Syria gas attack work of U.S. allies

[Larrymc]

http://www.wnd.com/2013/08/video-shows-rebels-launching-gas-attack-in-syria/

[Marcus Aurelius]

http://www.wnd.com/files/2013/08/syrian-rebels-31.jpg
Really? In English?

Reminds me of this bogus pic...
http://www.pslweb.org/liberationnews/assets/images/content/baby-milk-plant-in-iraq.jpg


I'm personally waiting for more evidence either way before I place blame for the gas attack.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

We should let them kill each other over there. As bad as Assad is those he fights are even worse and they are all muslims! Hell, let them fight, they been fighting each other ever since mohammad's sorry ass was poisoned! There are no good guys in this conflict but one thing is for sure Obama is determined to help the ones most dedicated to our destruction! The chemical attack on civilians would have been no advantage for Assad but have huge advantage for his opposition. When it looks like a dog, barks like a dog and bites like a dog its a damn dog! The media blitz pointing to the wrong party in this was a given. Remember way back when Obama suddenly issued his famous warning to Assad? That was to get the ball rolling on this false flag attack. --Tyr

[jafar00]

We should let them kill each other over there. As bad as Assad is those he fights are even worse and they are all muslims! Hell, let them fight, they been fighting each other ever since mohammad's sorry ass was poisoned! There are no good guys in this conflict but one thing is for sure Obama is determined to help the ones most dedicated to our destruction! The chemical attack on civilians would have been no advantage for Assad but have huge advantage for his opposition. When it looks like a dog, barks like a dog and bites like a dog its a damn dog! The media blitz pointing to the wrong party in this was a given. Remember way back when Obama suddenly issued his famous warning to Assad? That was to get the ball rolling on this false flag attack. --Tyr

Assad is not Muslim. He is Alawite.

[revelarts]

Assad is not Muslim. He is Alawite.


OK had to look that up

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/12399/Alawite




ʿAlawite, Arabic ʿAlawī, plural ʿAlawīyah, also called Nuṣayrī, plural Nuṣayrīyah, or Namīrī, plural Namīrīyah, or Ansarī, plural Ansarīyah, any member of a minority sect of Shīʿite Muslims living chiefly in Syria (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/578856/Syria).




The roots of ʿAlawism lie in the teachings of Muḥammad ibn Nuṣayr an-Namīrī (fl. 850), a Basran contemporary of the 10th Shīʿite imam, and the sect was chiefly established by Ḥusayn ibn Ḥamdān al-Khaṣībī (d. 957 or 968) during the period of the Ḥamdānid dynasty (905–1004), at which time the ʿAlawites had great influence in Aleppo (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/13837/Aleppo). With the fall of Shiʿite rule, however, the ʿAlawites, with other Shīʿites, became the victims of persecution. They were ill-treated by waves of Crusaders, by Mamlūks, and by Ottoman conquerors, in addition to fighting a number of internecine wars.
Considered by many Muslims to be heretics, the present-day ʿAlawites obtained a legal decision about their status as Muslims from the Lebanese leader of the Ithnā ʿAsharīyah (Twelver) sect of Shīʿite Islām. The ʿAlawite sect has become politically dominant in Syria (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/578856/Syria), particularly since 1971, when Ḥafiz al-Assad, an ʿAlawite, was elected president of the country. The sect is predominant in the Latakia (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/331236/Latakia) region of Syria, and it extends north to Antioch (Antakya), Turkey (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/609790/Turkey). Many ʿAlawites also live around or in Ḥimṣ and Ḥamāh. They are second in number within Syria to the Sunnite sect, which makes up about three-fourths of the Muslim population of mostly Muslim Syria.

The name ʿAlawī is more generally used to refer to all the groups affiliated with one of the ʿAlīs; thus the Muslims usually refer to the Syrian ʿAlawites as Nuṣayrīyah, or Namīrīyah. Though well established in Syria since the 12th century, the ʿAlawites were not able to fully adopt the name ʿAlawī until 1920, the time of French occupation of the area.
The basic doctrine of ʿAlawite faith is the deification of ʿAlī. He is one member of a trinity corresponding roughly to the Christian Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. ʿAlawites interpret the Pillars of Islām (the five duties required of every Muslim) as symbols and thus do not practice the Islāmic duties. They celebrate an eclectic group of holidays, some Islāmic, some Christian, and many ʿAlawite practices are secret. They consider themselves to be moderate Shīʿites, not much different from the Twelvers.



