Obama demolished Palestinian chances for statehood

[abso]

Obama demolished Palestinian chances for statehood




U.S. supports Israel's demand for the Palestinian state to be demilitarized, it supports postponing discussions on the refugees and Jerusalem, it talks about Israel's security and Israel's security alone.

When he mentioned the Tunisian vendor who was humiliated by a policewoman who overturned his stall - the vendor who later set himself and the revolution ablaze - was Obama thinking about the hundreds of Palestinian vendors who have suffered the exact same fate at the hands of Israeli soldiers and policemen? When he spoke nobly about the dignity of the oppressed vendors, was he speaking about their Palestinian brethren as well? The speech didn't show this enough.

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/obama-demolished-palestinian-chances-for-statehood-1.362895

[Kathianne]

Abso, I'm glad to see you back and hope all is well with you. Now of course, with pleasantries out of the way, a question; in the past hour you've posted two new topics, both from Haaretz, a Jewish news publication. That is cool and both were pro-Palestinian opinion pieces, here's the question; is there a Palestinian paper that gives voice to the 'other side' as the Jewish publication does to the Palestinians? Are their Palestinian or Arabs that address the intransigence of the Palestinians in moving towards peace?

[abso]

Abso, I'm glad to see you back and hope all is well with you. Now of course, with pleasantries out of the way, a question; in the past hour you've posted two new topics, both from Haaretz, a Jewish news publication. That is cool and both were pro-Palestinian opinion pieces, here's the question; is there a Palestinian paper that gives voice to the 'other side' as the Jewish publication does to the Palestinians? Are their Palestinian or Arabs that address the intransigence of the Palestinians in moving towards peace?

Palestinians have already agreed to participate in the peace negotiations based on 67 borders, but israel refused, so what intransigence are you talking about ???

Israel refuse to return east jerusalem, refuse to give the refugees their right to return, refuse to go back to 67 borders, israel already refused everything they can negotiate about, so what's left for negotiations !!!, they killed it before it can even start.

[Kathianne]

Palestinians have already agreed to participate in the peace negotiations based on 67 borders, but israel refused, so what intransigence are you talking about ???

Israel refuse to return east jerusalem, refuse to give the refugees their right to return, refuse to go back to 67 borders, israel already refused everything they can negotiate about, so what's left for negotiations !!!, they killed it before it can even start.

Ummm, you mean Israel refuses to start with what are the end points for its existence. How contrary of them.

[abso]

Ummm, you mean Israel refuses to start with what are the end points for its existence. How contrary of them.

and how can 67 borders be the end for its existence ?

[jimnyc]

ANow of course, with pleasantries out of the way, a question; in the past hour you've posted two new topics, both from Haaretz, a Jewish news publication. That is cool and both were pro-Palestinian opinion pieces, here's the question; is there a Palestinian paper that gives voice to the 'other side' as the Jewish publication does to the Palestinians?

I'd be curious to hear the answer to this ignored question as well.

[abso]

I'd be curious to hear the answer to this ignored question as well.

is there any israelian puplications that speak against israeli occupation and illegal actions, yes of course there is.

is there any arabian puplications that speak against the palestinan occupation and illegal actions, ......emmmm, oops, sorry, can you remind me exactly where is that land that the palsetinans are currently occupying ?

about illegal actions, i do agree, Hamas firing rockets towards civilians is not something i admire or support, i am strongly against it, and i always express my opposition to the suicide bombing and firing rockets at civilians even if they live on occupied lands, that opinion i tell to my egyptian friends too, and nearly everyone agree with me, so does arabs condemn such actions, "Yes, many of them disagree with that".


is there any arabs that support such actions, unfortunately yes, like there is many israelians that support the occupation.


finally, because you would say that i am avoiding the question, here is my direct answer:

Yes, many egyptian puplications condemn Hamas actions, especially that some of their actions were against Egypt.

about palestinains i don't see any of their puplications, so i have no idea what they say in it, and i actually never had any interest at all to read what they write.

[jimnyc]

is there any israelian puplications that speak against israeli occupation and illegal actions, yes of course there is.

is there any arabian puplications that speak against the palestinan occupation and illegal actions, ......emmmm, oops, sorry, can you remind me exactly where is that land that the palsetinans are currently occupying ?

about illegal actions, i do agree, Hamas firing rockets towards civilians is not something i admire or support, i am strongly against it, and i always express my opposition to the suicide bombing and firing rockets at civilians even if they live on occupied lands, that opinion i tell to my egyptian friends too, and nearly everyone agree with me, so does arabs condemn such actions, "Yes, many of them disagree with that".


is there any arabs that support such actions, unfortunately yes, like there is many israelians that support the occupation.


finally, because you would say that i am avoiding the question, here is my direct answer:

Yes, many egyptian puplications condemn Hamas actions, especially that some of their actions were against Egypt.

about palestinains i don't see any of their puplications, so i have no idea what they say in it, and i actually never had any interest at all to read what they write.

Condemning and giving a voice to the other side are 2 completely different things. You could have save all that writing and just said no.

[abso]

Condemning and giving a voice to the other side are 2 completely different things. You could have save all that writing and just said no.

find me something that i can give my voice to in the current israeli situation and i would gladely do so.

