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View Full Version : Debt limit deal is not “A Tea Party Triumph” as big media reports!



johnwk
08-03-2011, 06:54 AM
SEE: A Tea Party Triumph (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903341404576480653492061150.html)

WALL STREET JOURNAL

“The tea partiers pride themselves on adhering to the Constitution, which was intended to make political change difficult. Yet in this deal they've forced both parties to make the biggest spending cuts in 15 years, with more cuts likely next year.”

Unfortunately, the truth is, this is not a Tea Party Triumph nor a victory for the American People, especially when Article 1, Section 5 of our Constitution is violated which requires at a minimum, a majority of the House and Senate members to be present, “to do Business“, which is the “making of law" and is significantly different from passing a law which only requires a vote.

This bill establishing a “committee of 12” to make law, allowed to be passed with the help of “Republicans“, is part of Obama’s fundamental transformation of our system of government and intended to exclude the people’s elected members of Congress from the "making of law", and only allows them in on the action with an up or down vote after a Washington Establishment’s hand picked inside crowd of 12 makes the law.

Keep in mind this hand pick gang does not represent each and every State in the making of law, nor does it represent the various congressional districts within the States, when making law, and thus violates the very essences of our “Republican Form of Government” guaranteed under Article 4 Section 4 of our Constitution.

But getting back to Article 1, Section 5 and its requirement that a “Majority” of members of both houses are present “to do Business“, this provision was specifically debated during the framing of our Constitution and it was intended to forbid “a small number of members of the two Houses to make laws ___ SEE for example:MADISON’S NOTES, AUGUST 10TH (http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/debates_810.asp)

Col. MASON

This is a valuable & necessary part of the plan. In this extended Country, embracing so great a diversity of interests, it would be dangerous to the distant parts to allow a small number of members of the two Houses to make laws. The Central States could always take care to be on the Spot and by meeting earlier than the distant ones, or wearying their patience, and outstaying them, could carry such measures as they pleased. He admitted that inconveniences might spring from the secession of a small number: But he had also known good produced by an apprehension, of it. He had known a paper emission prevented by that cause in Virginia. He thought the Constitution as now moulded was founded on sound principles, and was disposed to put into it extensive powers. At the same time he wished to guard agst. abuses as much as possible. If the Legislature should be able to reduce the number at all, it might reduce it as low as it pleased & the U. States might be governed by a Juncto- A majority of the number which had been agreed on, was so few that he feared it would be made an objection agst. the plan.

Now, under this 12 member committee crap, who are to be selected by the Washington Establishment, the various States , and, the people of the various congressional districts within the States, are not all represented in the making of law, which is not only a violation of the very intention for which Article 1, Section 5 was adopted, but it is a direct assault upon our “Republican Form of Government” guaranteed under Article 4, Section 4 of the Constitution of the united States in that the people’s representatives are intentionally excluded from the law making process, and may only vote on the adoption of a law after it is made.

And then what happens? It has to be passed so the people can find out what’s in it. Have we not learned this dirty little trick?

On this day, August 2nd, 2011, a giant step in Obama’s fundamental transformation of our system of government has taken place and every member in the Senate who voted YEA, is complicit in this subversive act of tyranny!

JWK

A longtime Tea Party admirer

America we have a problem! We have a group of DOMESTIC ENEMIES (http://republicmainstreet.wordpress.com/2010/11/11/members-of-the-congressional-progressive-caucus-is-your-representative-a-member/) who have managed to seize political power and whose mission is in fact to bring “change” to America ___ the dismantling of our military defensive power; the allowance of our borders to be overrun by foreign invaders, the diluting of our election process by allowing ineligible persons to vote; the circumvention of our Republican Form of Government which is now replace with a 12 member committee vested with power to make law; the destruction of our manufacturing capabilities; the transferring of America’s technology to hostile foreign nations; the strangulation of our agricultural industry and ability to produce food under the guise of environmental necessity; the destruction of our nation’s health care delivery system, the interference with our ability to develop our natural resources, namely oil, to fuel our economy; the looting of both our federal treasury and a mandatory retirement pension fund; the brainwashing of our nation’s children in government operated schools; the trashing of our nation’s traditions and moral values; the creation of an iron fisted control unauthorized by our written Constitution over America’s businesses and industries; the devaluation of our nation’s currency, and, the future enslavement of our children and grand children via unbridled debt and inflation, not to mention an iron fisted government which intends to rule their very lives!

fj1200
08-03-2011, 09:47 AM
When was the last time you saw a "deficit reduction" bill that included "deficit reduction" promises with NO tax increases?