So, J would you agree with this outline of a definition?

And BTW. according to your standards there aren't that many real Muslims in the world.

[jafar00]

OK had to look that up

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/12399/Alawite



So, J would you agree with this outline of a definition?

And BTW. according to your standards there aren't that many real Muslims in the world.

Alawites are not Muslim for the following reasons..

* They believe that Ali is divine in the same way that Christians believe that Jesus is also divine
* They drink alcohol and encourage their women not to wear hijab
* They celebrate Christian, Zoroastrian and Pagan festivals
* They do not pray in the same way or the 5 daily prayers of Muslims

They are a secretive sect and not much else is known about what they do. Some say they are Shia, but the link is only Political. They don't even follow Shiaism.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Assad is not Muslim. He is Alawite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites


The Alawites, also known as Alawis (ʿAlawīyyah Arabic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_language): علوية‎) are a prominent mystical (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysticism) religious group centred in Syria (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syria) who follow a branch of the Twelver (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelver) school of Shia Islam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia_Islam).

dumb ass.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Alawites are not Muslim for the following reasons..

* They believe that Ali is divine in the same way that Christians believe that Jesus is also divine
* They drink alcohol and encourage their women not to wear hijab
* They celebrate Christian, Zoroastrian and Pagan festivals
* They do not pray in the same way or the 5 daily prayers of Muslims

They are a secretive sect and not much else is known about what they do. Some say they are Shia, but the link is only Political. They don't even follow Shiaism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites

The Alawites derive their beliefs from the Prophets of Islam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Islam), from the Quran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quran), and from the books of the Imams from the Ahlulbayt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahlulbayt) such as the Nahj al-Balagha (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nahj_al-Balagha) by Ali ibn Abu Talib. Alawites are self-described Shi'ite Muslims, and have been recognised as such by Shi'ite authorities such as Ayatollah Khomeini (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayatollah_Khomeini) and the influential Lebanese Shi'ite cleric Musa al-Sadr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musa_al-Sadr) of Lebanon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanon).[38] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-KaplanSadr-38)[40] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-40)[41] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-Kramer-41)[42] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-Fisk-42)[43] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-43)[44] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-orsam-44)

The prominent Sunni Grand Mufti of Jerusalem (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Mufti_of_Jerusalem) Mohammad Amin al-Husayni (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Amin_al-Husayni) also issued a fatwah recognizing them as part of the Muslim community in the interest of Arab nationalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_nationalism).[45] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-45)[46] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-Bar-AsherKootstra2002-46) Some Sunni scholars such as Ibn Kathir (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibn_Kathir), on the other hand, have categorized Alawites as pagans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pagans) in their religious works[47] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-47) and documents.[18] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-GlobSec-18)[48] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites#cite_note-abdullah-48)



You still claim to be the sole authority on what/who is and is not Islamic... even though you refused to tell us what school of Islam you graduated from, and what exactly your Imam credentials are.

[jafar00]

That a wiki says so doesn't make it true. The Alawite/Shia connection stems from a political link between Iran and the Assad regime. They were not even recognised as Shia until 1974 when Musa Al Sadr recognised them (http://middleeast.about.com/od/syria/tp/The-Difference-Between-Alawites-And-Sunnis-In-Syria.htm) despite major doctrinal differences. Musa Al Sadr is of course the spiritual founder of your great friends and heroes, Hezbollah.

I previously posted what is different between Muslims and Alawites. They are as different to Muslims as Jews are to Christians. You don't need to be a scholar to recognise that.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Assad is not Muslim. He is Alawite. That's muslim dude. By definition and deed that is muslim. No different than if I said Catholics aren't Christians or Methodists aren't Christian. Islam is not one single unit, it has branches. When Shia fight and kill infidels does not Islam profit? Do Shia not believe in Allah, The Quran and the Prophet? The Islamic holy trinity?
God, the word and the Prophet?

[jafar00]

That's muslim dude. By definition and deed that is muslim. No different than if I said Catholics aren't Christians or Methodists aren't Christian. Islam is not one single unit, it has branches. When Shia fight and kill infidels does not Islam profit? Do Shia not believe in Allah, The Quran and the Prophet? The Islamic holy trinity?
God, the word and the Prophet?

