Screw the christian, help the muslims:

[Larrymc]

I have been kinda watching this story, and call me a fool i though if Obama had talks with Iran he would get him out,

http://clashdaily.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot-2013-11-25-at-10.06.27-AM-630x430.png (http://clashdaily.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Screen-Shot-2013-11-25-at-10.06.27-AM-630x430.png)

http://clashdaily.com/2013/11/screw-christian-help-muslims-obama-betrays-american-pastor-tortured-iran/

[jafar00]

Is proselytising Muslims illegal in Iran?

If so, then the Pastor is at fault and should have expected to be imprisoned if he was caught.

If you go overseas with the express intention to break the law, don't expect leniency because you are a foreigner.

[jimnyc]

Is proselytising Muslims illegal in Iran?

If so, then the Pastor is at fault and should have expected to be imprisoned if he was caught.

If you go overseas with the express intention to break the law, don't expect leniency because you are a foreigner.

IF that is specifically what he was doing. I don't trust a single word from a single person in authority over there. It wouldn't be beyond them to invent charges to win favors in return from other countries, and far from it being the first time they have done so.

[Larrymc]

Is proselytising Muslims illegal in Iran?

If so, then the Pastor is at fault and should have expected to be imprisoned if he was caught.

If you go overseas with the express intention to break the law, don't expect leniency because you are a foreigner.It is in any Muslim Country that i know of, not sure if he was actively witnessing beyond his church, but its probably illegal for other Muslims to go to his Church, i think the only reason he hasn't been killed is because of his ties to America.

[jafar00]

IF that is specifically what he was doing. I don't trust a single word from a single person in authority over there. It wouldn't be beyond them to invent charges to win favors in return from other countries, and far from it being the first time they have done so.

Has it been established that he wasn't breaking the law?

[jimnyc]

Has it been established that he wasn't breaking the law?

Normally I would say, has it been established that he did break the law? But this is Iran, not America, and we KNOW they have lied in the past in order to ease sanctions and the similar. That's generally when someone gets captured for breaking the law or illegally entering their country to spy - not long before meetings and negotiations with them.

Then I would next say, wait for the evidence to come out in court and hopefully he will be freed. But unfortunately their kangaroo courts don't need much in the way of evidence to hold people indefinitely.

These "people" can tell me that they just struck a deal with the international community about their nuke program and I wouldn't believe them.

[Nukeman]

Has it been established that he wasn't breaking the law?As a Muslim is your faith so fragile that it cannot withstand competition of another faith?? I always find this ironic.. In all the countries that are Islamic and run in the name of Islam it is either flat out illegal or discouraged to the point of harassment or bodily injury to practice/preach another religion. Yet the Islamist in countries that allow FREEDOM of religion pitch a holy fit if they feel their religious rights are even slightly questioned.

It must be sad to have such a fragile hold on your adherents that you must threaten violence in your Islamic run countries against all others and then be so pathetic that you have to beg for acceptance and demand tolerance in those that are not.... Pathetic, and you wonder why those NOT living in Islamic countries do not want theirs becoming such!!!!!!!!!

[jimnyc]

As a Muslim is your faith so fragile that it cannot withstand competition of another faith?? I always find this ironic.. In all the countries that are Islamic and run in the name of Islam it is either flat out illegal or discouraged to the point of harassment or bodily injury to practice/preach another religion. Yet the Islamist in countries that allow FREEDOM of religion pitch a holy fit if they feel their religious rights are even slightly questioned.

It must be sad to have such a fragile hold on your adherents that you must threaten violence in your Islamic run countries against all others and then be so pathetic that you have to beg for acceptance and demand tolerance in those that are not.... Pathetic, and you wonder why those NOT living in Islamic countries do not want theirs becoming such!!!!!!!!!

In "free" countries, most people can discuss whatever religion they want to whomever they want and in almost every location. Of course there are limitations to this, but generally you'll find those limitations in craphole countries, IMO. I never understood why such harsh penalties in these places either. I understand it's the law, and if you break the law in a foreign country, you pay the penalty like anyone else. I get that. It's having such a penalty in the first place. If a Muslim can openly discuss Allah or Muhammed without fear of reprisals, then a Christian should be able to do the same thing. But that would be freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and we can't have that in too many places. :(

[Larrymc]

Has it been established that he wasn't breaking the law?I've only seen it said that he was a Christian, and that he was jailed for it, no other specifics,

[jafar00]

As a Muslim is your faith so fragile that it cannot withstand competition of another faith?? I always find this ironic.. In all the countries that are Islamic and run in the name of Islam it is either flat out illegal or discouraged to the point of harassment or bodily injury to practice/preach another religion. Yet the Islamist in countries that allow FREEDOM of religion pitch a holy fit if they feel their religious rights are even slightly questioned.

It must be sad to have such a fragile hold on your adherents that you must threaten violence in your Islamic run countries against all others and then be so pathetic that you have to beg for acceptance and demand tolerance in those that are not.... Pathetic, and you wonder why those NOT living in Islamic countries do not want theirs becoming such!!!!!!!!!

Whether you agree with the Iranian law or not is moot. He apparently broke it and so should pay the penalty. Christian missionaries are known to use sneaky underhanded tactics and brainwashing to convert people away from the truth and often pray on the sick and needy, leaving bibles and heads full of nonsense with their "charity". Its no wonder they made it illegal.


