Gun Ban At Country Star Toby Keith's Newest Restaurant Causes Outcry

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2013/12/29/gun-ban-at-country-star-toby-keiths-newest-restaurant-causes-outcry/?partner=yahootix Gun Ban At Country Star Toby Keith's Newest Restaurant Causes Outcry In mid-December, the 15th in country superstar Toby Keith’s growing restaurant chain opened its doors in the North Virginia town of Woodbridge, around 20 miles south of Washington, D.C.

It didn’t take long for diners to notice a sign some saw as incongruous on the door of the self-proclaimed cowboy’s I Love This Bar & Grill: “No Guns Permitted.”


The singer’s team posted the following statement on the restaurant’s Facebook page on Saturday, after days of social media questions and complaints:



“While we understand and respect every person’s right to own and bear arms, we at Toby Keith’s I Love This Bar and Grill, with guidance from the State of Virginia and based on insurance regulations, have adopted a no weapons policy. It is our desire to provided a safe, enjoyable and entertaining experience for our patrons and staff.

While some gun control activists have posted notes of gratitude underneath the restaurant’s announcement, there are plenty of angry Keith fans and Second Amendment advocates expressing their ire on Facebook: FF TOBY KEITH. I'LL NEVER BUY ANOTHER THING HE MAKES MONEY FROM. The guy is nothing but a lying damn fraud IMHO. IF WE EVER MEET FACE TO FACE I'LL SLAP THE LIVING HELL OUT OF HIM. Fact.. the lousy bastard! -Tyr

[fj1200]

^So you disagree with his stance on private property rights? They trump 2A IMO.

[jafar00]

It's a little bit weird to be outraged about this. It would also be surreal for an Australian visitor to see such a sign. It reminds me of the scene where Mad Max has to hand in his weapons in order to enter Bartertown.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

^So you disagree with his stance on private property rights? They trump 2A IMO. Actually I disagree with Keith presenting himself as a cowboy and a conservative type of guy. In short he is a fraud , a double face liar. And I have an extreme dislike for that type of man regardless of his wealth , fame or any other accomplishments he may have. He rates no higher than a card cheat to me and yes I have beat the hell out of a few of those in my time too. In fact, rather enjoyed doing so since playing poker made me a lot of money ! -Tyr

[DragonStryk72]

FF TOBY KEITH. I'LL NEVER BUY ANOTHER THING HE MAKES MONEY FROM. The guy is nothing but a lying damn fraud IMHO. IF WE EVER MEET FACE TO FACE I'LL SLAP THE LIVING HELL OUT OF HIM. Fact.. the lousy bastard! -Tyr

Hold up there, cochice. It's sounds more like a corporate decision, than one of Toby Keith's decisions, so we should likely look at whether he's actually at fault, or that was just a bad corporate choice.

[DragonStryk72]

From the article:


It’s worth noting that Keith’s involvement in his own chain — named after one of his biggest hits — varies by location. As my colleague Zack O’Malley Greenburg explained in his cover story on Keith’s $500 million empire (http://www.forbes.com/sites/zackomalleygreenburg/2013/06/26/toby-keith-cowboy-capitalist-countrys-500-million-man/), the country crooner owns a big chunk of both the land and eatery in Oklahoma City, some 20 minutes from his house.
“For others he strikes licensing agreements with large operators for a flat fee, a cut of revenues or both,” wrote Greenburg. Ownership structure aside, Forbes estimates Keith pulls in $12 million a year from his restaurants.



Okay, so it is likely that he doesn't even know about the gun ban, and it's at this one location, not a blanket declaration for his restaurants. Unfortunately, this means that the decision is made by a bunch of bean counters who don't realize they've just marked their restaurant as a target. I mean, the sign might as well say the words, "Please, come rob us at gun point. We're not armed!"

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

From the article:



Okay, so it is likely that he doesn't even know about the gun ban, and it's at this one location, not a blanket declaration for his restaurants. Unfortunately, this means that the decision is made by a bunch of bean counters who don't realize they've just marked their restaurant as a target. I mean, the sign might as well say the words, "Please, come rob us at gun point. We're not armed!" A fair point you make. I could not imagine being so careless as to let anybody tarnish my name by implementing such a dumbass policy. So I assumed he must have ok'ed it. Maybe he did not. If he did not he should issue a statement correcting this IMHO. IF NO STATEMENT BY HIM COMES FORTH IN THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS I SHALL HAVE TO THINK HE IS OK WITH IT SINCE NOW ITS HAS HIT THE NEWS AND IS NO LONGER AN UNKONOWN LOCAL MATTER.--Tyr

[DragonStryk72]

A fair point you make. I could not imagine being so careless as to let anybody tarnish my name by implementing such a dumbass policy. So I assumed he must have ok'ed it. Maybe he did not. If he did not he should issue a statement correcting this IMHO. IF NO STATEMENT BY HIM COMES FORTH IN THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS I SHALL HAVE TO THINK HE IS OK WITH IT SINCE NOW ITS HAS HIT THE NEWS AND IS NO LONGER AN UNKONOWN LOCAL MATTER.--Tyr

He may not have, and if he just gave licensing rights for the restaurant, then there's really not going to be much that he can actually do about the policy, as it isn't likely to have been covered in any of the contracts, and would thus fall under the franchise owner's discretion.

