Ron Paul Confirms He Is A Total Asshole When It Comes To War On Terror

[red states rule]

The US scored a big victory with the death of Awlaki, but asshole Ron Paul attacks the US for taking out a major threat and known terrorist

Others of Paul's ik say this pig was denied "due process"

There are few things Obama has done that I support, but this is one. Good job Mr President! Good call!





Not the only libertarian all-star troubled by this morning’s op in Yemen. Earlier on Fox, Gary Johnson (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/184821-gary-johnson-awlaki-was-qentitled-to-due-processq) confessed to mixed feelings that a U.S. citizen, degenerate though he was, had been targeted for execution without due process. Honestly, I’m conflicted too: Read the exchange between Andy McCarthy (http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/278836/what-williamson-gets-wrong-awlaki-andrew-c-mccarthy) and Kevin Williamson (http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/278859/assassinations-etc-kevin-d-williamson) at The Corner for sharp arguments on each side. There are two difficulties here, I think. One is the fact of Awlaki’s citizenship, the other is the nature of the combat he was engaged in. No one outside of the far left disputes that if an American joins a foreign army and points a gun at a U.S. soldier on the battlefield, the soldier’s entitled to take him down. No one disputes either that officers are legitimate targets in war, not merely the infantrymen they command. (Ask Admiral Yamamoto about that.) Awlaki was an officer in Al Qaeda’s army, tasked mainly with propaganda but increasingly given to directing would-be killers like Abdulmutallab around the global battlefield. Or so we’re told; there’s endless video out there of him denouncing America and exhorting attacks on the country, but the proof that he was planning operations — the heart of the argument for taking him out — remains within the upper reaches of America’s counterterror establishment.


http://hotair.com/archives/2011/09/30/video-ron-paul-condemns-drone-strike-on-awlaki/

[Gaffer]

This is one of Paul's bad points. And it's a major flaw in him.

[chloe]

Ron Paul does not have any interest in the United States being global in anyway. I agree with alot of things he says, not everything but alot of things.The military issue is one I disagree with him on.:salute:

[red states rule]

This is one of Paul's bad points. And it's a major flaw in him.

When people ask me why I do not support Ron Paul now I can give them as a reason in addition to his stupid comment that America brought 9/11 on itself

Not only is Paul's campaign now toast after this insane defense of a terrorist - it is toast with butter and jam

[red states rule]

Ron Paul does not have any interest in the United States being global in anyway. I agree with alot of things he says, not everything but alot of things.The military issue is one I disagree with him on.:salute:


Ron Paul has gone over the edge on this one. Who the hell would NOT support taking out an enemy of the state who is plotting terrroist attacks to slaughter innocent people?

I know the far left nuts are bitching this bastard was "denyed due process" but that only shows how stupid the left is by wanting to fight the war on terror with lawbooks while the terrorists fight it with bombs and bullets

[revelarts]

1992 - 1995: ’Aryan Republican Army’ Robs Banks in Midwestern States (http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a199295ara#a199295ara)

http://www.historycommons.org/pics/icons/edit.png (http://www.historycommons.org/eventedit.jsp?oid=1626004942-88342&drafts=null&timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln)

The “Aryan Republican Army” (ARA) commits at least 22 bank robberies across America’s Midwest. The ARA is modeled after the violent white supremacist organization The Order (see Late September 1983 (http://www.historycommons.org/item.jsp?item=a0983orderfounded&timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln)), which had funded itself primarily through robbing armored trucks. For a time, the group’s headquarters is in Elohim City, Oklahoma (see 1973 and After (http://www.historycommons.org/item.jsp?item=a1973elohim&timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln)). The ARA’s leaders claim to be dedicated to the “overthrow of the US government, the extermination of American Jews, and the establishment of an Aryan Republic” on the North American continent. Members are required to read the infamous Turner Diaries (see 1978 (http://www.historycommons.org/item.jsp?item=a1978turnerdiaries&timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln)), a novel depicting the overthrow of the US government by white separatists and the genocide of minorities. The robberies in all secure between $250,000 and $500,000 for the group....
http://www.historycommons.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln&haitian_elite_2021_organizations=haitian_elite_202 1_other_militias

So why where these fools simply caught and given a trial?
U.S. citizens maybe?, As a matter of fact they were allowed to run free with several Federal informants in there ranks for years.
Is a POTENTIAL-POSSIBLE-MAYBE ONE DAY Alquida attack worse than an Aryan. Note the latest in Sweden.
Some Klansmen have even gone over seas to meet with Akmedinajad in IRAN.

What ever happened to the cries for the "RULE OF LAW" that was so loud Against the Dems?

Should we expect drone strikes against against those selling the turner diaries here in the U.S. or only overseas?
If not, WHY THE HE•• NOT.!!!??? THEY ARE TERRORIST ENCOURAGERS AND DON"T DESERVE TO LIVE ANOTHER MOMENT THE GOV'T SAID SO!!!

Ron Paul is right again. We've crossed another line and the water is boiling.

[red states rule]

http://www.historycommons.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln&haitian_elite_2021_organizations=haitian_elite_202 1_other_militias

So why where these fools simply caught and given a trial?
U.S. citizens maybe?, As a matter of fact they were allowed to run free with several Federal informants in there ranks for years.
Is a POTENTIAL-POSSIBLE-MAYBE ONE DAY Alquida attack worse than an Aryan. Note the latest in Sweden.
Some Klansmen have even gone over seas to meet with Akmedinajad in IRAN.

What ever happened to the cries for the "RULE OF LAW" that was so loud Against the Dems?

Should we expect drone strikes against against those selling the turner diaries here in the U.S. or only overseas?
If not, WHY THE HE•• NOT.!!!??? THEY ARE TERRORIST ENCOURAGERS AND DON"T DESERVE TO LIVE ANOTHER MOMENT THE GOV'T SAID SO!!!

Ron Paul is right again. We've crossed another line and the water is boiling.


As usual Rev you are far out there as well. In war you would not target the leaders of the enemy eh? You would not want to kill those who would slaughter inncent people for the hell of it eh?

This is why people like you and Ron Paul should NEVER be in a position of power to make calls of the defense of this nation


Sure, put the SOB on trial. and the first thing the deense laywer would say is whine there are no Muslims on the jury. Tell me Rev would you feel warm all over with Muslims judging a M\uslim accused of murder and attempted murder of US citizens?

Then the liberla media could turn the trail of this worthless bastard into the trial of the US and how we are he bully of the world

You would love that to I bet

[revelarts]

As sual Rev you are far out there as well. In war yo would not target the leaders of the enemy eh? You would not want to kil those who would slaughter inncent people for the hell of it eh?

This is why people like you and Ron Paul should NEVER be in a position of power to make calls of the defense of this nation


Sure, put the SOB on trial. and the first thing the deense laywer would say is whine there are no Muslims on the jury. Tell me Rev would you feel warm all over with Muslims judging a M\uslim accused of murder and attempted murder of US citizens?

Then the liberla media could turn the trail of this worthless bastard into the trial of the US and how we are he bully of the world

You would love that to I bet

We've tried Hundreds of Muslim terrorist and put them in jail the U.S. gov't knows how to put people in jial . we've got more people in prison than percap than any other country. NOT A PROBLEM. We Put MOSOUSI in jail and he's half Crazy, defense lawyers couldn't stop it EVEN on us soil, WAshingto DC no less. They put away a Muslim Black extremist who plotted/conspried to hyjack and kill. He's In Jail TODAY.
What's so hard about it. No Riots in the streets no Muslims counter attacks.
Just another THUG in JAIL. Red
what's wrong with that?
RULE OF LAW.

[red states rule]

We've tried Hundreds of Muslim terrorist and put them in jail the U.S. gov't knows how to put people in jial . we've got more people in prison than percap than any other country. NOT A PROBLEM. We Put MOSOUSI in jail and he's half Crazy, defense lawyers couldn't stop it EVEN on us soil, WAshingto DC no less. They put away a Muslim Black extremist who plotted/conspried to hyjack and kill. He's In Jail TODAY.
What's so hard about it. No Riots in the streets no Muslims counter attacks.
Just another THUG in JAIL. Red
what's wrong with that?
RULE OF LAW.

and at waht cost Rev? So you would not of taken out the convoy, you have sent in trops (some getting killed in the process) tried to capture this bastard, bring him to America, and spent humdreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to show how "civil" we are

No, it was much better taking the SOB out the way we did.

You can livein your child like fantasy world where you defeat terrorists with law books, and fight this war under Marquess of Queensberry Rules - manwhile the adults will fight this war the old fashioned way

By killing the enemy wherever we find them

As I said, I seldom agree with anything Obama does but in this case

CONGRATS MR PRESIDENT. GOOD CALL!!!!!

Rev, I know I am right on this when you, the ACLU, and the far left kooks are all pissed off over the death of a worthless piece of shit like this terrorist

[revelarts]

As sual Rev you are far out there as well. In war yo would not target the leaders of the enemy eh? You would not want to kil those who would slaughter inncent people for the hell of it eh?

This is why people like you and Ron Paul should NEVER be in a position of power to make calls of the defense of this nation


Sure, put the SOB on trial. and the first thing the deense laywer would say is whine there are no Muslims on the jury. Tell me Rev would you feel warm all over with Muslims judging a M\uslim accused of murder and attempted murder of US citizens?

Then the liberla media could turn the trail of this worthless bastard into the trial of the US and how we are he bully of the world

You would love that to I bet

"AT WAR"
BS BS BS BS
the CIA directors have said there are less than 2000 active alquida WORLD WIDE.
the U.S .Gov't is not "AT WAR" with 2000 people. 2000 people are a mob not an Army, not by Any stretch. the threat is overblown and our reaction is even moreso. 911 traumatized people but it's been 10 years we need to get a freaking grip and realize that Alquiada is not a threat to 300Million Americans unless we keep acting like they are some kind of super villians.

[revelarts]

and at waht cost Rev? So you would not of taken out the convoy, you have sent in trops (some getting killed in the process) tried to capture this bastard, bring him to America, and spent humdreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to show how "civil" we are

No, it was much better taking the SOB out the way we did.

You can livein your child like fantasy world where you defeat terrorists with law books, and fight this war under Marquess of Queensberry Rules - manwhile the adults will fight this war the old fashioned way

By killing the enemy wherever we find them

As I said, I seldom agree with anything Obama does but in this case

CONGRATS MR PRESIDENT. GOOD CALL!!!!!

Rev, I know I am right on this when you, the ACLU, and the far left kooks are all pissed off over the death of a worthless piece of shit like this terrorist

I'm still waiting for your answer on the Aryan Millitia Red, When do we start the drone strikes, there are a few people that have visited this board may make it on that HIT list? They need to be stopped.
"By killing the enemy wherever we find them."

[red states rule]

"AT WAR"
BS BS BS BS
the CIA directors have said there are less than 2000 active alquida WORLD WIDE.
the U.S .Gov't is not "AT WAR" with 2000 people. 2000 people are a mob not an Army, not by Any stretch. the threat is overblown and out reaction is even moreso. 911 tramatized people but it's been 10 years we need to get a freaking grip and realize that Alquiada is not a threat to 300Million Americans unless we keep acting like they are some kind of super villians.