I've only seen it said that he was a Christian, and that he was jailed for it, no other specifics,

His supporters said his arrest was due to his conversion and efforts to spread Christianity in Iran. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saeed_Abedini)

[CSM]

Whether you agree with the Iranian law or not is moot. He apparently broke it and so should pay the penalty. Christian missionaries are known to use sneaky underhanded tactics and brainwashing to convert people away from the truth and often pray on the sick and needy, leaving bibles and heads full of nonsense with their "charity". Its no wonder they made it illegal.



His supporters said his arrest was due to his conversion and efforts to spread Christianity in Iran. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saeed_Abedini)

Jafar, I have no idea why you leave yourself open like this. I can hear the retort sure to be forthcoming regarding the Islamic methods for conversion. I suppose some prefer the more direct approach of removing someone's head if they do not convert.

That said, I partially agree with Jafar on this in that if a person KNOWINGLY goes to a foreign country and KNOWINGLY breaks the law, they are then subject to whatever judicial system is in place in that country.

[Larrymc]

Whether you agree with the Iranian law or not is moot. He apparently broke it and so should pay the penalty. Christian missionaries are known to use sneaky underhanded tactics and brainwashing to convert people away from the truth and often pray on the sick and needy, leaving bibles and heads full of nonsense with their "charity". Its no wonder they made it illegal.



His supporters said his arrest was due to his conversion and efforts to spread Christianity in Iran. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saeed_Abedini)(pray on the sick and needy) You mean the ones that Islamist leave to die of things that are easily treated, or starve to death, its no wounder they convert, when people they don't even know, and or even of different Faiths, come to there Rescue, of course they tell them why they came, because there God loves and cares for them to, and leaves a Bible, for those who might want to know more about this God, and who could blame them. Yea sounds like a crime to me, how dear someone show compassion, to those that Islam has decided aren't worth saving.

[Nukeman]

Whether you agree with the Iranian law or not is moot. He apparently broke it and so should pay the penalty. Christian missionaries are known to use sneaky underhanded tactics and brainwashing to convert people away from the truth and often pray on the sick and needy, leaving bibles and heads full of nonsense with their "charity". Its no wonder they made it illegal.



His supporters said his arrest was due to his conversion and efforts to spread Christianity in Iran. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saeed_Abedini)WOW........Just WOW!!!!!!!!!!! I don't even have a response for that. I would rather convert willingly than be FORCED, but hey to each their own......

[jafar00]

Jafar, I have no idea why you leave yourself open like this. I can hear the retort sure to be forthcoming regarding the Islamic methods for conversion. I suppose some prefer the more direct approach of removing someone's head if they do not convert.

That said, I partially agree with Jafar on this in that if a person KNOWINGLY goes to a foreign country and KNOWINGLY breaks the law, they are then subject to whatever judicial system is in place in that country.

You are talking about forced conversion which is a non Islamic practise. Faith cannot be forced.

[Nukeman]

You are talking about forced conversion which is a non Islamic practise. Faith cannot be forced.
Yet it is done in the name of Islam all the time..

[red states rule]

Yet it is done in the name of Islam all the time..

I would not say one is forced into Islam. You either convert or die

and like the Mafia, once you are in Islam you stay. If you try to leave Islam your breathing privileges will be removed

[jafar00]

Yet it is done in the name of Islam all the time..

You try to pin forced conversion on Islam, yet that is a violation of Islamic law.

[tailfins]

You try to pin forced conversion on Islam, yet that is a violation of Islamic law.

In that case, Iran is an apostate state and you should oppose them and everything they stand for.

[Trigg]

You try to pin forced conversion on Islam, yet that is a violation of Islamic law.

Once again, those who FORCE people to convert aren't REAL muslims, according to jafar :lame2:

Yet it happens:


"I saw the militants grabbing five villagers Wednesday and threatening them: 'Either you convert to Islam or you will be beheaded,'" he said.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/


Hindu and Christian representatives say forced conversions to Islam have become the latest weapon of Islamic extremists in what they call a growing campaign against Pakistan's religious minorities,

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/03/27/forced-religious-conversions-hike-pakistan-minorities-fears/

[Gaffer]

So the muslims don't force conversion? Maybe you need to look at Turkey in the early 1900's when they slaughter over 2 million Armenians and forced those they didn't kill to convert to islam. islam has a long and proven history of forced conversion. To deny it means your either lying or ignorant of your own religions past.

[red states rule]

I will let the Quran do all the talking on this one






Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/008-qmt.php#008.055) (8:55) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/008-qmt.php#008.055) - Surely the vilest of animals in Allah's sight are those who disbelieve

Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/048-qmt.php#048.029) (48:29) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/048-qmt.php#048.029) - Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves

Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/009-qmt.php#009.030) (9:30) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/009-qmt.php#009.030) - And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah... Allah (Himself) fights against them. How perverse are they!

Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/008-qmt.php#008.012) (8:12) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/008-qmt.php#008.012) - I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them

Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/009-qmt.php#009.123) (9:123) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/009-qmt.php#009.123) - O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness

Quran (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/005-qmt.php#005.033) (5:33) (http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/005-qmt.php#005.033) - The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Articles/Quran_Hate.htm