Wrongful Convictions

[indago]

From The New York Times 16 February 2015:
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When prosecutors cheat and lie repeatedly to win convictions, should their office be held accountable?

When a man spends years, or decades, in prison as a result of such prosecutorial misconduct, should he be compensated?

And yet in a bizarre 2011 ruling, five justices of the Supreme Court managed to answer no to both, essentially closing off one of the only ways to hold prosecutors and their offices liable for wrongdoing.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/16/opinion/how-to-force-prosecutors-to-play-fair.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0)


Justice • the quality of being fair and reasonable


With that kind of "Justice", who needs a Supreme Court?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

From The New York Times 16 February 2015:
----------------------------------------------------------------
When prosecutors cheat and lie repeatedly to win convictions, should their office be held accountable?

When a man spends years, or decades, in prison as a result of such prosecutorial misconduct, should he be compensated?

And yet in a bizarre 2011 ruling, five justices of the Supreme Court managed to answer no to both, essentially closing off one of the only ways to hold prosecutors and their offices liable for wrongdoing.
----------------------------------------------------------------

article (http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/16/opinion/how-to-force-prosecutors-to-play-fair.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0)


Justice • the quality of being fair and reasonable


With that kind of "Justice", who needs a Supreme Court?

How did the socialist, lYing scum obama installed on the SCOTUS vote????

[indago]

How did the socialist, lYing scum obama installed on the SCOTUS vote????

THOMAS, J., delivered the opinion of the Court, in which ROBERTS, C. J., and SCALIA, KENNEDY, and ALITO, JJ., joined. SCALIA, J., filed a concurring opinion, in which ALITO, J., joined.

GINSBURG, J., filed a dissenting opinion, in which BREYER, SOTOMAYOR, and KAGAN, JJ., joined.

[fj1200]

How did the socialist, lYing scum obama installed on the SCOTUS vote????


... dissenting opinion, ... SOTOMAYOR, and KAGAN... joined.

And?

[indago]

From The Associated Press 12 April 2015:
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The city of Los Angeles agreed to pay $8 million to a man who spent 17 years in prison for a murder he didn't commit. The settlement with Obie Anthony was reached last month in his lawsuit against Los Angeles Police detectives and the city for wrongful imprisonment... Lawyers later showed that a pimp who was a key witness had lied and prosecutors had not disclosed an agreement with him for a lighter sentence in exchange for his testimony.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_MURDER_OVERTURNED_LAWSUIT?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-04-12-19-58-37)

Eight million Bux...

That's a lot of cash; and there's more to come. You would think that the folks there would finally get tired of paying out for the corruption of their law enforcement personnel and demand that they all be fired, and removed from office.

[darin]

Part of the issue is this: So many americans are idiots. The Lawyers use logical fallacy for their arguments and Juries eat it up.

[indago]

Journalist Denise Lavoie wrote for The Associated Press 10 February 2016:
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George Perrot was convicted of raping 78-year-old Mary Prekop in her Springfield home in 1985. Last month, Judge Robert Kane granted Perrot a new trial after finding that an FBI agent's testimony about microscopic hair evidence was flawed. The agent said in no uncertain terms that a hair found in the victim's home was a match for Perrot's. ...The judge said there were other problems at Perrot's trial. Prekop repeatedly described the man who beat and raped her as a man without any facial hair. On the night of the attack, Nov. 30, 1985, Perrot had a beard and a mustache.

Prekop refused to identify Perrot as her attacker in a lineup. When she was shown his lineup photo during his trial and asked if he was her attacker, she replied, "How can I say it when this man has a mustache and a beard?"

...Perrot's case for a new trial was championed by lawyers from The Innocence Project and the Schuster Institute for Investigative Journalism at Brandeis University in Waltham.
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_FLAWED_EVIDENCE_NEW_TRIAL?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-02-10-19-02-04)

Three decades in prison, and he didn't even look like the perp. Case upon case, these lies and corruptions are being uncovered, while the REAL perp goes free to commit further devastations.

