avg retired joe home owner vs police

[revelarts]

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these police are real tough guys. yep

[Marcus Aurelius]

thankfully, this represents the vast minority of police officers.

[Abbey Marie]

thankfully, this represents the vast minority of police officers.

Some say they don't exist. Only lying, faux "victims". :eek:

[Marcus Aurelius]

Some say they don't exist. Only lying, faux "victims". :eek:

They exist in every profession. In most cases, as I said, they are the vast minority and represent bad people in general, rather than the profession itself.

[taft2012]

I watched this twice trying to figure out what was going on, and mostly only heard some cotton-mouthed mumbling punctuated by loud piercing screams.

Near as I can tell; a Constitutional crisis of some sort was triggered when a young woman requested a uniformed police escort to re-enter a shotgun shack she used to dwell in to retrieve her Waffle House waitress skirt, which naturally gave Constitutional cause to said shotgun shack resident to confront them with a firearm.

The police involved, clearly recruited from the local moonshining population, could have and should have articulated the reason for their presence better, but I'm not sure it would have mattered much to said shotgun shack resident, who clearly has the pothead conservative talking points down pat. Undoubtedly, the resident panicked at the thought of his thrift shop sofa/bed being confiscated by the constabulary. The situation certainly justified resorting directly to a firearm rather than waiting until later to file a complaint with the officer's superiors. :rolleyes:

In local news... a Darwin Award winner stepped out from between parked cars this week, in the wee hours of the morning with an iPod blasting in his ears, which prevented him from hearing (and seeing apparently) a police car responding to an emergency with lights and sirens blaring. In an act of overt racism, the police cruiser plowed over him, demonstrating once again the need to legalize marijuana. :laugh2:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdCAw0isacQ

[fj1200]

... the pothead conservative talking points...

I see you've abandoned the defense in your "pothead conservative" thread so that you can continue to make assertions based in ignorance and with a weak intellectual footing. Good on 'ya bro.

[taft2012]

I see you've abandoned the defense in your "pothead conservative" thread so that you can continue to make assertions based in ignorance and with a weak intellectual footing. Good on 'ya bro.

I haven't abandoned anything Cheech.

Least of all, due to your allegedly compelling arguments. :rolleyes:

So what's the pothead position here? If someone who used to live in a dwelling returns with a uniformed police officer to retrieve her clothes without incident, the occupant has the right to open fire?

"Of course! The cop may stumble across my stash!"

[fj1200]

I haven't abandoned anything Cheech.

Least of all, due to your allegedly compelling arguments. :rolleyes:

I'll have to check the (lack of) activity in that thread.

[taft2012]

I'll have to check the (lack of) activity in that thread.

Yeah, along with the level of derailment.

Please get back to us with a detailed analysis and report. OK? Thnx. :rolleyes:

[fj1200]

Yeah, along with the level of derailment.

Please get back to us with a detailed analysis and report. OK? Thnx. :rolleyes:

Derailment? Is that what you call it when someone challenges your "logic" and you have no answer for it due to your inherent inconsistencies? Besides I already responded to your post there and the crickets are deafening which only reinforces previous conclusions.

[taft2012]

I wish the US Constitution afforded some protections against on-line leg-humping from pwned individuals who lack the self-awareness to move on. :rolleyes:

[tailfins]

these police are real tough guys. yep

Paddle faster, I hear banjos.


I wish the US Constitution afforded some protections against on-line leg-humping from pwned individuals who lack the self-awareness to move on. :rolleyes:

Apparently, there are banjos in parts of New York. You know what they say about wishing: "Wish in one hand and poop in the other and see which fills up first".

[revelarts]

Taft your blindness is painful, you wouldn't see Bigfoot if he picked you up took you home and made his roommate.

What normal people see is 2 cops breaking the law harassing a man for no reason. 1 walking into a home without a warrant, without invitation, without IDing himself then he assaults and handcuffs an old man because the officer is in fear of his life since a calm respectful citizen has gun in his house. Then remembering his police lines once he realized a camera was on. The other off duty cop with ZERO city authority acting an @ss on his own time, attacking a man and then lying to create false charges against an innocent party by lying to police. Both officers finally being called on their day of protect'n n serv'n by the news media and thankfully their own department heads and hopefully court.


As for your glee over police killing a young man by accident with their car. I have nothing to say to that except I pray you retire soon.

[fj1200]

I wish the US Constitution afforded some protections against on-line leg-humping from pwned individuals who lack the self-awareness to move on. :rolleyes:

I can see why you defend handcuffing "perps," they might outwit you.

[logroller]

thankfully, this represents the vast minority of police officers.
I know. I've seen three civil standbys, and not once did the officer carry out the luggage-- that guy's a gem.:dance:

[Marcus Aurelius]

I wish the US Constitution afforded some protections against on-line leg-humping from pwned individuals who lack the self-awareness to move on. :rolleyes:

If it did you'd never be able to post on this board again.

[Robert A Whit]

Yesterday, 2 plain clothes detectives were killed by the guy they went to talk to.

When he shot them, he then fled about a block away where uniforned cops confronted him and blew him away in a hail of bullets. Today the News shows the scene of the cops killing the killer.

Some pretty large holes are in the door from what is called a hail of cop bullets. The perp it is sayd shot a lot of bullets at the cops and it was quite the gun battle.

A 30 year vet not far from retiring was shot to death by the perp along with a female detective who had 10 years of service.

Now, this is in CA where we have the worst gun laws in the nation.

Every weekend the news informs us residents turn in their guns and mostly to be paid for the guns.

Some residents surrender their guns for free.

So, even if you have an assault gun ban, you will have people killed. And even cops who have guns will die.

This is so sad. I wonder if you guy living back east heard of these 2 cops shot to death Tuesday?

This happened in Santa Cruz, Ca about an hour from me. This is the first case of cops being shot in that city. I have always considered that beach front city as a safe city.

[gabosaurus]

Bad cops are like bad Marines. You don't want them to exist, but they do.

[taft2012]

What normal people see is 2 cops breaking the law harassing a man for no reason. 1 walking into a home without a warrant, without invitation, without IDing himself

Wrong again, Alpo breath.

From what I was able to gather without the luxury of subtitles is that the young Princess Diana of Tennessee was returning to a place she dwelled in to retrieve some personal items. That person has to legal authority to grant the police entrance to said shotgun shack, even if she isn't the owner. As long as she had a legal address there.

