Beginner's Mind

[Wind Song]

<CENTER>
Empty Your Cup
</CENTER>http://www.debatepolicy.com/dot_red.gifA university professor went to visit a famous Zen master. While the master quietly served tea, the professor talked about Zen. The master poured the visitor's cup to the brim, and then kept pouring. The professor watched the overflowing cup until he could no longer restrain himself. "It's overfull! No more will go in!" the professor blurted. "You are like this cup," the master replied, "How can I show you Zen unless you first empty your cup."
http://www.ironpalm.com/beginner.html


I've emptied my cup and I'm starting over. Thank you Jim for reinstating my membership, and thank you everyone else for the helpful feedback.

[Wind Song]

If you'd like me to comment on any of your posts, let me know.

[Anton Chigurh]

It makes me no difference if anyone comments on what I post.

[Wind Song]

Beginner's mind means to start over. I'm starting over. New beginning.

I accept the challenge of only posting when I'm at my best.

[logroller]

Welcome aboard back. You should introduce yourself.

[Wind Song]

Introduce myself?

Naw. I'm just here to listen....

[Wind Song]

My name is Judith, meaning
She Who Is Praised
I do not want to be called praised
I want to be called The Power of Love.

if Love means protect then whenever I do not
defend you
I cannot call my name Love.
if Love means rebirth then when I see us
dead on our feet
I cannot call my name Love.
if Love means provide & I cannot
provide for you
why would you call my name Love?

do not mistake my breasts
for mounds of potatoes
or my belly for a great roast duck.
do not take my lips for a streak of luck
nor my neck for an appletree,
do not believe my eyes are a warm swarm of bees;
do not get Love mixed up with me.

Don't misunderstand my hands
for a church with a steeple,
open the fingers & out come the people;
nor take my feet to be acres of solid brown earth,
or anything else of infinite worth
to you, my brawny turtledove;
do not get me mixed up with Love.

not until we have ground we call our own
to stand on
& weapons of our own in hand
& some kind of friends around us
will anyone ever call our name Love,
& then when we do we will all call ourselves
grand, muscley names:
the Protection of Love,
the Provision of Love & the
Power of Love.
until then, my sweethearts,
let us speak simply of
romance, which is so much
easier and so much less
than any of us deserve.

~Judy Grahn~<!-- google_ad_section_end -->

[Thunderknuckles]

You're almost as bad a buddhist as I am a christian. For all the great zen qualities you post, your persona on this board reflects none of them.

It is becoming my opinion that this board is becoming a tool for you to achieve some level of balance. In that endeavor, I wish you success.

[gabosaurus]

I've emptied my cup and I'm starting over.

http://www.cesas.lt/images/screens/go_away_noob.jpg


:poke:

[Wind Song]

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to take your comment Gabby.:bye1:

[logroller]

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to take your comment Gabby.:bye1:

With salt?

[Wind Song]

With salt?

I don't understand this comment either.

[revelarts]

At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked,
“Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. And he said:
“Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me.

Matthew 18

[Wind Song]

Another post that I don't understand.

Beginner's mind. Every moment a new beginning. Each day, starting over with a clean slate.

[DragonStryk72]

Another post that I don't understand.

It's a biblical example of the same thing that you are espousing in the OP, so he's agreeing with you from a differing philosophical bent. Children do not need to "empty their cup", because they never filled it to begin with. At the time of Christ, the Pharisees who oversaw the Jewish Law (Leviticus) had gotten it into people's minds that there was one clear path that could be taken step by step to Heaven, and so many of Christ's admonitions were about abandoning the dogma that was shackling the faith. Everyone kept asking for a single method, but in truth there isn't one.

People Judge because they believe they know the situation, but they don't, and have no business doing so. "Judge Not, Be Judged not" was the message from Christ.

The Pharisees claimed to know the will of God, to which Jesus said, "You cannot know God".

[Wind Song]

Thanks for the explanation. I'm having a tough time tonight understanding what people mean. It's probably because I'm distracted by my work. I'm on-call tonight for the crisis line and I've already taken three calls.

[logroller]

I don't understand this comment either.
To 'take it with a pinch of salt' -- It's an idiom, meaning accept it, but maintain a degree of skepticism.

[Wind Song]

To 'take it with a pinch of salt' -- It's an idiom, meaning accept it, but maintain a degree of skepticism.


