Are there any car experts in the house?

[gabosaurus]

My dad needs a new car. He is driving a 2004 that is on its last legs.
My dad has driven Chevy compact cars all his life, so I expect he wants another one. My brother in law recommended a Chevy Cruze.
It needs to be automatic transmission with high gas mileage.
Anyone want to offer an opinion? I know zero about vehicles.

[fj1200]

... a 2004 that is on its last legs. ... has driven Chevy compact cars all his life...

Well there's your problem. :poke:

EDIT:

It really doesn't matter, do a search on edmunds for what fits his criteria; cars are appliances unless he's looking for fun.

[Abbey Marie]

Well there's your problem. :poke:

EDIT:

It really doesn't matter, do a search on edmunds for what fits his criteria; cars are appliances unless he's looking for fun.

Never heard it put that way, but I like it!

[Anton Chigurh]

He can get a huge rebate and a huge tax credit when he goes "green" and buys the Chevy Volt!

[Little-Acorn]

My dad needs a new car. He is driving a 2004 that is on its last legs.
My dad has driven Chevy compact cars all his life,
There's his problem right there.


so I expect he wants another one.
If he ate a bad apple and got really sick, would he want another from the same bushel?


My brother in law recommended a Chevy Cruze.
Is your brother in law volunteering to pay the repair bills?

I'm also driving a 2004 that I bought new that year. It now has 125,000 miles on it, and runs like it's new.

I've changed oil and tranny fluid, replaced the belts, changed the brakes and shocks, and put tires on it. NOTHING more.

Hint: It's a Toyota. Built in Princeton, Indiana, by American workers.

Before that, I had a Ford, that I bought new in 1996. Replaced all of the above at the usual intervals, plus one linkage piece to the transmission. It was also running like new when I had a close encounter with a Jeep Grand Cherokee in 2004, then bought the Toyota.


It needs to be automatic transmission with high gas mileage.
Ford Focus, Toyota Camry, Corolla, Yaris. Nissan Altima also gets surprisingly high gas mileage. Honda Fit gets just as good mileage, and has a lot of internal room for a car that size, probably the most efficient car on the road today among stiff competition. And all of them are VERY reliable, almost never break down, unlike your Chevy.

And my neighbor just bought a Toyota Prius hybrid for $21,000 out the door. It was a Friday "Loss Leader", see below. Priuses are normally very expensive, I was surprised at that much-lower-than-usual price for a Prius. 40-plus MPG is a reality for that car (and no other). But ask the dealer when the main batteries must be replaced, and how much the replacement costs.

Finally, once you've decided what you want to get, wait till a Friday, get up early and grab a local newspaper. Find the ads that say, "Big sale, two only at this price!", and which list the VIN numbers of the exact cars on sale. Go there, and be leaning on the door when the dealer opens. You won't find a lower price for that car, new, with full warranty, anywhere, ever.

Those are "Loss Leaders" - the dealer actually takes a loss on those two cars, in hopes that hundreds of people will come in for them. They sell instantly, of course, and to the rest the dealer says, "Gee, those two are gone, but right over here we have many others at just slightly higher prices....". When the weekend is over, the dealer has made more money than he would have if he had never advertised and sold those first two cars at a loss.

This is completely legal, and if you are quick enough to grab the exact car that's in the ad (check the VIN number), you can get a major bargain. I did that for my wife's 2005 Camry. Now, seven years later, we are still very happy with the deal. (And it also still runs like new with 110,000 miles on it, NO unscheduled repairs ever!)

[gabosaurus]

My dad drives a lot in his job. I believe he is closing in on 170,000 miles on his Malibu.

I have a 2004 Chevy Cavalier. My sister has a 2002 Cavalier. Neither of us has had many problems.
Any vehicle that is well maintained should run as long as you want it to, barring unusual incidents.

Don't see any reason why I should ask him to switch.

[cadet]

My dad needs a new car. He is driving a 2004 that is on its last legs.

This just reminds me why i love my 93 Ford Ranger.
My baby will live forever. Only ever switched the tiers and had the exhaust fixed. :happy0203:
(Knock on wood)

[Anton Chigurh]

This just reminds me why i love my 93 Ford Ranger.
My baby will live forever. Only ever switched the tiers and had the exhaust fixed. :happy0203:
(Knock on wood)Same story with my '97 F-150... Except no exhaust work ever needed. 127,000 miles and still looks and purrs like new.

And did you hear Ford never took any of our bailout money?

[Robert A Whit]

My dad needs a new car. He is driving a 2004 that is on its last legs.
My dad has driven Chevy compact cars all his life, so I expect he wants another one. My brother in law recommended a Chevy Cruze.
It needs to be automatic transmission with high gas mileage.
Anyone want to offer an opinion? I know zero about vehicles.