Try telling that to the families who lost people on 9/11, the Kobo Towers, USS Cole, and all the other terror attacks Rev

Weak ass people like you say we need to "get over" 9/11 and forget about it. It is fools like you that doom us to repeat history when we do not learn from it

[red states rule]

I'm still waiting for your answer on the Aryan Millitia Red, When do we start the drone strikes, are few people that have visited this board may make it on that list? They need to be stopped
"By killing the enemy wherever we find them."


Rev, I am sure I have already been deemed an mof the state by the Obama administration based on my posts here, and the bumper stickers on my car

The BS you try and ofer in defense of not killing terrorists is sad and pitiful. If we ever have a government that takes people out like with drones, or drags them out of their homes at night it wil be because of fools like you who refused to step up and admit playing nice with terrorists will not work

Then you can stand off on the sidelines and watch the beheadings take place on a daily basis. I am sure you will blame thoise being killed and not the ones doing the killing

[revelarts]

Rev, I am sure I have already been deemed an eney of the sate by the Obama administration based on my posts here, and the bumper stickers on my car

The BS you try and ofer in defense of not killing terrorists is sad and pitiful. If we ever have a government that takes people out like with drones, or drags them out of their homes at night it wil be because of fools like you who refused to step up and admit playing nice with terrorists will not work

Then you can stand off on the sidelines and watch the beheadings take place on a daily basis. I am sure you will blame thoise being killed and not the ones doing the killing
Red I can't understand why you don't see that every time to cheer for Obama killing a U.S. citizens you are tighten the noose around your own neck. If your on the list, you should agree that the RULE of LAW should APPLY TO ALL. Not just those that the gov't says deserve it. Reread what you've written with a cup of coffee and a deep breath my friend.

[red states rule]

Red I can't understand why you don't see that every time to cheer for Obama killing a U.S. citizens you are tighten the noose around you own neck. If your on the list you should agree that the RULE of LAW should APPLY TO ALL. Not just those that the gov't says deserve it. Reread what you've written with a cup of coffee and a deep breath my friend.

Rev what is so sad is YOU do not see the differecne bewtten me and Awlaki. He planned the Ft Hood killings, the attempted Chrstmas Day bombing of the jet, and the attempted bombing of Times Sq. This pig was responsible for the deaths of innocent people Rev

All I have done is spoken out against this administration and I have NEVER called for violence

Only people like you Rev would dare to make such a lams ass comparison since you are so desperate to give your child like reasoning some minor amount of credibility

[chloe]

Rev what is so sad is YOU do not see the differecne bewtten me and Awlaki. He planned the Ft Hood killings, the attempted Chrstmas Day bombing of the jet, and the attempted bombing of Times Sq. This pig was responsible for the deaths of innocent people Rev

All I have done is spoken out against this administration and I have NEVER called for violence

Only people like you Rev would dare to make such a lams ass comparison since you are so desperate to give your child like reasoning some minor amount of credibility

I don't think you are a white racist terrorist. Interestingly, I have heard people accuse Ron Paul of being a white supremacist.

[red states rule]

I don't think you are a white racist terrorist. Interestingly, I have heard people accuse Ron Paul of being a white supremacist.

Clloe, I have been called a racist, a memebr of the KKK, a Nazi, a hearless monster, and every other name in the liberal playbook

You see, when confronted with logic, reason, and sanity, liberals flip out and fall back on their natural strength - attack mode

[chloe]

Clloe, I have been called a racist, a memebr of the KKK, a Nazi, a hearless monster, and every other name in the liberal playbook

You see, when confronted with logic, reason, and sanity, liberals flip out and fall back on their natural strength - attack mode

I never think of Rev as a Liberal (yikes) but I also never think of you as a racist. I think people completely misunderstand you and to me your a sweet soft tender hearted human being who has been through tough times. At any rate I disagree with Ron Paul about the military and war issues.

It is the one reason why I won't vote for him.

[Gaffer]

The ayrian army has nothing to do with this situation and are being dealt with by law enforcement. Probably not as they should be, but they are being dealt with. The AO leader was a different story. He was in a convoy, surrounded by lots of guards to protect him. He was in a foreign country, where we couldn't just put cops on the ground and order them all to stop and surrender. There was one option. Take him out with a predator or let him go so he can plan more attacks against this country.

Anyone that commits murder or tries too and is shot by police didn't get due processes any more than this guy. They are taken out before they can do any more harm. This guy was determined to be an extremely dangerous man and was treated as such.

You think the CIA is correct about their estimate of 2000 AQ in the world? The CIA? Part of our govt? The CIA are an enemy of this country in your mind, but their estimate of AQ is spot on? AQ is small by comparison to their bother organizations hamas, hezbollah, muslim brotherhood, iranian qods force and the taliban, but their support runs deep.

Paul has blown his chances again with another stupid statement that's going to be used against him big time.

[red states rule]

I never think of Rev as a Liberal (yikes) but I also never think of you as a racist. I think people completely misunderstand you and to me your a sweet soft tender hearted human being who has been through tough times. At any rate I disagree with Ron Paul about the military and war issues.

It is the one reason why I won't vote for him.


I suspect Rev is waht is known as "moderate". You know "middle of the road" types

Of course I tell folks the only thing in the middle of the road are yellow lines and dead animals

I am still waiting for someone to tell me where I can buy the Book "Great Moderats in US History"

[revelarts]

The ayrian army has nothing to do with this situation and are being dealt with by law enforcement. Probably not as they should be, but they are being dealt with. The AO leader was a different story. He was in a convoy, surrounded by lots of guards to protect him. He was in a foreign country, where we couldn't just put cops on the ground and order them all to stop and surrender. There was one option. Take him out with a predator or let him go so he can plan more attacks against this country.

Anyone that commits murder or tries too and is shot by police didn't get due processes any more than this guy. They are taken out before they can do any more harm. This guy was determined to be an extremely dangerous man and was treated as such.

You think the CIA is correct about their estimate of 2000 AQ in the world? The CIA? Part of our govt? The CIA are an enemy of this country in your mind, but their estimate of AQ is spot on? AQ is small by comparison to their bother organizations hamas, hezbollah, muslim brotherhood, iranian qods force and the taliban, but their support runs deep.

Paul has blown his chances again with another stupid statement that's going to be used against him big time.

"our good friends" the Yemanse Where tracking his movements as well as us. They knew where the "convoy" came from and where it was going most likley. We've renditioned people out of every middle eastern country, the US and Canada but this guy was "too hard". Like bin Laden hold up in a ratty house with a 8 ft brick wall a couple of AKs and a few women. To hard, sorry I don't by it. If they knew where he was and could Id him for a drone strike we could ID ALL of his associates in the "convey" etc. and pick them up 1 by one well before or after his trip and before any planed or Unplanned attack. that's what intel people do right. in the WAR? Alquida doesn't always travel in a pack/convey right?

As far as police Go. the Police don't shoot people who send threatening letters via e-mail or youtube. They collect them. and if they can't find any evidence of any real action they sometime have to let them go with a warning or restraining order. If they have done something they put them on trial.

the CIA maybe lying about the number of AlQuada, it may be ZERO, or 50. But I doubt theyed under estimate the number, their dept is looking good to the powers that be with all their drone killings and what not. Alquida is job security. As far as Hamas goes, well, are we at war with Hamas now? or Hezbollah or the muslim brotherhood? Why aren't we drone striking their leadership? Bush and Obama have dropped the ball there. But the brotherhood brings me back to the Aryain Army, they have ties to each other so why aren't we drone striking the them? we can't have it both ways, a terrorist is a terrorist, citizen or not, muslim or not, US soil or not. Hangings to good for-um, just shoot on sight. At least that's what I'm hearing here.

[Gaffer]

rev you really need to reevaluate your thinking. You see conspiracy in everything the govt does. Yet when they do something that's good for the country you condemn it as infringing on your freedoms. You sit in an ivory tower wearing rose colored glasses with no concept of the real world and how things work. Would you have been happier if the govt had sent the guy a harshly worded letter instead of blowing him up?


They also took out about 20 other AQ guys with him. I guess that means there's only 1980 left in the world. At this rate they will be on the endangered species list and the EPA can protect them.


Just sit back and watch Ron Paul's poll numbers tank.

[DragonStryk72]

Ron Paul has gone over the edge on this one. Who the hell would NOT support taking out an enemy of the state who is plotting terrroist attacks to slaughter innocent people?

I know the far left nuts are bitching this bastard was "denyed due process" but that only shows how stupid the left is by wanting to fight the war on terror with lawbooks while the terrorists fight it with bombs and bullets

Clearly you misunderstand or misrepresent how slow the military is. someone had to requisition the drone, get it airborn, do a confirmation, these all take time, more time than say grabbing the guy from the location, imprisoning him, getting info out of him on remaining AQ operatives, and getting him ready for trial. Had he gone to trial, he would have been found guilty, since we had more than enough evidence in this case to convict, as well as the capacity to have him executed for his crimes. So really, why not bring him in? What is so wrong about giving due process in this instance, RSR?

You claim Paul "attacked" america. Where's the attack? All he said was that we should have given him due process, and paul being from TX, means that execution is still on the table. We wasted an opportunity to learn more about how AQ is operating now after the death of OBL and so many other members of the group. I don't see how that's somehow inherently superior to bringing him and squeezing as much info as we can get, and then having him executed. I mean, really, what was the guy going to say in court that was gonna let him walk away?

Also, when did AQ get an army? I thought they were all "enemy combatants?"

[Gunny]

This is one of Paul's bad points. And it's a major flaw in him.

Took the words right outta my mouth. His isolationist stance is a deal-breaker with me. It's unrealistic.

[Missileman]

Clearly you misunderstand or misrepresent how slow the military is. someone had to requisition the drone, get it airborn, do a confirmation, these all take time, more time than say grabbing the guy from the location, imprisoning him, getting info out of him on remaining AQ operatives, and getting him ready for trial. Had he gone to trial, he would have been found guilty, since we had more than enough evidence in this case to convict, as well as the capacity to have him executed for his crimes. So really, why not bring him in? What is so wrong about giving due process in this instance, RSR?

You claim Paul "attacked" america. Where's the attack? All he said was that we should have given him due process, and paul being from TX, means that execution is still on the table. We wasted an opportunity to learn more about how AQ is operating now after the death of OBL and so many other members of the group. I don't see how that's somehow inherently superior to bringing him and squeezing as much info as we can get, and then having him executed. I mean, really, what was the guy going to say in court that was gonna let him walk away?

Also, when did AQ get an army? I thought they were all "enemy combatants?"

We are actively at war with AQ...due process IS blowing them into oblivion. People are concerned about Paul's attitude because it smacks slightly like the Obama DoJ. Protecting the country from foreign entities isn't a matter to be handled with civil law or for that matter, civility. You don't go after those types of problems with a stun-gun, can of mace, and a ticket book.

[DragonStryk72]

We are actively at war with AQ...due process IS blowing them into oblivion. People are concerned about Paul's attitude because it smacks slightly like the Obama DoJ. Protecting the country from foreign entities isn't a matter to be handled with civil law or for that matter, civility. You don't go after those types of problems with a stun-gun, can of mace, and a ticket book.

