NYC mayor wants hospitals to lock up baby formula to encourage breast-feeding

[Shadow]

The nanny state is going after moms.Mayor Bloomberg is pushing hospitals to hide their baby formula behind locked doors so more new mothers will breast-feed.
Starting Sept. 3, the city will keep tabs on the number of bottles that participating hospitals stock and use — the most restrictive pro-breast-milk program in the nation.

Under the city Health Department’s voluntary Latch On NYC initiative, 27 of the city’s 40 hospitals have also agreed to give up swag bags sporting formula-company logos, toss out formula-branded tchotchkes like lanyards and mugs, and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receives.
While breast-feeding activists applaud the move, bottle-feeding moms are bristling at the latest lactation lecture.

“If they put pressure on me, I would get annoyed,” said Lynn Sidnam, a Staten Island mother of two formula-fed girls, ages 4 months and 9 years. “It’s for me to choose.”


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/nyc-mayor-wants-hospitals-to-lock-up-baby-formula-to-encourage-breast-feeding/#ixzz221kHj9Ya

[jimnyc]

I can't wait for this man to leave office. Shit, he should have been gone already, but was nice enough to have term limits extended for himself. The man makes you miss Giuliani just like Obama makes you miss Bush.

[Shadow]

He looks like a tyrant too. ;)

I just love this line in the article...



With each bottle a mother requests and receives, she’ll also get a talking-to.


If these fuckers messed with me after my aversion...c-section... major spinal tap migraine... and refused to give me baby formula without a lecture attached. I would have chased them down and beat their ass...no matter how much more pain it caused me.

[Missileman]

He looks like a tyrant too. ;)

I just love this line in the article...



If these fuckers messed with me after my aversion...c-section... major spinal tap migraine... and refused to give me baby formula without a lecture attached. I would have chased them down and beat their ass...no matter how much more pain it caused me.

Relax! I'll beat their ass for you just on principle.

[Gaffer]

Jim I don't know how you do it, I would not visit NYC let alone live there.

[logroller]

He looks like a tyrant too. ;)

I just love this line in the article...



If these fuckers messed with me after my aversion...c-section... major spinal tap migraine... and refused to give me baby formula without a lecture attached. I would have chased them down and beat their ass...no matter how much more pain it caused me.
I'll bet you received a "talking to" about the inherent benefits/risks of a c-section and spinal block/Epidural. Admittedly, I don't think each bottle need or should be accompanied with a lecture, but an explanation of the risks and benefits should be discussed beforehand--it's not as though feeding the baby after birth is an unforeseen event. Our first required days of persistence, but she took a bottle immediately. My wife and I were lucky the hospital had a lactation specialist who encouraged my wife to be patient and that our baby would latch on, that a few days wasnt abnormal, and would be perfectly healthy without milk for a couple days (especially since milk doesn't come in for few days).
obviously situations vary and if breast feeding doesn't fit a mother and child's best interest the mother shouldn't be chastised, but I don't think that's the intention of the rule-- there is a long history of formula companies and medical providers favoring formula and foregoing the breast feeding process early on because its easier and gives the mother time to rest. But early on is when it is necessary-- not necessarily for the health of the baby, but to stimulate milk production especially. It also stimulates the autonomic healing of the mother. (uterine shrinkage, fat conversion and weight loss etc) of course, there are risks as well, and a mother should continue taking prenatal vitamins as the body will strip the mother of her own minerals and vitamins to feed the baby. Mothers are just biological awesome givers!!!:2up:
I don't think it's a bad thing to make that giving the preferred mode of feeding.

Kind of an aside, but all three of my kids were by c-section. I've heard that foregoing vaginal birth has been correlated to higher incidence of postpartum depression; they theorize the intensity of the birthing process causes levels of serotonin to astronomically spike and create an "addiction" to child. Yet another way mothers are awesome.

[hjmick]

Mayor or nanny? WTF?

[Abbey Marie]

I'll bet you received a "talking to" about the inherent benefits/risks of a c-section and spinal block/Epidural. Admittedly, I don't think each bottle need or should be accompanied with a lecture, but an explanation of the risks and benefits should be discussed beforehand--it's not as though feeding the baby after birth is an unforeseen event. Our first required days of persistence, but she took a bottle immediately. My wife and I were lucky the hospital had a lactation specialist who encouraged my wife to be patient and that our baby would latch on, that a few days wasnt abnormal, and would be perfectly healthy without milk for a couple days (especially since milk doesn't come in for few days).
obviously situations vary and if breast feeding doesn't fit a mother and child's best interest the mother shouldn't be chastised, but I don't think that's the intention of the rule-- there is a long history of formula companies and medical providers favoring formula and foregoing the breast feeding process early on because its easier and gives the mother time to rest. But early on is when it is necessary-- not necessarily for the health of the baby, but to stimulate milk production especially. It also stimulates the autonomic healing of the mother. (uterine shrinkage, fat conversion and weight loss etc) of course, there are risks as well, and a mother should continue taking prenatal vitamins as the body will strip the mother of her own minerals and vitamins to feed the baby. Mothers are just biological awesome givers!!!:2up:
I don't think it's a bad thing to make that giving the preferred mode of feeding.

Kind of an aside, but all three of my kids were by c-section. I've heard that foregoing vaginal birth has been correlated to higher incidence of postpartum depression; they theorize the intensity of the birthing process causes levels of serotonin to astronomically spike and create an "addiction" to child. Yet another way mothers are awesome.

I disagree. I don't want or need a lecture.
Deliver my baby, and then wait for ME to ask YOU for any information my apparently dumb ass needs. Dear lord.

If you really thought mothers were so "awesome" you wouldn't propose lecturing us. We would be awesome enough to figure it out, just as we always have. Mind your business.

[Shadow]

I'll bet you received a "talking to" about the inherent benefits/risks of a c-section and spinal block/Epidural. Admittedly, I don't think each bottle need or should be accompanied with a lecture, but an explanation of the risks and benefits should be discussed beforehand--it's not as though feeding the baby after birth is an unforeseen event. Our first required days of persistence, but she took a bottle immediately. My wife and I were lucky the hospital had a lactation specialist who encouraged my wife to be patient and that our baby would latch on, that a few days wasnt abnormal, and would be perfectly healthy without milk for a couple days (especially since milk doesn't come in for few days).
obviously situations vary and if breast feeding doesn't fit a mother and child's best interest the mother shouldn't be chastised, but I don't think that's the intention of the rule-- there is a long history of formula companies and medical providers favoring formula and foregoing the breast feeding process early on because its easier and gives the mother time to rest. But early on is when it is necessary-- not necessarily for the health of the baby, but to stimulate milk production especially. It also stimulates the autonomic healing of the mother. (uterine shrinkage, fat conversion and weight loss etc) of course, there are risks as well, and a mother should continue taking prenatal vitamins as the body will strip the mother of her own minerals and vitamins to feed the baby. Mothers are just biological awesome givers!!!:2up:
I don't think it's a bad thing to make that giving the preferred mode of feeding.

Kind of an aside, but all three of my kids were by c-section. I've heard that foregoing vaginal birth has been correlated to higher incidence of postpartum depression; they theorize the intensity of the birthing process causes levels of serotonin to astronomically spike and create an "addiction" to child. Yet another way mothers are awesome.

My baby was breech...and I actually had requested a c-section right off since we knew this the whole time. Told me no... too risky...made me try an adversion...induced labor (twice) with pitocin etc..

1 extra week of hell while they tried to coax the litte tike out...ended up with toxemia and a high fever...and guess what... ended up getting an emergency c-section anyway. So no...they don't always know what is 'best' apparently. They can keep the lectures.