What I don't get is the tactical/economic thinking that went into this move. You own a restaurant/bar that is custom tailored to appeal to rednecks, in a state with open carry, and then made one of the only real business decisions you could have made that would have sent them off to Texas Roadhouse or Logan's, all the while putting a "rob me" sign on the front door. I mean, how dumb can you fucking be?

[DragonStryk72]

It's a little bit weird to be outraged about this. It would also be surreal for an Australian visitor to see such a sign. It reminds me of the scene where Mad Max has to hand in his weapons in order to enter Bartertown.

Yeah, but you have to understand: The whole theme of the place is to appeal to, for lack of better term, hillbillies and rednecks, who are ardent 2nd Amendment proponents, in a red state with open carry gun laws. I mean, it would be like an Australian bar and grill opening here that decides to ban imported beers, including Australian. You just kind of stare, going, "the fuck?!"

[DragonStryk72]

From the article:


In September, with mounting pressure from gun control groups including Moms Demand Action For Gun Sense, Starbucks’ billionaire founder Howard Schultz announced firearms were no longer welcome in his coffee shops (http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2013/09/18/starbucks-ceo-howard-schultz-tells-customers-to-leave-guns-at-home/). The Seattle-based java giant had found itself playing host, unwittingly, to pro-gun rallies in its stores (http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2013/08/12/latte-with-an-extra-shot-as-gun-lovers-hold-armed-rallies-at-starbucks-howard-schultz-faces-call-to-ban-weapons/). After their success lobbying Starbucks, Moms Demand Action has set their sights on office supply chain Staples (http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2013/09/26/after-starbucks-success-gun-control-advocates-target-staples/), where there is no explicit corporate policy banning guns.
The gun control group was formed the day after the Newtown massacre at Sandy Hook and now boasts a membership of over 110,000 grassroots activists. Its founder, Shannon Watts, posted on Keith’s restaurant page shortly after the gun ban announcement: “Mothers of America thank you!”



Oh Christ, I found the stupid. Okay, so a bunch of moms have gotten together after a massacre in a "gun free zone", and are now putting pressure on businesses to create more publicly known gun free zones. That... Jesus fucking Christ is that not the answer.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for taking action that helps to stop, or reduce the likelihood of another Sandy Hook, but this isn't how to do it. There are so many other ways that work so much.... well, work really, if we're being honest. Declaring a place gun-free does not stop people from coming to murder people in that area, it simply informs them of the expected level of capable resistance. Gun buybacks, getting the community to meet, and get to know each other better, these are far better tools to effect the desired change that is less death.

The big problem in Sandy was not the guns, but the crazy loner who wielded them. Being drawn into a community, having more friends and loved ones, these things could have turned the tide for him.

[jafar00]

Yeah, but you have to understand: The whole theme of the place is to appeal to, for lack of better term, hillbillies and rednecks, who are ardent 2nd Amendment proponents, in a red state with open carry gun laws. I mean, it would be like an Australian bar and grill opening here that decides to ban imported beers, including Australian. You just kind of stare, going, "the fuck?!"

We have bars with Australian only beer policies here. I never heard of any outrage. Most Australians would welcome it in fact ;)

I think I can understand the type of establishment you are talking about, but those who want to strut about like John Wayne in a Western with their guns hanging out should simply choose not to eat there. I'm sure there are other choices of restaurant/bar for them to go to instead?

[gabosaurus]

“While we understand and respect every person’s right to own and bear arms, we at Toby Keith’s I Love This Bar and Grill, with guidance from the State of Virginia and based on insurance regulations, have adopted a no weapons policy. It is our desire to provided a safe, enjoyable and entertaining experience for our patrons and staff.

I personally don't think this was entirely Keith's decision. In most states, there are state and local mandates you have to observe. And others in order to obtain insurance. Some of you are getting way to reactionary to these types of stories.

[Kathianne]

From the article:



Okay, so it is likely that he doesn't even know about the gun ban, and it's at this one location, not a blanket declaration for his restaurants. Unfortunately, this means that the decision is made by a bunch of bean counters who don't realize they've just marked their restaurant as a target. I mean, the sign might as well say the words, "Please, come rob us at gun point. We're not armed!"

Cracker Barrel anyone?

