Al Qaeda not trying to get into US?

[jimnyc]

Some won't believe that Al Qaeda has ties in the US, or that sleeper cells might actually exist right down the road from us. These people will continue to try and find new ways to attack, hence me continually saying we need to remain vigilant against these scumbags. This guy planned on using remote control toys to blow shit up!


Massachusetts Man to Plead Guilty in Model Plane Terror PlotA Massachusetts man accused of plotting to attack the Pentagon and U.S. Capitol building with model planes filled with C-4 explosives will plead guilty to two terror charges, say prosecutors, and serve a 17-year federal sentence.

According to court documents filed by prosecutors and attorneys for Rezwan Ferdaus, a Northeastern University physics graduate and U.S. citizen, Ferdaus has agreed to plead guilty to attempting to provide material support to terrorists and attempting to damage and destroy federal buildings by means of an explosive.

Ferdaus, 27, was arrested at the culmination of a long-term sting operation by undercover FBI agents posing as Al Qaeda operatives.

According to investigators, Ferdaus believed he had been working for al Qaeda since 2010, when he began modifying cell phones to serve as electrical switches for improvised explosive devices (IEDs) to be passed on to fighters in the Middle East and then providing them to the supposed operatives.

"During a June 2011 meeting, he appeared gratified when he was told that his first phone detonation device had killed three U.S. soldiers and injured four or five others in Iraq. Ferdaus responded, 'That was exactly what I wanted,'" the Department of Justice said in a statement in September 2011.

The alleged model-plane plot called for Ferdaus to command a team of six operatives to use remote-controlled aircraft filled with explosives to attack the Pentagon and the Capitol before shooting survivors in a subsequent "ground" attack.

Ferdaus allegedly travelled to Washington, D.C. to conduct reconnaissance on his targets. Ferdaus was arrested in Framingham, Mass. in September 2011 after he took delivery of the AK-47 rifles, grenades and C-4 explosives that were allegedly to be used in the attack.

http://news.yahoo.com/massachusetts-man-plead-guilty-model-plane-terror-plot-180142894--abc-news-topstories.html

[ConHog]

Some won't believe that Al Qaeda has ties in the US, or that sleeper cells might actually exist right down the road from us. These people will continue to try and find new ways to attack, hence me continually saying we need to remain vigilant against these scumbags. This guy planned on using remote control toys to blow shit up!



http://news.yahoo.com/massachusetts-man-plead-guilty-model-plane-terror-plot-180142894--abc-news-topstories.html

Hmm the article says the man THOUGHT he was working for AQ, and that FBI agents posed as AQ agents, it doesn't say anything about AQ actually being involved.

AQ is a dead organization. Just a few scraps left laying around. Doesn't mean there aren't fools who will try stupid stuff and claim they are associated with them or what have you, but they're gone.

And that's not to say other groups don't exist which would like to cause harm to the US.

[jimnyc]

Hmm the article says the man THOUGHT he was working for AQ, and that FBI agents posed as AQ agents, it doesn't say anything about AQ actually being involved.

AQ is a dead organization. Just a few scraps left laying around. Doesn't mean there aren't fools who will try stupid stuff and claim they are associated with them or what have you, but they're gone.

And that's not to say other groups don't exist which would like to cause harm to the US.

Nor did I state this man was Al Qaeda, hence me posting the article and link. Al Qaeda is more than just "scraps", and they would love to hit us again if they could. And this article shows that we have people here in the US that would gladly serve for Al Qaeda.

And you say they are gone - then why are they still claiming responsibility for terrorism elsewhere? They just claimed to be responsible for a shitload of bombings and assassinations of Shiites through the month of June. If they have the capability to perform so many acts within a month, I assure you, they aren't done.

[ConHog]

Nor did I state this man was Al Qaeda, hence me posting the article and link. Al Qaeda is more than just "scraps", and they would love to hit us again if they could. And this article shows that we have people here in the US that would gladly serve for Al Qaeda.

And you say they are gone - then why are they still claiming responsibility for terrorism elsewhere? They just claimed to be responsible for a shitload of bombings and assassinations of Shiites through the month of June. If they have the capability to perform so many acts within a month, I assure you, they aren't done.

Your OP DID imply that this guy was AQ.

As for other attacks claimed by AQ, I agree there are a few left out there, scraps, but nothing like the organization that pulled off 9/11.

[jimnyc]

Your OP DID imply that this guy was AQ.

As for other attacks claimed by AQ, I agree there are a few left out there, scraps, but nothing like the organization that pulled off 9/11.

Scraps apparently killed hundreds and wounded over 600 in June alone, and that's just in one country. I'm sure the few hundred dead would disagree with you that it's scraps. Maybe not with the leadership they had 10 years ago, but they're hardly "scraps" incapable of causing widespread deaths and destruction.

[ConHog]

Scraps apparently killed hundreds and wounded over 600 in June alone, and that's just in one country. I'm sure the few hundred dead would disagree with you that it's scraps. Maybe not with the leadership they had 10 years ago, but they're hardly "scraps" incapable of causing widespread deaths and destruction.