[Dilloduck]

Isn't lecturing mothers sorta risky and a waste of time ?

[gabosaurus]

Can anyone explain why Bloomberg remains such a popular figure in NYC? Does he supervise the Kool Aid that is in every resident's drinking water? That place is loonier than Los Angeles.

[Little-Acorn]

The nanny state is going after moms.Mayor Bloomberg is pushing hospitals to hide their baby formula behind locked doors so more new mothers will breast-feed.
Starting Sept. 3, the city will keep tabs on the number of bottles that participating hospitals stock and use — the most restrictive pro-breast-milk program in the nation.

Under the city Health Department’s voluntary Latch On NYC initiative, 27 of the city’s 40 hospitals have also agreed to give up swag bags sporting formula-company logos, toss out formula-branded tchotchkes like lanyards and mugs, and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receives.
While breast-feeding activists applaud the move, bottle-feeding moms are bristling at the latest lactation lecture.

“If they put pressure on me, I would get annoyed,” said Lynn Sidnam, a Staten Island mother of two formula-fed girls, ages 4 months and 9 years. “It’s for me to choose.”


Leftists like Bloomberg believe the the purpose of government is to control people, and to somehow "make them better" through government guidance and social engineering.

Conservatives (if you can find any, especially in NYC) believe that the purpose of government is to protect people's rights, and nothing else. And to leave people free to better themselves, to whatever degree they can or want to.

Is it November yet?

[jimnyc]

Jim I don't know how you do it, I would not visit NYC let alone live there.

I started this username back in the late 90's. I worked in NYC for many years and I lived in Queens. Now I live in Westchester County, north of the City, and we don't fall into the crazy regulations under Bloomberg's umbrella. But things that end up even remotely "successful" in the City then get extended to areas outlining the city next.


Can anyone explain why Bloomberg remains such a popular figure in NYC? Does he supervise the Kool Aid that is in every resident's drinking water? That place is loonier than Los Angeles.

He was popular simply as "Bloomberg", for being a billionaire. NY loves rich people. Look how long we have tolerated Trump. You have the money, you control the city. I think a lot of people don't realize just how much Bloomberg is worth and how much control he has. It wouldn't surprise me if this jerk off decides to pull a 4th term out of his hat.

I don't know about being worse than LA. Pretty similar for sure, and no offense, both filled to excess with loony liberals. The best things in total would be the Dodgers and the Yankees. I'd be happy to have 50 or so tug boats put a chain around NYC and bring 'er around to the west coast and let you all blend into one happy place! We're keeping Lady Liberty though, which is on the NJ side of the water anyway.

[Shadow]

Leftists like Bloomberg believe the the purpose of government is to control people, and to somehow "make them better" through government guidance and social engineering.

Conservatives (if you can find any, especially in NYC) believe that the purpose of government is to protect people's rights, and nothing else. And to leave people free to better themselves, to whatever degree they can or want to.

Is it November yet?

Kinda cute how they talk outta both sides of their face too. Why the hell should some loon lib care if I breast feed or not. Shouldn't they be off somewhere talking the masses into aborting their babies?

Nitwits. :rolleyes:

[Shadow]

Isn't lecturing mothers sorta risky and a waste of time ?

Especially when they are in pain and cranky.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Kinda cute how they talk outta both sides of their face too. Why the hell should some loon lib care if I breast feed or not. Shouldn't they be off somewhere talking the masses into aborting their babies?

Nitwits. :rolleyes:

The lib insanity demands total control..Thats why we must nevr again allow them the power they currently have, its destroying the nation. Will do the job if we do not stop it soon IMHO.-Tyr

[logroller]

I disagree. I don't want or need a lecture.
Deliver my baby, and then wait for ME to ask YOU for any information my apparently dumb ass needs. Dear lord.

If you really thought mothers were so "awesome" you wouldn't propose lecturing us. We would be awesome enough to figure it out, just as we always have. Mind your business.
I forgot you know everything-- Im sure shadow would have been just fine birthing the baby breach and not having a cesarean then, she'd of figured it out.


My baby was breech...and I actually had requested a c-section right off since we knew this the whole time. Told me no... too risky...made me try an adversion...induced labor (twice) with pitocin etc..

1 extra week of hell while they tried to coax the litte tike out...ended up with toxemia and a high fever...and guess what... ended up getting an emergency c-section anyway. So no...they don't always know what is 'best' apparently. They can keep the lectures.
Again with the "lecture".I don't understand why you think a doctor should just hand over supplements without informed consent. Maybe you don't realize that they give out formula without any request whatsoever. I'm talking about informing the patient so they can make their own decision, as opposed to the a la cart paternalism that the medical community so firmly believes in about them knowing best. Ive been there and seen them push formula to my kids because it was easier than encouraging my wife when our first wouldn't latch on. similar to you, primary breach, only she had a planned cesarean. On the second she tried a vbac (she was "a good candidate") with pitocin and my wife's uterus ruptured -- During what the nurse said was "mild cramping" accordin to the monitor. Was I pissed, yes. Agree with the decision to have vbac, no-- I knew the risks and thought them too great, but my wife wanted to try vaginal birth so that later on she could advise our daughters on the experience. That was her choice and one she nearly paid her life for. So I don't appreciate abbey telling me to mind my own business. I do mind my business, but I also believe there is no such thing as too much information and that information is something I shall not keep to myself. If one feels as though being informed is burdensome, and others informing them "a lecture" then just ignore my posts.

[Kathianne]

I was and am a strong believer in breast feeding. With that said, I think the mayor should shut up. I agree with LR that mothers should be advised of the benefits of breast feeding, nutrition, etc., during pregnancy. By the time they've given birth, respect their decisions.

I have my thoughts, which doesn't discount that many babies since at least the 1940's have been well cared for with formula and bottles. My brother and I both were formula raised. Most of my friends had chosen formula over breastfeeding and their kids are just fine and fully bonded with their parents, indeed some seem never to want to leave!

BTW, LR, my friend nearly died with a ruptured uterus after her second pregnancy, she came home 2 weeks after her baby and certainly couldn't have nursed. She had to have a complete hysterectomy at 28, to stop the bleeding. Horrible and I'm glad your wife survived.

[Shadow]

I forgot you know everything-- Im sure shadow would have been just fine birthing the baby breach and not having a cesarean then, she'd of figured it out.


Again with the "lecture".I don't understand why you think a doctor should just hand over supplements without informed consent. Maybe you don't realize that they give out formula without any request whatsoever. I'm talking about informing the patient so they can make their own decision, as opposed to the a la cart paternalism that the medical community so firmly believes in about them knowing best. Ive been there and seen them push formula to my kids because it was easier than encouraging my wife when our first wouldn't latch on. similar to you, primary breach, only she had a planned cesarean. On the second she tried a vbac (she was "a good candidate") with pitocin and my wife's uterus ruptured -- During what the nurse said was "mild cramping" accordin to the monitor. Was I pissed, yes. Agree with the decision to have vbac, no-- I knew the risks and thought them too great, but my wife wanted to try vaginal birth so that later on she could advise our daughters on the experience. That was her choice and one she nearly paid her life for. So I don't appreciate abbey telling me to mind my own business. I do mind my business, but I also believe there is no such thing as too much information and that information is something I shall not keep to myself. If one feels as though being informed is burdensome, and others informing them "a lecture" then just ignore my posts.

Informed is one thing ( don't really have an issue with that at all). Brow beaten everytime you request formula is something else entirely. Libs want to tell others to butt out of a womans uterus...they can damn well piss off when it comes to my breast milk then. They kill me with the never ending double standards.:rolleyes:

Yeah...my doctors thought having a vaginal birth would be better in regard to healing and recovery. It was my experience both times that they really try to talk you into that route instead of a c-section. In my case it hurt instead of helped. Found out later I could have never delivered that way anyway because of the shape of my cervix.