[aboutime]

Part of the issue is this: So many americans are idiots. The Lawyers use logical fallacy for their arguments and Juries eat it up.


dmp. RIGHT ON THE MARK. Lawyers (Defense lawyers) are able to LIE without worry. That logical fallacy is what most JURY members will never understand.

Sad thing is. Criminals of all kinds DO NOT HAVE TO PROVE they are innocent. Only the Prosecution must PROVE they are guilty. Lawyers make their FEE whether they win or lose. PERIOD.

[darin]

Same reason politicians get fockers to vote for them. Human nature is fundamentally susceptible to lies. Democrats today FEED lies to people. They massage their lies into things that trigger 'feel-goods' in the population. And people eat that shit up.

[aboutime]

Same reason politicians get fockers to vote for them. Human nature is fundamentally susceptible to lies. Democrats today FEED lies to people. They massage their lies into things that trigger 'feel-goods' in the population. And people eat that shit up.


Which also explains why Democrats always use the children, and education excuses to convince the UN-educated to vote for them. Dems need people to REMAIN uninformed, uneducated, and always dependent on getting STUFF FOR NOTHING. That's what gets Dems the most votes.

[indago]

From The New York Times 12 February 2016:
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In 2015, 149 people convicted of crimes large and small — from capital murder to burglary — were exonerated. It is the highest yearly total since this grim form of record-keeping began, in 1989. In that time, there have been at least 1,733 exonerations across the country, and the pace keeps picking up. ...The individual cost to those wrongly convicted is steep: Last year’s group spent an average of more than 14 years behind bars. Five had been sentenced to death.

...Official misconduct — including perjury, withholding of exculpatory evidence and coercive interrogation practices — occurred in three of every four exonerations involving homicide, and it was an important factor in many other cases as well.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/13/opinion/prisoners-exonerated-prosecutors-exposed.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=0)

[fj1200]

I wonder the racial makeup of those exonerated.

[indago]

I wonder the racial makeup of those exonerated.

Mostly blacks that I have seen in the news...

[fj1200]

Mostly blacks that I have seen in the news...


What is the racial breakdown of exonerees?


More than 70% are people of color (African American, Latino or Asian) while the remainder are white. The exact racial breakdown of DNA exonerees is here (http://www.innocenceproject.org/free-innocent/improve-the-law/fact-sheets/dna-exonerations-nationwide).
http://www.innocenceproject.org/faqs/what-is-the-racial-breakdown-of-exonerees

[indago]

Rick Rojas wrote for The New York Times 4 March 2016:
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A judge who had previously thrown out a jury’s award to a New York City man who was wrongly convicted of rape and imprisoned for over 20 years ruled on Friday that the judgment should be reduced by more than $6 million.

A jury in 2010 awarded $18.5 million to Alan Newton, who was found guilty in 1985 of rape, robbery and assault in a case built largely on eyewitness testimony. He was cleared by DNA evidence and released from prison in 2006.

On Friday, United States District Court Judge Shira A. Scheindlin reduced the award to $12 million, after comparing amounts awarded others who had been wrongfully convicted.
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/05/nyregion/judge-reduces-mans-wrongful-conviction-award-to-12-million.html?ref=todayspaper)

[revelarts]

And to make it worse the real criminals are often never caught.

[indago]

Journalist Jennifer Peltz wrote for The Associated Press 23 March 2016:
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Richard Rosario thought he'd quickly clear himself of suspicion in a New York City killing when he gave police the names of 13 people who could vouch he was in Florida when the shooting happened. Instead, he was arrested, found guilty and imprisoned for 20 years...
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CONVICTIONS_QUESTIONED?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-03-23-00-56-55)

[indago]

Journalist Michael Tarm wrote for The Associated Press 18 April 2016:
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Jack McCullough awoke a few months into his life sentence for the 1957 slaying of an Illinois schoolgirl as his cellmate plunged a shank fashioned from a toothbrush into his face, eventually dislodging his eye.

Multiple inmates had vowed to kill him to avenge Maria Ridulph, he said in phone interviews Sunday and Monday, and his bunkmate was seeking to make good on that pledge. Court records show his cellmate was convicted in the attack, in which McCullough said surgeons at a Chicago hospital were able to save his eye.

