented by the negative minority. But human nature likes to be LAZY and lump wholes groups into "good" or "bad". Especially if the are different from our group "regular people" in any way.
Rather than ... as Kathianne's post noted... do the HARD work of PINPOINTING the real problem people -within any group- and targeting them specifically for correction or more.

so basically her argument has problems.
1. she fails to narrow the focus down to the problem elements within a larger group --targeting NAZIs instead of "Germans".--
2. she fails to acknowledge the strength and allies for good in the majority of any large group.

Her point IS, that it doesn't matter that there are "peaceful" muslims. Her point is that 25% of muslims are jihadists, not all muslims can be jihadists, many of them here in America want sharia law. And those who are so called "peaceful" muslims want the Jihadists to succeed, they support them by not condemning them. Many of the "peaceful muslims were born into Islam, they made no choice .There are enough to stand up and say stop. Some musllims have to stay at home and breed more little jihadists. Islam is a political system with religion as it's title.

If there are 1.8 billion muslims in the world, what is 25% of that? Have your calculator Rev? Well, I will tell you. It is 300 million. And by the way since this video, they are growing. And they are here. And I see you continually ignoring these numbers and making excuses.

Trump is on the right side here. He has given us a voice.

[pete311]

Many millions of muzzies would love to saw your idiot head off on camera and have stated that they support this sort of thing.

See the danger now, genius? Get it?

Yeah well they had they're chance for 4 months in their own back yard and it never happened. So, yeah, no.

[jimnyc]

I don't care what any report says. There is not 300 million radical (harmful) muslims in the world. At least we need a solid definition of radical.

Comments noted, will remember this the next time you expect any of us to believe any of your polls or studies. Btw, this is VARIOUS studies that came up with similar numbers. Also from studies that were done over YEARS. Do a search here on the board, educate yourself if you doubt the studieS.

And I assure you that more than .01% of them are more than harmful. Polls for YEARS have been stating that they hate our way of life and would love to see us attacked, or worse. One would have to be blind to not see such things.

[Drummond]

You are intolerable.

You'd find it a lot easier to tolerate my posts if you approached them with realism, rather than from a propagandist / PC standpoint.


If you want to show other stats make your own damn map. The map clearly explains it's purpose, no deception other than the conspiracy you create yourself.

Yes, its purpose was to report on a period which ignored the 9/11 attack.


Love how you care so much about a few terrorist attacks when 13,000 people have been shot dead with a gun. No outrage there?

'A FEW', you say. Well, that begs the question: JUST HOW MANY MORE SUCH ATTACKS MUST THE US, OR THE WIDER WORLD, SUFFER - BEFORE YOU'RE PREPARED TO RESPOND TO THEM AS THEY DESERVE TO BE RESPONDED TO ??

Your 'we must remain complacent, to satisfy Leftie PC imperatives' attitude is of itself intolerable !! Is life so very cheap to you Left-leaning people, that you demand many MORE such attacks as a price for wanting something decisively DONE about those behind them ???

As to your diversionary point about gun crime and deaths from them ... ask yourself how many more deaths there would've been from having the law-abiding American people deprived of their ownership. Criminals aren't, by their nature, law-abiding, therefore, WILL get firearms, regardless of other restrictions. You insist that the decent citizen remains unarmed in the face of such a threat ??

Pete, even I have heard of the US Constitution. Even I think that you should RESPECT it and ABIDE by it, instead of yearning to see it circumvented ! Americans have the freedom, the RIGHT, to BEAR ARMS. I for one envy them that freedom. Without it ... in 2011, England suffered a riot that didn't abate for days. Buildings were razed to the ground. Widespread looting occurred. Why ? Because citizens COULD NOT PROTECT THEIR PROPERTY, and the police simply weren't up to the task of dealing with such widespread disorder.

So, we suffered needlessly .. where if we'd been armed, it could've all been stopped in its tracks.

You want greater 'internationalism', don't you, Pete ? Well .. the EU runs its version of it, in microcosm. Result ... open borders. Result ... immigrants streaming across Europe, with greater freedom to do so than otherwise. Result ... an expectation, from the EU Parliament that, REGARDLESS of national considerations, EU countries take quotas of refugees.

The open border policy of the EU allows unprecedented movement of people from EU country to EU country. The ringleader of the recent Paris atrocity managed to get from France to Syria, and back again, UNDETECTED, thanks to a lack of border controls in each EU country he is thought to have passed through.

Leftie political correctness imperatives, Pete, MAKE THE WORLD A MORE DANGEROUS PLACE. FACT.

[PixieStix]

Many millions of muzzies would love to saw your idiot head off on camera and have stated that they support this sort of thing.

See the danger now, genius? Get it?

And our President make light of it. An American being beheaded by ISIS scum. No big deal. Obama acts like either a dhimmi or an outright supporter of ISIS.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EE6RUOOYhI

[jimnyc]

Yeah well they had they're chance for 4 months in their own back yard and it never happened. So, yeah, no.

Many millions survive in the muslims back yards. Hundreds of thousands have died at their hands in the past few years alone. So yeah, yes. If they'll saw the head off of a local for reading the bible, or a woman for adultery, or a man for petty theft - then they WILL chop your head off too. Shit, ISIS alone makes up more than .01% of muslims.

