Romney: If You Want Free Stuff, Vote For Obama

[tailfins]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/03/20/romney_to_contraception_heckler_if_you_want_free_s tuff_vote_for_obama.html

[revelarts]

that's the best quote yet from Romney.

I'd like to hope that head'd try to repeal Obama's health care plans but I doubt it.

[LiberalNation]

I want free stuff.

& I really like obama healthcare law that is allowing me to stay on my parents insurance till I'm 24.

[cadet]

I want free stuff.

& I really like obama healthcare law that is allowing me to stay on my parents insurance till I'm 24.

(please be joking...)

[Little-Acorn]

(please be joking...)

He probably is.

Keep in mind, of course, that kids can't stay on their parents' insurance thru age 24 (actually it's 26) if the parents feel like kicking them off.

Parents have to be the enablers here, keeping their kids kids.

[tailfins]

He probably is.

Keep in mind, of course, that kids can't stay on their parents' insurance thru age 24 (actually it's 26) if the parents feel like kicking them off.

Parents have to be the enablers here, keeping their kids kids.

You have swerved into something very significant. It seems designed to promote dependency and discourage autonomous adulthood.

[Nukeman]

He probably is.

Keep in mind, of course, that kids can't stay on their parents' insurance thru age 24 (actually it's 26) if the parents feel like kicking them off.

Parents have to be the enablers here, keeping their kids kids.


You have swerved into something very significant. It seems designed to promote dependency and discourage autonomous adulthood.
Actually that is the ONLY part of Obamacare that I like. The demographic with some of the highest uninsured rates is young adults from the age of 18-25, tell me both of you WHEN and WHAT age are most college students, are they working full time to obtain insurance on their own?? Do you feel they should pay for it through the college, hell should the college even offer insurance?

Nothing and no one is being "enabled" with keeping young adults on insurance during their college years and even a little beyond until the insurance is available to them through their own employment.....

Or would you prefer that these young adults have NO insurance and have a medical event, hell just have the hospital write it off, not like it cost anything to do that right!!!!

[darin]

I think the Gov't should fund abortions for ALL women - NOT JUST pregnant ladies. Why should a lady HAVE to get pregnant for an ABORTION? That's discriminatory.

[tailfins]

Actually that is the ONLY part of Obamacare that I like. The demographic with some of the highest uninsured rates is young adults from the age of 18-25, tell me both of you WHEN and WHAT age are most college students, are they working full time to obtain insurance on their own?? Do you feel they should pay for it through the college, hell should the college even offer insurance?

Nothing and no one is being "enabled" with keeping young adults on insurance during their college years and even a little beyond until the insurance is available to them through their own employment.....

Or would you prefer that these young adults have NO insurance and have a medical event, hell just have the hospital write it off, not like it cost anything to do that right!!!!


The parents still have power over their children since the parents can cancel the coverage of those young adults. If it were young adults could get their own policies at the same price as if they were on their parent's policy, that would be another discussion.

[fj1200]

I want free stuff.

& I really like obama healthcare law that is allowing me to stay on my parents insurance till I'm 24.

You do know nothing is free right? And that regulation is an additional mandate that raises the cost of insurance for everyone?

[SassyLady]

(please be joking...)

She's not.

[jimnyc]

I would like to see an update from the woman in the video that went viral in 2008 - the woman who was overjoyed at Obama being President as he was going to pay for her mortgage and gas. Never mind the mortgage part, I would just like an update from her as to how she likes the gas now after Obama's been in office for 4 years. Free my ass.

[SassyLady]

I would like to see an update from the woman in the video that went viral in 2008 - the woman who was overjoyed at Obama being President as he was going to pay for her mortgage and gas. Never mind the mortgage part, I would just like an update from her as to how she likes the gas now after Obama's been in office for 4 years. Free my ass.