[aboutime]

I was and am a strong believer in breast feeding. With that said, I think the mayor should shut up. I agree with LR that mothers should be advised of the benefits of breast feeding, nutrition, etc., during pregnancy. By the time they've given birth, respect their decisions.

I have my thoughts, which doesn't discount that many babies since at least the 1940's have been well cared for with formula and bottles. My brother and I both were formula raised. Most of my friends had chosen formula over breastfeeding and their kids are just fine and fully bonded with their parents, indeed some seem never to want to leave!

BTW, LR, my friend nearly died with a ruptured uterus after her second pregnancy, she came home 2 weeks after her baby and certainly couldn't have nursed. She had to have a complete hysterectomy at 28, to stop the bleeding. Horrible and I'm glad your wife survived.


Bloomburg is just Jealous that REAL MEN in New York City have access to Breast Feeding, while he only has the TAX TEET to keep him happy.

[fj1200]

I disagree. I don't want or need a lecture.
Deliver my baby, and then wait for ME to ask YOU for any information my apparently dumb ass needs. Dear lord.

If you really thought mothers were so "awesome" you wouldn't propose lecturing us. We would be awesome enough to figure it out, just as we always have. Mind your business.

Do you know how many incompetent women are out there who won't even give breastfeeding a first thought? Information is NOT evil.

[jafar00]

Since when did Bloomberg become a medical practitioner?

Some new mothers, especially first timers have difficulty getting into the swing of breastfeeding and as do some babies. If my experience is anything to go by, further stressing a mother out will make it even less likely for the milk to flow freely.

Beginning to breast feed requires a little knowhow and a LOT of patience and sometimes in order to ensure a baby gains a healthy amount of weight, it is sometimes necessary to supplement with formula.

[Nell's Room]

The nanny state is going after moms.Mayor Bloomberg is pushing hospitals to hide their baby formula behind locked doors so more new mothers will breast-feed.
Starting Sept. 3, the city will keep tabs on the number of bottles that participating hospitals stock and use — the most restrictive pro-breast-milk program in the nation.

Under the city Health Department’s voluntary Latch On NYC initiative, 27 of the city’s 40 hospitals have also agreed to give up swag bags sporting formula-company logos, toss out formula-branded tchotchkes like lanyards and mugs, and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receives.
While breast-feeding activists applaud the move, bottle-feeding moms are bristling at the latest lactation lecture.

“If they put pressure on me, I would get annoyed,” said Lynn Sidnam, a Staten Island mother of two formula-fed girls, ages 4 months and 9 years. “It’s for me to choose.”


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/07/29/nyc-mayor-wants-hospitals-to-lock-up-baby-formula-to-encourage-breast-feeding/#ixzz221kHj9Ya

Nope. I'm sorry, but when you become a mother, those boobs are their for a reason. Their purpose is to FEED your child. That is why women have breasts. To feed your baby. Use them to feed the baby. Don't feed the baby a heap of chemicals. If you can't breastfeed because you have extreme pain, then fine, use formula. But if you just choose not to breastfeed, tough shit. Hide the formula and force these women to use their breasts for what nature intended - feeding their child.

[KarlMarx]

My son's birth weight was 10 pounds 2 ounces. My ex-wife had every intention to breast feed him, and tried for nearly a week, but she could not keep up with him. He would cry because he was always hungry. She called the hospital asking for help and their only answer was "try the other breast"... she already had fed him with both! She was in tears. That did it, we switched to formula. He started sleeping through the night and the continual crying stopped.

This edict from King Bloomberg reminds me of another idiotic notion. Cars no longer have ash trays. Now smokers are forced to throw their used butts out their car windows and litter the landscape.

This is the problem with a lot of people, they don't think past "stage 1" as Thomas Sowell described it. There are unintended consequences. Keep the kids on formula, return ash trays to cars... we'll have healthy happy kids and keep America Beautiful.

[Shadow]

Nope. I'm sorry, but when you become a mother, those boobs are their for a reason. Their purpose is to FEED your child. That is why women have breasts. To feed your baby. Use them to feed the baby. Don't feed the baby a heap of chemicals. If you can't breastfeed because you have extreme pain, then fine, use formula. But if you just choose not to breastfeed, tough shit. Hide the formula and force these women to use their breasts for what nature intended - feeding their child.

Do you have kids? Your words remind me of those new mothers that once have a baby...think they were the first woman in the history of the world to give birth. LOL


My son's birth weight was 10 pounds 2 ounces. My ex-wife had every intention to breast feed him, and tried for nearly a week, but she could not keep up with him. He would cry because he was always hungry. She called the hospital asking for help and their only answer was "try the other breast"... she already had fed him with both! She was in tears. That did it, we switched to formula. He started sleeping through the night and the continual crying stopped.

This edict from King Bloomberg reminds me of another idiotic notion. Cars no longer have ash trays. Now smokers are forced to throw their used butts out their car windows and litter the landscape.

This is the problem with a lot of people, they don't think past "stage 1" as Thomas Sowell described it. There are unintended consequences. Keep the kids on formula, return ash trays to cars... we'll have healthy happy kids and keep America Beautiful.

They are also so short sighted that they think the same solution will work for everyone. Makes me wonder if they even live in the real world at all.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

My wife was in the hospital for 3 days while they gave medicine intraveniously to advance our sons lungs etc.Our son was taken by c-section on the morning of the third day at 27 weeks to save his life. He was exactly one pound 8 ounces at birth. Spent 85 days in the hospital and came home when he had gained 2 pounds making him a total of 3 pounds 8 ounces. My wife's breast milk was not adequate to give him so he went on formula from the start while my wife used a breast pump and we stored her breast milk by freezing it, later we would take a 3 day supply to the hospital ,they would give it to our son mixed with formula. After two operations , him surviving two hospital infections and 85 days we couldnt wait to get him home! Then began almost three years of round the clock care with him taking an antibiotic everyday for urinary reflux disease , now finally he has overcame everything except the weight gain. He will be 6 years old in December this year but is still in the 5 percentile. We chose to give him breast milk and formula combined because my wife's breast milk was too weak and he needed more. I believe that if a woman understands about breast feeding it then should be her choice to decide and she should not be brow beaten over and over again about it. Even with my wife's breast milk being weak we still wanted our son to have it for many reasons. Still had my wife said no to breast pumping and giving the breast milk to our son I'd been 100% with her on that!!! By the way , our son now at 5 years old still drinks formula to aid in his nutrition needs , we are hoping his weight gain vastly improves in the coming months so we can take him off his SPECIAL formula that his nutrition specialist doctor has him on currently. Almost 6 years with giving formula I've become quite knowledgable about it methinks.-I know its benefits and its drawbacks and am so tired of having to supplement my son's diet with it but do heed his nutrition specialist doctor's advice! We are truly close to an almost 6 year ordeal being over thank God! So close that we expect in October to be able to stop the formula altogether if his doctor agrees! Has been the hardest thing I've ever faced and my wife as well. 6 years of serious stress on my son's health problems has taken a heavy toll. Just made him a doctor appointment this morning for 1 o'clock today at Pediatric Care for a fever he came down with late last night, called at 8 am and got earliest appointment available today, wait time 5 hours! American health care not destroyed yet, than God!!! -Tyr

[taft2012]

I can't wait for this man to leave office. Shit, he should have been gone already, but was nice enough to have term limits extended for himself. The man makes you miss Giuliani just like Obama makes you miss Bush.

IMO, Rudy would have been a way better president than Bush.

Just my two cents.