What definition of Islam do you have?

Consider this.

* They have a Trinity. Muslims don't.
* They worship Ali (as) as a deity. Muslims worship Allah alone.
* They drink alcohol. Muslims don't as it is forbidden in the Qur'aan.
* They consider the 5 Pillars of Islam (Shahada, Prayer, Charity, Fasting in Ramadan, and Hajj) to be mere symbols and there is no need to follow them. For Muslims the 5 pillars are compulsory. Alawites also have 2 extra pillars. Jihad and devotion to Ali (as)
* They celebrate Christian and Zoroastrian holidays.
* They believe in reincarnation in this world. Good Alawites are reincarnated as Alawites again. Unbelievers (in Ali as God) are reincarnated as animals or if they were particularly bad, as Christians or Jews. Muslims believe in reincarnation as ourselves to answer for our deeds on this Earth, on the Day of Judgement only.
* Attending the Mosque has little importance and is mostly for Taqqiya to fool the Muslims.

and so on....

They are as much Muslims as Hindus are Christian. Why are you so stubborn as to not recognise that?

[Marcus Aurelius]

What definition of Islam do you have?

Consider this.

* They have a Trinity. Muslims don't.
* They worship Ali (as) as a deity. Muslims worship Allah alone.
* They drink alcohol. Muslims don't as it is forbidden in the Qur'aan.
* They consider the 5 Pillars of Islam (Shahada, Prayer, Charity, Fasting in Ramadan, and Hajj) to be mere symbols and there is no need to follow them. For Muslims the 5 pillars are compulsory. Alawites also have 2 extra pillars. Jihad and devotion to Ali (as)
* They celebrate Christian and Zoroastrian holidays.
* They believe in reincarnation in this world. Good Alawites are reincarnated as Alawites again. Unbelievers (in Ali as God) are reincarnated as animals or if they were particularly bad, as Christians or Jews. Muslims believe in reincarnation as ourselves to answer for our deeds on this Earth, on the Day of Judgement only.
* Attending the Mosque has little importance and is mostly for Taqqiya to fool the Muslims.

and so on....

They are as much Muslims as Hindus are Christian. Why are you so stubborn as to not recognise that?

bullshit. My ex wife's brother was the head of security for a major corporation, while in Riyadh, SA. He has Muslim contacts that could get him anything he wanted, and deliver it to their compound without fail. They were always invited in for a drink, and ALWAYS accepted.

[Drummond]

Perhaps this explains why Jafar is keen to distance Alawites from other Muslims (.. just as he's also keen to separate most other Muslims from being seen to be Muslims .. :lol:) ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18084964


Alawite practices, which are said to include celebrating Christmas and the Zoroastrian new year, are little known even to most Muslims.

They account for 12% of Syria's population, or just under 3 million people, and yet have been in tight control of a Sunni-majority country, for more than 40 years.

After a coup in 1970, led by President Bashar al-Assad's father Hafez, Alawites consolidated power over Syria's main institutions and security apparatus.

Hafez's identity as an Alawite helped him gain the loyalty of other minority groups in Syria, to whom he promised rights and protection.

Alawites are seen by other Muslims in the Middle East as very liberal or even secular. In Syria women are not encouraged to wear hejab and many choose not to fast or pray. Some Muslims consider the Alawites a heretic sect.

The word Alawite, or Alawi means "follower of Ali", who was a cousin and son-in-law of the Prophet Muhammad.

Shia Muslims also venerate Imam Ali and like the Alawis believe he was the true heir to the Prophet and should have succeeded him.

The perception that Alawis regard Ali as a deity or God in human form is what provokes disdain from some orthodox Sunni Muslims.

They regard the Alawite notion of Ali as heretical and a challenge to the fundamental belief that there is only one indisputable manifestation of God.

But some scholars argue this is a misinterpretation and Alawis actually believe Ali to be an essence or form, rather than a human being, through which followers can try to "grasp God".

In addition to the main tenets of Islam, Alawis observe two others, "jihad" or struggle and "waliya", the devotion to Imam Ali and his family.

So, there are definite differences, according to this piece. BUT, are these any more than mere interpretational differences ?

And, are we seeing, here, another manifestation of rivalry between Sunnis and Shias, BOTH OF WHICH ARE MUSLIM ??

