The future: It's not good

[GW in Ohio]

Two things make me very pessimistic about the future of mankind......

1. Global warming. Many on the right deny it is happening. Or, whenever a course of action is proposed, they find fault with it and oppose it at every turn. Meanwhile, the earth heats up and climate change goes on. If strong measures are not taken soon, there will be starvation, death and war for billions of human beings and extinction for many animal species.

2. Global Islamic terrorism. The Bush team has completely botched the so-called "war on terror." If we ever had a chance to eliminate the threat of Islamofascism in the wake of 9/11, it is pretty well gone now. Our incursion into Iraq has spawned a many-headed hydra of loosely-affiliated terrorist groups. They are impossible to defeat, since they have no central structure, and they are emboldened by their successes in Iraq. They don't have to defeat us to win, and they don't have to kill us, either; all they have to do is disrupt....every terrorist strike costs the governments of the civilized world $billions. Eventually, they will bring many governments in the civilized world to the point of bankruptcy.

For these reasons, I am not optimistic about the future. There is one possible bright spot for the right-wingers, though. If this pessimistic vision of the future holds up, the Second Amendment will be more important than ever, because we're all going to need guns for personal protection.

[Monkeybone]

why would we have a war from global warming?

and i sorat agree with you, if all of the groups unite, they will just 'nickel and dime' us so to speak with attacks here and there.

[GW in Ohio]

why would we have a war from global warming?

and i sorat agree with you, if all of the groups unite, they will just 'nickel and dime' us so to speak with attacks here and there.

If global warming produces the expected results, billions of people will not have enough food and water to sustain life. When people are that desperate, wars ensue for control of limited resources.

[Dilloduck]

Two things make me very pessimistic about the future of mankind......

1. Global warming. Many on the right deny it is happening. Or, whenever a course of action is proposed, they find fault with it and oppose it at every turn. Meanwhile, the earth heats up and climate change goes on. If strong measures are not taken soon, there will be starvation, death and war for billions of human beings and extinction for many animal species.

2. Global Islamic terrorism. The Bush team has completely botched the so-called "war on terror." If we ever had a chance to eliminate the threat of Islamofascism in the wake of 9/11, it is pretty well gone now. Our incursion into Iraq has spawned a many-headed hydra of loosely-affiliated terrorist groups. They are impossible to defeat, since they have no central structure, and they are emboldened by their successes in Iraq. They don't have to defeat us to win, and they don't have to kill us, either; all they have to do is disrupt....every terrorist strike costs the governments of the civilized world $billions. Eventually, they will bring many governments in the civilized world to the point of bankruptcy.

For these reasons, I am not optimistic about the future. There is one possible bright spot for the right-wingers, though. If this pessimistic vision of the future holds up, the Second Amendment will be more important than ever, because we're all going to need guns for personal protection.

Does this mean you plan on hiding under a rock ?

[Monkeybone]

no duck....a padlock..a rock...sheesh.;) with a bullhorn yelling 'this is all your fault! i warned you!'

[5stringJeff]

For these reasons, I am not optimistic about the future. There is one possible bright spot for the right-wingers, though. If this pessimistic vision of the future holds up, the Second Amendment will be more important than ever, because we're all going to need guns for personal protection.

Ready to rethink your position on gun control yet? :D

[loosecannon]

Two things make me very pessimistic about the future of mankind......



GW, you worry too much. And not enough.

I won't labor you with a 12 point list but the last 60 years and the next 200 have/will featured dangers much more ominous than those two you listed. In fact we can't even imagine....

It all boils down to too many people and what is gonna cap population growth. Because something MUST cap population.

It is not an advantage to be too succesful ~chinese proverb

[-Cp]

GW, you worry too much. And not enough.

I won't labor you with a 12 point list but the last 60 years and the next 200 have/will featured dangers much more ominous than those two you listed. In fact we can't even imagine....

It all boils down to too many people and what is gonna cap population growth. Because something MUST cap population.

It is not an advantage to be too succesful ~chinese proverb


If all the women in the world looked like Rosie - well, that'd put a stop to procreation....

[Hobbit]

If global warming produces the expected results, billions of people will not have enough food and water to sustain life. When people are that desperate, wars ensue for control of limited resources.