[taft2012]

This edict from King Bloomberg reminds me of another idiotic notion. Cars no longer have ash trays. Now smokers are forced to throw their used butts out their car windows and litter the landscape.

This is the problem with a lot of people, they don't think past "stage 1" as Thomas Sowell described it. There are unintended consequences. Keep the kids on formula, return ash trays to cars... we'll have healthy happy kids and keep America Beautiful.

Definitely.

Bloomberg's cigarette taxes were designed to prevent people from smoking. When the price of a pack of smokes soared up to $13 to $14, buying a pack became cost prohibitive for a lot of the city's poorer folks. So what happened is that many marijuana dealers switched over to illegally selling loose cigarettes on the street for $1 each. The penalty was only a summons, as opposed to arrest for selling weed, and the cash rewards were in the same ballpark.

The end result was that the intra-dealer violence that used to be among marijuana dealers is now associated with loose cigarettes. They will shoot one another to get the "best spot," like that near a subway exit with a lot of pedestrian traffic.

[Trigg]

Under the city Health Department’s voluntary Latch On NYC initiative, 27 of the city’s 40 hospitals have also agreed to give up swag bags sporting formula-company logos, toss out formula-branded tchotchkes like lanyards and mugs, and document a medical reason for every bottle that a newborn receives.
While breast-feeding activists applaud the move, bottle-feeding moms are bristling at the latest lactation lecture.


What's the problem????

I don't see a controversy. They aren't giving out free formula and they aren't doing free advertising for the formula companies.

There are so many women who have never had any information about breast feeding, and many more who are discouraged from doing so by friends and co-workers.

It is the best thing for the baby, especially in the first few weeks. So, I see nothing wrong with encouraging it.....note I did not say lecture or force.

Women are free to feed their babies however they choose, what I see are the hospitals encouraging nursing over formula instead of the other way around.

[Abbey Marie]

I forgot you know everything-- Im sure shadow would have been just fine birthing the baby breach and not having a cesarean then, she'd of figured it out.


Again with the "lecture".I don't understand why you think a doctor should just hand over supplements without informed consent. Maybe you don't realize that they give out formula without any request whatsoever. I'm talking about informing the patient so they can make their own decision, as opposed to the a la cart paternalism that the medical community so firmly believes in about them knowing best. Ive been there and seen them push formula to my kids because it was easier than encouraging my wife when our first wouldn't latch on. similar to you, primary breach, only she had a planned cesarean. On the second she tried a vbac (she was "a good candidate") with pitocin and my wife's uterus ruptured -- During what the nurse said was "mild cramping" accordin to the monitor. Was I pissed, yes. Agree with the decision to have vbac, no-- I knew the risks and thought them too great, but my wife wanted to try vaginal birth so that later on she could advise our daughters on the experience. That was her choice and one she nearly paid her life for. So I don't appreciate abbey telling me to mind my own business. I do mind my business, but I also believe there is no such thing as too much information and that information is something I shall not keep to myself. If one feels as though being informed is burdensome, and others informing them "a lecture" then just ignore my posts.

Yeah because we all know that delivering a breech baby (btw it's spelled "breech") and breast feeding require the same amount of medical involvement and supervision. :rolleyes:

And yes, when it comes to giving birth and whether or not I want to to breast feed my children,
I do know more than you. Looks like you don't think women are that awesome after all.

As for you minding your own business or not, you appear to still not get it, so let me spell it out:
-The method you employ to feed your child, your business.
-The method any and every other parent on the planet does to feed theirs, their business.

[Abbey Marie]

I was and am a strong believer in breast feeding. With that said, I think the mayor should shut up. I agree with LR that mothers should be advised of the benefits of breast feeding, nutrition, etc., during pregnancy. By the time they've given birth, respect their decisions.

I have my thoughts, which doesn't discount that many babies since at least the 1940's have been well cared for with formula and bottles. My brother and I both were formula raised. Most of my friends had chosen formula over breastfeeding and their kids are just fine and fully bonded with their parents, indeed some seem never to want to leave!

BTW, LR, my friend nearly died with a ruptured uterus after her second pregnancy, she came home 2 weeks after her baby and certainly couldn't have nursed. She had to have a complete hysterectomy at 28, to stop the bleeding. Horrible and I'm glad your wife survived.

Eggg-xactly. :thumb:

[Abbey Marie]

Do you know how many incompetent women are out there who won't even give breastfeeding a first thought? Information is NOT evil.

Did you read the OP? We are not talking information here. We are talking lecturing whenever a bottle is requested, which amounts to intimidation, an a guilt trip for your choice. Information would be handing out a pamphlet and/or a pre-natal discussion from a nurse.

[Abbey Marie]

Nope. I'm sorry, but when you become a mother, those boobs are their for a reason. Their purpose is to FEED your child. That is why women have breasts. To feed your baby. Use them to feed the baby. Don't feed the baby a heap of chemicals. If you can't breastfeed because you have extreme pain, then fine, use formula. But if you just choose not to breastfeed, tough shit. Hide the formula and force these women to use their breasts for what nature intended - feeding their child.

And that uterus is for developing a child and birthing it- alive. I assume therefore by this post that you must be pro-life.

[fj1200]

Did you read the OP? We are not talking information here. We are talking lecturing whenever a bottle is requested, which amounts to intimidation, an a guilt trip for your choice. Information would be handing out a pamphlet and/or a pre-natal discussion from a nurse.

Of course I did, but LR had moved beyond the force of state, with the inherent promotion of private baby formula companies of course, :rolleyes: at which point you went back to being "lectured." Do they go overboard? Of course, but it's Bloomberg being Bloomberg.

[logroller]

What's the problem????

I don't see a controversy. They aren't giving out free formula and they aren't doing free advertising for the formula companies.

There are so many women who have never had any information about breast feeding, and many more who are discouraged from doing so by friends and co-workers.

It is the best thing for the baby, especially in the first few weeks. So, I see nothing wrong with encouraging it.....note I did not say lecture or force.

Women are free to feed their babies however they choose, what I see are the hospitals encouraging nursing over formula instead of the other way around.


Yeah because we all know that delivering a breech baby (btw it's spelled "breech") and breast feeding require the same amount of medical involvement and supervision. :rolleyes:

And yes, when it comes to giving birth and whether or not I want to to breast feed my children,
I do know more than you. Looks like you don't think women are that awesome after all.

As for you minding your own business or not, you appear to still not get it, so let me spell it out:
-The method you employ to feed your child, your business.
-The method any and every other parent on the planet does to feed theirs, their business.
-the method drug companies use to coerce medical professionals into pushing their products-- everyone's business.
If don't believe you are so naive not see them doing that; so either you jut like taking issue with me personally or you are a corporate horror (btw, did I spell that right?):poke:
Personally I don't think you've been to a birthing hospital in a while. I have and I've seen the push for two rival drug companies, Merck and Roche. I'm talking free bottles, free nipples, free diaper bags, free formula-- weeeeeee-- free stuff. But where's that rally cry for free healthcare? It's not free-- they give out just enough formula to get the mother beyond the point her milk can come in. Then it's, hello high prices! But that's not how they pitch it in the birth units; it's just free stuff-- look how easy! Try both brands, see which one you like better. 1/5 nurses mentioned breast feeding but veryone mentioned the free formula bags. Maybe that was only my experience; but seeing the OP, I'm obviously not alone. How about the the hospital minds their business, patient care, and not pushing big pharma's business. I think that's what this is about; cleverly disguised as lecturing women. It's been said, you wanna know who's behind somethin, follow the money!

[Kathianne]

What's the problem????

I don't see a controversy. They aren't giving out free formula and they aren't doing free advertising for the formula companies.

