Iran drafts bill to block Hormuz for Gulf oil tankers

[red states rule]

This would do wonders for the Obama economy and jack gas up to $5/gal overnight

Maybe Obama will call Iran and say "Pretty please - don't do this"

Yet Obama is preventing the US from drilling for our own oil so he can secure the enviro wacko vote




Iran's National Security and Foreign Policy Committee has drafted a bill calling for Iran (http://www.debatepolicy.com/places/iran) to try to stop oil tankers from shipping crude through the Strait of Hormuz to countries that support sanctions against it, a committee member said on Monday.
The Iranian parliament is vocal and sees itself as independent but does not hold much power. Bills are unlikely to get far unless sanctioned by the leadership.

"There is a bill prepared in the National Security and Foreign Policy committee of Parliament that stresses the blocking of oil tanker traffic carrying oil to countries that have sanctioned Iran," Iranian MP Ibrahim Agha-Mohammadi was quoted by Iran's parliamentary news agency as saying.

"This bill has been developed as an answer to the European Union's oil sanctions against the Islamic Republic of Iran."

Agha-Mohammadi said that 100 of Tehran's 290 members of parliament had signed the bill as of Sunday.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/02/us-iran-oil-hormuz-idUSBRE8610R920120702

[ConHog]

This would do wonders for the Obama economy and jack gas up to $5/gal overnight

Maybe Obama will call Iran and say "Pretty please - don't do this"

Yet Obama is preventing the US from drilling for our own oil so he can secure the enviro wacko vote

First of all, the article flat out states that a bill from Parliament means nothing if the Iranian leadership doesn't sign it.

Second, the bill says try to stop oil ships from countries that have sanctions on Iran from using the strait, it doesn't say close the strait.

Third, I did not realize we were part of the European Union.

[red states rule]

First of all, the article flat out states that a bill from Parliament means nothing if the Iranian leadership doesn't sign it.

Second, the bill says try to stop oil ships from countries that have sanctions on Iran from using the strait, it doesn't say close the strait.

Third, I did not realize we were part of the European Union.

So lets not fire up the drills, put tens of thousands of people to work, utilize our own natural resources - and be at the mercy of these bastards who will use oil to blackmail the US and screw up our economy when they feel like it

This is another wake up call that many people will ignore and keep gas prices high

[Mr. P]

First of all, the article flat out states that a bill from Parliament means nothing if the Iranian leadership doesn't sign it.

Second, the bill says try to stop oil ships from countries that have sanctions on Iran from using the strait, it doesn't say close the strait.

Third, I did not realize we were part of the European Union.

Damn, it's always 10% who don't get the word or the Obama memo, WE are part of EVERY Union now. Geezzzz :laugh:

[ConHog]

So lets not fire up the drills, put tens of thousands of people to work, utilize our own natural resources - and be at the mercy of these bastards who will use oil to blackmail the US and screw up our economy when they feel like it

This is another wake up call that many people will ignore and keep gas prices high

How does this stupid Iranian bill that doesn't affect us change that RSR? Of course we should be drilling as much domestic oil as reasonably possible. Butto say that "oh noes USA in trouble if this thing that doesn't even affect us is done and Obama is evil" even make sense?

It's like saying that if Pepsi raises the price of their soda in China that the US better start buying more Coke. Apples meet oranges.

[Thunderknuckles]

I'd be surprised if Iran took any action over this. Sounds like more saber rattling to me.

[red states rule]

How does this stupid Iranian bill that doesn't affect us change that RSR? Of course we should be drilling as much domestic oil as reasonably possible. Butto say that "oh noes USA in trouble if this thing that doesn't even affect us is done and Obama is evil" even make sense?

It's like saying that if Pepsi raises the price of their soda in China that the US better start buying more Coke. Apples meet oranges.

The stupid Iranian bill is a REMINDER that we are being held hostage to the stupid Obama energy policy (which is getting regular tuneups and check your air pressure)

He still has the drilling ban in the Gulf, he has blcoked the Keystone Pipeline, and is doing all he can to put the coal industy out of business

If we start tapping the oil rserves (we have rserves that equal the Sauda Arabia) we will send a message we ares erious and prioces will drop

[ConHog]

The stupid Iranian bill is a REMINDER that we are being held hostage to the stupid Obama energy policy (which is getting regular tuneups and check your air pressure)

He still has the drilling ban in the Gulf, he has blcoked the Keystone Pipeline, and is doing all he can to put the coal industy out of business

If we start tapping the oil rserves (we have rserves that equal the Sauda Arabia) we will send a message we ares erious and prioces will drop

The only thing it's a reminder of is that we need to keep a Carrier Group in the area, and that idiot Obama has done just that. Iran won't stop us from getting a single ounce of oil.

[red states rule]

The only thing it's a reminder of is that we need to keep a Carrier Group in the area, and that idiot Obama has done just that. Iran won't stop us from getting a single ounce of oil.

Why do that when we can tap our own, put more Americans back to work, lower the price at the pump, and tell the Iranians to sit on their oil rigs and rotate

[ConHog]

Why do that when we can tap our own, put more Americans back to work, lower the price at the pump, and tell the Iranians to sit on their oil rigs and rotate

I quite agree with that sentiment, but this Iranian "bill" doesn't even threaten to affect us at all, it's aimed at the European Union and probably won't ever become law in any case. So using this as a launching pad of "Obama is letting this happen again, seee......" is silly.

By the way as far as that goes, their have been predictions that the ME is going to run out of oil in 20 years for the last 50 years and yet somehow hmmm they never do; so perhaps buying and only supplementing with our own rather than using up all of our own resources isn't such a bad idea anyway.

[red states rule]

I quite agree with that sentiment, but this Iranian "bill" doesn't even threaten to affect us at all, it's aimed at the European Union and probably won't ever become law in any case. So using this as a launching pad of "Obama is letting this happen again, seee......" is silly.

By the way as far as that goes, their have been predictions that the ME is going to run out of oil in 20 years for the last 50 years and yet somehow hmmm they never do; so perhaps buying and only supplementing with our own rather than using up all of our own resources isn't such a bad idea anyway.

and as I have said several times (you seem to have a mental block on it) it is another example as to WHY we need to Drill Baby Drill and tap all the oil we have right here

I know the enviro wackos will shit their pants but who cares about that except Obama who needs their votes?

I have also heard the "experts" say the US wil run out of oil yet we keep finding more and more reserves and the libs keep blocking all attempts to drill for it

[logroller]

Why do that when we can tap our own, put more Americans back to work, lower the price at the pump, and tell the Iranians to sit on their oil rigs and rotate
Because its not in our long term interests. Same reason existing pumps here aren't pumping anywhere near capacity.

[red states rule]

Because its not in our long term interests. Same reason existing pumps here aren't pumping anywhere near capacity.

If you are Pres Obama, a Dem, and enviro wacko - yea it is NOT in your best interest to see that happen

[logroller]

If you are Pres Obama, a Dem, and enviro wacko - yea it is NOT in your best interest to see that happen
Oil companies do that on their own. Are they dems or envirwackos?

[aboutime]

Does anyone know what Obama's Energy Bill says?
Does Obama have an Energy Bill?


Does anyone know. I Obama wins in November, and you pay for any kind of Energy, for your car, home, or business.
In January. The Non-existent Obama/Democrat Energy Bill....sponsored by the EPA, and granted more power than Both houses of Congress.
WE WILL ALL GET A NICE SURPRISE in the form of Higher Utility, Gas, Oil, Water, Electricity, and BREATHING taxes.

Anyone think that's all Bull?

Good for you. Just wait and see how a Vote for Obama becomes a Tree Hugger's Dream.

[jafar00]

So lets not fire up the drills, put tens of thousands of people to work, utilize our own natural resources - and be at the mercy of these bastards who will use oil to blackmail the US and screw up our economy when they feel like it

This is another wake up call that many people will ignore and keep gas prices high

Can you blame them? They are currently subjected to a whole load of sanctions.

They are probably sitting there thinking "Screw the USA and Israel. Who are they to think they can use sanctions and threats of destruction to blackmail us and screw up our economy when they feel like it?"

[red states rule]

Can you blame them? They are currently subjected to a whole load of sanctions.

They are probably sitting there thinking "Screw the USA and Israel. Who are they to think they can use sanctions and threats of destruction to blackmail us and screw up our economy when they feel like it?"

Yea why should anyone NOT want Little Adolf to get nukes so he can wipe Israel off the map, gun down protesters in the street, and publicly murder women for any violations of the religion of peace

So yea, in your world he is being "provoked"

[jafar00]

Yea why should anyone NOT want Little Adolf to get nukes so he can wipe Israel off the map, gun down protesters in the street, and publicly murder women for any violations of the religion of peace

So yea, in your world he is being "provoked"

They have sanctions and threats against them, yet not a single bit of evidence has been presented that they have a nuclear weapons program. Is that fair? The most vocal country against them, Israel, is not a signatory to the NPT, has never been inspected and has a MAD policy called the Samson Option whereby they will launch nukes at everybody including their friends if they feel threatened. Where is the logic in that?

[jimnyc]

Can you blame them? They are currently subjected to a whole load of sanctions.

Sanctions aren't given for no reason. They ADMIT they have a nuke program, but claim it's for peaceful purposes.

[aboutime]

They have sanctions and threats against them, yet not a single bit of evidence has been presented that they have a nuclear weapons program. Is that fair? The most vocal country against them, Israel, is not a signatory to the NPT, has never been inspected and has a MAD policy called the Samson Option whereby they will launch nukes at everybody including their friends if they feel threatened. Where is the logic in that?


You should have just told us, right from the start. You hate Jews, Israel, and even Americans.

Listening to you defend IRAN is like listening to CHARLES MANSON singing "Feelings".

[red state]

Wow! Another NUT!!! Iran has killed more US soldiers than most care to admit. They support terrorism, have been a thorn in our side for decades and even supported Hitler!!! I could have possibly supported Ron Paul if not for his nutty stance on Iran. Where's the tree that these nuts fall from?! Wow...very bad tree....very distasteful, wormy nuts.

The fact of the matter is Iran does pose a threat to us and their actions are directed towards US (specifically, our economy as they know full well that they are no match for our navy). Every time they pull this, gas prices go up (I declare that they go up for no good reason BUT Iran has learned that it works so they keep doing it).

It is also true that they will probably stop it because B.O. has already said "pretty please". Besides, they owe him one from when he supported every uprising in that general region (except for the legitimate uprising for freedom's sake there in Iran). It was a missed opportunity for us to FINALLY get some peace in that area...if not temporarily, for at least a decade. It is my opinion that IRAN is B.O.'s trump card. They now owe him one and gas prices will go to recent record lows as we near Nov. Watch it...wait on it. There may be a few minor drawbacks but that will quickly be fixed with a call from the "red phone".

B.O. is as dangerous as Iran (probably MUCH more so dangerous than any of our enemies). We must deal with him just a we will be inevitably forced to deal with Iran.

[logroller]

Wow! Another NUT!!! Iran has killed more US soldiers than most care to admit. They support terrorism, have been a thorn in our side for decades and even supported Hitler!!! I could have possibly supported Ron Paul if not for his nutty stance on Iran. Where's the tree that these nuts fall from?! Wow...very bad tree....very distasteful, wormy nuts.

The fact of the matter is Iran does pose a threat to us and their actions are directed towards US (specifically, our economy as they know full well that they are no match for our navy). Every time they pull this, gas prices go up (I declare that they go up for no good reason BUT Iran has learned that it works so they keep doing it).

It is also true that they will probably stop it because B.O. has already said "pretty please". Besides, they owe him one from when he supported every uprising in that general region (except for the legitimate uprising for freedom's sake there in Iran). It was a missed opportunity for us to FINALLY get some peace in that area...if not temporarily, for at least a decade. It is my opinion that IRAN is B.O.'s trump card. They now owe him one and gas prices will go to recent record lows as we near Nov. Watch it...wait on it. There may be a few minor drawbacks but that will quickly be fixed with a call from the "red phone".

B.O. is as dangerous as Iran (probably MUCH more so dangerous than any of our enemies). We must deal with him just a we will be inevitably forced to deal with Iran.
The Islamic republic of Iran has only been in existence since 1980. Never heard that about helping Hitler; But im well aware of the autocratic dynasty which ruled until 1979 under heavy support from America...but please, dont let facts and reason dissuade you from continuing on with your accusations and false conclusions.

[jafar00]

Sanctions aren't given for no reason. They ADMIT they have a nuke program, but claim it's for peaceful purposes.

For what reason are the sanctions put on them? For daring to develop nuclear power as is their right under the NPT?


You should have just told us, right from the start. You hate Jews, Israel, and even Americans.

Listening to you defend IRAN is like listening to CHARLES MANSON singing "Feelings".

Ok. This is how it is. I don't hate Jews. I even have a Jewish lawyer whom I pay considerable sums of money to for his services. We even buy each other lunch sometimes. I also have Jewish employees. I even have a couple of Americans.

You got me on Israel though. I cannot agree with an apartheid state that was built on terrorism.

[PostmodernProphet]

and yet some say there is no reason we should object to Iran having nuclear weapons.....

[jafar00]

and yet some say there is no reason we should object to Iran having nuclear weapons.....

Indeed they shouldn't. And neither should Israel, India or Pakistan but they do.

[red state]

logroller, I won't if you don't let your ignorance of history prevent you from remaining ignorant....Like all liberals, you take comments out of context. No one ever said that the IRI ever helped Hitler BUT, what is Iran of today did back Hitler....just as many of the other mu-SLUM nations helped this mad man. In fact, Iran's current made man could be considered an incarnate Hitler (if one believes in that sort of gibberish). Do your home-work....you'll not get any links or any additional info from me cuz lemmings will always be lemmings regardless of what information has been presented to them. In closing, ask yourself what IRAN means and then do some homework on that meaning of the word. Look, we can't all be as superior as you liberals are. We conservatives wouldn't even know that Iran is the old Persian Empire if not for the vast knowledge we get from liberals. Research the topic and thank me later. Or...stay just as you are....it is very entertaining. HA!!!!


The Islamic republic of Iran has only been in existence since 1980. Never heard that about helping Hitler; But im well aware of the autocratic dynasty which ruled until 1979 under heavy support from America...but please, dont let facts and reason dissuade you from continuing on with your accusations and false conclusions.

[red state]

Neither should we have such weapons....RIGHT Jafar00?! Israel and the US should simply turn our cheeks, bury our nukes and get out the ole prayer rugs....that's what cowards do. I and most of the service men I know are NOT cowards.


Indeed they shouldn't. And neither should Israel, India or Pakistan but they do.

[OCA]

The Islamic republic of Iran has only been in existence since 1980. Never heard that about helping Hitler; But im well aware of the autocratic dynasty which ruled until 1979 under heavy support from America...but please, dont let facts and reason dissuade you from continuing on with your accusations and false conclusions.

Yep, Amerika supported the Shah who murdred tens of thousands of his own citizens, eerily similair to our support of Sadaam.

[red state]

Give the man a cigar!!!! you're spot on OCA!!! Sadly, we had to choose between the lessor of two evils (like we'll be forced to do ONE AGAIN in Nov. election). Still, we should listen to George Washington and mind our business more often. If and when we do stick our nose in it....we need to go all our to WIN and win BIG!!! Pussy footin' around has cost us two, now three, wars that could have been easily won if the politicians would let our KICK @$$ men or the Air Force, Navy, Marines and Army do their job! Saddam was useful to many in that area (including the US as a hit man). He learned well, moved up in ranks and then got too big for his britches. Now we have not wall up against Iran....give me the good ole days when Iraq and Iran went at it all the blasted time!!! It beats what we have now.


Yep, Amerika supported the Shah who murdred tens of thousands of his own citizens, eerily similair to our support of Sadaam.

[logroller]

logroller, I won't if you don't let your ignorance of history prevent you from remaining ignorant....Like all liberals, you take comments out of context. No one ever said that the IRI ever helped Hitler BUT, what is Iran of today did back Hitler....just as many of the other mu-SLUM nations helped this mad man. In fact, Iran's current made man could be considered an incarnate Hitler (if one believes in that sort of gibberish). Do your home-work....you'll not get any links or any additional info from me cuz lemmings will always be lemmings regardless of what information has been presented to them. In closing, ask yourself what IRAN means and then do some homework on that meaning of the word. Look, we can't all be as superior as you liberals are. We conservatives wouldn't even know that Iran is the old Persian Empire if not for the vast knowledge we get from liberals. Research the topic and thank me later. Or...stay just as you are....it is very entertaining. HA!!!!


Wow! Another NUT!!! Iran has killed more US soldiers than most care to admit. They support terrorism, have been a thorn in our side for decades and even supported Hitler!!! I could have possibly supported Ron Paul if not for his nutty stance on Iran. Where's the tree that these nuts fall from?! Wow...very bad tree....very distasteful, wormy nuts.

The fact of the matter is Iran does pose a threat to us and their actions are directed towards US (specifically, our economy as they know full well that they are no match for our navy). Every time they pull this, gas prices go up (I declare that they go up for no good reason BUT Iran has learned that it works so they keep doing it).

It is also true that they will probably stop it because B.O. has already said "pretty please". Besides, they owe him one from when he supported every uprising in that general region (except for the legitimate uprising for freedom's sake there in Iran). It was a missed opportunity for us to FINALLY get some peace in that area...if not temporarily, for at least a decade. It is my opinion that IRAN is B.O.'s trump card. They now owe him one and gas prices will go to recent record lows as we near Nov. Watch it...wait on it. There may be a few minor drawbacks but that will quickly be fixed with a call from the "red phone".

B.O. is as dangerous as Iran (probably MUCH more so dangerous than any of our enemies). We must deal with him just a we will be inevitably forced to deal with Iran.

What context was that; hyperbolic tripe?

And save the entomological lesson on 'Iran' until you learn the meaning of "sovereign state." Then you can look up the mean of liberal, its not derogatory...except in certain conservative circles, e.g. FoxNews, Rush, Iranian leadership.:poke:

[jafar00]

Neither should we have such weapons....RIGHT Jafar00?! Israel and the US should simply turn our cheeks, bury our nukes and get out the ole prayer rugs....that's what cowards do. I and most of the service men I know are NOT cowards.

Well the US has shown they can't be trusted with them. They dropped 2 bombs killing more than 225,000 people by conservative estimates. More than any terrorist group could possible hope to achieve. But I am more concerned about Israel, India and Pakistan which are countries which have not had inspections and are not signatories to the NPT.

As for getting out the "ole prayer rugs", if you have seen the truth and you are ready to accept God into your heart, I would happily witness your shahada and call you my brother :)


Yep, Amerika supported the Shah who murdred tens of thousands of his own citizens, eerily similair to our support of Sadaam.

Mubarak was handy too for keeping quiet about the "secret" CIA torture chambers.

[sundaydriver]

]


I'd be surprised if Iran took any action over this. Sounds like more saber rattling to me.

It appears to be moe saber ratteling to go along with their 3 day Operation Great Phropphet 7 war games that include missle launches onto simulated foreign bases in their desert.


and as I have said several times (you seem to have a mental block on it) it is another example as to WHY we need to Drill Baby Drill and tap all the oil we have right here

I know the enviro wackos will shit their pants but who cares about that except Obama who needs their votes?

I have also heard the "experts" say the US wil run out of oil yet we keep finding more and more reserves and the libs keep blocking all attempts to drill for it

Sure there are new and old resourses left untapped. It was only with higher oil prices that these expensive to extract, dirtier, and hard to reach resources became profitable for the oil companies. Will they go after this oil at $65 a barrel so you can have gas at $2 a gallon? I think if you say yes, then you for sure have never even walked past an economics 101 class!


Because its not in our long term interests. Same reason existing pumps here aren't pumping anywhere near capacity.

Yes I would rather be called an enviro whacko by the ignornant that grasp for the past than to search for new energies or reinvent the old!

[Thunderknuckles]

A case for the defense of Iran:

Iran approaches the West with distrust and downright hostility. And why not? How has the West, particularly the U.S., historically treated Iran? Have we ever respected their sovereignty or their right to determine their own destiny? Starting in 1953 we covertly conspired with Britain to overthrow their government. We succeeded and propped up a puppet government lead by the Shah who engaged in the Westernization of Iran aided by U.S. tax dollars.
Sounds eerily close to our own fear of the Islamization of the West. Predictably, Iranians became increasingly resentful of the U.S. over the years and thus sparked the Iranian Revolution in 1979 shortly followed by the Iranian Hostage Crisis. This act infuriated people in the West. The Iranian response? "You have no right to complain, you took our whole country hostage in 1953". Nonetheless, the U.S. responded by freezing Iranian assets and imposing sanctions against Iran.
Shortly after the hostage debacle, Iran and Iraq went to war. The U.S. openly supported Iraq and supplied the Iraqis with military aid. Once again the U.S. showed it's hypocrisy with respect to WMD by selling Saddam biological weapons of mass destruction that he used on the battlefield against Iran. Iran could never hope to confront the U.S. directly over our newest attempt to overthrow their sovereignty, hence the Iranians responded with support for the embassy bombing and barracks bombing in Beirut in 1983.
Enter the Iran-Contra affair of 1986. Iran discovers a successful means of dealing with the U.S. Hold her citizens hostage and dangle them in front of the President in order to shake down the U.S. It worked.
Curiously, 2 years later an Iranian commercial flight was shot down by an American military vessel. Almost 300 civilians lost their lives on that day including children. Some folks call that a terrorist attack.

Let us fast forward to today and ask why does Iran seek nuclear weapons? The answer is simple. To deter continued U.S. meddling in their country. Afterall, it worked for North Korea did it not? The North Koreans rattle their sabers and threaten war. Rather than engaging in overthrowing their government we grant them aid in order to calm them. Why? They have nukes! If it worked for North Korea, why shouldn't it work for Iran?

[jafar00]

A case for the defense of Iran:

Iran approaches the West with distrust and downright hostility. And why not? How has the West, particularly the U.S., historically treated Iran? Have we ever respected their sovereignty or their right to determine their own destiny? Starting in 1953 we covertly conspired with Britain to overthrow their government. We succeeded and propped up a puppet government lead by the Shah who engaged in the Westernization of Iran aided by U.S. tax dollars.
Sounds eerily close to our own fear of the Islamization of the West. Predictably, Iranians became increasingly resentful of the U.S. over the years and thus sparked the Iranian Revolution in 1979 shortly followed by the Iranian Hostage Crisis. This act infuriated people in the West. The Iranian response? "You have no right to complain, you took our whole country hostage in 1953". Nonetheless, the U.S. responded by freezing Iranian assets and imposing sanctions against Iran.
Shortly after the hostage debacle, Iran and Iraq went to war. The U.S. openly supported Iraq and supplied the Iraqis with military aid. Once again the U.S. showed it's hypocrisy with respect to WMD by selling Saddam biological weapons of mass destruction that he used on the battlefield against Iran. Iran could never hope to confront the U.S. directly over our newest attempt to overthrow their sovereignty, hence the Iranians responded with support for the embassy bombing and barracks bombing in Beirut in 1983.
Enter the Iran-Contra affair of 1986. Iran discovers a successful means of dealing with the U.S. Hold her citizens hostage and dangle them in front of the President in order to shake down the U.S. It worked.
Curiously, 2 years later an Iranian commercial flight was shot down by an American military vessel. Almost 300 civilians lost their lives on that day including children. Some folks call that a terrorist attack.

Let us fast forward to today and ask why does Iran seek nuclear weapons? The answer is simple. To deter continued U.S. meddling in their country. Afterall, it worked for North Korea did it not? The North Koreans rattle their sabers and threaten war. Rather than engaging in overthrowing their government we grant them aid in order to calm them. Why? They have nukes! If it worked for North Korea, why shouldn't it work for Iran?

Well said. I wouldn't blame them either if they had a secret weapons program in order to get a nuke. But with the total lack of evidence to support the notion and that annoying little fatwa by their Ayatollah forbidding nuclear weapons (which are technically forbidden in Islam), I don't see them having a nuke any time soon.