DragonStryk72
08-03-2011, 02:56 PM
You know, you seriously need to go somewhere that has actual tyranny, so you can see what it actually looks like. I feel like Inigo Montoya for some reason, "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

johnwk
08-04-2011, 11:54 AM
.A couple of days ago Judge Napolitano was on FoxNews and he indicated the committee of 12 established under the debt limit Act was unconstitutional Although he is correct, I found myself very upset that the Judge failed to mention those parts of the Constitution which would be violated. They are Article 1, Section 5 and Article 4, Section 4.

Under Article 1, Section 5 it is required that a “Majority” of members of both houses must be present “to do Business“. This provision was specifically debated during the framing of our Constitution and it was intended by our founding fathers to forbid “a small number of members of the two Houses to “make law”. SEE for example: MADISON’S NOTES, AUGUST 10TH (http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/debates_810.asp)

Col. MASON

“This is a valuable & necessary part of the plan. In this extended Country, embracing so great a diversity of interests, it would be dangerous to the distant parts to allow a small number of members of the two Houses to make laws. The Central States could always take care to be on the Spot and by meeting earlier than the distant ones, or wearying their patience, and outstaying them, could carry such measures as they pleased. He admitted that inconveniences might spring from the secession of a small number: But he had also known good produced by an apprehension, of it. He had known a paper emission prevented by that cause in Virginia. He thought the Constitution as now moulded was founded on sound principles, and was disposed to put into it extensive powers. At the same time he wished to guard agst. abuses as much as possible. If the Legislature should be able to reduce the number at all, it might reduce it as low as it pleased & the U. States might be governed by a Juncto- A majority of the number which had been agreed on, was so few that he feared it would be made an objection agst. the plan.”

Under the 12 member committee the largest possible number of States that would be represented in the making of law would be a mere12 States. And, of the hundreds of Congressional Districts across America, 12 is the highest number that would be represented in the making of law. This 12 member committee which is designed to “make law” is exactly what the founders intended to prevent by requiring at a minimum a “Majority” of the members of both houses “shall constitute a Quorum to do Business”

Quorum is a legal term and is the number of the officers or members of any body as is competent by law or constitution to transact business. The Constitution by its very wording requires at a minimum 50 Senators and 218 Representatives to do business. Col. MASON‘S above quote tells us that the committee of 12 would be dangerous to “make law”, and keep in mind making law is significantly different from voting to approve a law which has already been “made“.

As to Article 4, Section 4, we are guaranteed a “Republican Form of Government” and the very essences of a Republican Form of Government is that the people’s representatives are to be directly involved in the law making process. So, are the unique interests of the various united States represented in the law making process in this committee? No! Are the people’s interests of each of the hundreds of State Congressional Districts represented in the law making process of under this committee? No!

Do we understand the important difference between the making of law and voting upon a law which is already made?

This act is a direct assault upon the very essence of our “Republican Form of Government” as our founders intended it to operate, and if allowed to take effect, it would be a devastating and fundamental transformation of our system of government in that is excludes both the people’s interests and the various State unique interests in the sausage making process and only allows them an up or down vote on a law made in secret and behind closed doors, just as occurred with Obamacare!

As I have said elsewhere, every member in the Senate who voted YEA to establish this “committee“, is complicit in a subversive act of tyranny designed to fundamentally transform and dissolved our guarantee to a Republican Form of Government!

But tell me, why are our “conservative” talk show hosts [Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Glenn Beck, Laura Ingraham, Schnitt, Mark Levin, Dennis Prager, Bill O'rielly, Mike Gallagher, Doc Thompson, Lee Rodgers, Neal Boortz, Mike Huckabee, Tammy Bruce, Monica Crowley, Herman Cain …. etc.] ignoring this attack upon our “Republican Form of Government”? Is there no outraged among them that Article 1, Section 5 will be subverted by the 12 member committee making law?