There are so many women who have never had any information about breast feeding, and many more who are discouraged from doing so by friends and co-workers.

It is the best thing for the baby, especially in the first few weeks. So, I see nothing wrong with encouraging it.....note I did not say lecture or force.

Women are free to feed their babies however they choose, what I see are the hospitals encouraging nursing over formula instead of the other way around.

They are lecturing though, that is one part of what he's asking for. Not once, but every time formula is given to the infant.

[Kathianne]

Did you read the OP? We are not talking information here. We are talking lecturing whenever a bottle is requested, which amounts to intimidation, an a guilt trip for your choice. Information would be handing out a pamphlet and/or a pre-natal discussion from a nurse.

No one's even brought up what these lectures might do to a woman that is experiencing postpartum depression.

[Kathianne]

Here's how I see it and I've been to a birthing unit within the past two years, several times. Any woman who's had prenatal care was informed by the 4th month to consider breast feeding, it's the best for babies. Information is given in pamphlets on how to nurse for a year or more, even when working full-time. Coupons for pumps and call numbers and websites for La Leche League (http://www.llli.org/)are given. (See how easy it is to find! :laugh2:)

Now if a woman just shows up at the hospital to give birth, I guess the same information should be given, but how likely is she to read it? Don't say a word about costs, everyone knows that if on WIC prenatal care is available. Bottom line, the women that don't go for prenatal care, certainly much more of a risk than formula feeding, probably fall into the category of breastfeeding cause is cheaper/less hassle or water, juice, milk from the get go.

Even moms that are committed to breast feeding can take the 'baby bag' and put it to good use. They can have the formula for 'an emergency' or give to a friend.

One point I want to address to an earlier post by Tyr and another I think by Karl Marx. 'Weak milk?' I've not heard of. Breast milk is sort of bluish water looking. More so than skim milk. Very sweet, much more than cows milk. I'm guessing the problem for tyr's wife and baby was just how sick the little guy was.

The bottom line is that the more the baby nurses, the more milk is produced and the inverse also. With such a big baby as KM said, the only way to get the milk production up is to feed that baby every hour or hour and half. The mom is going to not be feeling so hot. I'd supplement too!

I don't know if anyone here is preggers or their wife is. If contemplating breast feeding and it seems that milk production isn't high enough, a beer a day can help. Seriously.

[Nukeman]

-the method drug companies use to coerce medical professionals into pushing their products-- everyone's business.
If don't believe you are so naive not see them doing that; so either you jut like taking issue with me personally or you are a corporate horror (btw, did I spell that right?):poke:
Personally I don't think you've been to a birthing hospital in a while. I have and I've seen the push for two rival drug companies, Merck and Roche. I'm talking free bottles, free nipples, free diaper bags, free formula-- weeeeeee-- free stuff. But where's that rally cry for free healthcare? It's not free-- they give out just enough formula to get the mother beyond the point her milk can come in. Then it's, hello high prices! But that's not how they pitch it in the birth units; it's just free stuff-- look how easy! Try both brands, see which one you like better. 1/5 nurses mentioned breast feeding but veryone mentioned the free formula bags. Maybe that was only my experience; but seeing the OP, I'm obviously not alone. How about the the hospital minds their business, patient care, and not pushing big pharma's business. I think that's what this is about; cleverly disguised as lecturing women. It's been said, you wanna know who's behind somethin, follow the money!
Do you have ANY idea the restriction placed on drug companies and how they "market" their drugs... let me tell you they can't even give a freaking pen out with the name of the company or drug on it let alone anything else to the hospital/workers/ or physicians.. Its against the law now if your a freaking congresman you can be flown to the Bahama's for a week with your family to discuss healthcare by the SAME drug company now tell me where would YOU rather the company spend their money?? Educating the Dr's who will presribe and use their stuff or the govt who we all knwo are much more influenced by the "MONEY"

As for the "free" stuff given at hospitals for the new moms that is a starter kit that yes does have formula in it but it also has a lot of other nice things as well, Ultimately it is up to the MOTHER to decide if she wants to breast feed or not NOT the state... That is the problem I see with lecturing, have NO problem with information. I know all the hospitals I ahve ever worked for have ALWAYS pushed breast feeding over formula due to the nutritional benefits and health benefits, so I don't knwo what kind of crazy ass hospital you ahve been to that pushes the formula maybe they are corporate owned/sponsered by the drug company!!!! don't really know. I have worked in 4 different states and they have all been the same in educating breast feeding over formula.... EDUCATING not LECTURING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Shadow]

Did you read the OP? We are not talking information here. We are talking lecturing whenever a bottle is requested, which amounts to intimidation, an a guilt trip for your choice. Information would be handing out a pamphlet and/or a pre-natal discussion from a nurse.

And locking up the baby formula in a secure place.... like the super secret baby formula vault. Apparently new mothers can't be trusted not to steal it either. :laugh:

[Shadow]

NYC Hospitals’ Baby Formula Plan Rankles Mommy Bloggers


Breastfeeding experts are applauding New York City’s “Latch On NYC” initiative (http://www.medpagetoday.com/Pediatrics/Parenting/33993), which aims to encourage breastfeeding and curb baby formula use in hospitals, but some mommy bloggers are not happy, and they are taking their grievances online.

One of these bloggers is Katherine Stone, a 42-year-old mother who lives in Atlanta. In her Babble blog post on Monday — titled “Back Off of the Mamas, Mayor Bloomberg!” (http://blogs.babble.com/babble-voices/something-fierce-katherine-stone/2012/07/30/back-off-of-the-mamas-mayor-bloomberg/) — she criticizes the additional monitoring of formula use in hospitals.

“It’s a thin line,” she said. “I think it’s a little bit scary because it begins to infer that it’s a bad, bad thing to feed your child formula.”


Meredith Carroll is a 39-year-old mother and Babble blogger (http://blogs.babble.com/strollerderby/2012/07/30/is-nyc-mayor-michael-bloomberg-a-boob-for-directing-hospitals-to-hide-baby-formula/) who lives in Aspen, Colo., and she, too, takes issue with the impending New York City policy.

“This isn’t morphine,” Carroll said. “I’m not a drug addict that needs to be kept away from a drug. I just want to feed my baby.”

Both bloggers said they realized that the initiative would not affect them directly, as they do not live in New York. But the plan will see 27 of New York City’s hospitals implementing its policies on Labor Day, which include keeping formula in locked storage rooms and monitoring its use.
The initiative will also discontinue the practice of hospitals distributing free infant formula at the time of discharge, prohibit the display of formula promotional materials in hospitals, and encourage greater enforcement of existing regulations prohibiting the use of formula for breastfeeding infants unless medically indicated.

It is not the first time the availability of baby formula in hospitals has been put under the spotlight. An August 2011 report by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention lambasted hospitals for not adhering to steps designed to encourage breastfeeding in hospitals spelled out by the Baby-Friendly Hospital Initiative.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/health/2012/07/31/nyc-hospitals-baby-formula-plan-rankles-mommy-bloggers/

[logroller]

I read the link to NYC latch on initiative-- it said nothing about "lecturing" only informing on the advantages of breast feeding. Besides, If mothers have decided to feed their babies formula, why not bring it with them to the hospital; why are the hospitals expected to provide it?

[Shadow]

I read the link to NYC latch on initiative-- it said nothing about "lecturing" only informing on the advantages of breast feeding. Besides, If mothers have decided to feed their babies formula, why not bring it with them to the hospital; why are the hospitals expected to provide it?

A lot of the baby items given to new mothers in baby kits are also provided to the hospitals free of charge by the medical supply distributors. It does not hurt the hospitals to give this stuff away.