[avatar4321]

First of all, the article flat out states that a bill from Parliament means nothing if the Iranian leadership doesn't sign it.

Second, the bill says try to stop oil ships from countries that have sanctions on Iran from using the strait, it doesn't say close the strait.

Third, I did not realize we were part of the European Union.

First, you're right

Second, doesnt matter what countries, it's still going to up the price for everyone.

Third, see second.

This could be construed as an act of war. If they end up doing this, it's going to get ugly.

[logroller]

This could be construed as an act of war. If they end up doing this, it's going to get ugly.
No more so than economic sanctions imposed upon Iranian oil exports.

[red state]

Well the US has shown they can't be trusted with them. They dropped 2 bombs killing more than 225,000 people by conservative estimates. More than any terrorist group could possible hope to achieve. But I am more concerned about Israel, India and Pakistan which are countries which have not had inspections and are not signatories to the NPT.

As for getting out the "ole prayer rugs", if you have seen the truth and you are ready to accept God into your heart, I would happily witness your shahada and call you my brother :)



Mubarak was handy too for keeping quiet about the "secret" CIA torture chambers.

No....the United States has shown that they are not to be trampled on....Remember Pearl Harbor? I didn't care for the presidents of that era BUT they did the right thing by dropping those bombs. In doing so, a great deal of lives were saved and I'm extremely glad to have known my grandfather. Had the bombs not been used, I may possibly have never met him. The Japanese treated their emperor like deity and were no stranger to sacrificing ALL for his will. The other enemies that we faced value life much the way the Japs did. I'd be perfectly fine with using EVERYTHING we have if it saved American lives and the best among us. Our enemies of today are no different and deserve nothing but the same BUT we should keep our nose out of other nations business. I said that already but I'll not have someone belittle the evils of Iran and the other mu-SLUM nations. 1,000,000,000 of them aren't worth ONE, single US Soldier!!!

Besides, had Iran not been so "friendly" or accepting of the Nazis, Russia and Great Britain wouldn't have had to take over and place a more trustworthy leader at the helm. Iran was a better place under the Shah of Iran's leadership...much more modern and women were in better standing. I have Iranian friends who have told me that the country almost immediately went back to the dark ages when the Shah of Iran was put into exile. I suppose the same Jew hating, Nazi loving radicals took the country back cuz it is definitely nothing but a $#!THOLE now. Keep making them out as something they are not. Had our "occupier" in the White House lended them a hand when they asked for it, I'm sure they would have gone back to the days when they were actually part of the civilized world. Logroller, I see that you decided to remain ignorant of history, but you can be sarcastic to me all you like....I enjoy your little fit and play on the BOLD key. Wrong though he/she may be, at least Jafar00 has done a fairly decent job in keeping to an actual conversation.

One must keep in mind that mass murder was on the scene and communism was spreading and appeared to be quite successful, we saw a need in preventing Iran from becoming a Soviet State. When we saw first hand that the Shah was nothing more than a little communist who TOOK over private lands, the media and the universities, we should have taken him out or chose more wisely a leader that we KNEW was a man of freedom...not tyranny.

As wise our involvement may or may not have been, there was a necessity to do something....although I hold firm in my beliefs that we should mind our own business. As bad or good as the Shah may or may not have been, at least woman and Christians did MUCH better while he was leader...same goes for the Egypt situation.

In closing, I'll ask one more time; why has Obama supported the uprisings that the mu-SLUM brotherhood has organized but chose to leave the freedom fighters in Iran to their death and torture when they would have been great allies. Answer, he is partial to his own which seems to be radical socialists or is-SLUMists. Those he chose not to get involved with were more of a secular nature and wanted Iran to be more like a FREE USA. I see all of this (as well as our occupier in chief, as a movement/attack against FREEDOM) world wide.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

No....the United States has shown that they are not to be trampled on....Remember Pearl Harbor? I didn't care for the presidents of that era BUT they did the right thing by dropping those bombs. In doing so, a great deal of lives were saved and I'm extremely glad to have known my grandfather. Had the bombs not been used, I may possibly have never met him. The Japanese treated their emperor like deity and were no stranger to sacrificing ALL for his will. The other enemies that we faced value life much the way the Japs did. I'd be perfectly fine with using EVERYTHING we have if it saved American lives and the best among us. Our enemies of today are no different and deserve nothing but the same BUT we should keep our nose out of other nations business. I said that already but I'll not have someone belittle the evils of Iran and the other mu-SLUM nations. 1,000,000,000 of them aren't worth ONE, single US Soldier!!!

Besides, had Iran not been so "friendly" or accepting of the Nazis, Russia and Great Britain wouldn't have had to take over and place a more trustworthy leader at the helm. Iran was a better place under the Shah of Iran's leadership...much more modern and women were in better standing. I have Iranian friends who have told me that the country almost immediately went back to the dark ages when the Shah of Iran was put into exile. I suppose the same Jew hating, Nazi loving radicals took the country back cuz it is definitely nothing but a $#!THOLE now. Keep making them out as something they are not. Had our "occupier" in the White House lended them a hand when they asked for it, I'm sure they would have gone back to the days when they were actually part of the civilized world. Logroller, I see that you decided to remain ignorant of history, but you can be sarcastic to me all you like....I enjoy your little fit and play on the BOLD key. Wrong though he/she may be, at least Jafar00 has done a fairly decent job in keeping to an actual conversation.

One must keep in mind that mass murder was on the scene and communism was spreading and appeared to be quite successful, we saw a need in preventing Iran from becoming a Soviet State. When we saw first hand that the Shah was nothing more than a little communist who TOOK over private lands, the media and the universities, we should have taken him out or chose more wisely a leader that we KNEW was a man of freedom...not tyranny.

As wise our involvement may or may not have been, there was a necessity to do something....although I hold firm in my beliefs that we should mind our own business. As bad or good as the Shah may or may not have been, at least woman and Christians did MUCH better while he was leader...same goes for the Egypt situation.

In closing, I'll ask one more time; why has Obama supported the uprisings that the mu-SLUM brotherhood has organized but chose to leave the freedom fighters in Iran to their death and torture when they would have been great allies. Answer, he is partial to his own which seems to be radical socialists or is-SLUMists. Those he chose not to get involved with were more of a secular nature and wanted Iran to be more like a FREE USA. I see all of this (as well as our occupier in chief, as a movement/attack against FREEDOM) world wide.

SPOT ON, nothing else to add except to say BRAVO!!!--:beer:--TZS

[jafar00]

No....the United States has shown that they are not to be trampled on....Remember Pearl Harbor? I didn't care for the presidents of that era BUT they did the right thing by dropping those bombs. In doing so, a great deal of lives were saved and I'm extremely glad to have known my grandfather. Had the bombs not been used, I may possibly have never met him. The Japanese treated their emperor like deity and were no stranger to sacrificing ALL for his will. The other enemies that we faced value life much the way the Japs did. I'd be perfectly fine with using EVERYTHING we have if it saved American lives and the best among us. Our enemies of today are no different and deserve nothing but the same BUT we should keep our nose out of other nations business.

Actually, Japan was ready to surrender before the bombs were dropped... but that is a topic for another thread.


I said that already but I'll not have someone belittle the evils of Iran and the other mu-SLUM nations. 1,000,000,000 of them aren't worth ONE, single US Soldier!!!

Is that the going exchange rate? How does one place worth on a human life and how do you work out if one is more valuable than the other?


Besides, had Iran not been so "friendly" or accepting of the Nazis, Russia and Great Britain wouldn't have had to take over and place a more trustworthy leader at the helm. Iran was a better place under the Shah of Iran's leadership...much more modern and women were in better standing. I have Iranian friends who have told me that the country almost immediately went back to the dark ages when the Shah of Iran was put into exile. I suppose the same Jew hating, Nazi loving radicals took the country back cuz it is definitely nothing but a $#!THOLE now. Keep making them out as something they are not. Had our "occupier" in the White House lended them a hand when they asked for it, I'm sure they would have gone back to the days when they were actually part of the civilized world. Logroller, I see that you decided to remain ignorant of history, but you can be sarcastic to me all you like....I enjoy your little fit and play on the BOLD key. Wrong though he/she may be, at least Jafar00 has done a fairly decent job in keeping to an actual conversation.

One of my best childhood friends was Persian. His parents fled persecution under your lovely Shah for being Baha'i. I guess I should thank the west for meddling in Persian affairs for all those happy years playing with my best friend?


One must keep in mind that mass murder was on the scene and communism was spreading and appeared to be quite successful, we saw a need in preventing Iran from becoming a Soviet State. When we saw first hand that the Shah was nothing more than a little communist who TOOK over private lands, the media and the universities, we should have taken him out or chose more wisely a leader that we KNEW was a man of freedom...not tyranny.

What history books are you reading? The Shah was indeed a mass murdering tyrant!


As wise our involvement may or may not have been, there was a necessity to do something....although I hold firm in my beliefs that we should mind our own business. As bad or good as the Shah may or may not have been, at least woman and Christians did MUCH better while he was leader...same goes for the Egypt situation.

The Copts wouldn't not share your views. They claim to have suffered greatly under Mubarak.


In closing, I'll ask one more time; why has Obama supported the uprisings that the mu-SLUM brotherhood has organized but chose to leave the freedom fighters in Iran to their death and torture when they would have been great allies. Answer, he is partial to his own which seems to be radical socialists or is-SLUMists. Those he chose not to get involved with were more of a secular nature and wanted Iran to be more like a FREE USA. I see all of this (as well as our occupier in chief, as a movement/attack against FREEDOM) world wide.

You lost me with your "SLUM" stuff. If that was an attempt at being offensive, you failed. You also seem to be one of those people who weirdly believe Obama is Muslim.

[avatar4321]

No more so than economic sanctions imposed upon Iranian oil exports.

My point is that we are in dangerous territory right now.

[ConHog]

Well the US has shown they can't be trusted with them. They dropped 2 bombs killing more than 225,000 people by conservative estimates. More than any terrorist group could possible hope to achieve. But I am more concerned about Israel, India and Pakistan which are countries which have not had inspections and are not signatories to the NPT.

As for getting out the "ole prayer rugs", if you have seen the truth and you are ready to accept God into your heart, I would happily witness your shahada and call you my brother :)



Mubarak was handy too for keeping quiet about the "secret" CIA torture chambers.

Psss little historical fact for you. FAR more Japanese were killed by NON atomic bombing then by atomic weapons over the course of WWII, and I mean FAR more. Some would argue in fact that using atomic weapons was a humane decision , myself included.


Not sure what that had to do with the OP , but there it is.

[jafar00]

Psss little historical fact for you. FAR more Japanese were killed by NON atomic bombing then by atomic weapons over the course of WWII, and I mean FAR more. Some would argue in fact that using atomic weapons was a humane decision , myself included.


Not sure what that had to do with the OP , but there it is.

Yeh I know. Apparently some Iranians want to block the straights of Hormuz or something ;)

I've been to Hiroshima. I was moved by the museum and monument there. My Japanese friend was in tears. I dare you to go there a not have your heart jump up into your throat. The effects of the bomb were chilling.

[ConHog]

Yeh I know. Apparently some Iranians want to block the straights of Hormuz or something ;)

I've been to Hiroshima. I was moved by the museum and monument there. My Japanese friend was in tears. I dare you to go there a not have your heart jump up into your throat. The effects of the bomb were chilling.

No sane person denies that, but 60 years later most experts still agree that it was the least costly way to end the pacific war in terms of human lives. Japan wohld not have surrendered without their use

[logroller]

No....the United States has shown that they are not to be trampled on....Remember Pearl Harbor? I didn't care for the presidents of that era BUT they did the right thing by dropping those bombs. In doing so, a great deal of lives were saved and I'm extremely glad to have known my grandfather. Had the bombs not been used, I may possibly have never met him. The Japanese treated their emperor like deity and were no stranger to sacrificing ALL for his will. The other enemies that we faced value life much the way the Japs did. I'd be perfectly fine with using EVERYTHING we have if it saved American lives and the best among us. Our enemies of today are no different and deserve nothing but the same BUT we should keep our nose out of other nations business. I said that already but I'll not have someone belittle the evils of Iran and the other mu-SLUM nations. 1,000,000,000 of them aren't worth ONE, single US Soldier!!!

Besides, had Iran not been so "friendly" or accepting of the Nazis, Russia and Great Britain wouldn't have had to take over and place a more trustworthy leader at the helm. Iran was a better place under the Shah of Iran's leadership...much more modern and women were in better standing. I have Iranian friends who have told me that the country almost immediately went back to the dark ages when the Shah of Iran was put into exile. I suppose the same Jew hating, Nazi loving radicals took the country back cuz it is definitely nothing but a $#!THOLE now. Keep making them out as something they are not. Had our "occupier" in the White House lended them a hand when they asked for it, I'm sure they would have gone back to the days when they were actually part of the civilized world. Logroller, I see that you decided to remain ignorant of history, but you can be sarcastic to me all you like....I enjoy your little fit and play on the BOLD key. Wrong though he/she may be, at least Jafar00 has done a fairly decent job in keeping to an actual conversation.

One must keep in mind that mass murder was on the scene and communism was spreading and appeared to be quite successful, we saw a need in preventing Iran from becoming a Soviet State. When we saw first hand that the Shah was nothing more than a little communist who TOOK over private lands, the media and the universities, we should have taken him out or chose more wisely a leader that we KNEW was a man of freedom...not tyranny.

As wise our involvement may or may not have been, there was a necessity to do something....although I hold firm in my beliefs that we should mind our own business. As bad or good as the Shah may or may not have been, at least woman and Christians did MUCH better while he was leader...same goes for the Egypt situation.

In closing, I'll ask one more time; why has Obama supported the uprisings that the mu-SLUM brotherhood has organized but chose to leave the freedom fighters in Iran to their death and torture when they would have been great allies. Answer, he is partial to his own which seems to be radical socialists or is-SLUMists. Those he chose not to get involved with were more of a secular nature and wanted Iran to be more like a FREE USA. I see all of this (as well as our occupier in chief, as a movement/attack against FREEDOM) world wide.
I'm ignorant of history? Its possible. But i do know the current political structure of Iran began in 1980...it was kind of big ordeal and has much to do with our current diplomatic relations. You said Iran supported Hitler, in daft reference to the current state of affairs. I pointed out the IRI wasnt even in existence during WWII, thus couldn't have supported Hitler; you claimed no one said that, and I pointed out that you did, and you again repeat that falsity above; as though use of "Iran" Can be dually used in the same breath to infer the IRI and the iranian dynasties of the Past. It's a completely different regime; they have no more to do with what Hitler did in WWII than Germany does now. Iran is completely different politically now than then. It would be a more plausible accusation to assert the US supports slavery. You can continue taunting me if it makes you feel better; but it doesn't make what you said a valid critique of Iran.

As to use of bold or loud type...cast stones much Mr mu-SLUM is-SLUM-ic hatin type everything in red? You're hypocrisy is ripe; what america needs is a nice shower to cleanse that hate. The war is on terror, not Islam.

[sundaydriver]

Psss little historical fact for you. FAR more Japanese were killed by NON atomic bombing then by atomic weapons over the course of WWII, and I mean FAR more. Some would argue in fact that using atomic weapons was a humane decision , myself included.


Not sure what that had to do with the OP , but there it is.

The fire bombing of Tokyo killed more Japanese than the combined deaths from both atomic bombs dropped.

[red states rule]

]



It appears to be moe saber ratteling to go along with their 3 day Operation Great Phropphet 7 war games that include missle launches onto simulated foreign bases in their desert.



Sure there are new and old resourses left untapped. It was only with higher oil prices that these expensive to extract, dirtier, and hard to reach resources became profitable for the oil companies. Will they go after this oil at $65 a barrel so you can have gas at $2 a gallon? I think if you say yes, then you for sure have never even walked past an economics 101 class!



Yes I would rather be called an enviro whacko by the ignornant that grasp for the past than to search for new energies or reinvent the old!



Yes SD and under the energy policy of Obama we have seen hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars wasted on green energy programs, and those that did "create" any new jobs cost the taxpayers about $250,000 per job

Meanwhile we have the ban on drilling in Gulf but other countries continue to drill there

As the Obama ecnomy continues to slow and people continue to lose ther jobs, hundreds of thousands of people could be put back to work by simply tapping the energy resources we have here in the US

But alas, that is not on the Do List od Obama, the enviro wqckos, and those who support him. They would rather make the US more green

The only propblem with their business model is they are making the US more red - with all the red ink they are running up

And anyone whom points these facts to libs like you are deemed "ignornant"

[Drummond]

One point I'd like to add.

Iran's current regime, under Ahmadinejad, has threatened Israel with extermination !

What's more, they're reckoned to be THE leading State sponsor of terrorism in the world !!!

So, what possible grounds can there really be for offering arguments which argue in Iran's favour ?

Did the Shah of Persia threaten genocide against another nation ? Did he 'happen' to try, subsequently, to build a technology that 'happens' to help with that aim ?

If anything, the US is being WAY too soft on Iran right now. This is modern-day Hitlerism in the making, folks !!!

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Yes SD and under the energy policy of Obama we have seen hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars wasted on green energy programs, and those that did "create" any new jobs cost the taxpayers about $250,000 per job

Meanwhile we have the ban on drilling in Gulf but other countries continue to drill there

As the Obama ecnomy continues to slow and people continue to lose ther jobs, hundreds of thousands of people could be put back to work by simply tapping the energy resources we have here in the US

But alas, that is not on the Do List od Obama, the enviro wqckos, and those who support him. They would rather make the US more green

The only propblem with their business model is they are making the US more red - with all the red ink they are running up

And anyone whom points these facts to libs like you are deemed "ignornant"

Ever notice the media here amplifies the enviro wacko's when they scream about Americans drilling for oil here but they go silent when it's other nations(esp. China) drilling along our coastline? As if somehow drilling by other countries are perfectly safe while our doing so is a certain disaster just waiting to happen! Thats called propaganda my friend. Look to who it benefits! American enviro wacko's used as the ignorant shills most of them are! -Tyr

[ConHog]

Yes SD and under the energy policy of Obama we have seen hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars wasted on green energy programs, and those that did "create" any new jobs cost the taxpayers about $250,000 per job

Meanwhile we have the ban on drilling in Gulf but other countries continue to drill there

As the Obama ecnomy continues to slow and people continue to lose ther jobs, hundreds of thousands of people could be put back to work by simply tapping the energy resources we have here in the US

But alas, that is not on the Do List od Obama, the enviro wqckos, and those who support him. They would rather make the US more green

The only propblem with their business model is they are making the US more red - with all the red ink they are running up

And anyone whom points these facts to libs like you are deemed "ignornant"



A nice rant, but once again what does Obama have to do with a possible Iranian bill that might be POSSIBLY have Iran trying to prevent European Union oil containers from using the Strait ?

[fj1200]

A nice rant, but once again what does Obama have to do with a possible Iranian bill that might be POSSIBLY have Iran trying to prevent European Union oil containers from using the Strait ?

We live in an interconnected world and liberals, including the chief liberal, are responsible for all ills in the world today.












Duh!

[red state]

I WAS REFERRING TO THE MASS MURDER OF CHINA AND RUSSIA AND WHY THE USA THOUGHT IT BEST TO STICK OUR NOSE IN IRAN CUZ IT WAS BELIEVED THAT RUSSIA WOULD CONTINUE TO EXPAND AND CLAIM IRAN AS ANOTHER SATILITE. YOU SEE, THERE'S ANOTHER TYPICAL LIBERAL POST WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY ARE READING....IF THEY WANT TO UNDERSTAND AT ALL. YES, THE SHAH WAS NOT GOOD....I SAID THAT ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION BUT HE WAS 110% BETTER THAN WHAT THOSE FOLKS HAVE NOW (ESPECIALLY THE WOMEN AND CHILDREN). I DON'T KNOW HISTORY HUH? DO YOU KNOW WHY THE SHAH LOST SUPPORT OR FROM WHAT INCIDENT FROM WHICH HE STARTED LOSING SUPPORT FROM YOUR BELOVED RADICAL MU-slum LEADERS? I DO, THEY NEVER LIKED THE GUY BUT IT WAS HIS WISH TO CHOSE WHAT BIBLE, TORAH OR KORAN THAT THEY SWORE HIM IN ON THAT STARTED THEIR EXTREME DEFIANCE OF HIM. YOU SEE, RADICAL MU-slums, NAZIS AND LIBERALS DEFINITELY HAVE ONE THING IN COMMON.... INTOLERANCE. AND THIS IS THE BIGGEST REASON FOR THE TROUBLE OVER THERE (AND HERE IN THE USA). I DON'T CARE IF A QUEER IS QUEER....JUST DON'T FORCE ME TO RESPECT OR ACCEPT YOUR SICKNESS, I DON'T CARE IF YOU RATHER WATCH YOUR FAMILY BE RAPED WHILE WAITING ON THE COPS, I DON'T EVEN CARE IF YOU CURSE GOD AND DIE....JUST DON'T TELL ME THAT I CAN'T PRAY IN PUBLIC OR SPEAK MY MIND. YOU SEE, INTOLERANCE IS A BIG PROBLEM WITH YOU LIBERALS AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST THINGS YOU CAN'T TOLERATE IS TRUTH AND GOOD OLE FASHION COMMON SENSE.

[mundame]

Iran is very predictable about their saber-rattling. They shoot off missiles, they pass laws, they make inflammatory public statements. Basically, it doesn't matter at all.

If Iran ever tries to stop up the Strait of Hormuz, we will go to war with them immediately. They know that and I think we all know it, too.

The only interesting questions about Iran to me is whether Israel will hit them or not. And whether we'll let them get The Bomb; we may. The geopolitics journal Foreign Affairs is so resigned to it that they are now publishing an article on how it's a GOOD idea to let Iran get nuked up. I couldn't stand to read it, though.

[ConHog]

I WAS REFERRING TO THE MASS MURDER OF CHINA AND RUSSIA AND WHY THE USA THOUGHT IT BEST TO STICK OUR NOSE IN IRAN CUZ IT WAS BELIEVED THAT RUSSIA WOULD CONTINUE TO EXPAND AND CLAIM IRAN AS ANOTHER SATILITE. YOU SEE, THERE'S ANOTHER TYPICAL LIBERAL POST WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY ARE READING....IF THEY WANT TO UNDERSTAND AT ALL. YES, THE SHAH WAS NOT GOOD....I SAID THAT ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION BUT HE WAS 110% BETTER THAN WHAT THOSE FOLKS HAVE NOW (ESPECIALLY THE WOMEN AND CHILDREN). I DON'T KNOW HISTORY HUH? DO YOU KNOW WHY THE SHAH LOST SUPPORT OR FROM WHAT INCIDENT FROM WHICH HE STARTED LOSING SUPPORT FROM YOUR BELOVED RADICAL MU-slum LEADERS? I DO, THEY NEVER LIKED THE GUY BUT IT WAS HIS WISH TO CHOSE WHAT BIBLE, TORAH OR KORAN THAT THEY SWORE HIM IN ON THAT STARTED THEIR EXTREME DEFIANCE OF HIM. YOU SEE, RADICAL MU-slums, NAZIS AND LIBERALS DEFINITELY HAVE ONE THING IN COMMON.... INTOLERANCE. AND THIS IS THE BIGGEST REASON FOR THE TROUBLE OVER THERE (AND HERE IN THE USA). I DON'T CARE IF A QUEER IS QUEER....JUST DON'T FORCE ME TO RESPECT OR ACCEPT YOUR SICKNESS, I DON'T CARE IF YOU RATHER WATCH YOUR FAMILY BE RAPED WHILE WAITING ON THE COPS, I DON'T EVEN CARE IF YOU CURSE GOD AND DIE....JUST DON'T TELL ME THAT I CAN'T PRAY IN PUBLIC OR SPEAK MY MIND. YOU SEE, INTOLERANCE IS A BIG PROBLEM WITH YOU LIBERALS AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST THINGS YOU CAN'T TOLERATE IS TRUTH AND GOOD OLE FASHION COMMON SENSE.