Uh, isn't global warming supposed to melt glaciers and ice caps? Doesn't that make more potable water and arable land.

I'd also like to once again point out that this isn't the warmest we've been, even in recent history. There's a receding glacier in Switzerland where they keep finding silver mines under it, tools out and ready to use. Looks like the miners left for the winter, but the snow never melted.

The two largest threats I see to this country are the Mexican invasion and our deplorable government school system. Both of them are set to bring us from prosperity to ruin.

[lily]

Even if global warming isn't the threat some would like to think, wouldn't it be better to err on the side of caution? What could it hurt?

[Mr. P]

When I was a bit younger I had no doubt this Country wouldn't make the 200 year birthday in 1976. Ha! was I wrong...then again I tended to drink the Demo cool-aid back then.

[Dilloduck]

Even if global warming isn't the threat some would like to think, wouldn't it be better to err on the side of caution? What could it hurt?

Is erring on the side of caution something that you would recommend in all dangerous situations or is it something that you would just use willy nilly ?

[GW in Ohio]

Uh, isn't global warming supposed to melt glaciers and ice caps? Doesn't that make more potable water and arable land.

I'd also like to once again point out that this isn't the warmest we've been, even in recent history. There's a receding glacier in Switzerland where they keep finding silver mines under it, tools out and ready to use. Looks like the miners left for the winter, but the snow never melted.

The two largest threats I see to this country are the Mexican invasion and our deplorable government school system. Both of them are set to bring us from prosperity to ruin.

hobbit: I'm not real well versed in the scientific details about global warming. But you make me look like frickin' Einstein.

[GW in Ohio]

GW, you worry too much. And not enough.

I won't labor you with a 12 point list but the last 60 years and the next 200 have/will featured dangers much more ominous than those two you listed. In fact we can't even imagine....

It all boils down to too many people and what is gonna cap population growth. Because something MUST cap population.

It is not an advantage to be too succesful ~chinese proverb

You're absolutely right about the dangers posed by overpopulation, LC. Make that the third item on the list of Things That Will Do Us In.

[Hobbit]

hobbit: I'm not real well versed in the scientific details about global warming. But you make me look like frickin' Einstein.

Care to back that up?

[GW in Ohio]

Ready to rethink your position on gun control yet? :D

Yes.

In a safe world, there's no need to own a gun, except for sport. I do not forsee a safe world in the future.

[darin]

hobbit: I'm not real well versed in the scientific details about global warming. But you make me look like frickin' Einstein.

Translation: "In typical lib-fashion, I'll ignore your data, your points, and your logical discussion and insult you. I figure, if I can insult you, MY point of view will look/seem better."

Howniceforyou.

[lily]

Is erring on the side of caution something that you would recommend in all dangerous situations or is it something that you would just use willy nilly ?

Look, Dill.........I'm not that "deep". I was talking about global warming. No hidden sub-context or deeper inner thoughts.

[-Cp]

Yes.

In a safe world, there's no need to own a gun, except for sport. I do not forsee a safe world in the future.

Said in true liberal fashion - here's a News Flash:

The World has NEVER been nor never WILL be "Safe"....

[5stringJeff]

If all the women in the world looked like Rosie - well, that'd put a stop to procreation....

Or give a huge boost to the alcohol industry...

[lily]

Translation: "In typical lib-fashion, I'll ignore your data, your points, and your logical discussion and insult you. I figure, if I can insult you, MY point of view will look/seem better."

Howniceforyou.

How nice and insulting of you.:salute:

[5stringJeff]

Yes.

In a safe world, there's no need to own a gun, except for sport. I do not forsee a safe world in the future.

I don't think the world has ever been safe enough not to prepare for thieves and robbers. Nowadays, we have the added bonus of worrying anout rapists, pedophiles, and the occasional psycho.

[Dilloduck]

Look, Dill.........I'm not that "deep". I was talking about global warming. No hidden sub-context or deeper inner thoughts.

So we're to take this as an off-the-cuff comment regarding global warming and not a solution that you really recommend or posted for comment ? This might explain the lack of substance around here recently.

[darin]

How nice and insulting of you.:salute:

Whoa - you are saying I am insulting him for calling him out on Insulting Hobbit? WTF?