[logroller]

Do you have ANY idea the restriction placed on drug companies and how they "market" their drugs... let me tell you they can't even give a freaking pen out with the name of the company or drug on it let alone anything else to the hospital/workers/ or physicians.. Its against the law now if your a freaking congresman you can be flown to the Bahama's for a week with your family to discuss healthcare by the SAME drug company now tell me where would YOU rather the company spend their money?? Educating the Dr's who will presribe and use their stuff or the govt who we all knwo are much more influenced by the "MONEY"

As for the "free" stuff given at hospitals for the new moms that is a starter kit that yes does have formula in it but it also has a lot of other nice things as well, Ultimately it is up to the MOTHER to decide if she wants to breast feed or not NOT the state... That is the problem I see with lecturing, have NO problem with information. I know all the hospitals I ahve ever worked for have ALWAYS pushed breast feeding over formula due to the nutritional benefits and health benefits, so I don't knwo what kind of crazy ass hospital you ahve been to that pushes the formula maybe they are corporate owned/sponsered by the drug company!!!! don't really know. I have worked in 4 different states and they have all been the same in educating breast feeding over formula.... EDUCATING not LECTURING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Again with th lecturing-- that's an opinion, not fact. The fact is people don't like being informed about why their decision might not be the right one. I have a hard time thinking that a woman who has just had a great deal of blood loss or some other medical issue would be pressured into breast feeding; I do see the likelihood of a nurse grabbing another bottle because it's easier than encouraging a mother to breast feed-- probably because I've seen both!
As to restrictions on pharma; they exist for reason-- drug companies colluded with doctors to their mutual benefit and NOT to the benefit of patients.

[Nukeman]

Again with th lecturing-- that's an opinion, not fact. The fact is people don't like being informed about why their decision might not be the right one. I have a hard time thinking that a woman who has just had a great deal of blood loss or some other medical issue would be pressured into breast feeding; I do see the likelihood of a nurse grabbing another bottle because it's easier than encouraging a mother to breast feed-- probably because I've seen both!
As to restrictions on pharma; they exist for reason-- drug companies colluded with doctors to their mutual benefit and NOT to the benefit of patients.That my friend may be true in SOME instances but the OVERWHELMING majority DID NOT!!!! So you punish ALL for the actions of a few.

If by colluded you mean they brought in lunch to give a presentation or offered to send physicians to educational seminars than yes most are guilty as charged but if you mean they "colluded" in the sense that they didn't care about the outcome of their patient I say BS... Physicians are like everyone else they have PREFERENCES on what they like to use and sometimes with the preference they make a association with a company... Do some go beyond that?? YES!! Do most?? NO!!!!

We should hold all govt officials to the SAME standards that they hold private citizens to.

[jafar00]

Baby formula is a dangerous chemical weapon apparently. Just try getting on a plane with some these days and see how far you get.

[logroller]

That my friend may be true in SOME instances but the OVERWHELMING majority DID NOT!!!! So you punish ALL for the actions of a few.

If by colluded you mean they brought in lunch to give a presentation or offered to send physicians to educational seminars than yes most are guilty as charged but if you mean they "colluded" in the sense that they didn't care about the outcome of their patient I say BS... Physicians are like everyone else they have PREFERENCES on what they like to use and sometimes with the preference they make a association with a company... Do some go beyond that?? YES!! Do most?? NO!!!!

We should hold all govt officials to the SAME standards that they hold private citizens to.

I didn't say it was widespread, only that it happened. The reputation of the medical community was damaged by the acts of a few; to restore credibility, drastic changes were made. You can argue the same should apply to Congress, I'd take no issue.
But to reiterate your point about it being just a few, how many of these nurses will be "lecturing" vs "informing." I have a low expectation for people being diligent in their research on drugs and supplements. If they were, very few would opt for formula. I'd guess people get more information from the evening news than the FDA, WHO or the American Association of Pediatrics-- who all say breast-feeding only is best for the first six months (even formula manufacturers agree). But when a medical professional gives us something there is an expectation (naive though it may be) that it is the best course. If it is not, we should be told so. Each and every time, well, I don't know there is one answer for every situation, as there are medical reasons for formula to be administered by hospitals-- but following an aggressive marketing campaign During the 1950s and 1960s, the trend in breast-feeding was steadily downward, and by the early 1970s, only ∼25% of infants were breast-fed at age 1 wk and only 14% between 2 and 3 mo of age. So tell me, was that in the best interests of patients? Because I'll call BS on that.

From the sound of it this will make more work for nurses, because they'll have to document formula usage; not that they'll be required to browbeat mothers who choose formula feeding. Will some feel that way, perhaps; but as you said, should the acts of few result in the lambasting of a medically sound policy? I think not, and if mothers choose formula against medical advice, why should hospitals be complicit?

I can tell each time I go to the dentist he tells me I need a mouth hard because I grind my teeth. Or what about high- cholesterol; should the doctors tell you once that diet alone can drastically reduce it without drug intervention; then once I decide to take meds, they never mention diet again? Clearly there's a balance, and maybe this policy is unnecessary; but there was a huge trend of formula only use following the marketing campaigns of formula producers. Is that just coincidence?

Is there any contention that breast feeding isn't what is best under most all circumstances-- why should hospitals be complicit in going against what is medically best?

[KitchenKitten99]

Reading each and every post on this thread intrigues me. Especially those made by logroller.

Funny how the same people who claim conservatives have this 'war on women', and say that the government should stay out of women's uterus'... are the same ones trying to brow-beat women into choosing one method over another, even so much as making some sort of law over it. Hypocritical much?

Personally, I used a combination of both feeding methods for both of my heathens kids. Until I went back to work (both times) I nursed during the day, but formula fed at night. They slept better and longer at night and were sleeping for 5-6 hour stretches at night around 2 months of age.

I tried to breast feed around the clock (for both) but I just could not seem to produce that much and my supply seemed to get less and less even over a 2-week period. So I decided to at least nurse during the day when not much was going on, and formula feed at night so I could get some sleep. Being up every 1.5 hours was taking its' toll on me health-wise. I just could not keep up with both my boys' voracious appetites. Not to mention with a newborn and a very active 2yo and almost no help during the day, sitting down every 1.5 hours for 30 minutes didn't always work. Nor did breastfeeding while out and about. Eventually when I went back to work, I switched to full-time formula. Both for ease of use and my continued employment. Where I worked made it difficult to pump (damn near impossible), even if I had continued.

It wasn't even very long ago that I gave birth to my youngest. He is now 6 years old.

During both of my pregnancies, from the first clinic visit and subsequent visits, as well as websites and other media dedicated to parents and especially new moms... getting info on breastfeeding was not an issue. I think in each parenting mag I read (mostly for recipes and interesting fun things to do with your kids), there was SOMETHING about breastfeeding vs. formula.

Almost all of them said breastfeeding is best, but you won't hurt your baby (obviously) if you choose formula and not to be pressured either way.

This was SIX years ago. My oldest is almost 9... even THEN, there was PLENTY of info out there. Heck, in my county, they actually have a breast pump rental program that goes through the hospitals, on a sliding fee scale. The most anyone would pay was $60 a month, for as long as you chose. I chose to purchase mine secondhand through eBay. Then I re-sold it later for a little under what I purchased it for.

Breastfeeding was then (and still is) very emphasized (the have a special lactation department available 24-7 to help you out) but should you choose not to do so, no one there made you feel like a criminal.

Both my kids were born c-section and both full term. The only thing I was concerned about was the painkillers affecting my babies, so I chose to formula feed a bit more often during my 5-day stay. Plus my appetite wasn't quite back from the anesthesia.

