Freedom of Speech

[Gunny]

Relax, Jim. Not about the board.:laugh:

The First Amendment guarantees freedom of expression. No argument there. What I'm sick of is people thinking they aren't responsible for what they say. You open your mouth, you own it. It's like a bullet. Once it's out, you can't take it back. You walk up and call my daughter a bitch you'll be digging your teeth out of my fist for a week.

This latest little outburst in Garland is stupid. You don't like what others say but you want to shove your words down their throat? That insecure in your beliefs that you have to kill others to censor them?

All I got to say is "Welcome to fucking Texas, motherfucker."

[jimnyc]

Sometimes ones speech can get them in trouble with the law still ("fire" in theater), and sometimes it can get you an ass kicking. I like when the latter happens, as often it's recorded for my viewing pleasure. :)

[Gunny]

Sometimes ones speech can get them in trouble with the law still ("fire" in theater), and sometimes it can get you an ass kicking. I like when the latter happens, as often it's recorded for my viewing pleasure. :)

The thing is, nobody seems to get that we are under attack for speaking our minds. I don't care who those jerkoffs worship. If I want to worship my BBQ grill, f*ck them.

It's all about power, control and intolerance. You know I was about to say I wish I was still in the Marines. The wake-up call comes when remembering who the (not) commander in mediocrity is. I'd NEVER serve under him. In fact, one of the reasons I retired was I was sick of Clinton's half-assing. Had I known Bush was even running I'd have stayed in.

[jimnyc]

The thing is, nobody seems to get that we are under attack for speaking our minds. I don't care who those jerkoffs worship. If I want to worship my BBQ grill, f*ck them.

It's all about power, control and intolerance. You know I was about to say I wish I was still in the Marines. The wake-up call comes when remembering who the (not) commander in mediocrity is. I'd NEVER serve under him. In fact, one of the reasons I retired was I was sick of Clinton's half-assing. Had I known Bush was even running I'd have stayed in.

I will never temper my speech, written or verbal. And CERTAINLY not because of a whiney liberal who thinks they can dictate my actions. I may temper - cursing for example, if a lady is around. But if I saw a protestor holding a sign stating folks shouldn't ever curse, because of whatever the cause of the day, I would kindly tell her to EFF off. :)

[Gunny]

I will never temper my speech, written or verbal. And CERTAINLY not because of a whiney liberal who thinks they can dictate my actions. I may temper - cursing for example, if a lady is around. But if I saw a protestor holding a sign stating folks shouldn't ever curse, because of whatever the cause of the day, I would kindly tell her to EFF off. :)

This kind of where NT and I agree, even if he didn't think so. AND, I used to go through this crap all the time at the other board, so I DO understand some of your concerns. I was supposed to ban the NAZI's, skinheads, and anyone else the leftwingnut women found offensive; when, they themselves were just as offensive. Matter of fact, a certain Jewish, female mod got fired for it.

Let the a-holes say what they want. At least they identify themselves for the audience.

[jimnyc]

This kind of where NT and I agree, even if he didn't think so. AND, I used to go through this crap all the time at the other board, so I DO understand some of your concerns. I was supposed to ban the NAZI's, skinheads, and anyone else the leftwingnut women found offensive; when, they themselves were just as offensive. Matter of fact, a certain Jewish, female mod got fired for it.

Let the a-holes say what they want. At least they identify themselves for the audience.

That's generally been my take, let the idiots speak and give them string. It's either enjoyment, or they'll hang themselves once they get frustrated.

[Gunny]

I'm wondering how sad a commentary it is that a cop shooting a couple of terrorists is an extraordinary event. People don't like it and have backwards-assed argument why we aren't like the Romans, when if fact, we are. A stagnant society of punks who never knew how to fight. It's all supposed to be handed to them. They rob and loot the weak, but OH HELL NO don't get in a man's face.

All these weak-ass whiners who think they don't need the military, nor the police, who can't protect themselves. Clue: The police don't protect you. They figure out who murdered you. Some solace there.

I like a-holes that say what they want to. I don't have to figure out who they are. Unlike sneaky bastards that destroyed half of NYC because they don't have the balls to fight like anything but backstabbing pissants.