[Monkeybone]

if we were really oncerned that much with global warming, wouldn't we try to up the living styles of some Thrid world countries? cause with all the stuff that they burn to use / produce energy can't really help? or maybe get on Europe to up their emissions standards. you talk and talk about preparing and trying to fix and this perfect world, but how then? do you have an electric car? do u use solar energy? if so awesome. i can say how bad gas prices are but i still buy the gas.

[Hobbit]

if we were really oncerned that much with global warming, wouldn't we try to up the living styles of some Thrid world countries? cause with all the stuff that they burn to use / produce energy can't really help? or maybe get on Europe to up their emissions standards. you talk and talk about preparing and trying to fix and this perfect world, but how then? do you have an electric car? do u use solar energy? if so awesome. i can say how bad gas prices are but i still buy the gas.

Actually, in Africa the problem is that they can't use readily available power sources because they pollute too much and would risk losing foreign aid from hippies if they used it. For example, I saw video of a clinic in the middle of one of the jungle countries that was forced to run its entire operation off of solar power. They could power either the lights or the fridge, but not both. They're also sitting right next to some of the richest coal reserves outside the U.S.

[avatar4321]

Even if global warming isn't the threat some would like to think, wouldn't it be better to err on the side of caution? What could it hurt?

Freedom, honesty, and the livelihood of thousands of people.

[Abbey Marie]

GW, no offense, but Chicken Little type "run for your lives, the sky is falling" arguments tend to turn people off. We should be alert to and try to fix things we know are dangerous, but perspective beats doom and gloom. I have a natural tendency towards that kind of thinking myself, and I try to be on guard against it. As a couple of people have said in this thread, history shows that there have been and always will be dangerous times. These aren't even close to the worst.

[JLO]

You are absolutely right! The issue of global warming is getting more and more serious. I have had to research the issue quite a bit for my college courses. Although it seems that the major effects of global warming will not happen in our lifetime, we still need to be considerate of our children and their children's future. It is nice to see that some change is happening such as hybrid cars, more recycling programs, and even replantation of tree programs.

[TheStripey1]

If all the women in the world looked like Rosie - well, that'd put a stop to procreation....

they don't... so your solution doesn't hold water...

[TheStripey1]

Uh, isn't global warming supposed to melt glaciers and ice caps? Doesn't that make more potable water and arable land.

I'd also like to once again point out that this isn't the warmest we've been, even in recent history. There's a receding glacier in Switzerland where they keep finding silver mines under it, tools out and ready to use. Looks like the miners left for the winter, but the snow never melted.

The two largest threats I see to this country are the Mexican invasion and our deplorable government school system. Both of them are set to bring us from prosperity to ruin.

no, hobbit... the glaciers melt and then the fresh water flows downhill until it reaches the sea... at that point, you wave byebye to the fresh water and say hello to more salt water... as the salt water rises, people that live on the coasts will be displaced... and they will need to go somewhere...

THAT is when you will begin to see wars being fought over who gets what available land...

who do you think will win? those that were there first or those with the most guns...

[TheStripey1]

When I was a bit younger I had no doubt this Country wouldn't make the 200 year birthday in 1976. Ha! was I wrong...then again I tended to drink the Demo cool-aid back then.

With a non elected republican president that pardoned the then worst president ever, you can't be blamed for voting democrat... at least I don't blame you...

[TheStripey1]

Is erring on the side of caution something that you would recommend in all dangerous situations or is it something that you would just use willy nilly ?

Global Climate Change qualifies in my book as a dangerous situation... so yes, use whatever means are neccessary... Because, IMO, sticking your head in the sand and hoping it all goes away is not an answer.

[TheStripey1]

Freedom, honesty, and the livelihood of thousands of people.

as opposed to everyone losing it all... which would you choose?

[TheStripey1]

GW, no offense, but Chicken Little type "run for your lives, the sky is falling" arguments tend to turn people off. We should be alert to and try to fix things we know are dangerous, but perspective beats doom and gloom. I have a natural tendency towards that kind of thinking myself, and I try to be on guard against it. As a couple of people have said in this thread, history shows that there have been and always will be dangerous times. These aren't even close to the worst.

but will you agree that they are bad? and that it is not likely that anytime in our immediate future that things will once again be... ok...