No invitation necessary, no warrant needed. And I did point out that the responding moonshine cop could have been more informative towards the hillbilly.

However, if you really want to contend said hillbilly didn't know why the woman was coming into the shotgun shack with a uniformed officer, and was justified in pulling out a roscoe...then you're flat out lying.


The other off duty cop with ZERO city authority acting an @ss on his own time, attacking a man and then lying to create false charges against an innocent party by lying to police. Both officers finally being called on their day of protect'n n serv'n by the news media and thankfully their own department heads and hopefully court.

Yeah, I had no idea of what was going on with that moonshine cop especially, cotton-mouthed drawling punctuated by high-pitched screaming. I think the world would be a much better place if the entire cast of characters was locked up.



As for your glee over police killing a young man by accident with their car. I have nothing to say to that except I pray you retire soon.

Wrong yet again, Chuck Wagon breath.

That wasn't posted out of glee. I was just showing how your "cops are always wrong" brethren run around screaming about "the racist cops killed him" without having any idea of what happened.

Said dingleberry was grooving to his iPod at a decibel level that drowned out approaching wailing police sirens. He also so entrenched in his music that he didn't see the lights either. So dingleberry walked out from between two parked cars into the path of a speeding police cruiser responding to an emergency.

The NYC liberals weren't interested in the truth (like you), they merely went into their "blame the cops first" mode. Typical of liberals... and interestingly, typical of you. Really, it is just so easy to peg you phonies as the liberals you are.
:salute:

[taft2012]

Bad cops are like bad Marines. You don't want them to exist, but they do.

Bad teachers are like bad cops... you don't want them to exist but they do.

Right?:laugh2:

[aboutime]

Bad cops are like bad Marines. You don't want them to exist, but they do.


Honey Bun. You forgot to add Bad, Pretend, Former Teachers are like that too! But, with that LOG in your eye. You are blinded by stupidity.

[taft2012]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/n-teacher-nabbed-allegedly-offering-student-sex-cash-article-1.1273042?localLinksEnabled=false



A New Jersey high school teacher is accused of messaging a student on Facebook and offering $50 for sex, police said.


Thomas Weir, a veteran teacher at John F. Kennedy High School in Paterson, was nabbed Saturday night in the parking lot of a restaurant where he planned to meet the student, the Passaic County Prosecutor’s Office said in a news release (http://www.pcponj.org/PDF/2013/FINAL%20Arrest%20Press%20Release%20Thomas%20Weir%2 0%28C-032-13%29.pdf).


Weir, 50, of Monticello, N.Y., was charged with attempted sexual assault, attempted endangering the welfare of a child, luring/enticing a child and official misconduct.

Please note,

I admire teachers, but I'm against the ones that molest their underage students.

I hope everyone qualifies their respect for teachers in that manner.... :laugh2:

[gabosaurus]

Bad teachers are like bad cops... you don't want them to exist but they do.


I find that few people like the police. Except when they need them.

If you are resisting or evading arrest, you deserve to have the crap beaten out of you.
If a police officer orders you to put your hands in the air, and you reach for your belt area, you deserve to be shot.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

[Robert A Whit]

I find that few people like the police. Except when they need them.

If you are resisting or evading arrest, you deserve to have the crap beaten out of you.
If a police officer orders you to put your hands in the air, and you reach for your belt area, you deserve to be shot.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

I have heard of hanging judges in the old days but now you want killer cops. Amazing.

When my daughter trained using cops clubs, she showed me how nasty those clubs are. They are very hard and remind me of being hit with a steel bar.

My daughter and her cop husband were not trained to shoot as you say they should. Cops have available more than one type of club.

[taft2012]

I have heard of hanging judges in the old days but now you want killer cops. Amazing.

When my daughter trained using cops clubs, she showed me how nasty those clubs are. They are very hard and remind me of being hit with a steel bar.

My daughter and her cop husband were not trained to shoot as you say they should. Cops have available more than one type of club.

Go back and ask your daughter and her husband again. If they were taught: "When you tell someone to put their hands up in the air and instead they reach for their waistband .... DON'T SHOOT! Instead, try to use some sort of non-lethal force like a club" ....

... then they must be members of some sort of elite kamikaze unit.

[aboutime]

Go back and ask your daughter and her husband again. If they were taught: "When you tell someone to put their hands up in the air and instead they reach for their waistband .... DON'T SHOOT! Instead, try to use some sort of non-lethal force like a club" ....

... then they must be members of some sort of elite kamikaze unit.



taft. Honestly. I find all of the stories about Robert's cop family, nothing but BS.

Just watch how this is responded to here.

And I am only talking to YOU.

[taft2012]

taft. Honestly. I find all of the stories about Robert's cop family, nothing but BS.

Just watch how this is responded to here.

And I am only talking to YOU.

So true my friend. Let me share an old story with you.

My partner and I were patrolling a busy Manhattan street on foot one night. A loud ruckus was coming from inside a pizzeria. As we got closer a guy in the crowd told us "There's a guy in there waving a gun around." We pull our guns out and rush inside.

The pizza guys working behind the counter are shouting in another language pointing at the guy in question. We start yelling at him to put his hands up in the air and he keeps moving around and ignoring us. I had angle on the guy that I could catch a glimpse into his eyes and quickly pushed my partner out of the way so he wouldn't shoot.

Turned out the guy was having some kind seizure and was wandering into the back room looking for the restroom, which was an area for employees only. I told my partner "take care of this guy" and ran back out into the street looking for the a-hole who told us this guy had a gun. If he hadn't disappeared into the night and I had caught him, I would have beaten him down and arrested him for falsely reporting an incident, which the DA's Office would have dismissed because of the huge caseload of more pressing crimes to prosecute. This a-hole put this poor guy's life at risk, and almost had us shoot an innocent person... why? Because he thought it was funny? I was in a rage, and frankly, was my rage unjustifiable?

All of this happened in the course of about 10 seconds in the midst of chaotic shouting and screaming, with a crowd in our rear.

If we had shot him we could have articulated a reason why... but of course the newspapers, liberals, and pothead conservatives would have been looking to crucify us and send us to prison. Like they would have been looking to crucify me for beating in the face of the a-hole who almost got an innocent man shot. We had come *this* close to tragedy.

We put the seizure guy into an ambulance and continued on our way.