Editorial off. :)

[LongTermGuy]

`....Its not about cartoons with muslim radicals....Its about the rest of the civilized world not submitting and being considered "infidels"....IMO an anti-muzzy cartoon is a bonus because it speaks in "generalities" of the muslim mind-set overall ...so more power the the Lady and freedom of speech....and not worrying about "offending" radical cacaroaches....because they will always be offended as long as there is no submission to their cult of "peace" :salute:

http://www.greeleygazette.com/press/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Draw-Mohammed-day-color.jpg

[Gunny]

Got a lot of cliche's here. Walk a mile in MY boots. If you talk the talk, can you walk the walk?

I get tired of listening to people talk about how bad they are and what all they're gonna do. So do it. I might be the most outspoken but I'm not the only vet here. You get your ass out there with an M-16 face to face with someone trying to kill you. Your first clue is it ain't a video game. You don't come back to life for the next set.

What pisses me off about Pamela Gellar is I might agree with some of her sentiments, but she won't own it. She thinks she can say whatever she wants without consequence. THAT is NOT a right.

[aboutime]

Got a lot of cliche's here. Walk a mile in MY boots. If you talk the talk, can you walk the walk?

I get tired of listening to people talk about how bad they are and what all they're gonna do. So do it. I might be the most outspoken but I'm not the only vet here. You get your ass out there with an M-16 face to face with someone trying to kill you. Your first clue is it ain't a video game. You don't come back to life for the next set.

What pisses me off about Pamela Gellar is I might agree with some of her sentiments, but she won't own it. She thinks she can say whatever she wants without consequence. THAT is NOT a right.


GUNNY. OKAY. Let's see how serious you are about this. EVERYTHING you said above shouldn't have been said because somebody, like me, disagree's with you. So STOP SAYING THAT STUFF!

Is your name Pamela Gellar? Are both of you American citizens who use the 1st amendment?

I WANT BOTH OF YOU TO SHUT UP!

[LongTermGuy]

....Many who support gay rights and Gay Marriage....yet oppose anti-Mohammed muslim cartoons...are not these same folks concerned that the may be "Offending" muslims and their messiah Mohammed when they support Gay rights and Gay Marriage here in the USA?:coffee:




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz4bbqgge8

[Gunny]

GUNNY. OKAY. Let's see how serious you are about this. EVERYTHING you said above shouldn't have been said because somebody, like me, disagree's with you. So STOP SAYING THAT STUFF!

Is your name Pamela Gellar? Are both of you American citizens who use the 1st amendment?

I WANT BOTH OF YOU TO SHUT UP!

You're missing my point. I don't care WHAT she says. I honestly don't agree with her. But, I WILL defend her right to say what she wants.

[Gunny]

....Many who support gay rights and Gay Marriage....yet oppose anti-Mohammed muslim cartoons...are not these same folks concerned that the may be "Offending" muslims and their messiah Mohammed when they support Gay rights and Gay Marriage here in the USA?:coffee:




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tz4bbqgge8

They don't support gay marriage. They kill gays. But they ARE willing to use it as an excuse to divide us. Our government divides us, and so do our enemies. I don't see the difference between the two.

[aboutime]

You're missing my point. I don't care WHAT she says. I honestly don't agree with her. But, I WILL defend her right to say what she wants.


I didn't miss your point. You said it wasn't her RIGHT. To the contrary. It IS her right.

[hjmick]

Just because you can, doesn't mean you should...

[Gunny]

I didn't miss your point. You said it wasn't her RIGHT. To the contrary. It IS her right.

Nope. Never said it wasn't her right. All I said is she won't own the responsibility.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I'm wondering how sad a commentary it is that a cop shooting a couple of terrorists is an extraordinary event. People don't like it and have backwards-assed argument why we aren't like the Romans, when if fact, we are. A stagnant society of punks who never knew how to fight. It's all supposed to be handed to them. They rob and loot the weak, but OH HELL NO don't get in a man's face.

All these weak-ass whiners who think they don't need the military, nor the police, who can't protect themselves. Clue: The police don't protect you. They figure out who murdered you. Some solace there.