[darin]

GlobalWarmingmongers are hillarious.

C'mon guys - REALLY. Not sure how anyone can buy the crap Al Gore Sells.

[stephanie]

Man can only do so much...

Mother Earth is going to do whatever she wants...

She has a mind of her own..

:coffee:

[Pale Rider]

Two things make me very pessimistic about the future of mankind......

1. Global warming. Many on the right deny it is happening.

And of course you can post the scientific facts and data along with links that back up global warming is in deed a fact.... right?

Let's see it.

[stephanie]

And of course you can post the scientific facts and data along with links that back up global warming is in deed a fact.... right?

Let's see it.

But but...all those SCIENTIST..who have become god now....sez so....

And don't forget....their high priest....Al Bore...he sez so too...

:coffee:

[loosecannon]

And of course you can post the scientific facts and data along with links that back up global warming is in deed a fact.... right?

Let's see it.

Pale I absolutely, positively, with no reservations guarantee you that global warming is a proven fact.

The world is getting hotter and CO2 levels are rising faster that at any known moment in history. And the data is surprisingly good for CO2 levels dating back 400 million years.

The ONLY two things that are disputed is to what degree man is the cause and what the results will be.

Global warming is a fact.

[Kathianne]

Pale I absolutely, positively, with no reservations guarantee you that global warming is a proven fact.

The world is getting hotter and CO2 levels are rising faster that at any moment in history. And the data is surprisingly good for CO2 levels dating back 400 million years.

The ONLY two things that are disputed is to what degree man is the cause and what the results will be.

Global warming is a fact.

and the proof? It's coming? It's here?

[Pale Rider]

Pale I absolutely, positively, with no reservations guarantee you that global warming is a proven fact.

The world is getting hotter and CO2 levels are rising faster that at any known moment in history. And the data is surprisingly good for CO2 levels dating back 400 million years.

The ONLY two things that are disputed is to what degree man is the cause and what the results will be.

Global warming is a fact.

Well I see a lot more unsubstantiated claims and no proof. If there's so much of it, where is it?

And also, could you tell me just how it is we were able to measure the amount of Co2 in the atmosphere 400 million years ago?

[Kathianne]

Well I see a lot more unsubstantiated claims and no proof. If there's so much of it, where is it?

And also, could you tell me just how it is we were able to measure the amount of Co2 in the atmosphere 400 million years ago?

Hey, are you saying you don't take the word of a cyber poster? How cynical can you be? Rep to you.

[Kathianne]

Hey, are you saying you don't take the word of a cyber poster? How cynical can you be? Rep to you.

Umm, when I'm 'allowed' to rep. :embarrassed:

[Sitarro]

Two things make me very pessimistic about the future of mankind......

1. Global warming. Many on the right deny it is happening. Or, whenever a course of action is proposed, they find fault with it and oppose it at every turn. Meanwhile, the earth heats up and climate change goes on. If strong measures are not taken soon, there will be starvation, death and war for billions of human beings and extinction for many animal species.


Ahhh, how do you explain this GW?

http://www.capetimes.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=3844594

Weather breaks record
May 23, 2007

Sapa and Staff writer

THE icy weather of snow, hail and heavy rain that has swept across South Africa over the past few days has set 54 weather records.

The South African Weather Service said 34 new records were set on Monday and another 20 yesterday. Almost all records were for the lowest maximum and minimum daily temperatures in towns across the country.

Plettenberg Bay and Tsitsikamma both recorded their highest daily rainfall, at 68mm and 71.2mm respectively, on Monday. Plettenberg Bay recorded its lowest minimum temperature, 5.6°C, yesterday. Tsitsikamma had its lowest maximum temperature on Monday, 12.1°C, and its lowest minimum yesterday, 6.3°C.

The lowest minimum temperature recorded was -6°C in Welkom, while the lowest maximum temperature was a mere 1.7°C in Barkly East. Both were recorded on Monday night.

None of this week's records reached the lowest temperature yet recorded in South Africa - -18.6°C recorded at Buffelsfontein in the Eastern Cape in 1996.