I guess I have missed this story entirely. Link? Seriously

[jimnyc]

I guess I have missed this story entirely. Link? Seriously

This is just one of many stories from Al Qaeda around the world

http://news.yahoo.com/iraqs-al-qaeda-claims-june-attacks-shiites-164333107.html

And they are responsible for more destruction than just lives

http://news.yahoo.com/mali-parliament-calls-army-intervention-north-033858914.html;_ylt=A2KLOzEshv1PvEcApSXQtDMD

[gabosaurus]

Why would anyone think that AQ hasn't infiltrated in the U.S.

I doubt they are as numerous or as dangerous as Mexican drug cartels, who have also infiltrated this country.

[jafar00]

So, a delusional nutjob who was encouraged by FBI agents is proof of an Al Qaeda conspiracy?

I accept your Al Qaeda conspiracy and raise you a man who thinks he is Jesus

Man ran barefoot through Knock claiming he was Jesus (http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14877:man-ran-barefoot-through-knock-claiming-he-was-jesus&catid=23:news&Itemid=46)

[Kathianne]

Why would anyone think that AQ hasn't infiltrated in the U.S.

I doubt they are as numerous or as dangerous as Mexican drug cartels, who have also infiltrated this country.

and I wouldn't doubt that there are 'al quade operatives amongst the Mexican drug cartels. Our open borders make anything else, laughable.

[jimnyc]

So, a delusional nutjob who was encouraged by FBI agents is proof of an Al Qaeda conspiracy?

I accept your Al Qaeda conspiracy and raise you a man who thinks he is Jesus

Man ran barefoot through Knock claiming he was Jesus (http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14877:man-ran-barefoot-through-knock-claiming-he-was-jesus&catid=23:news&Itemid=46)



I suppose it's a good thing we don't have Christians running around various parts of the world blowing up innocents in the name of God!! Well, maybe one Christian for every 1,000 Muslims.

[Kathianne]

I suppose it's a good thing we don't have Christians running around various parts of the world blowing up innocents in the name of God!! Well, maybe one Christian for every 1,000 Muslims.

Even within our country, you are overstating the case. There are less than 'one Christian motivated nutjob' for 1000 non-ideological nutjobs.'

[cadet]

Even within our country, you are overstating the case. There are less than 'one Christian motivated nutjob' for 1000 non-ideological nutjobs.'

Ever heard of the westbro baptist church? yeah. they give me a bad name every time i say "Yes, in fact i am a christian."
I've... I've sent a lot of angry letters to them.

[Kathianne]

Ever heard of the westbro baptist church? yeah. they give me a bad name every time i say "Yes, in fact i am a christian."
I've... I've sent a lot of angry letters to them.

Indeed. And their numbers? Oh yea. Thank you for making my point.

[Drummond]

Just seen the nonsense claiming that the Al Qaeda of today are mere 'scraps'.

I for one accept that the War on Terror has done Al Qaeda very significant damage (.. and what better reason for continuing to fight it, even to ramp up the effort ??). But anyone wanting to write Al Qaeda off is making one massive mistake.

Here's a link to add to those already posted. It's just two months old.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/2012/05/bomb-plot.html


Although the latest attempt to take down an aircraft using a bomb hidden in underwear failed, the plot still shows al-Qaida in the Arabian Peninsula is making "big inroads" as the most active affiliate of the terrorist network, said Michael Leiter, former director of the National Counterterrorism Center.

Al-Qaida in the Arabian Peninsula is building a command structure and securing operational space in Yemen, Leiter said. The group has several hundred members and is committed to attacking the government of Yemen and to actively recruiting foreigners, especially Americans, for attacks within the United States, he said.

A bomb recently seized by U.S. authorities in an unspecified country in the Middle East, purportedly designed by al-Qaida bomb-maker Ibrahim Hassan al-Asiri, appears to be a redesigned version of the underwear bomb that failed to detonate on an airplane headed to Detroit on Christmas 2009. The FBI is studying the device now.

This latest suicide bombing reportedly was planned for the anniversary of the killing of al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden on May 2.

But let's assume, just for argument (and I don't believe this for a minute) that Al Qaeda of today could be regarded as 'mere scraps' compared to their strength in 2001. SO WHAT ? Nobody could just suppose that Al Qaeda is incapable of rebuilding and recruiting !!

How many Al Qaeda terrorists did it take to attack the US on 11th September 2001, anyway ?

And how many would it take, in the future, say, to deploy a WMD ?

Al Qaeda can be very small, yet nonetheless remain viable as a very serious threat to your security.

Just ONE Al Qaeda terrorist, infected with a biological agent, acting as a plague carrier, could ensure that just such a contagion spreads far and wide.

There is, ultimately, one solution, and only one. The War on Terror continues, for HOWEVER long it takes, until the likes of Al Qaeda are utterly smashed.

[Gaffer]

Kinda like roaches. Killing most of them doesn't work.

[jafar00]

I suppose it's a good thing we don't have Christians running around various parts of the world blowing up innocents in the name of God!! Well, maybe one Christian for every 1,000 Muslims.

None? How many US soldiers are there running around blowing up innocents while they "spread the word of the lord"?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hy5RnIykfCs

[aboutime]

As we can see. Al Qaeda doesn't need to TRY getting into the US. They're already here. Just waiting for orders from OBAMA, and his Pretend Christian Gate Keepers like Rev. Wright and Louey Farracanofcrap.