I like a-holes that say what they want to. I don't have to figure out who they are. Unlike sneaky bastards that destroyed half of NYC because they don't have the balls to fight like anything but backstabbing pissants.

Editorial off. :)

Our liberal schools teach Appeasement 101, Cowardice Is Good 102 and America Is Always Wrong 103, so when scum like those ffing muzzies try their sh!t and get blown away by TEXAS COP--
IT IS TIME TO TAKE NOTE, CELEBRATE AND SPEAK OPENLY ABOUT WHAT ISLAM TRULY IS...

MY TAKE ON ISLAM IS AND HAS BEEN EVER SINCE 9/11-- FFKK THEM AND LETS STAMP 'EM OUT.....
COCKROACHES ARE BETTER COMPANY THAN ARE SUCH MURDERING BRAIN-DEAD FFING SCUM IMHO...

Yet the obama can not even say the words muslim terrorists.
Strange that, since he desperately wants to give Iran damn nukes..
Something in that damn equation simply does not compute!-Tyr

[Kathianne]

Got a lot of cliche's here. Walk a mile in MY boots. If you talk the talk, can you walk the walk?

I get tired of listening to people talk about how bad they are and what all they're gonna do. So do it. I might be the most outspoken but I'm not the only vet here. You get your ass out there with an M-16 face to face with someone trying to kill you. Your first clue is it ain't a video game. You don't come back to life for the next set.

What pisses me off about Pamela Gellar is I might agree with some of her sentiments, but she won't own it. She thinks she can say whatever she wants without consequence. THAT is NOT a right.

I disagree. She knew the contest would be an incitement. She hired more security. Now she has hired even more. Truth is this is one time I really miss some liberals here, we mostly agree on this topic.

At another site I've been arguing pro-first amendment, as has been my wont for years. I remember how pissed people would get when I said that flag burning was protected, though the 'burner' better be ready for someone who would be willing to be arrested for trying to silence their 'burning.'

Geller was ready as she could be, with her 'protestors' being willing to kill, not just hit.

MLK wrote 'A Letter From Birmingham Jail,' fully cognizant that his peaceful 'provocations' had reactions that had led to lynchings, and might end his own life.

I don't know how many saw or read about Alan Dershowitz on FOX last night, but it's worth reading:

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/05/08/dershowitz-gellers-contest-similar-to-provocations-of-mlk-during-civil-rights-struggle/


On her Thursday night “The Kelly File” program on the Fox News Channel, host Megyn Kelly hosted a discussion between famed legal scholar Alan Dershowitz and National Review editor Rich Lowry.During the discussion, Dershowitz noted the “provocative” nature of Pamela Geller’s “Draw Mohammed” event last week in Garland, TX and that in some ways, that provocation is similar to the provocation civil rights activist Martin Luther King, Jr. employed. However, he was very careful to not to draw a moral or legal equivalence.

Partial transcript as follows:


KELLY: In America, we stand for liberty and freedom to offend, to provoke, to persuade, and to defy. Alan Dershowitz is a Harvard law professor and author of “Taking The Stand: My Life In The Law,” and Rich Lowry is the editor of National Review, a syndicated columnist, and a Fox News contributor. Alan, let me start with you.

DERSHOWITZ: Let me start with you and applaud your statement. It was fantastic. It’s the paradigm of the way Americans have to look at our freedoms and our First Amendment. Jefferson would have been proud of you.

KELLY: Thank you so much. Wow, that’s high praise. I think on this show last night, we went through Eugene Volokh. There’s not a more respected scholar who made very clear this is free speech what happened down in Texas, even if you don’t like the speech. He took it a step further and said the speech is valuable and should have been done. Those who say you shouldn’t, he took that on. Do you agree with that?

DERSHOWITZ: Right. The speech is tasteless, provocative, but it has a value because it’s making the statement that violent extremists aren’t going to set the boundaries of free speech in this country. This is a country where literally nothing is sacred. And if we’re going to accept an assassin’s veto in this case, we’re going to say the only exception is the image of Muhammad. That’s just perverse and that’s not what this country is about, and that’s not the way it should work.