Excuse, so now acting in a civil manner in the face of the enemy is a problem? Why? What are we losing by putting this guy on trial? Are stun-guns, cans of mace and tickets the only ways cops ever arrest anyone? No of course not, but you're busy with exaggeration on that front. I'm not saying he should've been let go, and I even specifically mentioned execution as the end of his due process. But, why not capture the guy and get him to talk? I mean, maybe AQ's recruiter might have names of, y'know, recruits he's brought in, giving us a better picture of the makeup of AQ, thus allowing us to better hunt them as their numbers dwindle?

When AQ was larger, it was fine if we just killed people, but as their numbers get smaller and smaller, we have to adjust the manner in which we fight. So war, we've been in a war footing, but as they've gotten smaller, we need to switch footing to hunting. Drone kills will only get the ones who pop their head up, they won't lead us back to the nests.

[Missileman]

Excuse, so now acting in a civil manner in the face of the enemy is a problem? Why? What are we losing by putting this guy on trial? Are stun-guns, cans of mace and tickets the only ways cops ever arrest anyone? No of course not, but you're busy with exaggeration on that front. I'm not saying he should've been let go, and I even specifically mentioned execution as the end of his due process. But, why not capture the guy and get him to talk? I mean, maybe AQ's recruiter might have names of, y'know, recruits he's brought in, giving us a better picture of the makeup of AQ, thus allowing us to better hunt them as their numbers dwindle?

When AQ was larger, it was fine if we just killed people, but as their numbers get smaller and smaller, we have to adjust the manner in which we fight. So war, we've been in a war footing, but as they've gotten smaller, we need to switch footing to hunting. Drone kills will only get the ones who pop their head up, they won't lead us back to the nests.

Are you really arguing that soldiers should no longer attempt to kill, but capture all enemy combatants, place them under arrest, read them their rights, and pack them off for a trial? I sure hope the hell not.

[Zona]

This is one of Paul's bad points. And it's a major flaw in him.

ONE bad flaw? There are numerious. One thing I have to give to Ron Paul though, he does not back down or change his positions, no matter how insane they are.

Good luck Mr. Paul. Good luck.

[red states rule]

Excuse, so now acting in a civil manner in the face of the enemy is a problem? Why? What are we losing by putting this guy on trial? Are stun-guns, cans of mace and tickets the only ways cops ever arrest anyone? No of course not, but you're busy with exaggeration on that front. I'm not saying he should've been let go, and I even specifically mentioned execution as the end of his due process. But, why not capture the guy and get him to talk? I mean, maybe AQ's recruiter might have names of, y'know, recruits he's brought in, giving us a better picture of the makeup of AQ, thus allowing us to better hunt them as their numbers dwindle?

When AQ was larger, it was fine if we just killed people, but as their numbers get smaller and smaller, we have to adjust the manner in which we fight. So war, we've been in a war footing, but as they've gotten smaller, we need to switch footing to hunting. Drone kills will only get the ones who pop their head up, they won't lead us back to the nests.

When some idiot points a gun at a Police Officer he/she does not receive your "due process" - and neither should terrorists who are also pointing their guns at the US

[red states rule]

http://www.americanthinker.com/cartoons/assets_c/2011/10/2011_10_01_alawlaki-thumb-700xauto-483.jpg

[revelarts]

...He was in a convoy, surrounded by lots of guards to protect him. ...


...The Yemeni Defense Ministry also reported the death, without elaborating, in a mobile phone SMS message.

Local tribal and security officials said al-Awlaki was travelling in a two-car convoy with two other al-Qaida in Yemen operatives from al-Jawf to neighboring Marib province when they were hit. They said the other two operatives were also believed dead. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to talk to the press....

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2011/09/anwar-al-awlaki-killed-in-yemen-airstrike-67257_page2.html

A two car convey? And 2 other guys. the military can't figure out away to safely stop a 2 car convoy and extract live prisoners? but the CIA can drone strike a moving vehicle it with precision.
seems a road block and fireing over the car and at the tires and tear gas though the window might get the job done, but I don't know jack, maybe it's really is to dangerous, idunno. Monday morning quarterbacking for sure but Where's chuck norris when ya need him

A 2 car "convoy" lol, the level of BSery has struck a new low.

[Gunny]

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2011/09/anwar-al-awlaki-killed-in-yemen-airstrike-67257_page2.html

A two car convey? And 2 other guys. the military can't figure out away to safely stop a 2 car convoy and extract live prisoners? but the CIA can drone strike a moving vehicle it with precision.
seems a road block and fireing over the car and at the tires and tear gas though the window might get the job done, but I don't know jack, maybe it's really is to dangerous, idunno. Monday morning quarterbacking for sure but Where's chuck norris when ya need him

A 2 car "convoy" lol, the level of BSery has struck a new low.

Two or more vehicles traveling together from Point A to Point B for the same purpose is a convoy. No BS involved.

Attempting to capture rather than kill increases the risk to the mission and the personnel A LOT. And you're right. It's Monday morning QB-ing. The commander in the field is the one charged with making the decision. He will have to file an after action report. If his superiors feel he made a bad decision, he'll answer for it.

[Gaffer]

Rev you have never been involved in combat or in making an arrest. You have watched too many Chuck Norris movies.

[revelarts]

Rev you have never been involved in combat or in making an arrest. You have watched too many Chuck Norris movies.
that's very true, and you've done a bit of that. so is my suggestion far fetched? ambush firing at the cars tires from cover . firing above the car to draw fire and not harm, and tear gas through a window or under the car?

[Gaffer]

that's very true, and you've done a bit of that. so is my suggestion far fetched? ambush firing at the cars tires from cover . firing above the car to draw fire and not harm, and tear gas through a window or under the car?

Yes your suggestion is far fetched. You don't shoot at a car to flatten the tires. Chances are you will put bullets through the doors and windows. Firing at a moving target is not as easy as the movies make it out to be. You don't fire to draw fire unless you want to distract your enemy while other members of your force move in from a flanking position. You fire at the enemy to suppress his ability to fire by making him keep his head down. Tear gas means you have to wear a gas mask which severely restricts your vision and in a case like this they may have masks as well. And lastly, what your calling for is someone assaulting the vehicles, assuming they were stopped. Would you want to be the one assaulting them, exposing yourself to their fire while you move forward telling them to drop their weapons?

Why not use a drone with missiles and eliminate any threat and danger to yourself?

In Vietnam if we came upon a position being held by enemy troops we didn't just assault it. We called in artillery or air strikes before moving in. It insures minimum risk to you and your troops. Those troops aren't just extras in a movie. They are guys like you and me with family and friends they want to go home too.

Also, ambushes are set up to kill the enemy, not capture them. The whole purpose is to get the first shot before he can shoot back. And in the case of this terrorist they used a drone to ambush him.

[revelarts]

Yes your suggestion is far fetched. You don't shoot at a car to flatten the tires. Chances are you will put bullets through the doors and windows. Firing at a moving target is not as easy as the movies make it out to be. You don't fire to draw fire unless you want to distract your enemy while other members of your force move in from a flanking position. You fire at the enemy to suppress his ability to fire by making him keep his head down. Tear gas means you have to wear a gas mask which severely restricts your vision and in a case like this they may have masks as well. And lastly, what your calling for is someone assaulting the vehicles, assuming they were stopped. Would you want to be the one assaulting them, exposing yourself to their fire while you move forward telling them to drop their weapons?

Why not use a drone with missiles and eliminate any threat and danger to yourself?

In Vietnam if we came upon a position being held by enemy troops we didn't just assault it. We called in artillery or air strikes before moving in. It insures minimum risk to you and your troops. Those troops aren't just extras in a movie. They are guys like you and me with family and friends they want to go home too.

Also, ambushes are set up to kill the enemy, not capture them. The whole purpose is to get the first shot before he can shoot back. And in the case of this terrorist they used a drone to ambush him.


I stand corrected. Ok lets try this agian. I'm more of a stealth type anyway. This may seem even more far fetched but bear with me.
It seems from the reports that the guy was on the road for some time or that they knew he would be there. given the time it would take to get a drone in position. Ok
so IF a team could get to the road he was going to be driving down and place camouflaged spikes on the road. causing them to have to stop. the some or all get out. Then some form tear gas and rubber bullet assault from a protected position and capture. I'm assuming that even if they had weapons they wouldn't have an inexhaustible supply of ammo and would have to surrender at some point.

I just find it difficult to believe that there's no good way for the US Military or CIA to capture someone alive from a convoy of 2 cars on a deserted road.

[Little-Acorn]

that's very true, and you've done a bit of that. so is my suggestion far fetched? ambush firing at the cars tires from cover . firing above the car to draw fire and not harm, and tear gas through a window or under the car?

I'm coming into this thread at a late date, sorry. I need to catch up. revelarts, this is a joke post, right?


Ron Paul Confirms He Is A Total Asshole When It Comes To War On Terror.

Ron Paul confirmed that many years ago, saying that we've got to pull the rug out from under allies who have trusted us for years and get ALL our troops out of various combat zone immediately, regardless of the promises we have made them and the committments they have made in turn, trusting we would be there to support them. His kookiness continued with statements to the effect that we have no reason to worry if Iran gets nuclear weapons. His latest statements that we should NOT kill a terrorist who is at war with us and has sent many people to kill us (some successfully), due to where he was born, is just the latest example of Ron Paul's long, consistent irrationality in foreign affairs.

And you just noticed this now?

[Little-Acorn]

so IF a team could get to the road he was going to be driving down and place camouflaged spikes on the road. causing them to have to stop. the some or all get out. Then some form tear gas and rubber bullet assault from a protected position and capture. I'm assuming that even if they had weapons they wouldn't have an inexhaustible supply of ammo and would have to surrender at some point.


I'm starting to think you're actually serious with this stuff.

Let me get this straight.

This guy declares war on the U.S. Then he send people to kill innocent U.S. citizens, and kill members of the U.S. military, succeeding more than once.

Explain to me why we owe this guy the slightest consideration or effort to keep him alive during a war when we could simply kill him with far less risk to our troops? He apparently has no such consideration for us.


I just find it difficult to believe that there's no good way for the US Military or CIA to capture someone alive from a convoy of 2 cars on a deserted road.

Nobody said there wasn't a "good way" (if you feel that putting our troops at greater risk is "good").

Just that there wasn't a good REASON.

And there is NO good reason to capture him rather than kill him during a war. If he doesn't like that, maybe he should be a little more careful who he declares war on.

[Gaffer]

I stand corrected. Ok lets try this agian. I'm more of a stealth type anyway. This may seem even more far fetched but bear with me.
It seems from the reports that the guy was on the road for some time or that they knew he would be there. given the time it would take to get a drone in position. Ok
so IF a team could get to the road he was going to be driving down and place camouflaged spikes on the road. causing them to have to stop. the some or all get out. Then some form tear gas and rubber bullet assault from a protected position and capture. I'm assuming that even if they had weapons they wouldn't have an inexhaustible supply of ammo and would have to surrender at some point.

I just find it difficult to believe that there's no good way for the US Military or CIA to capture someone alive from a convoy of 2 cars on a deserted road.

The convoy was in Yemen. While we are assisting the Yemeni govt there I don't believe we have any troops on the ground there. We would have to direct Yemeni soldiers to the area. We can trust in them to get the job done? We have a number of drones already in the area. Redirecting one to a certain point doesn't take a lot of time or effort. And it's very stealthy.