Anyone who thinks this is an easy profession to understand and that they are experts in police work, because they have family member who does it, is talking out of his ass.

[aboutime]

So true my friend. Let me share an old story with you.

My partner and I were patrolling a busy Manhattan street on foot one night. A loud ruckus was coming from inside a pizzeria. As we got closer a guy in the crowd told us "There's a guy in there waving a gun around." We pull our guns out and rush inside.

The pizza guys working behind the counter are shouting in another language pointing at the guy in question. We start yelling at him to put his hands up in the air and he keeps moving around and ignoring us. I had angle on the guy that I could catch a glimpse into his eyes and quickly pushed my partner out of the way so he wouldn't shoot.

Turned out the guy was having some kind seizure and was wandering into the back room looking for the restroom, which was an area for employees only. I told my partner "take care of this guy" and ran back out into the street looking for the a-hole who told us this guy had a gun. If he hadn't disappeared into the night and I had caught him, I would have beaten him down and arrested him for falsely reporting an incident, which the DA's Office would have dismissed because of the huge caseload of more pressing crimes to prosecute. This a-hole put this poor guy's life at risk, and almost had us shoot an innocent person... why? Because he thought it was funny? I was in a rage, and frankly, was my rage unjustifiable?

All of this happened in the course of about 10 seconds in the midst of chaotic shouting and screaming, with a crowd in our rear.

If we had shot him we could have articulated a reason why... but of course the newspapers, liberals, and pothead conservatives would have been looking to crucify us and send us to prison. Like they would have been looking to crucify me for beating in the face of the a-hole who almost got an innocent man shot. We had come *this* close to tragedy.

We put the seizure guy into an ambulance and continued on our way.

Anyone who thinks this is an easy profession to understand and that they are experts in police work, because they have family member who does it, is talking out of his ass.


taft. I will happily, and totally agree with the Certainty of your very last sentence above. Sad thing is. More people talk from that orifice than from any others lately, and most often.
Sad state of affairs when the brainless always offer their expert opinions because they knew somebody who knew somebody, that knew somebody who said they knew somebody....
You know as well as I. Everyone loves a police officer...when they need one.

[Robert A Whit]

taft. Honestly. I find all of the stories about Robert's cop family, nothing but BS.

Just watch how this is responded to here.

And I am only talking to YOU.

Here you go again. This time is is about me. The next time you will make it about some other poster.

You only speak BS and that is why you deny my son in law and my daughter. He worked for San Mateo in California and she worked for Concord, CA.

When if ever do you plan to discuss topics and end that habit of making it about posters whom you don't know, don't care to know and shun knowing. If Taft thinks you are his friend, he simply does not really understand how you are.

[Robert A Whit]

Go back and ask your daughter and her husband again. If they were taught: "When you tell someone to put their hands up in the air and instead they reach for their waistband .... DON'T SHOOT! Instead, try to use some sort of non-lethal force like a club" ....

... then they must be members of some sort of elite kamikaze unit.

I am getting the feeling here that Taft feels very lonely and picked on.
Taft, how many damned times do I need to say that I support cops, value cops and believe that over 99 percent do the job very well, are great humans and so forth for you to get it?

You talk as if you shot some person do death or at the least wounded them so they went to the hospital. I don't believe my son in law ever shot a person.

Randy, my son in law is a very nice human. And has not mentioned to me him having to point his gun at any person. My daughter got her degree in Administration of justice and were I the way you act as if I am, her and her husband would perhaps shun me.

Both her and him are very remarkable humans. I will try to ask Randy if he had to point his gun at someone.

Taft, the message your avatar sends is you think you are one bad ass take no prisoner sort of person. If so, I feel sorry for you. But you live in a city where you have a democrat mayor. Maybe that rubbed off on you for all I know.

[aboutime]

Everyone beware. Robert is now predicting that everyone is feeling LONELY, and PICKED ON.

And, let's not forget how Pissed we all are to be corrected after admitting making any mistakes...without the approval of Robert.

[gabosaurus]

Gotta love Robert's way of thinking sometimes. Everyone who disagrees with him suddenly becomes a liberal.
Sort of reminds me of the definition of "the liberal media." If you publish something that disagrees with conservative values, you become the "liberal media."

Police have to make split second judgements. In a way, they are no different than the military operating in hostile territory.
The police don't go after people just for their own jollies. They stop people for a reason. (Well, except for L.A. cops in black and Latino neighborhoods. but that is a different story. :p )
There is no reason for not following police instructions. You do it, you don't get hurt. You make swift or hostile moves, you risk getting hurt.

Of course, some of you bleeding heart liberals might want to police to ask permission to search or arrest you. If bet you also think military need to politely ask terrorists to stop shooting and surrender. :rolleyes:

[taft2012]

Taft, how many damned times do I need to say that I support cops, value cops and believe that over 99 percent do the job very well, are great humans and so forth for you to get it?



What I'm trying to say is I support the fathers and fathers-in-law of cops, and believe over 99% do the job very well, I just don't like the ones who sexually molest their own children.

BTW: You do realize that when your daughter and son-in-law fail to take action against your habitual marijuana smoking they are being derelict in their duties, and hence, qualify as "rogue cops"? How do you rationalize that?

[revelarts]

.....

Police have to make split second judgements. In a way, they are no different than the military operating in hostile territory.
The police don't go after people just for their own jollies. They stop people for a reason. (Well, except for L.A. cops in black and Latino neighborhoods. but that is a different story. :p )
There is no reason for not following police instructions. You do it, you don't get hurt. You make swift or hostile moves, you risk getting hurt.

Of course, some of you bleeding heart liberals might want to police to ask permission to search or arrest you. If bet you also think military need to politely ask terrorists to stop shooting and surrender. :rolleyes:
Um OK,:rolleyes:

the police are not the military.
it's a shame that so many people these days seem to think they are similar though.
we --as americans at least-- should know the difference but....

Main Jobs of the military, to wage WAR, to kill people and break things. period.
Main Jobs of the police are to capture criminals, give traffic tickets and on occasion stop crime UNDER THE LAW and in SERVICE to citizens of a community.

People standing in their homes or on the Street or in their cars should NOT have to Think when a Cop approaches , that the Cops think they are dealing with a with a person who believes they are in a WAR ZONE. And that they, the lowly civilian, is considered an enemy or potential enemy combatant.