If he drives enough miles per year, he should look at the Volt by Chevy.He may qualify for a $7,500 rebate from the Feds for the Volt. He will drive a car that uses almost no fuel. Some drivers use no fuel so long as they drive something like 40 miles.

[Robert A Whit]

He can get a huge rebate and a huge tax credit when he goes "green" and buys the Chevy Volt!

The great thing about the Volt is if he drives 40 miles or less he won't use any gasoline. If he has to drive a very long trip, the gasoline engine keeps charging the electric system and I believe he can go as far as around 500 miles and use one tank of gasoline.

[Anton Chigurh]

The great thing about the Volt is if he drives 40 miles or less he won't use any gasoline. If he has to drive a very long trip, the gasoline engine keeps charging the electric system and I believe he can go as far as around 500 miles and use one tank of gasoline.It's total bunk, a boondoggle. The Chevy Volt TV commercial? The numbers they give just screamed deception to me.

So I summoned my calculator.

A Volt costs $39K. While the fellow in the ad said he went 4000 miles on one tank, the reality is that the average is 900 miles. That still yields a very impressive 96.8 MPGe.

But let's compare the Volt to a basic Corolla ($17K, averaging 30 MPG overall). The Corolla takes regular gas at let's say ($3.38 US average), while the Volt takes premium ($3.67 US average).

Per 100 miles, a Corolla costs $11.27 to operate, while the Volt costs $3.79, yielding a savings of $7.48.

But - amortized over that $22K price differential, it means the Volt owner must drive 294,118 miles before there are any savings. And this does not even begin to factor in the price of financing. Or the increased electric bill for the charging of the batteries.

According to the Volt site, it can take up to 10 hours (on 120V) to recharge, or 4 hours on 240V. The battery is listed at 12.8kW, but one report I saw said it actually took 13.8kW. Electricity costs about 12 cents/kW-hr. After the crunching, it means the Volt costs about 3.8 cents per mile in EV mode.

Electric bill cost for the 294,000 miles it would take to make this viable? $1,079,413. Yes, that's in excess of one MILLION dollars.

C'mon now.... I was being facetious when I posted recommending the Volt.:laugh:

[gabosaurus]

I have read enough about electric cars to know that they are unworkable.

I love small cars. They will be totally essential when we switch to gas rationing again. Not to mention those new taxes on gas guzzlers. :cool:

[Robert A Whit]

It's total bunk, a boondoggle. The Chevy Volt TV commercial? The numbers they give just screamed deception to me.

So I summoned my calculator.

A Volt costs $39K. While the fellow in the ad said he went 4000 miles on one tank, the reality is that the average is 900 miles. That still yields a very impressive 96.8 MPGe.

But let's compare the Volt to a basic Corolla ($17K, averaging 30 MPG overall). The Corolla takes regular gas at let's say ($3.38 US average), while the Volt takes premium ($3.67 US average).

Per 100 miles, a Corolla costs $11.27 to operate, while the Volt costs $3.79, yielding a savings of $7.48.

But - amortized over that $22K price differential, it means the Volt owner must drive 294,118 miles before there are any savings. And this does not even begin to factor in the price of financing. Or the increased electric bill for the charging of the batteries.

According to the Volt site, it can take up to 10 hours (on 120V) to recharge, or 4 hours on 240V. The battery is listed at 12.8kW, but one report I saw said it actually took 13.8kW. Electricity costs about 12 cents/kW-hr. After the crunching, it means the Volt costs about 3.8 cents per mile in EV mode.

Electric bill cost for the 294,000 miles it would take to make this viable? $1,079,413. Yes, that's in excess of one MILLION dollars.

C'mon now.... I was being facetious when I posted recommending the Volt.:laugh:

I don't wish to do your homework and show that your million dollar for electricity is wrong. Just look at your numbers again.

I would have to FIRST drive and INSURE cost out both cars.

I did not recommend the Volt because I own one. I don't.

She admits his current car is one of those small targets for big rigs. Even a brush with a normal car might flip it over.

But the VOLT goes a very long distance between visits to gas stations.

Mechanics bills on the Volt ought to be very modest.

Still what you claim has to be why the Volt is a slow seller. I did not see you showing the $7500 refund by the IRS. Why is that?

BTW, I don't recall her mentioning cost. Some drive the Volt to be loyal to GM and also they get a charge out of claiming they use an electric car. Volt at least has that engine and plenty of gas to go very long distances.

To make my point, take my Seville. I paid a lot more for that car than I would have paid for the low end Chevy. I don't claim it was a great deal. I claim I love the car.

[Voted4Reagan]

Buy a Volvo...

[darin]

I don't wish to do your homework and show that your million dollar for electricity is wrong. Just look at your numbers again.

