Australian Navy sailors sacked over anti-Islamic remarks

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

http://zeenews.india.com/news/world/australian-navy-sailors-sacked-over-anti-islamic-remarks_923086.html


Australian Navy sailors sacked over anti-Islamic remarks

Melbourne: Several Australian Navy sailors have been sacked or ordered to justify their jobs after allegedly posting 'anti-Islamic' comments on social media.

The Royal Australian Navy (RAN) said the decision was a follow up from January media reports which led to an internal probe into the fact some sailors engaged in Operation Sovereign Borders had been posting anti-Islamic comments on social media.

"Several sailors have had their employment terminated or have been issued with notices of cause for termination. Others have received a range of disciplinary punishments or other administrative sanctions including formal warnings and either formal or informal counselling depending on the circumstances of the case," the RAN said in a statement.







"Inappropriate behaviour on social media is unacceptable in Navy because of the damage it causes to others and the impact it can have on us successfully achieving our mission," it said.

The reports had claimed at least 20 of them were members of the Australian Defence League, an anti-Islamic group affiliated with the English Defence League, which has often led violent street marches in the UK.

A statement released today by Chief of Navy Vice Admiral Ray Griggs said that while no serving member of the Navy has been found to be a member of the Australian Defence League, a number of personnel have been found to have made inappropriate comment on social media or to have an affiliation with different social media groups that are not consistent with Navy values.

It said due to the Privacy Act, the Navy "cannot provide specific information on the outcome of the individual cases that have been investigated, particularly where individuals have been named or 'outed' in the public domain

Folks, I keep telling you this is how they do it. They work on the authority figures/leaders in nations to shill for them! To turn on their own people to placate them and their ffing demands! They demand that non-muslims give up free speech rights .. but notice how nobody makes those same demands of them !!

Don't think its not going on here in USA LIKE CRAZY BECAUSE IT IS!! OBAMA LEADS IN DOING IT TOO. A fact that I'll bet my life on and likely already have IMHO.. -Tyr

[jafar00]

Folks, I keep telling you this is how they do it. They work on the authority figures/leaders in nations to shill for them! To turn on their own people to placate them and their ffing demands! They demand that non-muslims give up free speech rights .. but notice how nobody makes those same demands of them !!

Don't think its not going on here in USA LIKE CRAZY BECAUSE IT IS!! OBAMA LEADS IN DOING IT TOO. A fact that I'll bet my life on and likely already have IMHO.. -Tyr

Despite your conspiracy theory Tyr, you just don't understand Australia.

We have standards here. As an ex Australian soldier, I can tell you that we are held to the highest standards of behaviour in public. In private we could do what we wanted. I even put on my uniform inside out and painted on a fake moustache with camo so I could pretend to be Saddam Hussein when I was in the enemy party for SAS training.

Publicly acting like bigoted fools is not in the best interests of the military.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Despite your conspiracy theory Tyr, you just don't understand Australia.

We have standards here. As an ex Australian soldier, I can tell you that we are held to the highest standards of behaviour in public. In private we could do what we wanted. I even put on my uniform inside out and painted on a fake moustache with camo so I could pretend to be Saddam Hussein when I was in the enemy party for SAS training.

Publicly acting like bigoted fools is not in the best interests of the military.



They acted like fools --ONLY-- if what they stated were lies. If truth then they are being punished to appease the Muslims and its done out of fear!! A fear this man refuses to harbor. Any true American refuses to embrace such fear. Our problem is our schools are indoctrinating our kids and turning them into ffing cowards.

A man tells me a poisonous snake is harmless I tell him to pick it up and play with it himself to prove his damn lie. When he refuses I have my answer and prove my point both..

My father didn't raise me to be a fool nor a coward.. I was born in 1954 when this nation was still great and still taught its children correctly in school = no school liberal indoctrination program running then.-Tyr

[jimnyc]

Was it in "public" or on someone's private Facebook page? Did they post it for ALL to see? It's possible their account was bolted down as much as possible and someone else shared it. Were they in uniform? I think soldiers everywhere should still have freedoms, but similar to here, I don't think they should be able to do so while in uniform.

They should have freedoms as well, but I know they should also be cautious, as they can't bring negativity to the military.

It's a tough call. But I think the main question to be asked is whether or not the comments made can possibly be confused for a stance of the military itself, or whether or not the comments put the military in a bad light.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Was it in "public" or on someone's private Facebook page? Did they post it for ALL to see? It's possible their account was bolted down as much as possible and someone else shared it. Were they in uniform? I think soldiers everywhere should still have freedoms, but similar to here, I don't think they should be able to do so while in uniform.

They should have freedoms as well, but I know they should also be cautious, as they can't bring negativity to the military.

