Why does crap like this typically happen in the South?

[tailfins]

Texas, Florida and North Carolina seem to be the leaders in this kind of crap. This incident happened in Tennessee.

http://www.wate.com/story/24005228/cumberland-county-parent-releases-video-of-his-arrest-by-a-school-resource-officer

[DragonStryk72]

"On the other hand, the school system needs to realize you can't make a black and white law," Burgess said.


"If not for policy, we would have chaos, and we don't need chaos at the schools, but we also don't need an over zealous deputy setting an example in front of kids," Howe said.



Okay, so here's the problem as I see it: For some reason, the school seems to believe that, should parents be able to just come pick up their kids and leave, there will be "chaos". Nevermind that we've managed for decades of public schooling without those policies in effect without chaos. Then you have the fact that somehow the school system wrote a law. School systems don't make laws, they put down policies and procedures, but they're not laws. If laws are getting written by the schools, then something is horribly wrong.

[logroller]

Officer: "im not gonna argue with you"
Translation: "im losing this argument"

[jimnyc]

Watched this yesterday - and I think once that clock strikes 3 and school is out - the kids should be able to leave or parents pick them up in any manner. Of course I agree that if in vehicles it should be in an orderly line, but to stop a parent from walking in and picking up their child? I hope this video and the retarded policies show the judge enough to toss this out of court with an apology to the father.

[Jeff]

Watched this yesterday - and I think once that clock strikes 3 and school is out - the kids should be able to leave or parents pick them up in any manner. Of course I agree that if in vehicles it should be in an orderly line, but to stop a parent from walking in and picking up their child? I hope this video and the retarded policies show the judge enough to toss this out of court with an apology to the father.

Jim these lines are a pain in the neck but security at the schools have become so tight they really don't have a choice, when the boys where in elementary school we had a sign with there names on it and waited in line, the sign was so the teachers could have them lined up as we pulled up, without this kind of security kids would be running around all over the place . Just to get a kid ( one of your own ) out of school is a major project but with all the issues this country has now it has to be that way, could you imagine the law suits that would be filed if one child got hurt, it is a shame this has come to this but do to Law suites and people not taking responsibility for themselves and there families this is what ya get.

[logroller]

Jim these lines are a pain in the neck but security at the schools have become so tight they really don't have a choice, when the boys where in elementary school we had a sign with there names on it and waited in line, the sign was so the teachers could have them lined up as we pulled up, without this kind of security kids would be running around all over the place . Just to get a kid ( one of your own ) out of school is a major project but with all the issues this country has now it has to be that way, could you imagine the law suits that would be filed if one child got hurt, it is a shame this has come to this but do to Law suites and people not taking responsibility for themselves and there families this is what ya get.
Safety and security are pertinent concerns, and while some burdens are necessarythere still needs to be a reasonable balance. This guy wasn't being unreasonable-- he wanted to pick his kids up and have them released to him in a reasonable amount of time after class is dismissed. The officer was quite smug and showed no interest in reason.

Heres an update, the superintendent, Donalds Andrews responds

“We aren’t running a dictatorship here,” he said, adding that the principal of the school is willing to work with parents who have special circumstances...Andrews said Howe visited the school two other times protesting guidelines of the new pick-up policy. It was after Howe showed up for a third time that school resource officer Avery Aytes lost his patience.

“I stand behind our resource officer because there is much more to the story than meets the eye. We simply can’t have that in our public schools and we aren’t going to tolerate it,” the superintendent told TheBlaze. “Our duty is to protect our students. That sir, is nonnegotiable.”


-- snip---

TheBlaze also asked Andrews if Howe was correct in his assessment of Tennessee law. In the now-viral YouTube video, Howe told the school resource officer that state law requires the school to release his children to him within a reasonable amount of time after dismissal.


“I apologize for not knowing that,” he said. “I am actually new to the state of Tennessee myself, so I’m not familiar with that.”


After TheBlaze spoke with Andrews, Howe said there are rumors that the school district is planning on seeking additional charges against him. In response, he challenged the district to release video surveillance footage from inside and outside the elementary school to news stations or law enforcement to prove he broke a single law.


“If they can do that, not only will I drop it, I’ll leave town,” he said.



http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/11/20/we-arent-running-a-dictatorship-here-superintendent-backs-school-officer-in-dads-viral-arrest-over-student-pick-up-policy/

[jimnyc]

“Our duty is to protect our students. That sir, is nonnegotiable.”

I understand their take on this. But I still fail to see how a parent walking into a school, and then walking away with his child, is somehow placing the children in danger or making a mess of things. At my sons school there is also a HUGE line of cars to drop off and pick up. I can understand how things should be orderly with that and to ensure the safety of the kids. But not allowing a child to come meet his father and simply walk home or away from the school? I don't see where there was a need for such hostility. They could have just taken their time and got the kid, and that would have been the end. I think the copper was being confrontational and didn't want to resolve the issue. I don't know the back story, but it appears they know one another, have some history, and this cop was trying to be unreasonable on purpose.