Other towns and areas recording their lowest minimum temperatures yet included: Carolina (-5.5°C), Vanwyksvlei (-4.3°C), Ventersdorp (-3.9°C), Witbank (-3.7°C), Gariep Dam (-3.7°C), Pofadder (-3.5°C), Upington (-3.1°C), Marken (-2.9°C), Taung (-2.5°C), Oudestad (-1.7°C) and Nieuwoudtville (-0.1°C).

Kuruman, Kathu and Gariep Dam all recorded their lowest maximum temperatures on Monday and lowest minimums yesterday.

Kuruman went from a high of 9.2°C to a low of -5.1°C, Kathu from 10.1°C to -5.1°C, and Gariep from 6.9°C to -3.7°C.

[5stringJeff]

Ahhh, how do you explain this GW?

http://www.capetimes.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=3844594

Weather breaks record
May 23, 2007

Sapa and Staff writer

THE icy weather of snow, hail and heavy rain that has swept across South Africa over the past few days has set 54 weather records.

The South African Weather Service said 34 new records were set on Monday and another 20 yesterday. Almost all records were for the lowest maximum and minimum daily temperatures in towns across the country.

Plettenberg Bay and Tsitsikamma both recorded their highest daily rainfall, at 68mm and 71.2mm respectively, on Monday. Plettenberg Bay recorded its lowest minimum temperature, 5.6°C, yesterday. Tsitsikamma had its lowest maximum temperature on Monday, 12.1°C, and its lowest minimum yesterday, 6.3°C.

The lowest minimum temperature recorded was -6°C in Welkom, while the lowest maximum temperature was a mere 1.7°C in Barkly East. Both were recorded on Monday night.

None of this week's records reached the lowest temperature yet recorded in South Africa - -18.6°C recorded at Buffelsfontein in the Eastern Cape in 1996.

Other towns and areas recording their lowest minimum temperatures yet included: Carolina (-5.5°C), Vanwyksvlei (-4.3°C), Ventersdorp (-3.9°C), Witbank (-3.7°C), Gariep Dam (-3.7°C), Pofadder (-3.5°C), Upington (-3.1°C), Marken (-2.9°C), Taung (-2.5°C), Oudestad (-1.7°C) and Nieuwoudtville (-0.1°C).

Kuruman, Kathu and Gariep Dam all recorded their lowest maximum temperatures on Monday and lowest minimums yesterday.

Kuruman went from a high of 9.2°C to a low of -5.1°C, Kathu from 10.1°C to -5.1°C, and Gariep from 6.9°C to -3.7°C.

Weather does not equal climate.

[Psychoblues]

That's about as nice as dmp can be!!!!!!


How nice and insulting of you.:salute:

Take the remarks and get on with your life, lily. dmp ain't important. Dig it?

[lily]

That's about as nice as dmp can be!!!!!!



Take the remarks and get on with your life, lily. dmp ain't important. Dig it?

Don't I know it.....but the hypocrisy is worth noting.

[lily]

So we're to take this as an off-the-cuff comment regarding global warming and not a solution that you really recommend or posted for comment ? This might explain the lack of substance around here recently.

Dill.......I practice what I preach. I was re-cycling before it became fashionable. My statement was my opinion.....what is the harm in a actually taking some care, just in case the scientists just might be right.....what is the worse that can happen?

[loosecannon]

Dill.......I practice what I preach. I was re-cycling before it became fashionable. My statement was my opinion.....what is the harm in a actually taking some care, just in case the scientists just might be right.....what is the worse that can happen?

you might over react?

[lily]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Sitarro]

Weather does not equal climate.

54 records broken in late May???? Insignificant? What do the global warming crowd have? One year and a few hurricanes? What proof is there of manmade "climate change"(latest bullshit generalized label to replace the more focused "global warming"). A Harvard study in 2003 of the last 1,000 years showed a much warmer "climate" during the Middle Ages, all with out the use of aircraft or Hummers.

Snow storms in South Africa during the latter part of the month of May....... I guess it's just "unusual" weather patterns.

[avatar4321]

as opposed to everyone losing it all... which would you choose?

How is the earth getting warmer going to do anything other than cause mankind to adapt like we have the past 5000 years?