[aboutime]

Obviously. Jafar would have us believe there are TWO KINDS of Muslim's.

The GREEN Muslim's like jafar claims to be, and the DARK GREEN Muslim's he claims Assad must be.

Logically stated, but still. NOBODY is willing to take jafar's excuse.

[jafar00]

Perhaps this explains why Jafar is keen to distance Alawites from other Muslims (.. just as he's also keen to separate most other Muslims from being seen to be Muslims .. :lol:) ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18084964



So, there are definite differences, according to this piece. BUT, are these any more than mere interpretational differences ?

And, are we seeing, here, another manifestation of rivalry between Sunnis and Shias, BOTH OF WHICH ARE MUSLIM ??

There are no "interpretational" differences.

Take the prohibition of alcohol

They question thee about strong drink and games of chance. Say: In both is great sin, and (some) utility for men; but the sin of them is greater than their usefulness. (2:219)

If the Alawites ignore that and go on drinking, they are ignoring a direct and clear decree in the Qur'aan which makes them unbelievers.

I'm not even going to mention the deifying of Ali who would turn in his grave at that.

[logroller]

There are no "interpretational" differences.

Take the prohibition of alcohol

They question thee about strong drink and games of chance. Say: In both is great sin, and (some) utility for men; but the sin of them is greater than their usefulness. (2:219)

If the Alawites ignore that and go on drinking, they are ignoring a direct and clear decree in the Qur'aan which makes them unbelievers.

I'm not even going to mention the deifying of Ali who would turn in his grave at that.
It makes them sinners. A sin is a sin; their belief, or lack thereof, has little to do with whether or not they sin by drinking in the eyes of God. But as Jesus said "Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her." (John 8:7)
Now I realize this was Jesus, but you believe him to be a prophet, and muslim through his submission to the will of God, right?

Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel. (Sura 5, ayah 47)

similar, no? That if you fail to judge by all that Allah has revealed, including the teachings of the Messiah, a prophet of Allah, then you are no position to judge the sin of others (which none of us are, really)-- such is God's holy dominion to bring atonement for the deeds of His followers, good and bad, and, likewise the unfaithful too will face His wrath upon the second coming of the Messiah. Is this not what Allah hath revealed?

[Voted4Reagan]

Assad is not Muslim. He is Alawite.

you spelled it wrong... it's ALEWITE

Alewites are to Islam.... as Methodists are to Christianity..

They are just a branch of the Tree of Islam that you choose to dismiss.

They are just as Muslim as you...

[aboutime]

you spelled it wrong... it's ALEWITE

Alewites are to Islam.... as Methodists are to Christianity..

They are just a branch of the Tree of Islam that you choose to dismiss.

They are just as Muslim as you...



V4R. No use in arguing with jafar. Nothing anyone who ISN'T jafar, says...matters to him.

His massive Hatred Training, and Brainwashing was so complete. Even he isn't smart enough to know the difference between being a proven fool, and being one without proof.
Jafar is nothing but a Propagandist, and Liar who practices the OBAMA techniques of constantly repeating lies until they become believable enough to convince...even the liar.

[jafar00]

It makes them sinners. A sin is a sin; their belief, or lack thereof, has little to do with whether or not they sin by drinking in the eyes of God. But as Jesus said "Let any one of you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her." (John 8:7)
Now I realize this was Jesus, but you believe him to be a prophet, and muslim through his submission to the will of God, right?

Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel. (Sura 5, ayah 47)

similar, no? That if you fail to judge by all that Allah has revealed, including the teachings of the Messiah, a prophet of Allah, then you are no position to judge the sin of others (which none of us are, really)-- such is God's holy dominion to bring atonement for the deeds of His followers, good and bad, and, likewise the unfaithful too will face His wrath upon the second coming of the Messiah. Is this not what Allah hath revealed?

Thanks but we don't follow what the Bible says, especially not the New Testament which we regard as corrupted.

Surah 5:4 was revealed about not following God's laws when Mohamed (saw) questioned a Jew being punished for Adultery by his own kind by being flogged and having his face blackened with coal instead of stoning which was in the Bible. It turns out their nobles were committing adultery so they changed the laws to suit themselves. The verse is an admonition for those of the Christians and Jews who discarded their laws and made up their own to suit their whims.

