Should a person be held responsible for their brother's actions?

[Black Diamond]

Jeb Bush would like to know.

[fj1200]

No.

[Gunny]

Jeb Bush would like to know.

Why should he? My brother's a moron and I ain't taking responsibility for it.

[Drummond]

A firm 'no', assuming this also covers half-brothers.

I don't see why Malik Obama should ever be held culpable for Barack Hussein Obama's conduct ! Although, that'd be difficult to arrange in any case, considering that Malik is firmly rooted in Kenya .....

[revelarts]

Jeb Bush would like to know.

Well did he encourage and politically support his brothers actions?
Did he ever substantively and publicly disagree with "unproductive" moves on W's part?


"held responsible"? no.
but should we really expect much different?

[Black Diamond]

Well did he encourage and politically support his brothers actions?
Did he ever substantively and publicly disagree with "unproductive" moves on W's part?


"held responsible"? no.
but should we really expect much different?

He was governor of Florida. He wasn't Robert Kennedy.

[revelarts]

He was governor of Florida. He wasn't Robert Kennedy.

true they aren't as close as Robert and John were. but close enough in political colors.

And I'm convinced that Jeb rigged the election in florida for W (or covered for the rig).
people may be in shock and protest that. But I've got facts to make the case that FLs pro Gore votes were suppressed.
If people care about facts.

if someone wants to rant and rave about "well if so THEN, why didn't this! or that! happen!!" I'm not going to go there.
But if you want to look at publicly available facts and then make your own HONEST assessment on that then I'd take lil time.

[Black Diamond]

true they aren't as close as Robert and John were. but close enough in political colors.

And I'm convinced that Jeb rigged the election in florida for W (or covered for the rig).
people may be in shock and protest that. But I've got facts to make the case that FLs pro Gore votes were suppressed.
If people care about facts.

if someone wants to rant and rave about "well if so THEN, why didn't this! or that! happen!!" I'm not going to go there.
But if you want to look at publicly available facts and then make your own HONEST assessment on that then I'd take lil time.

Facepalm.

[revelarts]

Facepalm.
That's what i do over people who won't consider all the facts.

I'm not talking about "hanging chads"
But 57,000 - 94,000 "felons" taken off the voter rolls in FL before the elections. 54% Black folks.. what a coincidence.
But lo and below they found that many of those people were never felons. never.

And Jeb's office managed to block 50,000 new voters .. mostly democrats... what a coincidence... nothing to see here. if you're not concerned about facts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJopOtIa5Xo

[Black Diamond]

That's what do over people who won't consider all the facts.

I'm not talking about "hanging chads"
But 57,000 - 94,000 "felons" taken off the voter rolls in FL before the elections. 54% Black folks.. what a coincidence.
But lo and below they found that many of those people were never felons. never.

And Jeb's office managed to block 50,000 new voters .. mostly democrats... what a coincidence... nothing to see here. if you're not concerned about facts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJopOtIa5Xo
Yawn.

[revelarts]

Yawn.

Well, you can lead a horse to water.

[Black Diamond]

Well, you can lead a horse to water.

I am drinking water right now my friend.

[Abbey Marie]

That's what do over people who won't consider all the facts.

I'm not talking about "hanging chads"
But 57,000 - 94,000 "felons" taken off the voter rolls in FL before the elections. 54% Black folks.. what a coincidence.
But lo and below they found that many of those people were never felons. never.

And Jeb's office managed to block 50,000 new voters .. mostly democrats... what a coincidence... nothing to see here. if you're not concerned about facts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJopOtIa5Xo

And umpteen military (generally conservative) absentee ballots not counted.

Do you think felons should vote?

[revelarts]

And umpteen military (generally conservative) absentee ballots not counted.
if there's records of that in FL 2000 i'd like to see it.

Do you think felons should vote?
It was against the law at the time so No.
But do you want, literally, thousands of people CALLED felons who aren't to be taken off the voter rolls?
and 50,000 new voters blocked?


Concerning the policy in general. i don't understand why it's Ok to let a felon free after years in prison but somehow say he can't vote anymore.
Why is the right to vote taken permanently away AFTER they've supposedly paid their debt to society.
And you know, It's not like most ex-felons are big on political and civic activities anyway.
Plus with all the Crooks that are IN Politics you'd think politicians would WELCOME kindred spirits at the polls.

[Max R.]

Well did he encourage and politically support his brothers actions?
Did he ever substantively and publicly disagree with "unproductive" moves on W's part?