KELLY: It’s like some people want to look at what’s offensive to some in the Muslim world. They don’t like you to draw the prophet Mohammad and say OK that will be our value, too. Well, that’s not. That is not the value of most Americans. If they want to draw Mohammad, they can.

DERSHOWITZ: I know. I agree. Look, everything that the critics of what Geller has said could be said about Martin Luther King. Now, I don’t want to make any comparisons between the two of them morally or legally, but from a constitutional law point of view, there’s no difference. Martin Luther King picked some of the cities he went to precisely in order to provoke, and bring out the racists and show what kind of violent people they are, so the world could see what is wrong with Jim Crow. It’s part of the American tradition to provoke, so that the world can see.

KELLY: Right.

DERSHOWITZ: And there is some value, but I think one has to remember the most important part of this is there’s only one group in the world today that threatens to kill people who offend them, and that is radical Muslims. . They don’t need Geller to do it. They issued fatwas against Salman Rushdie.

KELLY: Right.

DERSHOWITZ: They issued a fatwa and then murdered Theo Van Gogh. You know, Jews and Christians don’t go after and threaten to kill (inaudible) when he makes this outrageous and anti-Semitic and anti-Christian statements are made. They don’t do it to other groups. And we just cannot accept the veto by threatened extreme violence.



KELLY: So why, Rich, have we seen so many in the media rush to condemn Pam Geller and say almost nothing about the two Jihadis two tried to murder her and everyone there.

[LongTermGuy]

I disagree. She knew the contest would be an incitement. She hired more security. Now she has hired even more. Truth is this is one time I really miss some liberals here, we mostly agree on this topic.

At another site I've been arguing pro-first amendment, as has been my wont for years. I remember how pissed people would get when I said that flag burning was protected, though the 'burner' better be ready for someone who would be willing to be arrested for trying to silence their 'burning.'

Geller was ready as she could be, with her 'protestors' being willing to kill, not just hit.

MLK wrote 'A Letter From Birmingham Jail,' fully cognizant that his peaceful 'provocations' had reactions that had led to lynchings, and might end his own life.

I don't know how many saw or read about Alan Dershowitz on FOX last night, but it's worth reading:

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/05/08/dershowitz-gellers-contest-similar-to-provocations-of-mlk-during-civil-rights-struggle/


`Of course she Knew....She Knew how these muslim radical cacaroaches would respond to shut everybody up...thus more security...and it worked...plus we got leads "through their confiscated computers" and probably saved more lives...
....​Like I said before...Its not about the cartoons...Its about us...they will always attack us..As soon their children are born they are thought to hate the western world...and become jihadist...the cult of islam is a cancer...the truth is in their `one` koran which all read...dont be fooled ...
~ Lying (Taqiyya and Kitman) ~

`Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences."
There are two forms of lying to non-believers that are permitted under certain circumstances, taqiyya and kitman. These circumstances are typically those that advance the cause Islam - in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their <nobr>vulnerability (http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/011-taqiyya.htm#)</nobr> and defeat them. `

*The whole civilized world should be drawing pictures....to `draw` these (infesting) roaches out..and put them down when needed...*worrying about "offending"... insulting a cancerous cult that wants to kill you "anyway" is ridiculous.... *sooner or latter the naive thinkers will have to face the reality of the cancer....There is no other way...they choose their fate.....

[Gunny]

I disagree. She knew the contest would be an incitement. She hired more security. Now she has hired even more. Truth is this is one time I really miss some liberals here, we mostly agree on this topic.

At another site I've been arguing pro-first amendment, as has been my wont for years. I remember how pissed people would get when I said that flag burning was protected, though the 'burner' better be ready for someone who would be willing to be arrested for trying to silence their 'burning.'

Geller was ready as she could be, with her 'protestors' being willing to kill, not just hit.

MLK wrote 'A Letter From Birmingham Jail,' fully cognizant that his peaceful 'provocations' had reactions that had led to lynchings, and might end his own life.

I don't know how many saw or read about Alan Dershowitz on FOX last night, but it's worth reading:

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/05/08/dershowitz-gellers-contest-similar-to-provocations-of-mlk-during-civil-rights-struggle/

I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with. I said I don't agree with her. I only agree she has the Right. I get pissed at a-holes that burn the flag. Or the latest stomping on it. I'd like to kick their collective asses. I DO understand that it is protected.

