Hold Your Breath

[Gunny]

for me to apologize for being white. You mean us white guys that paid taxes and fought wars while you black-ass slugs sucked off our money?

[Kathianne]

for me to apologize for being white. You mean us white guys that paid taxes and fought wars while you black-ass slugs sucked off our money?

I've known you a long time, I don't understand a post like this from you.

[jimnyc]

Yikes! A little rough there around the edges, huh Gunny? You know as well as I do that not all black folks are bad, not even close. And even the confederacy had black soldiers fighting. I'm no historian of course, and really only know anything about the major wars of the 1900's till today, but I'm confident they all had proud black soldiers fighting. And wars/units that didn't allow them, no one can hardly fault them for that.

If you want to discuss stats of various things, to include welfare or other things, I'm on board. Just was having a similar discussion with FJ recently about crime and sucking off the government. But of course each individual would technically be a different story, as I believe everyone makes it or breaks it on their own. But I believe there are problems, problems that start at home, at the dinner table, when kids are supposed to be home when it gets dark and such. Also another story.

But it's not all black folks as your post sounded, and like Kath, I know you're better than that, you're just angry. And that's cool. Wait till Jeff gets online and fuck with him and take it out on him! :laugh: :beer:

[LongTermGuy]

Yikes! A little rough there around the edges, huh Gunny? You know as well as I do that not all black folks are bad, not even close. And even the confederacy had black soldiers fighting. I'm no historian of course, and really only know anything about the major wars of the 1900's till today, but I'm confident they all had proud black soldiers fighting. And wars/units that didn't allow them, no one can hardly fault them for that.

If you want to discuss stats of various things, to include welfare or other things, I'm on board. Just was having a similar discussion with FJ recently about crime and sucking off the government. But of course each individual would technically be a different story, as I believe everyone makes it or breaks it on their own. But I believe there are problems, problems that start at home, at the dinner table, when kids are supposed to be home when it gets dark and such. Also another story.

But it's not all black folks as your post sounded, and like Kath, I know you're better than that, you're just angry. And that's cool. Wait till Jeff gets online and fuck with him and take it out on him! :laugh: :beer:


*He didnt say they are all bad!....just the "slugs" who happen to be whining about the long gone past at the moment.....*Slugs.....They come in all flavors....!!!

[Kathianne]

*He didnt say they are all bad!....just the "slugs" who happen to be whining about the long gone past at the moment.....*Slugs.....They come in all flavors....!!!

That's true, but you wouldn't know that's common belief around here lately. :coffee:

[LongTermGuy]

That's true, but you wouldn't know that's common belief around here lately. :coffee:

Kat...there ya go again...makin them there "akusations":thumb:

[jimnyc]

*He didnt say they are all bad!....just the "slugs" who happen to be whining about the long gone past at the moment.....*Slugs.....They come in all flavors....!!!

Well then I apologize. :) Just that it sounded like a blanket statement.

Dude, it's 4:37 and I'm DYING for a coffee! But I can't, as I have enough trouble sleeping from my coffee addiction, and I generally never have a cup after noon!

Maybe I'll find something else... :badsnort:

I kid, I kid! I just wanted to use that smiley again. :)

[Kathianne]

Kat...there ya go again...makin them there "akusations":thumb:

It wasn't an akusation, rather an observation. :thumb:

[LongTermGuy]

Well then I apologize. :) Just that it sounded like a blanket statement.

Dude, it's 4:37 and I'm DYING for a coffee! But I can't, as I have enough trouble sleeping from my coffee addiction, and I generally never have a cup after noon!