[gabosaurus]

Cracker Barrel anyone?

I would rather face the barrel of a gun. Cracker Barrel is one of the worst places I have ever eaten at. Pan fried steak soaked in grease. Mashed potatoes from a mix. Tasteless corn. A true greasy spoon.

[DragonStryk72]

We have bars with Australian only beer policies here. I never heard of any outrage. Most Australians would welcome it in fact ;)

I think I can understand the type of establishment you are talking about, but those who want to strut about like John Wayne in a Western with their guns hanging out should simply choose not to eat there. I'm sure there are other choices of restaurant/bar for them to go to instead?

Okay, I had to write an entire thread for you on this subject. No one here "Struts around like John Wayne", but I cover that more there. you realize, you're being really insulting to even myself with that, right? I'd really appreciate if you'd tone it down with that.

Yeah, Australian-only beer policies in Australia makes sense. Just like we have bars that only serve American beers (They're crap bars, but that's beside the point) in locations. However, try to imagine an Australian bar that refused to sell Australian beer. Weird, right? Especially if it's a tourist bar geared for Americans trying to get a taste of Australia. Or a sports bar that sets out a policy against wearing team hats or jerseys.

It isn't really about there being other options, but more about the establishment playing directly against the clientele it's supposed to be serving.

[DragonStryk72]

I personally don't think this was entirely Keith's decision. In most states, there are state and local mandates you have to observe. And others in order to obtain insurance. Some of you are getting way to reactionary to these types of stories.

Yeah, I sorta covered that point myself, but as a Virginian, there are plenty of bars and restaurants in the state where guns are allowed, you just have to post a sign that is clearly visible at the front door. Aside from that, you can decide for yourself whether to allow guns on premises, so it's not actually a requirement, and I know of no insurance company that requires a no-gun policy, so I figure they're basically using corporate speak to dodge.

[DragonStryk72]

I would rather face the barrel of a gun. Cracker Barrel is one of the worst places I have ever eaten at. Pan fried steak soaked in grease. Mashed potatoes from a mix. Tasteless corn. A true greasy spoon.

Actually, that depends on what Cracker Barrel you go to. Here in VA, it's a lot better, but I've had issues with it up in NY, and down in Florida. Basically, if you live in a redneck area, you're probably good to go. If not, might wanna try the golden corral.

[Jeff]

Actually I disagree with Keith presenting himself as a cowboy and a conservative type of guy. In short he is a fraud , a double face liar. And I have an extreme dislike for that type of man regardless of his wealth , fame or any other accomplishments he may have. He rates no higher than a card cheat to me and yes I have beat the hell out of a few of those in my time too. In fact, rather enjoyed doing so since playing poker made me a lot of money ! -Tyr


I have a problem with him trying to pass himself of as anything but a fraud, most of the new and great :laugh: country singers are anything but country singers and yes this guy is one of the worst at trying to make people believe he is something he isn't, heck he was a biker back in the summer :laugh: As for him not knowing because it is a corporate thing as Macho as he wants people to think he is he ought to of made that a priority given the state of the gun control debate right now.

[fj1200]

Actually I disagree with Keith presenting himself as a cowboy and a conservative type of guy. In short he is a fraud , a double face liar.

Because of one business decision? Single-issue politics will be the death of the right.

[darin]

I'd like to see us hop clean-up off Toby's nutsack about this.

He has a modicum of business-savy. He's not lazy. His music is generally good. His support for the troops is top-shelf. I haven't tried the food.

[edit] - clarifying point: Some act as if Toby Keith sits upon a throne of his Restaurant Empire making decisions. The guy pays people to make decisions in the interest of staying in business.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

We have bars with Australian only beer policies here. I never heard of any outrage. Most Australians would welcome it in fact ;)

I think I can understand the type of establishment you are talking about, but those who want to strut about like John Wayne in a Western with their guns hanging out should simply choose not to eat there. I'm sure there are other choices of restaurant/bar for them to go to instead? Nobody I know struts around with guns hanging out Jafar. And I know and shoot with a damn lot of gun people. I have dozens of people that I associate with that are conceal carry and unless they trust you to tell you that fact you'll never know they conceal carry. Also open carry states have not had a rampage of gun strutting people shooting up the place. Had it been so media would never have stopped screaming about it and demanding the law be abolished. Methinks you either watch too many westerns or have a mixed up idea of gun rights people here in America.-Tyr

[Jeff]

Nobody I know struts around with guns hanging out Jafar. And I know and shoot with a damn lot of gun people. I have dozens of people that I associate with that are conceal carry and unless they trust you to tell you that fact you'll never know they conceal carry. Also open carry states have not had a rampage of gun strutting people shooting up the place. Had it been so media would never have stopped screaming about it and demanding the law be abolished. Methinks you either watch too many westerns or have a mixed up idea of gun rights people here in America.-Tyr


GA is a open carry ( once you get your carry permit you may carry open or concealed ) And it is rare very rare to see someone carrying, when I get together with the Club to ride there are at any time at least 20 guns in the crowd but no one would ever know it, to carry exposed to me is just looking for trouble and I don't carry hoping there will be trouble ( hopefully the only time my gun comes out is to shoot at paper targets )

As for Toby I guess some have a difference in opinion of what a masculine Tough cowboy is, yes if he was half of what he wants us to believe, as I said before given the state of gun control and the location of this bar he would of made sure of what he puts his name to .As for his music , one mans garbage is an others treasure .