OK. I'll accept with a degree of skepticism. Thanks for the explanation.

[DragonStryk72]

Thanks for the explanation. I'm having a tough time tonight understanding what people mean. It's probably because I'm distracted by my work. I'm on-call tonight for the crisis line and I've already taken three calls.

Don't be afraid to ask if you're not sure what one of us is saying. Usually, either that poster, or someone else, like me, will provide a more in-depth explanation.

As to Gabs, I think she was being a smartass, using the pope as an analog to the Master from the OP, with "Piss off, Noob" referring to a far more crude way of telling the supplicant he wasn't ready.

[Wind Song]

Don't be afraid to ask if you're not sure what one of us is saying. Usually, either that poster, or someone else, like me, will provide a more in-depth explanation.

As to Gabs, I think she was being a smartass, using the pope as an analog to the Master from the OP, with "Piss off, Noob" referring to a far more crude way of telling the supplicant he wasn't ready.


So are you saying that Gabby thought my beginner's mind analogy was insincere?

[logroller]

So are you saying that Gabby thought my beginner's mind analogy was insincere?

Not so much insincere...more like cynicism + sarcasm = sardonic

Like I said , pinch of salt

[avatar4321]

It's a biblical example of the same thing that you are espousing in the OP, so he's agreeing with you from a differing philosophical bent. Children do not need to "empty their cup", because they never filled it to begin with. At the time of Christ, the Pharisees who oversaw the Jewish Law (Leviticus) had gotten it into people's minds that there was one clear path that could be taken step by step to Heaven, and so many of Christ's admonitions were about abandoning the dogma that was shackling the faith. Everyone kept asking for a single method, but in truth there isn't one.

People Judge because they believe they know the situation, but they don't, and have no business doing so. "Judge Not, Be Judged not" was the message from Christ.

The Pharisees claimed to know the will of God, to which Jesus said, "You cannot know God".

Where on earth did Jesus ever say you cannot know God? He taught people how to obtain Eternal Life. Eternal Life is defined as knowing the Father and Christ who He sent.

The whole message of the scriptures is to bring people to to God.

[logroller]

Where on earth did Jesus ever say you cannot know God? He taught people how to obtain Eternal Life. Eternal Life is defined as knowing the Father and Christ who He sent.

The whole message of the scriptures is to bring people to to God.
I think it was about knowing the will of God.

[revelarts]

It's a biblical example of the same thing that you are espousing in the OP, so he's agreeing with you from a differing philosophical bent. Children do not need to "empty their cup", because they never filled it to begin with.
I'm sorta with you here.
Children are open, humble, ready to hear and believe.



At the time of Christ, the Pharisees who oversaw the Jewish Law (Leviticus) had gotten it into people's minds that there was one clear path that could be taken step by step to Heaven, and so many of Christ's admonitions were about abandoning the dogma that was shackling the faith. Everyone kept asking for a single method, but in truth there isn't one.

People Judge because they believe they know the situation, but they don't, and have no business doing so. "Judge Not, Be Judged not" was the message from Christ.

The Pharisees claimed to know the will of God, to which Jesus said, "You cannot know God".
Yah lost me.
Yeah I'm with avatar here.

Jesus was pretty Clear, that he is the way.
And the Will of God was for all to trust him.

here's a portion of a discussion Jesus had with a woman who had a religion that was what some would consider only a little different from Judaism.



19 “Sir,” the woman said, “I can see that you are a prophet. 20 Our ancestors worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem.”

21 “Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22 You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

25 The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.”

26 Then Jesus declared, “I, the one speaking to you—I am he.”

He didn't say ...i am One of many Messiahs or Christs... BTW.

But Jesus acknowledge that part of what the woman believed was exactly right. And the Scripture says that about parts of most faiths.
One of the things that Jesus says that the Samaritan woman had exactly right was that:
"When he -the messiah- comes, he will explain everything to us.”

[Wind Song]

Beginner's mind means to not think you know everything. It means your cup is open at the top, empty and ready to receive what's availalble to learn. It's about starting over, making a new beginning.

[DragonStryk72]

So are you saying that Gabby thought my beginner's mind analogy was insincere?

Nope, she thought there was a joke to be made, and she made it. Has nothing to do with sincerity, agreeing or disagreeing with you.

[Wind Song]

Nope, she thought there was a joke to be made, and she made it. Has nothing to do with sincerity, agreeing or disagreeing with you.