As for gas and rubber bullets, that's for crowd control not enemy combatants. One rocket on each car insures you don't have to wait for them to run out of ammo. At least one other high level AQ guy was also killed in this strike. The Yemeni's are still identifying the bodies.

There was no reason to stop the vehicles and do a capture. They were in the open with no innocent civilians around. No collateral damage. Just dead bad guys, one of which happens to have been born a US citizen.

[revelarts]

I'm starting to think you're actually serious with this stuff.
Let me get this straight.
This guy declares war on the U.S.
Then he send people to kill innocent U.S. citizens, and kill members of the U.S. military, succeeding more than once.

You got any proof he did this? Last I check he "inspired" and "encouraged". Jane Fonda nearly did as much during a REAL war and somehow she's still breathing.




Explain to me why we owe this guy the slightest consideration...

Becuase we are better than he is and we do thongs by the rule of law and the constitution. Which you also seems to support on occasion.




or effort to keep him alive during a war when we could simply kill him with far less risk to our troops? He apparently has no such consideration for us.
This isn't a "WAR" and he wasn't firing on anyone at the time. at the momnet he was killed he was peacfully riding down the road. AND for those with a more practical bent Why not capture him and get more info from him for the WAR against 2000 people.




Nobody said there wasn't a "good way" (if you feel that putting our troops at greater risk is "good").
Just that there wasn't a good REASON.
And there is NO good reason to capture him rather than kill him during a war. If he doesn't like that, maybe he should be a little more careful who he declares war on.
As I mentioned the Aryan "Army" has declared war as well, and people have been killed, where are the drones over Montana, the Aryans should be more careful who they declare war on right?

[jimnyc]

First 9/11 was an inside job, and now we should be courteous to known terrorists (his own videos are proof) and let them have a day in court? Maybe you're right, we should have captured him, then waterboarded the fucker before we let him go and bomb him anyway.

Rev, you're probably a decent enough bloke to have a round of beers with on a Friday night, but you're still a bit fucking off your rocker! :coffee:

[jimnyc]

As I mentioned the Aryan "Army" has declared war as well, and people have been killed, where are the drones over Montana, the Aryans should be more careful who they declare war on right?

If they are "terrorists", domestic or international, and have killed or planning on killing innocents - then yes, we should send a few drones over them and wipe them up off the Earth later too.

[Gunny]

You got any proof he did this? Last I check he "inspired" and "encouraged". Jane Fonda nearly did as much during a REAL war and somehow she's still breathing.



Becuase we are better than he is and we do thongs by the rule of law and the constitution. Which you also seems to support on occasion.


This isn't a "WAR" and he wasn't firing on anyone at the time. at the momnet he was killed he was peacfully riding down the road. AND for those with a more practical bent Why not capture him and get more info from him for the WAR against 2000 people.



As I mentioned the Aryan "Army" has declared war as well, and people have been killed, where are the drones over Montana, the Aryans should be more careful who they declare war on right?

You're kidding, right? Your responses are naive and uneducated.

Jane Fonda SHOULD HAVE BEEN jailed for sedition.

We ARE at war with AQ. Simple fact. He's a criminal and a target and he got targeted. End of story.

Your comparing US separatists and Arab terrorists has one BIG flaw: We are militarily engaged with AQ for crimes it HAS committed. Last I checked, no one's blown up a Sears in Montana or the Feds would be all over it. The posse comitatus act prohibits using military force within the boundaries of the US.

[revelarts]

Well I'll call it night and I'll buy you all a round of beers and go back to my asylum called peace, reason and adherence to the constitution.
parting shot on the way out.


You're kidding, right? Your responses are naive and uneducated.

Jane Fonda SHOULD HAVE BEEN jailed for sedition.

We ARE at war with AQ. Simple fact. He's a criminal and a target and he got targeted. End of story.

Your comparing US separatists and Arab terrorists has one BIG flaw: We are militarily engaged with AQ for crimes it HAS committed. Last I checked, no one's blown up a Sears in Montana or the Feds would be all over it. The posse comitatus act prohibits using military force within the boundaries of the US.
Every hear of Oklahoma City federal building?

"posse comitatus" I only hope that holds true, cough-NORTHCOM-cough

[Zona]

Just like after the bin laden killing, the relics come out to say for us to thank bush. The old X president keeps forgetting how they disbanded the group they had together to get bin laden and this time, they are saying how bad Obama is for what he said in 08 about bush. He was right.

[red states rule]

http://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/sbr100211dAPR20111001124517.jpg

[red states rule]

Now Paul is talking about impeachment over killing the terrorist. I bet this makes you Ron Paul supporters feel so warm all over :laugh2:


http://cnn.com/video/?/video/politics/2011/10/03/bts-paul-obama-impeach.cnn

[Zona]

Now Paul is talking about impeachment over killing the terrorist. I bet this makes you Ron Paul supporters feel so warm all over :laugh2:


http://cnn.com/video/?/video/politics/2011/10/03/bts-paul-obama-impeach.cnn

I agree with you and the rest of the GOP nominee's are just as nuts. Obama is guaranteed a win in 2012 and it looks like you are agreeing with me. :salute:

[red states rule]

I agree with you and the rest of the GOP nominee's are just as nuts. Obama is guaranteed a win in 2012 and it looks like you are agreeing with me. :salute:

Really? Given the fact the economy is the #1 issue this should put a damper on your prediction




A new CBS News poll finds that nearly seven in 10 Americans believe President Obama has not made real progress in fixing the economy.

Sixty-nine percent say the president has not made real progress on the economy, which voters overwhelmingly cite as their most important issue. Twenty-five percent say he has made real progress.

Perceptions are not improving. The percentage who said Mr. Obama has made real progress has dropped 10 points from a survey 13 months ago, when 35 percent said he had made real progress.

Just 35 percent of Americans approve of Mr. Obama's handling of the economy, and his approval rating on the issue has been below 40 percent since February. Fifty-three percent approve of his handling of the economy.

Still, most don't blame the administration for the state of the economy. Asked who was most to blame, Americans cited the Bush administration (22 percent), followed by Wall Street (16 percent), Congress (15 percent) and then the Obama administration (12 percent.) One in 10 said "all of the above."

<!--pagebreak-->President Obama's overall approval rating now stands at 44 percent in the CBS News poll. It has not hit 50 percent or higher since April 2010.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20114996-503544.html

[MtnBiker]

I agree with you and the rest of the GOP nominee's are just as nuts. Obama is guaranteed a win in 2012 and it looks like you are agreeing with me. :salute:

Holy Hell, this post reminds me of another former Navy man who predicted the Weiner's district was solid blue and never go Republican. How did that prediction go, hmmmm. Oh yeah, FAIL.

[Zona]

Really? Given the fact the economy is the #1 issue this should put a damper on your prediction

Direct questions...who will beat him? Do you really think people forgot how close we were to a depression after bush? Do you really think a republican can beat him considering a republican almost got us into another depression?

Again, who will beat him?

[Zona]

Holy Hell, this post reminds me of another former Navy man who predicted the Weiner's district was solid blue and never go Republican. How did that prediction go, hmmmm. Oh yeah, FAIL.

No, I am the Navy man who said Obama would win in 2008. How did that turn out for ya?

[ConHog]

Holy Hell, this post reminds me of another former Navy man who predicted the Weiner's district was solid blue and never go Republican. How did that prediction go, hmmmm. Oh yeah, FAIL.

Zona is a different idiot than the idiot Virgil.

[Kathianne]

Direct questions...who will beat him? Do you really think people forgot how close we were to a depression after bush? Do you really think a republican can beat him considering a republican almost got us into another depression?

Again, who will beat him?

We're much closer today to a depression than when BO came in. Nearly anyone could beat Obama.

[Zona]

We're much closer today to a depression than when BO came in. Nearly anyone could beat Obama.

Its so funny. I can never get a direct answer with a name from the right. You know why, because there is no one on the right who can beat him for different reasons.

WE are not closer today to a depression than immediately after bush. That is very naive or just ignorant (in the truest sense of the word.)

[MtnBiker]

No, I am the Navy man who said Obama would win in 2008. How did that turn out for ya?

For those that prefer an unemployment check to a payroll check, pretty good.

[ConHog]

Its so funny. I can never get a direct answer with a name from the right. You know why, because there is no one on the right who can beat him for different reasons.

WE are not closer today to a depression than immediately after bush. That is very naive or just ignorant (in the truest sense of the word.)

Mitt Romney
Mike Huckabee

and yes we are closer to a recession than we have been in at least 3 decades.

[Nukeman]

Its so funny. I can never get a direct answer with a name from the right. You know why, because there is no one on the right who can beat him for different reasons.

WE are not closer today to a depression than immediately after bush. That is very naive or just ignorant (in the truest sense of the word.)Umm no dipshit the Republicans DON'T have a nominee yet.. That might be why there is NO NAME. personally if you ran Perry/Cain, or Romney/Cain you would beet that idiot-in-chief hands down....

Care to explain how Obama can even come close to winning this election. he won last time due to the fact he was the FIRST black man to have a real chance of winning and ran on his hope and change platform, that brought out a whole slew of college kids and independents that don't normally vote, well fast forward 4 years and MOST of those brainwashed college kids are still NOT working or are under working with the prospect of HIGHER taxes. YOU honestly think he has a chance.. What the hell are you smoking???? Well I guess there are a lot of villages that need an idiot!!!!

[Gaffer]

I have a name for you zona, how about Generic Republican. He can be the pants of the one-who-must-not-be questioned. In fact GR the only one actually running against him at this time.

[Zona]

Mitt Romney
Mike Huckabee

and yes we are closer to a recession than we have been in at least 3 decades.

Uh...Huckabee is not running. (you think he will beat Obama even though he is not even running?)

Romney, I wish he would win the republican nomination. I like his stance on health care. Here is the deal with him though, there are certain southern states (republicans) that already said there is no way they would ever vote for a Mormon.....ever. He is toast.

ConHog, you did realize Huckabee isn't running didnt you? I am fairly sure you are a little brighter than this. (I think). If not, wha happened to you? :salute:

[Zona]

I have a name for you zona, how about Generic Republican. He can be the pants of the one-who-must-not-be questioned. In fact GR the only one actually running against him at this time.

Gaffer, thanks for that specific name and your knowledge of his credentials is astounding really. That was a really good argument and with the background of your candidate, he is guaranteed to win.

See ya in 2012!

[ConHog]

Uh...Huckabee is not running. (you think he will beat Obama even though he is not even running?)

Romney, I wish he would win the republican nomination. I like his stance on health care. Here is the deal with him though, there are certain southern states (republicans) that already said there is no way they would ever vote for a Mormon.....ever. He is toast.

ConHog, you did realize Huckabee isn't running didnt you? I am fairly sure you are a little brighter than this. (I think). If not, wha happened to you? :salute:

Your question was who COULD beat Obama. The fact is we don't even know who actually is running right now. So once again you're dishonest.

[Zona]

Umm no dipshit the Republicans DON'T have a nominee yet.. That might be why there is NO NAME. personally if you ran Perry/Cain, or Romney/Cain you would beet that idiot-in-chief hands down....