Had someone lectured me each time I asked for formula, they probably would have found my IV needle out of my arm and in their neck. Or whatever sharp object was nearby.

[logroller]

Reading each and every post on this thread intrigues me. Especially those made by logroller.

Funny how the same people who claim conservatives have this 'war on women', and say that the government should stay out of women's uterus'... are the same ones trying to brow-beat women into choosing one method over another, even so much as making some sort of law over it. Hypocritical much?

Personally, I used a combination of both feeding methods for both of my heathens kids. Until I went back to work (both times) I nursed during the day, but formula fed at night. They slept better and longer at night and were sleeping for 5-6 hour stretches at night around 2 months of age.

I tried to breast feed around the clock (for both) but I just could not seem to produce that much and my supply seemed to get less and less even over a 2-week period. So I decided to at least nurse during the day when not much was going on, and formula feed at night so I could get some sleep. Being up every 1.5 hours was taking its' toll on me health-wise. I just could not keep up with both my boys' voracious appetites. Not to mention with a newborn and a very active 2yo and almost no help during the day, sitting down every 1.5 hours for 30 minutes didn't always work. Nor did breastfeeding while out and about. Eventually when I went back to work, I switched to full-time formula. Both for ease of use and my continued employment. Where I worked made it difficult to pump (damn near impossible), even if I had continued.

It wasn't even very long ago that I gave birth to my youngest. He is now 6 years old.

During both of my pregnancies, from the first clinic visit and subsequent visits, as well as websites and other media dedicated to parents and especially new moms... getting info on breastfeeding was not an issue. I think in each parenting mag I read (mostly for recipes and interesting fun things to do with your kids), there was SOMETHING about breastfeeding vs. formula.

Almost all of them said breastfeeding is best, but you won't hurt your baby (obviously) if you choose formula and not to be pressured either way.

This was SIX years ago. My oldest is almost 9... even THEN, there was PLENTY of info out there. Heck, in my county, they actually have a breast pump rental program that goes through the hospitals, on a sliding fee scale. The most anyone would pay was $60 a month, for as long as you chose. I chose to purchase mine secondhand through eBay. Then I re-sold it later for a little under what I purchased it for.

Breastfeeding was then (and still is) very emphasized (the have a special lactation department available 24-7 to help you out) but should you choose not to do so, no one there made you feel like a criminal.

Both my kids were born c-section and both full term. The only thing I was concerned about was the painkillers affecting my babies, so I chose to formula feed a bit more often during my 5-day stay. Plus my appetite wasn't quite back from the anesthesia.

Had someone lectured me each time I asked for formula, they probably would have found my IV needle out of my arm and in their neck. Or whatever sharp object was nearby.
I'm glad you found my posts interesting. :thumbs:
But as for my hypocrisy, alleged above, I've supported reasonable steps, vaginal ultrasounds, counseling by a doctor and waiting periods etc, being taken to make sure those who have abortions are informed of their options and the associated risks. I'm anything but laissez faire about the whole thing.
But am I to assume you are pro-life then? Yet think hospitals should provide formula, which is medically necessary in a disproportionate number to those who use formula, without counseling before it is administered by hospital personel?
That was rhetorical; i dont think you believe that--- but why do you think this policy is akin to being brow beaten or lectured? I think that's a bit hyperbolic-- the same way pro-choice proponents see vaginal ultrasounds as punitive. Breast feeding exclusively is considered a medical best practice. do you dispute that? Just like a cesarean for primary breech is the best course of treatment; if one chose to try vaginal the doctors and nurses and would assuredly inform you of the risks, perhaps repeatedly during the birthing process as the situation changes. Thats their job; not to sit back and say, "well you made the decision to have a natural birth."

Look. All I'm saying is this is much ado about nothing. I highly doubt nurses will ignore your request for formula, they'll just need to know your reasoning. If its, I don't produce enough milk or I don't want the pain meds affecting the baby, I'm guessing they would suggest formula temporarily and 'pump and dump' to encourage milk production w/o affecting the baby. Would that satisfy your concerns? If there's another reason, like you just don't want because of work/lifestyle, I'm quite sure they'd understand and not brow beat you or repeatedly lecture-- nobody wants a needle in the neck.

[KitchenKitten99]

I'm glad you found my posts interesting. :thumbs:
...
Funny how you assumed what I stated about your posts was in a good way...

[KitchenKitten99]

Look. All I'm saying is this is much ado about nothing. I highly doubt nurses will ignore your request for formula, they'll just need to know your reasoning. ...

Other than feeding the child... there should never NEED to be a reason.

Do you really believe all the bullshit that you post?

[jimnyc]

Funny how you assumed what I stated about your posts was in a good way...

Methinks the Logman was yanking yer chain when he wrote that!

[KitchenKitten99]

Methinks the Logman was yanking yer chain when he wrote that!

Possibly, but I don't know him very well thus I took the words at face value.

[logroller]

Other than feeding the child... there should never NEED to be a reason.

Do you really believe all the bullshit that you post?You know
, I had assumed you were reasonable.
ok then; you bring the formula, it's your baby. There's no NEED for the hospital to provide something you a perfectly capable of providing. So there you go, no lecture necessary.
I'm sorry you can't carry on a simple conversation without attacking me.
Please point to what I posted that was BS?

[Kathianne]

Reading each and every post on this thread intrigues me. Especially those made by logroller.

Funny how the same people who claim conservatives have this 'war on women', and say that the government should stay out of women's uterus'... are the same ones trying to brow-beat women into choosing one method over another, even so much as making some sort of law over it. Hypocritical much?

Personally, I used a combination of both feeding methods for both of my heathens kids. Until I went back to work (both times) I nursed during the day, but formula fed at night. They slept better and longer at night and were sleeping for 5-6 hour stretches at night around 2 months of age.

I tried to breast feed around the clock (for both) but I just could not seem to produce that much and my supply seemed to get less and less even over a 2-week period. So I decided to at least nurse during the day when not much was going on, and formula feed at night so I could get some sleep. Being up every 1.5 hours was taking its' toll on me health-wise. I just could not keep up with both my boys' voracious appetites. Not to mention with a newborn and a very active 2yo and almost no help during the day, sitting down every 1.5 hours for 30 minutes didn't always work. Nor did breastfeeding while out and about. Eventually when I went back to work, I switched to full-time formula. Both for ease of use and my continued employment. Where I worked made it difficult to pump (damn near impossible), even if I had continued.

It wasn't even very long ago that I gave birth to my youngest. He is now 6 years old.

During both of my pregnancies, from the first clinic visit and subsequent visits, as well as websites and other media dedicated to parents and especially new moms... getting info on breastfeeding was not an issue. I think in each parenting mag I read (mostly for recipes and interesting fun things to do with your kids), there was SOMETHING about breastfeeding vs. formula.

Almost all of them said breastfeeding is best, but you won't hurt your baby (obviously) if you choose formula and not to be pressured either way.

This was SIX years ago. My oldest is almost 9... even THEN, there was PLENTY of info out there. Heck, in my county, they actually have a breast pump rental program that goes through the hospitals, on a sliding fee scale. The most anyone would pay was $60 a month, for as long as you chose. I chose to purchase mine secondhand through eBay. Then I re-sold it later for a little under what I purchased it for.

Breastfeeding was then (and still is) very emphasized (the have a special lactation department available 24-7 to help you out) but should you choose not to do so, no one there made you feel like a criminal.

Both my kids were born c-section and both full term. The only thing I was concerned about was the painkillers affecting my babies, so I chose to formula feed a bit more often during my 5-day stay. Plus my appetite wasn't quite back from the anesthesia.

Had someone lectured me each time I asked for formula, they probably would have found my IV needle out of my arm and in their neck. Or whatever sharp object was nearby.