Maybe I'll find something else... :badsnort:

I kid, I kid! I just wanted to use that smiley again. :)

*Hey its always all good here...were all family here (well most of us) Need a bump?:dance:

[jimnyc]

*Hey its always all good here...were all family here (well most of us) Need a bump?:dance:

Need a bump? Now you wouldn't know that phrase unless.... And I wouldn't know what you know unless I knew too. Howdya like them apples? Oh shoot, maybe you only knew from movies and I just outed myself? :slap:

[LongTermGuy]

Need a bump? Now you wouldn't know that phrase unless.... And I wouldn't know what you know unless I knew too. Howdya like them apples? Oh shoot, maybe you only knew from movies and I just outed myself? :slap:


Was just waiting for some "akusations"....:coffee: But...I ran strip joints in the past....Familiar with many "terms"....Plus I seen scarface 25 times.....http://glocktalk.com/images/smilies/bump.gif

[Jeff]

Gunny is peaking !!! :laugh::laugh:

I understand what he is saying, he isn't by no means ( I believe ) saying all blacks are bad, he is talking to the blacks that are gloating over their victory of the flag being taken down, he is speaking to the blacks that think Obama not sending not one person to a white woman's funeral but sends reps from the Government to blacks criminals funerals, yes Gunny is Pissed, as should all white people be. Obama is making it a crime to be white. I see now MTV has a new show coming out that just shames white people, yup this is exactly what I and many like me predicted when we elected our first African American president :rolleyes: a man who had more privileges than any white man I have ever known.

The worst part is this is exactly what Obama was pushing for, a guy Like Gunny gets upset over this what do you think the real whack jobs are doing, Gunny is usually a very smart guy and they have pushed him this far, others aren't going to be so nice, yup and as soon as they do something it will be plastered all over the news talking about another hate crime, while the blacks are playing the knock out game , burning cities down and so on, yup Obama has succeeded in exactly what he wanted.

[Kathianne]

Gunny is peaking !!! :laugh::laugh:

I understand what he is saying, he isn't by no means ( I believe ) saying all blacks are bad, he is talking to the blacks that are gloating over their victory of the flag being taken down, he is speaking to the blacks that think Obama not sending not one person to a white woman's funeral but sends reps from the Government to blacks criminals funerals, yes Gunny is Pissed, as should all white people be. Obama is making it a crime to be white. I see now MTV has a new show coming out that just shames white people, yup this is exactly what I and many like me predicted when we elected our first African American president :rolleyes: a man who had more privileges than any white man I have ever known.

The worst part is this is exactly what Obama was pushing for, a guy Like Gunny gets upset over this what do you think the real whack jobs are doing, Gunny is usually a very smart guy and they have pushed him this far, others aren't going to be so nice, yup and as soon as they do something it will be plastered all over the news talking about another hate crime, while the blacks are playing the knock out game , burning cities down and so on, yup Obama has succeeded in exactly what he wanted.


I do think some blacks are gloating, I think some are as horrified by what is happening in this country as you and I. I think some whites are very angry, more than is good for them or society. It scares me and truly makes me sad.

[Gunny]

I've known you a long time, I don't understand a post like this from you.

Because I'm tired of this crap. Listen to the news. We whites are all wrong. I'm not racist. I could care less what color anyone is. The TRUE racists are the ones PC lets control our Nation. If you don't love fags, Mexicans and blacks, you're a racist. And what do white conservatives do? Hide in the corner because they're afraid of what the left calls them.

Can't make fun of blacks, pollocks nor anyone else but you can blame and make fun of white people.

I'm keeping my flag and keeping my balls. The rest of y'all can cow-tow to the left.

[jimnyc]

Because I'm tired of this crap. Listen to the news. We whites are all wrong. I'm not racist. I could care less what color anyone is. The TRUE racists are the ones PC lets control our Nation. If you don't love fags, Mexicans and blacks, you're a racist. And what do white conservatives do? Hide in the corner because they're afraid of what the left calls them.

Now THIS I am on board with. No matter what I say anymore I am condemned. And you're spot on, it's NOT enough to just disagree with certain things and then leave it be - you MUST agree and tolerate and all that other crap, you MUST swallow everything you disagree with - or you're a racist, a bigot, a homophobe or whatever the next word is they invent to crucify the person that disagrees with them.

And yep, I agree with the conservative thing too, but the problem anymore is WHO is a conservative? It's a dying breed. The idiots in Washington who claim to be conservative, who then are afraid of speaking out about what they disagree with - most of them won't conservative to begin with.