It's a tough call. But I think the main question to be asked is whether or not the comments made can possibly be confused for a stance of the military itself, or whether or not the comments put the military in a bad light.

Ten to one says the comments were true and that's exactly why they were punished. Telling the TRUTH about Islam is forbidden. Exposing Islam's true agenda is forbidden and often gets people murdered.

Saying a child molester is a savage brute that harms and sometimes murders to cover his evil deeds will get you no punishment because they have no murdering worldwide cult protecting them.
However saying a muslim terrorist is a savage brute that with deliberate intent harms and murders innocent women and children to magnify his deed and instill far, far greater terror will get you punished !!!
Yet both are true statements.. yet only the Muslim murderer is protected and appeased by dumbass and cowardly infidels. Meanwhile the Muslims laugh at us and our stupidity in aiding them to reach their true goal. Islam rewards deceit and treachery as no other religion known to man..-Tyr

[fj1200]

Much hand wringing over...


... if...

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Much hand wringing over...

if....

Ha!! As if I could ever give a one word reply!
NO HAND WRINGING ....
Just shining a light upon the evil that the world now revels in and too damn often praises.
Those that object so adamantly to the light surely have things they too want to remain hidden IMHO. -Tyr

[jimnyc]

Was it in "public" or on someone's private Facebook page? Did they post it for ALL to see? It's possible their account was bolted down as much as possible and someone else shared it. Were they in uniform? I think soldiers everywhere should still have freedoms, but similar to here, I don't think they should be able to do so while in uniform.

They should have freedoms as well, but I know they should also be cautious, as they can't bring negativity to the military.

It's a tough call. But I think the main question to be asked is whether or not the comments made can possibly be confused for a stance of the military itself, or whether or not the comments put the military in a bad light.

MY personal view would be this:

When another person saw/read it, would they perhaps mistake it for a military and/or government stance? Would others have the military/government come to mind when seeing the comments? I personally think that should be the distinction, this way one could retain their rights regarding speech, but also know enough to not involve their employment in any manner whatsoever.

But that's my opinion, as in reality they likely gave up more rights than my opinion calls for, and probably can't voice an opinion if it's controversial or political.

I would be curious as to what specifically was said. And what others that had previously been punished had said. Perhaps calling for violence and such would be wrong, but "anti-Islamic" is a rather broad definition.

[fj1200]

Ha!! As if I could ever give a one word reply!
NO HAND WRINGING ....
Just shining a light upon the evil that the world now revels in and too damn often praises.
Those that object so adamantly to the light surely have things they too want to remain hidden IMHO. -Tyr

Uh huh.

[logroller]

They acted like fools --ONLY-- if what they stated were lies.
One can be foolish with the truth as well. Take manning or snowden for example-- they told the truth, but also they undermined national security, thereby putting American lives at risk which could easily be construed to a foolish act. Even if this didn't rise to that level, if they are given orders to do/ not do something, anything, then they are not at liberty to act in defiance because it's the truthful. The military isn't a democracy; One gives up certain rights in service to the mission. Don't like it, get out.

[Trigg]

I live in an employment at will state. I've known people who were fired at my hospital because of stupid stuff they put on facebook for all to read.

People have to be smarter than to put inflammatory things out there on social media sites.

Sure these guys have the right to think whatever they want to about Islam, putting it out there was their mistake.

[DragonStryk72]

Was it in "public" or on someone's private Facebook page? Did they post it for ALL to see? It's possible their account was bolted down as much as possible and someone else shared it. Were they in uniform? I think soldiers everywhere should still have freedoms, but similar to here, I don't think they should be able to do so while in uniform.

They should have freedoms as well, but I know they should also be cautious, as they can't bring negativity to the military.

It's a tough call. But I think the main question to be asked is whether or not the comments made can possibly be confused for a stance of the military itself, or whether or not the comments put the military in a bad light.

Unfortunately, it's not that simple, Jim. We have to watch our mouths a lot more in the military, even over here. For instance, most military members voted against Obama, but there're limits on what we can say, because he's the CIC. As for our politics, we have to be careful there as well, because if we become a problem to good order and discipline, then we could cost lives in an emergency.

We knowingly surrender some of our rights when we enlist in the military, the chief amongst the ability to just say whatever we want. That's just the way military life works, and every member of the military is aware of it, whether here or abroad.

See, it comes down to this: If there are people in those guys' squads who are Muslim, or who are friends with Muslims, then learning that your squadmate is part of a group that believes in violent protests against Muslims is going to cause a wedge, and that can easily screw the unit over.

Now, I think chucking 20 guys out over a single incident is inane, and, over here, that wouldn't have happened. Oh, they'd have gotten masted, sure, but really, they would've been put on restriction, maybe taken a paycut, and that's about it.