[jimnyc]

None? How many US soldiers are there running around blowing up innocents while they "spread the word of the lord"?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hy5RnIykfCs

I stand corrected, without even watching videos... I should have said that yes, it does happen elsewhere, and in other countries. It's just not a staple of daily life and upbringing for Christians. Your attempts to continually compare modern day Christians and Muslims is laughable. I can literally find daily attacks by Muslims in the name of their religion, and then some, and even more, and it never stops...

[mundame]

Kinda like roaches. Killing most of them doesn't work.

Good analogy. I agree with you and Drummond and others; we have to keep at it. Not by pointless losing forever wars, but the new ways with intelligence and drones and Special Forces ---


THAT is truly our military protecting America, IMO.

[ConHog]

Good analogy. I agree with you and Drummond and others; we have to keep at it. Not by pointless losing forever wars, but the new ways with intelligence and drones and Special Forces ---


THAT is truly our military protecting America, IMO.

Let me point out the obvious. I never said otherwise. Of course we shouldn't just say "well we've weakened AQ, so good enough"

[Abbey Marie]

So, a delusional nutjob who was encouraged by FBI agents is proof of an Al Qaeda conspiracy?

I accept your Al Qaeda conspiracy and raise you a man who thinks he is Jesus

Man ran barefoot through Knock claiming he was Jesus (http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=14877:man-ran-barefoot-through-knock-claiming-he-was-jesus&catid=23:news&Itemid=46)



He ran barefoot? Quick, take cover! I can only imagine the fear and carnage he created. :rolleyes:

Perhaps when you stop making wholesale slaughter and idiotic barefoot running equivalent, we can talk.

[aboutime]

He ran barefoot! Quick, take cover! I can only imagine the fear and carnage he created. :rolleyes:

Perhaps when you stop making wholesale slaughter and idiotic barefoot running equivalent, we can talk.


Abbey. We should be asking jafar to provide a LINK that shows Obama running barefoot across the Potomac river...without getting his feet wet. That's how he avoids being labeled a WET BACK while opening up our borders to any, and all Enemies of Americans.
If only OBAMA hadn't lied about obeying his OATH OF OFFICE. We wouldn't be talking this way.

[jafar00]

I stand corrected, without even watching videos... I should have said that yes, it does happen elsewhere, and in other countries. It's just not a staple of daily life and upbringing for Christians. Your attempts to continually compare modern day Christians and Muslims is laughable. I can literally find daily attacks by Muslims in the name of their religion, and then some, and even more, and it never stops...

It's not a staple of daily life for Muslims either or you would probably be dead right now if 1.5billion of us were running around killing. I can't stand being branded a terrorist just because of my religion.


He ran barefoot! Quick, take cover! I can only imagine the fear and carnage he created. :rolleyes:

Perhaps when you stop making wholesale slaughter and idiotic barefoot running equivalent, we can talk.

It was simply comparing one nutcase to another. Crazy people should be seeing a doctor, not handed a bomb and coerced into trying to use it.

[jimnyc]

It's not a staple of daily life for Muslims either or you would probably be dead right now if 1.5billion of us were running around killing. I can't stand being branded a terrorist just because of my religion.

I for one have not branded you a terrorist. I've simply stated how an inordinate amount of abuse, violence and terrorism happens within Islam. I also stated, many times over the past few days, that not only did I find you to be reasonable and peaceful, but that the majority of Muslims are. But that shouldn't exclude me from being able to discuss the bad element.

[gabosaurus]

There is, ultimately, one solution, and only one. The War on Terror continues, for HOWEVER long it takes, until the likes of Al Qaeda are utterly smashed.

This will happen when the Catholics stop fighting the Protestants in Ireland.
Religious extremism has been around forever, and it will survive forever.

[Kathianne]

This will happen when the Catholics stop fighting the Protestants in Ireland.
Religious extremism has been around forever, and it will survive forever.

Who's extreme? Brits or Irish?

[jafar00]

I for one have not branded you a terrorist. I've simply stated how an inordinate amount of abuse, violence and terrorism happens within Islam. I also stated, many times over the past few days, that not only did I find you to be reasonable and peaceful, but that the majority of Muslims are. But that shouldn't exclude me from being able to discuss the bad element.

To be fair, you would be more accurate in saying that an inordinate amount of abuse, violence and terrorism happens within countries that are either in warzones, in the process of civil war and lawlessness, or ruled by vicious dictators that just happen to also contain a lot of Muslims who didn't ask to be in such situations.

[Drummond]

Good analogy. I agree with you and Drummond and others; we have to keep at it. Not by pointless losing forever wars, but the new ways with intelligence and drones and Special Forces ---

THAT is truly our military protecting America, IMO.

Fair points as far as they go. But can I point out that your ability to fight more focused warfare such as with drones and squads of Special Forces, can only be as effective as your ability to gather the intelligence data that such operations rely upon.

Actually putting soldiers into enemy territory has just that advantage .. as well as fighting as soldiers do, their activities have the side benefit of a presence which can gather information from the source territory. Fail to maintain that presence, and to what extent is intelligence gathering compromised ?

