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View Full Version : Work Place Violence? Terrorism? Questions May Have An Answer



Kathianne
06-06-2013, 12:29 AM
http://www.csmonitor.com/layout/set/print/USA/Justice/2013/0605/With-Nidal-Hasan-bombshell-time-to-call-Fort-Hood-shooting-a-terror-attack


With Nidal Hasan bombshell, time to call Fort Hood shooting a terror attack? Maj. Nidal Hasan, the Army major facing court-martial for a mass shooting at Fort Hood in 2009, plans to argue that he acted in defense of the Taliban in Afghanistan. So much for the official US line that the shootings were an act of workplace violence, critics say.


By Patrik Jonsson (http://www.csmonitor.com/About/Staff/Patrik-Jonsson), Staff writer / June 5, 2013


The admission by Army Maj. Nidal Hasan (http://www.csmonitor.com/tags/topic/Nidal+Malik+Hasan) on Tuesday that he attacked Fort Hood (http://www.csmonitor.com/tags/topic/Fort+Hood) in 2009 in defense of “the leadership of the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan (http://www.csmonitor.com/tags/topic/Afghanistan), the Taliban (http://www.csmonitor.com/tags/topic/The+Taliban)” has suddenly undermined the Obama administration (http://www.csmonitor.com/tags/topic/Barack+Obama)’s previous contention that the murders of 13 soldiers at the Texas base constituted an act of “workplace violence.”


Hasan’s legal argument, which is being considered by the judge, Col. Tara Osborn, may reignite the political furor over how the Obama administration has classified the shootings, as well as arguments about whether the mass shootings constituted the first major Islamic jihadist attack on the US after 9/11. As recently as May 23, President Obama said no "large-scale" terrorism attacks on the homeland have occurred on his watch.


Officials at the US Department of Defense have said there isn't enough evidence to put Hasan on trial for an act of terrorism, and they have worried that such a claim could undermine the Army major's right to a fair trial.



Critics argue that the Fort Hood incident has not been characterized as a jihadist attack in part to give the Obama administration political and policy cover. Moreover, they add, the Obama position works to the detriment of shooting victims, which includes the 32 wounded and the families of those killed. Victims would have been eligible for combat compensation under US law if the Pentagon had classified Hasan not as a murderous US Army psychiatrist but rather as an enemy combatant or an “associated force” under the Military Commissions Act of 2006, they say.


“If you were an apologist for Hasan, you can no longer advance the false narrative that he’s a disgruntled employee,” says Jeffrey Addicott, director of the Center for Terrorism Law in San Antonio, Texas. “He has now labeled himself as a jihadist Islamist murderer, a hardcore jihadist. It’s now clear…, in spite of our leadership in this country, including the Department of Defense and Obama, what his motives are.”

...

logroller
06-06-2013, 12:57 AM
A "bombshell", really???

I'm curious though, I believe that double jeopardy would apply for the murders themselves, so he couldn't be charged again after his trial-- for murder -- but a charge of terrorism could still be levied after his conviction for murder, and thus the military appropriations act could apply to the victims.

So after being tried, convicted, discharged and sentenced to death for murder, he can be tried as a terrorist too using his own defense as testament to the fact.

Kathianne
06-06-2013, 01:03 AM
A "bombshell", really???

I'm curious though, I believe that double jeopardy would apply for the murders themselves, so he couldn't be charged again after his trial-- for murder -- but a charge of terrorism could still be levied after his conviction for murder, and thus the military appropriations act could apply to the victims.

So after being tried, convicted, discharged and sentenced to death for murder, he can be tried as a terrorist too using his own defense as testament to the fact.

Old adage, "He who represents himself has a fool for a lawyer." Hassan fits the bill with the 'bombshell' that it wasn't the workplace, but war. Then again, he probably doesn't care, but it's a hell of a place for Obama to be.

logroller
06-06-2013, 02:03 AM
Old adage, "He who represents himself has a fool for a lawyer." Hassan fits the bill with the 'bombshell' that it wasn't the workplace, but war. Then again, he probably doesn't care, but it's a hell of a place for Obama to be.
As though Obama needs help making his policies stink: it's like farting at a sewage plant.

red states rule
06-06-2013, 02:14 AM
The reasons why Obama refuses to call this an act of terror are easy to see

1) He does not want to admit terrorism is still a problem. After all he said the war on terror is over

2) BY NOT calling it an act of terror he gets to screw those wounded by this SOB the benefits they are entitled to

As always it is all about Obama and how it helps/hurts his image

fj1200
06-06-2013, 08:01 AM
http://www.csmonitor.com/layout/set/print/USA/Justice/2013/0605/With-Nidal-Hasan-bombshell-time-to-call-Fort-Hood-shooting-a-terror-attack

Maj. Nidal Hasan, the Army major facing court-martial for a mass shooting at Fort Hood in 2009, plans to argue that he acted in defense of the Taliban in Afghanistan. So much for the official US line that the shootings were an act of workplace violence, critics say.