[Perianne]

So up to 25% of them are radicalized, but 99.9% of them are harmless?

Lay off the Peyote Petey!

I read, or heard on TV, that it's not the old Muslims who are radical. It's the new, young group of Muslim men who are becoming radicalized. It bodes poorly for the future.

I think they are angry because the women are so ugly. They look at someone like me and hate me because I am pretty, especially compared to their hairy female creatures. At some point they are going to get angry because of the obvious genetic difference between western women and the horridly masculine beasts they call women.

Here, even libs like gabosaurus are cute. There is only one in one million Muslim women who are cute.

[Abbey Marie]

a phobia is irrational. 99.9% of the world's muslims are harmless. that is called irrational then to fear them. get it?

This from a guy who has an irrational fear of the Bible. :eek:

[pete311]

So you think its OK to be intellectually dishonest, as long as it promotes your agenda?

Never mind, I already know the answer is "yes"- you're a lib.

There is nothing dishonest. It states the timeline. You can choose to desire more years. That might be helpful, but it's not dishonest. Dishonest is if it didn't include the timeline or changes it.

[Gunny]

Apparently the GOP that WERE polled agree with Trump to an extent. Where are all of those that disagree?

Voters Like Trump’s Proposed Muslim Ban



Despite an international uproar and condemnation by President Obama and nearly all of those running for the presidency, Donald Trump’s proposed ban on Muslims coming to the United States has the support of a sizable majority of Republicans – and a plurality of all voters.

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 66% of Likely Republican Voters favor a temporary ban on all Muslims entering the United States until the federal government improves its ability to screen out potential terrorists from coming here. Just 24% oppose the plan, with 10% undecided.

Among all voters, 46% favor a temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States, while 40% are opposed. Fourteen percent (14%) are undecided. (To see survey question wording, click here.)

Trump, the front-runner in the race for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination, proposed the ban following last week’s massacre in San Bernardino, California. Sixty-five percent (65%) of voters believe the two shooters in the incident were radical Islamic terrorists. Those individuals had entered the United States without problem and escaped detection despite several actions here suggesting that they had violent intentions.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/immigration/december_2015/voters_like_trump_s_proposed_muslim_ban

I disagree with it. He should have said it differently than "Muslim ban". I don't have a single problem with a moratorium on ALL immigration until our Gov't can get a clue. However, the stain of that boatload of Jews we turned away that dies in Auschwitz hasn't gone away.

My issue is that our Gov't won't get a clue. They never do. They just drag shit out to perpetuate their existence.

Next issue, a so-called "coalition" that is basically fighting one another. We can't get out shit together long enough to just defeat a common enemy.

And I don't want people trained from birth to hate us in my country. I hate ragheads. I'm not trying to live in their damned country.

[Gunny]

There is nothing dishonest. It states the timeline. You can choose to desire more years. That might be helpful, but it's not dishonest. Dishonest is if it didn't include the timeline or changes it.

Do you EVER address what's being said? And your definition of "dishonest" is kinda 1st grade level.

[pete311]

This from a guy who has an irrational fear of the Bible. :eek:

I have a bible in my bookshelf, along with a quran and other holy books for reference.

[Abbey Marie]

Many millions survive in the muslims back yards. Hundreds of thousands have died at their hands in the past few years alone. So yeah, yes. If they'll saw the head off of a local for reading the bible, or a woman for adultery, or a man for petty theft - then they WILL chop your head off too. Shit, ISIS alone makes up more than .01% of muslims.

I suspect Petey isn't too concerned with us idiot Bible-reading Christians getting our heads lopped off. We're too dumb to understand science, for one thing.

[PixieStix]

I have a bible in my bookshelf, along with a quran and other holy books for reference.

Why?

[pete311]

Do you EVER address what's being said? And your definition of "dishonest" is kinda 1st grade level.
Let me see if amazon has a "1st grade" dictionary...

[Abbey Marie]

There is nothing dishonest. It states the timeline. You can choose to desire more years. That might be helpful, but it's not dishonest. Dishonest is if it didn't include the timeline or changes it.


I guess I see how the lib media plies its propaganda so easily on half of our populace.

[pete311]

Why?
What exactly is your question

[PixieStix]

Let me see if amazon has a "1st grade" dictionary...

Trolling much?

[Abbey Marie]

I have a bible in my bookshelf, along with a quran and other holy books for reference.


And I have a Pakistani family a few doors down. I guess that means I'm not Islamophobic.

[pete311]

Trolling much?

do you have anything constructive to add?

[pete311]

And I have a Pakistani family a few doors down. I guess that means I'm not Islamophobic.

Maybe not. Why don't you demand they go back to pakistan? You are ok with them, but not a few more?

[Abbey Marie]

Maybe not. Why don't you demand they go back to pakistan? You are ok with them, but not a few more?


Does your having a Bible on your shelf, along with a Koran, prove you are not anti-Christian?

[pete311]

Does your having a Bible on your shelf, along with a Koran prove you are not anti-Christian?

no