But i wonder if that's not the mentality that's cultivated by some police and even some police depts.

[taft2012]

Um OK,:rolleyes:

the police are not the military.
it's a shame that so many people these days seem to think they are similar though.
we --as americans at least-- should know the difference but....

Main Jobs of the military, to wage WAR, to kill people and break things. period.
Main Jobs of the police are to capture criminals, give traffic tickets and on occasion stop crime UNDER THE LAW and in SERVICE to citizens of a community.

People standing in their homes or on the Street should NOT have to Think when a Cop approaches they are dealing with a with a person who believes they are in a WAR ZONE and that they, the lowly civilian, is considered an enemy or potential enemy combatant.

But i wonder if that's not the mentality that's cultivated by some police and even some police depts.

Nice speech.

You should have called in and seen if they could have added those sentiments to the eulogies of the two officers murdered this week in California.

... how these two officers were not doing anything special, anything heroic, anything particularly dangerous or noteworthy... how they were just run-of-the-mill civil servants, providing a routine public service, and deserving of no special notice.

Really. Is smoking marijuana *REALLY* so important as all of this?

[revelarts]

Nice speech.

You should have called in and seen if they could have added those sentiments to the eulogies of the two officers murdered this week in California.

... how these two officers were not doing anything special, anything heroic, anything particularly dangerous or noteworthy... how they were just run-of-the-mill civil servants, providing a routine public service, and deserving of no special notice.

Really. Is smoking marijuana *REALLY* so important as all of this?
All due respect to the Officers and their families Taft , no decent person one want anyone to die. And He should be honored for his service. just as fireman, or park ranger or a spy, or coast gard, heck a life guard , anyone who takes a job that has a higher risk potential for danger in the service of others.

BUT you think it's disrespectful of me to describe Police work as NOT waging war against the community? Or are we suppose to write in the form of a glowing eulogy every time we describe police work Taft?

No one's discounting the risk involved. or even the stress and pressures of the Job. However lets not make risk seem worse than it is.
there are 300 million plus people in the US. and in 2012, 128 police died in the line of duty.

Line of Duty Deaths: 128

9/11 related illness (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=9%2F11+related+illness&from=2012&to=2012): 1
Aircraft accident (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Aircraft+accident&from=2012&to=2012): 3
Assault (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Assault&from=2012&to=2012): 1
Automobile accident (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Automobile+accident&from=2012&to=2012): 25
Duty related illness (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Duty+related+illness&from=2012&to=2012): 4
Fall (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Fall&from=2012&to=2012): 2
Gunfire (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Gunfire&from=2012&to=2012): 48
Gunfire (Accidental) (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Gunfire+%28Accidental%29&from=2012&to=2012): 2
Heart attack (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Heart+attack&from=2012&to=2012): 7
Heat exhaustion (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Heat+exhaustion&from=2012&to=2012): 1
Motorcycle accident (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Motorcycle+accident&from=2012&to=2012): 5
Stabbed (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Stabbed&from=2012&to=2012): 5
Struck by vehicle (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Struck+by+vehicle&from=2012&to=2012): 6
Training accident (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Training+accident&from=2012&to=2012): 2
Vehicle pursuit (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Vehicle+pursuit&from=2012&to=2012): 5
Vehicular assault (http://www.odmp.org/search?cause=Vehicular+assault&from=2012&to=2012): 11

Read more: http://www.odmp.org/search/year/2012#ixzz2MU4OAp50



Yes there are job risks, but the U.S. is not a war zone and the "civilians" are not a foreign enemy on police territory.

[taft2012]

All due respect to the Officers and their families Taft , no decent person one want anyone to die.

So you want this violent army of occupation and denier of civil rights to continue on?


128 police died in the line of duty.

Thankfully 2012 was a good year for law enforcement. The safest year I can recall.

However, we're also talking about life-altering crippling injuries, day-to-day psychological pressures, PTSD, etc.

What you continue to consciously overlook is that these individuals put themselves in harm's way every day to protect others and enforce the laws of the people. The average person I encounter, even in NYC, does not view the police as some kind of occupying army violating civil rights.

If that's your perception, then perhaps you need to consider why you have that perception. Are you doing something wrong? Have you done something wrong? Most people who adhere to the law don't have a problem with police.

[Abbey Marie]

Um OK,:rolleyes:

the police are not the military.
it's a shame that so many people these days seem to think they are similar though.
we --as americans at least-- should know the difference but....

Main Jobs of the military, to wage WAR, to kill people and break things. period.
Main Jobs of the police are to capture criminals, give traffic tickets and on occasion stop crime UNDER THE LAW and in SERVICE to citizens of a community.

People standing in their homes or on the Street or in their cars should NOT have to Think when a Cop approaches , that the Cops think they are dealing with a with a person who believes they are in a WAR ZONE. And that they, the lowly civilian, is considered an enemy or potential enemy combatant.

But i wonder if that's not the mentality that's cultivated by some police and even some police depts.

Rev, the main duty of the military is to defend the country.

And if you go into certain urban neighborhoods, it is actually kind of like a war zone. There certainly is plenty of shooting.

[Robert A Whit]

Rev, the main duty of the military is to defend the country.

And if you go into certain urban neighborhoods, it is actually kind of like a war zone. There certainly is plenty of shooting.

Since the Santa Cruz cops being killed and the killer also being shot to death, the cops seem to have gone wild. We have lost 4 citizens to cops shooting them to death. I think in all cases a car was involved, such as a car chase. I don't believe the cops were shot at. Cops 0 citizens 4 as to those shot to death. And in one car, it was a passenger shot to death but I don't know what happened to the driver yet.

Seems to me the cops are mighty fast on the trigger. One car chase ended with the driver dead despite him being stopped by steel spikes to the point he was on the rims. Cops still killed him.

But we all know. The cops will be portrayed as innocent. The moms will bury the cops victims.

[Robert A Whit]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Robert A Whit http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621656#post621656)
Taft, how many damned times do I need to say that I support cops, value cops and believe that over 99 percent do the job very well, are great humans and so forth for you to get it?





What I'm trying to say is I support the fathers and fathers-in-law of cops, and believe over 99% do the job very well, I just don't like the ones who sexually molest their own children.

BTW: You do realize that when your daughter and son-in-law fail to take action against your habitual marijuana smoking they are being derelict in their duties, and hence, qualify as "rogue cops"? How do you rationalize that?