McCullough, a former police officer and security guard in Washington state, was released from prison on Friday after a judge vacated his 2012 conviction the same day based on a chief prosecutor's finding that he was 40 miles away when the 7-year-old was abducted, so he couldn't be the killer. The 76-year-old spoke to The Associated Press about his four years behind bars and what comes next: a lawsuit against the state of Illinois.

...A scathing report from Dekalb County State's Attorney Richard Schmack in March described the investigation and trial of McCullough as deeply flawed, zeroing in on what he described as investigators' erroneous statements to a grand jury that altered the known timeline of events to render McCullough's alibi moot.

...Now that he is out, McCullough says one of his missions is to highlight what he alleges is a prosecutorial culture of winning at all costs, even in cases like his where evidence doesn't point to guilt.

And a lawsuit would help ensure the state will pay a monetary price for what he and his family went through, especially his wife, who was left on her own in Washington state when he was arrested, he said.

..."They didn't just punish me, they punished ... my whole family. I want the state to be (held) responsible."
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_1957_KILLING_MCCULLOUGH_INTERVIEW?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-04-18-21-40-57)

The State of Illinois can hardly afford to be paying out BigBux for recompense, but I hope he wins a large settlement.

[Gunny]

Lucky me. I found another long, drawn out, neverending indago thread. :rolleyes:

[fj1200]

Lucky me. I found another long, drawn out, neverending indago thread. :rolleyes:

:confused: It's on topic and not another thread about the same thing.

[indago]

Lucky me. I found another long, drawn out, neverending indago thread. :rolleyes:

Well, BULLY for you! Now, maybe you can get somebody to read it to you.

[aboutime]

Well, BULLY for you! Now, maybe you can get somebody to read it to you.


Maybe somebody can teach you to have an original thought, or make an original statement WITHOUT resorting to, and advertising for the ASSOCIATED PRESS.

Your limited search, and dependence on ONE source of biased information is Laughable at best.

[Gunny]

Well, BULLY for you! Now, maybe you can get somebody to read it to you.

I read just fine. If it's worth reading. I come on here to interact with other people, not read some AP regurgitation. I can find them on my own without your help. All you do is bot this board with crap someone else wrote. And it's always one-sided.

Try growing a mind. That thing between your ears? You can actually make it work if you try.

[Elessar]

Well, BULLY for you! Now, maybe you can get somebody to read it to you.

I have a feeling you could not put up a self-felt dissertation
even it was "Jack and Jill Went Up the Hill".

All you do is cut, paste, and run.

[Gunny]

I have a feeling you could not put up a self-felt dissertation
even it was "Jack and Jill Went Up the Hill".

All you do is cut, paste, and run.

:laugh2:/ Sorry. I got to spread it around. THAT is spot on and funny as Hell. :laugh2:

[indago]

I read just fine. If it's worth reading. I come on here to interact with other people, not read some AP regurgitation. I can find them on my own without your help. All you do is bot this board with crap someone else wrote. And it's always one-sided.

Try growing a mind. That thing between your ears? You can actually make it work if you try.

And you are — let's see, the reciprocal of 1408 = 0.00071 — 0.07% of the members here...


An analogy: Pissing into the wind...

[indago]

Maybe somebody can teach you to have an original thought, or make an original statement WITHOUT resorting to, and advertising for the ASSOCIATED PRESS.

Your limited search, and dependence on ONE source of biased information is Laughable at best.

Really galls ya, don't it...

[aboutime]

Really galls ya, don't it...


Not at all. I find it more representative, and laughable of a person who must always bring someone else's idea's, and words here. Never bothering to post any kind of ORIGINAL, thoughtful words of your own. So...I enjoy laughing. You call that gall? Good for you...also not very original.

[Gunny]

And you are — let's see, the reciprocal of 1408 = 0.00071 — 0.07% of the members here...


An analogy: Pissing into the wind...