[avatar4321]

GlobalWarmingmongers are hillarious.

C'mon guys - REALLY. Not sure how anyone can buy the crap Al Gore Sells.

how else is he going to maintain those three computer monitors and buy all that paper?

[avatar4321]

Ahhh, how do you explain this GW?

http://www.capetimes.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=3844594

Weather breaks record
May 23, 2007

Sapa and Staff writer

THE icy weather of snow, hail and heavy rain that has swept across South Africa over the past few days has set 54 weather records.

The South African Weather Service said 34 new records were set on Monday and another 20 yesterday. Almost all records were for the lowest maximum and minimum daily temperatures in towns across the country.

Plettenberg Bay and Tsitsikamma both recorded their highest daily rainfall, at 68mm and 71.2mm respectively, on Monday. Plettenberg Bay recorded its lowest minimum temperature, 5.6°C, yesterday. Tsitsikamma had its lowest maximum temperature on Monday, 12.1°C, and its lowest minimum yesterday, 6.3°C.

The lowest minimum temperature recorded was -6°C in Welkom, while the lowest maximum temperature was a mere 1.7°C in Barkly East. Both were recorded on Monday night.

None of this week's records reached the lowest temperature yet recorded in South Africa - -18.6°C recorded at Buffelsfontein in the Eastern Cape in 1996.

Other towns and areas recording their lowest minimum temperatures yet included: Carolina (-5.5°C), Vanwyksvlei (-4.3°C), Ventersdorp (-3.9°C), Witbank (-3.7°C), Gariep Dam (-3.7°C), Pofadder (-3.5°C), Upington (-3.1°C), Marken (-2.9°C), Taung (-2.5°C), Oudestad (-1.7°C) and Nieuwoudtville (-0.1°C).

Kuruman, Kathu and Gariep Dam all recorded their lowest maximum temperatures on Monday and lowest minimums yesterday.

Kuruman went from a high of 9.2°C to a low of -5.1°C, Kathu from 10.1°C to -5.1°C, and Gariep from 6.9°C to -3.7°C.

Dont you know? Global warming is going to cause the next Ice Age.

[Pale Rider]

54 records broken in late May???? Insignificant? What do the global warming crowd have? One year and a few hurricanes? What proof is there of manmade "climate change"(latest bullshit generalized label to replace the more focused "global warming"). A Harvard study in 2003 of the last 1,000 years showed a much warmer "climate" during the Middle Ages, all with out the use of aircraft or Hummers.

Snow storms in South Africa during the latter part of the month of May....... I guess it's just "unusual" weather patterns.

I've asked for some proof myself. Ain't seen none yet.

[nevadamedic]

When I was a bit younger I had no doubt this Country wouldn't make the 200 year birthday in 1976. Ha! was I wrong...then again I tended to drink the Demo cool-aid back then.

lol

[nevadamedic]

if we were really oncerned that much with global warming, wouldn't we try to up the living styles of some Thrid world countries? cause with all the stuff that they burn to use / produce energy can't really help? or maybe get on Europe to up their emissions standards. you talk and talk about preparing and trying to fix and this perfect world, but how then? do you have an electric car? do u use solar energy? if so awesome. i can say how bad gas prices are but i still buy the gas.

:clap: :laugh2: :clap:

[stephanie]

We are all gonna die..........damn it...

First it was Global Cooling...

Now it's Global waming....

I'm soooooo confused...

Which one do I die over?????????????:eek:

[avatar4321]

We are all gonna die..........damn it...

First it was Global Cooling...

Now it's Global waming....

I'm soooooo confused...

Which one do I die over?????????????:eek:

you wont die to either. You die to the efforts of the wackos trying to "fix" the "problem"

[MtnBiker]

1. Global warming. Many on the right deny it is happening. Or, whenever a course of action is proposed, they find fault with it and oppose it at every turn. Meanwhile, the earth heats up and climate change goes on. If strong measures are not taken soon, there will be starvation, death and war for billions of human beings and extinction for many animal species.



What are these predictions based on?

Lily posed the question of erroring on the side of caution. If people recycle, drive more fuel effecient cars, are generally less wastefull with natural resources, I find nothing wrong with that. All of those things are great. It is the suggestions that the actions of the USA and its economy are the evil of the world and will kill all of mankind due to baised computer models that do not even account for water vapor, that is just absurd.