[jimnyc]

Unfortunately, it's not that simple, Jim. We have to watch our mouths a lot more in the military, even over here. For instance, most military members voted against Obama, but there're limits on what we can say, because he's the CIC. As for our politics, we have to be careful there as well, because if we become a problem to good order and discipline, then we could cost lives in an emergency.

We knowingly surrender some of our rights when we enlist in the military, the chief amongst the ability to just say whatever we want. That's just the way military life works, and every member of the military is aware of it, whether here or abroad.

See, it comes down to this: If there are people in those guys' squads who are Muslim, or who are friends with Muslims, then learning that your squadmate is part of a group that believes in violent protests against Muslims is going to cause a wedge, and that can easily screw the unit over.

Now, I think chucking 20 guys out over a single incident is inane, and, over here, that wouldn't have happened. Oh, they'd have gotten masted, sure, but really, they would've been put on restriction, maybe taken a paycut, and that's about it.

I agree, I clarified that part in the next post. That's just my opinions on what SHOULD be allowed by a soldier and what shouldn't. But I know one willingly gives up more than the average Joe once they sign on the dotted line.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Despite your conspiracy theory Tyr, you just don't understand Australia.

We have standards here. As an ex Australian soldier, I can tell you that we are held to the highest standards of behaviour in public. In private we could do what we wanted. I even put on my uniform inside out and painted on a fake moustache with camo so I could pretend to be Saddam Hussein when I was in the enemy party for SAS training.

Publicly acting like bigoted fools is not in the best interests of the military.



Really? Acting like bigoted fools you say!
ok, please post their comments so we may judge ,that is if you even know what they were!
Over reaction is the call for the day every time punishment is meted out to people giving their opinion on Islam!!!! Same way Islam deals with it to. Over reaction usually by killing or seriously maiming.

Australia is a goner and this just highlights that as a fact. I do not even feel sorry for damn sheeple that happily help their masters enslave them. --Tyr

[jafar00]

They acted like fools --ONLY-- if what they stated were lies. If truth then they are being punished to appease the Muslims and its done out of fear!! A fear this man refuses to harbor. Any true American refuses to embrace such fear. Our problem is our schools are indoctrinating our kids and turning them into ffing cowards.

A man tells me a poisonous snake is harmless I tell him to pick it up and play with it himself to prove his damn lie. When he refuses I have my answer and prove my point both..

My father didn't raise me to be a fool nor a coward.. I was born in 1954 when this nation was still great and still taught its children correctly in school = no school liberal indoctrination program running then.-Tyr

They didn't say any truth Tyr.

They apparently posted racist and bigoted statements. Being members of a neo-nazi group, ADL (like the EDL) I am not surprised.

Also, they violated Navy policy.


Navy has a strict social media policy that bans personnel from posting offensive material based on “personal traits, attributes, beliefs or practices that exploit, objectify or are derogatory of gender, ethnicity or religion”, Vice Admiral Griggs said.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/sailors-sacked-over-racist-and-antimuslim-facebook-posts-20140408-zqsdv.html#ixzz2yXaA4X00

[fj1200]

ok, please post their comments so we may judge ,that is if you even know what they were!
...
Australia is a goner...

You don't know what they said either and you created a whole thread to fill the vacuum with your narrative.


or 2.2%[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Australia#cite_note-1) of the total Australian population were Muslims.
:facepalm99:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

You don't know what they said either and you created a whole thread to fill the vacuum with your narrative.


:facepalm99:

This thread was started for discussion, its what people do here. I based my judgment on past deeds that punish any that dare criticize Islam what do you and others base your automatic defense on?
That you criticize me but yet had no such words for Jafar speaks volumes... Jafar immediately stated they were hate filled lies as if he had read the ACTUAL words they are punished for. At least I questioned what the words were and if they were lies or truth.

Careful pedro , your double standard is showing yet again ..

I simply love to shine light upon lies... :laugh: -Tyr

[fj1200]

This thread was started for discussion, its what people do here. I based my judgment on past deeds that punish any that dare criticize Islam what do you and others base your automatic defense on?
That you criticize me but yet had no such words for Jafar speaks volumes... Jafar immediately stated they were hate filled lies as if he had read the ACTUAL words they are punished for. At least I questioned what the words were and if they were lies or truth.

Careful pedro , your double standard is showing yet again ..

I simply love to shine light upon lies... :laugh: -Tyr

Oh get over yourself. You didn't start this thread to start a discussion, you started this thread to continue your narrative. Unless you can point the discussion starter here:


Folks, I keep telling you this is how they do it. They work on the authority figures/leaders in nations to shill for them! To turn on their own people to placate them and their ffing demands! They demand that non-muslims give up free speech rights .. but notice how nobody makes those same demands of them !!

