Israel - nest of international terrorism [Archive] - Debate Policy

Alik Bahshi

07-03-2013, 12:24 AM

Recently, after a three-year denial of guilt in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara", Israel has admitted his guilt and apologized to Turkey with the promise of compensation for those killed Turkish citizens. This article was written immediately after the attack on the flotilla of Israeli soldiers.Israel bombed the territory of a sovereign state of Syria, which has long been an everyday fact in the region. ForIsrael, there are no international borders. This fits inall that relates to the path chosenby Israel, the road to oblivion. Israel does not seek peace, he seeks war. <o:p></o
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Alik Bahshi

<o:p></o<o:p</o>
Israel - nest of international terrorism

"I do not know who slander weaves,
That slander then kill him "
M. Sa'di

Who would have guessed that from the ancienttimes to the expanses of the Mediterranean - the cradle of civilization, back thepirates. Thought about it and the people who slept the sweet predawn sleep incabins Turkish cruise ship «Mavi Marmara», when they climb aboard, and the upper deck literally descended from the sky armed Israeli commandos. Capturingthe peaceful ship in international waters was carried out, that is not otherwise classified as piracy, well, the fact that the action takes place under cover of darkness emphasizes his malice. An attempt unarmed people prevent lawlessness unleashed a savage open fire for effect. The result- 9 killed and dozens wounded. An importantfact, which highlights the criminal actions of commandos, is Israel's attempt to turn off the information from the attacked flotilla «Free Gaza».
Turks accuse shot that they are guilty, to resist the unlawful violence isequivalent to, as if to justify the armed gunman who killed the home owner because the latter attacked the gunman at the time when he broke into the house.

Seeing how the international situation is very icky hit Israel, Jewish journalists raised a real ruckus blaming everything and everyone: Turkey in aplanned provocation and Islamization, America and Europe again in the same Islamization, human rights and peace-keepers in a lie. In the heat of hysteria notorious hater Palestinians E. Bonner (http://alikbahshi.livejournal.com/ #post-alikbahshi-7804), rejecting the slogan "two states for two peoples" and trying to justify illegal actions of Israel, calls to leave political correctness. And it is clear why. Because she is, political correctness, in no way compatible with asplash terry cynicism by Bonner. Human rights activist, she has positioned herself, said that only "a bloated stomach and hands andlegs like sticks" reflect the degree of depletion of the hungry, andif this feature is not observed in the Palestinian children, and no humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza. In this nelly not think that tummy, glued tothe spine, which can be seen in the pictures of the children of Auschwitz, Naziorganization is proof of excellent food for prisoners of concentration camps.It is not about political correctness, speech, and the complete absence of MrsBonner morality. Even living together with a man of conscience and morality ofthe Great was powerless in this case.
Bonner echoes the cynicism, I would say, impudent cynicism Israeli ForeignMinister Lieberman, known for his special "love of peace" to theArabs. Mr. Minister share with the world the revelation consists in the factthat the people of Gaza eat at expensive restaurants! This, in his view,exposes the absurdity of talking about a humanitarian catastrophe. It becomes clear why among a long list of forbidden foods for Gaza there is chocolate. Onlycare about the health of the people, in order to protect the Palestinians from diabetes. I was thinking, did the dream Lieberman for the Palestinian cause, which lay in the fact that you first need tocarry out carpet bombing, then the surviving Palestinians hard to feed, and there will be peace and blessings.
Explaining the massacre of peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» in international waters, Lieberman did not see it as anything extraordinary, because, as hesays, are more significant in the world in terms of numbers of people andkilling a dozen dead Turks not worth attention, to stir up political scandal.Very interesting idea! Israel then was it worth venturing Second Lebanon because of the two abducted Israeli soldiers?

Want to look at the big lie that is present in the statements of journalist shanging out at the "Echo of Moscow" (Latynina, Radzikhovsky), andevery time, foaming at the mouth to justify any aggression by Israel. Ideliberately thought shovels newspaper "foaming at the mouth", which thought it had the most successful party promoters phrase that defines the final verdict of "Western libel", but which this time exactly true.They lie hidden here:
"And now about the so-called blockade of the Gaza Strip. Well whatabout the fact that the imaginary "blockade" - it's just political isolation after the rise to power of the Hamas terrorist organization, which themselves Palestinian Authority to put it mildly disagree. And what does the"blockade? Since Israel is constantly all imported products, energy and products needed for life. The restrictions imposed on Gaza was a response to the kidnapping of Hamas terrorists to Israel soldier Gilad Shalit "
In justification of military action to seize flotilla «Free Gaza» Bonnerwrites: "Israel, like any country, not only can, but must - it is the main duty of any government - to protect the country from penetrating into itsterritory of any danger to its citizens of the subject." But from the previous quote that Gaza is not Israeli territory. So where is the truth? Fleet, as we know, went to Gaza, not in Israel. Conclusion: Bonner is not that the question has to be taken seriously its dilettantism. It seems to me thatMs. Bonner does not really know where it borders Israel.
First, that was before the blockade. And before the blockade was not so Jewish settlers, who represented 5% of the total population of the Gaza Strip owned40% of arable land, not including the territory on which the substantial forcesof the Israeli army for the settlers, who in turn were armed with automaticrifles. The Arab population of Gaza, squeezed on a little pressed to the seaplot (density of population in Gaza is one of the largest in the world) and thedestitute, desperate to resist the occupation and as a result in 2005, Israelwas forced to withdraw the army and dismantle Jewish settlements. But Israel retained control of Gaza while continuing to complete isolation from the outside world. In fact, the Strip, surrounded by a concrete wall, turned to the Arabsinto a huge open-air prison and the only way for the Arabs have only seen inthe continuation of the struggle for freedom. Unbearable living conditions caused the radicalization of society and the rise to power of Hamas in 2006.Trying to suppress the resistance, Israel missed through checkpoints fuel and food, sometimes shuts off electricity and water supplies. Israeli military boats stopped any possibility of fishing. In 2007 there was a famine in Gaza,Palestinians vgryzlis like moles in the ground breaking underground tunnelsthrough which came primarily food and fuel from Egyptian territory. Thus, journalists lie "Echo of Moscow" is available. No appearance in the political arena has caused the blockade of Hamas, and Israel is trying to putthe Palestinian people to their knees by resorting to the blockade, was reasonfor the popularity of Hamas, against which Mahmoud Abbas became a political corpse.
Imagine, for example, that France will block the Netherlands, isolates it fromt he outside world, erecting a concrete wall. One need not be a rocket scientistto understand what can pour out such a venture. The blockade of Gaza is anintegral part of the policy of apartheid against the Palestinian people. At the same time, the blockade - a desperate attempt to break the will of thePalestinian people, the Palestinian resistance movement split into two isolated enclave and thus cause internal political divisions.

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Now about the Islamization of Turkey, which Latynina with Radzikhovsky blame the deterioration of relations with Israel. Thus, Islam is a religion, but religionin Turkey is separated from state constitutionally can not be said about Israel. Turkey - a secular country, and rabbis in Israel are members of the parliament and government. Moreover, part of the laws of Israel are halachic and here we should note that Judaism, unlike other religious ideologies,contains an element of hatred, as it believes the Jewish people chosen by God,are qualitatively different from non-Jews, that is, from the rest of humanity.Incidentally, of all the members of the Israeli parliament, convicted of theft,namely rabbis politicians have succeeded in this "godly" case overall.
Separation of church and state is a necessary indicator of the degree of democratization of society, but also, and most importantly, Turkey has implemented the Constitution and the basic principles of democracy - the separation of legislative and executive powers, which is not in Israel, and therefore it is not Israel, and Turkey is currently the only democratic countryin the region, not Israel, and Turkey is an outpost of democracy in the MiddleEast. And about Islamisation, there is the country, which would not have been a synagogue? Judaism is better than Islam? Actually, to put someone to blame whathe in the same shit on the ears, at least unwise. Religion has brought a lot of troubles of humanity. Polytheism of ancient Greece and the Roman Empire containeda more democracy than monotheism, which caused religious hatred and religious wars. Remember the era of the Crusades, the endless slaughter of Catholics and Protestants, the destruction of ancient monuments - a whole layer of cultural heritage was destroyed will fully Christianity. The grim history - the Inquisition is also required to monotheistic religions. All this is aconsequence of monotheism, which each overtighten over. Democracy is anecessary condition for the removal from power of the dogma of the Faith, and,I repeat, in this respect, Israel is far behind Turkey and not much differentfrom the Islamic Republic of Iran (see "Revolution or Sephardic Jewish Republic of Israel»).
As for the accusations of Israel to Turkey, allegedly organized the flotilla«Free Gaza» a provocative way to get some political points, they are easily swept aside the fact that the cargo ship «Rachel Corrie» the Irish. Surely Ireland provoked Israel? It would be interesting to know from the MinisterLieberman what were the goals of such insidious Ireland? On it Lieberman's no answer.
Funny explanation participation of Europeans in "provocations" givesLatynina: "Israel must rely only on himself, he should not count onthose European bastards, who cooperate with the terrorists, because terrorists are asked for their help." Latynina goes by that bastards, what it considers the human rights activist Rachel Corrie, whose name is called Israel seized a ship gave her life in order to provoke Israel to crush an army bulldozer himself standing in his way at the time the order to destroy the house of a Palestinian family. Brings to mind the poet Saadi, M.:

<o:p></o>
"Since you speak badly about people,
Let you're right - inside of you bad "

<o:p ></o>
But in this case, talking about the rightness Latynina and didnot have to. Latynina not understand the motivation of this action by the total absence of morality, and there is no other explanation. However, this, I wouldsay, "advantage" in the absence of morality and other journalist shave "Echo of Moscow" M.Fishman, V.Shenderovich (see "Word,fornication or full Albats»).

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But this gibberish Latynina, just some baby talk, a normalperson is difficult to understand: "Europe is no longer Europe, freedomin Europe quietly turns into its opposite. In particular, in the bureaucracy,which is openly collaborating with terrorist regimes because these regimes areasking for money and depict unhappy people and unhappy always a pleasure tohelp. "
If Europe by Latynina, is not free, and America, with its generally dissolute Obama, then a truly free country will henceforth consider Israel!
Presumably, this is another example of the confusion Yu.Latyninoy, as in thissentence its "peaceful Palestinian convoy of humanitarian aid bound for Gaza» , which shows that the journalist does not know what Flotilla (caravan) peace convoy of ships cannotbe. Escort for these vessels were Israeli warships when the sights of his gunbarrels peacekeepers escorted the flotilla to the port of Ashdod.

What is the cause violent incident? What made Israel in such a frankinternational crime? Response - the impunity afforded by the most powerful country in the world - America, at least it was until now.

The Arab-Israeli conflict is the generator of international terrorism, which isthe part of the state of Israel has grown. Persist in continuing the occupation of Palestine, Israel increasingly immersed in the quagmire, he pursued the practice of international terrorism, and refusal to comply with numerous decisions of the Security Council to condemn Israel, leading to disastrous pathisolation.