[loosecannon]

What are these predictions based on?

Lily posed the question of erroring on the side of caution. If people recycle, drive more fuel effecient cars, are generally less wastefull with natural resources, I find nothing wrong with that. All of those things are great. It is the suggestions that the actions of the USA and its economy are the evil of the world and will kill all of mankind due to baised computer models that do not even account for water vapor, that is just absurd.

actually I think the rationale goes like this:

The US comprises 5% of the worlds people, while consuming 25% of the earth's resources.

The rest of the world is responding to the same capitalist promises we are, and striving for the same life style.

Which is is impossible and impractical.

What is also impractical is a senseless capitalist model based on consumerism of disposable goods.

It is unsustainable, inherently wasteful and pursued blindly without rational consideration of the alternatives all in the names of greed and expediency.

Only the US can alter the wildly impractical consumption life style we have adopted. Everybody can not "have it all" and "live forever".

[theHawk]

The US comprises 5% of the worlds people, while consuming 25% of the earth's resources.


Does that mean in the last four years we've consumed 100% of the earth's resources?

:lol:

[5stringJeff]

54 records broken in late May???? Insignificant? What do the global warming crowd have? One year and a few hurricanes? What proof is there of manmade "climate change"(latest bullshit generalized label to replace the more focused "global warming"). A Harvard study in 2003 of the last 1,000 years showed a much warmer "climate" during the Middle Ages, all with out the use of aircraft or Hummers.

Snow storms in South Africa during the latter part of the month of May....... I guess it's just "unusual" weather patterns.

What I'm saying is that you can't take one area's weather for one month and use that as evidence for or against climate change.

For that matter, I don't think we can take a few decades' weather worldwide and use it as evidence for climate change. The earth is billions of years old, and we have detailed records for about 150 years of it. That's nothing. Now, we do have other evidences of some indicators from thousands of years back, using techniques like ice core drilling in Greenland/Antarctica, but I don't believe that we have sufficient evidence for climate change.

[Hobbit]

What I'm saying is that you can't take one area's weather for one month and use that as evidence for or against climate change.

For that matter, I don't think we can take a few decades' weather worldwide and use it as evidence for climate change. The earth is billions of years old, and we have detailed records for about 150 years of it. That's nothing. Now, we do have other evidences of some indicators from thousands of years back, using techniques like ice core drilling in Greenland/Antarctica, but I don't believe that we have sufficient evidence for climate change.

What about streets and places in England named after vineyards and grapes, despite the fact that England is currently too cold to grow grapes, or the fact that melting glaciers in Switzerland are revealing abandoned silver mines from a few hundred years ago with the equipment sitting there as if the mine had been closed for the winter and never re-opened?

[loosecannon]

What I'm saying is that you can't take one area's weather for one month and use that as evidence for or against climate change.

For that matter, I don't think we can take a few decades' weather worldwide and use it as evidence for climate change. The earth is billions of years old, and we have detailed records for about 150 years of it. That's nothing. Now, we do have other evidences of some indicators from thousands of years back, using techniques like ice core drilling in Greenland/Antarctica, but I don't believe that we have sufficient evidence for climate change.

The flaw in this thinking is in assuming that a trend as short as a decade is not a trend.

Nobody expects the climate change to be permanent. They never are.

The climate has, however, indisputably already changed.

[avatar4321]

The flaw in this thinking is in assuming that a trend as short as a decade is not a trend.

Nobody expects the climate change to be permanent. They never are.

The climate has, however, indisputably already changed.

you're right. It has changed. and global castastrophy hasn't occured.

[5stringJeff]

you're right. It has changed. and global castastrophy hasn't occured.

:word:

[TheStripey1]

you're right. It has changed. and global castastrophy hasn't occured.

yet...

[Sitarro]

A couple of years ago Colorado was really suffering from a lack of water....Lake Dillon had dried up and many of the resevoirs were very low, now.....

http://www.gazette.com/articles/snow_22774___article.html/summit_cadets.html

Climbers get the cold shoulder
Awash in snow, path to Pikes Peak summit proving dangerous
By DAVE PHILIPPS, THE GAZETTE
May 24, 2007 - 5:07PM

Last May, Teresa Taylor was watching climbers pad up to the summit of Pikes Peak in shorts and sneakers. This year, she’s warning everyone that beyond Barr Camp, you’d better be dressed for the worst.