I'm glad you know each other well enough to help me understand some posts.

[DragonStryk72]

I'm sorta with you here.
Children are open, humble, ready to hear and believe.


Yah lost me.
Yeah I'm with avatar here.

Jesus was pretty Clear, that he is the way.
And the Will of God was for all to trust him.

here's a portion of a discussion Jesus had with a woman who had a religion that was what some would consider only a little different from Judaism.

Okay, Rev, six years of Catholic school talking here, but if you ever want anyone to actually listen to you on this, you've gotta start bending a bit. Seriously, even Christ didn't completely roll over people with biblical truth (For instance, specifically stopping his apostle from calling him the Messiah). So, how many Our Fathers and Hail Mary's are we required to say each day in order to count as Christians? What foods must we give up to follow Christ's message? What special preparations must we make with our food so that it is properly sanctified?

Exactly, we don't. Judaism did require many of these things, such as Kosher food, not eating pork, outlined prayers, and it all pulled away from actual faith in God. It's much the same with Muslims. They became too caught up on the dogma, which was precisely what God saw coming when Solomon went to build the temple: "Build me no places of worship"


He didn't say ...i am One of many Messiahs or Christs... BTW.

But Jesus acknowledge that part of what the woman believed was exactly right. And the Scripture says that about parts of most faiths.
One of the things that Jesus says that the Samaritan woman had exactly right was that:
"When he -the messiah- comes, he will explain everything to us.”

He also said "Judge Not, Be Judged not", unless you're going to try and prove otherwise. As well, you cannot know the exact qualifications to get into Heaven, Rev. It simply isn't possible to know that, because if it were as simple as believing in Christ, then strictly speaking, Hitler is in Heaven right now. There has to be a scale, because humans are flawed, we err, and that is why "Ask, and ye Shall receive" was such a central message. Truly ask for forgiveness, and it shall be received.

[gabosaurus]

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to take your comment Gabby.:bye1:

http://m.demotivation.us/media/demotivators/thumb/demotivation.us_Sarcasm-if-you-dont-get-it-then-its-probably-about-you_130393237133.jpg

[revelarts]

He also said "Judge Not, Be Judged not", unless you're going to try and prove otherwise. As well, you cannot know the exact qualifications to get into Heaven, Rev. It simply isn't possible to know that, because if it were as simple as believing in Christ, then strictly speaking, Hitler is in Heaven right now. There has to be a scale, because humans are flawed, we err, and that is why "Ask, and ye Shall receive" was such a central message. Truly ask for forgiveness, and it shall be received.

Cool dragon I can bend, and reply to your comments,
But before i do can you give me an honest response to what i posted?

Did i misrepresent what Jesus said to the woman?
Is what he said to the woman JUST AS TRUE AS "judge not less you be judged."?


I'll be glad to reply and bend but what parts of what Jesus said do you want me to bend?

[logroller]

Cool dragon I can bend, and reply to your comments,
But before i do can you give me an honest response to what i posted?

Did i misrepresent what Jesus said to the woman?
Is what he said to the woman JUST AS TRUE AS "judge not less you be judged."?


I'll be glad to reply and bend but what parts of what Jesus said do you want me to bend?
Well I'd disagree with your saying God's will is for us to trust him. God's will be done, yet not all trust God; ergo God's doesn't will us to trust him. I assume then, it is our will to trust him.

[revelarts]

Well I'd disagree with your saying God's will is for us to trust him. God's will be done, yet not all trust God; ergo God's doesn't will us to trust him. I assume then, it is our will to trust him.

Well Log you got a point.
That's a question that gets a little deeper than i want to go. that larger picture, God's will vs mans Free will.
Suffice to say at this point, God created a path, via trust in Jesus's sacrifice, which he is please to have people use to reach Him and for eternal life.

[Wind Song]

http://m.demotivation.us/media/demotivators/thumb/demotivation.us_Sarcasm-if-you-dont-get-it-then-its-probably-about-you_130393237133.jpg

Why?

[Dilloduck]

You miss humor and sarcasm because your cup is not as empty as you claim.

[Wind Song]

You miss humor and sarcasm because your cup is not as empty as you claim.


I think it's more a question of not knowing Gabby at all. Humor and sarcasm are two different animals.