Israel deliberately does not recognize that there is a permanent war with the Palestinians, and reduces it to a series of terrorist attacks, responding to their legal vendetta. Persecution and elimination of the leaders of the Palestinian resistance is around the world, across borders and countries. Due to the fact that the moral substance of the conflict on the side of the Palestinians, Israel can not seek an international arrest warrant and the court, because the mass is inevitable unpleasant issuesof Israel itself, and therefore uses the services of knights of cloak and dagger. Hence not civilized Mossad immoral acts like the murder in Dubai. Immorality lies in the fact that the Israeli secret service con the citizens of other countries, using fake passports, creating aninternational scandal, which only worsens the image of Israel, describing theJewish state as a hotbed of international terrorism. Pirate capture peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» is a strong case to.

Marcus Aurelius

07-03-2013, 07:09 AM

This is getting ridiculous. Almost every post you make is a few thousand words of gibberish you've posted on multiple other sites, as well as your own. I've seen people ask specific questions, or comment on the content, and you ignore them. The only posts you seem to reply to, are ones like this which complain about your 'War and Peace' style of posting.

This is a DISCUSSION board, not your personal article repository. How about actually DISCUSSING things with people, instead of lecturing and disappearing from the threads you start?

Voted4Reagan

07-03-2013, 07:24 AM

More Propaganda? let me instruct you on something Alik Bahshi....

You call the interception of the Mavi Marmara an act of terrorism? You are a liar sir. The Israeli Blockade of Gaza is legal by all accepted international Standards and Treaties. Turkey and the Palestinians have no right to complain.

The Treaty of Paris of 1856 States the following:

The main points of the treaty are:

Privateering is, and remains, abolished;
The neutral flag covers enemy's goods, with the exception of contraband of war;
Neutral goods, with the exception of contraband of war, are not liable to capture under enemy's flag;
Blockades, in order to be binding, must be effective, that is to say, maintained by a force sufficient really to prevent access to the coast of the enemy.

...
The present Declaration is not and shall not be binding, except between those Powers who have acceded, or shall accede, to it.

Now.... you are asking yourself... how does a treaty signed in 1856 have bearing on Israel in 2013?

Easy.. The Treaty of Paris and the Declaration supporting Maritime War were signed by THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE. Turkey having the Capital of the Empire in Constantinople was a Signatory Power and is STILL BOUND to respect said treaty.

The Turkish Ship knew the Blockade to be effective and sustained by an effective Naval and Air Force. By Attempting to run the blockade in his ship he placed his passengers and crew in harms way.

By the standards of Maritime Law he is liable for the Deaths that occurred. He knowingly attempted to breach a Maritime Blockade.

He got what he asked for.

So read the treaty of Paris (1856) and also review the Hague Convention of 1907.

Those two Treaties are STILL VALID TODAY.

Your Essay is just antisemitic lies....

aboutime

07-03-2013, 10:57 AM

This is getting ridiculous. Almost every post you make is a few thousand words of gibberish you've posted on multiple other sites, as well as your own. I've seen people ask specific questions, or comment on the content, and you ignore them. The only posts you seem to reply to, are ones like this which complain about your 'War and Peace' style of posting.

This is a DISCUSSION board, not your personal article repository. How about actually DISCUSSING things with people, instead of lecturing and disappearing from the threads you start?

Marcus. I'm wondering why this person hasn't just applied for a job with AL JAZEERA, where his audience of Hate would be multiplied by thousands of fellow Bigots?
5197

Alik Bahshi

07-03-2013, 01:14 PM

More Propaganda? let me instruct you on something Alik Bahshi....

You call the interception of the Mavi Marmara an act of terrorism? You are a liar sir. The Israeli Blockade of Gaza is legal by all accepted international Standards and Treaties. Turkey and the Palestinians have no right to complain.

The Treaty of Paris of 1856 States the following:

The main points of the treaty are:

Privateering is, and remains, abolished;
The neutral flag covers enemy's goods, with the exception of contraband of war;
Neutral goods, with the exception of contraband of war, are not liable to capture under enemy's flag;
Blockades, in order to be binding, must be effective, that is to say, maintained by a force sufficient really to prevent access to the coast of the enemy.

...
The present Declaration is not and shall not be binding, except between those Powers who have acceded, or shall accede, to it.

Now.... you are asking yourself... how does a treaty signed in 1856 have bearing on Israel in 2013?

Easy.. The Treaty of Paris and the Declaration supporting Maritime War were signed by THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE. Turkey having the Capital of the Empire in Constantinople was a Signatory Power and is STILL BOUND to respect said treaty.

The Turkish Ship knew the Blockade to be effective and sustained by an effective Naval and Air Force. By Attempting to run the blockade in his ship he placed his passengers and crew in harms way.

By the standards of Maritime Law he is liable for the Deaths that occurred. He knowingly attempted to breach a Maritime Blockade.

He got what he asked for.

So read the treaty of Paris (1856) and also review the Hague Convention of 1907.

Those two Treaties are STILL VALID TODAY.

Your Essay is just antisemitic lies....

That's what I'll tell you: a negativeattitude toward Israel has not for me, and Israel's policy, which is much moreimportant. I'mjust telling you the truth, you do not like it. Youstill have not specifically identified any place in the articles, which wouldpresent my lie. And you know why? Because it is not. Forexample, you then convince me that there is a maritime law authorizing amilitary attack in international waters on a peaceful ship, referring to theTreaty of Paris in 1856, but there is no such law, do not have it and theGeneva Convention on the Law of the Sea (1958). Yes in nature and there isno such reference. Anyof these actions are limited to the territorial waters (12 miles).
Otherwise,Israel would not apologize for his pirate actions before Turkey!

TheState of Israel as a sense of impunity, disregards not only the law of theMaritime Law, but also bombed Syria, Sudan, constantly violating Lebaneseairspace. Right-wingpolitics in Israel leads to oblivion. Israelis losing the information war, and this is recognized in Israel. Moreand more people in Israel understand the destructiveness of such a policy. It is not clear why, but all left-wing forces in Israel is called anti-Semitic, I believe that it is right-wing politicians are anti-Semites, because the state lead to international isolation.

Isay in advance, I will find you and drops a lie that makes you and some othersare angry and hit me up to accusations of plagiarism and a lie, I do not say toname-calling me a fool, as you did. But it says onlyhelplessly as your opponent. You're angry, then you are wrong. Sofar, there is no reasoned objections, there is no specific question on the textof the topic.<o:p></o:p>

Voted4Reagan

07-03-2013, 01:19 PM

That's what I'll tell you: a negativeattitude toward Israel has not for me, and Israel's policy, which is much moreimportant. I'mjust telling you the truth, you do not like it. Youstill have not specifically identified any place in the articles, which wouldpresent my lie. And you know why? Because it is not. Forexample, you then convince me that there is a maritime law authorizing amilitary attack in international waters on a peaceful ship, referring to theTreaty of Paris in 1856, but there is no such law, do not have it and theGeneva Convention on the Law of the Sea (1958). Yes in nature and there isno such reference. Anyof these actions are limited to the territorial waters (12 miles).
Otherwise,Israel would not apologize for his pirateactions before Turkey!

TheState of Israel as a sense of impunity, disregards not only the law of theMaritime Law, but also bombed Syria, Sudan, constantly violating Lebaneseairspace. Right-wingpolitics in Israel leads to oblivion. Israelis losing the information war, and this is recognized in Israel. Moreand more people in Israel understand the destructiveness of such a policy.It is not clearwhy, butallleft-wing forcesin Israelis calledanti-Semitic, I believe that it isright-wing politiciansareanti-Semites, becausethe stateleadto international isolation.

Isay in advance, I will find you and drops a lie that makes you and some othersare angry and hit me up to accusations of plagiarism and a lie, I do not say toname-calling me a fool, as you did. But it says onlyhelplessly as your opponent. You're angry, then you are wrong. Sofar, there is no reasoned objections, there is no specific question on the textof the topic.<o:p>

The Interception of vessels in International Waters is permitted if they have declared they will be running a Blockade.

Also... When the Israelis repelled down to the ship the first ones down had PAINTBALL GUNS for Primary weapons.

They were me by screaming Arabs that Dragged them away with Knives and Clubs.

The Arabs attacked First. Not the Israeli's.

You continue to Lie Alik Bahshi....</o

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Declaration_Respecting_Maritime_Law

Voted4Reagan

07-03-2013, 01:41 PM

OK Alik Bahshi... you want Proof... Here it is.... Your whole Essay is a Lie... The Blockade was and remains 100% Legal according to Maritime Law.

Treaty of Paris 1856 and the Declaration Respecting Maritime Law

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Declaration_Respecting_Maritime_Law

http://www.archive.org/stream/declarationofpar00piggiala/declarationofpar00piggiala_djvu.txt

http://www.icrc.org/ihl/INTRO/105

http://www.jstor.org/stable/2187654

http://www.answers.com/topic/paris-declaration-of-1856

http://www.jstor.org/action/showArticleImage?image=images%2Fpages%2Fdtc.38.tif .gif&suffix=2187654

jafar00

07-04-2013, 12:01 AM

Voted4Reagan, you speak of treaties and law but neglect to mention that Israel never abides by international law, or treaties.

Marcus Aurelius

07-04-2013, 12:05 AM

Voted4Reagan, you speak of treaties and law but neglect to mention that Israel never abides by international law, or treaties.

Never? Not once? You can, of course, link to a credible source for that... right, Jahil?

Alik Bahshi

07-04-2013, 05:49 AM

OK Alik Bahshi... you want Proof... Here it is.... Your whole Essay is a Lie... The Blockade was and remains 100% Legal according to Maritime Law.

Treaty of Paris 1856 and the Declaration Respecting Maritime Law

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Declaration_Respecting_Maritime_Law

http://www.archive.org/stream/declarationofpar00piggiala/declarationofpar00piggiala_djvu.txt

http://www.icrc.org/ihl/INTRO/105

http://www.jstor.org/stable/2187654

http://www.answers.com/topic/paris-declaration-of-1856

http://www.jstor.org/action/showArticleImage?image=images%2Fpages%2Fdtc.38.tif .gif&suffix=2187654

Sorry, but I willcurrently in the law. Inaddition, I repeat, the State of Israel has officially apologized to the stateof Turkey for the attack and murder of nine Turkish citizens to compensation. What more do you want! If you do notunderstand, I have nothing more to say. Bythe way, this is not the first time that you do not perceive the text. I'm not a doctor to helpyou in this case.

