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LOki
06-12-2007, 06:31 PM
<b><a href="http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/coyne07/coyne07_index.html">ENJOY!</a></b>
<blockquote><b><a href="http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/coyne07/coyne07_index.html">Jerry Coyne:</a></b>
<i>"Suppose we asked a group of Presidential candidates if they believed in the existence of atoms, and a third of them said "no"? That would be a truly appalling show of scientific illiteracy, would it not? And all the more shocking coming from those who aspire to run a technologically sophisticated nation."</i></blockquote><blockquote><b><a href="http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/coyne07/coyne07_index.html">Jerry Coyne:</a></b>
<i>"By pretending that evolution is on shaky ground, and asserting that religion can contribute to our understanding of nature, creationists confuse people about the very form and character of scientific evidence. This confusion can only hurt our ability to make rational judgments about important social issues, like global warming, that involve science."</i></blockquote><blockquote><b><a href="http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/coyne07/coyne07_index.html">Jerry Coyne:</a></b>
<i>"Scientific truths are facts agreed on by all observers using scientific methods. The formula for water is H2O, the Earth is 4.6 billion years old, and the speed of light is 186,000 miles per second. These are matters that can be verified empirically by any scientist, be she Muslim, Catholic, or Hindu.

But what is "spiritual truth"? It is simply what someone believes to be true, without any need for evidence. One man's spiritual truth is another man's spiritual lie. Jesus may be the son of God to Christians, but not to Muslims. The Inuit creation story begins with a pair of giants who chopped off their daughter's fingers, which became seals, whales, walrus, and salmon. There have been thousands of religions, and thousands of religious "spiritual truths," but many of them conflict with each other, and some of them conflict with science.

Many Americans, for example, have been taught by their religion to believe that the world is less than 10,000 years old. The Inuits are wrong too: whales didn't come from detached digits but from land mammals. And those "spiritual truths" that aren't palpably false are systematically immune to challenge or rational investigation. There is simply no way to find out of them is really "true", just as we can't know which religion, if any, is "true". Is there any need, then, to speak of spiritual truths? Shouldn't we just call them "beliefs based on faith alone?" When "faith does its part," then, what does it contribute to our understanding of the way things are?"</i></blockquote><blockquote><b><a href="http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/coyne07/coyne07_index.html">Jerry Coyne:</a></b>
<i>"This attitude has enormous political—and educational—implications. What happens if scientific truth conflicts with a politician's "spiritual truth"? This is not a theoretical problem, but a real one, as we see in debates about stem-cell research, abortion, genetic engineering, and global warming. Ignorance about evolution may be widespread, but it's not nearly as dangerous as dogmatic certainty about the real world based on faith alone."</i></blockquote>

Psychoblues
06-21-2007, 12:13 AM
And don't know much about History. In the face of intelligence it's hard to take information sreiously.

Hugh Lincoln
06-26-2007, 08:30 PM
What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the notion of racial equality? Liberals wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the Bible? Conservatives wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the idea of romantic love? Everybody wets their pants.

The truth is that very few people can face scientific truth.

nevadamedic
06-26-2007, 08:43 PM
What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the notion of racial equality? Liberals wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the Bible? Conservatives wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the idea of romantic love? Everybody wets their pants.

The truth is that very few people can face scientific truth.

:clap:

avatar4321
06-27-2007, 02:06 AM
What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the notion of racial equality? Liberals wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the Bible? Conservatives wet their pants.

What happens when scientific truth conflicts with the idea of romantic love? Everybody wets their pants.

The truth is that very few people can face scientific truth.

Actually the real truth is that scientific truth isnt as firm as everyone seems to think. Much if it is simply interpretations. often made on very incomplete data. This is why science is always subject to revision. Its also why is silly to see people look to science for concrete answers. it may get things right but the fact it takes just as much faith to follow science as it does to follow God. More so actually because atleast with God you can get concrete answers.