No need ... Watch this.

here's some of the transcript




Pelosi’s video then offered the perspective of those in the welfare line.“I’m here tryin’ to get some Obama bucks, that’s what I’m doin’, trying to get some Obama money,” said one man in a Yankees baseball cap.“I am here to get some benefits, you know I mean, I’m here to get a check,” said another man as he blew smoke in the air. “Bitch, I wanna check.”
Everyone featured in the video promised to vote for President Barack Obama.“Cause, he gives me stuff,” a woman answered when asked why she likes Obama.“Cause he’s black,” said another man.One man admitted to not working in a decade. Another explained he cannot work because of his background as a former convict, and another man added that he deserves benefits because of the country’s history of slavery.The subjects of Pelosi’s film admitted that they don’t want to work — just a free check.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/18/a-pelosi-maher-go-to-nyc-welfare-office-to-show-plight-of-the-poor/#ixzz1pi0F4Tjd
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/18/a-pelosi-maher-go-to-nyc-welfare-office-to-show-plight-of-the-poor/#ixzz1pi00NWPh

[LiberalNation]

You have swerved into something very significant. It seems designed to promote dependency and discourage autonomous adulthood.
I don't know of anyone my age who has a good enough job that it offers insurance benifits....

[SassyLady]

I don't know of anyone my age who has a good enough job that it offers insurance benifits....

Aren't you in the military?

[LiberalNation]

besides those in the military, if I took tricare it would take almost all my drill pay every month. I don't hang out with other soldiers.

[SassyLady]

besides those in the military, if I took tricare it would take almost all my drill pay every month. I don't hang out with other soldiers.

Well, if you had a full time job elsewhere, the Drill Pay would be worth it to get Tricare. Don't you think it's better than bumming off your parents?

[darin]

I don't know of anyone my age who has a good enough job that it offers insurance benifits....

Kids your age are generally healthy. Anyone can buy 'emergency' type health insurance. Otherwise, pay out of pocket if you have to go to the doctor for a cold.

(shrug).

[logroller]

I think the Gov't should fund abortions for ALL women - NOT JUST pregnant ladies. Why should a lady HAVE to get pregnant for an ABORTION? That's discriminatory.

Its called menses...hence the birth control mandate :thumb:

[fj1200]

Kids your age are generally healthy. Anyone can buy 'emergency' type health insurance. Otherwise, pay out of pocket if you have to go to the doctor for a cold.

(shrug).

:eek: Heaven forbid...

[tailfins]

:eek: Heaven forbid...


A visit to the local doc-in-the-box runs about 80 bucks at your local pharmacy chain. Even someone earning minimum wage should be able to afford that.

[LiberalNation]

Well, if you had a full time job elsewhere, the Drill Pay would be worth it to get Tricare. Don't you think it's better than bumming off your parents?
I don't have a full x job & no I don't. My parents are quite well off & prefer I'm fully insurered so I can see a shrink every 2 weeks.

[fj1200]

I don't have a full x job & no I don't. My parents are quite well off & prefer I'm fully insurered so I can see a shrink every 2 weeks.

Or, and follow me here, they could pay for your policy. :eek:

[logroller]

Or, and follow me here, they could pay for your policy. :eek:

Conversely, if they pay for health insurance for their family (ie them and their dependents); how is it that they don't pay for it?

[logroller]

A visit to the local doc-in-the-box runs about 80 bucks at your local pharmacy chain. Even someone earning minimum wage should be able to afford that.

I need a doc-in-the-box round my house...even with insurance, I pay that. Perhaps if there weren't all these employers subsidizing health insurance and driving up the cost of healthcare... that gift horse should come with dental coverage-- that's all I'm saying.:laugh:

[tailfins]

besides those in the military, if I took tricare it would take almost all my drill pay every month. I don't hang out with other soldiers.


You have another option: Your county health department for simple doctor visits, especially if you are low income. I see you are in Louisville, KY in your post's header.

Here you are for preventative care: http://www.louisvilleky.gov/Health/Clinics/


Don't confuse treatment with insurance.

[darin]

...or...when you are sick and can't afford treatment...go anyway and use existing programs. OR...chalk it up to bad luck? I dunno. IMMORAL for folks to force their care upon others.