My point is you can say or do what you want but you're accountable. It's called personal responsibility. Something no one seems to get anymore.

I know exactly what Pamela Geller was trying to do, besides getting her name in the grade. While I can agree with some of the things she says, and get the spirit of what she's trying to do, I don't agree with her tactics and watching her on the news she comes off as a harsh bitch.

BUT ... just how much of this crap do we have to take? It boils down to "you can call me names and I can't say anything back."

[Kathianne]

I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with. I said I don't agree with her. I only agree she has the Right. I get pissed at a-holes that burn the flag. Or the latest stomping on it. I'd like to kick their collective asses. I DO understand that it is protected.

My point is you can say or do what you want but you're accountable. It's called personal responsibility. Something no one seems to get anymore.

I know exactly what Pamela Geller was trying to do, besides getting her name in the grade. While I can agree with some of the things she says, and get the spirit of what she's trying to do, I don't agree with her tactics and watching her on the news she comes off as a harsh bitch.

BUT ... just how much of this crap do we have to take? It boils down to "you can call me names and I can't say anything back."

I do think we agree, I just don't know exactly what you want her to say regarding 'personal responsibility.'

I actually think that extreme Islamiscists are very clear, "You do what we say or we'll kill you." We on the other hand are saying, "Just words or drawings and we will say them and draw them, as we please."

It's the left that is blaming Geller for the actions of those who wanted to kill. They are willing that everyone should give up their 1st amendment rights, to make 'friends' with the Islamacists. It won't work.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I do think we agree, I just don't know exactly what you want her to say regarding 'personal responsibility.'

I actually think that extreme Islamiscists are very clear, "You do what we say or we'll kill you." We on the other hand are saying, "Just words or drawings and we will say them and draw them, as we please."

It's the left that is blaming Geller for the actions of those who wanted to kill. They are willing that everyone should give up their 1st amendment rights, to make 'friends' with the Islamacists. It won't work.

Damn straight it will not work, they prove appeasement only excites them to demand more and more and more--UNTIL
finally one wakes to find they are enslaved or about to be murdered for not be muslim enough!
I call anybody alive a damn fool that fails to see that they are far worse than ever were the Nazi's.....-Tyr

[Gunny]

I do think we agree, I just don't know exactly what you want her to say regarding 'personal responsibility.'

I actually think that extreme Islamiscists are very clear, "You do what we say or we'll kill you." We on the other hand are saying, "Just words or drawings and we will say them and draw them, as we please."

It's the left that is blaming Geller for the actions of those who wanted to kill. They are willing that everyone should give up their 1st amendment rights, to make 'friends' with the Islamacists. It won't work.

I completely agree in regard to extremist Islamics. Their way or the highway. My only comment about Geller is she's into throwing stuff in people's faces. Just a comment, nothing more. What I DON'T like is the big deal being made out of Texas when you can tell by listening to her she's a Jew from NY. Take your snowbird ass back where you came from and start shit.

You get a bunch of Texas rednecks riled up and you'll have a war we don't need the Federal wimpy gov't to conduct.

[Kathianne]

I completely agree in regard to extremist Islamics. Their way or the highway. My only comment about Geller is she's into throwing stuff in people's faces. Just a comment, nothing more. What I DON'T like is the big deal being made out of Texas when you can tell by listening to her she's a Jew from NY. Take your snowbird ass back where you came from and start shit.

You get a bunch of Texas rednecks riled up and you'll have a war we don't need the Federal wimpy gov't to conduct.

She chose the venue for the reason that Muslims held a "Stand Up For The Prophet" rally there last January.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jan/18/stand-with-prophet-event-in-texas-draws-thousands-/

Notice there were only protestors, not killers.

[Gunny]

She chose the venue for the reason that Muslims held a "Stand Up For The Prophet" rally there last January.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jan/18/stand-with-prophet-event-in-texas-draws-thousands-/

Notice there were only protestors, not killers.

Ah. Some background. So it's okay to stand up for the pedophile but if you're Christian you die?

I still don't like her, but I DO get your point.