And .. let's not forget the potential of Gitmo, which exists to incarcerate enemy combatants captured by just such military activities.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Fair points as far as they go. But can I point out that your ability to fight more focused warfare such as with drones and squads of Special Forces, can only be as effective as your ability to gather the intelligence data that such operations rely upon.

Actually putting soldiers into enemy territory has just that advantage .. as well as fighting as soldiers do, their activities have the side benefit of a presence which can gather information from the source territory. Fail to maintain that presence, and to what extent is intelligence gathering compromised ?

And .. let's not forget the potential of Gitmo, which exists to incarcerate enemy combatants captured by just such military activities.

Great points my friend. The nature of Islamist terrorism is such that we must use every weapon at our disposal. For they use every weapon and method available to murder and instill terror! This they deliberately visit upon completely innocent people---women and children, with the desire to kill more rather than less! We should hold nothing back , nothing!--Tyr

[Drummond]

Who's extreme? Brits or Irish?

Well .. to be fair, Gabby is - I think - referring to old rivalries which we have heard of in the past spilling out into trouble in Northern Ireland .. and Northern Ireland is part of the UK, so is British.

[Drummond]

This will happen when the Catholics stop fighting the Protestants in Ireland.
Religious extremism has been around forever, and it will survive forever.

And yet, it's been quite a while since I've come across a story about this. Years, I think.

I wish I could say the same about Al Qaeda, or any of its affiliates.

I suggest to you that Al Qaeda is a far more pressing problem. I also suggest that trying to compare Al Qaeda's level of violence and capacity for threat with Irish Catholics is a bit like trying to compare a rifle with a catapult.

[aboutime]

Well .. to be fair, Gabby is - I think - referring to old rivalries which we have heard of in the past spilling out into trouble in Northern Ireland .. and Northern Ireland is part of the UK, so is British.


Drummond. This may sound odd to you. But I see Gabby as somewhat of a Jesse Jackson Figure.
Northern Ireland's version of a Jesse Jackson to be more exact.
Both seem to need, and want to perpetuate the Divide between people in order to advance their own Selfish needs to increase their followings of Hate filled people with tiny brains, and almost no education.
How's that sound to you? If you know who Jesse Jackson is, of course.

[Drummond]

Drummond. This may sound odd to you. But I see Gabby as somewhat of a Jesse Jackson Figure.
Northern Ireland's version of a Jesse Jackson to be more exact.
Both seem to need, and want to perpetuate the Divide between people in order to advance their own Selfish needs to increase their followings of Hate filled people with tiny brains, and almost no education.
How's that sound to you? If you know who Jesse Jackson is, of course.


You'll be able to judge that a lot better than I can. I've no reason not to accept your description.

And yes, though I only come across the name occasionally, I know who Jesse Jackson is. What I know of him tells me he's a Leftie political opportunist of the worst sort. Has a very shifty look to him ...

[jafar00]

And yet, it's been quite a while since I've come across a story about this. Years, I think.

I wish I could say the same about Al Qaeda, or any of its affiliates.

I suggest to you that Al Qaeda is a far more pressing problem. I also suggest that trying to compare Al Qaeda's level of violence and capacity for threat with Irish Catholics is a bit like trying to compare a rifle with a catapult.

The IRA were just as potent if not more so than AQ could ever hope to be.
I was on the phone to someone in Manchester when this one went off
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Manchester_bombing

[Kathianne]

The IRA were just as potent if not more so than AQ could ever hope to be.
I was on the phone to someone in Manchester when this one went off
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Manchester_bombing

18 years ago. Much has changed since then, though there are always those wanting to keep feuds going:

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/i/irish_republican_army/index.html


...In 1979, an I.R.A bomb killed Lord Louis Mountbatten, a well known aristocrat who had served as the last viceroy of colonial India, and in 1984, Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher narrowly escaped injury in another attack on the Conservative Party conference in the coastal town of Brighton.


In Northern Ireland itself, the I.R.A sparred with the British Army and the R.U.C., as well as with “loyalist” paramilitary groups determined to maintain British rule. According to the Council on Foreign Relations, since the 1960s the group has killed about 1,800 people, including about 650 civilians.


Yet while the I.R.A. enjoyed strong support in the 1970s amid deep-seated Catholic grievances, decades of British reforms improved the fortunes of Northern Ireland’s Irish nationalist minority and reduced support for the dissidents.


In the 1990s, with fewer nationalist grievances left to exploit, the I.R.A began talks with the British government. A ceasefire was enacted in 1997, and the next year the main political parties of Northern Ireland, including the I.R.A’s political wing Sinn Fein, renounced violence in the U.S.-brokered Good Friday Accord. In 2005, the I.R.A itself disarmed.


Read More... (javascript:toggleLayer('moretxt');%20javascript:t oggleLayer2('more');)
Following the I.R.A’s rapprochement with the British government, splinter groups such as the Real I.R.A and the Continuity I.R.A. broke away from the main organization, determined to continue with violence and reverse the results of ongoing political negotiations.


Analysts and anti-terrorist agencies say the Real I.R.A. and Continuity I.R.A. share identical aims and, despite their competitive rivalry, have cooperated in the past on planning and carrying out attacks.The Real I.R.A. carried out the 1998 Omagh bombing, the worst single attack in the history of the Irish troubles, in which 29 people died.