I would have to FIRST drive and INSURE cost out both cars.

I did not recommend the Volt because I own one. I don't.

She admits his current car is one of those small targets for big rigs. Even a brush with a normal car might flip it over.

But the VOLT goes a very long distance between visits to gas stations.

Mechanics bills on the Volt ought to be very modest.

Still what you claim has to be why the Volt is a slow seller. I did not see you showing the $7500 refund by the IRS. Why is that?

BTW, I don't recall her mentioning cost. Some drive the Volt to be loyal to GM and also they get a charge out of claiming they use an electric car. Volt at least has that engine and plenty of gas to go very long distances.

To make my point, take my Seville. I paid a lot more for that car than I would have paid for the low end Chevy. I don't claim it was a great deal. I claim I love the car.


What he's doing is taking a long-term view at the business case for owning a hybrid of ANY sort - vs the cost of a less-expensive traditional-engine car.

To get value - to get pay-back from the fuel-savings of a hybrid one typically must drive the car at LEAST 100000 miles. Doesn't take into account e-cars must use electricity from the Grid too, or in-addition.

Short-sighted at best to consider gas-station fuel up frequency as the ultimate factor in a car being affordable to operate.


Gabby - Why is the car having issues at only 170,000 miles? If those are highway miles the car should not be on its last legs; should only be getting warmed up.

If the car IS on its last legs at 170k miles, I'd seriously consider the maintenance - if it wasn't done, DO it. If it was done, consider a new brand of car.

[Nukeman]

If he is doing a lot of driving than why not look at the VW Jetta TDI. They get over 45 mpg. Plus they are a nice looking car with a decent price..

[glockmail]

If he's a Chevy guy, then by all means go with a Chevy. That being said, I've been a Ford guy all my life and now drive a Jeep. :laugh:

[Anton Chigurh]

I don't wish to do your homework and show that your million dollar for electricity is wrong. Just look at your numbers again.Yes, look at them and do the math.

[gabosaurus]

I don't know enough about cars to be able to tell you why my dad's cars is running down at 170,000 miles. California has a lot of different weather conditions.

[tailfins]

Reliability increases can make getting a used car an inferior deal. I use www.truecar.com (http://www.truecar.com) for the best deal on a new vehicle.

[gabosaurus]

Thanks for the link. Looks like a good site.

[fj1200]

Clark Howard is saying that reliability increases make getting a used car an inferior deal. I use www.truecar.com (http://www.truecar.com) for the best deal on a new vehicle.

I don't think that was his rationale.

Used cars are once again a great deal (http://www.clarkhoward.com/news/clarkhoward/cars/used-cars-are-once-again-great-deal/nSYR8/)
After some unprecedented market conditions, buying a used car instead of a new one is again becoming the Clark Smart move it always used to be.

Almost three years ago, for the first time in 26 years on air, I started recommending new cars over used cars when people would call me to ask what they should buy. That was such a shocker to a lot of listeners.

But in the aftermath of the financial crisis, the car market dried up, leases disappeared, and Cash for Clunkers made the used market extremely short of vehicles. It got to the unprecedented point that you could buy a brand new car for less than 1 to 3 year old car!

That is no longer the case right now as new auto sales have really heated up over the last year. People who come in to buy a new vehicle often trade in a used one. So the used vehicle market is getting well supplied again.

[Robert A Whit]

OK gang. I read one guy claim that electricity costs over a million dollars. ROFLMAO

Now let me tell you what your Chevy loving dad should really buy.

Get the Corvette. Drive one of those and have a lot of fun.

He drives compacts so he does not need room.

If he buys a Corvette he won't drive anything else.

And I love my Seville STS. I needed to carry passengers or I would be driving the Corvette.

If he wants to carry people, get the Caddy ATS. Have fun driving.

[Binky]

Well, I'm driving a Chevy HHR, 2006, and have only had to spend $300 on repairs and we bought it new. And that was about three months ago. Other than oil changes, a set of wipers, and new tires, that's it. I get 30 miles to the gallon and it still rides like a dream. I have 60,000 miles on it. I'll be keeping this car until I die as it's a great running vehicle and still looks great.

[Robert A Whit]

Yes, look at them and do the math.

ROFLMAO

Explain to the kiddies again how you transformed a few cents per hour for electricity into well over a million dollars again? Maybe you think in compound math. I still believe in 2+2 as being 4 and not ten thousand.