Don't think its not going on here in USA LIKE CRAZY BECAUSE IT IS!! OBAMA LEADS IN DOING IT TOO. A fact that I'll bet my life on and likely already have IMHO.. -Tyr

But of course you can not. But please don't let anything get in the way of your message.


A man tells me a poisonous snake is harmless I tell him to pick it up and play with it himself to prove his damn lie. When he refuses I have my answer and prove my point both.


However saying a muslim terrorist is a savage brute that with deliberate intent harms and murders innocent women and children to magnify his deed and instill far, far greater terror will get you punished !!!

There quite possibly might be someone here who doesn't know your position on the "Muzzys." :rolleyes:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Oh get over yourself. You didn't start this thread to start a discussion, you started this thread to continue your narrative. Unless you can point the discussion starter here:

Really? Please do explain how any member here can start a thread then stop others from participating and carrying on a discussion.. Perhaps explain how the humble little 'ole me somehow has that magical power.. After you do that impossible miracle then explain how/why the presentation of truth riles so many here. Yet you can and will do neither IMHO.. -TYR




But of course you can not. But please don't let anything get in the way of your message.
Advice not needed pedro. I let no man get in the way of tasks I intend on doing. Only way that has ever happened is after they defeated me or stomped my ass. A task 98% that tried failed miserably at.. You see I am one of those rare creatures that not only talks the talk but also walks the walk and can back up my play regardless of who or what attempts to shut me down..-Tyr






There quite possibly might be someone here who doesn't know your position on the "Muzzys." :rolleyes:

I doubt it but just in case let me say this for the edification of all.

The Muslims are a threat to every none Muslim on this planet. They will happily murder such with a smile on their faces and joy in their deluded, evil little wicked hearts.. .
Just take a look at this thread and its linked source for examples of that..--Tyr


http://www.debatepolicy.com/forumdisplay.php?5-Religion-Ethics


http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/


Does that satisfy your desires???? Do you feel better now having read the cold hard truth?? --Tyr



You can depend on me to never let anybody attempt to belittle me or besmirch my character whether it be here or anywhere else. I didn't spend a lifetime , blood and treasure maintaining that iron core principle only to abandon it in my senior years.



"Oh get over yourself" -So you say.
Any man worth his salt got over himself when he first found that women control our lives from the day we are born until the day we die!!
No man yet has found a way not to have had a mother....--Tyr

By the way this thread is two pages so far, 18 replies and 140 views. I'd say we are having a discussion. Just not the one you like or would prefer. ;)--Tyr

[fj1200]

I'll just leave that stellar job of quoting to stand on its own and leave your own words to ponder.


So true, one can leave out important facts and completely change how the reader will look at the information.

[jimnyc]

They didn't say any truth Tyr.

They apparently posted racist and bigoted statements. Being members of a neo-nazi group, ADL (like the EDL) I am not surprised.

Also, they violated Navy policy.



Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/sailors-sacked-over-racist-and-antimuslim-facebook-posts-20140408-zqsdv.html#ixzz2yXaA4X00

I've yet to see anywhere that states what they wrote was lies. Believe it or not, even the TRUTH can be offensive to some. I could go to my Facebook page and post absolutely horrid stories that happen daily out of a few Islamic nations, and then offer my opinion afterwards as to how sick the people are that commit these acts. I've seen some, even here, talk about how certain posts are bigoted or racist, just for speaking the facts. It happens all the time when I discuss crime statistics and black folk. Simply reporting the statistics had me considered racists many a time.

I would love to know specifically what was said, and how it was found/reported. I imagine how they found out matters little in the end, as rules are rules, but to ME it would make a difference. And also different, for example, if he was showing contempt for someone who committed an act, as opposed to lashing out at ALL Muslims for little or no reason.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I'll just leave that stellar job of quoting to stand on its own and leave your own words to ponder.


Thank you for seeing wisdom in those words. However context is everything so having a good foundation upon which to make informed judgments is a must. I do not read Arabic but the Koran and accompanying religious books are already translated into English. I have a very good foundation of what Islam is and what it represents. Accusing me of ignorance will get you nowhere.
And even if that was not your intent your message did a stellar job at boomeranging back onto you. After all , you quoted a fine man.. ;)---:slap:--Tyr

Many a man sees only the greatness of his own shadow. A wise man sees the greatness hidden within the hearts of honorable men regardless of the size of their shadows, the wealth they may or may not have or the fame they may or may not have garnered.
Such a wise man shall surely see the darkest evil no matter how well concealed..... And refuse to be blinded by the ignorance or biases of others.. --Tyr

[fj1200]

And even if that was not your intent your message did a stellar job at boomeranging back onto you.