San Remo Manualon International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994 (http://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/Treaty.xsp?action=openDocument&documentId=5B310CC97F166BE3C12563F6005E3E09)<o:p></o:p>
PRECAUTIONS IN ATTACK<o:p></o:p>
SECTION II : PRECAUTIONS IN ATTACK

46. With respect to attacks, the following precautions shall be taken:

(a) those who plan, decide upon or execute an attack must take all feasiblemeasures to gather information which will assist in determining whether or notobjects which are not military objectives are present in an area of attack;
(b) in the light of the information available to them, those who plan, decideupon or execute an attack shall do everything feasible to ensure that attacksare limited to military objectives;
(c) they shall further more take all feasible precautions in the choice ofmethods and means in order to avoid or minimize collateral casualties ordamage; and
(d) an attack shall not be launched if it may be expected to cause collateralcasualties or damage which world be excessive in relation to the concrete anddirect military advantage anticipated from the attack as a whole; an attackshall be cancelled or suspended as soon as it becomes apparent that thecollateral casualties or damage would be excessive.<o:p></o:p>
And this:
The United Nations Convention on theLaw of the Sea<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
SECTION 4. CONTIGUOUS ZONE<o:p></o:p>
Article 33<o:p></o:p>
Contiguous zone<o:p></o:p>
1.In a zone contiguous to its territorial sea, described as the contiguous<o:p></o:p>
zone,the coastal State may exercise the control necessary to:<o:p></o:p>
(a)prevent infringement of its customs, fiscal, immigration or<o:p></o:p>
sanitarylaws and regulations within its territory or territorial<o:p></o:p>
sea;<o:p></o:p>
(b)punish infringement of the above laws and regulations<o:p></o:p>
committedwithin its territory or territorial sea.<o:p></o:p>
2.The contiguous zone may not extend beyond 24 nautical miles from<o:p></o:p>
the baselines fromwhich the breadth of the territorial sea is measured.<o:p></o:p>

Voted4Reagan

07-04-2013, 10:16 AM

Sorry, but I willcurrently in the law. Inaddition, I repeat, the State of Israel has officially apologized to the stateof Turkey for the attack and murder of nine Turkish citizens to compensation. What more do you want! If you do notunderstand, I have nothing more to say. Bythe way, this is not the first time that you do not perceive the text. I'm not a doctor to helpyou in this case.

San Remo Manualon International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994 (http://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/Treaty.xsp?action=openDocument&documentId=5B310CC97F166BE3C12563F6005E3E09)<o:p></o>
PRECAUTIONS IN ATTACK<o:p></o>
SECTION II : PRECAUTIONS IN ATTACK

46. With respect to attacks, the following precautions shall be taken:

(a) those who plan, decide upon or execute an attack must take all feasiblemeasures to gather information which will assist in determining whether or notobjects which are not military objectives are present in an area of attack;
(b) in the light of the information available to them, those who plan, decideupon or execute an attack shall do everything feasible to ensure that attacksare limited to military objectives;
(c) they shall further more take all feasible precautions in the choice ofmethods and means in order to avoid or minimize collateral casualties ordamage; and
(d) an attack shall not be launched if it may be expected to cause collateralcasualties or damage which world be excessive in relation to the concrete anddirect military advantage anticipated from the attack as a whole; an attackshall be cancelled or suspended as soon as it becomes apparent that thecollateral casualties or damage would be excessive.<o:p></o>
And this:
The United Nations Convention on theLaw of the Sea<o:p></o>
<o:p></o>
SECTION 4. CONTIGUOUS ZONE<o:p></o>
Article 33<o:p></o>
Contiguous zone<o:p></o>
1.In a zone contiguous to its territorial sea, described as the contiguous<o:p></o>
zone,the coastal State may exercise the control necessary to:<o:p></o>
(a)prevent infringement of its customs, fiscal, immigration or<o:p></o>
sanitarylaws and regulations within its territory or territorial<o:p></o>
sea;<o:p></o>
(b)punish infringement of the above laws and regulations<o:p></o>
committedwithin its territory or territorial sea.<o:p></o>
2.The contiguous zone may not extend beyond 24 nautical miles from<o:p></o>
the baselines fromwhich the breadth of the territorial sea is measured.<o:p></o>

Alik Bahshi... do you realize I am versed in Merchant Marine Law? That I have Worked in the Merchant Marine business in the past and Operated large passenger vessels? Youre really going to run the San Remo Document at me?

Well...From the SAME SOURCE YOU QUOTED.... And you quoted the WRONG SECTION..ISREAL BOARDED the ship for Inspection.. They did not ATTACK IT.

See Below

The Legal Doctrine of Blockades
Under the San Remo Manual and the laws that it codifies, blockades are a legitimate tool in armed conflicts. Of particular relevance here, paragraph 98 states that merchant vessels that attempt to run a blockade can be not just boarded but actually attacked, ie fired upon:

98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.

Though within its rights to attack the vessels, Israel did not do so. Instead it put its own soldiers at risk in trying to board and take control of the ships.

Here is the relevant portion of the full section on blockades:

SECTION II : METHODS OF WARFARE
Blockade
93. A blockade shall be declared and notified to all belligerents and neutral States.

94. The declaration shall specify the commencement, duration, location, and extent of the blockade and the period within which vessels of neutral States may leave the blockaded coastline.
95. A blockade must be effective. The question whether a blockade is effective is a question of fact.

96. The force maintaining the blockade may be stationed at a distance determined by military requirements.

97. A blockade may be enforced and maintained by a combination of legitimate methods and means of warfare provided this combination does not result in acts inconsistent with the rules set out in this document.

98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.

99. A blockade must not bar access to the ports and coasts of neutral States.

100. A blockade must be applied impartially to the vessels of all States.
101. The cessation, temporary lifting, re-establishment, extension or other alteration of a blockade must be declared and notified as in paragraphs 93 and 94.
102. The declaration or establishment of a blockade is prohibited if:
(a) it has the sole purpose of starving the civilian population or denying it other objects essential for its survival; or
(b) the damage to the civilian population is, or may be expected to be, excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated from the blockade.
103. If the civilian population of the blockaded territory is inadequately provided with food and other objects essential for its survival, the blockading party must provide for free passage of such foodstuffs and other essential supplies, subject to:
(a) the right to prescribe the technical arrangements, including search, under which such passage is permitted; and
(b) the condition that the distribution of such supplies shall be made under the local supervision of a Protecting Power or a humanitarian organization which offers guarantees of impartiality, such as the International Committee of the Red Cross.
104. The blockading belligerent shall allow the passage of medical supplies for the civilian population or for the wounded and sick members of armed forces, subject to the right to prescribe technical arrangements, including search, under which such passage is permitted.
In addition, under Section IV, paragraph 60 (e) enemy merchant vessels become a legitimate military target after

refusing an order to stop or actively resisting visit, search or capture;
This is exactly what the Gaza-bound vessels did, thereby rendering themselves military targets.

You really are comical.... The Turkish Captain was a FOOL and violated every section of the San Remo Manual pertaining to Blockades.

You're a total Idiot...

Alik Bahshi

07-04-2013, 11:35 PM

Alik Bahshi... do you realize I am versed in Merchant Marine Law? That I have Worked in the Merchant Marine business in the past and Operated large passenger vessels? Youre really going to run the San Remo Document at me?

Well...From the SAME SOURCE YOU QUOTED.... And you quoted the WRONG SECTION..ISREAL BOARDED the ship for Inspection.. They did not ATTACK IT.

See Below

The Legal Doctrine of Blockades
Under the San Remo Manual and the laws that it codifies, blockades are a legitimate tool in armed conflicts. Of particular relevance here, paragraph 98 states that merchant vessels that attempt to run a blockade can be not just boarded but actually attacked, ie fired upon:

98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.

Though within its rights to attack the vessels, Israel did not do so. Instead it put its own soldiers at risk in trying to board and take control of the ships.

Here is the relevant portion of the full section on blockades:
SECTION II : METHODS OF WARFARE
Blockade

102. The declaration or establishment of a blockade is prohibited if:
(a) it has the sole purpose of starving the civilian population or denying it other objects essential for its survival; or
(b) the damage to the civilian population is, or may be expected to be, excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated from the blockade.
103. If the civilian population of the blockaded territory is inadequately provided with food and other objects essential for its survival, the blockading party must provide for free passage of such foodstuffs and other essential supplies, subject to:
(a) the right to prescribe the technical arrangements, including search, under which such passage is permitted; and
(b) the condition that the distribution of such supplies shall be made under the local supervision of a Protecting Power or a humanitarian organization which offers guarantees of impartiality, such as the International Committee of the Red Cross.

In addition, under Section IV, paragraph 60 (e) enemy merchant vessels become a legitimate military target after

refusing an order to stop or actively resisting visit, search or capture;

This is exactly what the Gaza-bound vessels did, thereby rendering themselves military targets.

You really are comical.... The Turkish Captain was a FOOL and violated every section of the San Remo Manual pertaining to Blockades.

You're a total Idiot...

The fact that you do not take the printed text that is understandable. And yet, if I'm an idiot, then Netanyahu, who admitted that Israel has violated international law of the sea in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara" and apologized to Erdogan, is also an idiot, and the only one you are "smart."

As I see it, you end up insulting any dispute, which means that you, our wise not right, because when a person is angry, then it is not right!

Marcus Aurelius

07-05-2013, 12:07 AM

The fact that you do not take the printed text that is understandable. And yet, if I'm an idiot, then Netanyahu, who admitted that Israel has violated international law of the sea in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara" and apologized to Erdogan, is also an idiot, and the only one you are "smart."

As I see it, you end up insulting any dispute, which means that you, our wise not right, because when a person is angry, then it is not right!

You whine like a little girl about him not taking the printed text YOU provide, yet you continually ignore the printed text HE provides.

Do you understand the word hypocrite?

aboutime

07-05-2013, 02:40 PM

You whine like a little girl about him not taking the printed text YOU provide, yet you continually ignore the printed text HE provides.

Do you understand the word hypocrite?

Marcus. I wonder why no member has just come out, and told this guy. "NOBODY READS, or CARES what your few thousand, boring lines of endless letters says here.

Since nobody has. Please allow me.

Alik Bahshi. With due respect to you. Since none of us have any idea who you are, where you are, or what your intentions really are here.

Speaking for myself, after giving it my best effort in trying to understand what you are whining endlessly about.

"NOBODY reads, or CARES what you write here. Your endless rants formed with what appears to be a poorly blended compound of letters that run on, and on, with no purpose...other than to impress yourself with a SPEED TYPING TEST of gobblygook. YOU FAILED."

Alik Bahshi

07-05-2013, 02:52 PM

<o:p></o:p>
Feeling impunity, when the U.S. will block all UN Security Council resolution condemning Israel disregards international norms; violating the airspace of any country on your own and bombed (Lebanon, Syria, Sudan) and in the case of the "Mavi Marmara" is traditionally done without regard with any standards, attacked at night in international waters (all such actions under the UN Convention limited 24 miles) to the peaceful ship, killing nine Turkish citizens. However, this one did not pass unpunished aggression and Netanyahu had to admit guilt and apologize to Turkey for their acts of piracy at sea. You have to think the Israeli government is better versed in the rules of international law, if you had to admit guilty about the incident with the "Mavi Marmara". Here in the forum of my opponents called me an idiot, which automatically means that the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu, who pleaded guilty in Israel, is an idiot. Opponents believe that insulting me, thus proving his innocence, but it says only one thing about the complete lack of logic, but that's not my problem.

aboutime

07-05-2013, 03:01 PM

<o:p></o>
Feeling impunity, when the U.S. will block all UN Security Council resolution condemning Israel disregards international norms; violating the airspace of any country on your own and bombed (Lebanon, Syria, Sudan) and in the case of the "Mavi Marmara" is traditionally done without regard with any standards, attacked at night in international waters (all such actions under the UN Convention limited 24 miles) to the peaceful ship, killing nine Turkish citizens. However, this one did not pass unpunished aggression and Netanyahu had to admit guilt and apologize to Turkey for their acts of piracy at sea. You have to think the Israeli government is better versed in the rules of international law, if you had to admit guilty about the incident with the "Mavi Marmara". Here in the forum of my opponents called me an idiot, which automatically means that the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu, who pleaded guilty in Israel, is an idiot. Opponents believe that insulting me, thus proving his innocence, but it says only one thing about the complete lack of logic, but that's not my problem.