Not that tolerance has a damn thing to do with this thread, but there are intolerant dillholes all over the political spectrum.

[aboutime]

You can deny as much as you think you can fool the rest of us. But, based on this thread alone. You, and others have again proven to be just like Obama. Defending those who claim to be the enemies of the United States, and anyone who claims, or is an American.

Deny as much as you like, but FACTS (as shown below) are not on your side.
Your hatred precedes you, and follows you around:

<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727883" style="width: 471px; ">

<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727879" style="width: 467px; ">



<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727874" style="width: 467px; ">
A lot of Americans have become so insulated from reality that they imagine that America can suffer defeat without any inconvenience to themselves..Pause a moment, reflect back.These events are actual events from history.. They really happened!!! Do you remember?

1. In 1968, Bobby Kennedy



was shot and killed
by a Muslim male.

2. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics,

athletes were kidnapped and massacred

by Muslim males.





3. In 1972 a Pan Am 747 was hijacked and eventually diverted to Cairo where a fuse was lit on final approach and it was blown up shortly after landing

by Muslim males.



4. In 1973 a Pan Am 707 was destroyed
in Rome , with 33 people killed, when it
was attacked with grenades
by Muslim males.

5. In 1979, the US embassy
in Iran was taken over
by Muslim males.

6. During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon
by Muslim males.

7. In 1983, the US Marine barracks
in Beirut was blown up
by Muslim males.

8. In 1985, the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair
by Muslim males.

9. In 1985, TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens , and a US Navy diver trying to rescue passengers was murdered
by Muslim males.

10. In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was
bombed
by Muslim males.

11. In 1993, the World Trade Center
was bombed the first time
by Muslim males.

12. In 1998, the US embassies in
Kenya and Tanzania were bombed
by Muslim males.

13. On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked;two were used as missiles to take down the World Trade Centers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US Pentagon and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers. Thousands of people were killed
by Muslim males.

14. In 2002, the United States
fought a war in Afghanistan
against Muslim males.

15. In 2002, reporter Daniel Pearl
was kidnapped and beheaded by---
you guessed it---
Muslim males.

No, I really don't see a pattern here to justify profiling, do you? So, to ensure we Americans never offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent on killing us, airport security screeners are not allowed to profile certain people...
Absolutely No Profiling!

They must conduct random searches of
80-year-old women, little kids, airline pilots with proper identification, 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips, and Medal of Honor winner and former Governor Joe Foss,
but leave Muslim Males alone lest they be guilty of profiling.

Have our American Leaders completely lost their Minds,or just their
Power of Reason???

Now...tell us you Love Obama, more than you Love, and Admire America. Then. LEAVE!


</tbody>



</tbody>


</tbody>

[ConHog]

You can deny as much as you think you can fool the rest of us. But, based on this thread alone. You, and others have again proven to be just like Obama. Defending those who claim to be the enemies of the United States, and anyone who claims, or is an American.

Deny as much as you like, but FACTS (as shown below) are not on your side.
Your hatred precedes you, and follows you around:

<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727883" style="width: 471px; ">

<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727879" style="width: 467px; ">



<tbody id="yui_3_2_0_5_1341343151727874" style="width: 467px; ">
A lot of Americans have become so insulated from reality that they imagine that America can suffer defeat without any inconvenience to themselves..Pause a moment, reflect back.These events are actual events from history.. They really happened!!! Do you remember?

1. In 1968, Bobby Kennedy



was shot and killed
by a Muslim male.

2. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics,
athletes were kidnapped and massacred
by Muslim males.


3. In 1972 a Pan Am 747 was hijacked and eventually diverted to Cairo where a fuse was lit on final approach and it was blown up shortly after landing
by Muslim males.

4. In 1973 a Pan Am 707 was destroyedin Rome , with 33 people killed, when itwas attacked with grenadesby Muslim males. 5. In 1979, the US embassy
in Iran was taken overby Muslim males.

6. During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanonby Muslim males.

7. In 1983, the US Marine barracksin Beirut was blown upby Muslim males.

8. In 1985, the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchairby Muslim males.

9. In 1985, TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens , and a US Navy diver trying to rescue passengers was murderedby Muslim males.

10. In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 wasbombedby Muslim males.

11. In 1993, the World Trade Centerwas bombed the first timeby Muslim males.

12. In 1998, the US embassies inKenya and Tanzania were bombedby Muslim males.

13. On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked;two were used as missiles to take down the World Trade Centers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US Pentagon and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers. Thousands of people were killedby Muslim males.

14. In 2002, the United Statesfought a war in Afghanistan
against Muslim males.

15. In 2002, reporter Daniel Pearlwas kidnapped and beheaded by---you guessed it---Muslim males.

No, I really don't see a pattern here to justify profiling, do you? So, to ensure we Americans never offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent on killing us, airport security screeners are not allowed to profile certain people...Absolutely No Profiling!

They must conduct random searches of
80-year-old women, little kids, airline pilots with proper identification, 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips, and Medal of Honor winner and former Governor Joe Foss,but leave Muslim Males alone lest they be guilty of profiling.

Have our American Leaders completely lost their Minds,or just theirPower of Reason???

Now...tell us you Love Obama, more than you Love, and Admire America. Then. LEAVE!


</tbody>



</tbody>


</tbody>

Who's defending Iran? LOL

It's just a simple fact that this "bill" wouldn't even affect the US at ALL since it is aimed at the European Union, and that's if it was even passed.


PS - Off topic but do you have a shred of evidence that Oswald was a Muslim? LOL

[Thunderknuckles]

Who's defending Iran? LOL
I did in post #33, although it was purely the work of devil's advocate. I'm still a little shocked you and others didn't rake me over the coals for it :laugh:

[ConHog]

I did in post #33, although it was purely the work of devil's advocate. I'm still a little shocked you and others didn't rake me over the coals for it :laugh:

Oh, I missed that but after reading it, I don't think of that as defending Iran, I mean you're not trying to say they are good guys or anything. Maybe defending their right to have nukes, and THAT I would argue with , but then again I don't believe we should have stood by while N Korea obtained them either.

[fj1200]

PS - Off topic but do you have a shred of evidence that Oswald was a Muslim? LOL

RFK, not JFK.

[aboutime]

RFK, not JFK.


Bobby is spelled much differently than JACK, or JOHN.

Sirhan sound like Lee Harvey to anyone?

[fj1200]

Bobby is spelled much differently than JACK, or JOHN.

Sirhan sound like Lee Harvey to anyone?

Like I said.

[ConHog]

RFK, not JFK.


Oops , was on Droid, hard to read small print sometimes.

BUT, oops Sirhan is a Christian Arab.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirhan_Sirhan

Sirhan is a Christian Palestinian Arab who was born in Jerusalem and who strongly opposed Israel. In 1989, he told David Frost "My only connection with Robert Kennedy was his sole support of Israel and his deliberate attempt to send those 50 bombers to Israel to obviously do harm to the Palestinians."

[fj1200]

Oops , was on Droid, hard to read small print sometimes.

BUT, oops Sirhan is a Christian Arab.

But that doesn't count, he's got one of them there funny names. :spittoon:

[ConHog]

But that doesn't count, he's got one of them there funny names. :spittoon:

And even worse, he's brown and smells funny. :doublespittoon:

[Gaffer]

I've seen it argued here in the past that all the oil on the market goes into one big bucket and prices are set accordingly, so it doesn't matter where the oil comes from or is shipped too. So if iran shuts off one third of the worlds oil that is going to have a major impact on the world. Doesn't make any difference where the oil is bound. Therefore this is a strategic interest to the United States.

During the iran iraq war the US did not give or sell chemical weapons to saddam. He was given intelligence as to iranian positions and troop movements. The weapons he had and used came from the soviets. The iranians used American and European made equipment which they couldn't get replacement parts for.

The iranians want to dominate the middle east, and the only way to insure that is to have nuclear weapons. They began their attempt to gain nukes over ten years ago. With the help of..the russians. It's been their goal all this time and even many of their leaders have let slip that they don't want nukes for peaceful purposes. They want warheads. They are even now trying to buy or develop ICBM's. With such weapons they become the supreme power in the region. They learned a lesson from saddam. Keep the west talking while you continue to build your forces.

They also have another weapon. Research key words: Quds force, revolutionary guards, hezbollah. They have cells made up from these groups all over the world, thousands of them. Should iran be attacked they will go into a defensive mode and activate the cells in the western countries. They won't need nukes to create total chaos and a world war.

The country of iran got it's name from Aryan. Out of respect for hitler. They even sent troops to serve in the SS brigades. They want to carry on what the nazis started.

[jafar00]

One point I'd like to add.

Iran's current regime, under Ahmadinejad, has threatened Israel with extermination !

Did they? The only time I have ever seen them threaten Israel is in retaliation IF Israel attacks them. Iran does have a right to defend themselves right?


If anything, the US is being WAY too soft on Iran right now. This is modern-day Hitlerism in the making, folks !!!

Hitler invaded other countries. Name one country that Iran has attacked on the offensive in the last say, 100 years.


I WAS REFERRING TO THE MASS MURDER OF CHINA AND RUSSIA AND WHY THE USA THOUGHT IT BEST TO STICK OUR NOSE IN IRAN CUZ IT WAS BELIEVED THAT RUSSIA WOULD CONTINUE TO EXPAND AND CLAIM IRAN AS ANOTHER SATILITE. YOU SEE, THERE'S ANOTHER TYPICAL LIBERAL POST WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY ARE READING....IF THEY WANT TO UNDERSTAND AT ALL. YES, THE SHAH WAS NOT GOOD....I SAID THAT ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION BUT HE WAS 110% BETTER THAN WHAT THOSE FOLKS HAVE NOW (ESPECIALLY THE WOMEN AND CHILDREN). I DON'T KNOW HISTORY HUH? DO YOU KNOW WHY THE SHAH LOST SUPPORT OR FROM WHAT INCIDENT FROM WHICH HE STARTED LOSING SUPPORT FROM YOUR BELOVED RADICAL MU-slum LEADERS? I DO, THEY NEVER LIKED THE GUY BUT IT WAS HIS WISH TO CHOSE WHAT BIBLE, TORAH OR KORAN THAT THEY SWORE HIM IN ON THAT STARTED THEIR EXTREME DEFIANCE OF HIM. YOU SEE, RADICAL MU-slums, NAZIS AND LIBERALS DEFINITELY HAVE ONE THING IN COMMON.... INTOLERANCE. AND THIS IS THE BIGGEST REASON FOR THE TROUBLE OVER THERE (AND HERE IN THE USA). I DON'T CARE IF A QUEER IS QUEER....JUST DON'T FORCE ME TO RESPECT OR ACCEPT YOUR SICKNESS, I DON'T CARE IF YOU RATHER WATCH YOUR FAMILY BE RAPED WHILE WAITING ON THE COPS, I DON'T EVEN CARE IF YOU CURSE GOD AND DIE....JUST DON'T TELL ME THAT I CAN'T PRAY IN PUBLIC OR SPEAK MY MIND. YOU SEE, INTOLERANCE IS A BIG PROBLEM WITH YOU LIBERALS AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST THINGS YOU CAN'T TOLERATE IS TRUTH AND GOOD OLE FASHION COMMON SENSE.

Would it be ok with you if I spread my carpet out in front of your house to pray? ^^

[red state]

Did they? The only time I have ever seen them threaten Israel is in retaliation IF Israel attacks them. Iran does have a right to defend themselves right?



Hitler invaded other countries. Name one country that Iran has attacked on the offensive in the last say, 100 years.



Would it be ok with you if I spread my carpet out in front of your house to pray? ^^

SURE...come on over! I'll set up a bucket and charge passers by to see the ridiculous specticle. However, I can't guarantee that some good ole boy won't mistake you for OBL and take a pop at you. HA!

[red state]

Thanks for the additional history lesson...some of us need all the history we can get. Still, they are ignorant of reality. You've wasted your time posting it (obviously) because THEY will never adhere to truth, facts or common sense. Again, thanks for the additional info on Hitler and Iran (Aryan) I forgot to mention the SS part.


I've seen it argued here in the past that all the oil on the market goes into one big bucket and prices are set accordingly, so it doesn't matter where the oil comes from or is shipped too. So if iran shuts off one third of the worlds oil that is going to have a major impact on the world. Doesn't make any difference where the oil is bound. Therefore this is a strategic interest to the United States.

During the iran iraq war the US did not give or sell chemical weapons to saddam. He was given intelligence as to iranian positions and troop movements. The weapons he had and used came from the soviets. The iranians used American and European made equipment which they couldn't get replacement parts for.

The iranians want to dominate the middle east, and the only way to insure that is to have nuclear weapons. They began their attempt to gain nukes over ten years ago. With the help of..the russians. It's been their goal all this time and even many of their leaders have let slip that they don't want nukes for peaceful purposes. They want warheads. They are even now trying to buy or develop ICBM's. With such weapons they become the supreme power in the region. They learned a lesson from saddam. Keep the west talking while you continue to build your forces.

They also have another weapon. Research key words: Quds force, revolutionary guards, hezbollah. They have cells made up from these groups all over the world, thousands of them. Should iran be attacked they will go into a defensive mode and activate the cells in the western countries. They won't need nukes to create total chaos and a world war.

The country of iran got it's name from Aryan. Out of respect for hitler. They even sent troops to serve in the SS brigades. They want to carry on what the nazis started.

[Gaffer]

Did they? The only time I have ever seen them threaten Israel is in retaliation IF Israel attacks them. Iran does have a right to defend themselves right?



Hitler invaded other countries. Name one country that Iran has attacked on the offensive in the last say, 100 years.



Would it be ok with you if I spread my carpet out in front of your house to pray? ^^

So you haven't seen the many times the iranian president has said he wants to wipe Israel off the map? His many, many calls for the destruction of Israel? His denial that the holocaust ever happened? His use of hezbollah to attack Israel?

Iran has Quds force agents and many others throughout the world. They are strike forces within other countries awaiting orders to strike. They supply the taliban, and shia forces in iraq with weapons and support. They have no need to invade any place yet. It's all carried out covertly.

Is it okay with you if my pet pig Mo sits beside you as you pray?

[jafar00]

So you haven't seen the many times the iranian president has said he wants to wipe Israel off the map? His many, many calls for the destruction of Israel? His denial that the holocaust ever happened? His use of hezbollah to attack Israel?

Ahmedinejad didn't threaten to wipe Israel off the map. If you recall he said the zionist regime will vanish from the pages of time which is a completely different sentence. At the time he was addressing a group of Palestinian refugees. When you look at it that way, he was trying to be reassuring to them that the Zionist regime that had driven them from their homes would one day be just a distant memory. In history, apartheid regimes have rarely lasted that long so there is that to look forward to.

As for the holocaust, he is entitled to an opinion and has the right to also voice that opinion does he not?

Hezbullah, have attacked Israel in response to Israel's attacks on Lebanon. The Lebanese have the right to defend themselves against aggression.


Iran has Quds force agents and many others throughout the world. They are strike forces within other countries awaiting orders to strike. They supply the taliban, and shia forces in iraq with weapons and support. They have no need to invade any place yet. It's all carried out covertly.

The ole' secret sleeper cells thing went out with the war on terror when Al Qaeda was supposed to have dozens of sleeper cells hiding under our beds waiting to strike. I'm guessing they a) Don't exist and never did or b) are still asleep.


Is it okay with you if my pet pig Mo sits beside you as you pray?

Sure, it's ok with me. He would probably want to follow me home too since I am less likely to eat him next time I get a craving for a bacon sammich :p

[Thunderknuckles]

Sure, it's ok with me. He would probably want to follow me home too since I am less likely to eat him next time I get a craving for a bacon sammich :p
I disagree with a few things you have stated but you seem to be even keeled with a sense of humor. Good show.

For the rest of you I think it is clear that jafar != abso.

[fj1200]

I've seen it argued here in the past that all the oil on the market goes into one big bucket and prices are set accordingly, so it doesn't matter where the oil comes from or is shipped too. So if iran shuts off one third of the worlds oil that is going to have a major impact on the world. Doesn't make any difference where the oil is bound. Therefore this is a strategic interest to the United States.

...

The country of iran got it's name from Aryan. Out of respect for hitler. They even sent troops to serve in the SS brigades. They want to carry on what the nazis started.

That seems to be a stretch.


The name "Iran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_(word))", which in Persian means "Land of the Aryans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan)", has been in use natively since the Sassanian era (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sassanid_Empire). It came into use internationally in 1935, before which the country was known to the Western world as Persia (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8a/Loudspeaker.svg/11px-Loudspeaker.svg.png / (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)ˈ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)p (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ɜr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ʒ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ə (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English) or / (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)ˈ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)p (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ɜr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ʃ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ə (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)).[11] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-AHD-10)[14] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-Iranicaonline.org-13) Both "Persia" and "Iran" are used interchangeably in cultural contexts; however, "Iran" is the name used officially in political contexts.[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-artarena-14)[16] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-iranian-15)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran


The term "Airya/Airyan" appears in the royal Old Persian inscriptions in three different contexts:

As the name of the language of the Old Persian version of the inscription of Darius the Great (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darius_the_Great) in Behistun
As the ethnic background of Darius (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darius_the_Great) in inscriptions at Naqsh-e-Rostam and Susa (Dna, Dse) and Xerxes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerxes_I_of_Persia) in the inscription from Persepolis (Xph)
As the definition of the God of Aryan people, Ahuramazda, in the Elamite version of the Behistun inscription.[13] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#cite_note-Bailey-12)[15] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#cite_note-Schmitt-15)[23] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#cite_note-iranica.com-23)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#In_Iranian_literature

But you're correct about the oil. World markets would definitely react to the news and it's likely that oil prices would spike if supply were actually disrupted.

[sundaydriver]

That seems to be a stretch.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan#In_Iranian_literature

But you're correct about the oil. World markets would definitely react to the news and it's likely that oil prices would spike if supply were actually disrupted.

Oil futures are already up 13% over last week closing due to renewed world wide short term confidence with the banking deal in Europe & even slowing growth in the still slowly growing economy.

As for the Straight of Hormuz? We have a carrier group in place, minesweepers were sent to the area a month ago, Saudi Arabia has reopened an older pipeline thru Iraq to the Red Sea, and Iran cannot bear much more of the consequences of it's actions.

[red states rule]

A nice rant, but once again what does Obama have to do with a possible Iranian bill that might be POSSIBLY have Iran trying to prevent European Union oil containers from using the Strait ?

Only to people like you would pointing out Obama's energy policy be dismissed as a rant.

Meanwhile oil wnet up nealry $4/bl yesterday so Happy 4th folks

[jimnyc]

An "act of provocation" elsewhere... I think they should lay out 200'x200' banners of Muhammed all around the area, and let Israel and the US have a few exercises of their own, and practice blowing them up. Would be funny to see so many froth at the mouth!


Iran test-fires dozens of missilesIran’s Revolutionary Guards test-fired dozens of missiles on Tuesday, in a display of might that coincides with the tightening of US and European Union oil sanctions against Tehran over its nuclear programme.

Amid growing concern in western governments that tensions between the US and Iran could rise significantly in the Strait of Hormuz this month, Iran said the exercise was a response to the refusal by Israel and the US to rule out military strikes against Iran.

The Revolutionary Guards test-fired the medium-range Shahab-3 missile – which has a range of up to 2,000km and which is believed to be able to hit Israel. The short-range Shahab-1 and Shahab-2 missiles, which have a range of 300km and 500km respectively, were also test-fired.

The Iranian tests came as the US said it has been boosting its military presence in the region in recent months. The Pentagon announced on Tuesday that it now had eight minesweepers in the Gulf region, which it said are to deter any Iranian attempts to block the Strait of Hormuz.

The USS Ponce, a former transport ship that has been redesigned into a staging base for special operations forces, has also recently arrived in the region.

The military moves by both Iran and the US may be an early indication that tensions in the region are again set to rise, repeating the unsettled mood in the Strait of Hormuz at the start of this year.

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/1fb99d16-c52a-11e1-b6fd-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1zf8AYTmU

[red states rule]

An "act of provocation" elsewhere... I think they should lay out 200'x200' banners of Muhammed all around the area, and let Israel and the US have a few exercises of their own, and practice blowing them up. Would be funny to see so many froth at the mouth!



http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/1fb99d16-c52a-11e1-b6fd-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1zf8AYTmU

I suspect Israel will put an end to this bullshit long before Obama even makes up his mind to call/not call Little Adolf in iran and say "pretty please" do not block our oil

[logroller]

I suspect Israel will put an end to this bullshit long before Obama even makes up his mind to call/not call Little Adolf in iran and say "pretty please" do not block our oil
so you are for US military attacks on Iran forthwith?

[jimnyc]

so you are for US military attacks on Iran forthwith?

If we can pinpoint them and only take out achminiaheajadhijihad, and a few clerics and mullahs, then it would be a good thing... :slap:

[red states rule]

so you are for US military attacks on Iran forthwith?

Rather then allow Little Adolf to get nukes - YES!!!!!!

[logroller]

If we can pinpoint them and only take out achminiaheajadhijihad, and a few clerics and mullahs, then it would be a good thing... :slap:
Define "good". I mean, more Americans with health coverage is a "good thing", but not by any means. I just see military attacks as a last resort; because inevitably there is collateral damage; both in lives and political support. I just wanted to know if rSR, or anyone really, thinks its at that point where sanctions and such are fruitless. I think this move by the Ira Ian's is a sign that sanctions are working, because they now try the same thing.

[logroller]

Rather then allow Little Adolf to get nukes - YES!!!!!!
We went into Iraq under similar auspices, only it was WMDs. Though Saddam was deposed, a "good thing", Iraq is tumultuous, our political capital on the world stage has lessened, gas prices are higher and America is no more safe from the abundance of threats from foreign powers. If anything it emboldened the "liberal agenda" here in America. So I struggle to understand how attacking Iran, a sovereign state, is in our best interests.

[red states rule]

We went into Iraq under similar auspices, only it was WMDs. Though Saddam was deposed, a "good thing", Iraq is tumultuous, our political capital on the world stage has lessened, gas prices are higher and America is no more safe from the abundance of threats from foreign powers. If anything it emboldened the "liberal agenda" here in America. So I struggle to understand how attacking Iran, a sovereign state, is in our best interests.

So you are cool with Little Adolf - who has vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the map, said the Holocaust never happened - have nukes

LR you sound so much like Neville Chamberlain when he was dealing with Hitler in the late 1930's

[jimnyc]

Define "good". I mean, more Americans with health coverage is a "good thing", but not by any means. I just see military attacks as a last resort; because inevitably there is collateral damage; both in lives and political support. I just wanted to know if rSR, or anyone really, thinks its at that point where sanctions and such are fruitless. I think this move by the Ira Ian's is a sign that sanctions are working, because they now try the same thing.

Regardless of nukes and such, I just think Achminjajihad is a scumbag, as are the majority of clerics and mullahs who he answers to and the ayatollah. Just my personal opinion of course, that I wouldn't mind seeing them 6 feet under. I wouldn't lose any sleep. Save the collateral damage then, I wouldn't mind another Seal Team 6 episode, only bury a bunch of those bastards at sea.

[red states rule]

Regardless of nukes and such, I just think Achminjajihad is a scumbag, as are the majority of clerics and mullahs who he answers to and the ayatollah. Just my personal opinion of course, that I wouldn't mind seeing them 6 feet under. I wouldn't lose any sleep. Save the collateral damage then, I wouldn't mind another Seal Team 6 episode, only bury a bunch of those bastards at sea.