No boomerang, only the words of one who proclaims 'truth' so many times I can't count but on the other acknowledges that 'truth' can be propagandized. Can't have it both ways.

[Abbey Marie]

Am I the only one who thinks that Tyr and fj could get along well if they tried?


http://whatwillmatter.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/friendshipIsEnjoying-e1366130489100.jpg

[jafar00]

http://www.millerstime.net/wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/tol-boys_photo.jpg

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Am I the only one who thinks that Tyr and fj could get along well if they tried?


http://whatwillmatter.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/friendshipIsEnjoying-e1366130489100.jpg

I can be friends with anybody that acts right, shows respect and doesn't question my honesty and intelligence. What you see going on now is me trying. Actually is me forcing my milder self to give another man a long break. However my milder self usually eventually loses to my stronger aggressive spirit. I do not find great fault with others having differing opinions than I have but do find fault in being disrespected. That's a biggie with me. If I give a man a measure of respect he must return the favor. For not to do so shows ingratitude , lack of great insight and possibly even arrogance born of elitism. Three things that I ever so richly abhor. Just sayin'.
When one decides to question my "not so stellar job at quoting" that's disrespect that I'll not ignore.

If a man thinks his judgment is superior he should can the insults and prove the opponent wrong based upon facts not clever little sarcasms tossed out at every opportune moment..
If I refuse to endure insults face to face why would I chose to endure them on the internet after having voluntarily chosen to give a measure of respect to see how it goes? Giving respect is not demanding that a man MUST answer your questions. I am a free citizen despite the government and despite anything tossed at me by any person in real life. Only in real life people learn quickly not to trifle with me or attempt to belittle me unless they are willing to face the music..

A man may question my version of truth (many do)but he may not question my honesty, personal honor and level of intelligence. Rev disagreed with me often but never once attempted to cleverly insult me. Thus he never ever received anything but respect in return...
Here if a member continues trying to issue clever little insults I just stop engaging in my milder side..
Its then not my problem whether that person likes that or not.. --Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Quote Originally Posted by Tyr-Ziu Saxnot View Post

And even if that was not your intent your message did a stellar job at boomeranging back onto you.



No boomerang, only the words of one who proclaims 'truth' so many times I can't count but on the other acknowledges that 'truth' can be propagandized. Can't have it both ways.

Sure TRUTH can be propagandized. That's what propaganda so often is.... I authored and continue a very, very long thread here which was condemned by my opponents yet each time I asked those opponents that accused me of hate, lying and bigotry to prove those posts by me there to be lies they refused to do so or else ignored those requests. In my opinion it stands as a mark of a coward to call a man a liar when he merely posts facts garnered from other sources but then refuse to prove any of those facts to be in error(lies)...

I post no lies knowingly .. Any man thinks and proclaims I do can just kiss my ass and not expect any measure of respect coming from me..

Care to re-crank be my guest but do not toss out accusations that question my honor.
I'll not give any measure of respect to ANY MAN that does that..
I've been told that I am a very hard man but that may be .
However, I am also a very fair man.. And in my mind that makes up for my harsh attitude that leaps out at times.. -Tyr

[fj1200]

Am I the only one who thinks that Tyr and fj could get along well if they tried?

Who says we don't get along? :confused:

[fj1200]

Sure TRUTH can be propagandized. That's what propaganda so often is.... I authored and continue a very, very long thread here which was condemned by my opponents yet each time I asked those opponents that accused me of hate, lying and bigotry to prove those posts by me there to be lies they refused to do so or else ignored those requests. In my opinion it stands as a mark of a coward to call a man a liar when he merely posts facts garnered from other sources but then refuse to prove any of those facts to be in error(lies)...

I post no lies knowingly .. Any man thinks and proclaims I do can just kiss my ass and not expect any measure of respect coming from me..

Care to re-crank be my guest but do not toss out accusations that question my honor.
I'll not give any measure of respect to ANY MAN that does that..
I've been told that I am a very hard man but that may be .
However, I am also a very fair man.. And in my mind that makes up for my harsh attitude that leaps out at times.. -Tyr

Exactly my point, thank you. But my point remains that you filled a vacuum with your particular narrative in the absence of actual fact to what occurred. Now as to your thread, I don't recall stating that there was anything untrue but remember a lie by omission is still a lie.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Exactly my point, thank you. But my point remains that you filled a vacuum with your particular narrative in the absence of actual fact to what occurred. Now as to your thread, I don't recall stating that there was anything untrue but remember a lie by omission is still a lie.