In a way, you being a cop scares the shit out of me. I now know what sort of thugs work in NY City. I don't like men or women that molest their own children. You were as wrong to say that to me as you would be to say it about your Mayor or your brother. Or your own father.
Then you lie more by accusing me of smoking Marijuana.

My son in law I assure you is proud of me. When he and my daughter had a time of great financial need, they turned to me for help over his own father.

You act as if there are no rogue cops. That I find baffling. Then if you are correct, just disband all the internal affairs offices of all police departments.

[taft2012]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Robert A Whit http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621656#post621656)
I don't like men or women that molest their own children. You were as wrong to say that to me

Yet you act as if they do not exist.

By utilizing the identical logic you applied to declare me a "rogue cop," I am well within my rights to declare you a child molester. :dance:

[Robert A Whit]

Yet you act as if they do not exist.

By utilizing the identical logic you applied to declare me a "rogue cop," I am well within my rights to declare you a child molester. :dance:

If I did that, and I don't believe I did, unless in reply to you approving rogue cops, you are not correctly using logic.

See, you picked a fight with me. I had not picked one with you but am the target of your daily barbs.

Don't worry, I bet you say that to your father, brothers, uncles and so forth. I realize you have a very abrasive personality.

[revelarts]

So you want this violent army of occupation and denier of civil rights to continue on?
i want all cops that fit that description fired. the rest can stay.



Thankfully 2012 was a good year for law enforcement. The safest year I can recall.
However, we're also talking about life-altering crippling injuries, day-to-day psychological pressures, PTSD, etc.
What you continue to consciously overlook is that these individuals put themselves in harm's way every day to protect others and enforce the laws of the people.


...No one's discounting the risk involved. or even the stress and pressures of the Job....Are you reading or projecting again?



The average person I encounter, even in NYC, does not view the police as some kind of occupying army violating civil rights. I go by a case by case basis Taft, (unlike you who want to broad brush and assume the best of most cops and assume that those who question them are pot heads or emotional liars) and my point has been over the years that it's seems to be more and more of a pattern. When i was a kid there were no check points on the road, no stop an frisk in NY, no TSA in airports, nobody asking me why i am taking pictures outside, no "no knock warrants", no cops tapping my cell phone or putting tracking devises on my car, or a million laws that a cop could pick and choose from to make me guilty of something. No cops stripping female assault VICTIMS because they were "hysterical" and "uncooperative". To name a few, (and no i don't think the wolrd id that much more danfgerous or that those new tacits help make me safer)
Some people do notice the change and do care about civil rights. Be nice if you felt as strong a desire to enforce civil liberty laws as you seem have in protecting the reputation of police.




If that's your perception, then perhaps you need to consider why you have that perception. Are you doing something wrong? Have you done something wrong? Most people who adhere to the law don't have a problem with police.:laugh:
Have I done something wrong?:laugh:
That's why you keep calling me a pothead, you cannot conceive of anyone just looking at the actions of some police an police depts and reaching the honest conclusion that they are wrong... corrupt or consistently overstepping their authority and that as a country the security state is making it worse.

Sorry to burst you bubble, but I'm not a law breaker Taft. i just call it like i see it.
You seem to call it to keep your pension and your comrades reputation in good repair.

You think If i perceive (SEE) the police doing something wrong then i should wonder if I have done something wrong, because the police are generally never wrong. that's what i read you saying here.

How about this, if someone sees the police doing wrong over and over and over and also the laws changing, real erosion of the civil liberties of myself and others then, the police might being something wrong.
and the lawmakers
and the courts and the people too i suppose by NOT speaking up and voting to change it.

[Robert A Whit]

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by taft2012 http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621706#post621706)

So you want this violent army of occupation and denier of civil rights to continue on?
i want all cops that fit that description fired. the rest can stay.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by taft2012 http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621706#post621706)
Thankfully 2012 was a good year for law enforcement. The safest year I can recall.
However, we're also talking about life-altering crippling injuries, day-to-day psychological pressures, PTSD, etc.
What you continue to consciously overlook is that these individuals put themselves in harm's way every day to protect others and enforce the laws of the people.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by revelarts
...No one's discounting the risk involved. or even the stress and pressures of the Job....







Are you reading or projecting again?

http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by taft2012 http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621706#post621706)
The average person I encounter, even in NYC, does not view the police as some kind of occupying army violating civil rights.



I go by a case by case basis Taft, (unlike you who want to broad brush and assume the best of most cops and assume that those who question them are pot heads or emotional liars) and my point has been over the years that it's seems to be more and more of a pattern. When i was a kid there were no check points on the road, no stop an frisk in NY, no TSA in airports, nobody asking me why i am taking pictures outside, no "no knock warrants", no cops tapping my cell phone or putting tracking devises on my car, or a million laws that a cop could pick and choose from to make me guilty of something. No cops stripping female assault VICTIMS because they were "hysterical" and "uncooperative". To name a few, (and no i don't think the wolrd id that much more danfgerous or that those new tacits help make me safer)
Some people do notice the change and do care about civil rights. Be nice if you felt as strong a desire to enforce civil liberty laws as you seem have in protecting the reputation of police.


http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by taft2012 http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/debate_policy/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=621706#post621706)
If that's your perception, then perhaps you need to consider why you have that perception. Are you doing something wrong? Have you done something wrong? Most people who adhere to the law don't have a problem with police.



:laugh:
Have I done something wrong?:laugh:
That's why you keep calling me a pothead, you cannot conceive of anyone just looking at the actions of some police an police depts and reaching the honest conclusion that they are wrong... corrupt or consistently overstepping their authority and that as a country the security state is making it worse.

Sorry to burst you bubble, but I'm not a law breaker Taft. i just call it like i see it.
You seem to call it to keep your pension and your comrades reputation in good repair.

You think If i perceive (SEE) the police doing something wrong then i should wonder if I have done something wrong, because the police are generally never wrong. that's what i read you saying here.

How about this, if someone sees the police doing wrong over and over and over and also the laws changing, real erosion of the civil liberties of myself and others then, the police might being something wrong.
and the lawmakers
and the courts and the people too i suppose by NOT speaking up and voting to change it.
Last edited by revelarts; Today at 02:48 PM.

Very good Revelarts. Well stated.