Not one of us here has any need to PROVE anything about you. Seems like you managed to state it better than anyone else could.

Robert A Whit

07-05-2013, 03:18 PM

Recently, after a three-year denial of guilt in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara", Israel has admitted his guilt and apologized to Turkey with the promise of compensation for those killed Turkish citizens. This article was written immediately after the attack on the flotilla of Israeli soldiers.Israel bombed the territory of a sovereign state of Syria, which has long been an everyday fact in the region. ForIsrael, there are no international borders. This fits inall that relates to the path chosenby Israel, the road to oblivion. Israel does not seek peace, he seeks war. <o:p></o
<o:p> </o
Alik Bahshi

<o:p></o<o:p</o>
Israel - nest of international terrorism

"I do not know who slander weaves,
That slander then kill him "
M. Sa'di

Who would have guessed that from the ancienttimes to the expanses of the Mediterranean - the cradle of civilization, back thepirates. Thought about it and the people who slept the sweet predawn sleep incabins Turkish cruise ship «Mavi Marmara», when they climb aboard, and the upper deck literally descended from the sky armed Israeli commandos. Capturingthe peaceful ship in international waters was carried out, that is not otherwise classified as piracy, well, the fact that the action takes place under cover of darkness emphasizes his malice. An attempt unarmed people prevent lawlessness unleashed a savage open fire for effect. The result- 9 killed and dozens wounded. An importantfact, which highlights the criminal actions of commandos, is Israel's attempt to turn off the information from the attacked flotilla «Free Gaza».
Turks accuse shot that they are guilty, to resist the unlawful violence isequivalent to, as if to justify the armed gunman who killed the home owner because the latter attacked the gunman at the time when he broke into the house.

Seeing how the international situation is very icky hit Israel, Jewish journalists raised a real ruckus blaming everything and everyone: Turkey in aplanned provocation and Islamization, America and Europe again in the same Islamization, human rights and peace-keepers in a lie. In the heat of hysteria notorious hater Palestinians E. Bonner (http://alikbahshi.livejournal.com/ #post-alikbahshi-7804), rejecting the slogan "two states for two peoples" and trying to justify illegal actions of Israel, calls to leave political correctness. And it is clear why. Because she is, political correctness, in no way compatible with asplash terry cynicism by Bonner. Human rights activist, she has positioned herself, said that only "a bloated stomach and hands andlegs like sticks" reflect the degree of depletion of the hungry, andif this feature is not observed in the Palestinian children, and no humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza. In this nelly not think that tummy, glued tothe spine, which can be seen in the pictures of the children of Auschwitz, Naziorganization is proof of excellent food for prisoners of concentration camps.It is not about political correctness, speech, and the complete absence of MrsBonner morality. Even living together with a man of conscience and morality ofthe Great was powerless in this case.
Bonner echoes the cynicism, I would say, impudent cynicism Israeli ForeignMinister Lieberman, known for his special "love of peace" to theArabs. Mr. Minister share with the world the revelation consists in the factthat the people of Gaza eat at expensive restaurants! This, in his view,exposes the absurdity of talking about a humanitarian catastrophe. It becomes clear why among a long list of forbidden foods for Gaza there is chocolate. Onlycare about the health of the people, in order to protect the Palestinians from diabetes. I was thinking, did the dream Lieberman for the Palestinian cause, which lay in the fact that you first need tocarry out carpet bombing, then the surviving Palestinians hard to feed, and there will be peace and blessings.
Explaining the massacre of peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» in international waters, Lieberman did not see it as anything extraordinary, because, as hesays, are more significant in the world in terms of numbers of people andkilling a dozen dead Turks not worth attention, to stir up political scandal.Very interesting idea! Israel then was it worth venturing Second Lebanon because of the two abducted Israeli soldiers?

Want to look at the big lie that is present in the statements of journalist shanging out at the "Echo of Moscow" (Latynina, Radzikhovsky), andevery time, foaming at the mouth to justify any aggression by Israel. Ideliberately thought shovels newspaper "foaming at the mouth", which thought it had the most successful party promoters phrase that defines the final verdict of "Western libel", but which this time exactly true.They lie hidden here:
"And now about the so-called blockade of the Gaza Strip. Well whatabout the fact that the imaginary "blockade" - it's just political isolation after the rise to power of the Hamas terrorist organization, which themselves Palestinian Authority to put it mildly disagree. And what does the"blockade? Since Israel is constantly all imported products, energy and products needed for life. The restrictions imposed on Gaza was a response to the kidnapping of Hamas terrorists to Israel soldier Gilad Shalit "
In justification of military action to seize flotilla «Free Gaza» Bonnerwrites: "Israel, like any country, not only can, but must - it is the main duty of any government - to protect the country from penetrating into itsterritory of any danger to its citizens of the subject." But from the previous quote that Gaza is not Israeli territory. So where is the truth? Fleet, as we know, went to Gaza, not in Israel. Conclusion: Bonner is not that the question has to be taken seriously its dilettantism. It seems to me thatMs. Bonner does not really know where it borders Israel.
First, that was before the blockade. And before the blockade was not so Jewish settlers, who represented 5% of the total population of the Gaza Strip owned40% of arable land, not including the territory on which the substantial forcesof the Israeli army for the settlers, who in turn were armed with automaticrifles. The Arab population of Gaza, squeezed on a little pressed to the seaplot (density of population in Gaza is one of the largest in the world) and thedestitute, desperate to resist the occupation and as a result in 2005, Israelwas forced to withdraw the army and dismantle Jewish settlements. But Israel retained control of Gaza while continuing to complete isolation from the outside world. In fact, the Strip, surrounded by a concrete wall, turned to the Arabsinto a huge open-air prison and the only way for the Arabs have only seen inthe continuation of the struggle for freedom. Unbearable living conditions caused the radicalization of society and the rise to power of Hamas in 2006.Trying to suppress the resistance, Israel missed through checkpoints fuel and food, sometimes shuts off electricity and water supplies. Israeli military boats stopped any possibility of fishing. In 2007 there was a famine in Gaza,Palestinians vgryzlis like moles in the ground breaking underground tunnelsthrough which came primarily food and fuel from Egyptian territory. Thus, journalists lie "Echo of Moscow" is available. No appearance in the political arena has caused the blockade of Hamas, and Israel is trying to putthe Palestinian people to their knees by resorting to the blockade, was reasonfor the popularity of Hamas, against which Mahmoud Abbas became a political corpse.
Imagine, for example, that France will block the Netherlands, isolates it fromt he outside world, erecting a concrete wall. One need not be a rocket scientistto understand what can pour out such a venture. The blockade of Gaza is anintegral part of the policy of apartheid against the Palestinian people. At the same time, the blockade - a desperate attempt to break the will of thePalestinian people, the Palestinian resistance movement split into two isolated enclave and thus cause internal political divisions.

<o:p></o>
Now about the Islamization of Turkey, which Latynina with Radzikhovsky blame the deterioration of relations with Israel. Thus, Islam is a religion, but religionin Turkey is separated from state constitutionally can not be said about Israel. Turkey - a secular country, and rabbis in Israel are members of the parliament and government. Moreover, part of the laws of Israel are halachic and here we should note that Judaism, unlike other religious ideologies,contains an element of hatred, as it believes the Jewish people chosen by God,are qualitatively different from non-Jews, that is, from the rest of humanity.Incidentally, of all the members of the Israeli parliament, convicted of theft,namely rabbis politicians have succeeded in this "godly" case overall.
Separation of church and state is a necessary indicator of the degree of democratization of society, but also, and most importantly, Turkey has implemented the Constitution and the basic principles of democracy - the separation of legislative and executive powers, which is not in Israel, and therefore it is not Israel, and Turkey is currently the only democratic countryin the region, not Israel, and Turkey is an outpost of democracy in the MiddleEast. And about Islamisation, there is the country, which would not have been a synagogue? Judaism is better than Islam? Actually, to put someone to blame whathe in the same shit on the ears, at least unwise. Religion has brought a lot of troubles of humanity. Polytheism of ancient Greece and the Roman Empire containeda more democracy than monotheism, which caused religious hatred and religious wars. Remember the era of the Crusades, the endless slaughter of Catholics and Protestants, the destruction of ancient monuments - a whole layer of cultural heritage was destroyed will fully Christianity. The grim history - the Inquisition is also required to monotheistic religions. All this is aconsequence of monotheism, which each overtighten over. Democracy is anecessary condition for the removal from power of the dogma of the Faith, and,I repeat, in this respect, Israel is far behind Turkey and not much differentfrom the Islamic Republic of Iran (see "Revolution or Sephardic Jewish Republic of Israel»).
As for the accusations of Israel to Turkey, allegedly organized the flotilla«Free Gaza» a provocative way to get some political points, they are easily swept aside the fact that the cargo ship «Rachel Corrie» the Irish. Surely Ireland provoked Israel? It would be interesting to know from the MinisterLieberman what were the goals of such insidious Ireland? On it Lieberman's no answer.
Funny explanation participation of Europeans in "provocations" givesLatynina: "Israel must rely only on himself, he should not count onthose European bastards, who cooperate with the terrorists, because terrorists are asked for their help." Latynina goes by that bastards, what it considers the human rights activist Rachel Corrie, whose name is called Israel seized a ship gave her life in order to provoke Israel to crush an army bulldozer himself standing in his way at the time the order to destroy the house of a Palestinian family. Brings to mind the poet Saadi, M.:

<o:p></o>
"Since you speak badly about people,
Let you're right - inside of you bad "

<o:p ></o>
But in this case, talking about the rightness Latynina and didnot have to. Latynina not understand the motivation of this action by the total absence of morality, and there is no other explanation. However, this, I wouldsay, "advantage" in the absence of morality and other journalist shave "Echo of Moscow" M.Fishman, V.Shenderovich (see "Word,fornication or full Albats»).

<o:p></o>
But this gibberish Latynina, just some baby talk, a normalperson is difficult to understand: "Europe is no longer Europe, freedomin Europe quietly turns into its opposite. In particular, in the bureaucracy,which is openly collaborating with terrorist regimes because these regimes areasking for money and depict unhappy people and unhappy always a pleasure tohelp. "
If Europe by Latynina, is not free, and America, with its generally dissolute Obama, then a truly free country will henceforth consider Israel!
Presumably, this is another example of the confusion Yu.Latyninoy, as in thissentence its "peaceful Palestinian convoy of humanitarian aid bound for Gaza» , which shows that the journalist does not know what Flotilla (caravan) peace convoy of ships cannotbe. Escort for these vessels were Israeli warships when the sights of his gunbarrels peacekeepers escorted the flotilla to the port of Ashdod.