[Gunny]

Now THIS I am on board with. No matter what I say anymore I am condemned. And you're spot on, it's NOT enough to just disagree with certain things and then leave it be - you MUST agree and tolerate and all that other crap, you MUST swallow everything you disagree with - or you're a racist, a bigot, a homophobe or whatever the next word is they invent to crucify the person that disagrees with them.

And yep, I agree with the conservative thing too, but the problem anymore is WHO is a conservative? It's a dying breed. The idiots in Washington who claim to be conservative, who then are afraid of speaking out about what they disagree with - most of them won't conservative to begin with.

Conservatives aren't a dying breed. Republicans are. The only things that seem to last are Democraps. Pelosi who's made deals for her husband's fishing business has been around how long? How about Hillary? She and Bill have made an art of lying? Their constituents don't hold them accountable, and perfectly fine with being the sheep they are.

The right doesn't want to win, they want to be right. Look how that last 7 years worked. I don't even recognize this country anymore.

I risked my life, and the lives of my Marines to save that Constitution the left is selling right down the drain. I don't know who I am more disgusted with. Them or me.

[Kathianne]

Because I'm tired of this crap. Listen to the news. We whites are all wrong. I'm not racist. I could care less what color anyone is. The TRUE racists are the ones PC lets control our Nation. If you don't love fags, Mexicans and blacks, you're a racist. And what do white conservatives do? Hide in the corner because they're afraid of what the left calls them.

Can't make fun of blacks, pollocks nor anyone else but you can blame and make fun of white people.

I'm keeping my flag and keeping my balls. The rest of y'all can cow-tow to the left.
I'm pretty sure Poles are white. :laugh2: I do wish that everyone, not just here, those bitching about this and that, would grow up and treat each other the way they claim they want to be treated.

You, Jeff, and many others here and elsewhere are upset about the Confederate Flag being centered in some's sights because of a racist thug, (which actually sounds like he was 'tough,' he wasn't), killing people that had shown him nothing but respect. How did white 'Southerners' get caught up in that? I honestly don't know.

Then I imagine those blacks that have seen the flag as a symbol of racism, whether others agree or not, are probably pretty well convinced by the reactions of some that they were right all along.

It's not just 'white people' who are the butt of jokes and meaner things. It's Christians, Jews, Catholics (who are Christians but some of those that speak directly to and for God claim they are not). It's white males, especially on campuses where they are being denied due process. It's conservatives in general that are being ridiculed and unfortunately some play right into the stereotypes.

I can't change everyone, actually not anyone but myself. Heck I can't even change the kids anymore, they're all grown up. I try to treat others decently, even when disagreeing. Yes, I lose it sometimes but I keep trying. If everyone did the same, things would be at least more civil.

[Gunny]

I'm pretty sure Poles are white. :laugh2: I do wish that everyone, not just here, those bitching about this and that, would grow up and treat each other the way they claim they want to be treated.

You, Jeff, and many others here and elsewhere are upset about the Confederate Flag being centered in some's sights because of a racist thug, (which actually sounds like he was 'tough,' he wasn't), killing people that had shown him nothing but respect. How did white 'Southerners' get caught up in that? I honestly don't know.

Then I imagine those blacks that have seen the flag as a symbol of racism, whether others agree or not, are probably pretty well convinced by the reactions of some that they were right all along.

It's not just 'white people' who are the butt of jokes and meaner things. It's Christians, Jews, Catholics (who are Christians but some of those that speak directly to and for God claim they are not). It's white males, especially on campuses where they are being denied due process. It's conservatives in general that are being ridiculed and unfortunately some play right into the stereotypes.

I can't change everyone, actually not anyone but myself. Heck I can't even change the kids anymore, they're all grown up. I try to treat others decently, even when disagreeing. Yes, I lose it sometimes but I keep trying. If everyone did the same, things would be at least more civil.

Do you realize that battle standard is British, and not the flag of the CSA?

Third paragraph ... you just named white people. And last I checked, it's white guys being denied due rpocess on college campuses. Guilty until proven innocent. How 1st Amendment is THAT?

[indago]

I've known you a long time, I don't understand a post like this from you.