LOki
06-27-2007, 04:31 AM
Actually the real truth is that scientific truth isnt as firm as everyone seems to think. Much if it is simply interpretations. often made on very incomplete data. This is why science is always subject to revision. Its also why is silly to see people look to science for concrete answers. it may get things right but the fact it takes just as much faith to follow science as it does to follow God. More so actually because atleast with God you can get concrete answers.Faith is not terribly relevent to science, and LOLz regarding the "concrete" answers from God.

nevadamedic
06-27-2007, 04:37 AM
Actually the real truth is that scientific truth isnt as firm as everyone seems to think. Much if it is simply interpretations. often made on very incomplete data. This is why science is always subject to revision. Its also why is silly to see people look to science for concrete answers. it may get things right but the fact it takes just as much faith to follow science as it does to follow God. More so actually because atleast with God you can get concrete answers.

The scientific proof is so acurate it is scary. You need to watch the documentary Rameses The Wrath of God or Man http://www.amazon.com/Rameses-Wrath-God-Tom-Pollack/dp/B00076QKLU/ref=pd_bbs_1/002-7759884-0386457?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1182936921&sr=1-1 .

They have the plageues explained down to every detail. Also some other parts of the bible.

theHawk
06-27-2007, 08:02 AM
<
Many Americans, for example, have been taught by their religion to believe that the world is less than 10,000 years old.


I'm curious to know, where in the bible is the age of the world stated?

LOki
06-27-2007, 08:37 AM
I'm curious to know, where in the bible is the age of the world stated?You tell me.

Monkeybone
06-27-2007, 09:04 AM
i don't think that it does...in fact ain't there gaps in the time line? like the minium of a few hundred years?

theHawk
06-27-2007, 02:44 PM
You tell me.

I'm not the one stating Christians are taught the Earth is only 10,000 years old. Your source is. I can't tell you any passage that states the age of the earth in such specific terms, because I've never seen any. I was raised Christian, but I was never taught anything about the Earth's age.

LOki
06-27-2007, 03:39 PM
I'm not the one stating Christians are taught the Earth is only 10,000 years old.Neither am I.


Your source is.Let's just pretend that's what he said, I'll stipulate it's what he meant--this is why you're asking me?


I can't tell you any passage that states the age of the earth in such specific terms, because I've never seen any.Are you implying that I think I have?


I was raised Christian, but I was never taught anything about the Earth's age.Thanks for sharing.

glockmail
06-27-2007, 05:19 PM
The OP is clearly a staw man as well as Christian baiting. Knock yourself out, LOki.

LOki
06-27-2007, 08:12 PM
The OP is clearly a staw[sic] man as well as Christian baiting.By accusing Mr. Coyne creating a Straw Man, you're saying he simply ignored these republican's actual position and substituted a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. I'd like to see you demonstrate that.

As for this Christian baiting business you've decided to pile onto...it's more like moron baiting.

glockmail
06-27-2007, 08:16 PM
By accusing Mr. Coyne creating a Straw Man, you're saying he simply ignored these republican's actual position and substituted a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. I'd like to see you demonstrate that.

As for this Christian baiting business you've decided to pile onto...it's more like moron baiting.

Show me a GOP candidate who doesn't believe in the existence of atoms.

LOki
06-27-2007, 08:22 PM
Show me a GOP candidate who doesn't believe in the existence of atoms.Coyne never said there is a GOP candidate who doesn't believe in the existence of atoms. Are you tryng to make a Straw Man?

glockmail
06-27-2007, 08:43 PM
Coyne never said there is a GOP candidate who doesn't believe in the existence of atoms. Are you tryng to make a Straw Man? From the first line of your OP:
Jerry Coyne:
"Suppose we asked a group of Presidential candidates if they believed in the existence of atoms, and a third of them said "no"?

LOki
06-27-2007, 08:46 PM
From the first line of your OP:Exactly where in there did he say a GOP candidate doesn't believe in the existence of atoms?

glockmail
06-27-2007, 08:56 PM
Exactly where in there did he say a GOP candidate doesn't believe in the existence of atoms? He set up the straw man, not me.

LOki
06-27-2007, 08:58 PM
He set up the straw man, not me.The actual Straw Man, glockmail, is in your implication that Coyne said there is a GOP candidate that doesn't believe in the existence of atoms.

glockmail
06-27-2007, 09:00 PM
The actual Straw Man, glockmail, is in your implication that Coyne said there is a GOP candidate that doesn't believe in the existence of atoms. Sorry, I'm not buying your spin.

LOki
06-27-2007, 09:03 PM
Sorry, I'm not buying your spin.There's no spin, it's plain fact.