[fj1200]

Conversely, if they pay for health insurance for their family (ie them and their dependents); how is it that they don't pay for it?

The real issue of course being that this mandate, on top of all the other mandates, is yet another cost driver for health insurance. Or it would be disingenuous to complain about fast rising medical costs and then be happy that, "I got my birth control for 'free,'" and/or, "hey, I'll just be on my parents insurance as a 'free'-rider."

[logroller]

The real issue of course being that this mandate, on top of all the other mandates, is yet another cost driver for health insurance. Or it would be disingenuous to complain about fast rising medical costs and then be happy that, "I got my birth control for 'free,'" and/or, "hey, I'll just be on my parents insurance as a 'free'-rider."
Hey brother I feel ya. It's a runaway train. Not to mix idioms, but you ever seen Airplane!? Where they're doing interviews with people, and somebody quips,'they knew what they were getting into. I say, let em crash!' until all people are responsible for their own healthcare coverage, the problem of rising costs will continue to mount. If I were king for a day, Ive got some ideas that would fix the problem; but the reality is politicians won't get reelected if they put in place subtle measures to lower costs, it's too indirect. Rather, they cut taxes and/or increase benefits. Neither holds long-term promise, but it sure does garner votes.

[Nukeman]

The real issue of course being that this mandate, on top of all the other mandates, is yet another cost driver for health insurance. Or it would be disingenuous to complain about fast rising medical costs and then be happy that, "I got my birth control for 'free,'" and/or, "hey, I'll just be on my parents insurance as a 'free'-rider."Do you pay for a "family plan" if not you really don't have room to talk. The family plan where I work is DOUBLE the cost for a single person. Now I ahve the oppourtunity to keep my kids on during the time they are in college WITHOUT having to jump through a shit load of hoops, like I said this is probably the ONLY thing I like about the whole obamacare. and a child is NOT a "free rider" It cost ME money not you, not to mention that the demeographic with some of the LOWEST healthcare use is the young adult between the ages of 18-25 so they rarely use it but it is now available if their parents want to keep the family plan. It's not like your placing your parents or elderly grand parents who will utilize the hell out of the care....

So I am either paying through my personal health care provider with higher premiums for a family plan or I pay less and buy a secondary supplemental plan for my kids through the college. I really don't see what some of you find so terrible about this. Maybe you dont have college age kids maybe you don't have kids, either way it doesn't affect you... YET!!!!

So this really isn't FREE msomeone pays for it and that someone is the policy holder

[fj1200]

Hey brother I feel ya. It's a runaway train. Not to mix idioms, but you ever seen Airplane!? Where they're doing interviews with people, and somebody quips,'they knew what they were getting into. I say, let em crash!' until all people are responsible for their own healthcare coverage, the problem of rising costs will continue to mount. If I were king for a day, Ive got some ideas that would fix the problem; but the reality is politicians won't get reelected if they put in place subtle measures to lower costs, it's too indirect. Rather, they cut taxes and/or increase benefits. Neither holds long-term promise, but it sure does garner votes.

Which is why the problem only festers. A group of politicians will band together and force private enterprise to add another "benefit" that will please a particular voting block (see below) but exacerbates the exact problem that everyone complains about which engenders more "solutions." That only reinforces my statement that, "Congress, as an institution, is stupid." You are correct though, depending on what you mean exactly, that people are not responsible for their own HC. They are almost completely insulated from the true cost of what they receive; they don't know the real cost of their insurance, they don't know the real cost of a doctor's visit, they don't know the comparative costs of other treatment options, etc., they only know, "if it's covered" and "what's my copay." What will truly fix the problem of runaway HC costs is massive deregulation that turns us into true consumers of HC with responsibility for dollars spent. Once that occurs, we can turn insurance into true risk mitigation rather than a HC payment plan. We can also turn HC for those that can't afford it into a safety net program rather than one that is becomes another entitlement program for the middle class.