Israel is not going to wait aorund for the PC crowd in DC it make a decision Jim. If Little Adolf gets close to making a nuke they will take it out and screw what DC has to say

[logroller]

Regardless of nukes and such, I just think Achminjajihad is a scumbag, as are the majority of clerics and mullahs who he answers to and the ayatollah. Just my personal opinion of course, that I wouldn't mind seeing them 6 feet under. I wouldn't lose any sleep. Save the collateral damage then, I wouldn't mind another Seal Team 6 episode, only bury a bunch of those bastards at sea.
Im not defending Iranian leadership; I'm defending sovereignty. I know it's a difficult concept to wholly accept; that someone can do something wrong and still be within their rights to do so; but such is the nature of liberty.

So you are cool with Little Adolf - who has vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the map, said the Holocaust never happened - have nukes

LR you sound so much like Neville Chamberlain when he was dealing with Hitler in the late 1930's
See above response. Name calling rsr; if that is that the best you got; there's a playground here for such antics.

Israel is not going to wait aorund for the PC crowd in DC it make a decision Jim. If Little Adolf gets close to making a nuke they will take it out and screw what DC has to say
And that is their decision to make as a sovereign power. It's ironic you would disparage decision making from a comprehensive politial perspective on a political debate site.

[red states rule]

Im not defending Iranian leadership; I'm defending sovereignty. I know it's a difficult concept to wholly accept; that someone can do something wrong and still be within their rights to do so; but such is the nature of liberty.

See above response. Name calling rsr; if that is that the best you got; there's a playground here for such antics.

And that is their decision to make as a sovereign power. It's ironic you would disparage decision making from a comprehensive politial perspective on a political debate site.

It is not name calling LR. History is ful of folks like you who think you dictators and men who seek unlimited power can be reasoned with and how international law will stop them from what they want

[jimnyc]

Im not defending Iranian leadership; I'm defending sovereignty. I know it's a difficult concept to wholly accept; that someone can do something wrong and still be within their rights to do so; but such is the nature of liberty.

It's not difficult at all to accept. That doesn't mean it's wrong of me to wish death upon the scumbags I listed. I'm not advocating a full scaled war, or really advocating war of any sort. I'm just of the personal opinion that these people are better off dead. I have no issue with the Iranian people.

[logroller]

It is not name calling LR. History is ful of folks like you who think you dictators and men who seek unlimited power can be reasoned with and how international law will stop them from what they want
History is full of peopl of all kinds of people; but that doesn't mean I am sufferable to dictatorships. I'm merely saying sovereignty is to be respected, else we should be subject to other nations' will on our domestic affairs. International law is very persuasive. Believe or not, international sanctions are just as effective at creating the conditions for despotism as democracies. Maintaining a balance between respecting sovereignty and individual freedom is a delicate process that is easily undermined-- history shows us this time and time again. See: the versailles treaty and operation iraqi freedom.

[red states rule]

History is full of peopl of all kinds of people; but that doesn't mean I am sufferable to dictatorships. I'm merely saying sovereignty is to be respected, else we should be subject to other nations' will on our domestic affairs. International law is very persuasive. Believe or not, international sanctions are just as effective at creating the conditions for despotism as democracies. Maintaining a balance between respecting sovereignty and individual freedom is a delicate process that is easily undermined-- history shows us this time and time again. See: the versailles treaty and operation iraqi freedom.

Thankfully while you are respecting sovereignty, Little Adolf is preparing his nuke to take out Israel, and Obama is talking to Little Adolf and trying to reason with him - Israel will do what is needed to save their lives and their country and take the little bastard out

They wil make your life easier and prevent Obama from making a real decision

[Gaffer]

Sovereignty, a word for tyrants and dictators to hide behind. They have a right to do whatever they want within their borders. A PC word.

Sanctions. Something that doesn't work unless everyone takes part. If one or two refuse and continue to trade with the sanctioned country then nothing is accomplished.

[red states rule]

Sovereignty, a word for tyrants and dictators to hide behind. They have a right to do whatever they want within their borders. A PC word.

Sanctions. Something that doesn't work unless everyone takes part. If one or two refuse and continue to trade with the sanctioned country then nothing is accomplished.

and do not forget the UN

Libs and dictators love to use the UN to solve "problems"

http://www.thoseshirts.com/images/imaoun500.gif

[logroller]

Thankfully while you are respecting sovereignty, Little Adolf is preparing his nuke to take out Israel, and Obama is talking to Little Adolf and trying to reason with him - Israel will do what is needed to save their lives and their country and take the little bastard out

They wil make your life easier and prevent Obama from making a real decision

. Just what makes you conservative anyways? Hating libs? Because you seem hellbent on sticking your nose and the lives of our brave soldiers on the line for something that doesn't affect you or I. don't you have some jobs bill, or otherwise more pressing issue, to push?

[red states rule]

. Just what makes you conservative anyways? Hating libs? Because you seem hellbent on sticking your nose and the lives of our brave soldiers on the line for something that doesn't affect you or I. don't you have some jobs bill, or otherwise more pressing issue, to push?

and I am sure you would continue to scream about the rights of Little Adolf to have nukes, and the US has no right to stop him from getting them, even as the mushroom cloud forms over Israel

and then you would try to excuse the action by listing all the acts of aggression Israel was showing. Like its citizens going to work, taking care of their children, and breathing

[aboutime]

Regardless of nukes and such, I just think Achminjajihad is a scumbag, as are the majority of clerics and mullahs who he answers to and the ayatollah. Just my personal opinion of course, that I wouldn't mind seeing them 6 feet under. I wouldn't lose any sleep. Save the collateral damage then, I wouldn't mind another Seal Team 6 episode, only bury a bunch of those bastards at sea.


Why add to the scum that already occupies the world's oceans with more SCUM?

I'd rather see them learn....first hand. What a MOAB is like in person. You know? To spread their words of Hatred....WIDELY.

And Logroller. Just for you. When will you begin to fully respect, and be proud of America? Your words remind me of Michelle Obama in many ways.

[red states rule]

Why add to the scum that already occupies the world's oceans with more SCUM?

I'd rather see them learn....first hand. What a MOAB is like in person. You know? To spread their words of Hatred....WIDELY.

And Logroller. Just for you. When will you begin to fully respect, and be proud of America? Your words remind me of Michelle Obama in many ways.

http://www.thoseshirts.com/images/square-large-forecast-back.gif

[red states rule]

I would love to see the US military call Iran's bluff





(Reuters) - Iran (http://www.debatepolicy.com/places/iran) has threatened to destroy U.S. military bases across the Middle East and target Israel within minutes of being attacked, Iranian media reported on Wednesday, as Revolutionary Guards extended test-firing of ballistic missiles into a third day.
Israel has hinted it may attack Iran if diplomacy fails to secure a halt to its disputed nuclear energy program. The United States also has mooted military action as a last-resort option but has frequently nudged the Israelis to give time for intensified economic sanctions to work against Iran.

"These bases are all in range of our missiles, and the occupied lands (Israel) are also good targets for us," Amir Ali Haji Zadeh, commander of the Revolutionary Guards aerospace division, was quoted by Fars news agency as saying.

Haji Zadeh said 35 U.S. bases were within reach of Iran's ballistic missiles, the most advanced of which commanders have said could hit targets 2,000 km (1,300 miles) away.

"We have thought of measures to set up bases and deploy missiles to destroy all these bases in the early minutes after an attack," he added.

It was not clear where Haji Zadeh got his figures on U.S. bases in the region. U.S. military facilities in the Middle East are located in Bahrain, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates, Kuwait and Turkey, and it has around 10 bases further afield in Afghanistan (http://www.debatepolicy.com/places/afghanistan) and Kyrgyzstan.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/04/us-iran-nuclear-missiles-idUSBRE86308I20120704

[logroller]

Sovereignty, a word for tyrants and dictators to hide behind. They have a right to do whatever they want within their borders. A PC word.

Sanctions. Something that doesn't work unless everyone takes part. If one or two refuse and continue to trade with the sanctioned country then nothing is accomplished.

Sovereignty is a function of the individual; I dictate absolute control over myself-- if this, in your opinion, makes me a dictator, then so be it.

Your definition is yours to dictate; it's acceptance, I suspect, would find more than a few detractors.
From blacks law.
Definition of SOVEREIGNTYThe possession of sovereign power; supreme political authority; paramount control of the constitution and frame of government and Its administration (http://thelawdictionary.org/administration/) ; the self-sufficient source of political power, from which all specific political powers are derived; the international independence (http://thelawdictionary.org/independence/) of a state, combined with the right and power of regulating its internal affairs without foreign dictation; also a political society, or state, which is sovereign and independent. See Chisholm v. Georgia, 2 Dall. 455, 1 L. Ed. 440: Union Bank v. Hill, 3 Cold. (Tenn.) 325; Moore v. Shaw, 17 Cal. 218, 79 Am. Dec. 123. “The freedom of the nation has its correlate in the sovereignty of the nation. Political sovereignty is the assertion of the self-determinate will of the organic people, and in this there is the manifestation of its freedom. It is in and through the determination (http://thelawdictionary.org/determination/) of its sovereignty that the order of the nation is constituted and maintained.” Mulford, Nation, p. 129. “If a determinate human superior, not in a habit of obedience to a like superior, receive habitual obedience from the bulk of a given society, that determinate superior is sovereign in that society, and the society (including the superior) is a society political and independent.” Aust. Jur.

The bulk of a society being obedient to an authority makes it sovereign. Politically correct...indeed-- a government of the People-- its the basis for democracy,. As for sanctions, no argument there. That's why multilateral international support is necessary to impose sanctions; but that doesnt mean unilateral military actions are preferable or more effective.

[red states rule]

Sovereignty is a function of the individual; I dictate absolute control over myself-- if this, in your opinion, makes me a dictator, then so be it.

Your definition is yours to dictate; it's acceptance, I suspect, would find more than a few detractors.
From blacks law.

The bulk of a society being obedient to an authority makes it sovereign. Politically correct...indeed-- a government of the People-- its the basis for democracy,. As for sanctions, no argument there. That's why multilateral international support is necessary to impose sanctions; but that doesnt mean unilateral military actions are preferable or more effective. [/COLOR]
[/COLOR]

Yes, you would he happy to file a lawsuite against Little Adolf in the World court after he fires a nuke and takes out Israel

and I am sure you would sink some money into Corning Inc after Little Adolf takes out Israel since there would be alot of new glass where Israel once stood

[Gaffer]

I would love to see the US military call Iran's bluff

The US bases have anti missile systems that are very good at taking out missiles. They have such systems on the ships in the gulf as well. Not to mention all the missile sites in iran will be targeted first thing to prevent launching.

Would be interesting if they attempt to strike US bases in other countries. An act of war against a "sovereign" country. There's that word again. Wonder what Turkey would think of missiles flying their way?

Should be lots of gun camera footage.

[red states rule]

The US bases have anti missile systems that are very good at taking out missiles. They have such systems on the ships in the gulf as well. Not to mention all the missile sites in iran will be targeted first thing to prevent launching.

Would be interesting if they attempt to strike US bases in other countries. An act of war against a "sovereign" country. There's that word again. Wonder what Turkey would think of missiles flying their way?

Should be lots of gun camera footage.

It owuld be fun to see how the liberal media "reports" how the US provoked Little Adolf and goaded him into an attack

Of course the US would destroy Iran and its weapons without breaking a sweat. I do know of anything that could withstand a few Daisy Cutters dropped on them

and I would hope Little Adolf was in one of the buildings that a Daisy Cutter was dropped on

[logroller]

Yes, you would he happy to file a lawsuite against Little Adolf in the World court after he fires a nuke and takes out Israel

and I am sure you would sink some money into Corning Inc after Little Adolf takes out Israel since there would be alot of new glass where Israel once stood
OK smart ass; what tort, or injury would I have to justify such a suit?

[red states rule]

OK smart ass; what tort, or injury would I have to justify such a suit?

Oh Little Adolf violated international law by firing a nuke and the only way to deal with that action is via the legal system

After all, that is how "reasonable" and "civilized" people deal with these type of issues - rigth LR?

[jimnyc]

Yes, you would he happy to file a lawsuite against Little Adolf in the World court after he fires a nuke and takes out Israel

and I am sure you would sink some money into Corning Inc after Little Adolf takes out Israel since there would be alot of new glass where Israel once stood

C'mon man, just because he disagrees on certain things about Iran, doesn't make him an enemy! Logroller is a reasonable guy. We're all going to differ on SOME aspects of politics, whether international or domestic. People can still be reasonable to one another even though they may disagree on some politics out there.

[red states rule]

C'mon man, just because he disagrees on certain things about Iran, doesn't make him an enemy! Logroller is a reasonable guy. We're all going to differ on SOME aspects of politics, whether international or domestic. People can still be reasonable to one another even though they may disagree on some politics out there.

I never said he was the enemy Jim. I am saying he reminds me of the same people who thoguht they could reason with Hitler, and Saddam and we ended up going to war with them anyway

If Little Adolf is cloe to getting a nuke there is no way to talking him out of using it.

[jimnyc]

I never said he was the enemy Jim. I am saying he reminds me of the same people who thoguht they could reason with Hitler, and Saddam and we ended up going to war with them anyway

If Little Adolf is cloe to getting a nuke there is no way to talking him out of using it.

You infer some awful things about him and perhaps support for Iran destroying Israel. Him not thinking it's a good idea to attack Iran doesn't mean he is FOR the things you insinuate, that's all I'm saying.

[red states rule]

You infer some awful things about him and perhaps support for Iran destroying Israel. Him not thinking it's a good idea to attack Iran doesn't mean he is FOR the things you insinuate, that's all I'm saying.

and I never ment to infer such things

Only that I will never understand why some people think you can reason with dictators who are obsessed with detroying other nations when they are close to obatining weapons to amke that obsession a reality

[Kathianne]

You infer some awful things about him and perhaps support for Iran destroying Israel. Him not thinking it's a good idea to attack Iran doesn't mean he is FOR the things you insinuate, that's all I'm saying.

This is the type of idea I was trying to elucidate on Adams and Jefferson. To presume there is 'one way' meaning, 'my way' to address issues is the height of hubris. This is as true on messageboards as in political arena. There's a tendency of those on the right to project weakness and lack of patriotism towards those pontificating on the left. which is everyone to the left of themselves.

Those on the left often use elitist tone to condescend to those they consider conservative, which is everyone to the right of themselves.

I for one would be much happier to see more thoughtful posts instead of just frantic posting. Just my opinion.

[logroller]

Oh Little Adolf violated international law by firing a nuke and the only way to deal with that action is via the legal system

After all, that is how "reasonable" and "civilized" people deal with these type of issues - rigth LR?
Who fired a nuke? At whom? What tort do I have? Or is there not one... Let's just get the facts straight here mr hyperbole; we have no more proof of nukes in Iran than we did WMDs in Iraq. And yes; legal standards are how reasonable and civilized people behave-- it begins with actual grounds for standing, a tort of injury; which you have not, so you have to make up stuff-- why don't you go put on a hoody and snack on some skittles and iced tea...maybe jointhe occupy movement. Something hooey changey. Cause international torts don't seem to be your forte.

[fj1200]

and I never ment to infer such things

Bull.

[red states rule]

Who fired a nuke? At whom? What tort do I have? Or is there not one... Let's just get the facts straight here mr hyperbole; we have no more proof of nukes in Iran than we did WMDs in Iraq. And yes; legal standards are how reasonable and civilized people behave-- it begins with actual grounds for standing, a tort of injury; which you have not, so you have to make up stuff-- why don't you go put on a hoody and snack on some skittles and iced tea...maybe jointhe occupy movement. Something hooey changey. Cause international torts don't seem to be your forte.

Little Adolf is not close to getting nukes???

I guess all those satellite photos are fakes, and Iran is only using nuclear power for peaceful purposes

As I said before you remind me alot of Neville Chamberlain

[fj1200]

Little Adolf is not close to getting nukes???

I guess all those satellite photos are fakes, and Iran is only using nuclear power for peaceful purposes

As I said before you remind me alot of Neville Chamberlain

You really can't go two posts deep with someone without repeating can you?

[red states rule]

You really can't go two posts deep with someone without repeating can you?

and for some reason a hair has gotten up your ass recently

What seems to be your problem FJ? As far as I know I have said very little to you

Why the massive chip on your shoulder?

[fj1200]

^Was that a "no"?

[Kathianne]

and for some reason a hair has gotten up your ass recently

What seems to be your problem FJ? As far as I know I have said very little to you

Why the massive chip on your shoulder?

RSR, you know I like you, not an issue. I think some are getting a bit frustrated with the labeling of themselves, without any just cause, other than how you perceive their posts. You friend, are not alone.

There's a plethora of posts throwing around terms like 'socialist,' communist,' 'Nazi,' 'Little Hitler,' without any salient points being made.

Want to say that, 'Iran is close to getting nukes?' Find the link, I KNOW they are out there. Hell you can find some from UN sites. Seriously. Read the link, find what is suggestions being considered. Take a stand.

Hell, few of us are interested enough or have time enough to do this on each and every topic, but once in awhile? A short article?

[logroller]

Why add to the scum that already occupies the world's oceans with more SCUM?

I'd rather see them learn....first hand. What a MOAB is like in person. You know? To spread their words of Hatred....WIDELY.

And Logroller. Just for you. When will you begin to fully respect, and be proud of America? Your words remind me of Michelle Obama in many ways.
I do so every time I advocate freedom, liberty and justice; or so i thought. Perhaps name calling is how one "fully" supports America?

[Kathianne]

In all seriousness, there is a whiff of McCarthyism around here of late. I don't think it's intentional, seems to me that some believe just that 'everyone knows' that such and such is true, means they don't have to even attempt any justification, it just IS. Well truth is, others may disagree with your thinking. They might change their mind if you posted something to back it up or at least make is logical.

[aboutime]

I would love to see the US military call Iran's bluff


Though most all of us see Iran's threats again, as nothing more than the same sabre-rattle we've been seeing for years.

I hope AhmaDinnerJacket tries something to see how far he can go.
Yes. We would probably experience some dangerous results in harming Americans. But war, no matter how small, or short always causes injuries.
The difference is. Probably because I feel more confident than most Americans today. If Iran tries to follow through with their Threats to Close the Straits of Hormuz. And they attempt to use any kind of missiles directed at our ships, or those of Nato members.
That Huge Number of NEW Walmart Parking lots will eventually show up on GOOGLE EARTH.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

In all seriousness, there is a whiff of McCarthyism around here of late. I don't think it's intentional, seems to me that some believe just that 'everyone knows' that such and such is true, means they don't have to even attempt any justification, it just IS. Well truth is, others may disagree with your thinking. They might change their mind if you posted something to back it up or at least make is logical.

Evem McCarthy wasnt completely wrong. Look here 60 years later and we see evidence of that . Each man's truth is his own and sometimes defending said truth against the same ole tired and ridiculous claims puts those of us that have done so for many years on edge because of the silliness of the deniers. Tempers flair and people tend to post the short and sweet of it without bothering to try to prove the obvious. The problem with some dem/liberals and most all socialists is that they tend to totally reject or simply IGNORE the truth when it is submitted and many then say why post it? As regard to history some of us dont bother to post links to WELL KNOWN historic facts, tending to think even the opposition here already knows such facts. I now see that assumption is quite wrong. Many libside posters here are as ignorant of American and World history as I am of brain surgery! I've participated on many message boards/political forums for many years and I am currently on four now! This making the conservative jump thru hundreds of hoops gets tiring as hell and many of us refuse to play that game. For we tend to give our opposition no such numerous demands but our opposition wants everything in triplicate , double stamped and verified by at least 4 or 5 independent sources/voices, even then when such is given they ignore or deny it all.. This is done to show utter contempt for the conservative's poster's own written opinion. Myself, I've decided to do the minimium jumping simply because I refuse to be pissed on by elitist azzhats that speak so deeply from a position of desperate ignorance! If that rates me as a lone and low intelligent being so be it. I'm not here to prove my intelligence is above that of everybody else here or anything other than the TRUTH stands on its own despite the world's cry otherwise. I need nobody's approval of how I cite the TRUTH! I never need the blessing of and instructions given by those that so rigidly hate and refuse the TRUTH. We have a few such people here although admittedly less than at other sites I've joined and participated at...
I tell a lib that water is wet. They attempt to force me to prove it at least a dozen different ways. When I refuse to do so they either declare some kind of victory or start a chorus the condemnation of my refusal. This method lets them ignore the points made in the post and turn it into a judgement of my honesty.
THEY DONT LIKE MY TRUTH LET THEM PROVE IT FALSE! NOT GET BY WITH DEMANDING that I jump thru a dozen hoops and prove it ten ways from Sunday.
Ever notice that in their butt rubbing , self congratulating posts to each other reinforcing previous posted views or accusations that most contentions are a given and never asked to be proven with links and duplicated evidence , etc? -Tyr

edit, rant over....

[mundame]

Though most all of us see Iran's threats again, as nothing more than the same sabre-rattle we've been seeing for years.



Sure ---- that's the thing. It's all nonsense, in a way ---------- if they close the Gulf, we will squash them. We certainly squashed Saddam, twice. There's no use having a Navy if we can't protect our oil that we need, so that's that.


Except that I do worry that we are letting Iran get nukes. And THEN, will it be "only" saber-rattling? Because people always mean what they say.......Hitler did, Saddam did, Osama did, and what Iran is saying is that they want to OBLITERATE us or Israel. I take them at their word, and I question whether it's a great idea letting them go on and on working to perfect their nuclear weapons.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Sure ---- that's the thing. It's all nonsense, in a way ---------- if they close the Gulf, we will squash them. We certainly squashed Saddam, twice. There's no use having a Navy if we can't protect our oil that we need, so that's that.


Except that I do worry that we are letting Iran get nukes. And THEN, will it be "only" saber-rattling? Because people always mean what they say.......Hitler did, Saddam did, Osama did, and what Iran is saying is that they want to OBLITERATE us or Israel. I take them at their word, and I question whether it's a great idea letting them go on and on working to perfect their nuclear weapons.

Hitler was ignored and part of the reason the war 's ultimate victory was so close was because of the great headstart he was allowed. Iran should not be allowed that long headstart and too late is just that too late!
A nuke hitting USA or Israel is just that= too late. -Tyr

[Kathianne]

Hitler was ignored and part of the reason the war 's ultimate victory was so close was because of the great headstart he was allowed. Iran should not be allowed that long headstart and too late is just that too late!
A nuke hitting USA or Israel is just that= too late. -Tyr

Pre-emptively hitting them, without provable just cause? Recipe for disaster.

We've been there and done that. Not only t-shirts, but graves and finding ourselves in a worse place than we started from.

This discussion should be for expansion of humint over drones and satellites, but Washington doesn't want to go there.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Pre-emptively hitting them, without provable just cause? Recipe for disaster.

We've been there and done that. Not only t-shirts, but graves and finding ourselves in a worse place than we started from.

This discussion should be for expansion of humint over drones and satellites, but Washington doesn't want to go there.

Ignoring it until it is too late often has serious and deadly consequences too. World War 2 is a good example of ignoring it until its too late IMHO. Chamberlain's mistake highlights that well enough in my opinion. Look at how many millions died as a result of early preventative actions not being taken...Had Germany been miltarily countered early on they would have stopped and tried to keep the early territory gained rather than risk that which they had so easily won!
As noted , after Iran gets the nukes it is too late. They will refuse any demands we make and use them when they get good and ready to do so. Idly waiting does nothing and neither will the sanctions. War should be entered into as a last option. They are clearly forcing that last option IMO.--Tyr

[Kathianne]

Ignoring it until it is too late often has serious and deadly consequences too. World War 2 is a good example of ignoring it until its too late IMHO. Chamberlain's mistake highlights that well enough in my opinion. Look at how many millions died as a result of early preventative actions not being taken...Had Germany been miltarily countered early on they would have stopped and tried to keep the early territory gained rather than risk that which they had so easily won!
As noted , after Iran gets the nukes it is too late. They will refuse any demands we make and use them when they get good and ready to do so. Idly waiting does nothing and neither will the sanctions. War should be entered into as a last option. They are clearly forcing that last option IMO.--Tyr

The failure is diplomatic, aka Obama admin. They should be pressuring UN, sanctions are not working.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

The failure is diplomatic, aka Obama admin. They should be pressuring UN, sanctions are not working.