The verse would suit the Alawites in that they profess to be Muslims (part of their Taqiyya to fool both the Shia and the Muslims) yet discard Islam to suit their own way of doing things. Discarding Hijab and Prayer are other things they have discarded.


you spelled it wrong... it's ALEWITE

Alewites are to Islam.... as Methodists are to Christianity..

They are just a branch of the Tree of Islam that you choose to dismiss.

They are just as Muslim as you...

I disagree strongly. Muslims do not raise a man to the level of deity (Ali (as)), then worship him. This is a clear case of disbelief.

[Truth Detector]

http://www.wnd.com/2013/08/video-shows-rebels-launching-gas-attack-in-syria/

I'm curious who these Syrian "allies" are? Do we have a treaty with them?

Syria has never been a US ally and the US has not taken sides one way or another regardless of Obamas bluster filled rhetoric and empty headed claims.

If Syria implodes on itself it should be seen as a good thing for the US and her allies in the region. This militaristic regime has always been a threat to peaceful coexistence with its Hezbollah Iranian allies and watching it descend into chaos is a good thing.

[Arbo]

What definition of Islam do you have?

Consider this.

* They have a Trinity. Muslims don't.
* They worship Ali (as) as a deity. Muslims worship Allah alone.
* They drink alcohol. Muslims don't as it is forbidden in the Qur'aan.
* They consider the 5 Pillars of Islam (Shahada, Prayer, Charity, Fasting in Ramadan, and Hajj) to be mere symbols and there is no need to follow them. For Muslims the 5 pillars are compulsory. Alawites also have 2 extra pillars. Jihad and devotion to Ali (as)
* They celebrate Christian and Zoroastrian holidays.
* They believe in reincarnation in this world. Good Alawites are reincarnated as Alawites again. Unbelievers (in Ali as God) are reincarnated as animals or if they were particularly bad, as Christians or Jews. Muslims believe in reincarnation as ourselves to answer for our deeds on this Earth, on the Day of Judgement only.
* Attending the Mosque has little importance and is mostly for Taqqiya to fool the Muslims.

and so on....

They are as much Muslims as Hindus are Christian. Why are you so stubborn as to not recognise that?

But, but, but, don't you understand, these Americans know so much better ALL ABOUT Islam and what is a Muslim, just ask them, they will tell you. Of course the reality is this is just more of the 'they all look the same to me' sort of thing the same people probably used to say about blacks, and now just use it for Muslims.

In the same way that 'islamic extremists' are bad for islam, the brazen ignorance of americans like this is bad for America.

[Arbo]

V4R. No use in arguing with jafar. Nothing anyone who ISN'T jafar, says...matters to him.

His massive Hatred Training, and Brainwashing was so complete. Even he isn't smart enough to know the difference between being a proven fool, and being one without proof.
Jafar is nothing but a Propagandist, and Liar who practices the OBAMA techniques of constantly repeating lies until they become believable enough to convince...even the liar.

5475

Next time you should actually stick to the topic so as to quit blowing up irony meters. :laugh:

[Arbo]

V4R. No use in arguing with jafar. Nothing anyone who ISN'T jafar, says...matters to him.

His massive Hatred Training, and Brainwashing was so complete. Even he isn't smart enough to know the difference between being a proven fool, and being one without proof.
Jafar is nothing but a Propagandist, and Liar who practices the OBAMA techniques of constantly repeating lies until they become believable enough to convince...even the liar.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?42839-An-example-of-off-topic

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

But, but, but, don't you understand, these Americans know so much better ALL ABOUT Islam and what is a Muslim, just ask them, they will tell you. Of course the reality is this is just more of the 'they all look the same to me' sort of thing the same people probably used to say about blacks, and now just use it for Muslims.

In the same way that 'islamic extremists' are bad for islam, the brazen ignorance of americans like this is bad for America.

First prove that the other person's opinions are brazen ignorance and also list why yours is not. Americans are waking up to the extreme threat Islam is to our nation and survival. That your post belittles that and sides with Jafar and Islam against patriot's opinion on the subject speaks volumes about how much you do not know and how little you do know IMHO.-Tyr

[Arbo]

First prove that the other person's opinions are brazen ignorance and also list why yours is not. Americans are waking up to the extreme threat Islam is to our nation and survival. That your post belittles that and sides with Jafar and Islam against patriot's opinion on the subject speaks volumes about how much you do not know and how little you do know IMHO.-Tyr

Thank you for proving my point. "I is uh Ahmerican! That means I know it all!"