Do you pay for a "family plan" if not you really don't have room to talk. The family plan where I work is DOUBLE the cost for a single person. Now I ahve the oppourtunity to keep my kids on during the time they are in college WITHOUT having to jump through a shit load of hoops, like I said this is probably the ONLY thing I like about the whole obamacare. and a child is NOT a "free rider" It cost ME money not you, not to mention that the demeographic with some of the LOWEST healthcare use is the young adult between the ages of 18-25 so they rarely use it but it is now available if their parents want to keep the family plan. It's not like your placing your parents or elderly grand parents who will utilize the hell out of the care....

So I am either paying through my personal health care provider with higher premiums for a family plan or I pay less and buy a secondary supplemental plan for my kids through the college. I really don't see what some of you find so terrible about this. Maybe you dont have college age kids maybe you don't have kids, either way it doesn't affect you... YET!!!!

So this really isn't FREE msomeone pays for it and that someone is the policy holder

I'm not sure what our paying for a family plan has to do with it but here we go. If a private firm, either the insurance company or your company, wants to offer that benefit I have no problem with that. If government is going to mandate what must be offered I have a problem with that, understand that your new benefit is going to cost people more who do not fall into that category. Why should others now be responsible for a portion of the cost of the benefit for your family?

You say that the young adult will "rarely use it," which is true, so why pay for a traditional plan which will most likely hardly be used? That makes no sense, but to buy a catastrophic plan that will kick in in the event of an emergency does make sense. It's about getting people to make good decisions based on true costs. If you knew the true cost of a traditional plan for a college student (unlikely to be utilized) versus a catastrophic plan (hopefully not to be utilized) then you could make a more informed decision. That is what this is about.

[logroller]

Which is why the problem only festers. A group of politicians will band together and force private enterprise to add another "benefit" that will please a particular voting block (see below) but exacerbates the exact problem that everyone complains about which engenders more "solutions." That only reinforces my statement that, "Congress, as an institution, is stupid." You are correct though, depending on what you mean exactly, that people are not responsible for their own HC. They are almost completely insulated from the true cost of what they receive; they don't know the real cost of their insurance, they don't know the real cost of a doctor's visit, they don't know the comparative costs of other treatment options, etc., they only know, "if it's covered" and "what's my copay." What will truly fix the problem of runaway HC costs is massive deregulation that turns us into true consumers of HC with responsibility for dollars spent. Once that occurs, we can turn insurance into true risk mitigation rather than a HC payment plan. We can also turn HC for those that can't afford it into a safety net program rather than one that is becomes another entitlement program for the middle class.



I'm not sure what our paying for a family plan has to do with it but here we go. If a private firm, either the insurance company or your company, wants to offer that benefit I have no problem with that. If government is going to mandate what must be offered I have a problem with that, understand that your new benefit is going to cost people more who do not fall into that category. Why should others now be responsible for a portion of the cost of the benefit for your family?

You say that the young adult will "rarely use it," which is true, so why pay for a traditional plan which will most likely hardly be used? That makes no sense, but to buy a catastrophic plan that will kick in in the event of an emergency does make sense. It's about getting people to make good decisions based on true costs. If you knew the true cost of a traditional plan for a college student (unlikely to be utilized) versus a catastrophic plan (hopefully not to be utilized) then you could make a more informed decision. That is what this is about.
Is it congress that's stupid, or those that put them there?

I find it odd that you say it's fine for a company to mandate what's to be covered, but not govt. I completely agree that the "safety net" begets insolence. Its the nature of a paternalistic relationship for the client to be under informed, which tends toward lesser autonomy of the client; which, given time, the client will grow to resent the agent for this. The client doesn't become more informed usually, only resentful; demanding more in an attempt to express some semblance of autonomy. Regardless of whether it's a private entity or a public one, the mechanism is the same. The problem is exacerbated under both situations; now I've no problem ith let em crash! It's just that those who are informed get the raw end of the deal, because thanks to these companies and government succubi I can't enter into a free market. I forget who coined the euphemism but it says 'you have the right to put your knife anywhere you wish, except my chest.' I think thats what's happening; despite the benevolent intentions for offering healthcare coverage, it does more harm than good.