Gaedon Levy gave his voice to palestinians because of the israelian occupation which he hate, so why would i as an example give my voice to israel, for what reason ?

does Hamas stupid useless rockets qualify to be a reason ???, if that so then i give my voice to israel because i hate Hamas rockets and suicide bombings too.

[jimnyc]

Again, it appears the answer to her question is either NO, or you are unaware of any. My reply to that is what a fucking surprise.

[abso]

Again, it appears the answer to her question is either NO, or you are unaware of any. My reply to that is what a fucking surprise.

Again it appears that you haven't gave my any reason or you are unaware of any.

[jimnyc]

Again it appears that you haven't gave my any reason or you are unaware of any.

So Israel is allowed to post differing viewpoints but palstinkians will likely kill anyone doing so from their side. True dat!

[abso]

So Israel is allowed to post differing viewpoints but palstinkians will likely kill anyone doing so from their side. True dat!

if palestinians fire at viewpoints built on 67 borders, that would be considered as an act of war then israel can fire too, but in the current situation israel occupation is an act of war which give palestinians the right to fire at israel, it's that simple according to the international law.

[jimnyc]

Thanks for admitting that the answer to Kathianne's question is no.

[Gaffer]

The pals are just pawns of the surrounding arab states. The Israelis did not defeat the pals in 67. They defeated the arab states surrounding them. syria, jordan, iraq, egypt, the sauds, all of them. They took territory and established new borders. pals that were displaced did so because they chose to. There is history and there is the arab story line. You chose to believe the story line.

Anyone that believes Israel will go back to the pre 67 borders is a fool. They would be foolish to do that. One of the big differences with Israel and the pals is that Israel allows distention. The pals don't. In fact you will not find any arab publications or media supporting Israel in anything or even accepting their existence. Finding Israeli, American, British or other country publications against Israel is real easy to do. Want a challenge? Find arab publications supporting Israel.

[Kathianne]

find me something that i can give my voice to in the current israeli situation and i would gladely do so.

Gaedon Levy gave his voice to palestinians because of the israelian occupation which he hate, so why would i as an example give my voice to israel, for what reason ?

does Hamas stupid useless rockets qualify to be a reason ???, if that so then i give my voice to israel because i hate Hamas rockets and suicide bombings too.

Umm, how about the Palestinians taking advantage of Obama's being a douche? I mean he provide the perfect cover for them, saying 'Hey, we don't want to be unreasonable, we know that Israel needs secure borders, but they really need to get out of Gaza. We're willing to deal with this."

Would have been an exemplary start.

[fj1200]

if palestinians fire at viewpoints built on 67 borders, that would be considered as an act of war then israel can fire too, but in the current situation israel occupation is an act of war which give palestinians the right to fire at israel, it's that simple according to the international law.

Aren't rockets being fired at civilians an act of war?

[abso]

The pals are just pawns of the surrounding arab states. The Israelis did not defeat the pals in 67. They defeated the arab states surrounding them. syria, jordan, iraq, egypt, the sauds, all of them. They took territory and established new borders. pals that were displaced did so because they chose to. There is history and there is the arab story line. You chose to believe the story line.

Anyone that believes Israel will go back to the pre 67 borders is a fool. They would be foolish to do that. One of the big differences with Israel and the pals is that Israel allows distention. The pals don't. In fact you will not find any arab publications or media supporting Israel in anything or even accepting their existence. Finding Israeli, American, British or other country publications against Israel is real easy to do. Want a challenge? Find arab publications supporting Israel.

maybe it's because israel is the one who is wrong, haven't that idea crossed your mind ? :rolleyes:

[abso]

Umm, how about the Palestinians taking advantage of Obama's being a douche? I mean he provide the perfect cover for them, saying 'Hey, we don't want to be unreasonable, we know that Israel needs secure borders, but they really need to get out of Gaza. We're willing to deal with this."

Would have been an exemplary start.


don't see any reason !!!, Obama stupidity is an american issue, it doesn't have anything to do with Israel or Palestine, after all everything that USA does is not determined by Obama, its determined by the jewish lobby and the other lobbies which pays for election campaigns.

[abso]

Aren't rockets being fired at civilians an act of war?

an act of war during an occupation ???, they are already in a war, they are fighting for their land, so firing at civilians at the current situation doesn't qualify to be an act of war, but it does qualify to be a war crime, and i agree with that and i puplicly express that opinion to anyone who discuss that subject with me, suicide bombing and firing rockets at civilians are inhuman and war crimes and forbidden according to my religious beliefs.

but to say that Hamas started the war by firing at civilians while israel is already occupying their land since 67, doesn't that sound a bit wrong ???

Hamas didn't start it, but it fought it in a wrong manner which i don't agree with.

[fj1200]

an act of war during an occupation ???, they are already in a war, they are fighting for their land, so firing at civilians at the current situation doesn't qualify to be an act of war, but it does qualify to be a war crime, and i agree with that and i puplicly express that opinion to anyone who discuss that subject with me, suicide bombing and firing rockets at civilians are inhuman and war crimes and forbidden according to my religious beliefs.

but to say that Hamas started the war by firing at civilians while israel is already occupying their land since 67, doesn't that sound a bit wrong ???

Hamas didn't start it, but it fought it in a wrong manner which i don't agree with.

Hamas is just the latest iteration. Israel won't have security until it has acceptance and it won't have acceptance as long as they are scapegoated and poverty abounds for those that oppose her.