[revelarts]

Rev, the main duty of the military is to defend the country.
Yes, by killing people and breaking things. we agree.




And if you go into certain urban neighborhoods, it is actually kind of like a war zone. There certainly is plenty of shooting.thankfully most neighborhoods even urban ones are not like that. However there are too many. But most of the people getting shot are the Young men who live there not police. when police get shot there's a mobilization and crackdown that really makes it look like a war zone. they do not rest much until the cop killer -or a reasonable facsimile- is caught or killed.
after that the usual killing can continue.

[Robert A Whit]

Here are 3 of them. Too bad the cops shoot to kill drivers they chase. We are told the cops suspected this or that. But bullets did the job for the cops.
I still like all good cops. Keep that in mind.

Union City Police Shoot, Kill Armed Man Fleeing Arrest (http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2013/03/03/union-city-police-kill-armed-man/)
<cite>CBS Local</cite> ‎- 2 hours ago
Union City police officers shot and killed an armed suspect on Saturday night, police said.




Daly City cops kill suspect in San Francisco (http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Daly-City-cops-kill-suspect-in-San-Francisco-4323306.php)

<cite>San Francisco Chronicle</cite>‎ - 1 day ago




San Jose police kill man who led them on wild chase (http://www.mercurynews.com/crime-courts/ci_22705548/san-jose-police-shooting-snarls-traffic-blossom-hill)

<cite>San Jose Mercury News</cite>‎ - 17 hours ago





Daly City cops kill suspect in San Francisco - SFGate (http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Daly-City-cops-kill-suspect-in-San-Francisco-4323306.php)<cite>www.sfgate.com/.../Daly-City-cops-kill-suspect-in-San-Francis...</cite>
1 day ago – (03-02) 14:23 PST San Francisco -- A Daly City police officer shot and killed a suspected car thief in San Francisco early Saturday after a chase ...


Robert says: Since the cops were shot in Santa Cruz, war has broke out. Beware you run from the cops. They must have planned to shoot you to death.

[taft2012]

i want all cops that fit that description fired. the rest can stay.

.

I want all potheads rotting in prison behind bars.

What did the Rolling Stones say? You can't always get what you want.

[aboutime]

taft. Did you ever...in your wildest dreams. Ever expect that your profession would become something for so many illiterate, ignorant, stupid law breaking, constitution hating Americans to celebrate so openly????

Actually both sad, and informative when you think about it. The same people who always complain about others so much, would be the very same people who would complain when any police officer arrives more than a reasonable time after they CALL FOR YOUR HELP.

And, when they no longer need you while they intentionally break laws, or attempt to do so. They call police officers every name in the book because that's how STUPID works.

Anyone who is, or has been a Police Officer deserves all of the thanks, and credit they can get...while protecting the rest of us who appreciate Police Officers....from the STUPID people who whine, complain, and break the law.

[Robert A Whit]

taft. Did you ever...in your wildest dreams. Ever expect that your profession would become something for so many illiterate, ignorant, stupid law breaking, constitution hating Americans to celebrate so openly????

Actually both sad, and informative when you think about it. The same people who always complain about others so much, would be the very same people who would complain when any police officer arrives more than a reasonable time after they CALL FOR YOUR HELP.

And, when they no longer need you while they intentionally break laws, or attempt to do so. They call police officers every name in the book because that's how STUPID works.

Anyone who is, or has been a Police Officer deserves all of the thanks, and credit they can get...while protecting the rest of us who appreciate Police Officers....from the STUPID people who whine, complain, and break the law.

Don't know for sure who you are blasting but knowing you, it won't be long till you accuse those not liking Obama of some of the same things. NOT
LIKING OBAMA I SAY.

Revelarts and myself have said what cops we don't like.

HERE, SPELLED OUT .... ROGUES

But for some rather ODD reason. Taft ignores that and resorts to dumb name calling, such as calling a few of us POTHEADS.

Maybe you know. I had major heart surgery.

Why is it that when a doctor prescribed pain pills following surgery, it was fine with TAFT.

Suppose I did not take said pills. Suppose I gave them away. You think he would shut his face about that?

My body and pills, fine. Some other persons body, not fine. Hypocrisy is smiling on you and Taft.

[aboutime]

Don't know for sure who you are blasting but knowing you, it won't be long till you accuse those not liking Obama of some of the same things. NOT
LIKING OBAMA I SAY.

Revelarts and myself have said what cops we don't like.

HERE, SPELLED OUT .... ROGUES

But for some rather ODD reason. Taft ignores that and resorts to dumb name calling, such as calling a few of us POTHEADS.

Maybe you know. I had major heart surgery.

Why is it that when a doctor prescribed pain pills following surgery, it was fine with TAFT.

Suppose I did not take said pills. Suppose I gave them away. You think he would shut his face about that?

My body and pills, fine. Some other persons body, not fine. Hypocrisy is smiling on you and Taft.


Robert. It must be JUST YOU. You see. Four years ago. I had a heart attack, and a Quadruple Bypass as a result of my arteries being clogged in, and around my heart.
I have been on drugs since that time, and not once...did I take offense by anything Taft said about Druggies, or POTHEADS.

As for hypocrisy Robert. You really should take a long, hard look at your posts from the past....BEFORE you come here calling others what YOU are guilty of doing, and being.

[Robert A Whit]

Robert. It must be JUST YOU. You see. Four years ago. I had a heart attack, and a Quadruple Bypass as a result of my arteries being clogged in, and around my heart.
I have been on drugs since that time, and not once...did I take offense by anything Taft said about Druggies, or POTHEADS.

As for hypocrisy Robert. You really should take a long, hard look at your posts from the past....BEFORE you come here calling others what YOU are guilty of doing, and being.

I just knew you are a perfect human being. How many more times must you pat yourself on the back before you pound that into my head?

Fine, you and TAFT are perfect.

I got that.

You explained it to me.

[logroller]

Nice speech.

You should have called in and seen if they could have added those sentiments to the eulogies of the two officers murdered this week in California.

... how these two officers were not doing anything special, anything heroic, anything particularly dangerous or noteworthy... how they were just run-of-the-mill civil servants, providing a routine public service, and deserving of no special notice.