Care to explain how Obama can even come close to winning this election. he won last time due to the fact he was the FIRST black man to have a real chance of winning and ran on his hope and change platform, that brought out a whole slew of college kids and independents that don't normally vote, well fast forward 4 years and MOST of those brainwashed college kids are still NOT working or are under working with the prospect of HIGHER taxes. YOU honestly think he has a chance.. What the hell are you smoking???? Well I guess there are a lot of villages that need an idiot!!!!

The irony of the highlighted part is precious really. So is the rest of your post.

A sitting president who took over after Bush will win. I dont care what color he is. Even republicans know how close we came to a depression. Please tell me what new demographic/religious/racial etc groups the republicans have now as opposed to what they had in 2008.

Blacks
Gays
Women
Asian
Hispanic
Jews
etc etc

Who?

Villiage idiot indeed.

[Zona]

Your question was who COULD beat Obama. The fact is we don't even know who actually is running right now. So once again you're dishonest.

Direct question to you. In your heart of hearts, do YOU think Obama will lose. If so, who do you think will beat him?

Dont be dishonest now. :laugh:

[Missileman]

The irony of the highlighted part is precious really. So is the rest of your post.

A sitting president who took over after Bush will win. I dont care what color he is. Even republicans know how close we came to a depression. Please tell me what new demographic/religious/racial etc groups the republicans have now as opposed to what they had in 2008.

Blacks
Gays
Women
Asian
Hispanic
Jews
etc etc

Who?

Villiage idiot indeed.

Obama has only one shot at winning re-election, and that's if McCain wins the GoP nomination...wait a minute, McCain's not running. Obama will lose in a landslide to either Romney, Perry, or Cain. It matters not which of the 3 gets the nod.

[ConHog]

Direct question to you. In your heart of hearts, do YOU think Obama will lose. If so, who do you think will beat him?

Dont be dishonest now. :laugh:

Do I think he'll lose? No. I think the average American is a god damned idiot and will vote for a 2nd term for the worst President of our lifetime.

[Nukeman]

The irony of the highlighted part is precious really. So is the rest of your post.. Funny how you picked out the incorrect word.. You however did not refute the fact that he will not be re-elected!!


A sitting president who took over after Bush will win. I dont care what color he is. Even republicans know how close we came to a depression. Please tell me what new demographic/religious/racial etc groups the republicans have now as opposed to what they had in 2008.
And we are CLOSER to a depression today 3 years after he took office and deeper in dept by trillions of dollars...



Blacks

Only 17% of the population with less than 10% of them actively voting..

Gays

why would they vote for him do they not work in the same fields as straights

Women

once again they are in the same boat economically as everyone else. What has he done to further womens rights

Asian

Why?? They are not treated as a minority since they do so well, in fact most Asians vote conservative.

Hispanic

Might have that one if they can pass the "Dream Act" before the election BIG IF!!!

Jews

I believe that has already been proven to be false with the current elections!!!



Villiage idiot indeedYep Obama is the villiage idiot of America!!!!!

[Zona]

Obama has only one shot at winning re-election, and that's if McCain wins the GoP nomination...wait a minute, McCain's not running. Obama will lose in a landslide to either Romney, Perry, or Cain. It matters not which of the 3 gets the nod.

Perry is so far gone its not even funny. (Did you not see that last debate? Did you not see the latest polls?) Cain is a joke candidate. Romney is a republican who is a Mormon. Enough said.

Obama is guaranteed to win in 2012. You really have nothing on your side. You really dont. Sorry.

[Zona]

Funny how you picked out the incorrect word.. You however did not refute the fact that he will not be re-elected!!

And we are CLOSER to a depression today 3 years after he took office and deeper in dept by trillions of dollars...



Only 17% of the population with less than 10% of them actively voting..

why would they vote for him do they not work in the same fields as straights

once again they are in the same boat economically as everyone else. What has he done to further womens rights

Why?? They are not treated as a minority since they do so well, in fact most Asians vote conservative.

Might have that one if they can pass the "Dream Act" before the election BIG IF!!!

I believe that has already been proven to be false with the current elections!!!


Yep Obama is the villiage idiot of America!!!!!

Its funny how you are just dismissing the black vote. That 17% is way stronger a group than you think. (did you learn nothing from 2008?)

I listed a few groups up there. Have you ever seen a pic of a group shot of the audience at a RNC convention? How many of those I listed where in attendance?

There is no way the republicans will win with only the white vote in 2012. Its just not mathematically possible and the republicans have done nothing..NOTHING to entice any of said groups I listed to join them. NOTHING. I cant wait until 2012. This will be bigger than 2008 to tell you the truth.

[Zona]

Do I think he'll lose? No. I think the average American is a god damned idiot and will vote for a 2nd term for the worst President of our lifetime.

Then this day is historic...

I have to apologize for automatically thinking you thought he would lose. You know better....good.

[ConHog]

Its funny how you are just dismissing the black vote. That 17% is way stronger a group than you think. (did you learn nothing from 2008?)

I listed a few groups up there. Have you ever seen a pic of a group shot of the audience at a RNC convention? How many of those I listed where in attendance?

There is no way the republicans will win with only the white vote in 2012. Its just not mathematically possible and the republicans have done nothing..NOTHING to entice any of said groups I listed to join them. NOTHING. I cant wait until 2012. This will be bigger than 2008 to tell you the truth.

Which would just prove how stupid blacks can be considering the fact that they are WORSE off with Obama than they were with Bush. Is that REALLY what you are trying to tell us Zona? Are you proud that blacks will vote for another black irregardless of the facts?

[Zona]

Which would just prove how stupid blacks can be considering the fact that they are WORSE off with Obama than they were with Bush. Is that REALLY what you are trying to tell us Zona? Are you proud that blacks will vote for another black irregardless of the facts?

If that was the case, they would vote for cain. They are not dumb at all.

When we were losing over 700 thousand jobs monthly under Bush, do you think they liked him then as well? Did you like Bush then? Did you like bush when he retaliated the 9/11 attack (the worse attack on american soil ever by the way) with the start of the Iraq war? Did you like bush when he said there were WMD's? Do you like him now knowing how that war damn near bankrupted this entire country because of the cost? etc etc...

You honestly think Bush was a good president and Iraq was justified? Seriously?

[ConHog]

If that was the case, they would vote for cain. They are not dumb at all.

When we were losing over 700 thousand jobs monthly under Bush, do you think they liked him then as well? Did you like Bush then? Did you like bush when he retaliated the 9/11 attack (the worse attack on american soil ever by the way) with the start of the Iraq war? Did you like bush when he said there were WMD's? Do you like him now knowing how that war damn near bankrupted this entire country because of the cost? etc etc...

You honestly think Bush was a good president and Iraq was justified? Seriously?

Zona, unemployment among blacks is HIGHER under OBama than it was under Bush. That is absolute fact. So IF they vote for him, it is ONLY because of skin color (which by the way it was last time, or do we really need to post the videos again?)

It's okay I'll just go ahead and expose you now as the black man who thinks it's perfectly okay for blacks to be racists.

[chloe]

I do think when Bush left office the Country was in bad shape and it was only the begining of more bad news to come. I don't blame Obama for the mess Bush made, However Obama did make promises he has failed to deliver just like other Politicians have done in the past.


Frankly I don't know who I will vote for yet, I suppose it will be the Politician who has the best answers to my concerns and who I actually believe will really try to deliver said promises.

I am Independant I don't vote strictly Republican or Democrat. I have voted for both parties locally.

I don't know enough about the Candidates that are competing for the right to be Republican Presidential candidate yet to say for sure who is going to run against Obama.
But I don't think Obama has a shoe-in win for the next Election. :salute:

[Missileman]

Perry is so far gone its not even funny. (Did you not see that last debate? Did you not see the latest polls?) Cain is a joke candidate. Romney is a republican who is a Mormon. Enough said.

Obama is guaranteed to win in 2012. You really have nothing on your side. You really dont. Sorry.

Care to wager a grand on it? I'm sure we can arrange for an independent 3rd party to hold the bets and pay the winner.

[Missileman]

If that was the case, they would vote for cain. They are not dumb at all.

When we were losing over 700 thousand jobs monthly under Bush, do you think they liked him then as well? Did you like Bush then? Did you like bush when he retaliated the 9/11 attack (the worse attack on american soil ever by the way) with the start of the Iraq war? Did you like bush when he said there were WMD's? Do you like him now knowing how that war damn near bankrupted this entire country because of the cost? etc etc...

You honestly think Bush was a good president and Iraq was justified? Seriously?

Only total fucking idiots believe that the money we've spent on the war on terror is the reason for our out of control deficit and debt. From 2003-2010, we spent $709 billion in Iraq. Obama blew that in a single useless stimulus bill and then some.

As for his re-election prospects, you keep jumping back to 2008 and ignoring 2010 and the other special elections this year.

[ConHog]

Only total fucking idiots believe that the money we've spent on the war on terror is the reason for our out of control deficit and debt. From 2003-2010, we spent $709 billion in Iraq. Obama blew that in a single useless stimulus bill and then some.

As for his re-election prospects, you keep jumping back to 2008 and ignoring 2010 and the other special elections this year.

You will quickly discover that Zona is a troll and nothing more. Don't expect any honest discussion from him.

[Zona]

Zona, unemployment among blacks is HIGHER under Obama than it was under Bush. That is absolute fact. So IF they vote for him, it is ONLY because of skin color (which by the way it was last time, or do we really need to post the videos again?)

It's okay I'll just go ahead and expose you now as the black man who thinks it's perfectly okay for blacks to be racists.

So when blacks voted for Clinton, it was because he was white, no black ...no, now dammit I am confused. When blacks voted for democrats when both bushes ran, it was becuase the opponents where white, no black..no wait. Now I am confused.

Please help me out here. Blacks seem to have been voting for dems since the dixiecrats acted like idiots.

Its not cool for blacks to be racists, just like it not cool for hacks to be partisan.

[Zona]

Only total fucking idiots believe that the money we've spent on the war on terror is the reason for our out of control deficit and debt. From 2003-2010, we spent $709 billion in Iraq. Obama blew that in a single useless stimulus bill and then some.

As for his re-election prospects, you keep jumping back to 2008 and ignoring 2010 and the other special elections this year.

And here comes the 2010 votes. Was that a presidental year?

Whats next, 57 states? :laugh:

[Zona]

You will quickly discover that Zona is a troll and nothing more. Don't expect any honest discussion from him.

We were asked to not bring our pasts in here. That includes troll talk and your name in the same sentance so I will restrain myself. Please do the same. :laugh:

[ConHog]

We were asked to not bring our pasts in here. That includes troll talk and your name in the same sentance so I will restrain myself. Please do the same. :laugh:

You were a troll in the past, you're a troll in the present, and you will no doubt be a troll forever in the future.


THE END

[Zona]

Care to wager a grand on it? I'm sure we can arrange for an independent 3rd party to hold the bets and pay the winner.

Lets just have fun the day after the election in here. I hate vegas because whenever money is involved, I lose.

I have a strong candidate (you know, the sitting president who took over the office when this country was close ..close..to a depression) and you guys cant find ONE candidate to beat him. I have enjoyed watching the repbublicans eat their own.

Fun stuff and Obama will win in 2012.