In March 2009, the two groups took responsibility for a series of killings that deeply shook Northern Ireland. The Real I.R.A. said it was behind an attack that killed two British soldiers as they were accepting a pizza delivery outside their base on March 8.The Continuity I.R.A. said its gunmen had killed a police officer as he sat in his car two days later.


Yet rapprochement continued, despite opposition from the splinter groups. In June 2012 (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/28/world/europe/queen-elizabeth-meets-former-ira-commander.html?ref=global-home), Queen Elizabeth II (http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/reference/timestopics/people/e/queen_of_great_britain_elizabeth_ii/index.html), Britain (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/unitedkingdom/index.html?inline=nyt-geo)’s head of state, visited Northern Ireland as part of her Diamond Jubilee celebration of 60 years on the throne. While the queen has no formal political power, her imprimatur on a process of reconciliation is seen as exerting a powerful influence.


While in Belfast, in a display of heady symbolism that would once have seemed unthinkable, the queen shook hands with Martin McGuinness (http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/reference/timestopics/people/m/martin_mcguinness/index.html?8qa), a onetime commander of the I.R.A. The gesture represented a remarkable sign of reconciliation for both figures, since the queen is the titular head of Britain’s armed forces.


Since the cease-fire, Mr. McGuinness has built a political career and is now the deputy first minister in Northern Ireland’s provincial government.


Gerry Adams, the president of Sinn Fein, the political arm before the I.R.A. disbanded, said the decision to greet the queen was “the right thing to do, at the right time and for the right reasons.”


Yet even though the gesture was widely depicted by British and Irish officials as a milestone of reconciliation, some analysts said many political and emotional distinctions persisted in the tangled relationship between Northern Ireland and mainland Britain.


The day before the momentous handshake, the police fought running battles with youths throwing Molotov cocktails in a Republican area of Belfast, recalling lingering hostilities between mainly Protestant Unionists and mainly Roman Catholic Republicans. Nine officers suffered minor injuries, police officials said. The violence reflected continued divisions in a city carved into sectarian zones by barriers and so-called peace walls between neighborhoods.



It helped a lot when US Irish were made aware of the IRA's and especially Sinn Féin's contributions to killings of both British and Irish. Donations dropped precipitously. I do believe Muslims could learn something from that, no?

[jafar00]

It helped a lot when US Irish were made aware of the IRA's and especially Sinn Féin's contributions to killings of both British and Irish. Donations dropped precipitously. I do believe Muslims could learn something from that, no?

Don't you mean the US could learn something from that?

I mean, one of the things that keeps little groups like Al Qaeda alive is the US blind support of Israel and the way that you look the other way every time the Israelis decide to slaughter a bunch of Palestinians. I believe it is also one of Iran's biggest beefs against the US.

Every terrorist group has a root cause. If you address the root instead of just answering with bombs and invasions, there might be a way of removing the reasons for these terrorist groups to exist.

Just as the IRA ended up with no reason to continue.

[Kathianne]

Don't you mean the US could learn something from that?

I mean, one of the things that keeps little groups like Al Qaeda alive is the US blind support of Israel and the way that you look the other way every time the Israelis decide to slaughter a bunch of Palestinians. I believe it is also one of Iran's biggest beefs against the US.

Every terrorist group has a root cause. If you address the root instead of just answering with bombs and invasions, there might be a way of removing the reasons for these terrorist groups to exist.

Just as the IRA ended up with no reason to continue.

No, I didn't mean or imply that. You've written time and again that the core problem of the Islamacists is ignorance and the corrupted and often also ignorant imams. That includes the incessant harping on the big and little Satan bit. Indeed, often repeated so that the Europeans now chant it too, they however are the chattering class. I wouldn't be surprised if you were European educated?

No state is without blame, not going to argue such. Britain certainly was not with the Irish, still doesn't justify IRA blowing up innocents at Harrod's, as one example. Israel is paranoid, for good reasons. Most of her neighbors want her eliminated, none would mourn the loss. The US? Given our history my money would be on the case of one player in the area we can count on, rather than assuming we're anti-Islamic.

Now back to the main contention, al Quaeda receives funds from people all over the Middle East, no doubt many Saudis hoping they'll just stay in Pakistan or Afghanistan.They are hoping against hope that the leaders don't mean what Osama said many times. When folks get what the Irish in the US finally understood, that the violence made possible by their feeding the extremists is hurting their cause, peace may come. Slow, but deliberate. People have to want it and recognize there will always be some trying to undo it.

[Drummond]

The IRA were just as potent if not more so than AQ could ever hope to be.
I was on the phone to someone in Manchester when this one went off
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Manchester_bombing

Yes, the IRA exploded bombs, did a lot of damage, killed people. Yes, that's what terrorist trash do. It's in the job description ...

But, did the IRA ever ally themselves with tribal rulers of a country, then cover it with terrorist training camps ? Did they ever hijack planes and fly them into skyscrapers, demolishing them in the process, killing around 3,000 people in a single DAY ?

Perhaps the IRA has committed an act of terrorism so major, that it's forced a Government to ground all civilian aircraft flying in its airspace ??