Does that make treason the appropriate charge?


Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.

Whatever speeds up the imposition of capital punishment gets my vote.

Kathianne
06-06-2013, 09:42 AM
Does that make treason the appropriate charge?



Whatever speeds up the imposition of capital punishment gets my vote.

I'm not a lawyer, I don't think treason as defined though really fits. The question to me has always been that by defining it as 'workplace violence,' the victims whom were forced to be unarmed under orders of military base, were not permitted benefits that same injuries would have allowed under war conditions. That the incident occurred though had everything to do with war.

jimnyc
06-06-2013, 09:44 AM
Whatever speeds up the imposition of capital punishment gets my vote.

That was my thinking when I read he was going to defend himself, that it's that much quicker before he is dead. The 9th circuit doesn't have any access to this on appeal, would they? LOL Those assholes would likely grant him a new trial based on ineffective counsel. :(

Marcus Aurelius
06-06-2013, 09:52 AM
Old adage, "He who represents himself has a fool for a lawyer." Hassan fits the bill with the 'bombshell' that it wasn't the workplace, but war. Then again, he probably doesn't care, but it's a hell of a place for Obama to be.

'client', actually. But, 6 of one, half a dozen of the other, right?

Kathianne
06-06-2013, 09:55 AM
'client', actually. But, 6 of one, half a dozen of the other, right?

LOL! Seems there are many slight variations on this. I actually went for a 'quote' and source of, nothing. Just lots of variations on it. Even found a version from Samuel Johnson, no surprise there.

red states rule
06-06-2013, 09:55 AM
That was my thinking when I read he was going to defend himself, that it's that much quicker before he is dead. The 9th circuit doesn't have any access to this on appeal, would they? LOL Those assholes would likely grant him a new trial based on ineffective counsel. :(

He probably will still do life on death row

and he is still collecting his pay and other benefits even after murdering over a dozen people

fj1200
06-06-2013, 10:03 AM
I'm not a lawyer, I don't think treason as defined though really fits. The question to me has always been that by defining it as 'workplace violence,' the victims whom were forced to be unarmed under orders of military base, were not permitted benefits that same injuries would have allowed under war conditions. That the incident occurred though had everything to do with war.

But treason includes war. Nevertheless I think log had the best argument on why he is being charged the way he is.

Kathianne
06-06-2013, 10:08 AM
But treason includes war. Nevertheless I think log had the best argument on why he is being charged the way he is.

Best argument for the government, not for the victims. What's been done to those serving, killed, and wounded is a travesty. Now with him acting as his own 'fool,' he will not only be able to propagandize, he will be able to not only face his victims, but question them aggressively. Talk about the government's concern regarding PTSD.

red states rule
06-06-2013, 10:19 AM
Best argument for the government, not for the victims. What's been done to those serving, killed, and wounded is a travesty. Now with him acting as his own 'fool,' he will not only be able to propagandize, he will be able to not only face his victims, but question them aggressively. Talk about the government's concern regarding PTSD.

Amazing how this is tolerated but if you get your food a Chick fil A and show your support for traditional marriage - you are damn near thrown in the stockade

WTF????

fj1200
06-06-2013, 10:19 AM
Best argument for the government, not for the victims. What's been done to those serving, killed, and wounded is a travesty. Now with him acting as his own 'fool,' he will not only be able to propagandize, he will be able to not only face his victims, but question them aggressively. Talk about the government's concern regarding PTSD.

I think we can agree that conviction is the primary motive here. I'll presume that him acting as his own fool would also allow him to do so under any scheme; but I could certainly be wrong about that.

fj1200
06-06-2013, 10:21 AM
Amazing how this is tolerated but if you get your food a Chick fil A and show your support for traditional marriage - you are damn near thrown in the stockade

WTF????

Rules suck huh?