[Zona]

You were a troll in the past, you're a troll in the present, and you will no doubt be a troll forever in the future.


THE END

This is the bulletin board version of "I know you are, but what am I".

Nicely dont in an eighth grade sort of way. FF, you rule.

[Gunny]

Lets just have fun the day after the election in here. I hate vegas because whenever money is involved, I lose.

I have a strong candidate (you know, the sitting president who took over the office when this country was close ..close..to a depression) and you guys cant find ONE candidate to beat him. I have enjoyed watching the repbublicans eat their own.

Fun stuff and Obama will win in 2012.

Last time we had a worse President it was Carter, and THAT is arguable. You're proud of THAT?

Idiot. The only things he hasn't fucked up are the ones he hasn't thought of or touched. Want to pull thine head out of thine crack, or what?

And this board is just what YOU leftwingers clamor for ... freedom of speech. Oh, but that's not what you want is it. You just want a forum to force your BS socialism down everyone's throats. Sorry. Here, you dish it out, you get it back.

If you have anything else to say about the forum feel free to PM a mod or admin with your little panty twist. Otherwise, that topic is done in this thread.

[ConHog]

Last time we had a worse President it was Carter, and THAT is arguable. You're proud of THAT?

Idiot. The only things he hasn't fucked up are the ones he hasn't thought of or touched. Want to pull thine head out of thine crack, or what?

And this board is just what YOU leftwingers clamor for ... freedom of speech. Oh, but that's not what you want is it. You just want a forum to force your BS socialism down everyone's throats. Sorry. Here, you dish it out, you get it back.

If you have anything else to say about the forum feel free to PM a mod or admin with your little panty twist. Otherwise, that topic is done in this thread.



I would COMPLETELY disagree with you. Carter was an ineffectual President, but he didn't actually have ideas which are dangerous to this nation. Obama is out and out dangerous.

[Gunny]

I would COMPLETELY disagree with you. Carter was an ineffectual President, but he didn't actually have ideas which are dangerous to this nation. Obama is out and out dangerous.

Like I said ... arguable. And yes, Carter DID have ideals that are dangerous to this Nation. He's the one that created the current crop of uber-lefties. Obama's just the next step in Europeanizing the US into mediocracy.

[Kat]

IMO Carter was THE WORST president to date...not judging anyone in office now.

I think Carter is and was a total nutcase.

Examples:

He boycotted the 1980 summer Olympics because they were held in Moscow. This punished American athletes because the Soviet leaders just plain did not care.

He set up trade relations with China that are still in place today. These trade relations were a very bad idea. We are still paying for them today, since everything is made in China -very cheaply made, I would remind you. And then they kill our dogs, poison our toothpaste, put lead paint in our kids toys, and most recently, arsenic was found in the fingerprinting CSI crime kit made in China that was a kids' toy.

He gave away the Panama Canal.

Gas prices soared during his Presidency so far that they hit two dollars a gallon in 1980.

Iran was a thorn in our side even then and they took seventy hostages from the US Embassy in Teheran. Carter supposedly sent troops to rescue them but it turned out very badly.

Carter was solely responsible for the biggest hike in inflation in forty or more years!

Need more?

[Zona]

Last time we had a worse President it was Carter, and THAT is arguable. You're proud of THAT?

Idiot. The only things he hasn't fucked up are the ones he hasn't thought of or touched. Want to pull thine head out of thine crack, or what?

And this board is just what YOU leftwingers clamor for ... freedom of speech. Oh, but that's not what you want is it. You just want a forum to force your BS socialism down everyone's throats. Sorry. Here, you dish it out, you get it back.

If you have anything else to say about the forum feel free to PM a mod or admin with your little panty twist. Otherwise, that topic is done in this thread.

So thats a no to you naming who will beat Obama. Deflection, thy name is Gunny?

Obama 2012.

[Kat]

So thats a no to you naming who will beat Obama. Deflection, thy name is Gunny?

Obama 2012.


How the heck can anyone be named when we don't even know who is running. Sheesh. :rolleyes:

[Zona]

By the way, did carter send over 4 thousand service members to their deaths based on a lie? If so, then he is equal to the horrors of Bush. If not, he is not the worse president ever. We all know who that is. 4 thousand brethren killed for a lie. I gets no worse than that.

[Zona]

How the heck can anyone be named when we don't even know who is running. Sheesh. :rolleyes:

Pick from who you have...who do you think will run who already isn't? Christie knows better and we all know Palin is a blatant liar when she says she is not sure...(but send her money to Sarahpac).

Who else do they have? You already know who is running on that side....make a choice between that gene pool.

Obama 2012.

[ConHog]

By the way, did carter send over 4 thousand service members to their deaths based on a lie? If so, then he is equal to the horrors of Bush. If not, he is not the worse president ever. We all know who that is. 4 thousand brethren killed for a lie. I gets no worse than that.

Oh is that the litmus test now? JFK 50,000 + killed because of his ramp up in Vietnam for no good reason. What a shitty President.


Troll, thy name is Zona.

[Kat]

By the way, did carter send over 4 thousand service members to their deaths based on a lie? If so, then he is equal to the horrors of Bush. If not, he is not the worse president ever. We all know who that is. 4 thousand brethren killed for a lie. I gets no worse than that.


Naw he's just a peanut farmer. Learn your history, man. And prove the lie while you're at it.

[Gunny]

So thats a no to you naming who will beat Obama. Deflection, thy name is Gunny?

Obama 2012.

Either I don't recall what a real dumbass you are, or you've gotten WAY worse since last I encountered you. You're a sheep. Vote left and damn the consequences. You try to run your mouth like you're a wolf but all that really comes out is *bleat*.

I don't need to name who is going to beat Obama. At the rate he's going, Jimmy Carter could poll higher than him and Carter is considered a one man disaster. The sad thing is, it doesn't matter who beats Obama. It will be an improvement no matter who it is.

And watch your own party jerkoff, instead of worrying about the GOP. Don't think they're priming Hillary for a run? She already legitimately beat the Obama-lama, had your superdelegates voted the will of their constituents instead of the will of the media. Your President doesn't even have the backing of his own party; yet, you talk shit? Just about covers YOU in a nutshell, doesn't it?

[Kat]

Pick from who you have...who do you think will run who already isn't? Christie knows better and we all know Palin is a blatant liar when she says she is not sure...(but send her money to Sarahpac).

Who else do they have? You already know who is running on that side....make a choice between that gene pool.

Obama 2012.


Can't pick till I know. I wouldn't mind if Herman Cain was the man. Palin? You still on that one. Must be one that gets you hot.

[Gunny]

By the way, did carter send over 4 thousand service members to their deaths based on a lie? If so, then he is equal to the horrors of Bush. If not, he is not the worse president ever. We all know who that is. 4 thousand brethren killed for a lie. I gets no worse than that.

No, Carter left US personnel hostage for over a year and then tried to pull off the lamest attempt at a rescue since Churchill's abortion in the Dardenelles.

[Gunny]

Naw he's just a peanut farmer. Learn your history, man. And prove the lie while you're at it.

Now you've done it. Prepare for incoming red herrings.

[ConHog]

Can't pick till I know. I wouldn't mind if Herman Cain was the man. Palin? You still on that one. Must be one that gets you hot.

That's a fact right there. Go read the thread in the lounge about Palin and Rice , he's so jealous that Rice nailed Palin that he can't stand it.

[ConHog]

Now you've done it. Prepare for incoming red herrings.

That's for damned sure. Apparently Zona had a pretty low level job in the Navy and never had to depend on intel when making a decision. Well not intel beyond " the trash cans in the bathroom are full" anyway.

Fool doesn't know the difference between bad intel and lying.

[Gunny]

That's for damned sure. Apparently Zona had a pretty low level job in the Navy and never had to depend on intel when making a decision. Well not intel beyond " the trash cans in the bathroom are full" anyway.

Fool doesn't know the difference between bad intel and lying.

He was one of those zero's that believes that just being a zero makes him smart. Damn the facts, logic and/or truth/intel ... I have shiny shit on my collar. Probably almost killed some Chief trying to keep his ass out of hot water.

[ConHog]

He was one of those zero's that believes that just being a zero makes him smart. Damn the facts, logic and/or truth/intel ... I have shiny shit on my collar. Probably almost killed some Chief trying to keep his ass out of hot water.



Unfortunately we all knew shit heads like that in the military, and I'm sure other branches as well.

[Kat]

Ah well, I am not going to discuss his military service. I appreciate all that serve. Besides, he has enough other stuff that can be discussed...never ending. :cool:

[Gunny]

Ah well, I am not going to discuss his military service. I appreciate all that serve. Besides, he has enough other stuff that can be discussed...never ending. :cool:

His service is not in question, and it is appreciated. HE and his political opinions are in question.

The inter-service, officer enlisted thing ... well .... you just had to be there. It's not as bad as it sounds to an outsider unless one takes exception to itin which case, one just gets picked on more.:laugh:

[red states rule]

Direct questions...who will beat him? Do you really think people forgot how close we were to a depression after bush? Do you really think a republican can beat him considering a republican almost got us into another depression?

Again, who will beat him?

So under Bush we had a depression?

Gas was about $1.80 per gallon - now it is around $3.50

Unemployment was at 7.0% when Bush left office - now it is 9.1%

The last budget under Bush was about $500 billion - now Obama has the deficit at $1.5 Trillion

Under Obama we have a record number of Americnas on food stamps. A record number of people living below the poverty level.

Housing prices continue to slide and millions of foreclosures in the pipeline ready to be completed

So is this what you call a recovery?

More and more people like me are beginning to see Bush's "depression" was alot better than Obama's so called recovery

Who can beat Obama in 2012? With the Obama recovery rolling along - damn near anybody who runs against him

[Missileman]

Lets just have fun the day after the election in here. I hate vegas because whenever money is involved, I lose.

I have a strong candidate (you know, the sitting president who took over the office when this country was close ..close..to a depression) and you guys cant find ONE candidate to beat him. I have enjoyed watching the repbublicans eat their own.

Fun stuff and Obama will win in 2012.

IOW, you aren't so confident in the poser after all. The really bad news for Obama is that he's still got another year of slipping poll numbers to contend with. How do you figure he's going to get re-elected with approval numbers BELOW 35%?

[Missileman]

By the way, did carter send over 4 thousand service members to their deaths based on a lie? If so, then he is equal to the horrors of Bush. If not, he is not the worse president ever. We all know who that is. 4 thousand brethren killed for a lie. I gets no worse than that.

One more time for the intellectually slow...Obama will not be running against Bush in 2012. He's got to contend with the current state of the country being HIS responsibility...his own people are finally claiming ownership. Obama's record is one long string of failed policy after failed policy...he's destined to be a one-term-blunder. Or maybe you can point to some policy...any policy of Obama's that's actually been of benefit to the country.

[Abbey Marie]

http://www.historycommons.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=us_domestic_terrorism_tmln&haitian_elite_2021_organizations=haitian_elite_202 1_other_militias

So why where these fools simply caught and given a trial?
U.S. citizens maybe?, As a matter of fact they were allowed to run free with several Federal informants in there ranks for years.
Is a POTENTIAL-POSSIBLE-MAYBE ONE DAY Alquida attack worse than an Aryan. Note the latest in Sweden.
Some Klansmen have even gone over seas to meet with Akmedinajad in IRAN.