Recall the attempted attack on the Pentagon. Did the IRA fly planes at Canary Wharf ? The 'Gherkin' ? Big Ben ? The Houses of Parliament ??

Did the IRA try to get controlling influences in any other Failed States in the world, as Al Qaeda has done ?

Has the IRA taken upon itself to wage its form of warfare against any country not meeting its supposed ideological or 'religious standards ?

'Jafar', you should really rethink your stance.

[Drummond]

Don't you mean the US could learn something from that?

I mean, one of the things that keeps little groups like Al Qaeda alive is the US blind support of Israel and the way that you look the other way every time the Israelis decide to slaughter a bunch of Palestinians. I believe it is also one of Iran's biggest beefs against the US.

Every terrorist group has a root cause. If you address the root instead of just answering with bombs and invasions, there might be a way of removing the reasons for these terrorist groups to exist.

Just as the IRA ended up with no reason to continue.

The IRA claimed to be fighting for a United Ireland, that's to say, to get to the point where Northern Ireland ceased to be British, and instead politically became part of Southern Ireland.

So, tell me .. did they ever achieve this aim ?

No, 'Jafar', fact is, the IRA were defeated. Oh, they fractured, formed smaller groups, but though the IRA and its splinter groups killed plenty of people, ultimately, that's ALL they ever achieved. The IRA is effectively dead, and Northern Ireland is just as British as before.

So you see, the so-called 'root cause' of their terrorism wasn't addressed as they themselves wanted it to be.

The British Government never did bend to their will, since to do so was unthinkable. And the British Government prevailed.

This is the way it also needs to be with Al Qaeda. You don't negotiate with terrorist trash, instead, you DEFEAT them.

[mundame]

It could be al Qaeda that attacks; especially in Britain.

I am myself more concerned about Iranian attacks, for this reason: we have for EVER --- think how long, really since the Mexican-American War! fought only against enemies which lacked the capacity to attack this country. At all. Hitler did a little bit -- shelling from offshore and those eight saboteurs landed by submarine that Roosevelt hanged. But Koreans never came over here, Vietnamese never did, nor Iraqis or Serbs or Afghans or anyone we ever, ever made war against.


But how long can that really last? Sooner or later, we'll face an enemy that will actually fight back. I'm thinking it could be Iran.

[jafar00]

Now back to the main contention, al Quaeda receives funds from people all over the Middle East

I don't know about that. Where would one donate to such a thing? Not that I would anyway but you get my point. Its not very well publicised.


'Jafar', you should really rethink your stance.

Which stance? That the IRA and Al Qaeda are the same? Both terrorist organisations?

[Nukeman]

I don't know about that. Where would one donate to such a thing? Not that I would anyway but you get my point. Its not very well publicised.



Which stance? That the IRA and Al Qaeda are the same? Both terrorist organisations?
Try CIAR.. They send money to all sorts of terrorist organizations, disguised as "charity"....



Sixteen months ago, the word GUILTY was read in a Dallas court room a total of 108 times, as a jury convicted the Holy Land foundation, and each of the associated defendants of raising money to fund Hamas terrorism. Implicated along with those convicted was supposed Civil Rights organization CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations which lobbies the government from its headquarters in Washington DC. CAIR was named an unindicted co-conspirator in the Holy Land case. Its leaders are frequent guests Network News Programs, where they are usually called upon to white wash some terrorist act.
One key piece of evidence in the case was the Wiretap evidence heard in the case put CAIR’s executive director, Nihad Awad, at a Philadelphia meeting of Hamas leaders secretly recorded by the FBI. Participants hatched a plot to deceive Americans and disguise payments to Hamas as it launched a campaign of terror attacks. CAIR co-founder Omar Ahmad joined Hamas big shots at the summit.


http://www.redstate.com/jeffdunetz/2010/03/13/fbi-reaffirms-cairs-terrorist-ties/

[Kathianne]

al qaida funding. An old article, I'm thinking perhaps 2004, (I hate when there's no date!). At that time at least, funding was down:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/para/al-qaida-funding.htm



Al-Qaida / Al-Qaeda Funding in Afghanistan Contrary to popular belief, funding for al Qaeda does not come from the personal assets of Bin Ladin but from a complex fundraising network fueled by financial facilitators and diverted Islamic charity donations. Prior to September 11, the financial facilitators raised money from Gulf country donors, particularly Saudi Arabia. They primarily relied on imams at mosques who diverted compulsory charitable donations known as zakat to al Qaeda. They also received money from individuals in corrupted charities. Al Qaeda operatives infiltrated large charitable organizations with loose external oversight or controlled smaller ones. They used these employment positions to gain access to the organization's bank accounts.


Although some governments may have consciously chosen to disregard al Qaeda's fundraising activites, there is no concrete evidence that any government actually supported al Qaeda finacially before Septmeber 11 (other than the Taliban's limited support upon Bin Ladin's arrival in Afghanistan). According to the Commission on Terrorist Attacks, Saudi Arabia, a country whose name is associated with al Qaeda funding, has never provided al Qaeda with monetary support. The report also denies allegations that al Qaeda relied heavily on the drug trade and on diamond trafficking from African states during the civil wars for sources of revenue.
After money was collected through donations and financial facilitators, money was moved by hawala, a traditional, trust-based method for the transfering of funds, or by couriers. There is little evidence that Bin Ladin or any high-ranking al Qaeda leaders used banks during this time period in Afghanistan, although hawaladars under al Qaeda may have used banks to move and hold money.