There are over 1.6 BILLION Muslims in the world. (link (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/07/worlds-muslim-population-more-widespread-than-you-might-think/)) If they were all 'bad' and 'out to get us', they could wipe America off the map without blinking.

There are indeed violent idiots that are in the religion or claim to follow the religion, and they need to be made dead, as that is the only way to end their stupidity and terrorism. But to continue to suggest that all 1.6 BILLION are horrible, violent, terrorists that desire the destruction of all non-muslims, is to show utter and complete ignorance.

"Hey look! there's one of them there muslims on the forum! we are under attack! Call him names maybe he'll go away!" Such trifling stupidity it makes Americans that are rational and that have intellectual integrity look bad.

[Gaffer]

Thank you for proving my point. "I is uh Ahmerican! That means I know it all!"

There are over 1.6 BILLION Muslims in the world. (link (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/07/worlds-muslim-population-more-widespread-than-you-might-think/)) If they were all 'bad' and 'out to get us', they could wipe America off the map without blinking.

There are indeed violent idiots that are in the religion or claim to follow the religion, and they need to be made dead, as that is the only way to end their stupidity and terrorism. But to continue to suggest that all 1.6 BILLION are horrible, violent, terrorists that desire the destruction of all non-muslims, is to show utter and complete ignorance.

"Hey look! there's one of them there muslims on the forum! we are under attack! Call him names maybe he'll go away!" Such trifling stupidity it makes Americans that are rational and that have intellectual integrity look bad.

If you weren't so goddamn condescending people might have a little more respect for you. There's my insult for the day.

In regards to what you posted. How many of those "bad" muslims do you think there are among that 1.6 billion? And how many of those that don't participate in terrorism do you suppose support the ones that do? jafar is not going to go out and join hamas and start executing jews. But he supports hamas efforts to do so.

If you try to find facts and numbers concerning the islamists and their supporters you will not find them except on the "Umerican patriot" sites or those like jihad watch or atlas shrugged. The libtards gloss over the facts and muslims hide the facts.

I don't lump all muslims in the same pot. Just most of them. It's a far more dangerous religion than christianity will ever be.

[Arbo]

How many of those "bad" muslims do you think there are among that 1.6 billion?

I have no idea, thus I have asked that very question on this forum before. Still haven't seen anyone answer it.


I don't lump all muslims in the same pot. Just most of them.

How many of the 1.6 million is 'most of them'?


It's a far more dangerous religion than christianity will ever be.

Christianity is no 'saint' when it comes to not killing innocent people. It has quite a long history of killing 'non-believers' as well. Probably impossible to know total numbers for any religion (how many they have murdered), but there is no valid excuse for any of them doing it.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Thank you for proving my point. "I is uh Ahmerican! That means I know it all!"

There are over 1.6 BILLION Muslims in the world. (link (http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/07/worlds-muslim-population-more-widespread-than-you-might-think/)) If they were all 'bad' and 'out to get us', they could wipe America off the map without blinking.

There are indeed violent idiots that are in the religion or claim to follow the religion, and they need to be made dead, as that is the only way to end their stupidity and terrorism. But to continue to suggest that all 1.6 BILLION are horrible, violent, terrorists that desire the destruction of all non-muslims, is to show utter and complete ignorance.

"Hey look! there's one of them there muslims on the forum! we are under attack! Call him names maybe he'll go away!" Such trifling stupidity it makes Americans that are rational and that have intellectual integrity look bad.

Feel free to point out any bad name I have called Jafar. My criticisms with him are about his faith, its true goals and his support of Hamas. So stop trying to put words in mouth I didnt say. As to my criticisms of muslims they are no more than those expressed by Jim, Drummond, Marcus, and a few others here. Your cry that it's done by ignorant Americans and here at this site by morons is itself truly stupid. And why would it make you "look bad" since you tout the appeasing line? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Wipe us out you say!! :laugh: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So that's it , you are defending them out of fear..:laugh2: :laugh: :laugh2: Here let me enlighten you on the number of Christians in the world.. --------------------------------------------http://www.pewforum.org/2011/12/19/global-christianity-exec/
A comprehensive demographic study of more than 200 countries finds that there are 2.18 billion Christians of all ages around the world, representing nearly a third of the estimated 2010 global population of 6.9 billion. Christians are also geographically widespread – so far-flung, in fact, that no single continent or region can indisputably claim to be the center of global Christianity.