Really. Is smoking marijuana *REALLY* so important as all of this?
That is not at all what rev was saying. Your propensity to twist the facts to fit your police state agenda is insulting to the assumed diligent service of thousands, including the detectives you referenced; which had nothing in common with the OP. Those detectives were investigating a felony assault, by a convicted felon iirc.; neither was the case in the OP. there are standards used in law enforcement; things like reasonable suspicion, probable cause, due process...Is keeping people from smoking marijuana really worth violating these tenets? Do you believe its sometimes necessary to break the law to maintain order? And if so, could it not sometimes be necessary to break the law to maintain liberty? It's quite a conundrum; which is worse? I often ask this question of LE friends of mine; is there an acceptable number of innocent people convicted to keep the guilty from escaping a conviction?

[aboutime]

I just knew you are a perfect human being. How many more times must you pat yourself on the back before you pound that into my head?

Fine, you and TAFT are perfect.

I got that.

You explained it to me.


Taft. Did you see that? Robert says we're perfect. Problem is. We all know. Nobody is perfect...unless it's Robert.

[Robert A Whit]

Taft. Did you see that? Robert says we're perfect. Problem is. We all know. Nobody is perfect...unless it's Robert.

Oh no.... You know how perfect you are. You keep telling me that it is me that is all wrong. Has to mean you are perfect.

[taft2012]

taft. Did you ever...in your wildest dreams. Ever expect that your profession would become something for so many illiterate, ignorant, stupid law breaking, constitution hating Americans to celebrate so openly????

Actually both sad, and informative when you think about it. The same people who always complain about others so much, would be the very same people who would complain when any police officer arrives more than a reasonable time after they CALL FOR YOUR HELP.


The criminals apparently want a say in what kind of police patrol the streets. You can't blame them for trying. :laugh:

[taft2012]

Your propensity to twist the facts to fit your police state agenda

Now who is it who is twisting facts to fit an agenda? What police state did I advocate? Furthermore, you might have an iota of credibility if you weren't sitting on your hands watching everything I said twisted into a defense of "rogue cops."



there are standards used in law enforcement; things like reasonable suspicion, probable cause, due process...Is keeping people from smoking marijuana really worth violating these tenets? Do you believe its sometimes necessary to break the law to maintain order?

Where did I ever advocate violating the law? Another twisted fact.

In the OP, Rev labored under a misconception that the police needed a warrant and standard of proof to accompany a resident into a home to retrieve her goods. That is not the case. Police Departments train their personnel in such matters directly from case law, not from the editorial page of "High Times" magazine.


Do you believe its sometimes necessary to break the law to maintain order? And if so, could it not sometimes be necessary to break the law to maintain liberty? It's quite a conundrum; which is worse?
I'd need an example of what you mean.

If you're arguing that smoking pot makes you the Abraham Lincoln of the 21st century, then I find that position to be less than compelling.


I often ask this question of LE friends of mine; is there an acceptable number of innocent people convicted to keep the guilty from escaping a conviction?

No. Who wants innocent people to get convicted? Besides, that's more of a question for prosecutors, not the police. Police only decide if a standard of proof known as "probable cause" exists... anything further standard of proof has to be argued by the prosecutor.

Furthermore, police do not convict or decide guilt or innocence. Nor do prosecutors.

[taft2012]

Oh no.... You know how perfect you are. You keep telling me that it is me that is all wrong. Has to mean you are perfect.

No, you are just giving us more left-wing extremist liberal logical fallacy.

Pointing out the multitude of flaws in your beloved Barack Obama would then make the GOP "perfect," and that clearly is not the case.

[logroller]

Now who is it who is twisting facts to fit an agenda? What police state did I advocate? Furthermore, you might have an iota of credibility if you weren't sitting on your hands watching everything I said twisted into a defense of "rogue cops."



Where did I ever advocate violating the law? Another twisted fact.

In the OP, Rev labored under a misconception that the police needed a warrant and standard of proof to accompany a resident into a home to retrieve her goods. That is not the case. Police Departments train their personnel in such matters directly from case law, not from the editorial page of "High Times" magazine.


I'd need an example of what you mean.

If you're arguing that smoking pot makes you the Abraham Lincoln of the 21st century, then I find that position to be less than compelling.



No. Who wants innocent people to get convicted? Besides, that's more of a question for prosecutors, not the police. Police only decide if a standard of proof known as "probable cause" exists... anything further standard of proof has to be argued by the prosecutor.

Furthermore, police do not convict or decide guilt or innocence. Nor do prosecutors.
police must give a lawful reason for their presence when requested. Now the guy on the op may have not asked the direct question, but it was clear his lawful presence was in question. he could have easily assuaged the situation and didn't. As a peace officer, he should have. Hence why the dept is changing their rules on civil standbys.
. I've been on enough juries to know that a conviction is practically written in stone before the jury hears it. I've seen a third string ADA getting coached by the judge on defense challenges to a report filed by a newby deputy that was modified by his CO after the event took place. Pretty much negating any attempt by the defense to introduce doubt. I so wanted to acquit that guy but his own testimony was even less believable. :laugh:

I suppose the reason I sit on my hands in rogue cops has to do with your constant reference to marijuana. I read policy and case law, not high times. Its insulting to me to have you make constant refernces to such, because I work hard to stay abreast of law and order, but also promote freedom. But you sure do try hard to paint me as a pothead. Maybe that's why I attribute unto you a general lack of decency and uncivil behavior. Maybe we call a truce, ill give you the benefit of doubt.

Just for example I was walking home with a friend and was stopped because the person I was with fit a description of a burglary suspect. Now honestly, i dont mnow the guy that well, but i certainly dont know him to be a burglar. So I thought, well I'm just walking home, here's my ID, see--I live right down there. Despite the fact i had voluntarily shown a valid state issued drivers license to show my legal residence in the neighborhood I was in, I was told to have my thumbprint scanned. i refused, and was then ordered to. So I complied under duress. i said, ive done nothing wrong, what is your cause to search? he said, its not a search. we need to check if you have warrants. They already had my ID; and my address is listed with DMV, so is my thumbprint. Besides that, i have never had a warrant-- So what good will a thumbprint scan serve? Ill tell you that singular incident indellibly changed my view towards law enforcement; My right to privacy was violated and I was lied to. I finally asked if i was free to go. Which it turned out, i was-- no probable cause existed nor even reasonable suspicion. I filed a complaint, and received a form letter that they were reviewing their policy on biometric scan devices. But seriously, the whole way the system works is that unless I was charged, and could therefore get the evidence dismissed, I just get violated and have to deal with it. Its a shit deal man. What else could have I done; just ignored them and kept walking? That's what I'll do next time. I certainly don't feel compelled to assist law enforcement anymore. I'll give my name from now on, but nothing more. Just b tight-lipped and unassistive, same as the guy in the OP. It makes me think the cops are just out to get me, even when I've done nothing wrong. That bothers me; does it bother you?

