McDonald’s faces scrutiny over Brazil pay

[tailfins]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d129943e-832b-11e1-9f9a-00144feab49a.html?ftcamp=published_links/rss/companies_retail-consumer/feed//product#axzz1rk0zhM3H

I asked the manager in a Rio de Janeiro McDonalds about why they charge the same price for a number one as in the US, but pay the help a small fraction. He replied that for every Real in compensation Brasilia charges R$1,30 in taxes and fees. In other words every R$100 in wages costs the company R$230. Add to that the mandatory Christmas bonus of a month's pay and a month's paid vacation.

[darin]

If folks don't like the pay, they will find other work. Non-issue.

[tailfins]

If folks don't like the pay, they will find other work. Non-issue.

Responses like yours is exactly what wins elections for the ruling Socialist Workers Party (PT) and the Communist Party of Brasil (PC do B) [part of the ruling coalition]. Wages/Salaries in Brazil are 1/3 or less than a similar job in the US ACROSS PROFESSIONS. The money being spent to employ someone is close in the US versus Brazil, however in Brazil, most of payroll gets sent to the government.

Here is what wins elections in Brazil: This guy's winning election slogan was "Vote for the idiot: ME"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KbK8RkYlvE

[darin]

Elections are based on reactions, not votes?

Weird.

employees accepting low wages is exactly why employers keep offering low wages.

[Noir]

If folks don't like the pay, they will find other work. Non-issue.

Just a tad flippant =/

Reminds me of an African production plant for the Giant Tesco (simalar to your WalMart). The workers turn up one day to be told that they had all been fired as a new company had bought the plant (though Ofcourse, the new company was owned by tesco too) the 'good' news for the now unemployed was that the 'new' company was willing to hire all of the old employees with immediate effect, for the small price of a 40% cut in their hourly wage. And if they didn't like it, they could go find another job...

Easy to be flippant when it isn't you and your loved ones lives depending on a wage that isn't good enough, but atleast means you get something.

[darin]

Not flippant. I'm 'FREE'. When the gov't steps in, costs rise, efficiencies drop. When the feds REQUIRE a wage scale, businesses suffer.

The problem is the people willing to sell their work for a low wage. Its as if you believe businesses OWE people a job. :( Then again, you've been raised in a very restricted, socialist society. Its like you've fallen in love with your captors. I get it.

[fj1200]

If folks don't like the pay, they will find other work. Non-issue.

Issue because every job is affected by the same tax rules and with such onerous tax rules it will limit any other real opportunity they may have.

[Trigg]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d129943e-832b-11e1-9f9a-00144feab49a.html?ftcamp=published_links/rss/companies_retail-consumer/feed//product#axzz1rk0zhM3H

I asked the manager in a Rio de Janeiro McDonalds about why they charge the same price for a number one as in the US, but pay the help a small fraction. He replied that for every Real in compensation Brasilia charges R$1,30 in taxes and fees. In other words every R$100 in wages costs the company R$230. Add to that the mandatory Christmas bonus of a month's pay and a month's paid vacation.

I'm unable to pull more of the article up.

From the little you posted it looks like the employee is getting quite a bit more than a US employee would (a month's Christmas bonus and a Months vacation) so I could understand why the company offers a lower wage in exchange for better employee perks.

I don't see a problem with that.

[tailfins]

Not flippant. I'm 'FREE'. When the gov't steps in, costs rise, efficiencies drop. When the feds REQUIRE a wage scale, businesses suffer.

The problem is the people willing to sell their work for a low wage. Its as if you believe businesses OWE people a job. :( Then again, you've been raised in a very restricted, socialist society. Its like you've fallen in love with your captors. I get it.


You may be right that it's a non-issue if you properly identify the issue. It's not "stingy" McDonald's or other companies. It's evidence that the Brazilian people are willing to sacrifice for social justice to further the goals of the Socialist Worker's Party and Communist Party of Brazil.

Brazilians Sacrificing for Social Justice:
http://media.lonelyplanet.com/lpimg/929/929-32/preview.jpg

[ConHog]

Why should we care what a burger flipper in Brazil earns?

[tailfins]

Why should we care what a burger flipper in Brazil earns?

To properly assign blame when socialists complain how little McDonald's or other companies pay which in some places are comparable to US inmate wages. Also, you can take out a work visa in Brazil if you want to rehearse for Obama's second term.

[ConHog]

To properly assign blame when socialists complain how little McDonald's or other companies pay.


What McDonalds pays here in the US has nothing to do with what they pay in Brazil. Therefor I don't care what they pay in Brazil.

As for who to "blame" for low wages. Blame the workers for being mostly uneducated buffoons who quite simply don't deserve to be paid more. I certainly don't want to pay $12.99 for my number 3 because some idiot who didn't bother to graduate high school wants to earn more money.

[tailfins]

What McDonalds pays here in the US has nothing to do with what they pay in Brazil. Therefor I don't care what they pay in Brazil.