A lie by omission is only a lie if the omission was intentionally engaged in to foster the lie. Otherwise its a mistake that stands to be corrected. I do not intentionally lie or deliberately omit facts to boost my presented case. It's not how I operate. The advantage in how I post is I do not have to remember thousands of lies. By posting only the truth as I judge it to be I have a shield in place at all times(quite handy that). Sure my judgment may be shown to be in error but so far nobody and I do mean nobody can show any post IVE MADE THAT IS A DELIBERATE ENGAGEMENT IN LYING ON MY PART.

I CHALLENGE anybody to TRY to do that.. Anybody..

I have no problem with you disagreeing but any words stating I deliberately lie are not and will not ever be ignored. Show me to be in error and I'll admit it openly and not take a bad attitude about doing so...
I have a blessed life now and simply will not stoop to any form of dishonor for any reason.. We all love to win but some of us would rather lose that cheapen ourselves by lying, cheating or dishonorable actions. Doesn't make me better than anybody else but does make me quite different that many others IMHO..---Tyr

[fj1200]

A lie by omission is only a lie if the omission was intentionally engaged in to foster the lie. Otherwise its a mistake that stands to be corrected. I do not intentionally lie or deliberately omit facts to boost my presented case. It's not how I operate. The advantage in how I post is I do not have to remember thousands of lies. By posting only the truth as I judge it to be I have a shield in place at all times(quite handy that). Sure my judgment may be shown to be in error but so far nobody and I do mean nobody can show any post IVE MADE THAT IS A DELIBERATE ENGAGEMENT IN LYING ON MY PART.

I CHALLENGE anybody to TRY to do that.. Anybody..

I have no problem with you disagreeing but any words stating I deliberately lie are not and will not ever be ignored. Show me to be in error and I'll admit it openly and not take a bad attitude about doing so...
I have a blessed life now and simply will not stoop to any form of dishonor for any reason.. We all love to win but some of us would rather lose that cheapen ourselves by lying, cheating or dishonorable actions. Doesn't make me better than anybody else but does make me quite different that many others IMHO..---Tyr

My point is proven then because you repeatedly state Islam is to be defined by Muslim terrorists and discount Muslims who are not terrorists.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

My point is proven then because you repeatedly state Islam is to be defined by Muslim terrorists and discount Muslims who are not terrorists.

So you contend that I discount people that I defend . Also that I constantly post are innocent victims! Here are just a few examples and there are hundreds more in that thread. I condemn the murder of these Muslims too!!! I keep having to point this out every time somebody makes an accusation as you just did. I rightly call ALL THESE VICTIMS "INNOCENT VICTIMS" . And the majority of them are Muslims being murdered by other Muslims.





http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?37131-Most-recent-muslim-terrorist-attacks


Lets do the numbers. 15+8+3+6+20+4= 56 murdered innocent people. Just more peace from that widely known religion of peace..-Tyr



Lets do those numbers. 24+13+3+30+9+11= 90 murdered innocent people !! Lets cheer this great peace Allah's servants are promoting. -Tyr


The numbers. 13+3+9+11+(3?) +2= at least 41 innocent people.. Seems Putin has distracted Obama and his muslim buddies suffer without enough bombs and bullets to murder more people!! What a shame. --Tyr





Lets do those numbers again. 6+5+1+10+6+2= 30 MURDERED INNOCENT PEOPLE!! I bet Obama will be getting calls for more supplies since the number is so low.. Imagine only 30 murdered! A disgrace. --Tyr



Lets do the numbers shall we?? 2+7+4+7+40+6= 66 murdered innocent people. --Tyr


Now if I made no distinction and lodged no complaints when its Muslims murdering fellow Muslims you would possibly have a point but that is not the case and I authored a very long thread proving that isn't the case.

Some of you people simply hate reading the truth and seek to suppress it IMHO. I yield to no such attempted action. That's called integrity.

You disagree fine but you'll not prove that I hate ALL Muslims or that my concern leaves out the majority that do not engage the worldwide murdering. I do however question the deafening silence and lack of any meaningful action taken against the murdering Islamist groups by that majority. Especially when its easily shown how quick that majority is to defend Islam with violence when its attacked in even the slightest way by non-Muslims(we infidels).

I must conclude that your powers of logical reasoning fail you greatly in this case.-Tyr

[Abbey Marie]

My point is proven then because you repeatedly state Islam is to be defined by Muslim terrorists and discount Muslims who are not terrorists.

Of course there are peaceful Muslims. The problem is that self-proclaimed Muslims commit so many violent (and terrorist) acts, even towards their own people, that the awful reputation is there and frankly, well-deserved. For just one example. Can you name another current religious group that has sworn to move towards the annihilation of a whole people?

[jafar00]

Can you name another current religious group that has sworn to move towards the annihilation of a whole people?