UN will prove no great decider in this matter. Iran only cares about it's agenda. They are religious fanatics so the wants and desires of infidels or infidel regimes/nations/bodies means exactly zero to them. That agenda doesn't give a damn about anything but the advancement and ultimate control Iran wants over the region and eventually the world. For Allah must be obeyed and the crazy mullahs care only about Allah!-Tyr

[jafar00]

I suspect Israel will put an end to this bullshit long before Obama even makes up his mind to call/not call Little Adolf in iran and say "pretty please" do not block our oil

Bring it on. I want Israel to attack Iran. It will hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state.


If we can pinpoint them and only take out achminiaheajadhijihad, and a few clerics and mullahs, then it would be a good thing... :slap:

Sure. That worked out well when you went after Osama :p


So you are cool with Little Adolf - who has vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the map, said the Holocaust never happened - have nukes

LR you sound so much like Neville Chamberlain when he was dealing with Hitler in the late 1930's

1) He didn't threaten to "wipe Israel from the map"
2) The right to disagree with the holocaust version we have been fed should be a right that you defend
3) Provide proof Iran has, could have, wants, is working towards getting nukes.


and do not forget the UN

Libs and dictators love to use the UN to solve "problems"

http://www.thoseshirts.com/images/imaoun500.gif

#8 was written for Israel


http://www.thoseshirts.com/images/square-large-forecast-back.gif

I thought we were talking about Iran? Now you want to nuke Saudi Arabia too?



I hope AhmaDinnerJacket tries something to see how far he can go.


What is it with you people and your infantile name calling? Ahmedinejad is his name. It's hard to take you seriously while you are sitting in the sandpit at kindergarten.


Hitler was ignored and part of the reason the war 's ultimate victory was so close was because of the great headstart he was allowed. Iran should not be allowed that long headstart and too late is just that too late!
A nuke hitting USA or Israel is just that= too late. -Tyr

Pre-emptive warfare without provocation and without evidence of a threat of imminent attack is a violation of the UN charter and a crime against humanity. Do you want to go down in history as a nation of cold blooded murderers worse than Hitler?

[jimnyc]

Sure. That worked out well when you went after Osama :p

What would me wanting Achm.. whatever his stupid name is, what does me desiring to see him taken out, and a few other of the nutsos at the top - have to do with Osama? Or are you implying that the Iranian leader and the top clerics and ayatollah are terrorists too?

But as to Osama, another bunch of fucked up countries leaders wouldn't help us and preferred war instead of helping hand over a madman and mass murderer. I can see a relation between the Taliban and the idiots in Iran. And I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if every last one of them was on a morgue slab come morning time.

[jimnyc]

What is it with you people and your infantile name calling? Ahmedinejad is his name. It's hard to take you seriously while you are sitting in the sandpit at kindergarten.

Some people aren't worthy of learning the spelling, or giving them any respect at all. I prefer to call him whatever comes close enough at the time. Besides, it's funny to laugh at a dickhead who thinks he is all powerful when in reality he doesn't amount to jack shit.

[aboutime]

If you are insulted when we talk about the guy you seem to admire, and love so much. What'shisname Achmadinnerjacket will probably welcome you with open arms to his next Western Beheading...in your name.
How proud will you be then?

Otherwise. As I said above. YOU do have a choice here.
If you dislike how we address your Beloved Savior, and fellow Jew Hater extraordinaire. YOU SHOULD either Ignore us, or GO SOME WHERE where somebody GIVES A FLYIN....PILE OF PIGMEAT.

[Drummond]

.. Thumbing back to post #65, from 'jafar00' ... this is about Iran threatening 'to wipe Israel off the map'.


Did they? The only time I have ever seen them threaten Israel is in retaliation IF Israel attacks them. Iran does have a right to defend themselves right?

For your information .. Iran has been threatening Israel AGAIN ...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/01/us-iran-idUSBRE8600HG20120701


(Reuters) - Iran announced missile tests on Sunday and threatened to wipe Israel "off the face of the earth" if the Jewish state attacked it, brandishing some of its starkest threats on the day Europe began enforcing an oil embargo and harsh new sanctions.

The European sanctions - including a ban on imports of Iranian oil by EU states and measures that make it difficult for other countries to trade with Iran - were enacted earlier this year but mainly came into effect on July 1.

They are designed to break Iran's economy and force it to curb nuclear work that Western countries say is aimed at producing an atomic weapon. Reporting by Reuters has shown in recent months that the sanctions have already had a significant effect on Iran's economy.

Israel says it could attack Iran if diplomacy fails to force Tehran to abandon its nuclear aims. The United States also says military force is on the table as a last resort, but U.S. officials have repeatedly encouraged the Israelis to be patient while new sanctions take effect.

Announcing three days of missile tests in the coming week, Revolutionary Guards General Amir Ali Hajizadeh said the exercises should be seen as a message "that the Islamic Republic of Iran is resolute in standing up to ... bullying, and will respond to any possible evil decisively and strongly."

Any attack on Iran by Israel would be answered resolutely: "If they take any action, they will hand us an excuse to wipe them off the face of the earth," said Hajizadeh, head of the Guards' airborne division, according to state news agency IRNA.

It's clear, isn't it, that Iran likes to play the 'victim', saying that their actions, if taken, would be in defence against Israel's first strike. BUT, note the wording in red from the quote. This says .. 'they will hand us an excuse to wipe them off the face of the earth'.

.. They're waiting for AN EXCUSE to do that ?? Belligerent talk, aggressive talk. These are the words, I submit, of AN AGGRESSOR.

And consider the scope of the threatened so-called 'retaliation', anyway. A threat of genocide is NOT, repeat, NOT, any form of 'defensive' action !!


Name one country that Iran has attacked on the offensive in the last say, 100 years.

Interesting that you set an entire century for that .. a century that has seen not one form of regime during that time, but something of a spectrum of them.

But your question is hard to answer as it stands, as you haven't provided clear context for it. Are you limiting that to a 'head to head' confrontation between Nation States ? OR, do you refer to Iran's covert actions in sponsoring and arming terrorist groupings who in turn are 'pleased' to attack Israel, for example ?

Don't forget that Iran is known to be the world's biggest sponsor of terrorism !!

If you have in mind the 'covert, behind-the scenes' machinations I refer to, well .. I've already named Israel. You know, that so-called 'belligerent aggressor' YOU suggest that Iran has a right to defend itself FROM.

[Drummond]

Ahmedinejad didn't threaten to wipe Israel off the map. If you recall he said the zionist regime will vanish from the pages of time which is a completely different sentence.

I don't find this very convincing.

One mistranslation is perhaps understandable. But Ahmadinejad made his threat a NUMBER of times. To suppose that mistranslations kept on happening, time after time, is really pushing the bounds of credibility to snapping-point .. isn't it ?

I seem to recall UN delegates walking out on an Ahmadinejad speech in protest at those threats. Did they ALL get it wrong ??


As for the holocaust, he is entitled to an opinion and has the right to also voice that opinion does he not?

Arguable at absolute best. When does an opinion cease to be one ? When it's known to be a lie ?

And here's the thing about Ahmadinejad and his offensive statements .. whether he's issuing a series of genocidal threats that Hitler would've applauded, or whether he's issuing a massive and cruelly insulting lie against the memory of one of the worst crimes against humanity this planet has ever witnessed .. he KEEPS FINDING WAYS OF GOADING ISRAEL. Now .. are these the actions of a 'victim', or are they instead the product of racist bigotry of the very worst kind, and characteristic of especially disgusting AGGRESSION ?


Hezbullah, have attacked Israel in response to Israel's attacks on Lebanon. The Lebanese have the right to defend themselves against aggression.

And where does terrorism fit into all this ? Or aren't Hezbollah a terrorist organisation, all of a sudden ??


The ole' secret sleeper cells thing went out with the war on terror when Al Qaeda was supposed to have dozens of sleeper cells hiding under our beds waiting to strike. I'm guessing they a) Don't exist and never did or b) are still asleep.

Guess away. And keep getting it wrong ...

Here's where I can actually provide you with some clear proof you're wrong, that just happens to have been covered in an article in Wednesday's 'Independent' newspaper (a British publication) ...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/iranian-agents-arrested-in-kenya-were-looking-for-foreign-targets-7906819.html?origin=internalSearch


The cold war between Israel and Iran appears to have spilled into East Africa after two alleged Iranian agents arrested in Kenya on suspicion of plotting bomb attacks were claimed to have been targeting foreign interests, including the British High Commission.

Prior to their arrest on 19 June, the suspects had toured sites including the Israeli embassy in Nairobi and a golf course in the coastal city of Mombasa, as well as the British High Commission, according to Kenyan police sources.

Believed to be members of Iran's secretive al-Quds corps, Ahmad Abolfathi Mohammad and Sayed Mansour Mousavi subsequently led authorities to a cache of high explosives.

The two men have been charged with illegal possession of 15 kilograms of RDX, a chemical previously used in the 2006 Mumbai train bombings and 2010 Moscow metro attacks. They are due back in court in the Kenyan capital Nairobi later this month.

Point taken ? 'Al-Quds', acting as a terrorist cell would, was certainly active quite recently, judging by this report. Either the story's a fabrication, or, you're completely WRONG.

[mundame]

Belligerent talk, aggressive talk. These are the words, I submit, of AN AGGRESSOR.

And consider the scope of the threatened so-called 'retaliation', anyway. A threat of genocide is NOT, repeat, NOT, any form of 'defensive' action !





Right, that's the thing. If we haven't learned by now that it's a bad, bad idea to suppose people somehow don't mean what they say, that just means we missed the 20th century.

I'm getting concerned about Iran. If they DO "wipe Israel off the face of the map," it would plunge a lot of the world into war. (Whereas Israel hitting Iran wouldn't matter, anymore than it mattered when Israel hit Iraq or Syria and knocked all their nukes out.)

I think our pols are going to let Iran get the bomb, and that will be extremely destabilizing, because they do not seem to be rational actors, anymore than Hitler was. It is entirely possible, I suspect, that the Iranian clergy running the country is just crazy enough to decide the destruction of Iran is a good exchange for some crazy, imaginary religious goal of their own.

What they SAY is crazy, and so I don't know why we suppose these are rational actors who can be "trusted" with an atom bomb.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

Bring it on. I want Israel to attack Iran. It will hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state.



Sure. That worked out well when you went after Osama :p



1) He didn't threaten to "wipe Israel from the map"
2) The right to disagree with the holocaust version we have been fed should be a right that you defend
3) Provide proof Iran has, could have, wants, is working towards getting nukes.



#8 was written for Israel



I thought we were talking about Iran? Now you want to nuke Saudi Arabia too?



What is it with you people and your infantile name calling? Ahmedinejad is his name. It's hard to take you seriously while you are sitting in the sandpit at kindergarten.



Pre-emptive warfare without provocation and without evidence of a threat of imminent attack is a violation of the UN charter and a crime against humanity. Do you want to go down in history as a nation of cold blooded murderers worse than Hitler?

On your bolded in your post. Who stated hitting without provocation? I deem their words and actions as provocating enough already. Certainly their history of funding Terrorist groups points towards their hatred of all that is not of the Islamic faith. Should we strike or Israel and USA strike it will not go down as anything even remotely comparable to Hitler's brutal and murderous regime that caused the deaths of millions!-Tyr

[jafar00]

What would me wanting Achm.. whatever his stupid name is, what does me desiring to see him taken out, and a few other of the nutsos at the top - have to do with Osama? Or are you implying that the Iranian leader and the top clerics and ayatollah are terrorists too?

But as to Osama, another bunch of fucked up countries leaders wouldn't help us and preferred war instead of helping hand over a madman and mass murderer. I can see a relation between the Taliban and the idiots in Iran. And I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if every last one of them was on a morgue slab come morning time.

I'm talking about your track record of going after one guy. It took ten years of war and two countries laid waste to get him, and he wasn't even in the two countries you attacked.


If you are insulted when we talk about the guy you seem to admire, and love so much. What'shisname Achmadinnerjacket will probably welcome you with open arms to his next Western Beheading...in your name.
How proud will you be then?

Otherwise. As I said above. YOU do have a choice here.
If you dislike how we address your Beloved Savior, and fellow Jew Hater extraordinaire. YOU SHOULD either Ignore us, or GO SOME WHERE where somebody GIVES A FLYIN....PILE OF PIGMEAT.

I don't love Ahmedinejad any more than you do. Nor do I care much for Shiaism being a Sunni Muslim myself. But when I am discussing something important I do like to at least try to get the name right. I always said "Bush" instead of Chimpy or Tony Blair instead of Tony Bliar. Al Qaeda instead of Al CIAdah.


.. Thumbing back to post #65, from 'jafar00' ... this is about Iran threatening 'to wipe Israel off the map'.



For your information .. Iran has been threatening Israel AGAIN ...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/01/us-iran-idUSBRE8600HG20120701
Did you choose to ignore the "if the Jewish state attacked it" bit? Doesn't Iran have the right to retaliate if it is attacked?



Don't forget that Iran is known to be the world's biggest sponsor of terrorism !!


What do you say of US support of listed terrorist organisations such as Jundullah for terrorist attacks inside Iran?

The US cannot criticise anyone for rewarding terrorism. Iyad Allawi blew up a bus full of school children, and you made him PM of Iraq after Saddam was removed.


I don't find this very convincing.

One mistranslation is perhaps understandable. But Ahmadinejad made his threat a NUMBER of times. To suppose that mistranslations kept on happening, time after time, is really pushing the bounds of credibility to snapping-point .. isn't it ?

I seem to recall UN delegates walking out on an Ahmadinejad speech in protest at those threats. Did they ALL get it wrong ??

Threats of retaliation are not threats.

If I tell you that if you punch me face, I will stab you, will you still punch me in the face? Would you still threaten to punch me then also criticise me for wanting to stab you in return but only if you punch me first?

There is a simple way to deal with Iran. Don't attack them.


I think our pols are going to let Iran get the bomb,

You would be waiting a long time. Where is the evidence they are trying to build one?



On your bolded in your post. Who stated hitting without provocation? I deem their words and actions as provocating enough already. Certainly their history of funding Terrorist groups points towards their hatred of all that is not of the Islamic faith. Should we strike or Israel and USA strike it will not go down as anything even remotely comparable to Hitler's brutal and murderous regime that caused the deaths of millions!-Tyr

The US has already killed millions in the last decade in wars based on dubious claims. Iran's threats have only come in response to threats from Israel and the US.

[Tyr-Ziu Saxnot]

[QUOTE=jafar00;563356]I'm talking about your track record of going after one guy. It took ten years of war and two countries laid waste to get him, and he wasn't even in the two countries you attacked.



I don't love Ahmedinejad any more than you do. Nor do I care much for Shiaism being a Sunni Muslim myself. But when I am discussing something important I do like to at least try to get the name right. I always said "Bush" instead of Chimpy or Tony Blair instead of Tony Bliar. Al Qaeda instead of Al CIAdah.


Did you choose to ignore the "if the Jewish state attacked it" bit? Doesn't Iran have the right to retaliate if it is attacked?

Does Israel have to wait until its too late? Until after they are nuked to respond? Or do they have a right to act on a very real threat by not waiting until after a few hundred thousand of their citizens are vaporised by a nuke? I'M sure the citizens would prefer not to be the victims allowed to die just to prove how "fair" Israel is! -Tyr

How about a link proving USA has killed millions in the last decade in wars based upon dubious claims?

[jafar00]

Does Israel have to wait until its too late? Until after they are nuked to respond? Or do they have a right to act on a very real threat by not waiting until after a few hundred thousand of their citizens are vaporised by a nuke? I'M sure the citizens would prefer not to be the victims allowed to die just to prove how "fair" Israel is! -Tyr

Isn't that being a little freaking nuts? There isn't a shred of evidence that Iran has a nuclear weapons program. If they aren't working towards getting a nuke, no nukes from Iran are ever going to fall in Israel.

By the same logic, shouldn't Iran be trying to get a nuke anyway to attack the US or Israel to pre-emptively stop threatened attacks?

There is a big difference here. The US and Israel are threatening pre-emptive attacks and Iran isn't. Who are the crazy ones?


How about a link proving USA has killed millions in the last decade in wars based upon dubious claims?

There isn't one link. Are you telling me Afghanistan and Iraq were not invaded and occupied during the last decade or does that not count?

[jimnyc]

I'm talking about your track record of going after one guy. It took ten years of war and two countries laid waste to get him, and he wasn't even in the two countries you attacked.

Only one country was about Osama Bin Laden. But in case you forgot, war is about killing the enemy. Last time I checked, there were a couple hundred thousand dead cockroaches to about 5,000 US troops, and when the dust settled, Seal Team 6 was dropping the carcass of OBL into the ocean.

But anyway, my original point was about "pinpointing" a few leaders as OPPOSED to full scale war, so I'm still baffled at your comparison.


Did you choose to ignore the "if the Jewish state attacked it" bit? Doesn't Iran have the right to retaliate if it is attacked?

Threats of retaliation are not threats.

You sure do cherry pick what you would like to reply to. Why did you cut out Iran's latest threat to wipe Israel off the face of the Earth, and not so much as retaliation, but as an EXCUSE. That means they want to already. No "legitimate" country in the world goes around telling others that they want to wipe them from the Earth, and asking for excuses to do so.

[aboutime]

[/B]

On your bolded in your post. Who stated hitting without provocation? I deem their words and actions as provocating enough already. Certainly their history of funding Terrorist groups points towards their hatred of all that is not of the Islamic faith. Should we strike or Israel and USA strike it will not go down as anything even remotely comparable to Hitler's brutal and murderous regime that caused the deaths of millions!-Tyr
Since we now know. Jafar hates Israel, and Jews so much. Why should any of us expect to hear, or read about the Palistinian Rocket Attacks that take place against Israel, almost every day.
I like the foolish, intentional reference to Hitting without Provocation.
Almost sounds like An Obama Writer is speaking for Jafar. Propaganda 101 just never seems to succeed...beyond the Wildest Dreams of some.

[jafar00]

Only one country was about Osama Bin Laden. But in case you forgot, war is about killing the enemy. Last time I checked, there were a couple hundred thousand dead cockroaches to about 5,000 US troops, and when the dust settled, Seal Team 6 was dropping the carcass of OBL into the ocean.

Cockroaches?!? How racist is that?


But anyway, my original point was about "pinpointing" a few leaders as OPPOSED to full scale war, so I'm still baffled at your comparison.

To pinpoint a leader, you need boots on the ground.


You sure do cherry pick what you would like to reply to. Why did you cut out Iran's latest threat to wipe Israel off the face of the Earth, and not so much as retaliation, but as an EXCUSE. That means they want to already. No "legitimate" country in the world goes around telling others that they want to wipe them from the Earth, and asking for excuses to do so.

Are US and Israeli threats against Iran legitimate considering the fact that there is no evidence to support the idea that they are building a bomb?

If I was the leader of Australia and another country was threatening me like that, I would also be threatening swift and decisive retaliation if attacked.

I keep asking for evidence that Iran is building a bomb. I hear crickets.


Since we now know. Jafar hates Israel, and Jews so much. Why should any of us expect to hear, or read about the Palistinian Rocket Attacks that take place against Israel, almost every day.


Where did you get that I hate Jews? My lawyer is Jewish. I have Jewish employees.

[aboutime]

Cockroaches?!? How racist is that?



To pinpoint a leader, you need boots on the ground.



Are US and Israeli threats against Iran legitimate considering the fact that there is no evidence to support the idea that they are building a bomb?

If I was the leader of Australia and another country was threatening me like that, I would also be threatening swift and decisive retaliation if attacked.

I keep asking for evidence that Iran is building a bomb. I hear crickets.



Where did you get that I hate Jews? My lawyer is Jewish. I have Jewish employees.

Jafar. No, that line does not, and will not work here.
It sounds strangely like a line people like ARCHIE BUNKER...of American Fame used to use, when everyone knew he was a bigot, and racist by always saying 'I work with people like that, and they're some of my best friends (in person, but I hate them otherwise).
So Jafar.
Investigate what the meaning of 'Falling off the turnip truck' is. And keep telling yourself you hope....WE will believe your hypocrisy, disguised as a Kind-hearted Racist.

[jimnyc]

Cockroaches?!? How racist is that?

That's all I see 99% of them as, and not because of their race.


To pinpoint a leader, you need boots on the ground.

Yes, as in pinpointing. Was what Seal Team 6 did in Pakistan a full scale war?


Are US and Israeli threats against Iran legitimate considering the fact that there is no evidence to support the idea that they are building a bomb?

If I was the leader of Australia and another country was threatening me like that, I would also be threatening swift and decisive retaliation if attacked.


Amazing how you completely overlook the fact that Iran is looking for an excuse to wipe out an entire nation. Honestly, I hope they try, so I can see the suffering come back to them ten fold.

[jimnyc]

I keep asking for evidence that Iran is building a bomb. I hear crickets.

Then why don't they cooperate with international inspectors? Why do they play little games, reminiscent of Saddam Hussein? Why have spys and defectors claim they are seeking detonators and other such components of a nuclear bomb?


Documents and other records provide new details on the role played by a former Soviet weapons scientist who allegedly tutored Iranians over several years on building high-precision detonators of the kind used to trigger a nuclear chain reaction, the officials and experts said. Crucial technology linked to experts in Pakistan and North Korea also helped propel Iran to the threshold of nuclear capability, they added.

The officials, citing secret intelligence provided over several years to the International Atomic Energy Agency, said the records reinforce concerns that Iran continued to conduct weapons-related research after 2003 — when, U.S. intelligence agencies believe, Iranian leaders halted such experiments in response to international and domestic pressures.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/iaea-says-foreign-expertise-has-brought-iran-to-threshold-of-nuclear-capability/2011/11/05/gIQAc6hjtM_story.html


In the most critical and damning report of Iran’s nuclear program to date, the International Atomic Energy Agency said Tuesday that the Islamic Republic was working to develop a nuclear-weapon design and was conducting extensive research and tests that could only be relevant for such a weapon.

“The agency has serious concerns regarding possible military dimensions to Iran’s nuclear program,” the IAEA said in the report, which included a 13-page annex with key technical descriptions of its research. “The information indicates that Iran has carried out activities relevant to the development of a nuclear explosive device.”

http://www.jpost.com/IranianThreat/News/Article.aspx?id=244833

[jimnyc]

Here's another. The IAEA says they have solid evidence that Iran has tested a detonator. What purpose would a detonator have in peaceful nuclear plants?


Iran has tested detonators for a nuclear bomb, Sueddeutsche Zeitung reported in an e-mailed preview of an article to be published today,

The newspaper added that the International Atomic Energy Agency had solid evidence that the attempt was made in a blast chamber at Parchin, the newspaper said, citing an unidentified Western intelligence service official.

Agency inspectors want access to the Parchin base to determine the possible military dimensions of the tests, the newspaper added.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-04-13/iran-tested-nuclear-bomb-detonator-sueddeutsche-zeitung-reports.html



Iran 'trying to remove evidence that it tested detonators for nuclear weapons'Iran is trying to remove evidence that its scientists tested detonators for nuclear weapons by clearing a military site ahead of a visit by inspectors, according to the International Atomic Energy Agency.

Satellite photographs show the appearance of earth-moving vehicles and haulage lorries at Parchin, a military base where the IAEA said in its last report that Iranian scientists had experimented with a device that could only be used in the detonation system of a nuclear bomb.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/9130082/Iran-trying-to-remove-evidence-that-it-tested-detonators-for-nuclear-weapons.html

[jimnyc]

Here's another, with a link to official reports. This is from the IAEA...


The UN's nuclear watchdog says it has information indicating Iran has carried out tests "relevant to the development of a nuclear explosive device".