What is the cause violent incident? What made Israel in such a frankinternational crime? Response - the impunity afforded by the most powerful country in the world - America, at least it was until now.

The Arab-Israeli conflict is the generator of international terrorism, which isthe part of the state of Israel has grown. Persist in continuing the occupation of Palestine, Israel increasingly immersed in the quagmire, he pursued the practice of international terrorism, and refusal to comply with numerous decisions of the Security Council to condemn Israel, leading to disastrous pathisolation.


Israel deliberately does not recognize that there is a permanent war with the Palestinians, and reduces it to a series of terrorist attacks, responding to their legal vendetta. Persecution and elimination of the leaders of the Palestinian resistance is around the world, across borders and countries. Due to the fact that the moral substance of the conflict on the side of the Palestinians, Israel can not seek an international arrest warrant and the court, because the mass is inevitable unpleasant issuesof Israel itself, and therefore uses the services of knights of cloak and dagger. Hence not civilized Mossad immoral acts like the murder in Dubai. Immorality lies in the fact that the Israeli secret service con the citizens of other countries, using fake passports, creating aninternational scandal, which only worsens the image of Israel, describing theJewish state as a hotbed of international terrorism. Pirate capture peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» is a strong case to.



From UN report on boarding ships

117. Israel’s decision to board the vessels with such substantial force at a great
distance from the blockade zone and with no final warning immediately prior to the
boarding was excessive and unreasonable:
a. Non-violent options should have been used in the first instance. In
particular, clear prior warning that the vessels were to be boarded and a
demonstration of dissuading force should have been given to avoid the type
of confrontation that occurred;
b. The operation should have reassessed its options when the resistance to the
initial boarding attempt became apparent so as to minimize casualties.

Abbey Marie

07-05-2013, 03:19 PM

This does seem to be reaching the level of spamming.

Robert A Whit

07-05-2013, 03:28 PM

The Legal Doctrine of Blockades
Under the San Remo Manual and the laws that it codifies, blockades are a legitimate tool in armed conflicts. Of particular relevance here,paragraph 98 states that merchant vessels that attempt to run a blockade can be not just boarded but actually attacked, ie fired upon:
98. Merchant vessels believed on reasonable grounds to be breaching a blockade may be captured. Merchant vessels which, after prior warning, clearly resist capture may be attacked.

Though within its rights to attack the vessels, Israel did not do so. Instead it put its own soldiers at risk in trying to board and take control of the ships.

*************

Reply by Robert

\Actually the UN report clearly said the attack was in international waters and used excessive force. The Helicopter attacked from the air.

While the Blockade was fully legal, the attack took place many miles outside the blockade border.

Armed troops confronted unarmed passengers.

The mission by the flotilla is entirely suspect since no ports ahle to handle such shops were at Gaza. That and the ships were warned ahead of time force might be used and were also warned to set sail for ports approved for such cargo.

Robert A Whit

07-05-2013, 03:39 PM

The Interception of vessels in International Waters is permitted if they have declared they will be running a Blockade.

Also... When the Israelis repelled down to the ship the first ones down had PAINTBALL GUNS for Primary weapons.

They were me by screaming Arabs that Dragged them away with Knives and Clubs.

The Arabs attacked First. Not the Israeli's.

You continue to Lie Alik Bahshi....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_Declaration_Respecting_Maritime_Law[/QUOTE
[QUOTE] Robert says:
This is the real debate as I tried to tell you Reagan. But you wanted no constructive comments.

Now you are actually debating his points.

I urge you to read the actual UN report on this matter.

The Treaty of Paris was between some other warring opponents that agreed to settle that conflict in a different part of the world.

These vessels were determined by the UN to be trying to provoke the Israelis and it worked.

But they were 5 hours distant from the blockade. And the Captain of the Mara (something), changed course heading his ship at Egypt.

I can't recall any Turkish ships in the convoy. Turkish citizens of course died on the one ship.

UN says the first shots fired were by Israelis in the helicopter.

Marcus Aurelius

07-05-2013, 03:39 PM

[/B]From UN report on boarding ships

117. Israel’s decision to board the vessels with such substantial force at a great
distance from the blockade zone and with no final warning immediately prior to the
boarding was excessive and unreasonable:
a. Non-violent options should have been used in the first instance. In
particular, clear prior warning that the vessels were to be boarded and a
demonstration of dissuading force should have been given to avoid the type
of confrontation that occurred;
b. The operation should have reassessed its options when the resistance to the
initial boarding attempt became apparent so as to minimize casualties.

No link I see, as required. Typical. And you cherry picked info. Here, I can do that too... but at least I provide the required link....
http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/1922B40C9F4575598525790300457132

Report of the Secretary-General’s Panel of Inquiry
on the 31 May 2010 Flotilla Incident

September 2011

ii. The fundamental principle of the freedom of navigation on the high seas is subject to only certain limited exceptions under international law. Israel faces a real threat to its security from militant groups in Gaza. The naval blockade was imposed as a legitimate security measure in order to prevent weapons from entering Gaza by sea and its implementation complied with the requirements of international law.

iv. Although people are entitled to express their political views, the flotilla acted recklessly in attempting to breach the naval blockade. The majority of the flotilla participants had no violent intentions, but there exist serious questions about the conduct, true nature and objectives of the flotilla organizers, particularly IHH. The actions of the flotilla needlessly carried the potential for escalation.

v. The incident and its outcomes were not intended by either Turkey or Israel. Both States took steps in an attempt to ensure that events did not occur in a manner that endangered individuals’ lives and international peace and security. Turkish officials also approached the organizers of the flotilla with the intention of persuading them to change course if necessary and avoid an encounter with Israeli forces. But more could have been done to warn the flotilla participants of the potential risks involved and to dissuade them from their actions.

vii. Israeli Defense Forces personnel faced significant, organized and violent resistance from a group of passengers when they boarded the Mavi Marmara requiring them to use force for their own protection. Three soldiers were captured, mistreated, and placed at risk by those passengers. Several others were wounded.



The UN says the blockade is legal. Period.

Report of the Secretary-General’s Panel of Inquiry
on the 31 May 2010 Flotilla Incident - See more at: http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/1922B40C9F4575598525790300457132#sthash.gkFwzKzl.d puf

aboutime

07-05-2013, 03:41 PM

This does seem to be reaching the level of spamming.

Abbey. I would like to agree with you, but I was told differently when all of this massive, muti-page, useless stuff began. To give the member a break and leave it alone.

Of course. I'm just a useless member who must IGNORE others or else.

Robert A Whit

07-05-2013, 03:41 PM

This does seem to be reaching the level of spamming.

Who is spamming Abbey?

Voted4Reagan

07-05-2013, 03:44 PM

The fact that you do not take the printed text that is understandable. And yet, if I'm an idiot, then Netanyahu, who admitted that Israel has violated international law of the sea in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara" and apologized to Erdogan, is also an idiot, and the only one you are "smart."

As I see it, you end up insulting any dispute, which means that you, our wise not right, because when a person is angry, then it is not right!

What is your Nationality? What Country do you come from Alik Bahshi?

Marcus Aurelius

07-05-2013, 04:06 PM

link to complete UN report...
http://unispal.un.org/pdfs/GazaFlotillaPanelReport.pdf


106.

The first warning radioed by the Israeli Navy to the flotilla invited the vessels to
head for Ashdod port where the humanitarian supplies could be delivered.
338
The second warning requested them to change course and not enter the blockade area.
339
Two subsequent warnings were delivered emphasizing that “all necessary measures” would be
taken to enforce the blockade, including through the boarding of the vessels.

108.
On the best view we can form of the matter we believe it was reasonable in the
circumstances for the Israeli Navy to conclude that the vessels of the flotilla intended to
proceed to Gaza. That is what they repeatedly said. That intention was consistent with
an intention to breach the blockade.

118.
In this segment of the chapter we explore what conclusions and findings are
possible concerning the violent confrontation that occurred when Israel boarded the
Mari Marmara
. In the Panel’s view, having reviewed the two national reports there is conflicting material on many of the key points. It unfortunately may never be possible to fully establish precisely what occurred.

120.
Significant difference lies as to when live fire was first used and why. The Turkish report asserts that live fire was used from both the speedboats and helicopters before any IDF personnel had landed on the vessel, and that this prompted passengers to panic and to defend themselves.
371
The Israeli report alleges in contrast that the IDF personnel were attacked as they began to land
from the first helicopter, and three of the first to land were taken captive, requiring the resort
to the use of live fire in self-defence in order to secure the vessel

121.
It is clear from both reports that stun and smoke grenades were fired onto the deck
from the speed boats and helicopters before boarding had commenced in order to dispel
resistance by the passengers.
373
The Israeli report also confirms that beanbags and paintball rounds were fired from the
speedboats during the initial boarding attempt.
374
This is consistent with passengers’ witness accounts which describe firing from the speed
boats prior to the IDF personnel boarding the vessel.
375
But we are unable to conclude whether this included live fire during the initial
stages of the boarding attempt. However, live fire was used from speedboats once the boarding operation was underway.

122.
The two investigations reached opposite conclusions as to whether live rounds
were fired from the helicopters.
377
Several witness statements refer to live fire from the helicopters, although these vary as to whether the rounds were fired before or after boarding or by soldiers during their descent from the helicopters.
378
Available limited video footage shows soldiers descending by fast-rope but not with weapons drawn and there is no audible sound of gunfire at that point.
379
Photographs show bullet marks on the funnel of the vessel, which appear consistent with firing from above.
380
The wounds of several of the deceased were also consistent with bullets being fired from above.
381
The explanation given in the Israeli report that these shots were fired from the roof or as
victims were bending over is not dispositive on this point.
382
The Panel considers it unlikely that the soldiers fired as they descended, but does not rule
out the possibility that live fire was directed from the helicopters once the altercation on board the vessel had begun.


Looks like the UN is saying that the Israelis fired in self -defense.

Alik Bahshi

07-05-2013, 04:11 PM

Marcus. I wonder why no member has just come out, and told this guy. "NOBODY READS, or CARES what your few thousand, boring lines of endless letters says here.

Since nobody has. Please allow me.

Alik Bahshi. With due respect to you. Since none of us have any idea who you are, where you are, or what your intentions really are here.

Speaking for myself, after giving it my best effort in trying to understand what you are whining endlessly about.

"NOBODY reads, or CARES what you write here. Your endless rants formed with what appears to be a poorly blended compound of letters that run on, and on, with no purpose...other than to impress yourself with a SPEED TYPING TEST of gobblygook. YOU FAILED."