[fj1200]

Is it congress that's stupid, or those that put them there?

I find it odd that you say it's fine for a company to mandate what's to be covered, but not govt. I completely agree that the "safety net" begets insolence. Its the nature of a paternalistic relationship for the client to be under informed, which tends toward lesser autonomy of the client; which, given time, the client will grow to resent the agent for this. The client doesn't become more informed usually, only resentful; demanding more in an attempt to express some semblance of autonomy. Regardless of whether it's a private entity or a public one, the mechanism is the same. The problem is exacerbated under both situations; now I've no problem ith let em crash! It's just that those who are informed get the raw end of the deal, because thanks to these companies and government succubi I can't enter into a free market. I forget who coined the euphemism but it says 'you have the right to put your knife anywhere you wish, except my chest.' I think thats what's happening; despite the benevolent intentions for offering healthcare coverage, it does more harm than good.

It's Congress. I started a thread about it. ;) The electorate and Congresspeople could both be highly intelligent but once they are compelled to compromise they will inevitably create an undesirable scenario.

Why would it be odd that I'm not concerned what a private firm offers? Either the insurance company could create a rider or the company could offer it as a benefit with nary a regulation found. I'm not sure what to make of the rest of your post but it seems you're describing a scenario where the clients are insulated from actual knowledge and decision making which is what we have today.

[tailfins]

It's Congress. I started a thread about it. ;) The electorate and Congresspeople could both be highly intelligent but once they are compelled to compromise they will inevitably create an undesirable scenario.

Why would it be odd that I'm not concerned what a private firm offers? Either the insurance company could create a rider or the company could offer it as a benefit with nary a regulation found. I'm not sure what to make of the rest of your post but it seems you're describing a scenario where the clients are insulated from actual knowledge and decision making which is what we have today.

Health insurance is inflated by being income tax exempt when paid for as a payroll deduction. During WWII with income tax rates above 90% in some cases, fringe benefits were introduced to avoid crushing income taxes. Now days, companies sometimes say "look at our great benefits" to distract from a sub-par compensation package.

[logroller]

It's Congress. I started a thread about it. ;) The electorate and Congresspeople could both be highly intelligent but once they are compelled to compromise they will inevitably create an undesirable scenario.

Why would it be odd that I'm not concerned what a private firm offers? Either the insurance company could create a rider or the company could offer it as a benefit with nary a regulation found. I'm not sure what to make of the rest of your post but it seems you're describing a scenario where the clients are insulated from actual knowledge and decision making which is what we have today.

Not so much odd as inconsistent; the exact same complaints of socialized insurance apply to any third-party subsidy/provision, even private; choices down/ prices up. You could argue one's worse than the other; but they're both insidious.

[fj1200]

Health insurance is inflated by being income tax exempt when paid for as a payroll deduction. During WWII with income tax rates above 90% in some cases, fringe benefits were introduced to avoid crushing income taxes. Now days, companies sometimes say "look at our great benefits" to distract from a sub-par compensation package.

Actually it was to get around wage controls. Introduce a regulation and money will find a way to flow around it.


Not so much odd as inconsistent; the exact same complaints of socialized insurance apply to any third-party subsidy/provision, even private; choices down/ prices up. You could argue one's worse than the other; but they're both insidious.

Perfectly consistent. No one is forced to provide the option and no one is forced to accept it. You also missed the true-cost transparency requisite.

[logroller]

Perfectly consistent. No one is forced to provide the option and no one is forced to accept it. You also missed the true-cost transparency requisite.

You mean the multiple, 5-page statements I receive for one routine doctor visit that require one to be adept at spreadsheets to comprehend?

--or--

The employer-paid insurance premium payments appearing nowhere on one's paid compensation forms?

[fj1200]

You mean the multiple, 5-page statements I receive for one routine doctor visit that require one to be adept at spreadsheets to comprehend?

--or--

The employer-paid insurance premium payments appearing nowhere on one's paid compensation forms?

As in, it's missing. Hence your examples.