Al Qaeda's funds were dispersed just as quickly as they were brought in. The CIA estimated that prior to September 11, al Qaeda spent $30 million dollars annually, $10-$20 million of which went to the Taliban.
Since September 11 and the fall of the Taliban, al Qaeda funding has drastically decreased. Countless financial facilitators have either been arrested or killed resulting in decreased fundraising with increased fund transfering difficulty. Many corrupt charities have gone completely out of business. Due to the monetary shortcommings, al Qaeda attacks in Saudi Arabia decreased in May and November of 2003. Al Qaeda's negative image has also caused significant decreases in charitable donations.


In addition to a decrease in funds, al Qaeda's expeditures have also enormously decreased due to cutbacks in the organization. Al Qaeda no longer provides financial assistance to the Taliban or runs Afghan training camps. Terrorist operations, however, require little money and are still relatively easy for al Qaeda to fund.

[Drummond]

Which stance? That the IRA and Al Qaeda are the same? Both terrorist organisations?

You posted ...


The IRA were just as potent if not more so than AQ could ever hope to be.

May I suggest that you pay closer attention to your own posts in future ?

(You might even conclude that you should revise them ...)

[Drummond]

By the way, Jafar, what is the significance (if any) of your current avatar ?

It looks to me like a migraine attack ...

[jafar00]

By the way, Jafar, what is the significance (if any) of your current avatar ?

It looks to me like a migraine attack ...

It's nice and positive. It's a "Happy Ramadan" avatar. :)

[Drummond]

It's nice and positive. It's a "Happy Ramadan" avatar. :)

My migraines have Muslim tendencies ?

You learn a little something every day ... OK, well, thanks for the information !

[aboutime]

My migraines have Muslim tendencies ?

You learn a little something every day ... OK, well, thanks for the information !

Reminded me of Al Jazera's logo that brought hate into the Internet world for those who use hatred as their guide. It also makes Migraines expand so much. The beholder needs an IED to meet those virgins.

[Drummond]

Great points my friend. The nature of Islamist terrorism is such that we must use every weapon at our disposal. For they use every weapon and method available to murder and instill terror! This they deliberately visit upon completely innocent people---women and children, with the desire to kill more rather than less! We should hold nothing back , nothing!--Tyr:clap::clap:

I absolutely couldn't agree more ! :bow2:

[red state]

Don't you mean the US could learn something from that?

I mean, one of the things that keeps little groups like Al Qaeda alive is the US blind support of Israel and the way that you look the other way every time the Israelis decide to slaughter a bunch of Palestinians. I believe it is also one of Iran's biggest beefs against the US.

Every terrorist group has a root cause. If you address the root instead of just answering with bombs and invasions, there might be a way of removing the reasons for these terrorist groups to exist.

Just as the IRA ended up with no reason to continue.


Root Killer...works every time I use it! HA! As Tyr suggested, kill em any way we have an opportunity to do so because they certainly have no problem using their abused/brainwashed women and children as bombs or shields. In my opinion, the only good mu-SLUM is a dead one or those who have seen the LIGHT and got out of that cult that had to copy Judaism because of lack of originality or contributing capabilities. Can anyone name some contributing factors that muSLUMs have bettered mankind or science? I can't and even if their were...the bad FAR outweighs the insignificant good.

And since injustices were mentioned: shame on the honorable Israeli's if they EVER trust or give into the childish wants of ANY mu-SLUM scum! And shame on any president such as BUSH for pursuading Israel to evict lawful Israeli citizens, only to have the mu-SLUM scum thank them for giving Israeli land over by sending rockets deeper within Israeli territory. You can deal with SCUM in one way and one way ONLY...dig up and burn the ROOT.

Not all mu-SLUMS are terrorists but MOST ALL terrorists are Mu-SLUMs. A fact to believe in...unless you're an absolute IDIOT!!!

[red state]

This quote came from the Czech Republic.
Someone over there has it figured out


It is Very Well Said and extremely accurate!

Some people have the vocabulary to sum up things in a way you can understand them.

"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency .

It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president.

The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America.

Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince.

The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president."

Of course....this threat has its "ROOTS" as well and we must deal with it. We start with the Family, the Church and in properly dealing with our enemies (both foreign and afar00). I'll be forced, once again, to vote the lessor of two evils but we must get the muSLUM sympathizer, currently occupying the White House, OUT!!! He can take the "jewelry" he received just after '08 when he [bowed] to his king and highest campaign supporter. B.O. received this 'BLING' which is only bestowed upon the highest ranking muSLUM. B.O. and the cult of muSLUMS can stick their "BLING" where the sun don't shine!!!

Keep in mind, the communists have said for 50 years that we will fall without our enemies firing a single shot....THEY were correct and we're seeing it come to pass with OUR tolerance to clear and present dangers from infiltrators, occupiers and the rest of the traitors!