[SassyLady]

Beginner's mind means to not think you know everything. It means your cup is open at the top, empty and ready to receive what's availalble to learn. It's about starting over, making a new beginning.

If you truly are starting over with the beginner's mind regarding this board, then aren't you afraid you'll become more conservative?

[Wind Song]

If you truly are starting over with the beginner's mind regarding this board, then aren't you afraid you'll become more conservative?

No.

[Wind Song]

If you truly are starting over with the beginner's mind regarding this board, then aren't you afraid you'll become more conservative?


In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities, in the expert's mind there are few. Suzuki Roshi

You could consider beginner's mind as "don't know" mind. It implies an openness.

[Dilloduck]

Your actions are in direct opposition to your words.

[Wind Song]

I'm being much more careful with you, dillo. I finally recognized what it is in your posting style that I choose not to follow.

[Dilloduck]

I'm being much more careful with you, dillo. I finally recognized what it is in your posting style that I choose not to follow.

Great idea--that's bound to confuse matters more.

[Wind Song]

Being more careful with you, starting this morning.

[Dilloduck]

Being more careful with you, starting this morning.

Chicken shit.

[Wind Song]

Chicken shit.

I'm trying to have a conversation with you that is free of enmity. What's wrong with that? I've had nearly 100% negative feedback about my posting style, so I am trying to change it.

[Dilloduck]

I'm trying to have a conversation with you that is free of enmity. What's wrong with that? I've had nearly 100% negative feedback about my posting style, so I am trying to change it.

Changing it to please people ? Now there's a stupid plan. Just say wft comes to your mind. No one is going to slap the shit out of you.

[Wind Song]

Changing it to please people ? Now there's a stupid plan. Just say wft comes to your mind. No one is going to slap the shit out of you.

You've apparently not been paying attention to the rest of the community. I'm adjusting my posting style at the request of most of the people who post on this forum. I choose to conform to DP culture.

[Dilloduck]

You've apparently not been paying attention to the rest of the community. I'm adjusting my posting style at the request of most of the people who post on this forum. I choose to conform to DP culture.

How generous of you.

[Wind Song]

How generous of you.


Sarcasm noted.

[Dilloduck]

Whose posting style will serve as your role model?

[Wind Song]

Whose posting style will serve as your role model?


There are a number of people who post here whose style I appreciate. fj1200, is one. Howard Roark is another.

[Wind Song]

Surrender Dorothy..

I give myself an A for effort today, and for pulling back before I said anything I would later regret.

[Wind Song]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Nb848V_zHI&feature=related

Snatam Kaur~The Sun Shines on Everyone

[Dilloduck]

Surrender Dorothy..

I give myself an A for effort today, and for pulling back before I said anything I would later regret.

Are you taking all of the neg rep back too ?:laugh:

[Wind Song]

You earned it.

[Wind Song]

Beginner's mind means every moment is a new beginning.

[Shadow]

Surrender Dorothy..

I give myself an A for effort today, and for pulling back before I said anything I would later regret.

Me too since your goal today...like every other day... is spamming the board with only the topics you want discussed...and anything else that turns the discussions back to yourself.

A+ indeed.:rolleyes:

[Wind Song]

Me too since your goal today...like every other day... is spamming the board with only the topics you want discussed...and anything else that turns the discussions back to yourself.

A+ indeed.:rolleyes:


Well kiddo, thanks for your comment. I get the distinct impression that you don't like it if I start a thread, and that you don't like it if I comment on someone's thread.

Beginner's mind means every moment is a new beginning. That means I let go of your criticism the second after you say it.

I'm having a good time. I wish you the same.

[Shadow]

Well kiddo, thanks for your comment. I get the distinct impression that you don't like it if I start a thread, and that you don't like it if I comment on someone's thread.

Beginner's mind means every moment is a new beginning. That means I let go of your criticism the second after you say it.

I'm having a good time. I wish you the same.

Of course you are. Why else would you spend morning until night on here keeping the spotlight on yourself . DUH.

[Wind Song]

Of course you are. Why else would you spend morning until night on here keeping the spotlight on yourself . DUH.

Besides shutting up permanently, how else can I make your posting life more meaningful?

Really, tell me exactly what you'd like me to do.

[Dilloduck]

Besides shutting up permanently, how else can I make your posting life more meaningful?

Really, tell me exactly what you'd like me to do.

Have babies.