As for who to "blame" for low wages. Blame the workers for being mostly uneducated buffoons who quite simply don't deserve to be paid more. I certainly don't want to pay $12.99 for my number 3 because some idiot who didn't bother to graduate high school wants to earn more money.

You may not be able to buy a number three at all when you don't have answers to respond to occupiers demanding that no building permits be issued to McDonald's for being "socially irresponsible". Try finding a Walmart in the five boroughs of NYC if you want to see the template.

[Abbey Marie]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d129943e-832b-11e1-9f9a-00144feab49a.html?ftcamp=published_links/rss/companies_retail-consumer/feed//product#axzz1rk0zhM3H

I asked the manager in a Rio de Janeiro McDonalds about why they charge the same price for a number one as in the US, but pay the help a small fraction. He replied that for every Real in compensation Brasilia charges R$1,30 in taxes and fees. In other words every R$100 in wages costs the company R$230. Add to that the mandatory Christmas bonus of a month's pay and a month's paid vacation.

Coming soon to a country near you. :(

[DragonStryk72]

What McDonalds pays here in the US has nothing to do with what they pay in Brazil. Therefor I don't care what they pay in Brazil.

As for who to "blame" for low wages. Blame the workers for being mostly uneducated buffoons who quite simply don't deserve to be paid more. I certainly don't want to pay $12.99 for my number 3 because some idiot who didn't bother to graduate high school wants to earn more money.

Hey, CH, I've flipped burgers, I was both a high school graduate, and I'm former Navy. So, a little less condescension please?

As to why we should pay attention to Brazil, it's because cost of living is equivalent to the US cost of living. It would actually be far lower, and allow citizens to be able to own far better property, if their government weren't so insanely top heavy. This is the direction that CA could easily head in due to the way they run their government, so yeah, it has some bearing, as an example.

[logroller]

You may not be able to buy a number three at all when you don't have answers to respond to occupiers demanding that no building permits be issued to McDonald's for being "socially irresponsible". Try finding a Walmart in the five boroughs of NYC if you want to see the template.

'occupiers' ? You mean the residents of the boroughs. I think they should be able to charter their own course. If that's no McDs or Walmarts or Marijuana dispensaries or liquor stores-- 'tis their right to charter their own. That's far different than a nationalized system; as its far easier to travel out of the city than abroad of country. Nonetheless, you'll find a flourishing black market in the tri-border area of Brazil. Free markets find a way.

[jimnyc]

I'm retired burger flipper from Roy Rogers, circa 1983 or so. And I was good at it! I would stick a small piece of wood in the burgers for my friends. When no one was looking I learned to eat an entire cheeseburger in 2 bites so that I didn't get caught stealing. Never spit on any food, that's disgusting to think that other flippers do that and gave us a bad name, but I did kind of purposely drop a burger or 2 on the ground and then accidentally kick it before placing it back on the grill.

Anyway, IMO, McDonald's is going to pay whatever the shittiest wage is for the area they open their store. You're lucky to get a nickel over minimum if you start at one here in NY. I'm confident it ain't much different elsewhere, but wages might increase with time or duties.

As for Brazil, what they pay employees and what a burger cost have nothing to do with one another, I feel that's in there for effect. If they can get some idiot to pay $1000 for a burger, and they pay the employee $10hr, who cares? So as for me, I don't give a crap what they charge for their food, customers will decide if they want to eat there or not. The wages on the other hand... Do they have a minimum wage law there? And if so, are they paying that? And if not, are they paying what similar jobs would pay in that area?

[MtnBiker]

Do we know what the locally owned flop&puke burger joint in Rio de Janeiro pays it's employees?

[jimnyc]

Do we know what the locally owned flop&puke burger joint in Rio de Janeiro pays it's employees?

From what I understand about the crime rate over there, probably the ability to continue breathing.

[tailfins]

Do we know what the locally owned flop&puke burger joint in Rio de Janeiro pays it's employees?

Funny you should mention that: I indeed asked that question and the response was "Nao chega dois salarios" which means less than double the minimum wage.

To illustrate this problem cuts across all professions, here are the BEST paying professions by monthly salaries:
http://www.hiperativo.com/carreiras-com-os-melhores-salarios-do-brasil/

[DragonStryk72]

I'm retired burger flipper from Roy Rogers, circa 1983 or so. And I was good at it! I would stick a small piece of wood in the burgers for my friends. When no one was looking I learned to eat an entire cheeseburger in 2 bites so that I didn't get caught stealing. Never spit on any food, that's disgusting to think that other flippers do that and gave us a bad name, but I did kind of purposely drop a burger or 2 on the ground and then accidentally kick it before placing it back on the grill.

Anyway, IMO, McDonald's is going to pay whatever the shittiest wage is for the area they open their store. You're lucky to get a nickel over minimum if you start at one here in NY. I'm confident it ain't much different elsewhere, but wages might increase with time or duties.