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

GA is a open carry ( once you get your carry permit you may carry open or concealed ) And it is rare very rare to see someone carrying, when I get together with the Club to ride there are at any time at least 20 guns in the crowd but no one would ever know it, to carry exposed to me is just looking for trouble and I don't carry hoping there will be trouble ( hopefully the only time my gun comes out is to shoot at paper targets )

As for Toby I guess some have a difference in opinion of what a masculine Tough cowboy is, yes if he was half of what he wants us to believe, as I said before given the state of gun control and the location of this bar he would of made sure of what he puts his name to .As for his music , one mans garbage is an others treasure . Since he supports our military and presents himself as a very patriotic American and cowboy his allowing(regardless of how he allows) this anti-gun policy to stand in businesses he owns proves him to be both a liar and a hypocrite. Now if its an oversight which he corrects as soon as he finds out about it I'll acknowledge that he was judged too soon on the matter. No way in hell would I have allowed it if I owned the business. I'd take less money(less profit if need be) to uphold the 2nd Amendment rights our Constitution insures we have. -Tyr

[Jeff]

Since he supports our military and presents himself as a very patriotic American and cowboy his allowing(regardless of how he allows) this anti-gun policy to stand in businesses he owns proves him to be both a liar and a hypocrite. Now if its an oversight which he corrects as soon as he finds out about it I'll acknowledge that he was judged too soon on the matter. No way in hell would I have allowed it if I owned the business. I'd take less money(less profit if need be) to uphold the 2nd Amendment rights our Constitution insures we have. -Tyr


This to me is something that shouldn't even be debated , hell remember when Rosie came out against guns but yet Walmart carried them and she endorsed Walmart , now I am sure she pays people to do her business deals but yet people wanted to know was Walmart going to drop her or was she going to drop them, putting your name on something should mean something.

[gabosaurus]

I'd like to see us hop clean-up off Toby's nutsack about this.

He has a modicum of business-savy. He's not lazy. His music is generally good. His support for the troops is top-shelf. I haven't tried the food.

[edit] - clarifying point: Some act as if Toby Keith sits upon a throne of his Restaurant Empire making decisions. The guy pays people to make decisions in the interest of staying in business.

Business owners operate to make a profit. They make decisions based on their bottom line, not popular opinion.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Here is where he uses the lying cop out ------due to insurance. --Tyr
http://www.aceshowbiz.com/news/view/00067100.html


Toby Keith's Restaurant Criticized for No Guns Policy
December 30, 2013 08:52:44 GMT
Toby Keith

See larger image
Photo credit: DJDM/WENN
Toby Keith has sparked online buzz after a new restaurant in Woodbridge, Va. which is named after him shows a sign which reads 'NO GUNS PERMITTED' on the front door. Because of the sign, some upset gun-rights advocates took to the restaurant's Facebook to protest the no-gun policy.

"That sign on the door means that I will never try your restaurant ... It is a cultural thing among we Americans ... It is the fact that you seek to restrict a Constitutional Right that bothers the public. This is what will cost you," an angry Facebook user wrote. Another person said in a post, "I am now ashamed to say I was ever a fan of yours [T]oby. You truly are a hypocrite."

"While we understand and respect every person's right to own and bear arms, we at Toby Keith's I Love This Bar and Grill, with guidance from the State of Virginia and based on insurance regulations, have adopted a no weapons policy. It is our desire to provided a safe, enjoyable and entertaining experience for our patrons and staff," the restaurant's management said in a Facebook post on Saturday, December 28. A damn lying cop out. How is it other businesses allow it? Do they not have insurance? ffing lie.. So looks more like Toby knew all along which would clearly make him a lying hypocrite. -Tyr

[darin]

maybe that means "insurance costs would be cost-prohibitive".

He's not denying anyone, ANYTHING.

He's saying "don't bring your guns to THIS joint".

C'mon guys. Relax.

:)

[jimnyc]

Business owners operate to make a profit. They make decisions based on their bottom line, not popular opinion.

And it's the popularity that helps them make a profit. They need a bit of both, both good business sense and also an awareness of who your customers are and what they want.