Atheists' fight against 'under God' marches on

[Jeff]

Whether you agree with atheists or not, you have to give them credit for trying.
What other group spends this much effort trying to convince judges they are offended and injured by others expressing belief in something atheists insist does not exist.With no other reason to dislike something than to have it changed it looks like this will be a up hill battle for our Atheist friends as well.



The U.S. Supreme Court repeatedly has sidestepped opportunities to respond to atheists’ demands that the words “under God” be removed from the Pledge of Allegiance, but that apparently has in no way blunted the campaign to censor that traditional statement about the nation’s founding.
For example, a case now is pending before the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts that was brought by the American Humanist Society and others alleging that the words, which are recited voluntarily by students in the state’s schools, are unconstitutional.


http://www.wnd.com/2013/09/atheists-fight-against-under-god-marches-on/

[Arbo]

Isn't there already a thread on this one?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Isn't there already a thread on this one? Why? Would this thread be a thread too far? Your obvious hatred for Christianity merely proves you have not the tolerance for others as you pretend to have. Your first attack here was on Christians and their beliefs. Now you are a thread manager too. A thread on religion no less! --Tyr

[Arbo]

Why? Would this thread be a thread too far?

It is simply stupid to make multiple threads on the same subject.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?42742-Massachusetts-Outlawing-Pledge-of-Allegiance

BTW, welcome back, I have decided you are too much of a moron to not respond to and shame. In this case your shame comes because you yet again show your stupidity via your post, as in the other thread I said these people should lose the case. Thanks for failing.

[jafar00]

Whether you agree with atheists or not, you have to give them credit for trying.
What other group spends this much effort trying to convince judges they are offended and injured by others expressing belief in something atheists insist does not exist.With no other reason to dislike something than to have it changed it looks like this will be a up hill battle for our Atheist friends as well.



The U.S. Supreme Court repeatedly has sidestepped opportunities to respond to atheists’ demands that the words “under God” be removed from the Pledge of Allegiance, but that apparently has in no way blunted the campaign to censor that traditional statement about the nation’s founding.
For example, a case now is pending before the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts that was brought by the American Humanist Society and others alleging that the words, which are recited voluntarily by students in the state’s schools, are unconstitutional.


http://www.wnd.com/2013/09/atheists-fight-against-under-god-marches-on/

Does that mean you support them?

[hjmick]

I'm an Atheist. Well, just barely, probably slightly Agnostic... Anyway, doesn't matter. Suffice it to say that I am not religious, not even slightly. I have no problem with people of faith or their beliefs. It's a free country and I see nothing wrong with people holding beliefs that give them strength or bring them comfort. More power to them.

I was raised in the Catholic church until I was a teenager, 13 0r 14. Sunday school, communion, confession, the works. I freely credit this early exposure to the teachings for providing me with a good moral compass.

I am also a father of three. To them I did my best to pass along my experience and sense of morality. For the most part, I succeeded. Two of my kids turned out great, the third not so much, but to be honest, the third one is a stepchild. I did this while at the same time not taking them to church or exposing them to organized religion. I never told them it was bad, I never told them it was good. When they asked questions, I answered as best I could and told them if they wanted to know more to either do some research or talk to someone who could better answer their questions. Pastor, Rabbi, whatever.

I always told them that religion was their choice. If they found the church and faith, great. If not, that was fine as well. So far, one has, one hasn't, and the third one is in prison.

Why the history?

Because I am not fond of the line "under GOD" in the pledge.

My objection is this: When they added this line, the pledge, IMO, was turned almost into a prayer. Now, as an Atheist or Agnostic or whatever, I would prefer my child not be exposed to this in school. I can't help but think that, considering the melting pot of cultures in this country, their are other parents who feel the same way. Giving a child the option opt out of saying the pledge, while laudable, singles that child out. Not good, IMO. So, I believe that, if a school or school district is going to require students to say the pledge, the line "under GOD" should be excised. The pledge, prior to 1954, did not contain the phrase. I think times have changed enough that we can switch back...

My bigger objection to the pledge has to do with requiring children to recite it rote with no explanation of its meaning or its history. I could forget the religious issues if they changed the policy of indoctrination and actually taught children about The Pledge of Allegiance then had them recite it.

[aboutime]

Other than being selfish, and telling everyone you know, and don't know how you hate to use the word GOD in any way. Isn't it just as easy to mind your own business? Feel whatever you want about not believing, or not being a part of any religion, and just let it go?

Can any Agnostic, or Atheist tell the rest of us WHAT DAMAGE, HARM, or THREAT there is to you personally when you read, see, or hear the word GOD?

Is it like being in a GOD accident, and someone else crashes into your selfish little world with their GOD, and you suffer permanent damage to your selfish little ego??? Nothing personal directed at you hmick.

[Arbo]

Other than being selfish, and telling everyone you know, and don't know how you hate to use the word GOD in any way.

Heaven forbid people with differing opinions open their mouths! Shame on them!

:boohoo:

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Heaven forbid people with differing opinions open their mouths! Shame on them!