I do! He's insane...

[Jeff]

Conservatives aren't a dying breed. Republicans are. The only things that seem to last are Democraps. Pelosi who's made deals for her husband's fishing business has been around how long? How about Hillary? She and Bill have made an art of lying? Their constituents don't hold them accountable, and perfectly fine with being the sheep they are.

The right doesn't want to win, they want to be right. Look how that last 7 years worked. I don't even recognize this country anymore.

I risked my life, and the lives of my Marines to save that Constitution the left is selling right down the drain. I don't know who I am more disgusted with. Them or me.

White Christian males are what is a dying breed and our death sentence was signed when Obama took office.

[Abbey Marie]

Perhaps Gunny is referring to this?

http://radio.foxnews.com/2015/07/09/white-is-the-new-bad-mtv-promotes-white-guilt/

[indago]

Gunny's probably got this in mind...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o64Fz-KW1Dk



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLTTX35LNJo

[Gunny]

I do! He's insane...

Everyone knows that one, newbie. It means I ain't taking no shit.

No one wants to be responsible for one idiot. Let's blame a flag. So let's ...

Which two wars did the US fight that weren't imperialistic? Clue: it wasn't tyranny against our King and it wasn't the Civil War that violated the Constitution at every turn. It wasn't WWi, nor the Spanish American War, nor Korea or Vietnam.It wasn't the Banana Wars in the 20's It sure wasn't when Cooke sailed into Tokyo Harbor and said open up for trade or we open fire.

And it sure as shit wasn't when the US invaded the South.

You're running out of wars.

[aboutime]

for me to apologize for being white. You mean us white guys that paid taxes and fought wars while you black-ass slugs sucked off our money? Gunny. Nobody, but Nobody should ever feel any need to apologize for being who they are; no matter what their skin color might be. And those you spoke of above KNOW WHO THEY ARE...without You, or I having any reason to identify them.We do know. None of them are smart enough, or educated enough to come here to DP, or even to have a keyboard. They are too busy stealing, and demanding that Obama keep giving them more free stuff...those of us who actually earned it, never ask for, or get!

[Olivia]

I understand what he was trying to say. I think. I feel the same. Sick and tired of race hustlers and race baiters. Since Obama has taken office the hatred from blacks toward whites has been a mounting frenzy. Black on black crime is horrendous, what do you hear? Crickets. Let one mean assed white kid shoot nine innocent black Christians and all hell breaks loose. It's now a first amendment issue and a states rights issue. The left won't stop until we've fought a second civil war. It's a shame.

[Kathianne]

Do you realize that battle standard is British, and not the flag of the CSA?

Third paragraph ... you just named white people. And last I checked, it's white guys being denied due rpocess on college campuses. Guilty until proven innocent. How 1st Amendment is THAT?

It's not. I've been reading and writing on the nonsense on campuses a lot. Many things that start at universities become 'accepted' by the greater culture. This nonsense and the 'triggers' are so very wrong. It needs to go way beyond a messageboard.

[Kathianne]

Do you realize that battle standard is British, and not the flag of the CSA?

Third paragraph ... you just named white people. And last I checked, it's white guys being denied due rpocess on college campuses. Guilty until proven innocent. How 1st Amendment is THAT?
You mentioned the Poles. Personally I'm pretty sure their are Christians, etc., that are NOT white. C'mon Gunny, you're letting your anger get ahead of your thinking.

[Kathianne]

Perhaps Gunny is referring to this?

http://radio.foxnews.com/2015/07/09/white-is-the-new-bad-mtv-promotes-white-guilt/

Someone, I don't think Gunny, brought that up. I saw it on drudge. It's so wrong. Time for making some calls to all friends, relatives, businesses associates, etc, and have them all call/email MTV.

[Gunny]

It's not. I've been reading and writing on the nonsense on campuses a lot. Many things that start at universities become 'accepted' by the greater culture. This nonsense and the 'triggers' are so very wrong. It needs to go way beyond a messageboard.


You mentioned the Poles. Personally I'm pretty sure their are Christians, etc., that are NOT white. C'mon Gunny, you're letting your anger get ahead of your thinking.