"held responsible"? no.
but should we really expect much different?
Agreed. While a candidate shouldn't be held responsible for the actions of their brother, father or husband, they should be held accountable for their own actions and statements. This includes questions about their brother's, father's or husband's actions and statements.

[Kathianne]

if there's records of that in FL 2000 i'd like to see it.

It was against the law at the time so No.
But do you want, literally, thousands of people CALLED felons who aren't to be taken off the voter rolls?
and 50,000 new voters blocked?


Concerning the policy in general. i don't understand why it's Ok to let a felon free after years in prison but somehow say he can't vote anymore.
Why is the right to vote taken permanently away AFTER they've supposedly paid their debt to society.
And you know, It's not like most ex-felons are big on political and civic activities anyway.
Plus with all the Crooks that are IN Politics you'd think politicians would WELCOME kindred spirits at the polls.

There is something to be said for 'after serving their time...' but as you say, that wasn't the law at the time. It's pretty difficult to get folks riled up about fixing things for ex-cons.

I'm for voter ID, however I'm much more concerned about getting rid of 'early voting' and 'motor voting' that's where the real opportunities for fraud lay.

[Abbey Marie]

if there's records of that in FL 2000 i'd like to see it.

It was against the law at the time so No.
But do you want, literally, thousands of people CALLED felons who aren't to be taken off the voter rolls?
and 50,000 new voters blocked?

Concerning the policy in general. i don't understand why it's Ok to let a felon free after years in prison but somehow say he can't vote anymore.
Why is the right to vote taken permanently away AFTER they've supposedly paid their debt to society.
And you know, It's not like most ex-felons are big on political and civic activities anyway.
Plus with all the Crooks that are IN Politics you'd think politicians would WELCOME kindred spirits at the polls.




Applying widely varying standards from one county to the next, election officials threw out 1,527 ballots, according to an unofficial tally by The Associated Press, or 41 percent of the total, and the remaining ballots produced a net gain of 630 votes for Mr. Bush. Democrats said military ballots were fewer than half of those discarded statewide, while Republicans said they were more than half.

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/11/21/us/counting-vote-absentee-ballots-review-military-votes-florida-attorney-general.html

I'm surprised you do not remember that fiasco. Do you think felons deserve to vote more than our military serving overseas?

As for the felons, if they've served their time (full term) I think an argument could be made for voting rights. But I think Dems are pushing for currently incarcerated felons to vote. Anything for another insured Dem vote I guess.

[Black Diamond]

Agreed. While a candidate shouldn't be held responsible for the actions of their brother, father or husband, they should be held accountable for their own actions and statements. This includes questions about their brother's, father's or husband's actions and statements.

Absolutely. I agree. A month or two ago when he was asked about Iraq and gave 3-4 answers in three days...

He should have been prepared for the Iraq question. But I don't understand the whole dynasty concern. If jeb is the best candidate vote for him. People say oh no not another bush. Why not??? He's not his brother any more than Teddy was JFK.

[Max R.]

Absolutely. I agree. A month or two ago when he was asked about Iraq and gave 3-4 answers in three days...

He should have been prepared for the Iraq question. But I don't understand the whole dynasty concern. If jeb is the best candidate vote for him. People say oh no not another bush. Why not??? He's not his brother any more than Teddy was JFK.
The "dynasty concern", IMHO, is related to a general concern for the development of an American aristocracy.

Left Wingers often want us to be more like the Euros; faith in an elite central power. One common thread among Right Wingers is a distrust of central power. Distrust of a government in general and a large central/federal government in particular.

That said, family power dynasties are just too much like monarchies and aristocracies for my taste. I just hope I'm not the only one nor that it's a minority opinion.

[Abbey Marie]

The "dynasty concern", IMHO, is related to a general concern for the development of an American aristocracy.

Left Wingers often want us to be more like the Euros; faith in an elite central power. One common thread among Right Wingers is a distrust of central power. Distrust of a government in general and a large central/federal government in particular.

That said, family power dynasties are just too much like monarchies and aristocracies for my taste. I just hope I'm not the only one nor that it's a minority opinion.

This is our first President named Obama, and he has acted more like a dictator than all the Bushes and Roosevelts put together.

[revelarts]

http://www.nytimes.com/2000/11/21/us/counting-vote-absentee-ballots-review-military-votes-florida-attorney-general.html

I'm surprised you do not remember that fiasco. Do you think felons deserve to vote more than our military serving overseas?

As for the felons, if they've served their time (full term) I think an argument could be made for voting rights. But I think Dems are pushing for currently incarcerated felons to vote. Anything for another insured Dem vote I guess.