:boohoo: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ^^^^^^^ Wouldn't that also include people with different religions too. Logically

it would have to, right? -Tyr

[hjmick]

Other than being selfish, and telling everyone you know, and don't know how you hate to use the word GOD in any way. Isn't it just as easy to mind your own business? Feel whatever you want about not believing, or not being a part of any religion, and just let it go?

Can any Agnostic, or Atheist tell the rest of us WHAT DAMAGE, HARM, or THREAT there is to you personally when you read, see, or hear the word GOD?

Is it like being in a GOD accident, and someone else crashes into your selfish little world with their GOD, and you suffer permanent damage to your selfish little ego??? Nothing personal directed at you hmick.

Personally? Speaking for myself, absolutely none. No harm, no damage, no threat. I do not hate using the name GOD, I do not hate people who believe. Many of my best friends are people of faith, my mother returned to the fold not too many years ago. My wife, while not a church goer, believes in GOD. I unselfishly celebrate Christmas every year because that is what she wants. Me? I could do without it. It has nothing to do with ego and everything to do with a belief system, just as it does for people of faith.

You say:



Isn't it just as easy to mind your own business? Feel whatever you want about not believing, or not being a part of any religion, and just let it go?


Yes, it is. But couldn't the very same be said of those who worship? Isn't it just as easy to mind your own business? Feel whatever you want about believing, or being a part of any religion, and just let it go? Keep it in your home and in your houses of worship, and out of the public schools.

What about those faiths, the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses, who come knocking? Or many of the born again who feel it is their duty to convert the non-believers? When was the last time an Atheist knocked on your door and tried to convert you? If one did, how would you handle it? Me, I'm always polite, I express to my visitor(s) that I am not interested, and I ask them if they would care for something to drink before they go.

The truth is, at, I am probably the most disinterested Atheist you'll ever meet. I don't care that "In God We Trust" is emblazoned (Okay, not emblazoned, but you get the idea) on our money. I take no issue with the local municipality erecting a Nativity scene and propping up a menorah. It doesn't bother me when someone wishes me a Merry Christmas. And, since my kids are now adults, the "Under GOD" thing isn't all that important either. Now, should I ever have grandkids...

The subject was broached, I expressed my views. Just like every parent, my desire was to be left alone to raise my children as I saw fit. To expose them to my ideas, my beliefs, my experience. Not have something I may not support or believe become a part of their daily curriculum, GOD knows (see, I have no trouble with the word, the name. Must be my Catholic upbringing) there's enough being taught in the schools I'd rather not see. People of faith have their homes and houses of worship in which to teach and preach the word of GOD, why do so many want to bring prayer back to the public schools? Why does it need be in the Pledge of Allegiance? In 1954 it was mainly because of Communism, why is it still necessary? Especially when there are children from all backgrounds, believers and non.

[Jeff]

Isn't there already a thread on this one?

HMMM I should report this post, seems some idiot ( not mentioning anyone in particular ) likes to try and tear up anything I post , I guess he didn't get the memo that if ya don't wish to post or read a certain thread ya don't have to :rolleyes:

Dam I bet this post is already on its way to the principals list :laugh:

[jafar00]

I unselfishly celebrate Christmas every year because that is what she wants. Me? I could do without it. It has nothing to do with ego and everything to do with a belief system, just as it does for people of faith.


For Atheists, Christmas is an excuse for a holiday where you get to over indulge, but it ends up being a pain in the ass, assuming you keep your wallet and credit cards in your back pocket. ;)

[hjmick]

For Atheists, Christmas is an excuse for a holiday where you get to over indulge, but it ends up being a pain in the ass, assuming you keep your wallet and credit cards in your back pocket. ;)


As I said, I'd cancel the whole affair but for my wife. Every year I tell that we should skip and, if she really wants to give gifts to family, wait for the after sales and do it then.


She tells me it's not the same.

[jafar00]

As I said, I'd cancel the whole affair but for my wife. Every year I tell that we should skip and, if she really wants to give gifts to family, wait for the after sales and do it then.


She tells me it's not the same.

One good thing about being Muslim. We can plan to buy certain things during post Christmas sales :D.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

One good thing about being Muslim. We can plan to buy certain things during post Christmas sales :D. One doesn't have to be Muslim TO REAP BENEFIT FROM THAT !! I used to buy just about all my tools , power tools and manly stuff from after Christmas sales. Just good planning in my opinion. :beer:--Tyr

[Jeff]

One doesn't have to be Muslim TO REAP BENEFIT FROM THAT !! I used to buy just about all my tools , power tools and manly stuff from after Christmas sales. Just good planning in my opinion. :beer:--Tyr

I still do buy mine that way :thumb:

[aboutime]

One good thing about being Muslim. We can plan to buy certain things during post Christmas sales :D.


Best thing about being an American. It doesn't matter what anyone else who Isn't American thinks about our traditions, rights, liberties, and freedoms. UNLESS....They try to take them away.

[jafar00]

Best thing about being an American. It doesn't matter what anyone else who Isn't American thinks about our traditions, rights, liberties, and freedoms. UNLESS....They try to take them away.

Who's trying to take them away?

[aboutime]

Who's trying to take them away?



Learn to READ. Note the word "UNLESS".