So what does it take? Damn right my anger's getting ahead. Try slowing it down.

I'm a Marine. We ALL bleed green. But y'all want to let a suntan control this Nation? Or does the leftwing MSM want to? Any excuse at all is a good one to them. Anything to divert attention from Hillary being a liar. a crook and above the law.

My best friend was black. I could give a shit less what your tan looks like if you can hump ammo. I don't even care what's between your legs. One of the toughest Marines I knew had a vagina. I was afraid of her.

Don't you nor anyone else disgrace my Marine. I gave the order that got him killed and I'd give 20 sorry-ass basement dwelling white guys to have him back. He was a Corporal in the United States Marine Corps. He died on Jan 29th, 1991.

Now we're fighting over a fucking flag? A person's skin color?

I love you Kat ... just not this time.

[indago]

I love you Kat ... just not this time.

Hmmm! Fickle...

[Jeff]

You mentioned the Poles. Personally I'm pretty sure their are Christians, etc., that are NOT white. C'mon Gunny, you're letting your anger get ahead of your thinking.

They may be Christian but they are dumb as a wall, heck at one point we where going to put a fence around Poland so we could have our own private Disney land.

That is exactly what Gunny is speaking of, that joke is old and use to be funny, no one gave a dam about jokes until Obama took office, let me take that back, no one who wasn't a racist cared about jokes until Obama took office, you would hear how stupid the pollocks where, or names like kikes, niggers, whops, micks, you name it, they where all jokes that most didn't give a dam about, now the only one allowed to be made fun of is white, if you are white you should feel ashamed, you should feel like you owe the poor black man something. I say the hell with the poor black man, go to work and earn it like everyone else. Yes we heard how it was their turn now, Obama was going to pay their rent and all that trash ( and yes some where stupid enough to believe it, why because they where brought up with so much hatred in their eyes for white that they believed our bills where paid )

Yup Obama has done exactly what he set out to do, he turned this country upside down and inside out, put racism back 50 years and has people at each others throats, and all the while no one is watching what the thieves in DC are doing, all of them black, white Dem and rep.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Perhaps Gunny is referring to this?

http://radio.foxnews.com/2015/07/09/white-is-the-new-bad-mtv-promotes-white-guilt/

I feel guilty about not being the man my father wanted me to become but not about speaking truth about blacks, gays, illegal immigrants, leftists, libs and dems and other assorted trash.
They can all kiss my ass! I'll not buy into any of this PC BULLSHIT!

Last year a black man smarted some crap off to me in a store. I replied --"asshole if you do not like it , ain't nothing between us but air and opportunity, feel froggy jump! I'll be waiting right here!"
He shut the hell up, because I called his bluff.
Most of them are graven cowards unless they have you outnumbered 4 or 5 to one. Then if a fight happens you will end up fighting all five at the same time. As I said, basically cowards at heart. I've been seeing that for over 50 years now..-Tyr

[namvet]

im with the Gun

http://www.armysurplusworld.com/custom/photos/lincolnshoepolish.jpg

cover up those white faces. they can start riots

[Gunny]

I feel guilty about not being the man my father wanted me to become but not about speaking truth about blacks, gays, illegal immigrants, leftists, libs and dems and other assorted trash.
They can all kiss my ass! I'll not buy into any of this PC BULLSHIT!

Last year a black man smarted some crap off to me in a store. I replied --"asshole if you do not like it , ain't nothing between us but air and opportunity, feel froggy jump! I'll be waiting right here!"
He shut the hell up, because I called his bluff.
Most of them are graven cowards unless they have you outnumbered 4 or 5 to one. Then if a fight happens you will end up fighting all five at the same time. As I said, basically cowards at heart. I've been seeing that for over 50 years now..-Tyr

Don't feel guilty. Those of us that do what we have to, do it. Those of "them" that feel they're owed something, don't. They just sit around and Monday morning QB those that do.

The cop in Ferguson. The cops in Baltimore. The Marines in Fallujah. That nameless paramedic that's going to pull a bullet out of your ass at 3:30 AM or the firefighter risking his life to get someone out of a building about to collapse.