In its latest report on Iran, the IAEA says the research includes computer models that could only be used to develop a nuclear bomb trigger.

Correspondents say this is the International Atomic Energy Agency's toughest report on Iran to date.

The report highlights:


Work on fast-acting detonators that have "possible application in a nuclear explosive device, and... limited civilian and conventional military applications".

Tests of the detonators consistent with simulating the explosion of a nuclear device

"The acquisition of nuclear weapons development information and documentation from a clandestine nuclear supply network."

"Work on the development of an indigenous design of a nuclear weapon including the testing of components."

It says the information is "credible", and comes from some of the IAEA's 35 member states, from its own research and from Iran itself.

The report urges Iran "to engage substantively with the agency without delay for the purpose of providing clarifications."

And of course they fight with the IAEA about access and clarifications.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-15643460

Good reading on the original document for anyone interested:

http://isis-online.org/uploads/isis-reports/documents/IAEA_Iran_8Nov2011.pdf

[fj1200]

Investigate what the meaning of 'Falling off the turnip truck' is. And keep telling yourself you hope....WE will believe your hypocrisy, disguised as a Kind-hearted Racist.

Keep your "WE" to yourself. I can, but won't, count others here who do the same thing.

[jafar00]

Then why don't they cooperate with international inspectors? Why do they play little games, reminiscent of Saddam Hussein? Why have spys and defectors claim they are seeking detonators and other such components of a nuclear bomb?



http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/iaea-says-foreign-expertise-has-brought-iran-to-threshold-of-nuclear-capability/2011/11/05/gIQAc6hjtM_story.html



http://www.jpost.com/IranianThreat/News/Article.aspx?id=244833

So far there is only suspicion that Iran may or may not have conducted experiments at parchin. We will not know the result of the inspections of parchin. There is also the fact that much of the suspicion comes from outside of Iran. Even the opening paragraph of your jpost link says that much of the information came from Israel. That alone is enough to dismiss it, however in the interests of completeness and professionalism, the IAEA must investigate.
http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Documents/Board/2012/gov2012-23.pdf


Iran has not enriched Uranium above 20% which is what is required for fuel according to the IAEA and is well short of the 90% needed for a weapon. If they do start enriching further, then there might be a reason for action, but until that time there is no reason to threaten Iran with pre-emptive strikes.

[jafar00]

Jafar. No, that line does not, and will not work here.
It sounds strangely like a line people like ARCHIE BUNKER...of American Fame used to use, when everyone knew he was a bigot, and racist by always saying 'I work with people like that, and they're some of my best friends (in person, but I hate them otherwise).
So Jafar.
Investigate what the meaning of 'Falling off the turnip truck' is. And keep telling yourself you hope....WE will believe your hypocrisy, disguised as a Kind-hearted Racist.

Excuse me if I ignore your pathetic attempt at insulting me.


That's all I see 99% of them as, and not because of their race.

Then what makes you see people as cockroaches? Crack?

[jimnyc]

So far there is only suspicion that Iran may or may not have conducted experiments at parchin. We will not know the result of the inspections of parchin. There is also the fact that much of the suspicion comes from outside of Iran. Even the opening paragraph of your jpost link says that much of the information came from Israel. That alone is enough to dismiss it, however in the interests of completeness and professionalism, the IAEA must investigate.
http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Documents/Board/2012/gov2012-23.pdf


Iran has not enriched Uranium above 20% which is what is required for fuel according to the IAEA and is well short of the 90% needed for a weapon. If they do start enriching further, then there might be a reason for action, but until that time there is no reason to threaten Iran with pre-emptive strikes.

You think it's enough to dismiss it when the IAEA themselves have this stuff in their reports? It's hard for them to investigate properly when Iran is uncooperative. They claim they'll cooperate once sanctions are lifted... doesn't work that way.

[jimnyc]

Then what makes you see people as cockroaches? Crack?

I see scum as cockroaches. We completely annihilated 2 separate countries in a war, and you act as if we lost. Sore loser. :lol:

[mundame]

Of course Iran is building a nuclear bomb: that's what all this is about. If Iran weren't trying to build its own nukes, like Syria and Iraq tried before it, there wouldn't be all these underground centrifuges, all the sanctions, all the rocket testing, all the threats to destroy pretty much everyone they can think of.

I am concerned we are just going to let them do that --- sanctions have never worked, after all.

On the other hand, I do believe everyone means what they say, or they wouldn't say it. Iran keeps constantly talking about obliterating the USA and Israel, but our government ALSO has said we won't let Iran get the bomb. Maybe we mean it; I don't actually have much hope.

What tends to happen is that people hope and hope and deny and deny until there is actually a war starting by the aggressor who has given full and continual warning of his intentions, so that would be what I really expect.

[jimnyc]

Of course Iran is building a nuclear bomb: that's what all this is about. If Iran weren't trying to build its own nukes, like Syria and Iraq tried before it, there wouldn't be all these underground centrifuges, all the sanctions, all the rocket testing, all the threats to destroy pretty much everyone they can think of.

I am concerned we are just going to let them do that --- sanctions have never worked, after all.

On the other hand, I do believe everyone means what they say, or they wouldn't say it. Iran keeps constantly talking about obliterating the USA and Israel, but our government ALSO has said we won't let Iran get the bomb. Maybe we mean it; I don't actually have much hope.

What tends to happen is that people hope and hope and deny and deny until there is actually a war starting by the aggressor who has given full and continual warning of his intentions, so that would be what I really expect.

If they're not building weapons, they should just let the IAEA in there to verify, and follow up, and ensure the international community of what their intentions are. They apparently CHOOSE not to cooperate, and get sanctions instead. Even Jafar has stated that they must investigate, but Iran chooses a different route. Then when negative things happen, it'll be someone else's fault, like Israel, or the US, or the UK, or... anybody but those who refuse to properly cooperate.

[mundame]

If they're not building weapons, they should just let the IAEA in there to verify, and follow up, and ensure the international community of what their intentions are. They apparently CHOOSE not to cooperate, and get sanctions instead. Even Jafar has stated that they must investigate, but Iran chooses a different route. Then when negative things happen, it'll be someone else's fault, like Israel, or the US, or the UK, or... anybody but those who refuse to properly cooperate.


Muslim aggression is astounding, and to me it's just as astounding that so many Westerners are afraid to recognize it as what it is.

We went through all this before, with German aggression before WWI and WWII, and here it comes again. People try to pretend it away, deny it away.

Then the aggressors start a war.

[aboutime]

Excuse me if I ignore your pathetic attempt at insulting me.



Then what makes you see people as cockroaches? Crack?

Nobody can, or should stoop to Excusing you. It was not an attempt to insult you. The truth is normally pathetic to those who so easily deny it.

[Kathianne]

Muslim aggression is astounding, and to me it's just as astounding that so many Westerners are afraid to recognize it as what it is.

We went through all this before, with German aggression before WWI and WWII, and here it comes again. People try to pretend it away, deny it away.

Then the aggressors start a war.

I agree that most Muslims are not terrorists. What has disturbed me though since they began polling in these regions is the majorities that 'understand' where the terrorists are coming from. They support the terrorists, perhaps unknowingly.

[jimnyc]

I agree that most Muslims are not terrorists. What has disturbed me though since they began polling in these regions is the majorities that 'understand' where the terrorists are coming from. They support the terrorists, perhaps unknowingly.

And many knowingly support them. Some were furious when OBL was taken out. He was seen as a "leader" by many. Others responded similarly when other leaders of Al Qaeda were killed. We have a cockroach who helped in the planning of the first WTC bombing in 1993, he's jailed for life in the US. Not only do many adore him in Egypt, they are looking to have him released now that the "brotherhood" has taken over.

[Drummond]

Bring it on. I want Israel to attack Iran. It will hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state.

Just thought I'd highlight this little offering from you, 'jafar00'.

You want Israel to attack Iran, to 'hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state' .. YOUR WORDS.

Iran, for its part, has made it clear it wants 'an excuse' to attack Israel (as I've already illustrated).

Can it be clearer ?

And where DOES all this come from, anyway ? Why do you welcome any hope for Israeli deaths ?

Some of us would've hoped that Hitler's Holocaust could have shown the world that Jews had suffered enough, that there should be no more of ANY of this.

But - - au contraire ... very evidently ... in 1948, and since.

Why can't a lesson be learned from this ? 'Jafar', would you care to explain ?

[jimnyc]

Just thought I'd highlight this little offering from you, 'jafar00'.

You want Israel to attack Iran, to 'hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state' .. YOUR WORDS.

Iran, for its part, has made it clear it wants 'an excuse' to attack Israel (as I've already illustrated).

Can it be clearer ?

And where DOES all this come from, anyway ? Why do you welcome any hope for Israeli deaths ?

Some of us would've hoped that Hitler's Holocaust could have shown the world that Jews had suffered enough, that there should be no more of ANY of this.

But - - au contraire ... very evidently ... in 1948, and since.

Why can't a lesson be learned from this ? 'Jafar', would you care to explain ?

Yep, he obviously wants Israel to disappear too, and will likely deny it just like Achmedinajihad. But it IS very clear that so many muslims would like to see Israel and it's citizens "wiped off the map", and then cry bloody murder when the international community has reservations about such nutjobs having access to nukes.

[aboutime]

I am pragmatic enough to know, and understand how unfair, and inhumane it is to group all people together. Much as many Americans do when it comes to Muslims.
I agree. It is wrong to do such things on a wide basis. Much like saying All Whites are Racists, and All Blacks are Victims.
We all know. Both of those statements are totally wrong.

But there is where I draw the line on our relationship to Muslims...here in our own nation. Who happily celebrated, and danced in the streets when they learned about 9-11.

I also cannot bring myself to just be easily appeased, when I recognize there are people living in this nation who HATE this nation, and have no second thoughts about the killing of American servicemen, and women who are fighting to allow them to Remain here in the U.S.A., and away from the terror they left behind in their own nations.
My oldest son will forever be a U.S. Marine, and during his tours in both Iraq, and Afghanistan. He experienced being targeted by members of a group who live here, and call their Religion Peaceful.
In fact. Many of us know. There are Muslim's now living in this nation who claim to be SCARED for their family back in their home nation. So they would rather remain silent, and allow the hatred to Fester here in the U.S.A. while pretending to Love being here.
Until that attitude is proven to have changed, to me, and countless other Americans. The ENEMY within is, and will remain. The Enemy.

[Drummond]

'Jafar', you argue a pro-Iranian position, and to say the least, an anti-Israeli one.

You would like to push the position that Iran has the 'right' to 'defend herself', but that at the same time, there's supposedly 'no proof' of Iran working towards a nuclear weapons capability.

Iran should be pleased at your support of that country.

But you nonetheless overlook what it doesn't please you to recognise.

One issue is the threat Iran repeatedly, publicly, made to 'wipe Israel off the map'. You've made your case to say this is a supposed 'mistranslation', but you don't explain how this 'mistranslation' KEPT ON happening, repeatedly. And for good reason, because as an explanation it borders on the ridiculous.

But in any case, Iran AGAIN threatened Israel, saying in the process that they wanted, were waiting for, AN EXCUSE to attack her. This is despite .. 'NOT' .. working towards a nuclear weapons capability ...

... supposedly .... (!!) ...

Let me add a couple of extra items into the mix, then, and you may well want to skate over these, as well, 'Jafar' ...

See this ...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/sep/25/iran-secret-underground-nuclear-plant

Perhaps you've 'forgotten' the case of the secret nuclear installation, kept hidden from the world FOR YEARS ?


The US, Britain and France issued a strongly worded ultimatum to Iran today after US officials disclosed the existence of a secret nuclear plant which the Iranian authorities have kept hidden from UN inspectors for years.

Days ahead of a showdown meeting with Iran in Geneva, Barack Obama demanded that the UN nuclear watchdog, the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) be allowed access to the plant, which is built inside a mountain near the ancient city of Qom, one of the holiest Shia cities.

Obama described the site, apparently a second Iranian facility for enriching uranium, as a "disturbing revelation". Iran denied it was clandestine and said it had informed the IAEA about the plant earlier this week.

Western leaders, increasingly exasperated at Iran's nuclear truculence, were little assuaged by Iran's belated admission of the site's existence, which appears to have come after Iran learned that western intelligence services were on to its secret establishment.

Iran denies it is pursuing a nuclear weapon and insists its programme is solely for the generation of electricity. But western experts question why a legitimate operation would need to be concealed in a facility in a clandestine, underground site.

I may have quoted selectively. Nonetheless, Iran ONLY admitted to this facility's existence after having kept it secret for YEARS. This doesn't come within a light year of supporting the notion that Iran has nothing to hide !!!!!

You may care (or not ?) to watch the video clip of Gordon Brown's statement. You may (or may not) wish to note the justice Brown and his fellow partners have on their side in speaking out against this secret installation.

Now, check THIS out ... a rather more recent concern ..

http://www.kesq.com/news/Inspection-at-Iran-nuclear-facility-finds-higher-level-traces-of-uranium-U-N-says/-/233092/14177420/-/a9pg9a/-/index.html


Inspectors found a high level of enriched uranium in Iran, a U.N. report said Friday, as world powers attempt to work to stop the country from developing the capacity for nuclear weapons.

The U.N.'s International Atomic Energy Agency asked Iran this month to explain the presence of particles of enrichment levels of up to 27%, found in an analysis of environmental samples taken in February at the Fordo fuel enrichment plant near the city of Qom.

The previous highest level had been 20%, typically used for hospital isotopes and research reactors, but is also seen as a shortcut toward the 90% enrichment required to build nuclear weapons.

Iran said in response that the production of such particles "above the target value" may happen for "technical reasons beyond the operator's control." The IAEA said it is "assessing Iran's explanation and has requested further details."

This development comes a day after Iran held nuclear talks in Baghdad with six nations: the United States, Britain, France, Russia, China and Germany. There had been no breakthrough in discussions.

Iran rejected calls to stop the high enrichment of uranium that can be used for weapons, while the international powers refused Tehran's demand for an immediate end to sanctions crippling its economy.

I don't know about you, but I find the Iranian response, as it was reported, to be pathetic. And note, particularly, that Iran REJECTED CALLS TO STOP THE HIGH ENRICHMENT OF URANIUM THAT CAN BE USED FOR WEAPONS. 'Jafar', explain THAT away as being consistent with a so-called 'peaceful' nuclear program !!!

Oh, and one other thing.

Iran wants a nuclear program just for power generation ? But, WHY ?? Iran is especially rich in oil reserves, and is a major world exporter of the stuff, so WHY does Iran see any need to find an alternative for oil for its power needs ? It must surely be decades away from needing to seek any alternative to oil for its needs.

You wait around for 'proof' that Iran wants to attack Israel with nukes, and is building the capability for it. The rest of us will see reality for what it is, heed all the warning signs, and reach the only reasonable conclusion possible.

[Kathianne]

Tried to rep, system wouldn't let me! :thumb:

[Nukeman]

Here's the funny thing that MOST forget about Achmedinjihad, and that is HE was one of the hostage takers of the US embassy in Iran. The hostages have sated emphatically that he was one of the idiots that did that. That my friends tells you the type of person we are dealing with and if "jafar" makes excuses for this piece of shit he's as pathetic as the other loser is!!! Just my 2 cents worth!!!

[aboutime]

Here's the funny thing that MOST forget about Achmedinjihad, and that is HE was one of the hostage takers of the US embassy in Iran. The hostages have sated emphatically that he was one of the idiots that did that. That my friends tells you the type of person we are dealing with and if "jafar" makes excuses for this piece of shit he's as pathetic as the other loser is!!! Just my 2 cents worth!!!


Nukeman. Most people today have no idea what took place back in 1979-80. In fact. Most of them probably weren't born yet, in many cases.
Thankfully though. Unlike Jafar. I have no need, nor will I ever find any reason to Defend Achmedinnerjacket. And I enjoy making fun of Little Brained, Dangerous men who need to throw their Little weight around to Impress themselves.
Anyone who feels a need to make excuses for the Little A-Hole, or the dead Arafat who killed people just for the entertainment factor. Needs their head examined.



But first. There must be something worth Examining.

If that offended, or insulted anyone who Loves Achmedinnerjacket. Good for you.

[Roo]

Can you blame them? They are currently subjected to a whole load of sanctions.

They are probably sitting there thinking "Screw the USA and Israel. Who are they to think they can use sanctions and threats of destruction to blackmail us and screw up our economy when they feel like it?"

Perhaps they should should stop funding Terror......just a thought....

[Roo]

Here's the funny thing that MOST forget about Achmedinjihad, and that is HE was one of the hostage takers of the US embassy in Iran. The hostages have sated emphatically that he was one of the idiots that did that. That my friends tells you the type of person we are dealing with and if "jafar" makes excuses for this piece of shit he's as pathetic as the other loser is!!! Just my 2 cents worth!!!

He was also involved in the Embassy hostage crisis that took down Carter.

[Roo]

Bring it on. I want Israel to attack Iran. It will hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state.



Sure. That worked out well when you went after Osama :p



1) He didn't threaten to "wipe Israel from the map"
2) The right to disagree with the holocaust version we have been fed should be a right that you defend
3) Provide proof Iran has, could have, wants, is working towards getting nukes.



#8 was written for Israel



I thought we were talking about Iran? Now you want to nuke Saudi Arabia too?



What is it with you people and your infantile name calling? Ahmedinejad is his name. It's hard to take you seriously while you are sitting in the sandpit at kindergarten.



Pre-emptive warfare without provocation and without evidence of a threat of imminent attack is a violation of the UN charter and a crime against humanity. Do you want to go down in history as a nation of cold blooded murderers worse than Hitler?

How many "Zionists" have you killed sweet cheeks?

[Roo]

First of all, the article flat out states that a bill from Parliament means nothing if the Iranian leadership doesn't sign it.

Second, the bill says try to stop oil ships from countries that have sanctions on Iran from using the strait, it doesn't say close the strait.

Third, I did not realize we were part of the European Union.

You are quite the prick aren't you?

I have noticed that you have a strong tendency to hide behind semantics and pretend it makes you clever...it doesn't. ;)

Now, does the US have sanctions imposed upon Iran?

[Toro]

This would do wonders for the Obama economy and jack gas up to $5/gal overnight

Maybe Obama will call Iran and say "Pretty please - don't do this"

Yet Obama is preventing the US from drilling for our own oil so he can secure the enviro wacko vote

Hahahahaha!!

Like it's gonna happen ...

[jafar00]

You think it's enough to dismiss it when the IAEA themselves have this stuff in their reports? It's hard for them to investigate properly when Iran is uncooperative. They claim they'll cooperate once sanctions are lifted... doesn't work that way.

You can't blame Iran for trying to make it difficult. Sanctions and threats don't make it easy for them to be friendly and cooperative.

I see scum as cockroaches. We completely annihilated 2 separate countries in a war, and you act as if we lost. Sore loser. :lol:

Tried catching a flight these days or have your 4th amendment rights upheld? The terrorists won :lame2:


Of course Iran is building a nuclear bomb: that's what all this is about. If Iran weren't trying to build its own nukes, like Syria and Iraq tried before it, there wouldn't be all these underground centrifuges, all the sanctions, all the rocket testing, all the threats to destroy pretty much everyone they can think of.


How can you not come to the conclusion that the reason they went underground and threaten retaliatory strikes is that they have been threatened with attack constantly?


If they're not building weapons, they should just let the IAEA in there to verify, and follow up, and ensure the international community of what their intentions are. They apparently CHOOSE not to cooperate, and get sanctions instead. Even Jafar has stated that they must investigate, but Iran chooses a different route. Then when negative things happen, it'll be someone else's fault, like Israel, or the US, or the UK, or... anybody but those who refuse to properly cooperate.

According to the IAEA report they are making steps towards allowing access to the suspect site once guarantees for security have been met.


Muslim aggression is astounding, and to me it's just as astounding that so many Westerners are afraid to recognize it as what it is.

We went through all this before, with German aggression before WWI and WWII, and here it comes again. People try to pretend it away, deny it away.

Then the aggressors start a war.

This is Israeli style tactics. They attack someone then try to paint the victim as the aggressor.


Just thought I'd highlight this little offering from you, 'jafar00'.

You want Israel to attack Iran, to 'hasten the demise of the Zionist apartheid state' .. YOUR WORDS.

Do you deny that Israel is an apartheid state? As far as things are going now, it looks like the ones most likely to destroy the zionists are themselves.


And where DOES all this come from, anyway ? Why do you welcome any hope for Israeli deaths ?

I don't hope for anyone to die. If Israelis do die, they can only blame themselves. When you are a serial aggressor, sooner or later someone is going to come along and punch you in the nose.


Some of us would've hoped that Hitler's Holocaust could have shown the world that Jews had suffered enough, that there should be no more of ANY of this.

But - - au contraire ... very evidently ... in 1948, and since.

Why can't a lesson be learned from this ? 'Jafar', would you care to explain ?

Interesting that you mention 1948. Remember Jaffa in 1948 when the Palestinians were quite literally pushed into the sea by foreign invaders who still live in their homes?

3555


I am pragmatic enough to know, and understand how unfair, and inhumane it is to group all people together. Much as many Americans do when it comes to Muslims.
I agree. It is wrong to do such things on a wide basis. Much like saying All Whites are Racists, and All Blacks are Victims.
We all know. Both of those statements are totally wrong.

But there is where I draw the line on our relationship to Muslims...here in our own nation. Who happily celebrated, and danced in the streets when they learned about 9-11.

1/2 a dozen people bribed to dance around the camera for an unknown reason in a single report which turned out to be a fake psy-op is enough for you to demonise an entire group of people who overwhelmingly condemned the 9/11 attacks? Is that what kind of friends you are?


Annette Krüger Spitta of the ARD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARD_(broadcaster))'s (German public broadcasting) TV magazine Panorama states that footage not aired shows that the street surrounding the celebration in Jerusalem is quiet. Furthermore, she states that a man in a white T-shirt incited the children and gathered people together for the shot. The Panorama report, dated September 20, 2001, quotes Communications Professor Martin Löffelholz explaining that in the images one sees jubilant Palestinian children and several adults but there is no indication that their pleasure is related to the attack. The woman seen cheering (Nawal Abdel Fatah) stated afterwards that she was offered cake if she celebrated on camera, and was frightened when she saw the pictures on television afterward.


Huge crowds attended candlelit vigils in Iran, and 60,000 spectators observed a minute's silence at Tehran football stadium

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_September_11_attacks





One issue is the threat Iran repeatedly, publicly, made to 'wipe Israel off the map'. You've made your case to say this is a supposed 'mistranslation', but you don't explain how this 'mistranslation' KEPT ON happening, repeatedly. And for good reason, because as an explanation it borders on the ridiculous.

Repeating a mistake over and over and over again does not make it right.



Then, specialists such as Juan Cole (http://www.juancole.com/about)of the University of Michigan and Arash Norouzi (http://www.juancole.com/about%e2%80%9d%26gt;Juan%20Cole%26lt;/a%26gt;%20of%20the%20University%20of%20Michigan) of the Mossadegh Project (http://www.mohammadmossadegh.com/news/rumor-of-the-century)pointed out that the original statement in Persian did not say that Israel should be wiped from the map, but instead that it would collapse.Cole said this week that in the 1980s Khomeini gave a speech in which he said in Persian “Een rezhim-i eshghalgar-i Quds bayad az sahneh-i ruzgar mahv shaved.” This means, “This occupation regime over Jerusalem must vanish from the arena of time.” But then anonymous wire service translators rendered Khomeini as saying that Israel “must be wiped off the face of the map,” which Cole and Nourouzi say is inaccurate.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/did-ahmadinejad-really-say-israel-should-be-wiped-off-the-map/2011/10/04/gIQABJIKML_blog.html


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/sep/25/iran-secret-underground-nuclear-plant

Perhaps you've 'forgotten' the case of the secret nuclear installation, kept hidden from the world FOR YEARS ?