I don't think parents and kids should be free to do whatever they please, especially on school grounds, but once the day is over I think they should reasonably allow a parent to get their kid, even if it is somewhat different than normal days.

[Arbo]

But I still fail to see how a parent walking into a school, and then walking away with his child, is somehow placing the children in danger

I agree, it makes no sense. Perhaps they are going on the (wrong) assumption that if people walk in, they don't know who they are, and they want to keep all people out of the school. Doesn't justify their dumb policies, but perhaps that is the flawed reasoning.

[jimnyc]

I agree, it makes no sense. Perhaps they are going on the (wrong) assumption that if people walk in, they don't know who they are, and they want to keep all people out of the school. Doesn't justify their dumb policies, but perhaps that is the flawed reasoning.

Even if they don't know them, a kid will know, and they can ask for ID for special pickups, which my sons school does. I know the lady at my sons school and I still have to give ID every time I go there to pick him up if he's sick, or leaving early for another reason.

I'm willing to go along with the majority of their policies, as it's their school. But c'mon, they at least have to let us have our kids in a timely manner, no matter the reason, and no matter the transportation, IMO.

And in this case, the identification of the gentleman certainly didn't seem to be in question, they just didn't want to fork over his kid and they seemed intent in enforcing a policy that is likely being misused, misread, wrongly applied or whatever. I think they need to change or clarify things in the future, so that a parent can get their kid and leave in a timely manner.

And as to the cop, I think he should have stopped engaging the parent. I think he was adding fuel to the fire and kinda goading at the parent, who I believe had a legit complaint.

[Abbey Marie]

One possibility:
Child turned over wrongly inside school building: School district liability
Child goes with wrong person outside school building: Probably not District's problem.

Second possibility:
School secretary doesn't want to be bothered with parent pick up requests.

[Jeff]

I agree, it makes no sense. Perhaps they are going on the (wrong) assumption that if people walk in, they don't know who they are, and they want to keep all people out of the school. Doesn't justify their dumb policies, but perhaps that is the flawed reasoning.


Even if they don't know them, a kid will know, and they can ask for ID for special pickups, which my sons school does. I know the lady at my sons school and I still have to give ID every time I go there to pick him up if he's sick, or leaving early for another reason.

I'm willing to go along with the majority of their policies, as it's their school. But c'mon, they at least have to let us have our kids in a timely manner, no matter the reason, and no matter the transportation, IMO.

And in this case, the identification of the gentleman certainly didn't seem to be in question, they just didn't want to fork over his kid and they seemed intent in enforcing a policy that is likely being misused, misread, wrongly applied or whatever. I think they need to change or clarify things in the future, so that a parent can get their kid and leave in a timely manner.

And as to the cop, I think he should have stopped engaging the parent. I think he was adding fuel to the fire and kinda goading at the parent, who I believe had a legit complaint.

Down here in GA y'all are exactly right, they keep all the doors locked except the ones coming straight into the main office , Jim even if the kid knows the person unless they where put on a list to be able to pick them up so the kids could be yelling hello uncle Jim the school can't allow you to take them.

I have a feeling this guy was wanting the kids the second he walked in, they take there time and you have to sign them out and all that, if the child was a bus rider or a car rider same goes, now if the parent walked to pick up the kids there had to be arrangement's for that as well this way they could keep tabs on each kid.

[logroller]

One possibility:
Child turned over wrongly inside school building: School district liability
Child goes with wrong person outside school building: Probably not District's problem.
It would seem to me the impetus of the policy is to provide for the safety of the children in the pickup area, outside of the school building. Which would imply that the school has a duty of care that extends beyond the school buildings and any negligence could make them liable regardless of whether it occurred in the office or in the pickup area.


In fact i believe theres case law that extends school liability to and from school and recently, iirc a school held students responsible for actions taken before school on their own private property. Regardless of whether one agrees with the extent of such authority, it would be grossly inconsistent for a school to act in a manner that abandons liability whilst still claiming authority.




Second possibility:
School secretary doesn't want to be bothered with parent pick up requests.


:laugh: entirely possible.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Jim these lines are a pain in the neck but security at the schools have become so tight they really don't have a choice, when the boys where in elementary school we had a sign with there names on it and waited in line, the sign was so the teachers could have them lined up as we pulled up, without this kind of security kids would be running around all over the place . Just to get a kid ( one of your own ) out of school is a major project but with all the issues this country has now it has to be that way, could you imagine the law suits that would be filed if one child got hurt, it is a shame this has come to this but do to Law suites and people not taking responsibility for themselves and there families this is what ya get. Yes and American citizens know why" it has to be this way" but are too dense, too cowardly , too indifferent to take the proper actions to stop it. The government now tells us that it owns our kids. Yes, schools have to have security but not setting up a proper system to let a parent come in and walk their kid out is arrogance and pure bullshat. My son's school has a good system in place for that. -Tyr