My oldest just turned 31, youngest will be 26 in a few days. My experiences were the same as yours with your youngest. I knew I was going to nurse, indeed the question was on admit form. I'd talked to my OB doc, my husband, wrote for and received LaLeche materials. I knew about colostrum, I read about what breast milk looked like, smelled like, and that it was sweet. I read about the nutritional value, studies regarding preventing allergies and anti-bodies the baby would share. I knew I was staying home for at least 2 years, nursing seemed a no brainer to me. That doesn't mean it's for everyone.

I was a very scheduled mom for my kids and didn't go impulsively to do something where nursing may have been difficult. Of course with the first, wasn't much of an issue. I had 3 kids though in just over 4 years. (My oldest turned 31, July 28. My youngest will be 26, Aug. 9). Really, goofy years those nursing ones.

Each of the kids I nursed over 1 year, though not by much. For me, biting for laughs wasn't funny! But when the 3rd one was nursing, I knew what times schools started for the other two-one in preschool, one later in kindergarten. I worked on adjusting his times to not cross over with running around. Same with activities, I'd feed early so that we'd get through a class or game. Come home, nurse again, put him down for nap.

When my middle child was about 3 months old, I got a call from Bell System where I'd worked before the oldest was born. Divestiture was in full swing and they asked if I'd come in to 'consult.' I explained I had another new baby, "Please, it's your data we're using and it will help a lot, you can call your own hours and we'll pay you $30 per hour." I couldn't say no. While it sounded good, truth was I had to take train into city, 40 minutes each way. My mom said she'd babysit for 2 weeks, then I'd have to find 'permanent sitter.' (She didn't like the idea of working with newborn if not necessary.)

Well it didn't work out, he wouldn't take the bottle. After 3 days, I quit. (Sort of reminds me of the 'latching on' issues, no?) I agree with Kitten that pumping is a pain, though I did always have bottles in fridge in case something happened when kids were with someone other than me.

My first never had formula. My second did around 9 months, his father and I had to go away one weekend and I couldn't pump enough for that! Not too mention 'use by date.' The third though, had some from about 6 months on, occasionally because the schedules were becoming much more complicated with 5 in family. I couldn't 'nap' when he did with 2 preschoolers for the most part.

[Kathianne]

I read the link to NYC latch on initiative-- it said nothing about "lecturing" only informing on the advantages of breast feeding. Besides, If mothers have decided to feed their babies formula, why not bring it with them to the hospital; why are the hospitals expected to provide it?

Same with all patients, bring your own food! That's the ticket!

[logroller]

Same with all patients, bring your own food! That's the ticket!
My wife really wanted a chocolate bar during vbac and the nurse told her that of she shouldnt because if/ when she needed anesthesia she could get sick and aspirate-- she did end up getting g sick and an emergency c-section with a general-- so it ended up being good advice. Nurse was all smug later too, "aren't you glad I didn't let you have that candy bar?" My wife, anemic and assuredly in pain says, "does a uterus usually rupture during, as you put it,'mild cramping'?" :lol: come to find out later, it often does when pitocin is used for vbac. Suppose i should have been more leery of my wife being described as a good "candidate." obviously, it wasnt a proven treatment. Live and learn...thankfully.

[Kathianne]

My wife really wanted a chocolate bar during vbac and the nurse told her that of she shouldnt because if/ when she needed anesthesia she could get sick and aspirate-- she did end up getting g sick and an emergency c-section with a general-- so it ended up being good advice. Nurse was all smug later too, "aren't you glad I didn't let you have that candy bar?" My wife, anemic and assuredly in pain says, "does a uterus usually rupture during, as you put it,'mild cramping'?" :lol: come to find out later, it often does when pitocin is used for vbac. Suppose i should have been more leery of my wife being described as a good "candidate." obviously, it wasnt a proven treatment. Live and learn...thankfully.

So you are advocating that food be denied by both hospital, since food should come from patients and food should be denied from coming from patients? They should just do without food? Good advice from an advocate for breast feeding.

[Abbey Marie]

You know
, I had assumed you were reasonable.
ok then; you bring the formula, it's your baby. There's no NEED for the hospital to provide something you a perfectly capable of providing. So there you go, no lecture necessary.
I'm sorry you can't carry on a simple conversation without attacking me.
Please point to what I posted that was BS?

So to punish these terrible moms for not breast feeding as society demands, they should bring their own formula to the hospital? Or what, don't feed the baby? And pity the poor woman who has an unexpected early delivery and no time to get the formula.

Come to think of it, I am perfectly capable of providing lots of things- shall I bring the surgical tools, bandages, and sutures, too?

This just gets better and better.

[Shadow]

Bloomberg's breast-feeding plan: Will locking up formula help new moms?

(Time.com) -- There are lots of experts who have lots of opinions about New York City's new plan to encourage breast-feeding in new moms by urging hospitals not to give them baby formula. Advocates praise the move as a way to limit the influence of formula manufacturers on new mothers. Skeptics wonder whether the policy will shame women who choose not to breast-feed.

As for my sister-in-law, Rachel, who recently gave birth in a Manhattan hospital to her first child, she knows first-hand how nurses pushing formula can impact an inexperienced mother. After her C-section, a nurse offered to give her newborn a bottle "to make it easier on you."
Exhausted and uncertain, she agreed — even though she'd intended to breast-feed. "I was a new mom," she said. "I didn't know what I was doing."

Those are exactly the sorts of moms that Mayor Michael Bloomberg hopes to influence with his voluntary Latch On NYC (http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/html/pr2012/pr013-12.shtml) initiative.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/08/02/health/time-bloomberg-breast-feeding/index.html?hpt=hp_bn12

This was the quote that caught my attention...




When it goes into effect in September, nurses in participating hospitals will be instructed not to give formula to babies unless there's a medical reason to do so or unless moms specifically request it (they'll first have to listen to a mandatory speech about why breast is best).

[Shadow]

So to punish these terrible moms for not breast feeding as society demands, they should bring their own formula to the hospital? Or what, don't feed the baby? And pity the poor woman who has an unexpected early delivery and no time to get the formula.

Come to think of it, I am perfectly capable of providing lots of things- shall I bring the surgical tools, bandages, and sutures, too?

This just gets better and better.

And while you are at it...can you just deliver that baby yourself...it's selfish to expect others to help with something that should come naturally.:laugh:

[logroller]

So you are advocating that food be denied by both hospital, since food should come from patients and food should be denied from coming from patients? They should just do without food? Good advice from an advocate for breast feeding.
Uh nice try-- but that was your hyperbole kathianne, not mine. I just told a story about what my wife wanted to eat (which is her choice) being against her best interest from a medical POV and a nurse saying so. you're the one who took it to mean not providing food to an admitted patient. I'm glad you gals we having a great time patting eachother on the back. I'll leave you to it! Breast feeding is best and doctors should advocate what is best. Deny it all you wish-- ignorance becomes you all!

[Kathianne]

Uh nice try-- but that was your hyperbole kathianne, not mine. I just told a story about what my wife wanted to eat (which is her choice) being against her best interest from a medical POV and a nurse saying so. you're the one who took it to mean not providing food to an admitted patient. I'm glad you gals we having a great time patting eachother on the back. I'll leave you to it! Breast feeding is best and doctors should advocate what is best. Deny it all you wish-- ignorance becomes you all!

Here's your problem; assuming our ignorance. Unfortunately, seems the majority of us chose to breast feed, all or some. Not one of us have said it's not the best for babies, quite the contrary. We're advocating for mothers and babies to bond through feeding. On that too, IMO, nursing is best; however it's not the best route for all mothers. That is where your ignorance is showing.