I may have quoted selectively. Nonetheless, Iran ONLY admitted to this facility's existence after having kept it secret for YEARS. This doesn't come within a light year of supporting the notion that Iran has nothing to hide !!!!!

Can you blame them? They have been threatened with their installations being bombed!


You may care (or not ?) to watch the video clip of Gordon Brown's statement. You may (or may not) wish to note the justice Brown and his fellow partners have on their side in speaking out against this secret installation.

Now, check THIS out ... a rather more recent concern ..

http://www.kesq.com/news/Inspection-at-Iran-nuclear-facility-finds-higher-level-traces-of-uranium-U-N-says/-/233092/14177420/-/a9pg9a/-/index.html



I don't know about you, but I find the Iranian response, as it was reported, to be pathetic. And note, particularly, that Iran REJECTED CALLS TO STOP THE HIGH ENRICHMENT OF URANIUM THAT CAN BE USED FOR WEAPONS. 'Jafar', explain THAT away as being consistent with a so-called 'peaceful' nuclear program !!!

20% is not high enrichment and is in keeping with the claim that they are enriching only to fuel reactors. The 27% figure is apparently the result of new centrifuges over enriching before they are calibrated properly to 20%. There is no evidence that Iran has moved beyond 20%. 90% is needed for a weapon.


Experts said the discovery of traces of uranium enriched up to 27% at the Fordow facility near the holy city of Qom is above Iran’s previously highest-known enrichment grade, about 20%, but may be the result of improper calibration when the centrifuges were first used.
http://www.cdfai.org/the3dsblog/?cat=118


Iran wants a nuclear program just for power generation ? But, WHY ?? Iran is especially rich in oil reserves, and is a major world exporter of the stuff, so WHY does Iran see any need to find an alternative for oil for its power needs ? It must surely be decades away from needing to seek any alternative to oil for its needs

For the same reason Japan restarted it's reactors recently despite one of their facilities all but destroying the whole country.

It's cheaper :/

Also, being self sufficient with nuclear power has become a matter of national pride in their achievement for Iran.

[jimnyc]

You can't blame Iran for trying to make it difficult. Sanctions and threats don't make it easy for them to be friendly and cooperative.

It's the other way around. Had the been cooperative with the international community over the years, they wouldn't have had sanctions imposed on them. Now of course you and them will use the sanctions to further an excuse.


Tried catching a flight these days or have your 4th amendment rights upheld? The terrorists won :lame2:

I've had no issue with either. The terrorists have not won, they have placed us on alert. The major players are all dead, filled with holes, and their leader dumped in the sea like a bag of garbage. Thousands and thousands of their supporters are pushing up daisies. A shitload of other cockroaches are staring at the walls in Cuba, wondering where it all went wrong and why they won't be getting any virgins. Can you imagine that, Jafar? People thinking that if they blow themselves up in the name of Allah that they will get virgins in the after life? That's some sick shit right there! Allah Akbar, Allah Akbar, Allah Akbar!! Then again, these are the same nutsos who have no problem with Muhammed having slept with Aisha, all of 9 years old.

We still have our freedoms and liberties, rebuilt the World Trade Center and just celebrated America's birthday. Saddam is dead. His sons are dead. Osama is dead. We won.


According to the IAEA report they are making steps towards allowing access to the suspect site once guarantees for security have been met.

Oh please. They don't want sanctions and it's as simple as allowing an impartial agency to inspect their sites. They're stalling and not cooperating, until such time that the sites have been inspected. As it stands right now, Iran stands accused of working with detonators and seeking weapons, and this is from the IAEA. And then even you yourself said that the agency needs to investigate. There's only one party holding up the process.

I've never seen anyone make so many excuses for a terrorist supporting state, and one who wants an excuse to wipe another country from our planet.

[Roo]

You can't blame Iran for trying to make it difficult. Sanctions and threats don't make it easy for them to be friendly and cooperative.


Tried catching a flight these days or have your 4th amendment rights upheld? The terrorists won :lame2:



How can you not come to the conclusion that the reason they went underground and threaten retaliatory strikes is that they have been threatened with attack constantly?



According to the IAEA report they are making steps towards allowing access to the suspect site once guarantees for security have been met.



This is Israeli style tactics. They attack someone then try to paint the victim as the aggressor.



Do you deny that Israel is an apartheid state? As far as things are going now, it looks like the ones most likely to destroy the zionists are themselves.



I don't hope for anyone to die. If Israelis do die, they can only blame themselves. When you are a serial aggressor, sooner or later someone is going to come along and punch you in the nose.



Interesting that you mention 1948. Remember Jaffa in 1948 when the Palestinians were quite literally pushed into the sea by foreign invaders who still live in their homes?

3555



1/2 a dozen people bribed to dance around the camera for an unknown reason in a single report which turned out to be a fake psy-op is enough for you to demonise an entire group of people who overwhelmingly condemned the 9/11 attacks? Is that what kind of friends you are?





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_September_11_attacks




Repeating a mistake over and over and over again does not make it right.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/did-ahmadinejad-really-say-israel-should-be-wiped-off-the-map/2011/10/04/gIQABJIKML_blog.html



Can you blame them? They have been threatened with their installations being bombed!



20% is not high enrichment and is in keeping with the claim that they are enriching only to fuel reactors. The 27% figure is apparently the result of new centrifuges over enriching before they are calibrated properly to 20%. There is no evidence that Iran has moved beyond 20%. 90% is needed for a weapon.


http://www.cdfai.org/the3dsblog/?cat=118



For the same reason Japan restarted it's reactors recently despite one of their facilities all but destroying the whole country.

It's cheaper :/

Also, being self sufficient with nuclear power has become a matter of national pride in their achievement for Iran.


So tell me.....what Religious views drive the Iranian Leadership.....and oh yes...how many Zionists have you killed?

[Sir Evil]

Do you deny that Israel is an apartheid state? As far as things are going now, it looks like the ones most likely to destroy the zionists are themselves.


I don't hope for anyone to die. If Israelis do die, they can only blame themselves. When you are a serial aggressor, sooner or later someone is going to come along and punch you in the nose.



Won't happen diaperhead, Isreal has the backing of the USA so ammadouchebag is doing nothing more then letting his fellow people know they are due to make the extinction list with the way things are going. Iran is just another middle easter dumb still living in barbaric times. stupid little people...:laugh:

[Gaffer]

So tell me.....what Religious views drive the Iranian Leadership.....and oh yes...how many Zionists have you killed?

I would add, does he know what a Zionist is?

[Drummond]

Nukeman. Most people today have no idea what took place back in 1979-80. In fact. Most of them probably weren't born yet, in many cases.
Thankfully though. Unlike Jafar. I have no need, nor will I ever find any reason to Defend Achmedinnerjacket. And I enjoy making fun of Little Brained, Dangerous men who need to throw their Little weight around to Impress themselves.
Anyone who feels a need to make excuses for the Little A-Hole, or the dead Arafat who killed people just for the entertainment factor. Needs their head examined.


Yes, I remember that !

Besides, for those who don't remember, there are links out there which prove the point. This is one ...

http://www.danielpipes.org/4115/ahmadinejad-hostage-taker


Soon after his election as president of Iran, on June 25, 2005, pictures of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad emerged showing him as a hostage-taker. An Associated Press photograph showed a man looking very much like a younger version of today's Ahmadinejad holding a blind-folded man, apparently five days after the U.S. embassy in Tehran was seized on November 4, 1979.

Five former American hostages confirmed that Ahmadinejad as one of their captors. William J. Daugherty, a former intelligence officer, said he saw Ahmadinejad 8 to 10 times at the start of his captivity: "I recognized him right off. … I remember so much his hatred of Americans. It just emanated from every pore of his body."

BBC correspondent John Simpson recalled seeing Ahmadinejad on the embassy grounds. Abholhassan Bani-Sadr, a former president of Iran long living in exile, asserted that Ahmadinejad "wasn't among the decision-makers but he was among those inside the Embassy."

Note the mention of John Simpson, of the BBC. Simpson is, to this day, one of the BBC's leading presenters usually reporting from 'abroad'. Let me assure you that if a BBC reporter could cast doubt on such a report, he would ... and in fact, the BBC's own coverage of this tries to do just that.

But Simpson himself, DOES NOT .. and he was a witness there at the time !!!

[jafar00]

Won't happen diaperhead, Isreal has the backing of the USA so ammadouchebag is doing nothing more then letting his fellow people know they are due to make the extinction list with the way things are going. Iran is just another middle easter dumb still living in barbaric times. stupid little people...:laugh:

Diaperhead?

Iran is in Asia btw, not the Middle East but let's not let a little thing like elementary level geography get in the way of a good insult eh? :2up:

[Drummond]

You can't blame Iran for trying to make it difficult. Sanctions and threats don't make it easy for them to be friendly and cooperative.

What comes first, the chicken or the egg ?

Sanctions are a REACTION to Iran's failure to offer the cooperation necessary. Had Iran cooperated fully from the start, such measures wouldn't have been implemented.

Oh, and tell me. What made it 'difficult' for Iran to be other than as secretive, as they were, about that nuclear facility they kept hidden for years ?? Again, I suggest you check out the Gordon Brown video clip from my previous link. It makes clear that BECAUSE of that secrecy, he and other leaders were being DRIVEN to consider tougher sanctions !


How can you not come to the conclusion that the reason they went underground and threaten retaliatory strikes is that they have been threatened with attack constantly?

'Chicken and egg' again ?

It wasn't Israel that repeatedly threatened to 'wipe Iran off the map'. It was Iran, threatening that against Israel. Naturally it's in Israel's interests to neutralise Iran's attack capabilities ranged against it. And note ... their concern is to head off a nuclear attack against Israel. Though Iran is capable of directly attacking Israel through more 'conventional' means (.. leaving aside the terrorist tactics which Iran DOES get involved with, covertly !), Israel holds off from taking action against that.

'Jafar', tell me, if a foreign power threatened your people with genocide, then looked like they were working to arrange it, would YOU sit still, waiting around for YEARS afterwards, and still make no defensive moves of your own ? Frankly, I marvel at Israel's restraint !!


According to the IAEA report they are making steps towards allowing access to the suspect site once guarantees for security have been met.

In other words ... prevarication. Delay. Buying time ?

Well, quite. Thanks for that, 'Jafar'.


This is Israeli style tactics. They attack someone then try to paint the victim as the aggressor.

List for me a catalogue of 'attacks' from Israel which have led to Iran justifying their threat of GENOCIDE against Israel.

And explain to me how on earth threats of genocide are ever a 'defensive' act.


Do you deny that Israel is an apartheid state? As far as things are going now, it looks like the ones most likely to destroy the zionists are themselves.

'Apartheid' refers to a practise of segregation.

Well, I tried doing some research on that. I quickly found a BBC report (.. surprise, surprise ..) about segregation in Israel.

Here's the link ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-16342327


Thousands of Israelis have held a rally in the town of Beit Shemesh against ultra-Orthodox Jewish extremism.

The protest followed clashes after an eight-year-old girl said she had been harassed on her way to school.

Some ultra-Orthodox in Beit Shemesh are seeking to segregate men and women.

President Shimon Peres has backed the protest, saying the "entire nation must be recruited in order to save the majority from the hands of a small minority".

He said the demonstration was a defence of the "character" of the state of Israel "against a minority which breaks our national solidarity".

Thousands of protesters gathered in Beit Shemesh, west of Jerusalem, on Tuesday evening.

They held signs "reading "Free Israel from religious coercion" and "Stop Israel from becoming Iran" - a reference to the Islamist republic's stringent restrictions on women's freedoms.

OK, let me guess. Iran is extremely concerned about segregation between ISRAELI citizens, because they're such defenders of human rights, and feel, out of conscience, that they must intervene ?!? Perhaps they think that atomising Israelis is the best way to relieve their segregations, maybe as a kindness, to put them out of their misery ?

Or, perhaps Iranian society considers it should hold a monopoly on such offences for itself,, and they're getting a teensy bit jealous ??


I don't hope for anyone to die. If Israelis do die, they can only blame themselves. When you are a serial aggressor, sooner or later someone is going to come along and punch you in the nose.

Yes, and it's ISRAEL who find themselves having to do the punching !!

Repeatedly threatening genocide, may I suggest, is definite evidence of 'serial aggression' !!



Interesting that you mention 1948. Remember Jaffa in 1948 when the Palestinians were quite literally pushed into the sea by foreign invaders who still live in their homes?

And it's interesting that YOU forget the UN's own sanction of the settlement of Jews within the then-NEW State of Israel.

'Quite literally' being pushed into the sea, eh ? Do you have photos to share on this, proving the point ?

No ?

Oh, and tell me. Since when (and most certainly in 1948 !) was Palestine a recognised Nation State ?


Also, being self sufficient with nuclear power has become a matter of national pride in their achievement for Iran.

Got it.

OK, then.

Iran has plentiful energy reserves, and has absolutely no practical need to rely on nuclear technology for energy generation. Further, nuclear technology has military as well as peaceful applications .. and it's a technology that Iran has just HAPPENED to turn to, following multiple holocaustal threats it made against Israel.

Iran hid a nuclear facility for years. Iran has held sessions of talks about the direction of its program, none of which have got anywhere to allay worries about their real intentions. Iran keeps throwing up barriers to full inspections.

... But, heyy, none of that actually matters. And ... why ?

.. Because Iran can feel pride in the nuclear advances it's managed ????

Oh, that's all OK, then !! :bang3::bang3::bang3::blowup:

[Drummond]

Diaperhead?

Yes, 'Jafar'. From my point of view, it counts as an Americanism ..

The British equivalent would be .. 'Nappyhead'.

Just thought I'd include that for your information.

.. Enjoy.

Have a nice day.

[jimnyc]

I've seen endless excuses from Jafar, but no good reason as to why Iran just doesn't allow unfettered inspections which would put a halt to all these problems. With nothing to hide, this should be an open and shut case and sanctions get lifted. But they continue their cat and mouse game, because they are stalling or most likely moving/hiding things they wouldn't want found. The IAEA releases damning reports as a result of non-cooperation, and that still isn't enough, but of course enough to get continual denials.

[jimnyc]

Diaperhead?

Iran is in Asia btw, not the Middle East but let's not let a little thing like elementary level geography get in the way of a good insult eh? :2up:

Say what you will, but Iran is considered to be part of the Middle East. But don't let a thing called facts get in the way of you looking like an ass! :lol: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_East

http://i47.tinypic.com/98bwg4.jpg

[jimnyc]

And another from Wiki:


The 18th-largest country in the world in terms of area at 1,648,195 km2 (636,372 sq mi), Iran has a population of around 79 million.[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-CIA_Factbook_-_2010-4) It is a country of particular geopolitical (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geopolitics) significance owing to its location in the Middle East and central Eurasia.

[jimnyc]

And one last one for the hell of it, notice of course where I circled in red where Iran is located...

http://i48.tinypic.com/esp0fk.jpg

[Sir Evil]

Diaperhead?

Iran is in Asia btw, not the Middle East but let's not let a little thing like elementary level geography get in the way of a good insult eh? :2up:

:laugh2:

See, diaperheads are all stupid! Get out of the cave once in a while...

[aboutime]

Let's all just agree. Jarfar00 is a devout Iran Lover, and leave it go at that.

While I was on active duty in the Navy, back during the early sixties. A friend of mine had a line I've never forgotten that applies very well today. Especially when visiting forums where some Anonymous members must always feel far superior, and brag about it to others.
That line was...and anyone can use it, is:

"You cannot hold an Intelligent conversation with anyone who proves they have no Intelligence."

This thread seems to be the perfect time to use that line. If Jarfar is offended with it. I have succeeded.

[mundame]

Yes, 'Jafar'. From my point of view, it counts as an Americanism ..

The British equivalent would be .. 'Nappyhead'.

Just thought I'd include that for your information.

.. Enjoy.

Have a nice day.



My personal all-time favorite is "dune coon."


I know, it's so wrong. :rolleyes:

[jafar00]

I've had no issue with either. The terrorists have not won, they have placed us on alert. The major players are all dead, filled with holes, and their leader dumped in the sea like a bag of garbage.

So you say. There was no proof. No autopsy. Was your favourite terrorist really killed? Or was he given a new identity and spirited away to live a life of luxury for services rendered?


Thousands and thousands of their supporters are pushing up daisies. A shitload of other cockroaches are staring at the walls in Cuba, wondering where it all went wrong and why they won't be getting any virgins. Can you imagine that, Jafar? People thinking that if they blow themselves up in the name of Allah that they will get virgins in the after life? That's some sick shit right there! Allah Akbar, Allah Akbar, Allah Akbar!!

The 72 virgins thing is a media construct that has no basis in Islamic teaching. Try again. Are you Israeli btw? You use the same cockroaches thing as many Israeli leaders. It's the excuse they use every time they kill a bunch of innocent people.


Then again, these are the same nutsos who have no problem with Muhammed having slept with Aisha, all of 9 years old.

Where is the problem?

At the time, it was the custom. Aisha had reached puberty. Nobility use to marry young in Europe too. According to Christian sources Joseph was 90 years old when he married Mary at the age of 12-14. As recently as the 1880s the age of consent around the world ranged from 7 (Delaware USA!) to 14. Most places were at 10. http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/teaching-modules/230?section=primarysources&source=24

You cannot unfavourably judge someone who lived centuries ago under different customs and laws with the customs and laws of today.


We still have our freedoms and liberties, rebuilt the World Trade Center and just celebrated America's birthday. Saddam is dead. His sons are dead. Osama is dead. We won.

Sure... you still have all the freedom you had before...


1st AMENDMENT FREEDOM OF SPEECH
• The Patriot Act broadly expands the official definition of
terrorism, so that many domestic groups that engage in
nonviolent civil disobedience could very well find themselves
labeled as terrorists.
• The Government may now prosecute librarians or keepers
of any other records if they reveal that the government
requested information on their clients or members in the
course of an investigation. It has become a crime for these
individuals to try to safeguard your privacy or to tell you
that you are under investigation.
1st AMENDMENT FREEDOM OF ASSOCIATION
• Government agents may now monitor the First Amendmentprotected activities of religious and political institutions, and
then infiltrate these groups with no suspicion of criminal
activity. This is a return to domestic spying on law-abiding
religious and political groups.
• You may now be the subject of a government investigation
simply because of the political, activist, or advocacy
groups you are involved in, or the statements you make
within these groups.
1st AMENDMENT RIGHT TO ACCESS
GOVERNMENT INFORMATION
• A U.S. Department of Justice directive actively encourages
federal, state, and local officials to resist and/or limit access
to government records through Freedom of Information Act
(FOIA) requests.
• The Government has conducted immigration hearings in
secret behind closed doors. Such proceedings were once
open to the public. Hundreds, if not thousands, of immigrants
have already been deported in secret.
4th AMENDMENT FREEDOM FROM UNREASONABLE
SEARCHES &SEIZURES
• Law Enforcement authorities may now conduct secret searches and wiretaps in your home or office
without showing “probable cause.” They need only to claim that intelligence gathering is “a significant
purpose” of their intrusion, even when the primary goal is ordinary law enforcement. They may also
monitor where and to whom you send and receive e-mail, or where you go on the Internet, recording
every e-mail address and website you have been in contact with.
• Law Enforcement may now demand any personal records held by any source including your doctor,
employer, accountant, or library. All they have to do is claim that it is related to an investigation into
“terrorism.” The record keepers may not reveal that your records were provided to the government.
• Judicial oversight of secret searches has been effectively minimized. The Patriot Act directs judges to
consent to secret searches based only on the Government’s assertion that a “significant” purpose of
an investigation is gathering information related to “terrorism,” as the government defines it.
5th AMENDMENT RIGHT TO DUE PROCESS & FREEDOM FROM BEING
HELD WITHOUT CHARGE
• Americans can now be jailed without a formal charge & without the right to confront the witnesses or
evidence against them. American citizens are now being held in military jails without charge and without a clear path of appeal for their indefinite confinement.
• Hundreds of Arab, Muslim and South Asian men were rounded up in the Ashcroft raids following
September 11, and held for weeks without charges until all were cleared of terrorism charges
6th AMENDMENT RIGHT TO LEGAL REPRESENTATION
• Hundreds of U.S. residents have been detained for months at a time, and denied access to the advice
and advocacy of an attorney. The Government may now monitor conversations between attorneys &
clients in federal jails.
• The Bush Administration filed papers in court that arguing that an American citizen held in a military
jail without charge should be denied access to legal counsel because such access would interfere with
the process of his interrogation.
6th AMENDMENT RIGHT TO A SPEEDY AND PUBLIC TRIAL
• The U.S. Government may now jail its residents and citizens indefinitely without charge & without a public trial.
8th AMENDMENT FREEDOM FROM CRUEL AND UNUSUAL PUNISHMENTS
• The U.S. Government has taken into custody individuals they identify as “material witnesses,” transported them across the country, and held them for months in solitary confinement without charge or
contact with their family.
• According to the Justice Department’s own Inspector General, immigrant men rounded up in the
Ashcroft raids following September 11 and held in the Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn, NY
were subjected to a pattern of “physical and verbal abuse.”
14th AMENDMENT RIGHT TO EQUAL PROTECTION
• Over 82,000 men from Arab, Muslim and South Asian countries registered with the Government
under the Special Registration program. Over 13,000 are now in deportation proceedings. None
have been charged with terrorism.


http://www.nyclu.org/pdfs/eroding_liberty.pdf



So tell me.....what Religious views drive the Iranian Leadership.....and oh yes...how many Zionists have you killed?

A) Shia'ism
B) none

Say what you will, but Iran is considered to be part of the Middle East. But don't let a thing called facts get in the way of you looking like an ass! :lol: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_East


Meh....


Iran (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3c/Speakerlink.svg/11px-Speakerlink.svg.png (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/En-us-Iran.ogg)i (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:En-us-Iran.ogg)/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)ɪ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ˈ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)r (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ɑː (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)n (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)[10] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-9) or / (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English)aɪ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)ˈ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)r (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)æ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)n (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English#Key)/ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_English);[11] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran#cite_note-AHD-10) Persian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_language): ایران‎ [ʔiˈɾɒn] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IPA_for_Persian)<small class="nowrap" style="white-space: nowrap; "> (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/21/Speaker_Icon.svg/13px-Speaker_Icon.svg.png (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:IranPronunciationFarsi.ogg) listen (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/IranPronunciationFarsi.ogg))</small>), officially the Islamic Republic of Iran (Persian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_language): جمهوری اسلامی ایران‎ Jomhuri-ye Eslāmi-ye Irān), is a country in Southern (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia)and Western Asia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran


In the late 1990s and early 2000s, the economies of the PRC[28] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia#cite_note-27) and India have been growing rapidly, both with an average annual growth rate of more than 8%. Other recent very high growth nations in Asia include Malaysia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia), Indonesia, Pakistan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan), Thailand, Vietnam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam), Mongolia, Uzbekistan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uzbekistan), Cyprus and the Philippines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippines), and mineral-rich nations such as Kazakhstan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazakhstan), Turkmenistan, Iran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran), Brunei, United Arab Emirates (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Arab_Emirates), Qatar, Kuwait (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuwait), Saudi Arabia, Bahrain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahrain) and Oman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oman).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia


According to the United Nations geoscheme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_geoscheme),[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia#cite_note-1) Southern Asia comprises the countries of Afghanistan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghanistan), Bangladesh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangladesh), Bhutan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhutan), India (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India),Iran (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran), Maldives (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maldives), Nepal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepal), Pakistan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan), and Sri Lanka (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sri_Lanka). Burma (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burma)and Tibet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibet) are also sometimes included in the region. South Asia is home to well over one fifth of the world's population, making it both the most populous and most densely populated geographical region in the world.[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia#cite_note-2)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia

[aboutime]

So you say. There was no proof. No autopsy. Was your favourite terrorist really killed? Or was he given a new identity and spirited away to live a life of luxury for services rendered?