There are those that serve and those that don't.

[tailfins]

You mentioned the Poles. Personally I'm pretty sure their are Christians, etc., that are NOT white. C'mon Gunny, you're letting your anger get ahead of your thinking.

Anyone who TRULY cares about reducing conflict addresses the underlying frustrations. Cramming "equality" down someone's throat breeds resentment. Gunny's reaction makes perfect sense.

[Gunny]

It's not. I've been reading and writing on the nonsense on campuses a lot. Many things that start at universities become 'accepted' by the greater culture. This nonsense and the 'triggers' are so very wrong. It needs to go way beyond a messageboard.

Can I still get pissed at tailfins?

[Gunny]

I was getting pissed.

Kathianne is my friend. She has been able to disagree with me for 14 years.

Don't fuck with my friends.

[Kathianne]

I was getting pissed.

Kathianne is my friend. She has been able to disagree with me for 14 years.

Don't fuck with my friends.
Indeed, we've had a mutual admiration friendship for quite awhile now. ;)

[namvet]

http://i59.tinypic.com/2r7xb2h.jpg

http://11mvce1u204yohuqc313738f.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Black-Panther-on-Flag.png

the little respect i had left for blacks is now completely gone



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhGOZFkxGuI&feature=youtu.be

[Jeff]

http://i59.tinypic.com/2r7xb2h.jpg

http://11mvce1u204yohuqc313738f.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Black-Panther-on-Flag.png

the little respect i had left for blacks is now completely gone
NV I just posted this story as a thread, how disgusting is this, a wipe your Butt with the American flag challenge, this is disgusting, read some of the comments posted, most are against her but there are a few that are with her, they show what animals they are. When a grown woman shows a nude picture of herself wiping her butt, well yea she is a animal and deserves to be in a cage.

[namvet]

NV I just posted this story as a thread, how disgusting is this, a wipe your Butt with the American flag challenge, this is disgusting, read some of the comments posted, most are against her but there are a few that are with her, they show what animals they are. When a grown woman shows a nude picture of herself wiping her butt, well yea she is a animal and deserves to be in a cage.


no flag stomping is now stylish and the in thing to do

http://www.ijreview.com/2015/04/309822-americans-stomping-flag-posting-pictures-online-part-protest/

[namvet]

http://i57.tinypic.com/23h0t8w.jpg

[aboutime]

Just proves that the SCUM OF THE EARTH can't afford Toilet Paper to improve their IQ's.

[Gunny]

Just proves that the SCUM OF THE EARTH can't afford Toilet Paper to improve their IQ's.

Sorry I took a nap. WTF is THIS shit?

[aboutime]

Sorry I took a nap. WTF is THIS shit? Go back to sleep. You nailed it for what it is....Shit!

[LongTermGuy]

Go back to sleep. You nailed it for what it is....Shit!

:clap::clap::clap:...............:laugh::laugh::la ugh:

[Kathianne]

Do you realize that battle standard is British, and not the flag of the CSA?

Third paragraph ... you just named white people. And last I checked, it's white guys being denied due rpocess on college campuses. Guilty until proven innocent. How 1st Amendment is THAT?


A win!

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/due-process-win-california-judge-rules-campus-kangaroo-court-unfair/article/2568180


Due process win: California judge rules campus kangaroo court 'unfair'



By ASHE SCHOW (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/author/ashe-schow)
•
7/13/15 5:03 PM

...

"The Court determines that it is unfair to Petitioner that his questions were reviewed by the Panel Chair for her alone to determine whether or not the question would be asked and then answered by the witness," Pressman wrote. "While the Court understands the need to prevent additional trauma to potential victims of sexual abuse, this can be achieved in a less restrictive manner. The limiting of the questions in this case curtailed the right of confrontration [sic] crucial to any definition of a fair hearing."

Pressman noted that seven questions not asked by the panel chair dealt with text messages between John and Jane. The panel chair also paraphrased a question regarding John and Jane's relationship after the alleged sexual assault and allowed Jane to claim that their post-encounter relationship was not relevant. Further, Jane's questions were not given the same prior review as John's.