As for Brazil, what they pay employees and what a burger cost have nothing to do with one another, I feel that's in there for effect. If they can get some idiot to pay $1000 for a burger, and they pay the employee $10hr, who cares? So as for me, I don't give a crap what they charge for their food, customers will decide if they want to eat there or not. The wages on the other hand... Do they have a minimum wage law there? And if so, are they paying that? And if not, are they paying what similar jobs would pay in that area?

Actually they do 8.50~9.00/hr up here, starting, and in vermont it was 9.00/hr, so about $1.25-$1.75 over minimum. Believe it or not, they're not that bad as far as pay goes, mainly because the job sucks a lot. Even with that, there's high turnover here. Upswing: Free/reduced price meals.

The bitching about Mcdonald's pay is pretty reminiscent to me of the "Wal-Mart" pay sucks, even though the average pay there is $10/hr or more, and you get more hours than you would at pretty much any other store in the area, but hey, why let facts get in the way of an argument?

[ConHog]

Hey, CH, I've flipped burgers, I was both a high school graduate, and I'm former Navy. So, a little less condescension please?

As to why we should pay attention to Brazil, it's because cost of living is equivalent to the US cost of living. It would actually be far lower, and allow citizens to be able to own far better property, if their government weren't so insanely top heavy. This is the direction that CA could easily head in due to the way they run their government, so yeah, it has some bearing, as an example.

I have no issue with burger flippers. just saying that those who expect that to be a high paying profession aren't being realistic.

[Abbey Marie]

I thought the op was about the high taxes in Brasilia causing the high prices.

[gabosaurus]

employees accepting low wages is exactly why employers keep offering low wages.

This is exactly the cause of illegal immigration. In Mexico, wages are kept low by companies working in collusion. Which is why 10 percent of the population make 90 percent of the income. And why police and other government officials are easily bribed by drug cartels.
If every employer offers 25 cents an hour, workers have pretty much no choice. And we are often talking 12 hour days, not our 40 hour week. And under dangerous work conditions. This is not even mentioning the kickbacks many workplaces and workers have to pay to police and drug cartels.
If you have kids, your choice is usually this: Do I work for low wages here, or do I cross the border at a risk, but with the reward of earning 10 to 50 times more?

[tailfins]

This is exactly the cause of illegal immigration. In Mexico, wages are kept low by companies working in collusion. Which is why 10 percent of the population make 90 percent of the income. And why police and other government officials are easily bribed by drug cartels.
If every employer offers 25 cents an hour, workers have pretty much no choice. And we are often talking 12 hour days, not our 40 hour week. And under dangerous work conditions. This is not even mentioning the kickbacks many workplaces and workers have to pay to police and drug cartels.
If you have kids, your choice is usually this: Do I work for low wages here, or do I cross the border at a risk, but with the reward of earning 10 to 50 times more?

In much of Latin America the wages are low because THE GOVERNMENT takes the money and the employee never sees it. The the most extreme case is Cuba where the state charges companies absurd rates for services provided by "the people" while paying $20-$30 per month to the people doing the labor. It's SOCIALISM stealing payroll before the employee sees it, NOT companies paying starvation wages.

[fj1200]

This is exactly the cause of illegal immigration. In Mexico, wages are kept low by companies working in collusion.

If you had said "in collusion with government" you might be correct. The government clearly doesn't care about its' citizens otherwise it would provide an environment where real economic growth and advancement for its people could occur.

[ConHog]

If you had said "in collusion with government" you might be correct. The government clearly doesn't care about its' citizens otherwise it would provide an environment where real economic growth and advancement for its people could occur.

I assume we all understood that the government has to be in on the collusion. I mean here in this country no number of companies could get together and decide to ignore the federal minimum wage, for example. So of course the Mexican government could do the same but don't because they are in on the jig.

[fj1200]

I assume we all understood that the government has to be in on the collusion. I mean here in this country no number of companies could get together and decide to ignore the federal minimum wage, for example. So of course the Mexican government could do the same but don't because they are in on the jig.

There is no requirement to collude with the government, they can easily collude with each other while the incompetence and/or ineffectiveness of governing officials goes on unabated.

[tailfins]

There is no requirement to collude with the government, they can easily collude with each other while the incompetence and/or ineffectiveness of governing officials goes on unabated.

There certainly is a requirement to "collude" with government. In Brazil the payroll fees of 130% of wages are mandatory. In Cuba direct employment agreements are illegal under penalty of seizure of your business. The Castro brothers want to make sure individuals don't receive money that might be spent in a socially irresponsible manner.

[fj1200]

Twas speaking of Mexico.

[ConHog]

Twas speaking of Mexico.

That is true, but you can bet that the reason there is no federal minimum wage in Mexico is because the government has been bought off. Now true, that isn't exactly the same as if the government were caught passing a law saying companies only had to pay 25 cents an hour, but the end result is the same.