You think people actually read your regurgitated AP crap? :laugh: Dipstick. They say the same thing I did .. "great another indago thread of someone else's opinions". Your crap might get read when one of us is bored.

And while you're doing numbers, how about you figure out what percentage of ACTIVE members who contribute DAILY that I am? You can't even do math without adding a swerve.

[Elessar]

:laugh2:/ Sorry. I got to spread it around. THAT is spot on and funny as Hell. :laugh2:

Be My Guest!

There are others here whose focus and views I do not agree with,
but I respect them

Cut, Paste, and Run without commentary is TROLLING and chicken shit.

[indago]

:confused: It's on topic and not another thread about the same thing.

Yes, it's a shame that Gunny, aboutime, and Elessar condone these horrific practices perpetrated upon those individuals.

22 November 1998, Journalist Bill Moushey began a ten part series for the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette entitled Win At All Cost, where he exposed practices of misconduct by malicious prosecutors.

He began with: "Hundreds of times during the past 10 years, federal agents and prosecutors have pursued justice by breaking the law. They lied, hid evidence, distorted facts, engaged in cover-ups, paid for perjury and set up innocent people in a relentless effort to win indictments, guilty pleas and convictions, a two-year Post-Gazette investigation found. Rarely were these federal officials punished for their misconduct. Rarely did they admit their conduct was wrong. New laws and court rulings that encourage federal law enforcement officers to press the boundaries of their power while providing few safeguards against abuse fueled their actions. Victims of this misconduct sometimes lost their jobs, assets and even families. Some remain in prison because prosecutors withheld favorable evidence or allowed fabricated testimony. Some criminals walk free as a reward for conspiring with the government in its effort to deny others their rights."

[Gunny]

Yes, it's a shame that Gunny, aboutime, and Elessar condone these horrific practices perpetrated upon those individuals.

22 November 1998, Journalist Bill Moushey began a ten part series for the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette entitled Win At All Cost, where he exposed practices of misconduct by malicious prosecutors.

He began with: "Hundreds of times during the past 10 years, federal agents and prosecutors have pursued justice by breaking the law. They lied, hid evidence, distorted facts, engaged in cover-ups, paid for perjury and set up innocent people in a relentless effort to win indictments, guilty pleas and convictions, a two-year Post-Gazette investigation found. Rarely were these federal officials punished for their misconduct. Rarely did they admit their conduct was wrong. New laws and court rulings that encourage federal law enforcement officers to press the boundaries of their power while providing few safeguards against abuse fueled their actions. Victims of this misconduct sometimes lost their jobs, assets and even families. Some remain in prison because prosecutors withheld favorable evidence or allowed fabricated testimony. Some criminals walk free as a reward for conspiring with the government in its effort to deny others their rights."

I don't condone any "horrific" practices. Did you miss the part where I'm picking on YOU and haven't read a damned thing you've cut n pasted? If you want to have an actual discussion on the topic, fine.

I can't stand the unfairness of our legal system. Especially the part where ADA's will find the most likely person and go for a conviction just to get one. I also can't stand the courts refusing to review cases. I don't like cops.

I also don't like people that can't speak for themselves and come on boards like bots and cut and paste other peoples' crap.

[indago]

I also don't like people that can't speak for themselves and come on boards like bots and cut and paste other peoples' crap.

Yes, that's what I said. It's "crap" to you the exposing of what prosecutors do to obtain convictions. Too bad you don't like an expose of this magnitude. Probably too deep for you anyway...

[Gunny]

Yes, that's what I said. It's "crap" to you the exposing of what prosecutors do to obtain convictions. Too bad you don't like an expose of this magnitude. Probably too deep for you anyway...

It has nothing to do with what I do or don't like about the topic. It has to do with I do or don't like about your cut n pasting post after post in your threads. I can look crap up online without any help from you. If you'd like to put on your big boy panties and discuss the issue, we can go.

The problem you have is being just flat ass dumb. You and I agree on the topic, same as abusive cops, we just don't agree on your 2nd grade level of delivery. You preach and don't listen. I don't like one-way conversations. Nobody died and made your plagaristic ass God. Try getting a personality. It works.