Sorry, but that's what I'll tell you. You say that no one reads my stuff, but more importantly, what you read, otherwise you would not be able to accuse me of plagiarism. And, you will not only read my text, but started looking on the Internet dirt on me. It is logical to ask the question, what is the reason that you spent so much attention on me, and the reason is that you do not want to hear the truth that you do not like and you are not able to convincingly refute it.

Marcus Aurelius

07-05-2013, 04:13 PM

Sorry, but that's what I'll tell you. You say that no one reads my stuff, but more importantly, what you read, otherwise you would not be able to accuse me of plagiarism. And, you will not only read my text, but started looking on the Internet dirt on me. It is logical to ask the question, what is the reason that you spent so much attention on me, and the reason is that you do not want to hear the truth that you do not like and you are not able to convincingly refute it.

You're a legend in your own mind.

aboutime

07-05-2013, 04:33 PM

Sorry, but that's what I'll tell you. You say that no one reads my stuff, but more importantly, what you read, otherwise you would not be able to accuse me of plagiarism. And, you will not only read my text, but started looking on the Internet dirt on me. It is logical to ask the question, what is the reason that you spent so much attention on me, and the reason is that you do not want to hear the truth that you do not like and you are not able to convincingly refute it.

Really? Okay. Tell me what I am about to say?

Speaking of Truth. No need to refute what I know to be the truth. You cannot disprove true facts. But creating your own facts, and trying to convince others...as you have been doing. Is nothing short of impressing yourself with falsehoods.

No need to prove, or refute that either.

By the way. I have never accused you of plagiarism. FACTS...honest facts. Do not lie.

Alik Bahshi

07-06-2013, 04:10 AM

Really? Okay. Tell me what I am about to say?

Speaking of Truth. No need to refute what I know to be the truth. You cannot disprove true facts. But creating your own facts, and trying to convince others...as you have been doing. Is nothing short of impressing yourself with falsehoods.

No need to prove, or refute that either.

By the way. I have never accused you of plagiarism. FACTS...honest facts. Do not lie.
What does that mean?:
[QUOTE=Voted4Reagan;649549]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by aboutime http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=648613#post648613) Jim. I did a Google search with the first paragraph, and found...it has been copied from Wikipedia.
Here is the link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Peace_Initiative (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Peace_Initiative)
So he is a plagiarist....

Alik Bahshi

Fair Warning..... The admins here do not take kindly to copyright violations... Here is your question in a different theme. Someone did not find anything better than to accuse me of plagiarism, and you gladly accepted this lie, highlighting my name in big red letters. That is your participation. I have no desire to prove something to you and make excuses.

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 07:01 AM

So do you still consider the Blockade illegal Alik?

Netenyahu's apology was NOT for the BOARDING of the ships, but for the loss of life incurred when the Israelis fought back.

It was not an admission of wrongdoing but rather a way for him to say that loss of life is never a good thing and that it could have been handled differently.

He wasn't kissing Edrogans ass ..... He was saying he was sorry that Turks had to die as a result of the Blockade.

He neither acknowledged or Rejected guilt....

And Isreal and Turkey have now totally renewed relations in Full...

It was an act of reconciliation...

Study your Maritime Law more Alik....

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 07:05 AM

So do you still consider the Blockade illegal Alik?

Netenyahu's apology was NOT for the BOARDING of the ships, but for the loss of life incurred when the Israelis fought back.

It was not an admission of wrongdoing but rather a way for him to say that loss of life is never a good thing and that it could have been handled differently.

He wasn't kissing Edrogans ass ..... He was saying he was sorry that Turks had to die as a result of the Blockade.

He neither acknowledged or Rejected guilt....

And Israel and Turkey have now totally renewed relations in Full... Full Diplomatic relations...

It was an act of reconciliation...

Study your Maritime Law more Alik....

tailfins

07-06-2013, 07:59 AM

That's what I'll tell you: a negativeattitude toward Israel has not for me, and Israel's policy, which is much moreimportant. I'mjust telling you the truth, you do not like it. Youstill have not specifically identified any place in the articles, which wouldpresent my lie. And you know why? Because it is not. Forexample, you then convince me that there is a maritime law authorizing amilitary attack in international waters on a peaceful ship, referring to theTreaty of Paris in 1856, but there is no such law, do not have it and theGeneva Convention on the Law of the Sea (1958). Yes in nature and there isno such reference. Anyof these actions are limited to the territorial waters (12 miles).
Otherwise,Israel would not apologize for his pirateactions before Turkey!

TheState of Israel as a sense of impunity, disregards not only the law of theMaritime Law, but also bombed Syria, Sudan, constantly violating Lebaneseairspace. Right-wingpolitics in Israel leads to oblivion. Israelis losing the information war, and this is recognized in Israel. Moreand more people in Israel understand the destructiveness of such a policy.It is not clearwhy, butallleft-wing forcesin Israelis calledanti-Semitic, I believe that it isright-wing politiciansareanti-Semites, becausethe stateleadto international isolation.

Isay in advance, I will find you and drops a lie that makes you and some othersare angry and hit me up to accusations of plagiarism and a lie, I do not say toname-calling me a fool, as you did. But it says onlyhelplessly as your opponent. You're angry, then you are wrong. Sofar, there is no reasoned objections, there is no specific question on the textof the topic.<o:p></o>

Swing and miss!

http://www.tsbmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/caray1.jpg

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 08:43 AM

Swing and miss!

http://www.tsbmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/caray1.jpg

http://www.ohmagif.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/drunk-golfer-trick-shot-fail.gif

Alik Bahshi

07-06-2013, 09:21 AM

http://www.ohmagif.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/drunk-golfer-trick-shot-fail.gif

Perfect illustration of my assumption of your inability to express his thoughts in words. If you previously copied the blocks Wikipedia, now copy YouTub. The only person your words here are "fool".

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 09:48 AM

Perfect illustration of my assumption of your inability to express his thoughts in words. If you previously copied the blocks Wikipedia, now copy YouTub. The only person your words here are "fool".

See... I was not talking to you with the .gif file... I was talking to Gaffer.

So pipe down... Be quiet and go post another 6000 word essay that nobody can read because you butcher the language.

You really dont matter to us around here Alik... You actually are rather pathetic with your Essays...

You dont have an original thought and you think that you are some great expert on International affairs.

Personally... we LAUGH at you.

I spoke to Henry Kissinger one day In the lobby of his office in lower Manhattan, I was 19yo at the time and learned more from him in 20 minutes then you could ever hope to learn in a lifetime..

You're just a mouthpiece for those spread Hate. You Obviously side with the Arabs.

If you are an example of an intellectual islamist, we now know why the Arabs are 1000 years behind the west.

So are you Palestinian? Turk? Azerbaijani? Your IP Addy Comes from Israel so I know youre in the Middle East.

Which is it?

Marcus Aurelius

07-06-2013, 10:48 AM

So do you still consider the Blockade illegal Alik?

Netenyahu's apology was NOT for the BOARDING of the ships, but for the loss of life incurred when the Israelis fought back.

It was not an admission of wrongdoing but rather a way for him to say that loss of life is never a good thing and that it could have been handled differently.

He wasn't kissing Edrogans ass ..... He was saying he was sorry that Turks had to die as a result of the Blockade.

He neither acknowledged or Rejected guilt....

And Isreal and Turkey have now totally renewed relations in Full...

It was an act of reconciliation...

Study your Maritime Law more Alik....

I already posted where even the UN said it was legal. He ignored the post.

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 11:16 AM

I already posted where even the UN said it was legal. He ignored the post.

I saw Marcus... and the UN Report used the San Remo Manual as a basis for determining the legality of the blockade.

The San Remo Documents as wel as the Hague Convention of 1907 and the Treaty of Paris all read exactly the same.

The United Nations report you posted only reaffirms the three pieces I quoted him... That he also ignored.

He's Stuck on that... so he Abandoned Ship.

Marcus Aurelius

07-06-2013, 11:18 AM

I saw Marcus... and the UN Report used the San Remo Manual as a basis for determining the legality of the blockade.

The San Remo Documents as wel as the Hague Convention of 1907 and the Treaty of Paris all read exactly the same.

The United Nations report you posted only reaffirms the three pieces I quoted him... That he also ignored.

He's Stuck on that... so he Abandoned Ship.

Good thing I hid the last life vest :laugh:

Robert A Whit

07-06-2013, 02:18 PM

<b style="color: rgb(62, 62, 62); line-height: 15px; background-color: rgb(229, 229, 229);">
http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Marcus Aurelius http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=650599#post650599)
I already posted where even the UN said it was legal. He ignored the post.

</b>

I saw Marcus... and the UN Report used the San Remo Manual as a basis for determining the legality of the blockade.

The San Remo Documents as wel as the Hague Convention of 1907 and the Treaty of Paris all read exactly the same.

The United Nations report you posted only reaffirms the three pieces I quoted him... That he also ignored.

He's Stuck on that... so he Abandoned Ship.

Where did Alik claim the blockade is illegal. Perhaps he believes the Turkish report.

He believes the Israelis did what the UN report says, to wit: used far too much force and did not warn they they would be boarded, and further improper tactics used to prevent loss of life. Clearly the UN report states those ships were not armed.

The UN report alleges the blockade was legal. But the boarding was not at the blockade line, it was 5 hours sailing away from the blockade line.

Seems on this forum and most others I have posted to that if it is done by Israel, it automatically is right. Maybe they are in the right, but as Alik reminds us, Israel attacks countries it is not at war with.

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 03:46 PM

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Marcus Aurelius http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=650599#post650599)
I already posted where even the UN said it was legal. He ignored the post.

Where did Alik claim the blockade is illegal. Perhaps he believes the Turkish report.

He believes the Israelis did what the UN report says, to wit: used far too much force and did not warn they they would be boarded, and further improper tactics used to prevent loss of life. Clearly the UN report states those ships were not armed.

The UN report alleges the blockade was legal. But the boarding was not at the blockade line, it was 5 hours sailing away from the blockade line.

Seems on this forum and most others I have posted to that if it is done by Israel, it automatically is right. Maybe they are in the right, but as Alik reminds us, Israel attacks countries it is not at war with.

You are an absolute and complete and total Dumbass Islamo-Pologist.

Did you read any of the supporting documents that Marcus and I posted that showed this to be legal?

Do you know why nobody likes you and many have you on ignore?

Because you are more interested in being contrary and spouting garbage.

You truly are a negative attention seeking Dumbass....

Now go get on a 777 Dreamliner and call for help on the FM-Radio...

You absolute Idiot....

Robert A Whit

07-06-2013, 03:55 PM

<b style="color: rgb(62, 62, 62); line-height: 15px; background-color: rgb(229, 229, 229);">
Where did Alik claim the blockade is illegal. Perhaps he believes the Turkish report.

He believes the Israelis did what the UN report says, to wit: used far too much force and did not warn they they would be boarded, and further improper tactics used to prevent loss of life. Clearly the UN report states those ships were not armed.

The UN report alleges the blockade was legal. But the boarding was not at the blockade line, it was 5 hours sailing away from the blockade line.

Seems on this forum and most others I have posted to that if it is done by Israel, it automatically is right. Maybe they are in the right, but as Alik reminds us, Israel attacks countries it is not at war with.