I didn't remember it being FL specific in 2000. I know many absentee military ballots have been a problem here an there for quite some time.

And it's not a matter of WHOOSE votes are "MORE" important . EVERYONES VOTE is important. But Abbey why do you keep dogging the fact that the people i'm talking about WEREN'T "felons". Some of them were in the MILITARY, VETERANS and PASTORS etc, and one white woman was removed who was on the a county voting commission. Plus Hispanic "felons" WEREN'T included on the list. the hispanic in FL tend to vote R, another "coincidental" oversight. link (http://www.sptimes.com/2004/07/11/State/Florida_scraps_felon_.shtml).

Also the numbers involved for the NON-felons are more significant.
47-97 Thousand SUPPOSED felons.
50 Thousands NEW voters not allowed to vote.

Another group that was blocked from voting were some large number of college students. Many , like the military, had problems since many were from out of state, before the vote. But they had followed the rules and registered in FL and found themselves turned away at the polls.

Both sides are crooked and have their hands dirty in trying to suppress or fluff votes at different times. The "I know you are but what am i" defense by crooks on both sides is sickening.
Each side has used various semi legit and outright criminal tactics over the decades but in 2000 in FL it was the R's that did it the MOST. With Jeb Bush at the top post.

[gabosaurus]

If you believe that Jed shouldn't be held accountable for G.W.'s mistakes, will you also be willing to believe that Hillary is not responsible for Slick Willy's mistakes?

Won't happen. This is American politics. Jeb is dead in the water.

[Max R.]

This is our first President named Obama, and he has acted more like a dictator than all the Bushes and Roosevelts put together.
Mostly, IMO, due to a power vacuum left by a "do nothing" Congress.

http://politic365.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/2014/07/bills5-495x307.jpg

[Elessar]

true they aren't as close as Robert and John were. but close enough in political colors.

And I'm convinced that Jeb rigged the election in florida for W (or covered for the rig).
people may be in shock and protest that. But I've got facts to make the case that FLs pro Gore votes were suppressed.
If people care about facts.

if someone wants to rant and rave about "well if so THEN, why didn't this! or that! happen!!" I'm not going to go there.
But if you want to look at publicly available facts and then make your own HONEST assessment on that then I'd take lil time.

Conspiracy Theorist?

Another kook without proof?

Amazing!

[Elessar]

And umpteen military (generally conservative) absentee ballots not counted.

Do you think felons should vote?

Thanks!....Gore wanted to block that. Some 17000 If I recall?

[Elessar]

If you believe that Jed shouldn't be held accountable for G.W.'s mistakes, will you also be willing to believe that Hillary is not responsible for Slick Willy's mistakes?

Won't happen. This is American politics. Jeb is dead in the water.

Jeb was not in the White House with GWB.

Hilly was with Billy...she even declared "WE are the President".

Big...Huge difference

[revelarts]

Conspiracy Theorist?
Another kook without proof?
Amazing!

Look another unreasoning drone who can think past narrow political limits and is reduced to simple and outraged name calling when presented with facts that don't fit his small paradigm.

And too dishonest and afraid to even look at news reports that conflict with his world view.

[Gunny]

Look another unreasoning drone who can think past narrow political limits and is reduced to simple and outraged name calling when presented with facts that don't fit his small paradigm.

And too dishonest and afraid to even look at news reports that conflict with his world view.

What facts? That one person should be responsible for another's actions?

[Jeff]

What facts? That one person should be responsible for another's actions?

Hell thank God we aren't responsible for our Brothers issues, hell I would be in trouble. :laugh:

[SassyLady]

God, I hope not. One of my brothers is a murderer.

To answer the question about Jeb Bush.....only if he was one of his brother's advisors. And, if that is the case, then Congress should be held just as responsible.

[revelarts]

What facts? That one person should be responsible for another's actions?
read the whole thread for context then comment thanks

[Elessar]

Look another unreasoning drone who can think past narrow political limits and is reduced to simple and outraged name calling when presented with facts that don't fit his small paradigm.

And too dishonest and afraid to even look at news reports that conflict with his world view.

"Look another unreasoning drone".....that made no sense. Try punctuation.

And I did not name call...you get butt-hurt to easily if someone calls you out as
being a Conspiracy Freak, trying to create FACT from theory.

I thought you better.

[Elessar]

What facts? That one person should be responsible for another's actions?

That boy cannot answer a direct question...

His deflection mentality is on full swing,

[revelarts]

Should Rubio be held responsible for having Cuban parents?
Should Obama be held responsible for having A Kenyan parent?