A century ago, this was not the case. In 1910, about two-thirds of the world’s Christians lived in Europe, where the bulk of Christians had been for a millennium, according to historical estimates by the Center for the Study of Global Christianity.2 Today, only about a quarter of all Christians live in Europe (26%). A plurality – more than a third – now are in the Americas (37%). About one in every four Christians lives in sub-Saharan Africa (24%), and about one-in-eight is found in Asia and the Pacific (13%).

Regional Distribution of Christians

The number of Christians around the world has nearly quadrupled in the last 100 years, from about 600 million in 1910 to more than 2 billion in 2010. But the world’s overall population also has risen rapidly, from an estimated 1.8 billion in 1910 to 6.9 billion in 2010. As a result, Christians make up about the same portion of the world’s population today (32%) as they did a century ago (35%).

This apparent stability, however, masks a momentous shift. Although Europe and the Americas still are home to a majority of the world’s Christians (63%), that share is much lower than it was in 1910 (93%). And the proportion of Europeans and Americans who are Christian has dropped from 95% in 1910 to 76% in 2010 in Europe as a whole, and from 96% to 86% in the Americas as a whole. So your comment on 1.6 billion muslims proves to be worthless when compared to the larger number of Christians IMHO. -Tyr

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Christianity is no 'saint' when it comes to not killing innocent people. It has quite a long history of killing 'non-believers' as well. Probably impossible to know total numbers for any religion (how many they have murdered), but there is no valid excuse for any of them doing it. Really, how many has it killed since the Reformation?? Over 1400+ years and Islam has had no such reformation. And will have none because its designed to murder any that try to accomplish such. -Tyr

[Arbo]

Wipe us out you say!!

1.6 BILLION of the 'bad guys' according to you and others, 300+ million citizens in America.

If the discussion is about America, and how muslims are a 'threat', you must stick to those numbers, as those are the applicable numbers. Anything else is just a diversion.

[Arbo]

Really, how many has it killed since the Reformation??

Your question was answered in the post you quoted, to repeat it again: "Probably impossible to know total numbers for any religion."

[Gaffer]

I have no idea, thus I have asked that very question on this forum before. Still haven't seen anyone answer it.



How many of the 1.6 million is 'most of them'?



Christianity is no 'saint' when it comes to not killing innocent people. It has quite a long history of killing 'non-believers' as well. Probably impossible to know total numbers for any religion (how many they have murdered), but there is no valid excuse for any of them doing it.

I knew you would bring in history to back your argument. Lets stick to, oh say, the last hundred years when we discuss murder in the name of religion.

As to how many is most of them? My opinion is 90%. And I'm being generous there.

islam is much like the Japanese worship of their emperor, including honor deaths. Dying for the emperor was the highest achievement one could strive for. This same mindset is what makes up islam. It will have to be dealt with the same way the fanaticism of the Japanese was dealt with. And yes it will take an all out no holds barred war to achieve it. sharia and jihad would have to be outlawed in the muslim world. But it's going to take a major cataclysmic event to rally the world to do that.

[Arbo]

I knew you would bring in history to back your argument. Lets stick to, oh say, the last hundred years when we discuss murder in the name of religion.

Yeah, just skip all that stuff you don't want to talk about. LOL.


As to how many is most of them? My opinion is 90%. And I'm being generous there.

So you think there are 1.4 billion 'bad' muslims? But have nothing to support it, right?

Good thing someone with a thought process like yours didn't go for a mass extension of christians back when they were murdering in the name of religion, eh?

[Gaffer]

Yeah, just skip all that stuff you don't want to talk about. LOL.



So you think there are 1.4 billion 'bad' muslims? But have nothing to support it, right?

Good thing someone with a thought process like yours didn't go for a mass extension of christians back when they were murdering in the name of religion, eh?

I wouldn't have taken you for a libtard, but you sure use a lot of their arguments. Like I said lets keep this to the last 100 years. What happened 1000 years ago is not applicable to this discussion.

No I have nothing to support my opinion, which I stated as such. You seem to like to nit pick and cherry pick your responses to people and only partially quote them. Another libtard method of debating.