</b>

You are an absolute and complete and total Dumbass Islamo-Pologis

Clearly your mom did not school you that calling posters names is not debate.

Did you read any of the supporting documents that Marcus and I posted that showed this to be legal?

Interesting that I also said it is legal to have that blockade. And then you run that mouth trying to boost your self esteem.

Do you know why nobody likes you and many have you on ignore?e

That happens to be a lie

Because you are more interested in being contrary and spouting garbage.

Well, if that is true, you do the same thing. Actually I agreed with you that the blockade is legal yet you simply are not happy.

You truly are a negative attention seeking Dumbass....

Show where I have wasted time in petty name calling?

Now go get on a 777 Dreamliner and call for help on the FM-Radio...

You absolute Idiot..

Meaning of course in your mind you are the superior person.

Well, bragging like that must please you.

[/B]

Voted4Reagan

07-06-2013, 04:10 PM

Where did Alik claim the blockade is illegal. Perhaps he believes the Turkish report.

He believes the Israelis did what the UN report says, to wit: used far too much force and did not warn they they would be boarded, and further improper tactics used to prevent loss of life. Clearly the UN report states those ships were not armed.

The UN report alleges the blockade was legal. But the boarding was not at the blockade line, it was 5 hours sailing away from the blockade line.

Seems on this forum and most others I have posted to that if it is done by Israel, it automatically is right. Maybe they are in the right, but as Alik reminds us, Israel attacks countries it is not at war with.

You should seriously think before you speak...

#1 The Blockade is 100% Legal based on all prior Maritime Laws and Treaties.

#2 The Ship had declared it was going to run the Blockade. That made it a Legitimate Target even in International Waters. A ship doesnt have to cross the Blockade Like to be Boarded and inspected.

#3 The ship was warned several times it was approaching the Blockade line and was told to Change course for ASHDOD where the Humanitarian Cargo would be promptly brought to Gaza. This warning was repeated 3 more times. The Captain held his course.

#4 The Captain of the ship could have avoided all of this by diverting to Ashdod as requested by the Israelis.

#5 There would have been no loss of life.

#6 The loss of life lies directly on the Captain's shoulders for putting his passengers and Crew in harms way in an effort to pull off a political stunt.

#7 If the Ship had crossed the Blockade line it is considered allowable to sink her in accordance with the laws governing Blockades.

In my knowledge of Maritime law... (I have a USCG Masters License) I can assure you that the Israelis were very much prepared to send all three of those ships to the Bottom. And they would have been legally allowed to do so.

So shut up and stop talking about things you have no idea about....

So how's that FM-Radio working on the Plane Robert...?

aboutime

07-06-2013, 04:14 PM

KING FISAL-ROBERT has spoken. Nobody has permission to question the GOOD KING ROBERT.

Now a quasi-apologist for the terrorist idea's that make him feel the Humanity so deeply.

It's not nice to FOOL with KING ROBERT. You will instantly become labeled as his Alter-Enemy of Blame.

Robert A Whit

07-06-2013, 04:46 PM

You should seriously think before you speak...

#1 The Blockade is 100% Legal based on all prior Maritime Laws and Treaties.

The blockade is not in dispute by this poster. Don't know why you can't catch on.

#2 The Ship had declared it was going to run the Blockade. That made it a Legitimate Target even in International Waters. A ship doesnt have to cross the Blockade Like to be Boarded and inspected.
I am an airplane pilot, not a ships captain. I presume you are telling the truth unlike how you treat me. I recall that the ship did declare it would keep heading to Gaza but then what happened? The ship changed course to a point in Egypt. It was boarded from a helicopter well after it changed course to egypt. And to add insult to injury, it had no weapons on the ship nor supplies to wage war. Ships Crews have the right to defend the ship. And as a ship's master, you know they do. But you won't speak to that part. Why not?

#3 The ship was warned several times it was approaching the Blockade line and was told to Change course for ASHDOD where the Humanitarian Cargo would be promptly brought to Gaza. This warning was repeated 3 more times. The Captain held his course.

5 hours distant from the blockade is no threat. The Captain changed course. You ought to read the UN report. On open seas, captains are the sole authority.

#4 The Captain of the ship could have avoided all of this by diverting to Ashdod as requested by the Israelis.

He changed course per the UN report.

#5 There would have been no loss of life
Would there have been loss of life had the ship not been boarded from the air and sea?

Why did Isreal attack from the air given the ship was not armed? I am no expert but believe if our Coast guard intends to board a ship that refuses to comply, a warning, perhaps a shot is fired to make it clear to the captain he must stop. This attack commenced just before dawn. It was a sneak raid. The UN report says so.

#6 The loss of life lies directly on the Captain's shoulders for putting his passengers and Crew in harms way in an effort to pull off a political stunt.

Here is where you and I agree. Clearly the ships were playing politics yet at least the major ship was on course to Egypt. Still, 5 sailing hrs from the blockade shows me that Israel acted way too soon and as the UN report states, the attack was not following the rules.

#7 If the Ship had crossed the Blockade line it is considered allowable to sink her in accordance with the laws governing Blockades.

I don't doubt you.
In my knowledge of Maritime law... (I have a USCG Masters License) I can assure you that the Israelis were very much prepared to send all three of those ships to the Bottom. And they would have been legally allowed to do so.

So shut up and stop talking about things you have no idea about....

So how's that FM-Radio working on the Plane Robert...?

I hold a pilots license and believe that ships captains and airplane captains/pilots are held to the same standards of command.

Since you refuse to know my complaint, it is the same complaint the UN has.

All you need to do is read the UN complaint and I agree with that complaint.

Were it me, at the UN, I might have put a lot more credit on the Turks report than the report from Israel. But I simply like being fair and not bigoted.

Didn't Netanyahu tell the Turks he is sorry?

I have not read his actual full statement but it seems he did.

[/B]
*

Robert A Whit

07-06-2013, 04:47 PM

KING FISAL-ROBERT has spoken. Nobody has permission to question the GOOD KING ROBERT.

Now a quasi-apologist for the terrorist idea's that make him feel the Humanity so deeply.

It's not nice to FOOL with KING ROBERT. You will instantly become labeled as his Alter-Enemy of Blame.

You are too fucking funny. Got more material to show us all?

aboutime

07-06-2013, 06:11 PM

You are too fucking funny. Got more material to show us all?

Sure thing. Got any photo's of yourself?

Drummond

07-09-2013, 06:01 PM

Perfect illustration of my assumption of your inability to express his thoughts in words. If you previously copied the blocks Wikipedia, now copy YouTub. The only person your words here are "fool".

They say that a picture says a thousand words. So, you should average out at 5 pictures per post. What's more, they'll be easier on the eye.

So with this in mind, I've a challenge for you.

Considering the thread title, would you care to - with evidence of where you source them from, and what exactly it is we'll be viewing, of course - care to post 5 pictures of so-called 'Israeli terrorism' ... that's to say, pictorial evidence of 'terrorism' from Israel that wasn't a response to an earlier terrorist act committed by Israel's enemies ?

Alik Bahshi

07-19-2013, 09:41 AM

They say that a picture says a thousand words. So, you should average out at 5 pictures per post. What's more, they'll be easier on the eye.

So with this in mind, I've a challenge for you.

Considering the thread title, would you care to - with evidence of where you source them from, and what exactly it is we'll be viewing, of course - care to post 5 pictures of so-called 'Israeli terrorism' ... that's to say, pictorial evidence of 'terrorism' from Israel that wasn't a response to an earlier terrorist act committed by Israel's enemies ?

All my themes are based on the known facts, so there is no need to confirm the photographs. On terrorism, the issue is analyzed in detail by me in the topic "International terrorism and its interested parties."

Marcus Aurelius

07-19-2013, 09:47 AM

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Drummond http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=651208#post651208)
They say that a picture says a thousand words. So, you should average out at 5 pictures per post. What's more, they'll be easier on the eye.

So with this in mind, I've a challenge for you.

Considering the thread title, would you care to - with evidence of where you source them from, and what exactly it is we'll be viewing, of course - care to post 5 pictures of so-called 'Israeli terrorism' ... that's to say, pictorial evidence of 'terrorism' from Israel that wasn't a response to an earlier terrorist act committed by Israel's enemies ?

All my themes are based on the known facts, so there is no need to confirm the photographs. On terrorism, the issue is analyzed in detail by me in the topic "International terrorism and its interested parties."

Translation for those who do not speak 'Dumbass'...

I don't need to prove anything to you. I say it, so that alone makes it fact. PPPPPPPPPPPPPttttthhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!

aboutime

07-19-2013, 01:35 PM

All my themes are based on the known facts, so there is no need to confirm the photographs. On terrorism, the issue is analyzed in detail by me in the topic "International terrorism and its interested parties."

Alik. So tell us. How much does HAMAS pay you for your endless PROPAGANDA campaigns?

And, are you related to 'jafar'?

jimnyc

07-19-2013, 01:38 PM

I lay 100-1 odds that Alik is a Palestinian! Likely a big fan of Hamas as well.

Alik Bahshi

07-20-2013, 01:25 AM

I lay 100-1 odds that Alik is a Palestinian! Likely a big fan of Hamas as well.

The fight Hamas is no different from the actions of the Jewish partisans during the occupation of Palestine by Britain.

jimnyc

07-20-2013, 05:35 AM

The fight Hamas is no different from the actions of the Jewish partisans during the occupation of Palestine by Britain.

Just as I figured, a terrorist supporting palestinian. Do you drag bodies down the road behind motorcycles too?

Larrymc

07-20-2013, 06:31 AM

Recently, after a three-year denial of guilt in the incident occurred with the "Mavi Marmara", Israel has admitted his guilt and apologized to Turkey with the promise of compensation for those killed Turkish citizens. This article was written immediately after the attack on the flotilla of Israeli soldiers.Israel bombed the territory of a sovereign state of Syria, which has long been an everyday fact in the region. ForIsrael, there are no international borders. This fits inall that relates to the path chosenby Israel, the road to oblivion. Israel does not seek peace, he seeks war. <o:p></o
<o:p> </o
Alik Bahshi

<o:p></o<o:p</o>
Israel - nest of international terrorism

"I do not know who slander weaves,
That slander then kill him "
M. Sa'di

Who would have guessed that from the ancienttimes to the expanses of the Mediterranean - the cradle of civilization, back thepirates. Thought about it and the people who slept the sweet predawn sleep incabins Turkish cruise ship «Mavi Marmara», when they climb aboard, and the upper deck literally descended from the sky armed Israeli commandos. Capturingthe peaceful ship in international waters was carried out, that is not otherwise classified as piracy, well, the fact that the action takes place under cover of darkness emphasizes his malice. An attempt unarmed people prevent lawlessness unleashed a savage open fire for effect. The result- 9 killed and dozens wounded. An importantfact, which highlights the criminal actions of commandos, is Israel's attempt to turn off the information from the attacked flotilla «Free Gaza».
Turks accuse shot that they are guilty, to resist the unlawful violence isequivalent to, as if to justify the armed gunman who killed the home owner because the latter attacked the gunman at the time when he broke into the house.