[indago]

Nobody died and made your plagaristic ass God.


"plagaristic"???

plagiarism: the practice of taking someone else's work or ideas and passing them off as one's own.

Point out where I have done that!

[Gunny]

"plagaristic"???

plagiarism: the practice of taking someone else's work or ideas and passing them off as one's own.

Point out where I have done that!

I'm sorry. Did I compliment you as a plagarist? That would actually take some effort, personality and work. I guess I should have accused you of being a bot.

[indago]

I'm sorry. Did I compliment you as a plagarist? That would actually take some effort, personality and work. I guess I should have accused you of being a bot.

And did you point out where I have done any plagiarism? Of course not.

I thought that Bill Moushey's work in exposing corrupt prosecutors was pretty important and that he deserved to be recognized and lauded for his work. So, I presented it here. But it is obviously WAY over your head, so you go back to picking your nose, and putting one thumb in your mouth and the other up your ass, and switching thumbs from time to time.

[indago]

It has nothing to do with what I do or don't like about the topic. It has to do with I do or don't like about your cut n pasting post after post in your threads. I can look crap up online without any help from you. If you'd like to put on your big boy panties and discuss the issue, we can go.

The problem you have is being just flat ass dumb. You and I agree on the topic, same as abusive cops, we just don't agree on your 2nd grade level of delivery. You preach and don't listen. I don't like one-way conversations. Nobody died and made your plagaristic ass God. Try getting a personality. It works.

Talk about PREACHING (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?48705-Wrongful-Convictions&p=812019#post812019)...

[Gunny]

Talk about PREACHING (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?48705-Wrongful-Convictions&p=812019#post812019)...

Those two sentences got you all screwed up, huh? Nothing I post is half a page of someone else's words.

[indago]

Those two sentences got you all screwed up, huh? Nothing I post is half a page of someone else's words.

You probably couldn't find "someone else's words" to post anyway...

[indago]

I don't condone any "horrific" practices.

So, then, what is your take on the prosecution of Richard Rosario, and the reliability of eyewitness testimony when "No forensic or physical evidence tied Rosario to the crime", and thirteen people vouched for him being elsewhere during the perpetration of the crime, and not only elsewhere, but over one thousand miles away?

[Gunny]

You probably couldn't find "someone else's words" to post anyway...

Why would I want to? If I post a link it's to support MY argument and at best you might get 2 paragraphs. I don't drone around and regurgitate someone else's. I don't have my personal little threads bot-ing AP page after page just to stick shit on the board.

You're missing the main point. People come on here to interact with one another, not read what you can cut n paste.

[Gunny]

So, then, what is your take on the prosecution of Richard Rosario, and the reliability of eyewitness testimony when "No forensic or physical evidence tied Rosario to the crime", and thirteen people vouched for him being elsewhere during the perpetration of the crime, and not only elsewhere, but over one thousand miles away?

I don't know. I'm not a firm believer in forensic science when DA's make up stories to support it. The be all - end all now is forensics but I've seen repeated creations of stories around it, rather than using the facts. And trust me, I'm always watching forensic/crime shows. That and old movies is pretty much all I watch. I don't like a lot of what I see.

I also am consistently on record over the years for believing in the law, but not the way our justice system carries it out. Back when I was younger, I was quite outspoken. My OWN opinion, in threads where the topic comes up. I don't have multi-page bot threads of someone else's work.

[indago]

I don't know. I'm not a firm believer in forensic science when DA's make up stories to support it. The be all - end all now is forensics but I've seen repeated creations of stories around it, rather than using the facts. And trust me, I'm always watching forensic/crime shows. That and old movies is pretty much all I watch. I don't like a lot of what I see.

I also am consistently on record over the years for believing in the law, but not the way our justice system carries it out. Back when I was younger, I was quite outspoken. My OWN opinion, in threads where the topic comes up. I don't have multi-page bot threads of someone else's work.

Then you would make the poster the subject matter of your argument rather than the actual subject matter of the thread, or post. That says a lot about your "personality".