Either Christians or Atheists, depending on your perspective on Hitler. Then, there are the Zionist Jews who seem hell bent on wiping out the Palestinians and spend a lot of time and money demonising Muslims as a whole worldwide. You can't forget the Christians of CAR who only recently have been massacring Muslims. Also, the Buddhists of Myanmar, also killing and driving out the Muslims.

Humans are such terrible creatures.

[Gunny]

Folks, I keep telling you this is how they do it. They work on the authority figures/leaders in nations to shill for them! To turn on their own people to placate them and their ffing demands! They demand that non-muslims give up free speech rights .. but notice how nobody makes those same demands of them !!

Don't think its not going on here in USA LIKE CRAZY BECAUSE IT IS!! OBAMA LEADS IN DOING IT TOO. A fact that I'll bet my life on and likely already have IMHO.. -Tyr

Why not? It worked for Ho CHi Minh ...

[fj1200]

So you contend that I discount people that I defend . Also that I constantly post are innocent victims! Here are just a few examples and there are hundreds more in that thread. I condemn the murder of these Muslims too!!! I keep having to point this out every time somebody makes an accusation as you just did. I rightly call ALL THESE VICTIMS "INNOCENT VICTIMS" .And the majority of them are Muslims being murdered by other Muslims.

Now if I made no distinction and lodged no complaints when its Muslims murdering fellow Muslims you would possibly have a point but that is not the case and I authored a very long thread proving that isn't the case.

Some of you people simply hate reading the truth and seek to suppress it IMHO. I yield to no such attempted action. That's called integrity.

You disagree fine but you'll not prove that I hate ALL Muslims or that my concern leaves out the majority that do not engage the worldwide murdering. I do however question the deafening silence and lack of any meaningful action taken against the murdering Islamist groups by that majority. Especially when its easily shown how quick that majority is to defend Islam with violence when its attacked in even the slightest way by non-Muslims(we infidels).

I must conclude that your powers of logical reasoning fail you greatly in this case.-Tyr

Hmm all those posts are you defending Muslims? That's an interesting spin on things. That first bold might be a hint of sorts, that it's not Islam but something else.

Certainly no one can keep you from posting 'truth' but your labeling isn't accurate, it's your narrative.

I only point out that you are equally quick to condemn when 'truth' is unavailable.

[fj1200]

Of course there are peaceful Muslims. The problem is that self-proclaimed Muslims commit so many violent (and terrorist) acts, even towards their own people, that the awful reputation is there and frankly, well-deserved. For just one example. Can you name another current religious group that has sworn to move towards the annihilation of a whole people?

One would scarcely know it here.

[Gunny]

Hmm all those posts are you defending Muslims? That's an interesting spin on things. That first bold might be a hint of sorts, that it's not Islam but something else.

Certainly no one can keep you from posting 'truth' but your labeling isn't accurate, it's your narrative.

I only point out that you are equally quick to condemn when 'truth' is unavailable.

I was in the First Gulf War. 368 days deployed time to be exact. Two subsequent deployments to the Gulf. I don't trust Arabs and I don't trust Arab Muslims.

I'll leave to the PC, talking heads to figure that one out.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

One would scarcely know it here.
Yep and here is safe!!

Just imagine how their victims feel in those areas where there is no safety.


I feel quite safe with the weapons and ammo I have on hand to defend me and mine... Do you??
If you are banking on cops defending you and your family you had better look no farther than what the cops did during Katrina.. The donut eating bastards had better never come to my home demanding that I ignorantly give up my weapons. The guys down there were exactly right that shot at the cops doing that Unconstitutional attempted Gestapo crap !!! I'd done the same ffing thing !

When they try that shit they need to get the bullets first.., :laugh:--Tyr

[Gunny]

Yep and here is safe!!

Just imagine how their victims feel in those areas where there is no safety.


I feel quite safe with the weapons and ammo I have on hand to defend me and mine... Do you??
If you are banking on cops defending you and your family you had better look no farther than what the cops did during Katrina.. The donut eating bastards had better never come to my home demanding that I ignorantly give up my weapons. The guys down there were exactly right that shot at the cops doing that Unconstitutional attempted Gestapo crap !!! I'd done the same ffing thing !

When they try that shit they need to get the bullets first.., :laugh:--Tyr

Cops figure out who killed you after the fact. Guess your family may get some solace out of it. If they solve the crime.

I "lost" all my firearms if a cop ever asks me. Fell out of the back of my truck ... or something.:cool:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Cops figure out who killed you after the fact. Guess your family may get some solace out of it. If they solve the crime.