[aboutime]

Oh no.... You know how perfect you are. You keep telling me that it is me that is all wrong. Has to mean you are perfect.


Okay. You win Robert. So, I thank you for thinking I am perfect as you say.

I know different, and disagree with you. But...who am I to question you, or your demands???

[Robert A Whit]

police must give a lawful reason for their presence when requested. Now the guy on the op may have not asked the direct question, but it was clear his lawful presence was in question. he could have easily assuaged the situation and didn't. As a peace officer, he should have. Hence why the dept is changing their rules on civil standbys.
. I've been on enough juries to know that a conviction is practically written in stone before the jury hears it. I've seen a third string ADA getting coached by the judge on defense challenges to a report filed by a newby deputy that was modified by his CO after the event took place. Pretty much negating any attempt by the defense to introduce doubt. I so wanted to acquit that guy but his own testimony was even less believable. :laugh:

I suppose the reason I sit on my hands in rogue cops has to do with your constant reference to marijuana. I read policy and case law, not high times. Its insulting to me to have you make constant refernces to such, because I work hard to stay abreast of law and order, but also promote freedom. But you sure do try hard to paint me as a pothead. Maybe that's why I attribute unto you a general lack of decency and uncivil behavior. Maybe we call a truce, ill give you the benefit of doubt.

Just for example I was walking home with a friend and was stopped because the person I was with fit a description of a burglary suspect. Now honestly, i dont mnow the guy that well, but i certainly dont know him to be a burglar. So I thought, well I'm just walking home, here's my ID, see--I live right down there. Despite the fact i had voluntarily shown a valid state issued drivers license to show my legal residence in the neighborhood I was in, I was told to have my thumbprint scanned. i refused, and was then ordered to. So I complied under duress. i said, ive done nothing wrong, what is your cause to search? he said, its not a search. we need to check if you have warrants. They already had my ID; and my address is listed with DMV, so is my thumbprint. Besides that, i have never had a warrant-- So what good will a thumbprint scan serve? Ill tell you that singular incident indellibly changed my view towards law enforcement; My right to privacy was violated and I was lied to. I finally asked if i was free to go. Which it turned out, i was-- no probable cause existed nor even reasonable suspicion. I filed a complaint, and received a form letter that they were reviewing their policy on biometric scan devices. But seriously, the whole way the system works is that unless I was charged, and could therefore get the evidence dismissed, I just get violated and have to deal with it. Its a shit deal man. What else could have I done; just ignored them and kept walking? That's what I'll do next time. I certainly don't feel compelled to assist law enforcement anymore. I'll give my name from now on, but nothing more. Just b tight-lipped and unassistive, same as the guy in the OP. It makes me think the cops are just out to get me, even when I've done nothing wrong. That bothers me; does it bother you?

Why would that offend him? Consider the source.

[taft2012]

police must give a lawful reason for their presence when requested.

The woman was a resident who requested the police accompany her. Are the police required to explain their presence to everyone they encounter within?




I suppose the reason I sit on my hands in rogue cops has to do with your constant reference to marijuana. I read policy and case law, not high times. Its insulting to me to have you make constant refernces to such, because I work hard to stay abreast of law and order, but also promote freedom. But you sure do try hard to paint me as a pothead. Maybe that's why I attribute unto you a general lack of decency and uncivil behavior. Maybe we call a truce, ill give you the benefit of doubt.

Just for example I was walking home with a friend and was stopped because the person I was with fit a description of a burglary suspect. Now honestly, i dont mnow the guy that well, but i certainly dont know him to be a burglar. So I thought, well I'm just walking home, here's my ID, see--I live right down there. Despite the fact i had voluntarily shown a valid state issued drivers license to show my legal residence in the neighborhood I was in, I was told to have my thumbprint scanned. i refused, and was then ordered to. So I complied under duress. i said, ive done nothing wrong, what is your cause to search? he said, its not a search.

OK, so the scenario is: You're walking on the street with an individual who fits the description of a burglary suspect. You know him not to be a burglar, so apparently every police officer has the same exact relationship with your friend, correct?

Where in case law does it say that the police can not stop the two of you and inquire what you're doing? Are you of the belief that because *YOU* didn't fit the description too that the police should have ignored you?

Can we apply a teensy bit of common sense here? If you were a police officer in the Timothy McVeigh manhunt, and saw someone fitting Timothy McVeigh's description walking around with another guy... would you stop the two of them, or would you let the possible McVeigh accomplice walk away without investigation?

As crazy as liberal activist court rulings have been in recent years, even that sort of insanity hasn't yet become case law.



we need to check if you have warrants. They already had my ID; and my address is listed with DMV, so is my thumbprint. Besides that, i have never had a warrant-- So what good will a thumbprint scan serve? Ill tell you that singular incident indellibly changed my view towards law enforcement; My right to privacy was violated and I was lied to.

I'm missing something, what is the lie here? What privacy right was violated? What is the case law that supports your contention?

As for the thumbprint scan I could go into a multitude of scenarios of how it benefits innocent people in this age of identity theft.
But I can know a closed mind when I see one, so I won't bother.

I'll simply point out that the thumbprint scanners are used predominantly in red states. The ACLU and blue state liberals hate them. Conservatives support them.


I finally asked if i was free to go. Which it turned out, i was-- no probable cause existed nor even reasonable suspicion.

You're throwing around terms that you don't understand. You were stopped because there WAS reasonable suspicion. You were let go because there was NO probable cause. That's exactly what is supposed to happen.


It makes me think the cops are just out to get me

We are. We have your photo printed in each and every monthly issue of the Fraternal Order of Police magazine, with a caption: "If you see this guy, GET HIM!" :laugh:

I am offering this link to you in the spirit of friendship and as a public service:

http://www.examiner.com/article/how-marijuana-creates-paranoia


there are legitimate mental health concerns with chronic use. This article will discuss how marijuana can induce paranoia and stunt emotional growth. If you are a teenager or parent of a teenager, you might want to read this.