[Anton Chigurh]

ROFLMAO

Explain to the kiddies again how you transformed a few cents per hour for electricity into well over a million dollars again? Maybe you think in compound math. I still believe in 2+2 as being 4 and not ten thousand.Why don't you go back to the post, get out your calculator, and multiply it out. You're embarrassing yourself. It wasn't cents per hour, it was cents per MILE in EV mode. And I generously subtracted the government subsidies and rebates from the final figure which actually was much higher, and also took the lower of the two claimed electrical current draw amounts. I was being quite conservative with the numbers, to keep it as simple as possible.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?37338-Are-there-any-car-experts-in-the-house&p=585273#post585273

[Robert A Whit]

Why don't you go back to the post, get out your calculator, and multiply it out. You're embarrassing yourself. It wasn't cents per hour, it was cents per MILE in EV mode. And I generously subtracted the government subsidies and rebates from the final figure which actually was much higher, and also took the lower of the two claimed electrical current draw amounts. I was being quite conservative with the numbers, to keep it as simple as possible.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?37338-Are-there-any-car-experts-in-the-house&p=585273#post585273

Here is what you stated.

According to the Volt site, it can take up to 10 hours (on 120V) to recharge, or 4 hours on 240V. The battery is listed at 12.8kW, but one report I saw said it actually took 13.8kW. Electricity costs about 12 cents/kW-hr. After the crunching, it means the Volt costs about 3.8 cents per mile in EV mode.

Electric bill cost for the 294,000 miles it would take to make this viable? $1,079,413. Yes, that's in excess of one MILLION dollars.

My response

3.8 cents per mile times your 294,000 miles is what?

Want me to do is using correct math?

Fine.

3.8 cents times 294,000 is approximately the correct cents that you call dollars.

I come up with $11,172 dollars. You are off by a factor of 100.

[Anton Chigurh]

Here is what you stated.

According to the Volt site, it can take up to 10 hours (on 120V) to recharge, or 4 hours on 240V. The battery is listed at 12.8kW, but one report I saw said it actually took 13.8kW. Electricity costs about 12 cents/kW-hr. After the crunching, it means the Volt costs about 3.8 cents per mile in EV mode.

Electric bill cost for the 294,000 miles it would take to make this viable? $1,079,413. Yes, that's in excess of one MILLION dollars.

My response

3.8 cents per mile times your 294,000 miles is what?

Want me to do is using correct math?

Fine.

3.8 cents times 294,000 is approximately the correct cents that you call dollars.

I come up with $11,172 dollars. You are off by a factor of 100.I stand corrected!

$11,172 in electric cost, added to gasoline cost, for the 294,000 miles you would have to drive this pig to make it almost viable.

Good catch! The correct math is .038 times the 294,000

[Robert A Whit]

I stand corrected!

$11,172 in electric cost, added to gasoline cost, for the 294,000 miles you would have to drive this pig to make it almost viable.

Good catch! The correct math is .038 times the 294,000

I told you to check your own math before I had to embarass you.

You don't know me. Math and me are pals. Even in college, tricky calculus problems would almost instantly be solved in my head in a flash. Math as you use is primitive to me. At a glance and in a nano second I saw your mistake. Now you got it right.

Again, I am not a Volt seller. Matter of fact, Were I that dude, the guy wanting the new car, and driving arouind solo, I would pay the money and buy the Corvette. No bargain but like a fine woman, well worth the expense. Think how good he would feel after driving such a car. If he is a roaming salesman, I bet he would feel so good his sales would soar.

GM WAY overpriced the VOLT. Course they are trying to recover costs and try to make a profit. Sales so I hear are so slow that I think it might go the way of the Edsel did for Ford. Dad drove an Edsel and I liked his car.
:2up:

[Anton Chigurh]

I told you to check your own math before I had to embarass you. I wasn't embarrassed at all. It was a honest mistake while taking apart a dishonest one - the "green" Volt.

[tailfins]

ROFLMAO

Explain to the kiddies again how you transformed a few cents per hour for electricity into well over a million dollars again? Maybe you think in compound math. I still believe in 2+2 as being 4 and not ten thousand.


10^(2+2)=10,000.

[glockmail]

Again, I am not a Volt seller. Matter of fact, Were I that dude, the guy wanting the new car, and driving arouind solo, I would pay the money and buy the Corvette. No bargain but like a fine woman, well worth the expense. Think how good he would feel after driving such a car. If he is a roaming salesman, I bet he would feel so good his sales would soar.


A salesman needs room in the passenger compartment as well as at least some trunk space. And of course, good gas mileage. IF I was a Chevy guy (and I'm not) and in that position I'd buy a Camaro with the base engine. It has RWD IRS so should ride nice, has 300+ HP so is a real sports car and gets 31 mpg which is a lot better than the Vette. Since I don't like Chevy's though I'd refer the Dodge Challenger with the Pentastar V6 or if I needed more room and four doors, the Charger. All of these cars would be less expensive that the Volt, and a hell of a lot sexier.