Seeing how the international situation is very icky hit Israel, Jewish journalists raised a real ruckus blaming everything and everyone: Turkey in aplanned provocation and Islamization, America and Europe again in the same Islamization, human rights and peace-keepers in a lie. In the heat of hysteria notorious hater Palestinians E. Bonner (http://alikbahshi.livejournal.com/ #post-alikbahshi-7804), rejecting the slogan "two states for two peoples" and trying to justify illegal actions of Israel, calls to leave political correctness. And it is clear why. Because she is, political correctness, in no way compatible with asplash terry cynicism by Bonner. Human rights activist, she has positioned herself, said that only "a bloated stomach and hands andlegs like sticks" reflect the degree of depletion of the hungry, andif this feature is not observed in the Palestinian children, and no humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza. In this nelly not think that tummy, glued tothe spine, which can be seen in the pictures of the children of Auschwitz, Naziorganization is proof of excellent food for prisoners of concentration camps.It is not about political correctness, speech, and the complete absence of MrsBonner morality. Even living together with a man of conscience and morality ofthe Great was powerless in this case.
Bonner echoes the cynicism, I would say, impudent cynicism Israeli ForeignMinister Lieberman, known for his special "love of peace" to theArabs. Mr. Minister share with the world the revelation consists in the factthat the people of Gaza eat at expensive restaurants! This, in his view,exposes the absurdity of talking about a humanitarian catastrophe. It becomes clear why among a long list of forbidden foods for Gaza there is chocolate. Onlycare about the health of the people, in order to protect the Palestinians from diabetes. I was thinking, did the dream Lieberman for the Palestinian cause, which lay in the fact that you first need tocarry out carpet bombing, then the surviving Palestinians hard to feed, and there will be peace and blessings.
Explaining the massacre of peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» in international waters, Lieberman did not see it as anything extraordinary, because, as hesays, are more significant in the world in terms of numbers of people andkilling a dozen dead Turks not worth attention, to stir up political scandal.Very interesting idea! Israel then was it worth venturing Second Lebanon because of the two abducted Israeli soldiers?

Want to look at the big lie that is present in the statements of journalist shanging out at the "Echo of Moscow" (Latynina, Radzikhovsky), andevery time, foaming at the mouth to justify any aggression by Israel. Ideliberately thought shovels newspaper "foaming at the mouth", which thought it had the most successful party promoters phrase that defines the final verdict of "Western libel", but which this time exactly true.They lie hidden here:
"And now about the so-called blockade of the Gaza Strip. Well whatabout the fact that the imaginary "blockade" - it's just political isolation after the rise to power of the Hamas terrorist organization, which themselves Palestinian Authority to put it mildly disagree. And what does the"blockade? Since Israel is constantly all imported products, energy and products needed for life. The restrictions imposed on Gaza was a response to the kidnapping of Hamas terrorists to Israel soldier Gilad Shalit "
In justification of military action to seize flotilla «Free Gaza» Bonnerwrites: "Israel, like any country, not only can, but must - it is the main duty of any government - to protect the country from penetrating into itsterritory of any danger to its citizens of the subject." But from the previous quote that Gaza is not Israeli territory. So where is the truth? Fleet, as we know, went to Gaza, not in Israel. Conclusion: Bonner is not that the question has to be taken seriously its dilettantism. It seems to me thatMs. Bonner does not really know where it borders Israel.
First, that was before the blockade. And before the blockade was not so Jewish settlers, who represented 5% of the total population of the Gaza Strip owned40% of arable land, not including the territory on which the substantial forcesof the Israeli army for the settlers, who in turn were armed with automaticrifles. The Arab population of Gaza, squeezed on a little pressed to the seaplot (density of population in Gaza is one of the largest in the world) and thedestitute, desperate to resist the occupation and as a result in 2005, Israelwas forced to withdraw the army and dismantle Jewish settlements. But Israel retained control of Gaza while continuing to complete isolation from the outside world. In fact, the Strip, surrounded by a concrete wall, turned to the Arabsinto a huge open-air prison and the only way for the Arabs have only seen inthe continuation of the struggle for freedom. Unbearable living conditions caused the radicalization of society and the rise to power of Hamas in 2006.Trying to suppress the resistance, Israel missed through checkpoints fuel and food, sometimes shuts off electricity and water supplies. Israeli military boats stopped any possibility of fishing. In 2007 there was a famine in Gaza,Palestinians vgryzlis like moles in the ground breaking underground tunnelsthrough which came primarily food and fuel from Egyptian territory. Thus, journalists lie "Echo of Moscow" is available. No appearance in the political arena has caused the blockade of Hamas, and Israel is trying to putthe Palestinian people to their knees by resorting to the blockade, was reasonfor the popularity of Hamas, against which Mahmoud Abbas became a political corpse.
Imagine, for example, that France will block the Netherlands, isolates it fromt he outside world, erecting a concrete wall. One need not be a rocket scientistto understand what can pour out such a venture. The blockade of Gaza is anintegral part of the policy of apartheid against the Palestinian people. At the same time, the blockade - a desperate attempt to break the will of thePalestinian people, the Palestinian resistance movement split into two isolated enclave and thus cause internal political divisions.

<o:p></o>
Now about the Islamization of Turkey, which Latynina with Radzikhovsky blame the deterioration of relations with Israel. Thus, Islam is a religion, but religionin Turkey is separated from state constitutionally can not be said about Israel. Turkey - a secular country, and rabbis in Israel are members of the parliament and government. Moreover, part of the laws of Israel are halachic and here we should note that Judaism, unlike other religious ideologies,contains an element of hatred, as it believes the Jewish people chosen by God,are qualitatively different from non-Jews, that is, from the rest of humanity.Incidentally, of all the members of the Israeli parliament, convicted of theft,namely rabbis politicians have succeeded in this "godly" case overall.
Separation of church and state is a necessary indicator of the degree of democratization of society, but also, and most importantly, Turkey has implemented the Constitution and the basic principles of democracy - the separation of legislative and executive powers, which is not in Israel, and therefore it is not Israel, and Turkey is currently the only democratic countryin the region, not Israel, and Turkey is an outpost of democracy in the MiddleEast. And about Islamisation, there is the country, which would not have been a synagogue? Judaism is better than Islam? Actually, to put someone to blame whathe in the same shit on the ears, at least unwise. Religion has brought a lot of troubles of humanity. Polytheism of ancient Greece and the Roman Empire containeda more democracy than monotheism, which caused religious hatred and religious wars. Remember the era of the Crusades, the endless slaughter of Catholics and Protestants, the destruction of ancient monuments - a whole layer of cultural heritage was destroyed will fully Christianity. The grim history - the Inquisition is also required to monotheistic religions. All this is aconsequence of monotheism, which each overtighten over. Democracy is anecessary condition for the removal from power of the dogma of the Faith, and,I repeat, in this respect, Israel is far behind Turkey and not much differentfrom the Islamic Republic of Iran (see "Revolution or Sephardic Jewish Republic of Israel»).
As for the accusations of Israel to Turkey, allegedly organized the flotilla«Free Gaza» a provocative way to get some political points, they are easily swept aside the fact that the cargo ship «Rachel Corrie» the Irish. Surely Ireland provoked Israel? It would be interesting to know from the MinisterLieberman what were the goals of such insidious Ireland? On it Lieberman's no answer.
Funny explanation participation of Europeans in "provocations" givesLatynina: "Israel must rely only on himself, he should not count onthose European bastards, who cooperate with the terrorists, because terrorists are asked for their help." Latynina goes by that bastards, what it considers the human rights activist Rachel Corrie, whose name is called Israel seized a ship gave her life in order to provoke Israel to crush an army bulldozer himself standing in his way at the time the order to destroy the house of a Palestinian family. Brings to mind the poet Saadi, M.:

<o:p></o>
"Since you speak badly about people,
Let you're right - inside of you bad "

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But in this case, talking about the rightness Latynina and didnot have to. Latynina not understand the motivation of this action by the total absence of morality, and there is no other explanation. However, this, I wouldsay, "advantage" in the absence of morality and other journalist shave "Echo of Moscow" M.Fishman, V.Shenderovich (see "Word,fornication or full Albats»).

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But this gibberish Latynina, just some baby talk, a normalperson is difficult to understand: "Europe is no longer Europe, freedomin Europe quietly turns into its opposite. In particular, in the bureaucracy,which is openly collaborating with terrorist regimes because these regimes areasking for money and depict unhappy people and unhappy always a pleasure tohelp. "
If Europe by Latynina, is not free, and America, with its generally dissolute Obama, then a truly free country will henceforth consider Israel!
Presumably, this is another example of the confusion Yu.Latyninoy, as in thissentence its "peaceful Palestinian convoy of humanitarian aid bound for Gaza» , which shows that the journalist does not know what Flotilla (caravan) peace convoy of ships cannotbe. Escort for these vessels were Israeli warships when the sights of his gunbarrels peacekeepers escorted the flotilla to the port of Ashdod.

What is the cause violent incident? What made Israel in such a frankinternational crime? Response - the impunity afforded by the most powerful country in the world - America, at least it was until now.

The Arab-Israeli conflict is the generator of international terrorism, which isthe part of the state of Israel has grown. Persist in continuing the occupation of Palestine, Israel increasingly immersed in the quagmire, he pursued the practice of international terrorism, and refusal to comply with numerous decisions of the Security Council to condemn Israel, leading to disastrous pathisolation.


Israel deliberately does not recognize that there is a permanent war with the Palestinians, and reduces it to a series of terrorist attacks, responding to their legal vendetta. Persecution and elimination of the leaders of the Palestinian resistance is around the world, across borders and countries. Due to the fact that the moral substance of the conflict on the side of the Palestinians, Israel can not seek an international arrest warrant and the court, because the mass is inevitable unpleasant issuesof Israel itself, and therefore uses the services of knights of cloak and dagger. Hence not civilized Mossad immoral acts like the murder in Dubai. Immorality lies in the fact that the Israeli secret service con the citizens of other countries, using fake passports, creating aninternational scandal, which only worsens the image of Israel, describing theJewish state as a hotbed of international terrorism. Pirate capture peaceful flotilla «Free Gaza» is a strong case to.

Sorry i have to admit i did not read it all, but i get the gist of it. Israel is protected by the one true God, I could explain it but it would involve the Holy Bible, im guessing you have no regard for either, But you might consider this, with all who have and do seek to totally annihilate Israel, it stands strong, a virtual hornets nest, why is that considering there size?

Alik Bahshi

07-20-2013, 11:14 AM

Sorry i have to admit i did not read it all, but i get the gist of it. Israel is protected by the one true God, I could explain it but it would involve the Holy Bible, im guessing you have no regard for either, But you might consider this, with all who have and do seek to totally annihilate Israel, it stands strong, a virtual hornets nest, why is that considering there size?
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Well, at least one sample answer without cussing, maybe because it refers to God. But here's the problem, and that Hitler was not averse to call upon God to help.