Pressman also decried the school disallowing John to cross-examine and question the only "evidence" at his hearing beside the accuser's story. Submitted to the hearing panel was an investigative report conducted by Elena Acevedo Dalcourt, the school's complaint resolution officer. But Dalcourt did not attend the hearing, which prevented John from questioning her account of the incident.

"[T]he Panel relied on evidence that was outside the hearing. Ms. Dalcourt did not testify. While the technical rule of hearsay is not applicable to the hearing, the hearing did not allow petitioner any opportunity to refute Ms. Dalcourt's findings," Pressman wrote. "Ms. Dalcourt's conclusions were crucial to the findings, but petitioner was denied his right of confrontation."

John was also not provided all of the evidence against him that was found in Dalcourt's report. He was not given the names of the witnesses interviewed by Dalcourt or all of Jane's statements prior to the hearing.

Pressman reminded the university that "it was the panel's responsibility to determine whether it was more likely than not that petitioner violated the policy and not defer to an investigator who was not even present to testify at the hearing." (Emphasis original.)

...

[Kathianne]

and another:

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/iowa-court-upholds-ruling-clearing-student-of-campus-sexual-assault/article/2568322


Iowa court upholds ruling clearing student of campus sexual assault



By ASHE SCHOW (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/author/ashe-schow)
•
7/15/15 1:08 PM

​An Iowa appeals court has dismissed an appeal (http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/sports/college/iowa-state/basketball-mens/2015/07/09/bubu-palo-iowa-state-basketball-court-sexual-assault-ruling/29925659/) from Iowa State University that would have overturned an earlier ruling regarding a campus sexual assault accusation.In May 2012, Yempabou "Bubu" Palo, an ISU basketball player, was accused of sexually assaulting a fellow student. Palo and another man, Spencer Cruise, had been friends with the accuser — listed in court records as H.B. — since high school. Palo and H.B. had engaged in sexual activities years earlier.

H.B. accused both men of raping her, and Palo was criminally charged with second-degree sexual abuse. But after an investigation — which included the discovery of fabricated evidence (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8844638/abuse-charge-dropped-iowa-state-cyclones-bubu-palo) — the charges were dropped. H.B. had claimed that the blouse she had worn the night of the alleged attack had been torn during the encounter but that she had lost it. About seven months after the alleged incident, she found the torn blouse, but said she had washed it a week after the event.

A forensic expert determined the blouse had been torn after it was washed. That, along with several inconsistencies in H.B.'s story, led to the charges being dropped against Palo and Cruise. Despite this, ISU conducted its own investigation using a lower standard of evidence. An administrative law judge led the hearing against Palo, but determined the charges to be unfounded.

H.B. appealed the decision to ISU president Steven Leath. Using the same evidence that led to criminal charges being dropped and a campus judge finding in favor of the accused, Leath determined that Palo was actually responsible for violating the school's sexual misconduct policy.


Leath didn't suspend Palo but did sanction him to "indefinite deferred suspension," suspended him from the basketball team and prohibited him from participating in all other campus sports and ordered him to attend sexual assault and alcohol awareness training.


Palo appealed the new decision and requested a stay on his prohibition from participating in sports. ISU's board of regents denied the appeal and the request for a stay.


Palo then took his case to the district court, which temporarily granted Palo's stay.


"In its ruling, the district court noted President Leath issued his decision five days after the deadline that would have allowed Palo to transfer to a different school to take advantage of his remaining year of athletic eligibility," the appeals court wrote. "The court found 'irreparable injury' would occur if Palo was not allowed to return to the team for his final year of eligibility. The court also found that since H.B. had graduated and left the state of Iowa, granting the stay would not interfere with ISU's ability to protect H.B."


The district court found insufficient evidence to support ISU's finding of responsibility. Palo was allowed to return to the team and finish the 2014 season. His eligibility to participate expired at the end of the spring 2014 term, when Palo was set to graduate.


Because Palo has since graduated, the appeals court ruled that the issue is now moot.