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View Full Version : Whats Conservative or Llibertarian or Neo Con or Ron Paul



revelarts
01-14-2012, 04:49 PM
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the summation of the video is this:
Rush Limbaugh and some other said that the CPAC win for Ron Paul a while back means that CPAC is REALLY more Libertarian than "conservative". The "Southern Avenger" points out that they are Full of Crap and goes through history of modern conservationism and those that have written about it and the Core Books about it(like the Conservative Intellectual movement in America (http://www.amazon.com/Conservative-Intellectual-Movement-America-Since/dp/1933859121/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1326577955&sr=1-2)) that show plainly that Conservatism is at it's roots and core Libertarian and that in the past often the 2 terms were used almost interchangeable and that the early leadership were full on libertarians. And that the Big Gov't big military views of the current main stream conservationism came from the Neo-cons whos roots are in socialism and Trotsky.

this is not in the vid but from the same creator


...“Neoconservative” certainly is a label that puts you in a box. The prefix alone invites curiosity (which is why neoconservatives don’t like it) and the term itself suggests that it represents something different from plain old conservatism (which is why neoconservatives really don’t like it). Neoconservative Max Boot outlined the ideology in 2002: “Neoconservatives believe in using American might to promote American ideals abroad … [The] agenda is known as ‘neoconservatism,’ though a more accurate term might be ‘hard Wilsonianism’ …” Of President Bush’s “hard Wilsonianism,” columnist George Will and National Review founder William F. Buckley said the following during an exchange in 2005:
WILL: Today, we have a very different kind of foreign policy. It’s called Wilsonian. And the premise of the Bush doctrine is that America must spread democracy, because our national security depends upon it. And America can spread democracy. It knows how. It can engage in national building. This is conservative or not?
BUCKLEY: It’s not at all conservative. It’s anything but conservative …
The fact that a significant part of Ron Paul’s campaign has been to constantly point out distinctions between how past conservative Republicans have approached foreign policy and the current neoconservative approach that dominates the GOP irritates those who’ve spent their careers trying to blur these distinctions. Wrote the neoconservatives’ intellectual godfather Irving Kristol in 2003:
One can say that the historical task and political purpose of neoconservatism would seem to be this: to convert the Republican Party, and American conservatism in general, against their respective wills …



Wasn't Wilson a democrat?

revelarts
01-14-2012, 05:16 PM
"...In an interview with Reason magazine in 1975, Ronald Reagan said:


If you analyze it I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism … The basis of conservatism is a desire for less government interference or less centralized authority or more individual freedom and this is a pretty general description also of what libertarianism is.

Says Santorum: “I fight very strongly against libertarian influence within the Republican Party and the conservative movement.”
Santorum is not a Reagan conservative. Not even close.
It surprises people when they learn I’m not a libertarian. As Ron Paul’s official campaign blogger, I’m often perceived as being a libertarian and I am no doubt sympathetic to many libertarian views. But ultimately I’m a traditional conservative — a limited-government constitutionalist of the Barry Goldwater variety. That said, I’m no more offended at being called a libertarian than a heavy metal fan is when called a rock n’ roller — both terms represent far more synthesis than antithesis. Santorum has no comprehension of this basic philosophical and historical truism.
Being against big government does not represent the totality of American conservatism, but it does represent what Reagan called the “heart and soul” of conservatism. Reagan recognized that the “desire for less government interference or less centralized authority or more individual freedom” was indeed libertarianism but that it was also conservatism. This observation was fairly commonplace on the right during Reagan’s time, when “conservatism” was still more of a substantive philosophy than a Republican marketing tool. For example, in his book “Flying High,” a memoir about the 1964 presidential campaign, William F. Buckley repeatedly refers to Goldwater’s philosophy as “libertarian” and his famous book “The Conscience of a Conservative” as a “libertarian tome.”
So, were Reagan and Buckley wrong about libertarianism’s kinship to conservatism — or is Santorum correct to treat libertarianism as something alien to conservatism? This depends on your definition of that term.
Let’s begin with Reagan’s definition. In addition to calling libertarianism the heart of conservatism, Reagan believed that the American right was a three-legged stool consisting of social conservatives, national security conservatives and economic/libertarian conservatives. Lose a leg and conservatism loses a lot, or so Reagan believed...."

http://www.southernavenger.com/featured/santorum-isnt-a-reagan-conservative

Joyful HoneyBee
01-19-2012, 11:11 PM
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Joyful HoneyBee
01-19-2012, 11:20 PM
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Little-Acorn
01-19-2012, 11:48 PM
Conservative: A person who thinks the country will be the most prosperous, free, and safe if people are left mostly to fend for themselves without government "help", learn from their experiences, help each other, etc. NOTE: Most Republicans are not conservative.

Libertarian: See "Conservative", above.

Neocon: A liberal who has joined the Republican party.

Joyful HoneyBee
01-20-2012, 12:07 AM
I find it terribly intriguing that so many people agree wholeheartedly with the ideologies of smaller government, less governmental intrusion into our private lives, ending wars, balancing the nation's budget, free enterprise and so on, but they argue vehemently against the one man in a political office who has stood for all those ideals for three decades. I just don't get it.

I think Ron Paul is the best man for the job and if we don't elect him this time, no matter who gets the job, we are merely going to be spooning water out of our sinking ship of a nation, rather than fixing the gaping hole that's causing us to sink. We are in desperate trouble! We need decisive action and we need it now.

Neo
01-20-2012, 01:31 AM
I find it terribly intriguing that so many people agree wholeheartedly with the ideologies of smaller government, less governmental intrusion into our private lives, ending wars, balancing the nation's budget, free enterprise and so on, but they argue vehemently against the one man in a political office who has stood for all those ideals for three decades. I just don't get it.

I think Ron Paul is the best man for the job and if we don't elect him this time, no matter who gets the job, we are merely going to be spooning water out of our sinking ship of a nation, rather than fixing the gaping hole that's causing us to sink. We are in desperate trouble! We need decisive action and we need it now.


Please tell me what Ron Paul has accomplished in his 30 years in Congress. He's never run so much as a lemonade stand and you want to hand the keys of government over to that man? Do you realize that this man thinks it's just honkie dorie that Iran get a nuke, says it's their "right" to have one.

He's nuts.

logroller
01-20-2012, 05:02 AM
Please tell me what Ron Paul has accomplished in his 30 years in Congress. He's never run so much as a lemonade stand and you want to hand the keys of government over to that man? Do you realize that this man thinks it's just honkie dorie that Iran get a nuke, says it's their "right" to have one.

He's nuts.

So you think we should invade Iran, yes? Because we didn't invade Pakistan, or China or North Korea? All have threatened our allies and have nukes. Why not invade them all? The reason we didn't was because the costs would be too great for what we would net. Hell, Nixon even opened diplomatic relations with China, in spite of their attacks on neighboring sovereign states (states which had little economic value to us). Just admit we are an imperialist nation and we would benefit more greatly from the resources of Iran if the Iranian government was more in line with our interests; and we're willing to bomb them into submission and leave their nation in shambles like we did in Iraq. I love our way of life, so if that's the only or best way to secure our blessings, fuck em all. But lets be honest about it, even if our politicians can't be.

jimnyc
01-20-2012, 10:56 AM
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Why is it that all of the RP supporters post cute videos, with nice little music and artwork in them? Why do we not just read story after story after story of all the great things he has done, or good things he has done? His voting history is, well, odd to say the least and I'm baffled why no one is asking him why he was going solo on so many wacky votes. I'm also baffled why no one is asking him how he can compare the liberty to pray and go to church, with the same liberty to smoke crack cocaine or inject heroin.