This is the snowiest spring on Pikes Peak in more than a decade. Barr Camp recorded 231 inches of snow this winter. (It only saw 50 inches in 2006.)

Hikers venturing above treeline will find that the peak is more wintry this May than it usually is in January, and they should be prepared.

“The snow is still waist-deep in places, and we just got more today,” Taylor, the caretaker at Barr Camp, said Wednesday. Every day, she warns people that the trail is buried.

Some climbers listen — she persuaded a dozen Texans in jeans to turn back Sunday. But some climbers don’t. Two Air Force Academy cadets headed up to the summit Tuesday. They became stranded above treeline and had to be rescued by helicopter Wednesday morning.

The cadets, Jesse Mortensen, 21, a junior from Michigan, and Jesse Luschen, 22, a senior from Iowa, were out to enjoy a hike during an idle period at the academy between the end of spring term and graduation.

They hiked seven miles up the snowless bottom part of Barr Trail on Monday and spent the night at Barr Camp. Tuesday, they left camp early, expecting to cover the remaining five miles to the top before noon.

They did not have snowshoes, ice axes or winter gear, but they did carry sleeping bags and a tent.

When Taylor said weather was moving in, they assured her they could beat it to the top.

If you get in trouble or get tired, Taylor told them as they left, the last train leaves from the summit at 4 p.m.

“They said, ‘Four? We’ll be there long before then,’” she said Wednesday.

They never got there.

“We hiked for hours and hours. It was very frustrating and hard,” Mortensen said Wednesday.

The cadets pushed through knee- and waist-deep snow. A storm rolled in, pelting them with snow and hail.

Snow obscured the trail. Clouds obscured the summit.

“We could hear the train whistle. We kept thinking we were at the summit. Obviously, we weren’t,” Mortensen said.

The cadets likely took a wrong turn near 13,000 feet, two miles from the summit, and crossed onto a steep flank of the peak called the Bottomless Pit.

About 5:30 p.m., lost, soaked and shivering uncontrollably, they set up their tent. Inside, they shed their wet clothes and crawled into their sleeping bags. Mortensen called for help on his cellular phone.

El Paso County Search and Rescue drove a snowcat to the top of the closed Pikes Peak Highway, arriving at 10:30 p.m. Rescuers worked their way down the main cirque, searching for the cadets with no luck.

At dawn, searchers crossed into the Bottomless Pit and found them, said Steve Sperry, spokesman for Search and Rescue.

Both were cold and wet, wearing jeans and tennis shoes, but otherwise OK, Sperry said.

A National Guard Blackhawk helicopter flew the cadets and rescuers to town Wednesday morning. Neither cadet was treated for injuries.

Mortensen said he didn’t heed warnings at Barr Camp because he never anticipated how difficult the combination of deep, wet snow, weather and altitude would be.

In the years the cadets have lived in Colorado Springs, tennis shoes and jeans would have been adequate for a May Pikes Peak climb, but this year it’s so snowy that skiers have been riding the train up and skiing down the east face this month.

Temperatures at the summit have hovered around freezing for days. Snow will likely last into June or July.

I remember when I lived in Denver over 10 years ago that a few years before I left that Pikes Peak would be void of snow well before june.


Follow the money, scientist don't make a living without grants for research whether from a school, government or private business. How quickly did this "global warming " fad get a new marketing campaign and turn into climate change? When hasn't the climate changed? How is it that everything that could possibly happen that is bad will do so in our lifetimes? Why wouldn't it be 1,000 years from now or 200 years from now?

[avatar4321]

actually I think the rationale goes like this:

The US comprises 5% of the worlds people, while consuming 25% of the earth's resources.


And who do you think produces those resources? Oh yeah... WE DO. And its specifically because of the capitalist economy we have. People are motivated to work and create resources through their hard work.

Should you ever succeed in getting your communist agenda imposed on this nation, we would all be starving and no one would be doing anything.