There are 1.4 billion muslims that would like to kill or convert us. They are not coming here en-mass to over run us with shear numbers. 1.6 billion muslims hate Israel. More than half of that 1.6 billion live in the region surrounding Israel. Yet Israel remains. Technology, intelligence and determinations will defeat the ignorant savage no matter how many they may have. The muslims don't the means to take on Israel let alone this country.

[Arbo]

No I have nothing to support my opinion, which I stated as such.

You think they all want to kill non muslims, I think that is incorrect. Without hard data, we are stuck at that point.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

1.6 BILLION of the 'bad guys' according to you and others, 300+ million citizens in America.

If the discussion is about America, and how muslims are a 'threat', you must stick to those numbers, as those are the applicable numbers. Anything else is just a diversion. What are you trying to prove with citing those numbers? Is it that we haven't got a chance and should knuckle under or act like cowards and try to placate them? Neither one is choice for any real American. If you want to just give up, give in to save your hide you will find it will do just the opposite... The diversion is you playing that we with A-bombs-, H-bombs and Neutron bombs could NOT beat those odds. Now you did post you were in the military so are YOU now saying our military hasn't a chance of winning if we are forced to fight them? You are aware that not all 1.6 billion can be fighting since most are women , young children or old and infirmed. Additionally if numbers matter so much why don't we just surrender to China? I find your logic and confidence in our military lacking and rather strange position for an ex-military guy. I also doubt any other U.S. military or ex-military MEMBER HERE SHARES YOUR MASSIVE LACK OF CONFIDENCE IN OUR ABILITY TO DEFEND OURSELVES.. --Tyr

[Arbo]

What are you trying to prove with citing those numbers?

What I have said is clear, in english, if you do not understand it, read it again. Your 'misunderstanding' of what I have said is already beyond old, and you making up what I have said is transparent. Grow up.

[Larrymc]

I wouldn't have taken you for a libtard, but you sure use a lot of their arguments. Like I said lets keep this to the last 100 years. What happened 1000 years ago is not applicable to this discussion.

No I have nothing to support my opinion, which I stated as such. You seem to like to nit pick and cherry pick your responses to people and only partially quote them. Another libtard method of debating.

There are 1.4 billion muslims that would like to kill or convert us. They are not coming here en-mass to over run us with shear numbers. 1.6 billion muslims hate Israel. More than half of that 1.6 billion live in the region surrounding Israel. Yet Israel remains. Technology, intelligence and determinations will defeat the ignorant savage no matter how many they may have. The muslims don't the means to take on Israel let alone this country.They are vigilantly working on this country have been for a long time, but they needed a Muslim in the White House because they can't fight us, they will defeat us with our own Laws and Politics like they are now doing in the UK they count on, and rightfully so the American people not paying attention until its to late.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

What I have said is clear, in english, if you do not understand it, read it again. Your 'misunderstanding' of what I have said is already beyond old, and you making up what I have said is transparent. Grow up. Don't answer but stop with the childish denials and accusations. There was no misunderstanding and my post was coherent and relevant reply to your post. I ask relevant questions , you being caught in a bad place repeatedly use this tactic to avoid answering and any adult intelligent member here can see that's what you are doing. This has already happened many times. I'll keep asking because you say things then when my pointed questions point out their being wrong you play this crap. That's what is getting old... I linked to a source that shot down any relevance your 1.6 billion muslims had by pointing to there being over 2 billion Christians and you play this crap... its beyond childish IMHO.. You cant defend your posts and then toss out junk like this. --Tyr

[Kathianne]

Don't answer but stop with the childish denials and accusations. There was no misunderstanding and my post was coherent and relevant reply to your post. I ask relevant questions , you being caught in a bad place repeatedly use this tactic to avoid answering and any adult intelligent member here can see that's what you are doing. This has already happened many times. I'll keep asking because you say things then when my pointed questions point out their being wrong you play this crap. That's what is getting old... --Tyr

He's trolling with condescension, remember what I suggested. :thumb:

[Arbo]

There was no misunderstanding

Every time you reply to me, you ask questions that anyone that actually READS THE WORDS I TYPE see are answered in the posts you reply to. And then you continue to guess what I might have meant, as if it was not clear. That is the only repeating 'theme' here. It is a lame attempt to continue your puerile bickering and nothing more. Show at least a bit of integrity, quit trying to push words into the mouths of others and simply discuss the issue at hand, like an adult.