JWK

America we have a problem! We have a group of DOMESTIC ENEMIES (http://republicmainstreet.wordpress.com/2010/11/11/members-of-the-congressional-progressive-caucus-is-your-representative-a-member/) who have managed to seize political power and whose mission is in fact to bring “change” to America ___ the dismantling of our military defensive power; the allowance of our borders to be overrun by foreign invaders, the diluting of our election process by allowing ineligible persons to vote; the circumvention of our Republican Form of Government which is now replace with a 12 member committee vested with power to make law; the destruction of our manufacturing capabilities; the transferring of America’s technology to hostile foreign nations; the strangulation of our agricultural industry and ability to produce food under the guise of environmental necessity; the destruction of our nation’s health care delivery system, the interference with our ability to develop our natural resources, namely oil, to fuel our economy; the looting of both our federal treasury and a mandatory retirement pension fund; the brainwashing of our nation’s children in government operated schools; the trashing of our nation’s traditions and moral values; the creation of an iron fisted control unauthorized by our written Constitution over America’s businesses and industries; the devaluation of our nation’s currency, and, the future enslavement of our children and grand children via unbridled debt and inflation, not to mention an iron fisted government which intends to rule their very lives!

johnwk
08-05-2011, 06:47 AM
Article I

Section 1. All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.

Why are the various States, their Governors and Legislatures not up in arms against this tyranny? Seems to me only 12 States can be represented in the making of this legislation. Likewise, why are the people of the hundreds of Congressional Districts across America not up in arms as only 12 Congressional Districts can be represented in the making of the legislation.

Have the States and People lost their liking for a Republican Form of Government and are willing to surrender their constitutional right to be represented in the making of legislation which affects their lives, their liberty and property?

JWK

Our tyrants in Washington force the productive to pay income taxes so they can spread their wealth and buy votes, but the Washington Establishment does not force their beloved 45 % who pay no income taxes to work for the taxes they get

johnwk
08-06-2011, 11:13 AM
At another site I visit the 12 member committee was dubbed as the “Dirty Dozen”. I will henceforth be using that to describe this subversive creation, and so should every concerned American who wishes to help restore our constitutionally limited Republican Form of Government.

And just what is the job of the “Dirty Dozen Committee”? It is part of a subversive plan by members of Congress to write and propose legislation to be voted upon, without the proposal being first recognized as a “bill”, and to circumvent the required procedure by which a bill is to originate in the House! Let us look at the facts.

Keep in mind that whatever comes out of the “Dirty Dozen Committee” is not a “bill” within the meaning of our Constitution and cannot be treated as such, and especially not voted up or down and become law as is now proposed by members of Congress who voted to create the “Dirty Dozen Committee”.

All bills for raising revenue must originate in the House and how a bill originates in the house requires a “Quorum” to be present to do business. In fact the Chair is not to be taken till a Quorum for business is present [218 members of the House]. But let us look at how a bill originates in the House as stated in Jefferson’s Manual.

When the House is set to do business, proposed bills, and this would include whatever the “Dirty Dozen Committee” has cooked up, may be presented, the Clerk reads it at the table, and hands it to the Speaker, who, rising, states to the House the title of the bill; that it is the first time of reading it; and the question will be, whether it shall be read a second time? then sitting down to give an opening for objections.

It is at this point in procedure, prior to a bill being recognized in Congress as a bill, and prior to it being committed and engrossed, all of which is necessary for a bill to have originated in the House, that our Washington Establishment wishes to fundamentally transform in such a manner as to allow a proposed bill, cooked up by the “Dirty Dozen Committee”, to be recognized as a bill without it originating in the House which requires the above stated procedure. The fundamental transformation is to eliminate the people’s elected Representatives constitutionally mandated requirement in originating a bill, during which time objections may be made to what the “Dirty Dozen Committee” has cooked up, and have an up or down vote on proposed legislation which has never been made a bill.

Now, why are our “conservative” talk show hosts [Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Glenn Beck, Laura Ingraham, Schnitt, Mark Levin, Dennis Prager, Bill O'rielly, Mike Gallagher, Doc Thompson, Lee Rodgers, Neal Boortz, Mike Huckabee, Tammy Bruce, Monica Crowley, Herman Cain …. etc.] not outraged over this tyrannical attempt to ignore the process by which a proposed bill may originate in the House?

JWK

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our Constitution and unacknowledged by our laws, giving his assent to their acts of pretended legislation___ Declaration of Independence