The 72 virgins thing is a media construct that has no basis in Islamic teaching. Try again. Are you Israeli btw? You use the same cockroaches thing as many Israeli leaders. It's the excuse they use every time they kill a bunch of innocent people.



Where is the problem?

At the time, it was the custom. Aisha had reached puberty. Nobility use to marry young in Europe too. According to Christian sources Joseph was 90 years old when he married Mary at the age of 12-14. As recently as the 1880s the age of consent around the world ranged from 7 (Delaware USA!) to 14. Most places were at 10. http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/teaching-modules/230?section=primarysources&source=24

You cannot unfavourably judge someone who lived centuries ago under different customs and laws with the customs and laws of today.



Sure... you still have all the freedom you had before...


http://www.nyclu.org/pdfs/eroding_liberty.pdf




A) Shia'ism
B) none


Meh....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia
I agree. That 72 virgins idea is a myth. But the press...as usual, got the facts all wrong.

Instead of 72 virgins. They should have been honest, and told Future Martyrs....it's only ONE 72 year old virgin they will be visited by. And they must have a new Towel, as a matter of courtesy.

[aboutime]

My personal all-time favorite is "dune coon."


I know, it's so wrong. :rolleyes:

Isn't all of this talk about Head Apparel, worn by Terrorists just a major Insult to Diaper manufacturers?

Maybe we should call them "Huggies". And Mothers should never throw them away. Just save them when FULL, to create more Terrorists.

[jimnyc]

So you say. There was no proof. No autopsy. Was your favourite terrorist really killed? Or was he given a new identity and spirited away to live a life of luxury for services rendered?



The 72 virgins thing is a media construct that has no basis in Islamic teaching. Try again. Are you Israeli btw? You use the same cockroaches thing as many Israeli leaders. It's the excuse they use every time they kill a bunch of innocent people.



Where is the problem?

At the time, it was the custom. Aisha had reached puberty. Nobility use to marry young in Europe too. According to Christian sources Joseph was 90 years old when he married Mary at the age of 12-14. As recently as the 1880s the age of consent around the world ranged from 7 (Delaware USA!) to 14. Most places were at 10. http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/teaching-modules/230?section=primarysources&source=24

You cannot unfavourably judge someone who lived centuries ago under different customs and laws with the customs and laws of today.



Sure... you still have all the freedom you had before...


http://www.nyclu.org/pdfs/eroding_liberty.pdf




A) Shia'ism
B) none


Meh....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Asia

So you protect Mohammed, the pedophile "prophet". We perhaps faked the death of your idol, Osama Bin Laden. And although every modern world considers Iran to be a part of the Middle East, you still deny it. The point was, you laughed at someone for claiming Iran was in the Middle East. While some maps do consider them part of Asia, most consider Iran to be in the ME. So your laughing was wrong. Sir Evil was not incorrect in referring to the ME. Being identified by both doesn't invalidate one of them.

Sure, let's make stories about the times changing so that we can support a pedophile. A 9yr old is a child no matter how you slice it. Ironic that a pig wouldn't eat sausage! :lol:

[aboutime]

So you protect Mohammed, the pedophile "prophet". We perhaps faked the death of your idol, Osama Bin Laden. And although every modern world considers Iran to be a part of the Middle East, you still deny it. The point was, you laughed at someone for claiming Iran was in the Middle East. While some maps do consider them part of Asia, most consider Iran to be in the ME. So your laughing was wrong. Sir Evil was not incorrect in referring to the ME. Being identified by both doesn't invalidate one of them.

Sure, let's make stories about the times changing so that we can support a pedophile. A 9yr old is a child no matter how you slice it. Ironic that a pig wouldn't eat sausage! :lol:



jimnyc. Can't speak for anyone else here. But I really do enjoy your methods of exposing, and stating facts....those who seem to make their own up...cannot deny.

Truth is. You just have a way. An entertaining way of putting the mentally challenged in their place, with a smile, and a huge satisfied Laugh.

[logroller]

How would Iran enforce it?
And couldn't shippers just lie about their destination?

[red states rule]

Cockroaches?!? How racist is that?



To pinpoint a leader, you need boots on the ground.



Are US and Israeli threats against Iran legitimate considering the fact that there is no evidence to support the idea that they are building a bomb?

If I was the leader of Australia and another country was threatening me like that, I would also be threatening swift and decisive retaliation if attacked.

I keep asking for evidence that Iran is building a bomb. I hear crickets.



Where did you get that I hate Jews? My lawyer is Jewish. I have Jewish employees.

I will give Muslims credit on a few things

They know how to react when their women back sass them

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/pre-marital-sex-indonesia.jpg


They teach their kids respect

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/Madrassa-Child_sm.jpg


and Muslim countries have very low rates of adultery

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/adultery-lower.jpg

[aboutime]

I will give Muslims credit on a few things

They know how to react when their women back sass them

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/pre-marital-sex-indonesia.jpg


They teach their kids respect

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/Madrassa-Child_sm.jpg


and Muslim countries have very low rates of adultery

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/adultery-lower.jpg
Wonder if jafar understands the expression "A Picture is worth a Thousand words?"

[red states rule]

Wonder if jafar understands the expression "A Picture is worth a Thousand words?"

He will say they are fakes and/or staged

Even if he fell over their dead bodies he would still deny it

[aboutime]

He will say they are fakes and/or staged

Even if he fell over their dead bodies he would still deny it
That would take us back....full circle to his thoughts of OBL not being dead.
Come to think of it now. After all of this back and forth that means nothing but hatred from him, and those who feel the same way.

I NOW DECLARE THAT 'jafar00' is not REAL, and a FAKE.

That should save us all a few laughs for the weekend. Ya Think?

[Drummond]

Let's all just agree. Jarfar00 is a devout Iran Lover, and leave it go at that.

Fair enough. Nothing else could explain away what we're continually getting from this character. :puke:

[jafar00]

Let's all just agree. Jarfar00 is a devout Iran Lover, and leave it go at that.

While I was on active duty in the Navy, back during the early sixties. A friend of mine had a line I've never forgotten that applies very well today. Especially when visiting forums where some Anonymous members must always feel far superior, and brag about it to others.
That line was...and anyone can use it, is:

"You cannot hold an Intelligent conversation with anyone who proves they have no Intelligence."

This thread seems to be the perfect time to use that line. If Jarfar is offended with it. I have succeeded.


My personal all-time favorite is "dune coon."


I know, it's so wrong. :rolleyes:


Isn't all of this talk about Head Apparel, worn by Terrorists just a major Insult to Diaper manufacturers?

Maybe we should call them "Huggies". And Mothers should never throw them away. Just save them when FULL, to create more Terrorists.


When all you have left is insults usually heard on the playground in Primary School, I know I have won the debate.


So you protect Mohammed, the pedophile "prophet". We perhaps faked the death of your idol, Osama Bin Laden. And although every modern world considers Iran to be a part of the Middle East, you still deny it. The point was, you laughed at someone for claiming Iran was in the Middle East. While some maps do consider them part of Asia, most consider Iran to be in the ME. So your laughing was wrong. Sir Evil was not incorrect in referring to the ME. Being identified by both doesn't invalidate one of them.

Perhaps the ones putting Iran in the Middle East worked for FOX? (which country is in the wrong place here?)

http://meetusinghal.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/fox-egypt.jpg

Iran is Southeast of the Asian side of Turkey. They are not even Arab.

Oh, and I have condemned Osama Bin Laden and his type over and over again so don't say he is my idol.


Sure, let's make stories about the times changing so that we can support a pedophile. A 9yr old is a child no matter how you slice it. Ironic that a pig wouldn't eat sausage! :lol:

In the Middle Ages, Ashkenazi Jews were legally able to marry as young as 3y/o.


The Age of Consent in the Middle Ages
The romance of Courtly love was completely opposite to the practicalities of Medieval marriage. The Age of Consent - With parental permission it was legal for boys to marry at fourteen and girls at twelve. A betrothal often took place when the prospective bride and groom were as young as 7 years old and in the case of Higher nobility many were betrothed as babies. But a marriage was only legal once the marriage had been consummated.

http://www.middle-ages.org.uk/noble-women-in-the-middle-ages.htm

Yes to be married at 7 y/o is too young by today's standards but back then it was the norm.

We can put this to rest since you have no argument, only insults.


How would Iran enforce it?
And couldn't shippers just lie about their destination?

The straight of Hormuz is quite thin. They could easily close it off if only for a little while until the US came in with their aircraft carriers. Which would then become sitting ducks for sunburn missiles.


He will say they are fakes and/or staged

Even if he fell over their dead bodies he would still deny it

Many of these people are oppressed by the west's favourite dictators. Does that make them right? Definitely not!

The USA is not immune to the abuse of women btw..



Different research organizations’ reports: ‘In the USA, domestic violence is the leading cause of injury to women—more than car accidents, muggings, and rapes combined. Nearly 1 in 5 teenage girls who have been in a relationship said a boyfriend threatened violence if presented with a breakup.Every 9 seconds in the USA a woman is assaulted or beaten. Everyday in the USA, more than three women are murdered by their husbands or boyfriends.In the USA, 1.3 million women are victims of physical assault by an intimate partner each year. 85% of domestic violence victims are women. Historically, females have been most often victimized by someone they knew. Most cases of domestic violence are never reported to the police.’

http://freethoughtblogs.com/taslima/2012/06/10/violence-by-male-intimate-partner/
Here are the type of photos you seem to like. This is from the USA
http://freethoughtblogs.com/taslima/files/2012/06/domestic-violence-slap-51-150x150.jpg35603561

You really should look in your own back yard before pointing the finger at others.

[red states rule]

Jar, any stats on how many women are beheaded, stoned in public, or rec'd 100 lashes in the US?

[jimnyc]

Perhaps the ones putting Iran in the Middle East worked for FOX? (which country is in the wrong place here?)

Let me ask you this.... What would you say, if the Supreme Leader of Iran, the Ayatollah himself, refers to Iran as being in the Middle East... Would he be wrong?


In the Middle Ages, Ashkenazi Jews were legally able to marry as young as 3y/o.

http://www.middle-ages.org.uk/noble-women-in-the-middle-ages.htm

Yes to be married at 7 y/o is too young by today's standards but back then it was the norm.

We can put this to rest since you have no argument, only insults.


I don't care if this was done there, or even in NYC back then, and I don't care what the excuse is, 3yr olds, 7yr olds and 9 yr olds cannot possibly have developed enough to have the appropriate capacity to know what they're doing, and some filth took advantage of that, whether considered right or wrong, and one of them was the false "prophet" Muhammed.

[red states rule]

http://www.solveisraelsproblems.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/united-nations-620x310.jpg

[aboutime]

When all you have left is insults usually heard on the playground in Primary School, I know I have won the debate.



Perhaps the ones putting Iran in the Middle East worked for FOX? (which country is in the wrong place here?)

http://meetusinghal.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/fox-egypt.jpg

Iran is Southeast of the Asian side of Turkey. They are not even Arab.

Oh, and I have condemned Osama Bin Laden and his type over and over again so don't say he is my idol.



In the Middle Ages, Ashkenazi Jews were legally able to marry as young as 3y/o.


http://www.middle-ages.org.uk/noble-women-in-the-middle-ages.htm

Yes to be married at 7 y/o is too young by today's standards but back then it was the norm.

We can put this to rest since you have no argument, only insults.



The straight of Hormuz is quite thin. They could easily close it off if only for a little while until the US came in with their aircraft carriers. Which would then become sitting ducks for sunburn missiles.



Many of these people are oppressed by the west's favourite dictators. Does that make them right? Definitely not!

The USA is not immune to the abuse of women btw..


http://freethoughtblogs.com/taslima/2012/06/10/violence-by-male-intimate-partner/
Here are the type of photos you seem to like. This is from the USA
http://freethoughtblogs.com/taslima/files/2012/06/domestic-violence-slap-51-150x150.jpg35603561

You really should look in your own back yard before pointing the finger at others.


Wow! How terrible is that?

Imagine, someone made a huge mistake with a map, and labeled something wrong.
That's just as bad as STONING women, Beheading men and women, and pretending to be a member of a Peaceful Religion that KILLS, then denies it.
Excuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuse Me!

[red states rule]

Wow! How terrible is that?

Imagine, someone made a huge mistake with a map, and labeled something wrong.
That's just as bad as STONING women, Beheading men and women, and pretending to be a member of a Peaceful Religion that KILLS, then denies it.
Excuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuse Me!

Islam is a religion that will blow you away

[aboutime]

Wow! How terrible is that?

Imagine, someone made a huge mistake with a map, and labeled something wrong.
That's just as bad as STONING women, Beheading men and women, and pretending to be a member of a Peaceful Religion that KILLS, then denies it.
Excuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuse Me!

By the way, whoever you are. You have no idea how silly you sound. Claiming anything related to winning a debate is nothing more than a Joke.
Now how about telling us, or providing answers about HOW MANY WOMEN you have stoned lately.

[red states rule]

By the way, whoever you are. You have no idea how silly you sound. Claiming anything related to winning a debate is nothing more than a Joke.
Now how about telling us, or providing answers about HOW MANY WOMEN you have stoned lately.


Or how many "honor killings" when a daughter refuses to live her life accroding to Islam. They are beheaded, ran over with the family car, or shot by their PARENTS!!!!!

This is the religion of peace?

[jafar00]

By the way, whoever you are. You have no idea how silly you sound. Claiming anything related to winning a debate is nothing more than a Joke.
Now how about telling us, or providing answers about HOW MANY WOMEN you have stoned lately.


Thanks for reinforcing my point. You have only insults left.


Or how many "honor killings" when a daughter refuses to live her life accroding to Islam. They are beheaded, ran over with the family car, or shot by their PARENTS!!!!!

This is the religion of peace?

Ok I'll bite. Show me with references to the Qur'aan where so called "honour" killing is sanctioned by the religion of Islam.

While we are on the subject.

Dad kills daughter’s girlfriend and girlfriend’s mom … Christian honor killing? (http://coreysviews.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/dad-kills-daughters-girlfriend-and-girlfriends-mom-christian-honor-killing/)Iranian Christian man kills his daughters and family (http://answeringchristians.blogspot.com.au/2011/12/iranian-christian-man-kills-his.html)

[aboutime]

Thanks for reinforcing my point. You have only insults left.



Ok I'll bite. Show me with references to the Qur'aan where so called "honour" killing is sanctioned by the religion of Islam.

While we are on the subject.

Dad kills daughter’s girlfriend and girlfriend’s mom … Christian honor killing? (http://coreysviews.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/dad-kills-daughters-girlfriend-and-girlfriends-mom-christian-honor-killing/)

Iranian Christian man kills his daughters and family (http://answeringchristians.blogspot.com.au/2011/12/iranian-christian-man-kills-his.html)

Wrong again. No need to insult you. You are the insult. Taken care of before I got here.

[mundame]

I suppose this guy is an Iranian propaganda agent, working several forums, trying to keep Americans on the defensive. I have seen this before, and from Iran. Whatever country we are at war with or in any conflict with, if they are modern enough to be able to have a few English speakers of any acceptable level of education, they send propaganda agents here to do this sort of thing he's doing.

Iraq and Afghanistan were too primitive to manage it, but I've seen such agents from Iran and Pakistan, and during the Serbian war we were innundated with them -- because a lot of the college students there spoke and wrote English.

Iran is an enemy of the United States, and when I worked for the Army, it was specifically against the rules to be talking to these people, and I left one Yahoo group for that reason --- they had a very obvious Iranian agent who constantly tried to keep everyone's attention and posted a continual flow of faked up propaganda articles supposedly from Iranian newspapers, but since they were in English and inflammatory, they were obvious fakes.

I think the situation is simple. These people are enemies of our country, they don't have a case to make. And I'm not interested in their propaganda.

[aboutime]

I suppose this guy is an Iranian propaganda agent, working several forums, trying to keep Americans on the defensive. I have seen this before, and from Iran. Whatever country we are at war with or in any conflict with, if they are modern enough to be able to have a few English speakers of any acceptable level of education, they send propaganda agents here to do this sort of thing he's doing.

Iraq and Afghanistan were too primitive to manage it, but I've seen such agents from Iran and Pakistan, and during the Serbian war we were innundated with them -- because a lot of the college students there spoke and wrote English.

Iran is an enemy of the United States, and when I worked for the Army, it was specifically against the rules to be talking to these people, and I left one Yahoo group for that reason --- they had a very obvious Iranian agent who constantly tried to keep everyone's attention and posted a continual flow of faked up propaganda articles supposedly from Iranian newspapers, but since they were in English and inflammatory, they were obvious fakes.

I think the situation is simple. These people are enemies of our country, they don't have a case to make. And I'm not interested in their propaganda.



Gotta totally agree with you. I remember being warned, and reminded almost daily while I was still in uniform about how Loose Lips Sink Ships, and how intentional propaganda agents work to stir up, and maintain disorder.
In this case. With this idiot....oop's. I mean, Achmadinnerjacket Lover. I'm just playing around to see how smart he honestly believes he is. Thinking he's got all of us fooled, and unable to recognize an idiot who pretends to be a Peace Loving Porker.
Ain't gonna happen. And I look forward to the weekend. Letting this guy play his games. Just waiting for him/her to tell us how much Smarter than the rest of us...they believe they are.

[Drummond]

I suppose this guy is an Iranian propaganda agent, working several forums, trying to keep Americans on the defensive. I have seen this before, and from Iran. Whatever country we are at war with or in any conflict with, if they are modern enough to be able to have a few English speakers of any acceptable level of education, they send propaganda agents here to do this sort of thing he's doing.

Iraq and Afghanistan were too primitive to manage it, but I've seen such agents from Iran and Pakistan, and during the Serbian war we were innundated with them -- because a lot of the college students there spoke and wrote English.

Iran is an enemy of the United States, and when I worked for the Army, it was specifically against the rules to be talking to these people, and I left one Yahoo group for that reason --- they had a very obvious Iranian agent who constantly tried to keep everyone's attention and posted a continual flow of faked up propaganda articles supposedly from Iranian newspapers, but since they were in English and inflammatory, they were obvious fakes.

I think the situation is simple. These people are enemies of our country, they don't have a case to make. And I'm not interested in their propaganda.

Some very good points, which I hadn't properly considered. Thanks for this post.

[jafar00]

Let me ask you this.... What would you say, if the Supreme Leader of Iran, the Ayatollah himself, refers to Iran as being in the Middle East... Would he be wrong?

I know Iranians. They are insulted if you call them arab.


I don't care if this was done there, or even in NYC back then, and I don't care what the excuse is, 3yr olds, 7yr olds and 9 yr olds cannot possibly have developed enough to have the appropriate capacity to know what they're doing, and some filth took advantage of that, whether considered right or wrong, and one of them was the false "prophet" Muhammed.

It doesn't matter what you think here in 2012. If you lived 1500 years ago you wouldn't even bat an eyelid.

[jafar00]

I suppose this guy is an Iranian propaganda agent, working several forums, trying to keep Americans on the defensive.

That's a good one. I've been called all sorts of things on forums but this one is the most amusing.

I'm actually a white guy from Perth, Australia.

[red states rule]

http://www.strangepolitics.com/images/content/104137.jpg

[jimnyc]

I know Iranians. They are insulted if you call them arab.

And yet the Ayatollah himself, and Iranians, consider themselves to be a part of the middle east and refer to their location as such. The ME doesn't automatically mean "arab", unless of course all Israelis are arab, and every resident of Iraq.


It doesn't matter what you think here in 2012. If you lived 1500 years ago you wouldn't even bat an eyelid.

And yet another excuse. The pedophile "prophet" violated a child, not 2 ways about it.

[jimnyc]

That's a good one. I've been called all sorts of things on forums but this one is the most amusing.

I'm actually a white guy from Perth, Australia.

Propaganda crap can be repeated from anywhere. Are you Muslim? Whether you're a white guy or not doesn't matter. Oh, and i know the answer already, as you've stated it on at least 2 forums that I know of.

[jimnyc]

I just got off the phone with my buddy, Amir. He's a police officer in my town who I met at the coffee shop (no donuts there). He's a movie nut like me and a rock fan, so I'm always burning movies and albums for him. I'm taking him in about 10 minutes to pick up a new TV set in my truck.

Anyway, he was born in Iran and moved to the States when he was 10. You'd never know it as he doesn't look different and has no accent and is almost fully "Americanized". He not only acknowledged that Iran is a part of the Middle East, his exact words were "Of course it's a part of the Middle East". That comes from an Iranian.

[mundame]

Well, of course it's part of the Middle East!

Darn.

I think it's stretching it a little when people call Afghanistan or Pakistan "Middle East," but Iran? Duh.

[logroller]

I know Persia/Iran was distinctly not Arab, atleast until the mid- 7th century; with the attack of the Arabs, or as is preferred now, the dawn of islam.

[Kathianne]

I know Persia/Iran was distinctly not Arab, atleast until the mid- 7th century; with the attack of the Arabs, or as is preferred now, the dawn of islam.

Iran is not Arab, agreed. it's still part of the Middle East. Same regarding Turkey.

[jimnyc]

The entire modern world considers Iran to be a part of the Middle East, including Iran themselves. Yes, they are part of Western Asia. No, they are not Arab. But neither of those change the fact that Iran is a part of the Middle East.

[jimnyc]

Well, of course it's part of the Middle East!

Darn.

I think it's stretching it a little when people call Afghanistan or Pakistan "Middle East," but Iran? Duh.

Those countries are very close. Iran is smack dab in the middle of the "Middle East" - and Afghanistan and Pakistan are also part of what is referred to as the "greater middle east".

[Kathianne]

The entire modern world considers Iran to be a part of the Middle East, including Iran themselves. Yes, they are part of Western Asia. No, they are not Arab. But neither of those change the fact that Iran is a part of the Middle East.

Indeed. All of middle east is in Asia or Northern Africa. Some Arab, some not. Iran, not Arab.

[jimnyc]

Indeed. All of middle east is in Asia or Northern Africa. Some Arab, some not. Iran, not Arab.

Yep, currently arguing with another buddy of mine from Morocco. He says his country is Northern Africa, which I agree with. I further told him, that Morocco, Egypt and Algeria are lumped in as part of the greater middle east, and he bugged out like it was some sort of insult.

[mundame]

Yep, currently arguing with another buddy of mine from Morocco. He says his country is Northern Africa, which I agree with. I further told him, that Morocco, Egypt and Algeria are lumped in as part of the greater middle east, and he bugged out like it was some sort of insult.

Huh! That's a surprise.

Must be some cultural distinctions they are making that we don't understand.

Remember when Europeans were always trying to call everyone in this entire hemisphere "Americans"?

We didn't like that.

[jimnyc]

Huh! That's a surprise.

Must be some cultural distinctions they are making that we don't understand.

Remember when Europeans were always trying to call everyone in this entire hemisphere "Americans"?

We didn't like that.

Yep, and factually, "The Americas" are much larger than just the US of A. I think with all the turmoil and violence in the ME over the years, that some now take it as an insult to be associated with the area. And I can 'almost' see bordering countries arguing, but claiming Iran isn't a part of the Middle East? That's laughable.

[red states rule]

On the Arab Street


http://www.strangepolitics.com/images/content/110275.jpg

[Roo]

[B]A) Shia'ism
B) none

So far so good Jaffy Baby....now one step further, what Sect of "Shia"?

[aboutime]

Yep, currently arguing with another buddy of mine from Morocco. He says his country is Northern Africa, which I agree with. I further told him, that Morocco, Egypt and Algeria are lumped in as part of the greater middle east, and he bugged out like it was some sort of insult.


Seems like that kind of thing always happens whenever you confront someone with Honest, Truthful facts they cannot dispute.
Eventually. That is when they begin to start using the name calling, and making accusations about other people who do not know who their father was.
But then. That is the most appropriate description of the many Countries located in the M.E. that live, and thrive on Ignorance, Hatred, and Killing anyone who disagree's with them in any way.