What ever happened to the cries for the "RULE OF LAW" that was so loud Against the Dems?

Should we expect drone strikes against against those selling the turner diaries here in the U.S. or only overseas?
If not, WHY THE HE•• NOT.!!!??? THEY ARE TERRORIST ENCOURAGERS AND DON"T DESERVE TO LIVE ANOTHER MOMENT THE GOV'T SAID SO!!!

Ron Paul is right again. We've crossed another line and the water is boiling.

Rev, I have one name for you: O.J. Simpson

[Abbey Marie]

"AT WAR"
BS BS BS BS
the CIA directors have said there are less than 2000 active alquida WORLD WIDE.
the U.S .Gov't is not "AT WAR" with 2000 people. 2000 people are a mob not an Army, not by Any stretch. the threat is overblown and our reaction is even moreso. 911 traumatized people but it's been 10 years we need to get a freaking grip and realize that Alquiada is not a threat to 300Million Americans unless we keep acting like they are some kind of super villians.

Sorry, have to disagree again.
Rev, if one guy took out the east coast with a nuke, and regularly threatened to do it again, would he be an enemy? Wouldn't we be "at war" with him? I think your reliance on numbers, and traditional warfare, are no longer logical in today's world.

[logroller]

Sorry, have to disagree again.
Rev, if one guy took out the east coast with a nuke, and regularly threatened to do it again, would he be an enemy? Wouldn't we be "at war" with him?
Uh oh--using hyperbole to make a point. Could you declare war on a person, or their ideals as a class of people--systematic war on beliefs--or just their actions? -- How a threat is perceived, that fear of what might happen, often overshadows the actual risk and is furthered, quite effectively, by hyperbole and rhetoric. Justifying a larger, more pervasive government to combat such threats is quite 'traditional'. Never mind the fact we weren't bombed using a nuke; we were attacked using kamikaze tactics-- a non-traditional method of warfare I guess, but not exactly new. And, it is the US alone who has actually used a nuke, two of them in fact, to combat the suicidal methods of our opponent. Now I'm not on board with all of rev's conspiracy theories, but I can say I agree the systematic removal of freedoms rarely provides it's protection.


I think your reliance on numbers, and traditional warfare, are no longer logical in today's world.
Numbers schmumbers--history never repeats itself.
Every generation laughs at the old fashions but religiously follows the new.- Thoreau

[Zona]

So under Bush we had a depression?

Gas was about $1.80 per gallon - now it is around $3.50

Unemployment was at 7.0% when Bush left office - now it is 9.1%

The last budget under Bush was about $500 billion - now Obama has the deficit at $1.5 Trillion

Under Obama we have a record number of Americnas on food stamps. A record number of people living below the poverty level.

Housing prices continue to slide and millions of foreclosures in the pipeline ready to be completed

So is this what you call a recovery?

More and more people like me are beginning to see Bush's "depression" was alot better than Obama's so called recovery

Who can beat Obama in 2012? With the Obama recovery rolling along - damn near anybody who runs against him

ON day 1, Obama was blamed for all the crap bush put us in. Day freaking 1. You run off all these stats and expected him to fix all this in three years? Seriously, you do. Then you come back with...stop blaming Bush.

HE HAD TO FIX BUSH'S MESS. I cant wait until he wins in 2012. I really cant wait.

[Zona]

One more time for the intellectually slow...Obama will not be running against Bush in 2012. He's got to contend with the current state of the country being HIS responsibility...his own people are finally claiming ownership. Obama's record is one long string of failed policy after failed policy...he's destined to be a one-term-blunder. Or maybe you can point to some policy...any policy of Obama's that's actually been of benefit to the country.

Off the top of my head..

Extend child tax credits and marriage-penalty fixes
Increase minority access to capital
Establish a credit card bill of rights
Expand loan programs for small businesses
Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
Extend the Bush tax cuts for those making less than $250,000 (couples) or $200,000 (single)
Close the “doughnut hole” in Medicare prescription drug plan
Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions
Give tax credits to those who need help to pay health premiums
Require large employers to contribute to a national health plan
Require children to have health insurance coverage
Expand eligibility for Medicaid
Expand eligibility for State Children’s Health Insurance Fund (SCHIP)
Require health plans to disclose how much of the premium goes to patient care
Establish an independent health institute to provide accurate and objective information
In non-competitive markets, force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care
Eliminate the higher subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans
Reinstate executive order to hire an additional 100,000 federal employees with disabilities within five years.
Increase the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health
Fully fund the Veterans Administration
Expand the Veterans Administration’s number of “centers of excellence” in specialty care
Fully fund the Violence Against Women Act
Direct military leaders to end war in Iraq
Begin removing combat brigades from Iraq
No permanent bases in Iraq
End the abuse of supplemental budgets for war
Make U.S. military aid to Pakistan conditional on anti-terror efforts
Open “America Houses” in Islamic cities around the globe
Allocate Homeland Security funding according to risk
Seek verifiable reductions in nuclear stockpiles
Extend monitoring and verification provisions of the START I Treaty
Stand down nuclear forces to be reduced under the Moscow Treaty
Create a rapid response fund for emerging democracies
Grant Americans unrestricted rights to visit family and send money to Cuba
Establish an Energy Partnership for the Americas
Expand the Nurse-Family Partnership to all low-income, first-time mothers
Release presidential records
Require new hires to sign a form affirming their hiring was not due to political affiliation or contributions.
Provide affordable, high-quality child care
Recruit math and science degree graduates to the teaching profession
Reduce subsidies to private student lenders and protect student borrowers
Increase funding for national parks and forests
Expand Pell grants for low-income students
Push for enactment of Matthew Shepard Act, which expands hate crime law to include sexual orientation and other factors
Repeal “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy
Establish ‘Promise Neighborhoods’ for areas of concentrated poverty
Rebuild schools in New Orleans
Fund a major expansion of AmeriCorps
Work to overturn Ledbetter vs. Goodyear
Create new financial regulations
Ban lobbyist gifts to executive employees
Sign a “universal” health care bill
Create new criminal penalties for mortgage fraud
Raise fuel economy standards
Invest in all types of alternative energy
Invest in public transportation
Double federal spending for research on clean fuels
Increase funding for the Environmental Protection Agency
Extend unemployment insurance benefits and temporarily suspend taxes on these benefits
Reverse restrictions on stem cell research



OH and killed Bin Laden. :)

[ConHog]

Off the top of my head..

Extend child tax credits and marriage-penalty fixes
Increase minority access to capital
Establish a credit card bill of rights
Expand loan programs for small businesses
Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
Extend the Bush tax cuts for those making less than $250,000 (couples) or $200,000 (single)
Close the “doughnut hole” in Medicare prescription drug plan
Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions
Give tax credits to those who need help to pay health premiums
Require large employers to contribute to a national health plan
Require children to have health insurance coverage
Expand eligibility for Medicaid
Expand eligibility for State Children’s Health Insurance Fund (SCHIP)
Require health plans to disclose how much of the premium goes to patient care
Establish an independent health institute to provide accurate and objective information
In non-competitive markets, force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care
Eliminate the higher subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans
Reinstate executive order to hire an additional 100,000 federal employees with disabilities within five years.
Increase the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health
Fully fund the Veterans Administration
Expand the Veterans Administration’s number of “centers of excellence” in specialty care
Fully fund the Violence Against Women Act
Direct military leaders to end war in Iraq
Begin removing combat brigades from Iraq
No permanent bases in Iraq
End the abuse of supplemental budgets for war
Make U.S. military aid to Pakistan conditional on anti-terror efforts
Open “America Houses” in Islamic cities around the globe
Allocate Homeland Security funding according to risk
Seek verifiable reductions in nuclear stockpiles
Extend monitoring and verification provisions of the START I Treaty
Stand down nuclear forces to be reduced under the Moscow Treaty
Create a rapid response fund for emerging democracies
Grant Americans unrestricted rights to visit family and send money to Cuba
Establish an Energy Partnership for the Americas
Expand the Nurse-Family Partnership to all low-income, first-time mothers
Release presidential records
Require new hires to sign a form affirming their hiring was not due to political affiliation or contributions.
Provide affordable, high-quality child care
Recruit math and science degree graduates to the teaching profession
Reduce subsidies to private student lenders and protect student borrowers
Increase funding for national parks and forests
Expand Pell grants for low-income students
Push for enactment of Matthew Shepard Act, which expands hate crime law to include sexual orientation and other factors
Repeal “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy
Establish ‘Promise Neighborhoods’ for areas of concentrated poverty
Rebuild schools in New Orleans
Fund a major expansion of AmeriCorps
Work to overturn Ledbetter vs. Goodyear
Create new financial regulations
Ban lobbyist gifts to executive employees
Sign a “universal” health care bill
Create new criminal penalties for mortgage fraud
Raise fuel economy standards
Invest in all types of alternative energy
Invest in public transportation
Double federal spending for research on clean fuels
Increase funding for the Environmental Protection Agency
Extend unemployment insurance benefits and temporarily suspend taxes on these benefits
Reverse restrictions on stem cell research



OH and killed Bin Laden. :)

With the exception of killing Bin Laden, it is debatable, at best, as to whether any of those things you listed are beneficial to this nation.

[jimnyc]

Off the top of my head..

And in extremely similar "order" as many other websites.... http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/

Don't act like you sat there and wrote this "off the top of your head" - at least give credit to the site and/or sites you swiped the list from.

[chloe]

Off the top of my head..

Extend child tax credits and marriage-penalty fixes
Increase minority access to capital
Establish a credit card bill of rights
Expand loan programs for small businesses
Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
Extend the Bush tax cuts for those making less than $250,000 (couples) or $200,000 (single)
Close the “doughnut hole” in Medicare prescription drug plan
Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions
Give tax credits to those who need help to pay health premiums
Require large employers to contribute to a national health plan
Require children to have health insurance coverage
Expand eligibility for Medicaid
Expand eligibility for State Children’s Health Insurance Fund (SCHIP)
Require health plans to disclose how much of the premium goes to patient care
Establish an independent health institute to provide accurate and objective information
In non-competitive markets, force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care
Eliminate the higher subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans
Reinstate executive order to hire an additional 100,000 federal employees with disabilities within five years.
Increase the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health
Fully fund the Veterans Administration
Expand the Veterans Administration’s number of “centers of excellence” in specialty care
Fully fund the Violence Against Women Act
Direct military leaders to end war in Iraq
Begin removing combat brigades from Iraq
No permanent bases in Iraq
End the abuse of supplemental budgets for war
Make U.S. military aid to Pakistan conditional on anti-terror efforts
Open “America Houses” in Islamic cities around the globe
Allocate Homeland Security funding according to risk
Seek verifiable reductions in nuclear stockpiles
Extend monitoring and verification provisions of the START I Treaty
Stand down nuclear forces to be reduced under the Moscow Treaty
Create a rapid response fund for emerging democracies
Grant Americans unrestricted rights to visit family and send money to Cuba
Establish an Energy Partnership for the Americas
Expand the Nurse-Family Partnership to all low-income, first-time mothers
Release presidential records
Require new hires to sign a form affirming their hiring was not due to political affiliation or contributions.
Provide affordable, high-quality child care
Recruit math and science degree graduates to the teaching profession
Reduce subsidies to private student lenders and protect student borrowers
Increase funding for national parks and forests
Expand Pell grants for low-income students
Push for enactment of Matthew Shepard Act, which expands hate crime law to include sexual orientation and other factors
Repeal “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy
Establish ‘Promise Neighborhoods’ for areas of concentrated poverty
Rebuild schools in New Orleans
Fund a major expansion of AmeriCorps
Work to overturn Ledbetter vs. Goodyear
Create new financial regulations
Ban lobbyist gifts to executive employees
Sign a “universal” health care bill
Create new criminal penalties for mortgage fraud
Raise fuel economy standards
Invest in all types of alternative energy
Invest in public transportation
Double federal spending for research on clean fuels
Increase funding for the Environmental Protection Agency
Extend unemployment insurance benefits and temporarily suspend taxes on these benefits
Reverse restrictions on stem cell research



OH and killed Bin Laden. :)

I remember when Obama was campaigning he talked about setting up a program where people who wanted to go to college no matter there age could opt to make a contract with america and agree to work off the education debt by donating time to the community or government in the specialized field they recieved the degree in, this sounded great to alot of College students and then after Obama was elected never heard a word about it again.