[aboutime]

Root Killer...works every time I use it! HA! As Tyr suggested, kill em any way we have an opportunity to do so because they certainly have no problem using their abused/brainwashed women and children as bombs or shields. In my opinion, the only good mu-SLUM is a dead one or those who have seen the LIGHT and got out of that cult that had to copy Judaism because of lack of originality or contributing capabilities. Can anyone name some contributing factors that muSLUMs have bettered mankind or science? I can't and even if their were...the bad FAR outweighs the insignificant good.

And since injustices were mentioned: shame on the honorable Israeli's if they EVER trust or give into the childish wants of ANY mu-SLUM scum! And shame on any president such as BUSH for pursuading Israel to evict lawful Israeli citizens, only to have the mu-SLUM scum thank them for giving Israeli land over by sending rockets deeper within Israeli territory. You can deal with SCUM in one way and one way ONLY...dig up and burn the ROOT.

Not all mu-SLUMS are terrorists but MOST ALL terrorists are Mu-SLUMs. A fact to believe in...unless you're an absolute IDIOT!!!

Looks like we have a Root problem here as well. There's "Weed-Be-Gone", much like "jafar be gone", or, last, but not least...."ROTO ROOTER" gets down and dirty in pipes as well.

[red state]

Looks like we have a Root problem here as well. There's "Weed-Be-Gone", much like "jafar be gone", or, last, but not least...."ROTO ROOTER" gets down and dirty in pipes as well.

I take it that we need a new label...Depart a Fart! jafart, would you like to test out the new product? I would personally hate to see you go but on the other hand, it would be nice to get an Arabic point of view that was actually intelligent. Your views are so full of it that I doubt any sensible person can take you serious. Of course, I could probably list a few lil' libbie loser lemmings who trash this site with falsehoods and an overwhelming love for isSLUM.

[gabosaurus]

I take it that we need a new label...Depart a Fart! jafart, would you like to test out the new product? I would personally hate to see you go but on the other hand, it would be nice to get an Arabic point of view that was actually intelligent. Your views are so full of it that I doubt any sensible person can take you serious. Of course, I could probably list a few lil' libbie loser lemmings who trash this site with falsehoods and an overwhelming love for isSLUM.

I have run out of things to say about a certain group of newer DP members. Not that they would understand it anyway.

http://dudelol.com/DO-NOT-HOTLINK-IMAGES/Sarcasm-Sometimes-its-the-only-way-to-get-people-to-question-the-official-response.jpg

[jimnyc]

I have run out of things to say about a certain group of newer DP members. Not that they would understand it anyway.

http://dudelol.com/DO-NOT-HOTLINK-IMAGES/Sarcasm-Sometimes-its-the-only-way-to-get-people-to-question-the-official-response.jpg

Too bad your picture makes no sense whatsoever. Everything about it is incorrect and based off of retarded liberal talking points from over the years. It's not sarcastic, it's not funny and the point trying to be made is 100% wrong.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

I have run out of things to say about a certain group of newer DP members. Not that they would understand it anyway.http://dudelol.com/DO-NOT-HOTLINK-IMAGES/Sarcasm-Sometimes-its-the-only-way-to-get-people-to-question-the-official-response.jpg

Of course we newer members are only the dimwitted lesser beings here, right?Your gracious forgiveness of all the longtime members here that blasts you on a regular basis is noted. I guess that indicates your admittance that they are right about you being a lying dumbass of epic size is now declared by your own words, eh?
My , my you sound just like ConHog. Just how close are you two?
He is gone and yet you continue his song without missing a beat!
Amazing similiarities too. You aren't his blow up doll by any chance are you? -:laugh2:-Tyr

[aboutime]

3608
Of course we newer members are only the dimwitted lesser beings here, right?Your gracious forgiveness of all the longtime members here that blasts you on a regular basis is noted. I guess that indicates your admittance that they are right about you being a lying dumbass of epic size is now declared by your own words, eh?
My , my you sound just like ConHog. Just how close are you two?
He is gone and yet you continue his song without missing a beat!
Amazing similiarities too. You aren't his blow up doll by any chance are you? -:laugh2:-Tyr


​We were lost until we found Gabby, and began to emulate her. Now, trying to reverse it to please Gabby again. Please MAKE UP ONE'S MIND...gabby. Blow Up...above. Look familiar Gabby?

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

3608


​We were lost until we found Gabby, and began to emulate her. Now, trying to reverse it to please Gabby again. Please MAKE UP ONE'S MIND...gabby. Blow Up...above. Look familiar Gabby?

Gabby singing ConHog's song is a dead giveaway IMHO.
As both thought to try to pick on the lesser beings!;)
As if we being new meant we were just created the day before.-:laugh2:
I have no knowledge of Gabby's true age but the thinking often resembles that of a ten year old .--:laugh:-Tyr

[Drummond]

I have run out of things to say about a certain group of newer DP members.

Not completely sure if that includes me, Gabby, though I have noticed that your anti-British digs seem to be drying up.

I'm sure I won't miss them ...

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Not completely sure if that includes me, Gabby, though I have noticed that your anti-British digs seem to be drying up.

I'm sure I won't miss them ...

Im guessing that Gabby was zeroing in on we that came from that other forum. Of course you surely qualify as opposition to her liberal/leftist views .
Perhaps she included you because you are conservative as are we.-Tyr