[indago]

From The New York Times 21 April 2016:
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New York City has agreed to pay $40 million to settle civil rights lawsuits filed by five people who claimed they were wrongfully convicted of murder in the Bronx and who each spent more than 17 years in prison... The plaintiffs are to receive $8 million each to resolve their lawsuits, which accused two police detectives of misconduct in the way the murders were investigated. ...The settlements continue a pattern in which New York City has been resolving civil rights lawsuits, some stemming from cases that date back years and in which the city faced the risk of potentially high damages.

...“It is their hope that this settlement will shed light on the flawed police practices which resulted in their wrongful convictions and the wrongful convictions of so many others”
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article (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/nyregion/new-york-city-settling-with-5-over-wrongful-murder-convictions-in-bronx.html?ref=todayspaper)

[Gunny]

Then you would make the poster the subject matter of your argument rather than the actual subject matter of the thread, or post. That says a lot about your "personality".

No, goofball, I look athe reason for the subject matter. THAT says a lot about my personality. If you're looking for a fight, I'll give you one.

You're dumber than shit. I don't like cops and I don't like our justice system. Neother do you. Only your dumb ass ass could figure out some way to pick a fight with me on the topic. So who's the REAL idiot here? At least my posts aren't just cut n paste bullshit.

Discuss the topic or get off my damned line. I don't need jackasses firing blanks. Man up or shut up.

[indago]

No, goofball, I look athe reason for the subject matter. THAT says a lot about my personality. If you're looking for a fight, I'll give you one.

You're dumber than shit. I don't like cops and I don't like our justice system. Neother do you. Only your dumb ass ass could figure out some way to pick a fight with me on the topic. So who's the REAL idiot here? At least my posts aren't just cut n paste bullshit.

Discuss the topic or get off my damned line. I don't need jackasses firing blanks. Man up or shut up.

Back atcha...

[indago]

The original court assigned public defender filed a motion for funds to travel to Florida to investigate the statements of the thirteen witnesses, obtained the funds, and then begged off the case. The new public defender didn't follow up on interviewing them, but got two of the witnesses to testify, but the prosecutor dismissed them as friends of the accused and unreliable. So, Richard Rosario spent twenty years in prison trying to find a way to extricate himself from this situation while the real perp goes free to further his criminal activities.

Investigation (http://www.nbcnews.com/pages/conviction)

[Gunny]

The original court assigned public defender filed a motion for funds to travel to Florida to investigate the statements of the thirteen witnesses, obtained the funds, and then begged off the case. The new public defender didn't follow up on interviewing them, but got two of the witnesses to testify, but the prosecutor dismissed them as friends of the accused and unreliable. So, Richard Rosario spent twenty years in prison trying to find a way to extricate himself from this situation while the real perp goes free to further his criminal activities.

Investigation (http://www.nbcnews.com/pages/conviction)

You're entitled to as much "justice" as you can afford in this country.

[indago]

You're entitled to as much "justice" as you can afford in this country.

It wasn't so much a matter of money in this case, but a matter of the justice system would not listen.

[Gunny]

It wasn't so much a matter of money in this case, but a matter of the justice system would not listen.

I agree. And try to get a reversal on a conviction. Good luck with THAT.

[indago]

Journalist Bill Draper wrote for The Associated Press 10 May 2016:
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A Kansas man who spent 15 years in prison for a rape and murder to which his brother confessed several times, including in suicide notes, filed a federal lawsuit on Tuesday alleging he was framed by investigators, prosecutors and his brother's attorney. ...The suit is an attempt to find out why investigators wanted to pin the crimes on Floyd Bledsoe, who was 23 at the time and the father of two young sons, and to hold those people accountable...
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article (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_WRONGFULLY_IMPRISONED_LAWSUIT?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-05-10-17-53-16)

[Gunny]

It wasn't so much a matter of money in this case, but a matter of the justice system would not listen.

It is and isn't that the justice system doesn't listen. They have selective hearing. The ADA's want to be the DA. The DA wants to be governor. They get there on their conviction rate.