:salute:

[Kat]

ON day 1, Obama was blamed for all the crap bush put us in. Day freaking 1. You run off all these stats and expected him to fix all this in three years? Seriously, you do. Then you come back with...stop blaming Bush.

HE HAD TO FIX BUSH'S MESS. I cant wait until he wins in 2012. I really cant wait.


That is bull Zona. Obama was NOT blamed from day one. Regardless, he has been in office how long now?
Oh and btw....did Bush blame Clinton? NO. Did Clinton blame H. W.?? NO. On and on we could go.
I have never known of a president to blame preceding presidents for their own short comings, problems, and lack of leadership.

And maybe Obama WILL get in a 2nd term. I have said that all along. It still has nothing to do with what a lousy leader, and unprepared president he is.
It merely shows the sheep.

[jimnyc]

ON day 1, Obama was blamed for all the crap bush put us in. Day freaking 1.

Mainstream and reputable media keep dates for their articles... Can you please supply us with some articles that show people blaming him for "all the crap Bush put on us" on day 1? Or are you trying to slip another lie past us?

[ConHog]

That is bull Zona. Obama was NOT blamed from day one. Regardless, he has been in office how long now?
Oh and btw....did Bush blame Clinton? NO. Did Clinton blame H. W.?? NO. On and on we could go.
I have never known of a president to blame preceding presidents for their own short comings, problems, and lack of leadership.

And maybe Obama WILL get in a 2nd term. I have said that all along. It still has nothing to do with what a lousy leader, and unprepared president he is.
It merely shows the sheep.

Same thing I said. When you have a group of people rioting in the streets with such asinine demands as we see the group in NY making it tells us EXACTLY how dumb the average American is.

[Missileman]

With the exception of killing Bin Laden, it is debatable, at best, as to whether any of those things you listed are beneficial to this nation.

The killing of Bin Laden could hardly be termed an Obama policy also.

[Kat]

Same thing I said. When you have a group of people rioting in the streets with such asinine demands as we see the group in NY making it tells us EXACTLY how dumb the average American is.

Unfortunately that is true. Sad, huh?


Did you see who is joining in with the group in NY? Unions, and civic groups. LOL

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/nationnow/2011/10/occupy-wall-street-.html

[Abbey Marie]

Uh oh--using hyperbole to make a point. Could you declare war on a person, or their ideals as a class of people--systematic war on beliefs--or just their actions? -- How a threat is perceived, that fear of what might happen, often overshadows the actual risk and is furthered, quite effectively, by hyperbole and rhetoric. Justifying a larger, more pervasive government to combat such threats is quite 'traditional'. Never mind the fact we weren't bombed using a nuke; we were attacked using kamikaze tactics-- a non-traditional method of warfare I guess, but not exactly new. And, it is the US alone who has actually used a nuke, two of them in fact, to combat the suicidal methods of our opponent. Now I'm not on board with all of rev's conspiracy theories, but I can say I agree the systematic removal of freedoms rarely provides it's protection.

Numbers schmumbers--history never repeats itself.

When someone claims that it is not (read: never) ok to take out a US citizen who recruits terrorists, it takes a strong example to try to pull them back to reality. I will leave it to you to pull out smaller, quieter examples when you are debating.

And do you really think terrorists could never pull off a nuke attack? I am glad that the people monitoring terrorists have a more open-minded and comprehensive understanding of their wishes and capabilities than you do.

And finally, if you don't think flying planes into skyscrapers signals a mega-shift from traditional warfare, and thereby puts anything and everything on the table, I can't imagine what would do it for you.

[ConHog]

The killing of Bin Laden could hardly be termed an Obama policy also.

Exactly, but watch out Zona will be in here in a moment to tell us that BOOOSH wasn't looking to punch that dude's ticket. It took The One to make that happen.

[Gaffer]

Exactly, but watch out Zona will be in here in a moment to tell us that BOOOSH wasn't looking to punch that dude's ticket. It took The One to make that happen.

The one didn't make it happen either. hillery and Gates did it behind the ones back. They kept his iranian cohort jarrett distracted and ordered the operation, then called the one in from the golf course to watch it unfold. The dark one was kept in the dark until everything was well underway.

[red states rule]

I remember when Obama was campaigning he talked about setting up a program where people who wanted to go to college no matter there age could opt to make a contract with america and agree to work off the education debt by donating time to the community or government in the specialized field they recieved the degree in, this sounded great to alot of College students and then after Obama was elected never heard a word about it again.

:salute:

and I remember this Obama supporter saying what her life would be like after he took office

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[Kathianne]

and I remember this Obama supporter saying what her life would be like after he took office

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Hey, if you've paid for an Ivy Education teaching degree, they do have a program:

http://www.rethinkingschools.org/archive/24_03/24_03_TFA.shtml

[fj1200]

Direct questions...who will beat him? Do you really think people forgot how close we were to a depression after bush? Do you really think a republican can beat him considering a republican almost got us into another depression?

Again, who will beat him?

Who will beat him? Just about anybody right now.

And how specifically did Bush "almost" get us into another depression? Seems things peaked right about the time the Democrats took over Congress.

[Zona]

And in extremely similar "order" as many other websites.... http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/

Don't act like you sat there and wrote this "off the top of your head" - at least give credit to the site and/or sites you swiped the list from.

You honestly think I was trying to represent me writing all that? Seriously? Now back to Obama not doing anything. Comments on that?

[Zona]

Exactly, but watch out Zona will be in here in a moment to tell us that BOOOSH wasn't looking to punch that dude's ticket. It took The One to make that happen.

The only comment I will make about Bush and Bin Laden is this. He disbanded the group that was designed to get him. Again, Bush disbanded the team.

How can anyone say Bush had anything to do with getting Bin Laden? Need the link to him SAYING he is not a priority? Need a link to him disbanding the group that was designed to get Bin Laden? Seriously, do ya?

[Missileman]

You honestly think I was trying to represent me writing all that? Seriously? Now back to Obama not doing anything. Comments on that?

The question was for an Obama policy that's actually been of benefit to the country...still waiting.

[ConHog]

The only comment I will make about Bush and Bin Laden is this. He disbanded the group that was designed to get him. Again, Bush disbanded the team.

How can anyone say Bush had anything to do with getting Bin Laden? Need the link to him SAYING he is not a priority? Need a link to him disbanding the group that was designed to get Bin Laden? Seriously, do ya?

Do you REALLY believe that internal restructuring within the CIA really had any impact on getting Bin Laden?

[fj1200]

ON day 1, Obama was blamed for all the crap bush put us in. Day freaking 1.

How did Bush do that?


Off the top of my head..

He said "benefit of the country." Try again.

[ConHog]

How did Bush do that?



He said "benefit of the country." Try again.

Notice that Zona makes THAT claim, while at the same time he'd never admit that 3 years later Obama is STILL blaming Bush for his problems.

[Zona]

End result.....just like 2008, Obama will win BIG TIME ....in 2012.

Even conhog admits he will win. Go ConHog...or freedom fighter or whatever your name is in this BB. How many different BB's will you be banned from? Its always the same thing on every board you go to. You get into fights with females (sup with that anyway?), eventually bring family into the BB etc etc. Same crap. But I digress, Obama 2012!

[jimnyc]

You honestly think I was trying to represent me writing all that? Seriously? Now back to Obama not doing anything. Comments on that?

The rules require a link to ALL sources when posting. You said "off the top of my head" and supplied no link. So yes, I do think that's what you were doing. Regardless, in the future please supply a link.

As to Obama - I don't care for a list of a few things he accomplished when I know he fucked up 10x as much. And I don't even care if by some miracle he gets re-elected, it will not mean he deserves it. If it were a company, and he had to answer to shareholders, he would be fired.

[jimnyc]

End result.....just like 2008, Obama will win BIG TIME ....in 2012.

Even conhog admits he will win. Go ConHog...or freedom fighter or whatever your name is in this BB. How many different BB's will you be banned from? Its always the same thing on every board you go to. You get into fights with females (sup with that anyway?), eventually bring family into the BB etc etc. Same crap. But I digress, Obama 2012!

Leave other boards shit there.

[fj1200]

End result.....just like 2008, Obama will win BIG TIME ....in 2012.

It's amazing how you can base that on practically nothing considering in '08 he won because he was in the right place at the right time. First he was NOT Hillary as in he didn't vote for the war and second he was NOT Bush as in not "responsible" for the economy.

[Abbey Marie]

You honestly think I was trying to represent me writing all that? Seriously? Now back to Obama not doing anything. Comments on that?

Unless you post credit for the author, yes, we all think you are representing the post as original material.

[Zona]

The rules require a link to ALL sources when posting. You said "off the top of my head" and supplied no link. So yes, I do think that's what you were doing. Regardless, in the future please supply a link.

As to Obama - I don't care for a list of a few things he accomplished when I know he fucked up 10x as much. And I don't even care if by some miracle he gets re-elected, it will not mean he deserves it. If it were a company, and he had to answer to shareholders, he would be fired.

Excuse my naivete then. I will post every link I use from now on...no problem. I see you are finally embracing the inevitable here. Good. It seems like you are a student of politics and you know....KNOW....he will be re elected. Hell Bush got in for two terms...BUSH!

:)

[Zona]

Unless you post credit for the author, yes, we all think you are representing the post as original material.

I heard. Thanks.

[ConHog]

Excuse my naivete then. I will post every link I use from now on...no problem. I see you are finally embracing the inevitable here. Good. It seems like you are a student of politics and you know....KNOW....he will be re elected. Hell Bush got in for two terms...BUSH!

:)

So you admit that you are counting on the stupidity of your fellow idiots in regards to Obama being reelected?

[red states rule]

So you admit that you are counting on the stupidity of your fellow idiots in regards to Obama being reelected?

You know damn well Obama is in trouble when the "thrill" is gone :laugh2:



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[red states rule]

Notice that Zona makes THAT claim, while at the same time he'd never admit that 3 years later Obama is STILL blaming Bush for his problems.

Seems to me libs like Zona are telling voters that yea Obama sucks - but the R's suck worse

and they think that is a winning election plan