I "lost" all my firearms if a cop ever asks me. Fell out of the back of my truck ... or something.:cool:
Yep, when you lose them like that its best not to ever own any more.. ;)--Tyr

[Gunny]

Yep, when you lose them like that its best not to ever own any more.. ;)--Tyr

I'm back in Texas. I can buy them and lose them about as fast as I can come up with money. You know ... trip to gun store. Buy gun. Put it in the back of the truck to drive home. It falls out.

You'd think I'd learn. :)

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I'm back in Texas. I can buy them and lose them about as fast as I can come up with money. You know ... trip to gun store. Buy gun. Put it in the back of the truck to drive home. It falls out.

You'd think I'd learn. :)
I have been seriously thinking about relocating to Texas. Texas has the resources and the type of people I can relate to. Of all the states Texas is the one best able to stand alone if "need be"..
And amigo its looking a lot more like that "need be" is not too far around the next bend.

I worked in Houston for almost two years back during the boom. Was hot but the weather was not a deal breaker for me because I love hot weather. Hotter the weather the less clothes the women wear..;)

I tell you almost all my friends have lost their guns due to robberies and accidents like you've had.
A regular epidemic of that going around..;)

[Gunny]

I have been seriously thinking about relocating to Texas. Texas has the resources and the type of people I can relate to. Of all the states Texas is the one best able to stand alone if "need be"..
And amigo its looking a lot more like that "need be" is not too far around the next bend.

I worked in Houston for almost two years back during the boom. Was hot but the weather was not a deal breaker for me because I love hot weather. Hotter the weather the less clothes the women wear..;)

I tell you almost all my friends have lost their guns due to robberies and accidents like you've had.
A regular epidemic of that going around..;)

They have an end around in IL. You don't have to register your guns. Just yourself as a gun owner. You cannot buy nor possess firearms or ammunition in IL without a Firearm Owner ID from the IL State Police.

[fj1200]

Yep and here is safe!!

Just imagine how their victims feel in those areas where there is no safety.

I feel quite safe with the weapons and ammo I have on hand to defend me and mine... Do you??
If you are banking on cops defending you and your family you had better look no farther than what the cops did during Katrina.. The donut eating bastards had better never come to my home demanding that I ignorantly give up my weapons. The guys down there were exactly right that shot at the cops doing that Unconstitutional attempted Gestapo crap !!! I'd done the same ffing thing !

When they try that shit they need to get the bullets first.., :laugh:--Tyr

I was referring to DP. But don't let me get in the way of a good screed.

[Drummond]

Either Christians or Atheists, depending on your perspective on Hitler. Then, there are the Zionist Jews who seem hell bent on wiping out the Palestinians and spend a lot of time and money demonising Muslims as a whole worldwide. You can't forget the Christians of CAR who only recently have been massacring Muslims. Also, the Buddhists of Myanmar, also killing and driving out the Muslims.

Humans are such terrible creatures.

Ridiculous. By no stretch of the imagination was Hitler a Christian.

I'll not dwell on trying to find proof of this (though his actions speak volumes). See this ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Adolf_Hitler



Baptized and Confirmed as a child, he ceased to participate in the sacraments after childhood. In adulthood, he became disdainful of Christianity, but in power was prepared to delay clashes with the churches out of political considerations. It is generally believed by historians that Hitler's long term aim was the eradication of Christianity in Germany

As for 'Zionist Jews', if they'd wanted to wipe out Palestinians as you claim (to the extent that 'Palestinians' has any meaning), they could easily do so, and we all well know this. They've had that power for decades in armament terms. For that matter, they could so completely quarantine Gaza as to starve them ... if the will existed to do it.

Instead ...

http://www.algemeiner.com/2013/12/13/idf-opens-crossing-into-gaza-to-facilitate-humanitarian-aid-during-freak-snowstorm/


The Israel Defense Forces said Major General Eitan Dangot has called for his troops to open the Kerem Shalom Crossing into the Gaza Strip to facilitate the arrival of humanitarian aid, responding to a request by United Nations officials, as the region’s desert dwellers brace for continued heavy snow fall in a region that usually features a very temperate climate.

The IDF said that, earlier on Friday, tanks with heating gas for warming houses were transferred into the strip. Later in the day, as part of a combined effort, the Ministry of Defense, the Israeli National Water Company Mekorot, and UN agencies will transfer four water pumps into Gaza to address flooding from the snow.


So, Jews resent Muslims ? After all the rocket attacks they've suffered from Hamas, to say nothing of decades of warfare and anti-Semitic hate propaganda, is it any wonder that they give voice to it ? You can't threaten to 'wipe Israel off the map' and expect Israelis to like it !!!!!

I don't know of Christians 'massacring Muslims', as you claim. However, I do know what Muslim terrorists get up to ......

[Gaffer]

Hitler was an occultist.